No, the jury isn’t out on the scientific evidence!!! It's very, very clear. Acceptance of this practice condemns individuals to difficult, painful, limited lives. Making cousin marriage illegal is the humane thing to do! But our society is now more concerned with appeasing medieval cultural practices than being humane and making progress.
@andrewhotston983 Cousin marriage is banned in Philippines and I have never seen an inbred ever... It is not because of inbred...but because it's healthy that cousins dont marry each other
How sad that we are even talking about this. Anyone who is over fifty remembers a time in this country, when we had never heard of FGM, forced marriage, grooming gangs, acid attacks and sharia law. The western world has moved on from this medieval BS.
We had moved on. But we’re being dragged back into the dark ages by a religion that will brook no criticism. On pain of death. We are entering a time of global cultural flux brought on by the crash of cultures. And I mean ‘crash’. Cultural change used to happen gradually, but it is now happening at such a rapid rate that it’s causing a real rip-current in the historical & fundamental mores of many countries that never considered what mass instant migration would entail. And we are all paying the price.
@@janeawdry8182 Nicely put. I think we should never have facilitated the predicament we are in. Our do good attitude has enabled many countries, esp in ME to grow considerably post ww2. Without western aid and medicine etc many of these countries would have failed a long time ago. We created this.
Again, this is the problem, we're being forced into a more and more authoritarian society to deal with the consequences of the importation of huge numbers of people from alien societies.
When in grad school I attended a talk on the impact on cousin marriages on European royalty. The big takeaway was that occasional cousin marriages have little impact on genetic diversity, BUT repeated cousin marriages generation after generation are terrible for genetic outcomes. The problem in many Asian communities is that this practice is repeated over and over (as it was in European dynasties like the Hapsburgs). Using data from the occasional cousin marriages will not reveal this risk.
First of all you have to define what constitutes incest, because that varies by country/state world wide. I imagine that the definition can vary by community in some places. Certainly where those communities are isolated and/or the gene pool is very limited.
It's because of people like Dr Nazir Afal that TR is a "political prisoner", Brits not allowed to raise the serious cultural issues in the UK, we shall not be silenced. Freedom of Speech is enshrined in international Human Rights Law. So is the Human Right of Dissent, enshrined in international law.
@@KimThomas-vp4vm neither is TR anywhere near far right nowadays. I'm not particularly sure he ever was, whether his dealings brought him in contact with other groups who were or not. Mind you, given our current PM's redefinition of the term, even I am far right these days 🤷
Sad to say part of this video calls Tommy Robinson far right with the related statement that he opposes 1st cousin marriage for a silly reason. Tommy R is entitled to a point of view, even if you don't agree with it and even if it is silly or wrong, and entitled to speak out too. I don't agree with TR on this, but I abhor the insults repeated here and restiction of speech this commentator impies ought to be in place.
@@FC-PeakVersatility First cousins is about genetics. Has far as older women, there is a health risk at all ages. A friend's babies mama died while giving birth. My gran had two heart attacks while giving birth. However, my cut off point for having more children was age 40. Because around ten years to 15 years later women have the menopause to deal with. And the last thing a teenager requires is a mother that is menopausal. It's not fun for the mother either having to deal with the drama of teenagers when she doesn't feel well herself.
Is Britain a country or an Economic Zone which will accept whatever mental laws aggressive colonising migrants demand of it? With Dr Nazir Afsal Let's see what Dr Nazir Afsal has to say. He's clearly who the Spectator has chosen to represent Britain Or not. Bye everyone
Why is this even a question? Our culture is in no way "enriched" by such practices. Why do we not hear an outcry about this manifestation of "cultural imperialism" on the part of these uninvited guests?
To be fair it wasn’t uncommon in this country until a few generations ago. What’s frightening is that far from continuing to die out, the globalists have ensured it is resurgent.
Real reason. The issue was chosen to create ethnic tension in the face of mass immigration. The real issue to me is the lack of integration it represents
Quite possibly, but it in that case it only targets the Pakistani muslim community and some african muslim groups, not immigrants in general @@tomwright9904
How would they know if it is a cousin? The surnames are different for men and women within the same family. How would they know that the wife coming from Asia is actually a cousin?
Yeah its asking too much. Scientific knowledge and practice is too straightforward and logical for these people. They have to complicate it to twist it to their fascist ends and get control over people.
@carltaylor6452 It depends on that account, I'd rather have someone who can talk accurately about genetics, and the issues. Because that is where the ethical claims come from. A medical practitioner can just be a nurse, not good enough, I want the least biased opinions.
