The thing that puzzles me a little in the first incident is why the crew didn't check control movements before they left the ground. When I started flying it was drilled into me that all control surfaces were checked for full and correct movement even before taxiing.
The only thing I can think of is that fatigue and frequent repetition led to them to mistakenly believe they had already checked the controls (or some other item). I have seen this happen.
As an Army Grunt who has flown in the back of the 130 many times, this brought a tear to my eye. Ive been in the back during nap of the earth and was in the back during a combat descent or whatever you flyboys call it when your flying along and take fire. In all that time i always felt relatively safe. RIP thanks for the video putting it out there means they wont ever be forgotten.
I just retired from the Army in 2022 after 22 years. I agree I flew in a lot of C-130s. Have total appreciation for the job aviators do. Got me into and out of Iraq 3 times. Also various other missions etc.
I agree with that - neither case was bad luck. Luck had nothing to do with the shoddy maintenance of the second case. Stupidity only applies to the first mishap though. I’ve always wondered why the air force doesn’t use jet engines for these large planes especially.
@@moiraatkinson Turboprop engines are far more fuel efficient than jet engines, particularly at lower speeds necessary for dropping parachutes, and more reliable in unimproved areas with lots of dust, sand, grass, and rocks. So they are the engine of choice in applications where speed is not valued, but reliability and cost per mile is highly valued. They'll be around a long time yet. Besides, the turbo prop engines on the C130 are basically a jet engine driving a propeller.
The loss of 000 Nuts was a tragic loss for all USMC 130 folks including us retired guys. I had worked on that bird in the past as an engine Mech and knew GySgt Johnson (B)we had flown together many times in the past. He along with the others will always be remembered…we never forget…..
I was a C-130 (B & E models) propeller technician (AFS 42171) during the Viet Nam war. Although I never personally knew of a blade separating from a prop during that time, it was always one of my greatest fears. It's almost unbelievable the torsional and centrifugal forces at work in a prop. I'm pleasantly surprised we don't hear about more incidents like that.
All the blades are/were sent to Depot at Robins for inspection. They failed to detect the cracks in this one due to faulty procedures. Many others were found later. That's why the Navy grounded their Herks until the new Props were installed. NP2000, with 8 blades. The Air Force is finally upgrading all the remaining legacy(non J models) C-130s with the new propeller assemblies. I've heard of blade failures but it was an individual blade gear rather than separating from the prop housing. You know the blade going flat but still remaining attached.
Doubly tragic that the prop could have dislodged at any point outside of the 2-4 o'clock and 8-10 positions and moved cleanly away from the craft without such catastrophic damage.
@@my-yt-inputs2580 Their ASIP people clearly weren't doing their job. The program office was like, "We don't know the fatigue life of these things, that's unknowable." They'd know that if they were tracking it, they're only managing the 2nd oldest plane in the AF. I swear, anything managed out of Robins is a hot mess. The wrong ALCs got BRAC'd (2 of 5 got chopped, one of them should've been Robins).
They were cracking the blades in the peening they were doing with the wrong shot.At Robbins the plant I used to work for made the peening machines for them and they knew they weren't following procedures.
A minor correction to the first accident. NVG's are used to look outside and are focused for distance vision. Cockpit instrument scans are accomplished by looking underneath the NVG's unaided. The H3 and J model cockpit lighting is green and in a wavelength that doesn't interfere and washout the NVGs.
As a C-130 loadmaster with just under 5400 hours any C-130 incident hits close to home. But during all my years I never needed to have the pilots raise the elevators, and I've hauled plenty of high profile cargo over the years. All the loadmasters I've asked have said the same thing. All my time was spent in H2s. As for the Marine Corps incident, that also hits home because the first six years of my military career were spent in the Marine Corps, although not in Marine Corps aviation. That crew was doing everything right and still they never had a chance. Semper Fi.
I had about 3000 hours in E & G models and also never had to raise the elevators. The horizontal stab is high enough that that is not necessary. I quit flying C-130s after three instances, two of which were fatal crashes, that I narrowly, due to scheduling, missed being on them. I told them that they didn't kill me in a year on AC-47 gunships in Vietnam and I would be damned it they were going to do it then.
Right with you brother. I spent 4 years in Marine maintenance, and flew several times on 000. At re- enlistment, I became aTxANG FE on the 130, so this story really kicked me in the junk. The J model's problem was that you had 2 guys up front that got task saturated and didn't do a basic flight control test during taxi! Guess that's what happens when you try to dump all the jobs on just 2 people.
i spent 24 years on Hercs of all models in the AF. ( LM and FE) I think i saw the elevators raised only 2 or 3 times. Usually we did it by pulling back on the yoke and putting the seat belt around it. 100% obvious to anyone getting into the seat. Seems to me it was a large comm. van the army had.
@@bluskytoo I understand. I did that in maintenance, but it seems like these guys never got it of the seats... and I've seen pilots block the yokes in excavation this way before with the engines running. But as the FE, it was part of my mental checklist to ensure that whatever the two knuckleheads changed from the landing configuration hit changed back BEFORE takeoff!!! Moreover, I would watch the pilots as the went from CP to P to AC to IP and they would all get better at checking their flight controls on their own during taxi without me having to remind them or ensure that everything was good to go. Anybody that is thinking ahead can recognize that it takes more than 3 people to manage a 60 year old plane.
I imagine the horror in the 2nd flight, realizing that you're separated from the rest of the body and falling and there's nothing you can do. Not much better for the passengers that were in the other part though..
I had the exact same reaction - you’ve somehow survived thus far being “protected enough” to now be aware of the futility of ANY/ALL efforts you will make. Grim.
A lot like the Grand Canyon midair collision, where 1 of the planes also had the cockpit sheer off, and the passengers could only watch through the huge hole, where the cockpit was supposed to be, while the plane body stalled, then fell to the ground. As well as MH17 over Ukraine in 2014, it took them close to 3 min to reach the ground, and some of the victims were found with masks on, they had so much time to know, what was happening.
@@dfuher968 After I read your comment about the Grand Canyon I went to have a look at the history. What link do you have to show that one cockpit sheered off ? What I saw was that the tail impacted the wing. Nothing about a missing cockpit.
I'm not usually one to rave about the standard with which you deliver to these videos but I feel compelled to do so this time. The scene starting at 1:29 showing the aeroplane in flight with the fireworks going off was an inspired presentation. Likewise but possibly not as dramatic visually and easily missed, is at 3:30 with the loading of gear (humvee) through the rear and you can see it as it passes an open exit door. There's other things as well but these two had me impressed at your editing and collation skills to the point of my mouth dropping. Thankfully, my coffee was still on the table.
The second crash was unavoidable by the crew, but a 'full and free' pre-take off control check (which should have been carried out but obviously wasn't) would have prevented the first crash. I always did them twice - one on the apron visually observing the control surface movements (my aeroplane was small enough to do that), and then again, once lined up, the last thing before applying take off power was a full exercise of all flight controls to the limit stops checking for any resistance to full stick / yoke and rudder movement. You don't want to discover you don't have full control movement AFTER you have taken off!
Because it was an ERO (engines running onload/offload) it was a continuation of the same flight so pre start checks aren't needed, they were done at the beginning of the flight. An apron walk around with engines running is never done. It was a non SOP action that lead to it, putting the case there in the first place! Factor in fatigue, the desire to get going quickly, and the holes in the Swiss cheese start to line up.