Im a muslim from the balkans and topics like this aren't even something to be discussed in our region. Muslims from the eastern hemisphere on the otherhand are just too rigid with thier views and practices, not willing to accept that other cultures adopt it differently. Quite often I've personally experienced hilarious forms of guilt tripping to suggest our conservative take on religion is somehow of lesser quality. This is where I think the problem is wrongly targetted at religion and instead should be highlighted as a difference in culture.
This is a longer post but hopefully it’s worth it, regarding a book called British Islam and English Law by Patrick Nash that talks about cousin marriage as a turning point. On page 302, he talks about “types of group they endanger the nation, state, civil society and individual rights”, one of which is revolutionary religious groups and the other of which is transnational clans, which are “more widespread and cumulatively destructive by far. These kinship networks facilitate all manner of criminality and corruption: terrorist financing, money laundering, school misgovernance, election fraud, the toxification of politics, the disenfranchisement of young British Muslims, child sexual exploitation, drug trafficking, racial and religious hatred, misogyny and honour violence, forced marriage, cold-blooded murder, the obstruction of justice, and so forth.” He goes on to say “As to the deconstruction of clans, that requires little more than a halt to the inflow of consanguineous relationships via adequately enforced ban on cousin marriage up to and including second degree.” What might seem like an Islamic quirk is more likely to be an attempt to establish a deep and dangerous structure!
We left bonkers UK for the wonderful IOM last year. People are cery midful here about this issue ased on the hstory of the isand which was extremely insular with a small population until the recent past. There are very real genetic implicatiins of first cousin marriage. To be avoided.
21:58 and I paraphrase: 'the jury is out on whether first cousin marriage has genetic health risks' - these are beliefs which I really don't see as being compatible with those of the general population
How unfortunate that this speaker is so ignorant as to label Tommy Robinson 'far right'. Clearly he has bought the mainstream media propaganda. Tommy is not far right wing, he is simply sensible. He actually cares about his own community and the community of his country. I have always considered myself to be left wing but now in my early 60s I find that the things I have always believed are now called right wing. It's ridiculous and highly manipulative. I'm afraid that this makes me seriously question his judgement on other matters. As for who you can't marry, the Church of England has a table of affinity which tells you who you cannot marry (I.e. have children with). The Church of England is a state religion, so the state should be guided by it.
@louisetrott5532 First cousin marriage is not banned by CofE and is not on the list of prohibited relationships. Probably because historically that would have made a very small pool for royalty marrying other Protestants, and secondly because it was rare amongst the majority. As time passed and the dangers were well understood, marrying cousins of any degree in the UK died out.
This is one of those unfortunate things where the UK is being forced to do something that didn't need the force of law before. I know this is a minor "freedom" to give up, but still. Similar to the recently announced limits to homeschooling, both are because of mass immigration of people from different cultures. (and as an actual traditionalist, I'm not one to reflexively attack Islam from the left as many Western "centre-right" conservatives do, for being insufficiently liberal)
The craziest thing about this being in the news recently, is that i already thought it was banned...thought it is certain groups that "you shouldnt name" who take part in it.
If you marry your first cousin AND have children over the age of 35, what does that risk profile look like? And lets not forget the age of the father is also relevant but rarely discussed, as we still have a rather misogynist outlook that only discusses the risks and responsibilities of women who have their children at a more mature age. I invite people to have a look at those statistics. Whats the risk profile of first cousin marriage, with mother and father over the age of 35?
1st cousin marriage and civil partnerships should be banned legally to deter cousin marriage which will help avoid recessive genetic disorders in children, but if people want to co-habit or do special ceremonies they want to call marriage then 'have at it'.
If the risk is so small why do we see the consequences so often. Families with 4 or 5 children with disabilities. Seen it more than once. Some consequences are not so obvious. Aggressive behavior and poor self control are the most common ones.
If a community decide to continue with harmful cultural norms because of the so called 'far right' are critical of it I think that tells you all you need to know about both groups
If group A decide to continue with harmful cultural norms because group B are critical of it I think that tells you all you need to know about both groups
Does the risk of birth defects increase when the children of the 1st cousin marriage then go on to marry their 1st cousin who will be a product of a family of 1st cousin marriages in the same dynasty? hope that makes sense?
How far the UK has fallen that this even needs to be discussed.
No, the jury isn’t out on the scientific evidence!!! It's very, very clear.
Acceptance of this practice condemns individuals to difficult, painful, limited lives.
Making cousin marriage illegal is the humane thing to do! But our society is now more concerned with appeasing medieval cultural practices than being humane and making progress.