@@mirandahotspring4019 OK,I get that, and it would explain that there's no need to check 'correct control deflection' because that would still be 'good' as the controls worked correctly on the last leg. But there would still be pre-take-off checks to do before launching, and they should include 'full and free' cycling of the stick / yokes and rudder. All sorts of stuff could have affected 'full and free', from bags or other objects fouling the cockpit controls (as in this case), to a stone being blown into the elevator / tailplane gap by the props during taxy, to impact from a ground service vehicle during the stop - and lots of other reasons. It takes about 2 seconds and can be done on the roll if time is that critical, and I always did them before leaving the ground as an instinctive thing - not a check list item, just common sense. A quick 'stop to stop' of all flying controls to ensure 'full and free'. I thought all pilots did that - all the ones I know do.
Can’t decide which is worse, being in the cockpit and experiencing the nose down plummet to the ground, or being in the back and seeing the sky open up before you as you plunge backwards and fall to the ground? 🤔
It always bothered me every time I flew on the 130 that there is a red line painted around the interior of the fuselage in line with the propellers. That's the point the blades will come through should one fail. It was hard to get my nap in while in flight.
That's so sad to hear of the non-battle related crashes. Such a shame. Condolences to the families and friends of the brave service members that lost their lives.
Could you make a video of the Chilean Hercules missing on its way to Antarctica in 2019? It still remains a mystery what happened with that flight. Greetings.
It didn't just disappear, though- debris from the aircraft was located in the sea three days after it went missing. Chilean authorities have yet to release a report on the accident.
Very sad to hear the Missippi failure. All I knew was the plane broke apart during flight. I never heard the conclusion. God bless all of our service members.
Thank you for the graphics throughout the second flight. I was able to better understand the series of events. Condolences to families and friends of all involved.
Very well done, TFC. I couldn’t bring myself to watch the video beyond the point where the NVG case was used as a brace, because I knew what would happen. Finally, on the fourth attempt, I was able to watch. You did a great job on this one. You found an effective way to illustrate the physical damage that broke up the second plane.
Being from Memphis, I don’t know how I never heard about that accident. I would love to see you do FedEx 705 one week-I spotted that MD-10 on its retirement flight out of MEM.
Yanky 72 happened in central MS. It was a good distance from Memphis. I remember that incident quite well. I grew up in Eads, lived elsewhere then and now. The plane broke up over a hwy (not busy), and parts of the plane and equipment aboard were scattered over a large area. I wore a Yanky 72 memorial shirt yesterday coincidentally while frying a turkey and happened across this video. Terrible incident. Have a good one!
This incident was in the news for over a week in Memphis, lead story for most that time. They had reported this flight had departed from Memphis International just prior to the events that unfolded. Story hit home for me, have been in C-130s and my father in law was a navigator on them in Nam.
I've flown in a C-130. HUGE plane with amazing lift. The seating is 2 long benches along both sides, so take off and landing you tip left and right. But it's a smooth ride.
There is a reason why you are supposed to perform a preflight inspection before every takeoff. If the pilot in the left seat, the command pilot, had just pulled the yoke back and forth to check for proper movement he would have discovered the problem. When I was young and cocky I skipped a preflight as I had been flying that same plane and knew it very well. I forgot 2 items that could have been dangerous, but I was lucky. That cured me of skipping preflights.
My dad was a flight instructor in the Air Force when Vietnam was happening. If he was still alive for me to ask him about the first crash, i can only imagine the words that would be flying out of his mouth.
As a flight instructor myself, Jets and helicopters, after my first tour, I know what your dad would have said, since I used a term for my students many times, "Idiot, pay attention before you kill yourself and others". When I was going thru instrument training in flight school, i busted minimums a couple times and my scan of my insruments was too slow and I was missing my turns using an ADF approach. My instructor told me if i kept that up I would kill myself some day. Then I was off to Vietnam. I would practice flying by instruments at least once a week. I would also practive GCA approaches to a local air force base. Flying during monsoons would be a challenge during fog and heavy rain. I never hesitated to climb out to avoid hitting a mountain in the highlands. Many helicopters crashed in Vietnam trying to stay VFR when it became IFR.
@@garygrant9612lol "idiot" is such a kind thing to call someone like that. Its like calling a guy a douschebag for cutting. You off in traffic then brakechecking you
Something not mentioned in the second incident. When that prop blade came off ,the vibration would have been so severe i cant imagine. I had some snow one time frozen onto a blade on #3. We tried to start it thinking it would blow off and we could use the de-icing. It started shaking so incredibly bad we stopped start at around 50% as best i remember. Im sure that had a little to do with the structural failure. Just my input, ty.
PLE MIE, special forces attack. We were in a UH1 dropping flares over the area, our aircraft was blacked out to stop being shot at. Then in front of our glare shield, it seemed, to be a three foot wide of red tracers that lit up our cockpit. Instantly we turned on every outside light we had, to show spooky (C130) ,which we didn't know he was above us we, that were're under them. One of many close calls of flying in Vietnam 1966 and 1967. I went on to a career of flying corporate jets. Standard procedures was a Fats check before taking the runway. Trims, flaps, controls, airbrakes speeds.
I was stationed with 000 in New York and was actually in a C130 in the air at the same time the crash happened. When we landed our phones were blowing up because our families saw the news and thought it was us. I can’t describe how devastating it was to our small Marine C130 community to lose a crew of talented and beloved Marines.
The marine KC130 that broke up over Mississippi was from my base in Newburgh NY. Half the base was ANG, half Marine. I was with the air guard. We use to see the aircraft out there on the ramp and called it balls 0. As it was three 0’s, and a window near the numbers that also looked like a fourth 0. After this incident every one of their c130’s had the props removed for inspection
I was visiting my mom in the Mississippi Delta when the second crash occurred about 50 miles from her house. I heard that the fire crews could not get close because of the ammunition/ordnance going off. A portion of U.S. highway 82 was renamed for this crew and a permanent memorial was built at the crash site. I've visited it. Very sobering!
Flying one of my trips as captain for a US airline in a narrow body jet (either MD-88 or B-717: ATL-based), my First Officer was ex-USMC C-130 pilot, and iirc he also had flown their unique "Fat Albert" among other USMC C-130s. That's just a sidenote to highlight that he was a highly-qualified Marine "130 driver". Soon after the horrible crash in MS, he was an Aircraft Commander in cruise flight somewhere in a C-130. He was thoroughly familiar with what caused that crash, and was aware that a subtle but detectable odd vibration might be detected in a cockpit seat-- possibly even Before a prop could separate in this manner. He told me that he felt a very brief but weird vibration or whatever the words he used. Luckily he had been mentally prepared for the chance that this could happen. The vibration was reflected in at least one of the engine gauges (older classic C-130s had four rows of eight gauges in each) and he immed verified which condition lever was to be pulled, then Quickly but carefully "Caged It" = he feathered the prop and shutdown the engine. Normally in an aircraft you Always want to involve the other pilot in any major or sudden changes to engine controls, being very methodical, but he wasn't going to risk what could happen if the vibration was due to a crack in a propeller blade..
I cannot imagine just rising into the air slowly drifting upwards as the angle of attack increases second after second and there's nothing you can do to save your plane, you are literally flying up into a death trap.