@andrewhotston983 Cousin marriage is banned in Philippines and I have never seen an inbred ever... It is not because of inbred...but because it's healthy that cousins dont marry each other
This whole presentation was a muddying of the waters as to stop the bleedin obvious leading to a ban .
How sad that we are even talking about this. Anyone who is over fifty remembers a time in this country, when we had never heard of FGM, forced marriage, grooming gangs, acid attacks and sharia law. The western world has moved on from this medieval BS.
Great comment spot on, this stuff should stay in the rear view mirror
I’d never even heard of Islam growing up in the eighties. Seems unbelievable now but perfectly true.
We had moved on. But we’re being dragged back into the dark ages by a religion that will brook no criticism. On pain of death.
We are entering a time of global cultural flux brought on by the crash of cultures. And I mean ‘crash’. Cultural change used to happen gradually, but it is now happening at such a rapid rate that it’s causing a real rip-current in the historical & fundamental mores of many countries that never considered what mass instant migration would entail. And we are all paying the price.
I had no idea it was legal in the UK until the last few weeks.
@@janeawdry8182 Nicely put. I think we should never have facilitated the predicament we are in. Our do good attitude has enabled many countries, esp in ME to grow considerably post ww2. Without western aid and medicine etc many of these countries would have failed a long time ago. We created this.
How is this even a question is ridiculous that this is even still allowed in modern Britain
This should be banned to stop violence against Women and children as well as genetic defects
In Sweden, we didn't need to make it illegal...until now
It probably wasn't common enough to worry about until recently.
Again, this is the problem, we're being forced into a more and more authoritarian society to deal with the consequences of the importation of huge numbers of people from alien societies.
When in grad school I attended a talk on the impact on cousin marriages on European royalty.
The big takeaway was that occasional cousin marriages have little impact on genetic diversity, BUT repeated cousin marriages generation after generation are terrible for genetic outcomes.
The problem in many Asian communities is that this practice is repeated over and over (as it was in European dynasties like the Hapsburgs). Using data from the occasional cousin marriages will not reveal this risk.
If these daughters were free to marry who they want, they probably wouldn't pick their first cousin.
There wouldn't be any Indians or Arabs as a race if these women were free to choose who they wanted to marry.
They will ban smoking and drinking, boxing, whatever the Nanny State decides, but not this. We know why.
Say why and
Get some
Balls
Yes, we don't want incest thank you
It seems vast numbers do! Ensure that
First of all you have to define what constitutes incest, because that varies by country/state world wide. I imagine that the definition can vary by community in some places. Certainly where those communities are isolated and/or the gene pool is very limited.
It's because of people like Dr Nazir Afal that TR is a "political prisoner", Brits not allowed to raise the serious cultural issues in the UK, we shall not be silenced. Freedom of Speech is enshrined in international Human Rights Law. So is the Human Right of Dissent, enshrined in international law.
He did get rather pompous when he mentioned TR didnt he " who's real name is ...'
Hmm... ignoring a not very restrictive court order does not make you a political prisoner
@@tomwright9904 Years of trumped up charges does make you a political prisoner. Julian Assange was also a political prisoner.
@@tomwright9904 if the court had protected the children involved, as requested, there would have been no reason to.
@@KimThomas-vp4vm neither is TR anywhere near far right nowadays. I'm not particularly sure he ever was, whether his dealings brought him in contact with other groups who were or not. Mind you, given our current PM's redefinition of the term, even I am far right these days 🤷
Sad to say part of this video calls Tommy Robinson far right with the related statement that he opposes 1st cousin marriage for a silly reason. Tommy R is entitled to a point of view, even if you don't agree with it and even if it is silly or wrong, and entitled to speak out too. I don't agree with TR on this, but I abhor the insults repeated here and restiction of speech this commentator impies ought to be in place.
I always thought first cousin marriage was banned in the UK. Of course it should be banned for health reasons.
In that case so should pregnancy in older females - where the risk of defect is potentially higher.
@@FC-PeakVersatility First cousins is about genetics. Has far as older women, there is a health risk at all ages. A friend's babies mama died while giving birth. My gran had two heart attacks while giving birth. However, my cut off point for having more children was age 40. Because around ten years to 15 years later women have the menopause to deal with. And the last thing a teenager requires is a mother that is menopausal. It's not fun for the mother either having to deal with the drama of teenagers when she doesn't feel well herself.
YES! Most of them is never given any say in the matter!
of course not, they may start to think what a obscene and degenerate thing it is
I hope Britian is enjoying its cultural richness and diversity.