Wow, a couple of sad stories here. I'm former A.F. I spent most of my career on C-130's 20 years. The first should've never happened. As a maintainer, we never put anything between flight controls or control surfaces. At first I thought the pilot moved the elevators without hydraulic power which you are not susposed to do, but it said during ERO (Engine Run Offload), so hydraulic power was used and isn't that difficult to move the surfaces. I wonder why the load master had the pilot move the elevators? Knowing that the loading ramp is just as wide as the rear emphanage of the aircraft, you shouldn't have to move the control surfaces to load or unload the aircraft. Every time I've witnessed a load or unload, they come in straight from the back with a K-loader or forklift. If you had to move the elevators, it should be too big to fit. The second story is just sad. Nothing could've been done to save them except if they didn't fly that aircraft until an in-depth inspection on the prop assembly was performed. But that story reminds me of an almost tragic story similar to it. One of our sister squadrons was deploying from the states to somewhere in North Africa (I think), on final into Pope AFB the #3 prop detached from the engine and hit the #4 prop knocking off at a 45 degree angle. The type of aircraft was like the one shown at the end of this video. If you've ever worked that type you'll know they are heavy due to all the extra equipment on board. They managed to land without any other damage or injuries (except to their underwear), but I believe if they were at cruise height the results would've been tragically different.
@GearGuardianGaming Trying to understand your comment. Are you saying that because he used to fly C130s this upsets you ? If he was involved in this accident then I completely understand but if not then I don't really get the comment. Your use of past tense didn't suggest he was.
I remember when the Jalalabad crash happened. I was still enlisted and was stationed at Dyess AFB. I was a crew chief on the B-1. The C-130 was one of our birds and those were guys from our base. Couldn’t believe what I was hearing when we were told what caused it. Things like that are why they always stress to never deviate from procedures. Incredibly unfortunate accident. RIP TORQUE 62.
How terrifying it would be to be in the cockpit when the front part of the fuselage breaks away, falling to the ground knowing you are going to die and there was nothing you can do to change that...
I've subscribed to this channel before, but it looks like YT's got glitches, and unsubscribed me. I've heard about this happening on other channels! Thanks for the great content!
I'm wondering if it's because people gave them crap in the last video about the length of the "in memory of" portion, deeming it too short. Maybe they decided to eliminate it altogether going forward
Very Sad! Could have happened to any of us fliers on any given flight day. I was very lucky to safely accumulate 2,500 hours as a P-3C aircrewman, over 24 years of flying. 🙏
Non-pilot question: Wouldn't a preflight checklist include verifying the status of the elevators, which would have disclosed that they were not in standard placement and led to the discovery of the goggles box still blocking the yoke?
@@ladydamiana6841 Preflight was done before the first flight. They were performing an ERO(Engine Running Offload). They flew the plane in, offloaded cargo, and then returned to runway for a takeoff. The procedure is for the pilots to check for free and clear movement of the flight controls before taking the runway which they apparently did not do.
@@my-yt-inputs2580 Thanks for the reply! So....the offload was considered as part of the first flight (seems odd if the plane is on the ground, but OK). And then the flight controls weren't checked before resuming the flight. I wonder if it was necessary for the pilots to wear those goggles, which blocked them from seeing the box.
@@ladydamiana6841 In the C-130 world it is not uncommon to takeoff and land multiple times in the same day. A full pre-flight is performed before the first flight. Once you takeoff and then land again only to start engines within a certain period of time no new pre-flights are required especially if being operated by the same crew. A pre-flight is only required for the first flight of the day. The pilots are still required to check the flight controls properly as it is part of the checklist before taking off again. A specific challenge item. As far as them wearing goggles I'm not sure if they were actually wearing them at the time. Don't remember. I'd have to reread the accident report to be sure. Whether they were wearing them or not doesn't preclude them from using the NVG box as they did. I suspect they're not really required during grounds ops as the interior lighting is good enough without NVGs. NOGs are basically for looking outside.
I was flying locally and greenwood tower told me Memphis center had a plane not answering I saw the smoke flew over it and reported to greenwood never forget it
The pilots in the first tragedy seemed to do everything right in trying to recover the aircraft except remember to remove the case blocking the yoke. Also I can't imagine the terror those that were strapped in the front of that second plane felt as they waited to impact the earth. Thank you all for your service. RIP. 😢
In all preflight checks of the world, from a little Cessna to a big Jumbo, there´s a checkpoint called "Ckeck flight controls for free movement". A propeller strike with such catastrofic result is not acceptable.
Man hate seeing this, a MH53 mishap ended my career and almost ended me all together... was scared shitless and probably screamed like a little girl all the way down to the water (Our Main Gear Box Failed) RIP GONZO!
3:20 Its important to note the pilots did not have to hold the elevators all the way up. The request to raise the elevators was because the elevators drooped to their lowest positions when the engines are turned off and there is no hydraulic pressure. The pilots simply had to raise them to their level flight position or higher.
I don't remember the name of the flight but there was a civilian flight that did almost the same thing. The pilot was using a camera and taking photos then placed the camera down by the controls. It was also at night and this was not caught until it was too late.
I don't understand why the pilot who raised the elevators in the first incident didn't think at some point, 'you know, I might have left that case on the yoke.' He had plenty of time to remember.
If you cant push the yoke forward then it's blocked, simple reminder. On the second accident, pulling back power may have kept the other prop on. Just MHO.
I rode in a C-130 from Cairo, Egypt to Reykjavik, Iceland to Hunter Army Airfield in Savannah, GA. We had an overnight scheduled layover in Iceland but had to stay there for about 2 weeks because the two engines on the right wing weren’t getting fuel when we arrived at the airstrip the next morning, which frightened me a little when we had to re-board the plane for the last leg. And after watching videos from this channel over the last 6 months, I don’t believe I will ever fly again.
@@timf2279 airborne eh? Hooah! *edit* I just looked at your channel profile picture and I’m glad I understood what you meant within a couple seconds. I wanted to be airborne so desperately back then. When I was at the MEPS station picking infantry, the jobs guy told me that airborne would come to us at the end of basic training. Sure enough, they did come and handed out forms to sign up. Unfortunately, we were designated to the Bradleys and my drill sergeant called me into the office and ripped up my application saying “you’re mechanized infantry, you’ll never need this.” I was heart broken and those wings would’ve given me more points towards promotion. What was your mos?
@TheVenominside I was a 54E1P NBC specialist. When I enlisted, I had NBC, Jump school, and 82nd in my contract. The only options were cook and NBC. I later found out I was in a package platoon of 44 people. We all had the same contract. We were in basic AIT, jump school, and 82nd together. I think about 23 didn't make it all the way. Most all of us were sent to the 21st Chemical Company (ABN). At the time it was the only airborne Chemical Company in the free world. I understand now that it is no longer airborne but still at Fort Bragg.
When I rode one in 1995 I don’t recall the crew even mentioning them and I can’t remember seeing them. Typically you would be sitting on a long bench with your back to the fuselage with a seat belt. Once at cruising altitude you could unbuckle and be able to walk around. So, even if they did have parachutes, they probably wouldn’t have even been able to get to them much less be able to put them on in time
We carried six parachutes for the crew in our Air National Guard C-130 squadron, but I seriously doubt anyone would have been able to put one on and make a successful bailout. You'd be dealing with sudden deceleration and then wind blast once the forward section fell off. Anyone in back would have been incapacitated almost immediately with no chance of survival.
I rode one in 2003 and there were definitely parachute packs on board (don't know how many), however in a catastrophic event such as this there is no time to utilize them.
That's the nature of forgetting. Yes. It would have been great if you hadn't.. But.. You did. Unfortunately forgetting in this case was far more deadly. Many people die over the smallest things. "If Id just listened to Marcus, and waited 10 seconds before sending them on the beer run. They'd never have met with that maniac at the intersection. Now they're all dead!!". Fate can be cruel.
Yep. If I hadn't stopped at the convenience store for coffee, I'd have gone through that light 5 minutes before the guy who ran it and T-boned me. Then again, those 5 minutes might have saved me from something worse. Never know.
Pilot here, in the first incident why didn't the pilots conduct a preflight check to ensure flight controls were free and CORRECT...? WTF....they forget BASIC training?
"Is everybody happy?" Cried the Sergeant looking up Our hero feebly answered, "Yes" and then they stood him up He jumped into the icy blast, his static line unhooked And he ain't gonna jump no moreGory, gory, what a hell of a way to die Gory, gory, what a hell of a way to die Gory, gory, what a hell of a way to die He ain't gonna jump no more
I don't understand how the pilot and copilot did not recognize that the yoke was back further than normal. You would think that one of them would say, "Hey! Why is the yoke so far back?" and look into it....
Being a a Marine who worked on aircraft, even before the video about the Marine Corps C-130 finished I already knew what caused the accident!? Poor maintenance practices! And having retired not too long ago it’s still going on! That’s why I got out!
Disaster #2: The errant blade of engine #2 had 270 degrees in which to fall off from and miss the fuselage. Engine #3 had 270 degrees in which THAT prop could come off and miss the fuselage. That's Final Destination shit.
The 2nd crash was SO tragic as there was nothing for the crew to do to save their ship. My "non-pilot" brain asks if MAYBE they'd slowed their engine speeds & began a gradual descent COULD that have lessened the forces that made gearbox & propeller #3 fail ? Anyone who's a pilot or more educated care to comment ?
Former C130 Flight Engineer here. It happened almost instantaneously. The mass of an unbalanced C130 propeller transferred severe shaking and vibration through the aircraft which caused the #3 gearbox to separate. The C130 has 2 upper and 2 lower main structural stringers. Once they're compromised the nose breaks off. A similar thing happened to the USCG 1705 when the USMC Cobra impacted its left side. A friend hit a bald eagle once on landing in Dutch Harbor Alaska and it destroyed one of the propeller blades. He said the plane shook so bad they couldn't make out the individual instruments on the panel, and that prop retained it's blade, just threw the pitch out of whack with the others.
@@WellRoundedWoodsman Retired C-130 FE(82-2004) here as well. I remember hearing after this accident(I was already retired when it happened) that the Air Force accepted the risk of the 54H60 prop failure scenario. Prop failures of this nature were basically non-existent. Gearbox failures seemed to happen often enough. Dyess-Turkey from 1982. Several others.
I was a Blackhawk crew chief for 8 years so I am not an C-130 expert by any means. This video is slowed way way down. The initial intrusion to the separation was milliseconds.
Things get very tiring during continuous operations that too on goggles. Having said that, checking controls free is the most ignored item in takeoff checks
How is this extreme nose pitch up happening & the pilot who propped up the Yoke to raise the stabilizers NOT making note & removing the obvious cause, his goggle case ? I'm sorry I can't fathom a person being entrusted with such a physical task as piloting a massive & technically demanding craft & then NOT taking immediate corrective actions - especially since HE propped yoke up deliberately. We're I in his place, I'd have told load master to radio me the moment they'd cleared the load so I can return the stabilizer to normal status. All I can think of is this pilot was either massively distracted by an emotional turmoil or sleep deprivation or just lacking physio -mechanical competence. RIP to all the crew in Jesus name.
These large grey military planes always look so sinister, unlike their commercial counterparts. They look like trouble is to be expected more often than the safe completion of the flight. Maybe it’s their age and association with war.
I am baffled by the fact that the crew of the first aircraft did notice that the control column was aft of its normal position. At a minimum, muscle memory should have indicated the control column was aft. In addition, the glaring black spot at the bottom of the instrument panel should have been clue #2. Lastly, the pilot and copilot should have recognized what would feel like a jammed flight control when they attempted to push the control column forward. Given this was the second leg I wouldn't expect crew fatigue to be a factor so it appears to be purely channelized attention by both pilots that resulted in an inability to conclude what was happening.
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The thing that puzzles me a little in the first incident is why the crew didn't check control movements before they left the ground. When I started flying it was drilled into me that all control surfaces were checked for full and correct movement even before taxiing.
The only thing I can think of is that fatigue and frequent repetition led to them to mistakenly believe they had already checked the controls (or some other item). I have seen this happen.
Yep, a normal procedure to check for each takeoff/flight.
"Flight controls free and correct??"
Complacency
They were doing an engines running offload (ERO) so all the pre-flight checks were already done.
As an Army Grunt who has flown in the back of the 130 many times, this brought a tear to my eye. Ive been in the back during nap of the earth and was in the back during a combat descent or whatever you flyboys call it when your flying along and take fire. In all that time i always felt relatively safe. RIP thanks for the video putting it out there means they wont ever be forgotten.
I just retired from the Army in 2022 after 22 years. I agree I flew in a lot of C-130s. Have total appreciation for the job aviators do. Got me into and out of Iraq 3 times. Also various other missions etc.
Stupidity vs bad luck. I feel bad for everyone, but the 2nd crash must’ve been an unbelievable nightmare for all involved. RIP ❤
@@j.pslaym0666 I couldn’t agree more. Very sad.
Amen.
More like stupidity vs. corruption/incompetence. I could tell you many stories about how bad maint crews are. And that was 20 years ago
I agree with that - neither case was bad luck. Luck had nothing to do with the shoddy maintenance of the second case. Stupidity only applies to the first mishap though. I’ve always wondered why the air force doesn’t use jet engines for these large planes especially.
@@moiraatkinson Turboprop engines are far more fuel efficient than jet engines, particularly at lower speeds necessary for dropping parachutes, and more reliable in unimproved areas with lots of dust, sand, grass, and rocks. So they are the engine of choice in applications where speed is not valued, but reliability and cost per mile is highly valued. They'll be around a long time yet. Besides, the turbo prop engines on the C130 are basically a jet engine driving a propeller.
The loss of 000 Nuts was a tragic loss for all USMC 130 folks including us retired guys. I had worked on that bird in the past as an engine Mech and knew GySgt Johnson (B)we had flown together many times in the past. He along with the others will always be remembered…we never forget…..
more like loss deez nutz
@@mikes-wv3em💀
I was a C-130 (B & E models) propeller technician (AFS 42171) during the Viet Nam war. Although I never personally knew of a blade separating from a prop during that time, it was always one of my greatest fears. It's almost unbelievable the torsional and centrifugal forces at work in a prop. I'm pleasantly surprised we don't hear about more incidents like that.
All the blades are/were sent to Depot at Robins for inspection. They failed to detect the cracks in this one due to faulty procedures. Many others were found later. That's why the Navy grounded their Herks until the new Props were installed. NP2000, with 8 blades. The Air Force is finally upgrading all the remaining legacy(non J models) C-130s with the new propeller assemblies. I've heard of blade failures but it was an individual blade gear rather than separating from the prop housing. You know the blade going flat but still remaining attached.
Doubly tragic that the prop could have dislodged at any point outside of the 2-4 o'clock and 8-10 positions and moved cleanly away from the craft without such catastrophic damage.