We are very much not
It's not Britain, or not just, it's the entire West
Of course we should. I actually thought we had made it illegal already. Why haven’t we?
Is Britain a country or an Economic Zone which will accept whatever mental laws aggressive colonising migrants demand of it? With Dr Nazir Afsal
Let's see what Dr Nazir Afsal has to say. He's clearly who the Spectator has chosen to represent Britain
Or not. Bye everyone
Great comment
Very true.
Lets listen to what Dr Nazir Donkey Afsal has to say.
I hate that I have to share a passport with these people.
I thought it was already banned, morally if not legally.
Interesting discussion, although he undermined his argument by asserting that Robinson is "far right".
Hear hear.
There’s a reason why it’s controversial. Think about the children born into such a marriage. 😢 #incest
The answer is obviously yes, the fact we need to discuss....
Why is this even a question? Our culture is in no way "enriched" by such practices. Why do we not hear an outcry about this manifestation of "cultural imperialism" on the part of these uninvited guests?
Try and get that bloody Starmer and his crew to agree to anything that diminishes their voting base
Criticise Islam? Faaaar right..
That's a deflective prejudice.
Britain for Britons. No one else.
Nazir starts by playing the victim then tries to nuance a justification for forced incest! What a guy??
Why is this even being debated?
To be fair it wasn’t uncommon in this country until a few generations ago. What’s frightening is that far from continuing to die out, the globalists have ensured it is resurgent.
Real reason. The issue was chosen to create ethnic tension in the face of mass immigration.
The real issue to me is the lack of integration it represents
Quite possibly, but it in that case it only targets the Pakistani muslim community and some african muslim groups, not immigrants in general @@tomwright9904
How would they know if it is a cousin? The surnames are different for men and women within the same family. How would they know that the wife coming from Asia is actually a cousin?
genetic testing before marriage
Why not get a biologist to contribute to this, rather than a solicitor?
That would be asking too much
Yeah its asking too much. Scientific knowledge and practice is too straightforward and logical for these people.
They have to complicate it to twist it to their fascist ends and get control over people.
Or a medical practitioner ...
@carltaylor6452 It depends on that account, I'd rather have someone who can talk accurately about genetics, and the issues. Because that is where the ethical claims come from.
A medical practitioner can just be a nurse, not good enough, I want the least biased opinions.
Im a muslim from the balkans and topics like this aren't even something to be discussed in our region. Muslims from the eastern hemisphere on the otherhand are just too rigid with thier views and practices, not willing to accept that other cultures adopt it differently. Quite often I've personally experienced hilarious forms of guilt tripping to suggest our conservative take on religion is somehow of lesser quality. This is where I think the problem is wrongly targetted at religion and instead should be highlighted as a difference in culture.
This is a longer post but hopefully it’s worth it, regarding a book called British Islam and English Law by Patrick Nash that talks about cousin marriage as a turning point.
On page 302, he talks about “types of group they endanger the nation, state, civil society and individual rights”, one of which is revolutionary religious groups and the other of which is transnational clans, which are “more widespread and cumulatively destructive by far. These kinship networks facilitate all manner of criminality and corruption: terrorist financing, money laundering, school misgovernance, election fraud, the toxification of politics, the disenfranchisement of young British Muslims, child sexual exploitation, drug trafficking, racial and religious hatred, misogyny and honour violence, forced marriage, cold-blooded murder, the obstruction of justice, and so forth.”
He goes on to say “As to the deconstruction of clans, that requires little more than a halt to the inflow of consanguineous relationships via adequately enforced ban on cousin marriage up to and including second degree.”
What might seem like an Islamic quirk is more likely to be an attempt to establish a deep and dangerous structure!
Yes it should be banned. We are not a third world country, we developed. We should NOT be importing or reverting back to third world practices.
Don't agree with Nazir but this was excellent, a nuanced insider perspective. If you don't listen you don't learn.
Imagine showing this to our ancestors who fought for our values and culture in World War 2? What a joke this country has become.
NOW, I realize what is wrong with Britain...!
We left bonkers UK for the wonderful IOM last year.
People are cery midful here about this issue ased on the hstory of the isand which was extremely insular with a small population until the recent past. There are very real genetic implicatiins of first cousin marriage. To be avoided.
How sad that you even have to debate this as the once great England. Return to Christ who gave you that beautiful country in the first place
Yes. That would destroy the Monarchy.