@@my-yt-inputs2580
Their ASIP people clearly weren't doing their job. The program office was like, "We don't know the fatigue life of these things, that's unknowable." They'd know that if they were tracking it, they're only managing the 2nd oldest plane in the AF. I swear, anything managed out of Robins is a hot mess. The wrong ALCs got BRAC'd (2 of 5 got chopped, one of them should've been Robins).
They were cracking the blades in the peening they were doing with the wrong shot.At Robbins the plant I used to work for made the peening machines for them and they knew they weren't following procedures.
@@chazjackson6317
Interesting!
A minor correction to the first accident. NVG's are used to look outside and are focused for distance vision. Cockpit instrument scans are accomplished by looking underneath the NVG's unaided. The H3 and J model cockpit lighting is green and in a wavelength that doesn't interfere and washout the NVGs.
As a C-130 loadmaster with just under 5400 hours any C-130 incident hits close to home. But during all my years I never needed to have the pilots raise the elevators, and I've hauled plenty of high profile cargo over the years. All the loadmasters I've asked have said the same thing. All my time was spent in H2s. As for the Marine Corps incident, that also hits home because the first six years of my military career were spent in the Marine Corps, although not in Marine Corps aviation. That crew was doing everything right and still they never had a chance. Semper Fi.
I had about 3000 hours in E & G models and also never had to raise the elevators. The horizontal stab is high enough that that is not necessary. I quit flying C-130s after three instances, two of which were fatal crashes, that I narrowly, due to scheduling, missed being on them. I told them that they didn't kill me in a year on AC-47 gunships in Vietnam and I would be damned it they were going to do it then.
Right with you brother. I spent 4 years in Marine maintenance, and flew several times on 000. At re- enlistment, I became aTxANG FE on the 130, so this story really kicked me in the junk. The J model's problem was that you had 2 guys up front that got task saturated and didn't do a basic flight control test during taxi! Guess that's what happens when you try to dump all the jobs on just 2 people.
i spent 24 years on Hercs of all models in the AF. ( LM and FE) I think i saw the elevators raised only 2 or 3 times. Usually we did it by pulling back on the yoke and putting the seat belt around it. 100% obvious to anyone getting into the seat. Seems to me it was a large comm. van the army had.
@@bluskytoo I understand. I did that in maintenance, but it seems like these guys never got it of the seats... and I've seen pilots block the yokes in excavation this way before with the engines running. But as the FE, it was part of my mental checklist to ensure that whatever the two knuckleheads changed from the landing configuration hit changed back BEFORE takeoff!!! Moreover, I would watch the pilots as the went from CP to P to AC to IP and they would all get better at checking their flight controls on their own during taxi without me having to remind them or ensure that everything was good to go. Anybody that is thinking ahead can recognize that it takes more than 3 people to manage a 60 year old plane.
I'm curious would any of you guys serve in our military right now? Thank you all for your service...
I imagine the horror in the 2nd flight, realizing that you're separated from the rest of the body and falling and there's nothing you can do. Not much better for the passengers that were in the other part though..
I had the exact same reaction - you’ve somehow survived thus far being “protected enough” to now be aware of the futility of ANY/ALL efforts you will make. Grim.
A lot like the Grand Canyon midair collision, where 1 of the planes also had the cockpit sheer off, and the passengers could only watch through the huge hole, where the cockpit was supposed to be, while the plane body stalled, then fell to the ground.
As well as MH17 over Ukraine in 2014, it took them close to 3 min to reach the ground, and some of the victims were found with masks on, they had so much time to know, what was happening.
Sooooo sad situation!!!@@dfuher968 Reallyt sorry for all of them
There was the ww2 ball turret gunner in US plane, blown apart from plane, must have thought that, hit firs & was fine,phew
@@dfuher968 After I read your comment about the Grand Canyon I went to have a look at the history. What link do you have to show that one cockpit sheered off ? What I saw was that the tail impacted the wing. Nothing about a missing cockpit.
I like that you try to be as accurate as possible in every video
"The copilot states, 'Ahh'"
Honestly, this felt highly unusual and unnecessary, but that's just my opinion
I'm not usually one to rave about the standard with which you deliver to these videos but I feel compelled to do so this time. The scene starting at 1:29 showing the aeroplane in flight with the fireworks going off was an inspired presentation. Likewise but possibly not as dramatic visually and easily missed, is at 3:30 with the loading of gear (humvee) through the rear and you can see it as it passes an open exit door. There's other things as well but these two had me impressed at your editing and collation skills to the point of my mouth dropping. Thankfully, my coffee was still on the table.
Didn't he show both of these incidents before?
Agreed! The presentation is so amazing.
The second crash was unavoidable by the crew, but a 'full and free' pre-take off control check (which should have been carried out but obviously wasn't) would have prevented the first crash. I always did them twice - one on the apron visually observing the control surface movements (my aeroplane was small enough to do that), and then again, once lined up, the last thing before applying take off power was a full exercise of all flight controls to the limit stops checking for any resistance to full stick / yoke and rudder movement. You don't want to discover you don't have full control movement AFTER you have taken off!
Because it was an ERO (engines running onload/offload) it was a continuation of the same flight so pre start checks aren't needed, they were done at the beginning of the flight. An apron walk around with engines running is never done. It was a non SOP action that lead to it, putting the case there in the first place! Factor in fatigue, the desire to get going quickly, and the holes in the Swiss cheese start to line up.
@@mirandahotspring4019 OK,I get that, and it would explain that there's no need to check 'correct control deflection' because that would still be 'good' as the controls worked correctly on the last leg.
But there would still be pre-take-off checks to do before launching, and they should include 'full and free' cycling of the stick / yokes and rudder.
All sorts of stuff could have affected 'full and free', from bags or other objects fouling the cockpit controls (as in this case), to a stone being blown into the elevator / tailplane gap by the props during taxy, to impact from a ground service vehicle during the stop - and lots of other reasons. It takes about 2 seconds and can be done on the roll if time is that critical, and I always did them before leaving the ground as an instinctive thing - not a check list item, just common sense. A quick 'stop to stop' of all flying controls to ensure 'full and free'. I thought all pilots did that - all the ones I know do.
As always great work my friend. I couldn't imagine being in that cockpit seeing the ground coming at you. What a horrific way to die
Waiting for impact must have been awful RIP
just an old verbal responce, "oh shit"!!!
This is like something out of my worst nightmare
Can’t decide which is worse, being in the cockpit and experiencing the nose down plummet to the ground, or being in the back and seeing the sky open up before you as you plunge backwards and fall to the ground? 🤔
It always bothered me every time I flew on the 130 that there is a red line painted around the interior of the fuselage in line with the propellers. That's the point the blades will come through should one fail. It was hard to get my nap in while in flight.
That's so sad to hear of the non-battle related crashes. Such a shame. Condolences to the families and friends of the brave service members that lost their lives.
Could you make a video of the Chilean Hercules missing on its way to Antarctica in 2019? It still remains a mystery what happened with that flight. Greetings.
It didn't just disappear, though- debris from the aircraft was located in the sea three days after it went missing. Chilean authorities have yet to release a report on the accident.
Very sad to hear the Missippi failure. All I knew was the plane broke apart during flight. I never heard the conclusion. God bless all of our service members.
from a fault in the propeller blade from 6 years previously. Terrible luck all around.
God ?
no, the mistakes of man@@SunofYork
Thank you for the graphics throughout the second flight. I was able to better understand the series of events. Condolences to families and friends of all involved.
Very well done, TFC. I couldn’t bring myself to watch the video beyond the point where the NVG case was used as a brace, because I knew what would happen. Finally, on the fourth attempt, I was able to watch. You did a great job on this one. You found an effective way to illustrate the physical damage that broke up the second plane.
Being from Memphis, I don’t know how I never heard about that accident. I would love to see you do FedEx 705 one week-I spotted that MD-10 on its retirement flight out of MEM.
Yanky 72 happened in central MS. It was a good distance from Memphis. I remember that incident quite well. I grew up in Eads, lived elsewhere then and now. The plane broke up over a hwy (not busy), and parts of the plane and equipment aboard were scattered over a large area. I wore a Yanky 72 memorial shirt yesterday coincidentally while frying a turkey and happened across this video. Terrible incident. Have a good one!
This incident was in the news for over a week in Memphis, lead story for most that time. They had reported this flight had departed from Memphis International just prior to the events that unfolded. Story hit home for me, have been in C-130s and my father in law was a navigator on them in Nam.
The way it stalled reminded me of the Afghanistan 747 crash...
Rest in peace brothers ! 😢
Ret. GySgt USMC
I've flown in a C-130. HUGE plane with amazing lift. The seating is 2 long benches along both sides, so take off and landing you tip left and right. But it's a smooth ride.
Loud inside though. I got to ride in one once.
As soon as I read about the goggles case I knew what this was going to be... Infamous
There is a reason why you are supposed to perform a preflight inspection before every takeoff. If the pilot in the left seat, the command pilot, had just pulled the yoke back and forth to check for proper movement he would have discovered the problem. When I was young and cocky I skipped a preflight as I had been flying that same plane and knew it very well. I forgot 2 items that could have been dangerous, but I was lucky. That cured me of skipping preflights.
A pre-flight was done before the first take-off. This was an ERO(Engine Running Offload).
You would think.
Very horrible crashes. The second video was deep. Very deep
Again you excel on your channel! A beautifully done clip! Clear and precise 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
The scariest thing about plane crashes is imagining yourself in a situation out of your control accompanied by impending doom
My dad was a flight instructor in the Air Force when Vietnam was happening. If he was still alive for me to ask him about the first crash, i can only imagine the words that would be flying out of his mouth.
As a flight instructor myself, Jets and helicopters, after my first tour, I know what your dad would have said, since I used a term for my students many times, "Idiot, pay attention before you kill yourself and others".
When I was going thru instrument training in flight school, i busted minimums a couple times and my scan of my insruments was too slow and I was missing my turns using an ADF approach. My instructor told me if i kept that up I would kill myself some day.
Then I was off to Vietnam. I would practice flying by instruments at least once a week. I would also practive GCA approaches to a local air force base. Flying during monsoons would be a challenge during fog and heavy rain. I never hesitated to climb out to avoid hitting a mountain in the highlands. Many helicopters crashed in Vietnam trying to stay VFR when it became IFR.
@@garygrant9612lol "idiot" is such a kind thing to call someone like that. Its like calling a guy a douschebag for cutting. You off in traffic then brakechecking you
Your daddy was a terrible pilot.
@@RobertLegereIII ???
JFC that last one..like some kind of final destination movie.
Wow I love TFC
Agreed
Something not mentioned in the second incident. When that prop blade came off ,the vibration would have been so severe i cant imagine. I had some snow one time frozen onto a blade on #3. We tried to start it thinking it would blow off and we could use the de-icing. It started shaking so incredibly bad we stopped start at around 50% as best i remember. Im sure that had a little to do with the structural failure. Just my input, ty.
I wonder how long the whole sequence took, from the blade separating to the front of the plane coming off, if the pilots would have had any time.
PLE MIE, special forces attack. We were in a UH1 dropping flares over the area, our aircraft was blacked out to stop being shot at. Then in front of our glare shield, it seemed, to be a three foot wide of red tracers that lit up our cockpit. Instantly we turned on every outside light we had, to show spooky (C130) ,which we didn't know he was above us we, that were're under them. One of many close calls of flying in Vietnam 1966 and 1967. I went on to a career of flying corporate jets. Standard procedures was a Fats check before taking the runway. Trims, flaps, controls, airbrakes speeds.
I was stationed with 000 in New York and was actually in a C130 in the air at the same time the crash happened. When we landed our phones were blowing up because our families saw the news and thought it was us. I can’t describe how devastating it was to our small Marine C130 community to lose a crew of talented and beloved Marines.
How do you feel about trusting all responsible parties for your safety now?
That was beyond tragic
The marine KC130 that broke up over Mississippi was from my base in Newburgh NY. Half the base was ANG, half Marine. I was with the air guard. We use to see the aircraft out there on the ramp and called it balls 0. As it was three 0’s, and a window near the numbers that also looked like a fourth 0.
After this incident every one of their c130’s had the props removed for inspection
I was visiting my mom in the Mississippi Delta when the second crash occurred about 50 miles from her house. I heard that the fire crews could not get close because of the ammunition/ordnance going off. A portion of U.S. highway 82 was renamed for this crew and a permanent memorial was built at the crash site. I've visited it. Very sobering!
Flying one of my trips as captain for a US airline in a narrow body jet (either MD-88 or B-717: ATL-based), my First Officer was ex-USMC C-130 pilot, and iirc he also had flown their unique
"Fat Albert" among other USMC C-130s. That's just a sidenote to highlight that he was a highly-qualified Marine "130 driver".
Soon after the horrible crash in MS, he was an Aircraft Commander in cruise flight somewhere in a C-130. He was thoroughly familiar with what caused that crash, and was aware that a subtle but detectable odd vibration might be detected in a cockpit seat-- possibly even Before a prop could separate in this manner.
He told me that he felt a very brief but weird vibration or whatever the words he used. Luckily he had been mentally prepared for the chance that this could happen.
The vibration was reflected in at least one of the engine gauges (older classic C-130s had four rows of eight gauges in each) and he immed verified which condition lever was to be pulled, then Quickly but carefully "Caged It" = he feathered the prop and shutdown the engine.
Normally in an aircraft you Always want to involve the other pilot in any major or sudden changes to engine controls, being very methodical, but he wasn't going to risk what could happen if the vibration was due to a crack in a propeller blade..
The "Mrs. Liederlover" is my wife's designation. She never was a pilot.
Dude, tldr... Who do you think you are? lmfao NOBODY is going to read this.
I cannot imagine just rising into the air slowly drifting upwards as the angle of attack increases second after second and there's nothing you can do to save your plane, you are literally flying up into a death trap.
Wow, a couple of sad stories here. I'm former A.F. I spent most of my career on C-130's 20 years. The first should've never happened. As a maintainer, we never put anything between flight controls or control surfaces. At first I thought the pilot moved the elevators without hydraulic power which you are not susposed to do, but it said during ERO (Engine Run Offload), so hydraulic power was used and isn't that difficult to move the surfaces. I wonder why the load master had the pilot move the elevators? Knowing that the loading ramp is just as wide as the rear emphanage of the aircraft, you shouldn't have to move the control surfaces to load or unload the aircraft. Every time I've witnessed a load or unload, they come in straight from the back with a K-loader or forklift. If you had to move the elevators, it should be too big to fit.