"I'm going to cherry pick the facts and talking points to promote my viewpoint" - Dr Nazir Afsal
21:58 and I paraphrase: 'the jury is out on whether first cousin marriage has genetic health risks' - these are beliefs which I really don't see as being compatible with those of the general population
How unfortunate that this speaker is so ignorant as to label Tommy Robinson 'far right'. Clearly he has bought the mainstream media propaganda. Tommy is not far right wing, he is simply sensible. He actually cares about his own community and the community of his country. I have always considered myself to be left wing but now in my early 60s I find that the things I have always believed are now called right wing. It's ridiculous and highly manipulative. I'm afraid that this makes me seriously question his judgement on other matters. As for who you can't marry, the Church of England has a table of affinity which tells you who you cannot marry (I.e. have children with). The Church of England is a state religion, so the state should be guided by it.
@louisetrott5532 First cousin marriage is not banned by CofE and is not on the list of prohibited relationships. Probably because historically that would have made a very small pool for royalty marrying other Protestants, and secondly because it was rare amongst the majority. As time passed and the dangers were well understood, marrying cousins of any degree in the UK died out.
It's rife in the pakistani moslem community.
This is one of those unfortunate things where the UK is being forced to do something that didn't need the force of law before. I know this is a minor "freedom" to give up, but still. Similar to the recently announced limits to homeschooling, both are because of mass immigration of people from different cultures.
(and as an actual traditionalist, I'm not one to reflexively attack Islam from the left as many Western "centre-right" conservatives do, for being insufficiently liberal)
I’m amazed it is allowed. I thought it was already banned. I think it is not allowed by the Church
The craziest thing about this being in the news recently, is that i already thought it was banned...thought it is certain groups that "you shouldnt name" who take part in it.
The point is should it even be under consideration at all? The outcome is not good by reason of children born into such 😢medically
Obviously
More important than a ban on blasphemy
It shouldn't be banned outright, but there should be strict limitations on this.
This doctor is a hero.
If you marry your first cousin AND have children over the age of 35, what does that risk profile look like? And lets not forget the age of the father is also relevant but rarely discussed, as we still have a rather misogynist outlook that only discusses the risks and responsibilities of women who have their children at a more mature age. I invite people to have a look at those statistics. Whats the risk profile of first cousin marriage, with mother and father over the age of 35?
This should never have come up in parliament, it should how our nation as gone backwards just like any country that allows it!
1st cousin marriage and civil partnerships should be banned legally to deter cousin marriage which will help avoid recessive genetic disorders in children, but if people want to co-habit or do special ceremonies they want to call marriage then 'have at it'.
If the risk is so small why do we see the consequences so often. Families with 4 or 5 children with disabilities. Seen it more than once. Some consequences are not so obvious. Aggressive behavior and poor self control are the most common ones.
If a community decide to continue with harmful cultural norms because of the so called 'far right' are critical of it I think that tells you all you need to know about both groups
Why would you even want to marry your cousin......
If group A decide to continue with harmful cultural norms because group B are critical of it I think that tells you all you need to know about both groups
Why doesn't Britain change it's name to Anyland or Everyland or something like that? Cause it ain't Britain anymore!
Does the risk of birth defects increase when the children of the 1st cousin marriage then go on to marry their 1st cousin who will be a product of a family of 1st cousin marriages in the same dynasty? hope that makes sense?
How sad that we are talking about this? Not least, recessive chromosome disorders, lack hybrid vigour, unnecessary and cruel suffering.😮
Of course
I don’t think he’s the right person for this job. H s you moderate while the UK is facing an extreme existential threat
Communities communities communities.
Communities shouldn't have rights. Communities shouldn't make decisions. Just individuals
How is this issue controversial?
I read that there were over a thousand Muslims living in this country now. What is going on?
If you're referring to the UK, there are nearly 4 million Muslims legally resident here.
@@carltaylor6452 Don't believe you. I don't remember a referendum or a vote on that
worst bait ever
ban bar baric non-st un ani mal slaug hter
Does this mean it's legal now? Only asking because my cousin is hot as hell! 😁😆😅😂
Most of my cousins are married.
But what you do if it happens, especially in the Muslim culture and Jewish culture which is prevalent
Politely ask them to perhaps consider moving to a stone-age country where this sort of shit is normal.
Jail time
Everyone needs to follow the law. Is generally the consensus. Or face the consequences.
@@hogowar come-on! who is going to implement this, would be great but would not happen
@@DannysGalaxyTab why ? we need them, to take jobs we don't want , or that's what they tell us lol
Cousin marriage?
Inbreeding?
Well, if the Habsburgs are any indication . . .
Can I hear banjos?
This will continue...Sharia Law ? 😮
Yes!
Lol Britishstan
@JordanM