The second story is just sad. Nothing could've been done to save them except if they didn't fly that aircraft until an in-depth inspection on the prop assembly was performed. But that story reminds me of an almost tragic story similar to it. One of our sister squadrons was deploying from the states to somewhere in North Africa (I think), on final into Pope AFB the #3 prop detached from the engine and hit the #4 prop knocking off at a 45 degree angle. The type of aircraft was like the one shown at the end of this video. If you've ever worked that type you'll know they are heavy due to all the extra equipment on board. They managed to land without any other damage or injuries (except to their underwear), but I believe if they were at cruise height the results would've been tragically different.
I was in Air Force,worked on C-130s,there is no way elevators could interfere with loading out the back tail.
It's like 25'+!!!! I was dumbfounded by the request!! What the hell were they loading in that plane? lol
Sad loss. My daughter’s brother in law was on that plane😢
First or second?
Edit: i sense a bot.
@@GearGuardianGaming Both
Happy Thanksgiving to all the Flight Channel community.
TFC, i love your work, but honestly, i have to pass on this one.
My step son flew C 130s.
What does that mean ?
@@regwatson2017tell me you are a bot without telling me.
@@GearGuardianGaming Maybe born, nay, conceived.. in [late] 2017? ;]
@GearGuardianGaming Trying to understand your comment. Are you saying that because he used to fly C130s this upsets you ? If he was involved in this accident then I completely understand but if not then I don't really get the comment. Your use of past tense didn't suggest he was.
So much for the preflight walk around
Another re-upload. What a surprise.
I was thinking it had already been published.
Hard to complain when it is for free.
Genius pilot.
I remember when the Jalalabad crash happened. I was still enlisted and was stationed at Dyess AFB. I was a crew chief on the B-1. The C-130 was one of our birds and those were guys from our base. Couldn’t believe what I was hearing when we were told what caused it. Things like that are why they always stress to never deviate from procedures. Incredibly unfortunate accident.
RIP TORQUE 62.
How terrifying it would be to be in the cockpit when the front part of the fuselage breaks away, falling to the ground knowing you are going to die and there was nothing you can do to change that...
I've subscribed to this channel before, but it looks like YT's got glitches, and unsubscribed me.
I've heard about this happening on other channels!
Thanks for the great content!
Such a tragic incident that happened on the US Marines KC-130 Freighter Plane
The 2nd one was tough to watch. RIP to all who lost their lives in the service of their country.
Great loss RIP .In future such type of incidents must not happened
A very good video, but Why no in memory of for these people who died Flight Channel?
I'm wondering if it's because people gave them crap in the last video about the length of the "in memory of" portion, deeming it too short. Maybe they decided to eliminate it altogether going forward
Could you make a video about the Casa 212 that crashed near the island of Robinson Crusoe in the year 2011, please? Greetings
Very Sad! Could have happened to any of us fliers on any given flight day. I was very lucky to safely accumulate 2,500 hours as a P-3C aircrewman, over 24 years of flying. 🙏
The 2nd one is scary while the 1st was pilot error, i cant believe they forgot to remove the casing thats blocking the control yolk
Non-pilot question: Wouldn't a preflight checklist include verifying the status of the elevators, which would have disclosed that they were not in standard placement and led to the discovery of the goggles box still blocking the yoke?
@@ladydamiana6841 Preflight was done before the first flight. They were performing an ERO(Engine Running Offload). They flew the plane in, offloaded cargo, and then returned to runway for a takeoff. The procedure is for the pilots to check for free and clear movement of the flight controls before taking the runway which they apparently did not do.
@@my-yt-inputs2580 Thanks for the reply! So....the offload was considered as part of the first flight (seems odd if the plane is on the ground, but OK). And then the flight controls weren't checked before resuming the flight. I wonder if it was necessary for the pilots to wear those goggles, which blocked them from seeing the box.
@@ladydamiana6841 In the C-130 world it is not uncommon to takeoff and land multiple times in the same day. A full pre-flight is performed before the first flight. Once you takeoff and then land again only to start engines within a certain period of time no new pre-flights are required especially if being operated by the same crew. A pre-flight is only required for the first flight of the day.
The pilots are still required to check the flight controls properly as it is part of the checklist before taking off again. A specific challenge item.
As far as them wearing goggles I'm not sure if they were actually wearing them at the time. Don't remember. I'd have to reread the accident report to be sure. Whether they were wearing them or not doesn't preclude them from using the NVG box as they did. I suspect they're not really required during grounds ops as the interior lighting is good enough without NVGs. NOGs are basically for looking outside.
Freedom is never free!! Rest easy soldiers.
Thank You
How can you not see the case right in front of you much less forget you put it there?
I was flying locally and greenwood tower told me Memphis center had a plane not answering I saw the smoke flew over it and reported to greenwood never forget it
Re-upload? Pretty sure that I've seen this before.
Me too.
I hadn't seen the first crash before.
This is a classic flight 800 and "no ground to air never use"
The pilots in the first tragedy seemed to do everything right in trying to recover the aircraft except remember to remove the case blocking the yoke. Also I can't imagine the terror those that were strapped in the front of that second plane felt as they waited to impact the earth. Thank you all for your service. RIP. 😢
Thanks for share
First crash. "Controls free, clear, and correct"
The first mission,no End of Runway(EOR)-flap,stab check(stick forward,back,left then right).
In all preflight checks of the world, from a little Cessna to a big Jumbo, there´s a checkpoint called "Ckeck flight controls for free movement". A propeller strike with such catastrofic result is not acceptable.
Man hate seeing this, a MH53 mishap ended my career and almost ended me all together... was scared shitless and probably screamed like a little girl all the way down to the water (Our Main Gear Box Failed) RIP GONZO!
Wow! So, the plane beheaded itself!
It would be the first thing I would check, something interfering with the yoke. Then check the trim tabs.
3:20 Its important to note the pilots did not have to hold the elevators all the way up. The request to raise the elevators was because the elevators drooped to their lowest positions when the engines are turned off and there is no hydraulic pressure. The pilots simply had to raise them to their level flight position or higher.
The text noted it was an engines on loading/unloading, would the elevators still droop during that operation?
@@TheTommyCraft They still tend to droop a bit if you arent holding the stick/yoke. Its basically a reminder "hey dont let them drop"
I don't remember the name of the flight but there was a civilian flight that did almost the same thing. The pilot was using a camera and taking photos then placed the camera down by the controls. It was also at night and this was not caught until it was too late.
"Situational awareness" and "Risk assessment/management."
I don't understand why the pilot who raised the elevators in the first incident didn't think at some point, 'you know, I might have left that case on the yoke.' He had plenty of time to remember.
If you cant push the yoke forward then it's blocked, simple reminder. On the second accident, pulling back power may have kept the other prop on. Just MHO.
They really fuqd up. Forgetting the goggles 🤦🏼♀️😞
one of the craziest crashes to me,,,, very sad,,,
Laziness and complacency caused the first crash. Those pilots paid for that mistake with their lives.
they should have noticed the goggle case though. If not on the ground then while the plane was "misbehaving".
May they all Rest In Peace. ✝
I rode in a C-130 from Cairo, Egypt to Reykjavik, Iceland to Hunter Army Airfield in Savannah, GA. We had an overnight scheduled layover in Iceland but had to stay there for about 2 weeks because the two engines on the right wing weren’t getting fuel when we arrived at the airstrip the next morning, which frightened me a little when we had to re-board the plane for the last leg.
And after watching videos from this channel over the last 6 months, I don’t believe I will ever fly again.
Most of my flight experiences with the C-130 were one way trips.
@@timf2279 airborne eh? Hooah!
*edit* I just looked at your channel profile picture and I’m glad I understood what you meant within a couple seconds.
I wanted to be airborne so desperately back then. When I was at the MEPS station picking infantry, the jobs guy told me that airborne would come to us at the end of basic training. Sure enough, they did come and handed out forms to sign up.
Unfortunately, we were designated to the Bradleys and my drill sergeant called me into the office and ripped up my application saying “you’re mechanized infantry, you’ll never need this.”
I was heart broken and those wings would’ve given me more points towards promotion.
What was your mos?
@TheVenominside I was a 54E1P NBC specialist. When I enlisted, I had NBC, Jump school, and 82nd in my contract. The only options were cook and NBC. I later found out I was in a package platoon of 44 people. We all had the same contract. We were in basic AIT, jump school, and 82nd together. I think about 23 didn't make it all the way. Most all of us were sent to the 21st Chemical Company (ABN). At the time it was the only airborne Chemical Company in the free world. I understand now that it is no longer airborne but still at Fort Bragg.
@@timf2279 I wish someone would’ve told me about the contract! But, we’re here & we made it out alive. Cheers
@@TheVenominside Thank you for your service. Go Army
Imagine how loud the noise must've been if it's so loud in my headphones.
Look! An "Imagine" comment!
@@martinc.720 No one asked buddy go watch something else and get roasted there you dog.
This was a crazy set of failures. I'm not sure the second crew could have resolved the situation.
Plane was a space shuttle in it's last life.
Always so depressing and sad😢
Great video! I have a recommendation for you. Can you do a video about LANSA Flight 508?
The blade broke off because it was a metal blade , not composite. So they had fatigue.
Serious question, in a military flight do any of those guys have access to parachutes or could they have jumped after separation of the second flight
When I rode one in 1995 I don’t recall the crew even mentioning them and I can’t remember seeing them. Typically you would be sitting on a long bench with your back to the fuselage with a seat belt. Once at cruising altitude you could unbuckle and be able to walk around.
So, even if they did have parachutes, they probably wouldn’t have even been able to get to them much less be able to put them on in time
We carried six parachutes for the crew in our Air National Guard C-130 squadron, but I seriously doubt anyone would have been able to put one on and make a successful bailout. You'd be dealing with sudden deceleration and then wind blast once the forward section fell off. Anyone in back would have been incapacitated almost immediately with no chance of survival.
I rode one in 2003 and there were definitely parachute packs on board (don't know how many), however in a catastrophic event such as this there is no time to utilize them.
Flew in several C-130’s many, many years ago, I don’t recall seeing any
That's the nature of forgetting. Yes. It would have been great if you hadn't.. But.. You did. Unfortunately forgetting in this case was far more deadly. Many people die over the smallest things. "If Id just listened to Marcus, and waited 10 seconds before sending them on the beer run. They'd never have met with that maniac at the intersection. Now they're all dead!!". Fate can be cruel.
Yep. If I hadn't stopped at the convenience store for coffee, I'd have gone through that light 5 minutes before the guy who ran it and T-boned me. Then again, those 5 minutes might have saved me from something worse. Never know.
Pilot here, in the first incident why didn't the pilots conduct a preflight check to ensure flight controls were free and CORRECT...? WTF....they forget BASIC training?
"Is everybody happy?" Cried the Sergeant looking up
Our hero feebly answered, "Yes" and then they stood him up
He jumped into the icy blast, his static line unhooked
And he ain't gonna jump no moreGory, gory, what a hell of a way to die
Gory, gory, what a hell of a way to die
Gory, gory, what a hell of a way to die
He ain't gonna jump no more
I don't understand how the pilot and copilot did not recognize that the yoke was back further than normal. You would think that one of them would say, "Hey! Why is the yoke so far back?" and look into it....
Being a a Marine who worked on aircraft, even before the video about the Marine Corps C-130 finished I already knew what caused the accident!? Poor maintenance practices! And having retired not too long ago it’s still going on! That’s why I got out!
how did he get the traffic to match the time era?
For Example in the video about the Hughes Airwest cash and PSA 182
No one inspected the aircraft before flight?
Disaster #2: The errant blade of engine #2 had 270 degrees in which to fall off from and miss the fuselage. Engine #3 had 270 degrees in which THAT prop could come off and miss the fuselage. That's Final Destination shit.
The 2nd crash was SO tragic as there was nothing for the crew to do to save their ship.
My "non-pilot" brain asks if MAYBE they'd slowed their engine speeds & began a gradual descent COULD that have lessened the forces that made gearbox & propeller #3 fail ?
Anyone who's a pilot or more educated care to comment ?
Former C130 Flight Engineer here. It happened almost instantaneously. The mass of an unbalanced C130 propeller transferred severe shaking and vibration through the aircraft which caused the #3 gearbox to separate. The C130 has 2 upper and 2 lower main structural stringers. Once they're compromised the nose breaks off. A similar thing happened to the USCG 1705 when the USMC Cobra impacted its left side. A friend hit a bald eagle once on landing in Dutch Harbor Alaska and it destroyed one of the propeller blades. He said the plane shook so bad they couldn't make out the individual instruments on the panel, and that prop retained it's blade, just threw the pitch out of whack with the others.
@@WellRoundedWoodsman Retired C-130 FE(82-2004) here as well. I remember hearing after this accident(I was already retired when it happened) that the Air Force accepted the risk of the 54H60 prop failure scenario. Prop failures of this nature were basically non-existent. Gearbox failures seemed to happen often enough. Dyess-Turkey from 1982. Several others.
I was a Blackhawk crew chief for 8 years so I am not an C-130 expert by any means. This video is slowed way way down. The initial intrusion to the separation was milliseconds.
@@drn13355#TANGOLIFE!
This is so very tragic and makes me more afraid for all military flights. Of course, flying in general!
Things get very tiring during continuous operations that too on goggles. Having said that, checking controls free is the most ignored item in takeoff checks
How is this extreme nose pitch up happening & the pilot who propped up the Yoke to raise the stabilizers NOT making note & removing the obvious cause, his goggle case ?
I'm sorry I can't fathom a person being entrusted with such a physical task as piloting a massive & technically demanding craft & then NOT taking immediate corrective actions - especially since HE propped yoke up deliberately.
We're I in his place, I'd have told load master to radio me the moment they'd cleared the load so I can return the stabilizer to normal status.
All I can think of is this pilot was either massively distracted by an emotional turmoil or sleep deprivation or just lacking
physio -mechanical competence.
RIP to all the crew in Jesus name.
These large grey military planes always look so sinister, unlike their commercial counterparts. They look like trouble is to be expected more often than the safe completion of the flight. Maybe it’s their age and association with war.
I am baffled by the fact that the crew of the first aircraft did notice that the control column was aft of its normal position. At a minimum, muscle memory should have indicated the control column was aft. In addition, the glaring black spot at the bottom of the instrument panel should have been clue #2. Lastly, the pilot and copilot should have recognized what would feel like a jammed flight control when they attempted to push the control column forward. Given this was the second leg I wouldn't expect crew fatigue to be a factor so it appears to be purely channelized attention by both pilots that resulted in an inability to conclude what was happening.
PRE FLIGHT CHECKLIST