Honestly, the best villain theory I've heard to this day is the one about how the rock trolls are the real villains of the movie. It explains all the weird stuff Hans does in the end and while Weaselton demonstrates the typical paranoia of small thinking, he never came across like a real villain. His reasoning for being suspicious of Arendelle and not liking Elsa actually makes a lot of sense from a political perspective. He's trying to protect his people from, as far as he knows, an evil sorceress of the isolated kingdom who's tried to attack foreign dignitaries at the first ball the kingdom has held in years after being closed for so long.
Trolls also in the mythology of where Frozen takes place are not benevolent entities. The most common one is they steal children, then replace them with fake wood ones that die early so the parents dont realize what really happened. Now obviously they didnt replace Kristoff that way but they did just take him. If I remember it basically gave them access to the Royalty of Arendelle although Im not too sure what they would do with that as the typical theme with magical creatures are otherworldly motives or ones that are just really simple.
@@Corsair-Mandrake I assume the wood babies are to make them not think the child is in the hands of the trolls. Didn't Kristoff find them after getting separated from the rest of the workers?
@@Drave_Jr. Yes thats why I said it was a little different as they didn't do that, but it was a similarity of taking a child from his previous caretakers that I noticed that gave a little credence to the particular type of troll they are
That could make sense. In the original Snow Queen story the trolls are actually the ones that cause the conflict in the story by creating an evil magic mirror that will show a distorted and hateful world to whoever looks into it. However when they’re carrying it to heaven to force God to look in it (these guys dream big lol) they get shot down and the mirror falls to earth and shatters, scattering tiny shards to the winds. In the book Kai accidentally gets infected by two of these shards with one landing in his eye, forcing him to see the world as far crueler than it is, and the other lodges in his heart, causing him to become cold hearted and cruel to others. In the original book the Snow Queen isn’t actually a villain, arguably the mirror is the main villain with the trolls being the originators of the mirror. The Snow Queen simply takes Kai away when he starts causing trouble after becoming cursed by the mirror and Gerta, the protagonist, ends up saving Kai when her warm love melts the mirror shards, after which the Snow Queen either simply lets them go.
I was just about to comment this theory! It also makes sense with their grand father and parents being so suspicious of magic that the trolls quite possibly lost all their influence with the previous generations to the point of being forgotten. Only now with two new heirs having never heard of them, that theyd again find sway in royal family, even trusted enough to watch over the kingdom during the last film. Also a villain who could possibly see the future like the lead troll did with else, could have a lot of potential
I'll never understand why they didn't make him a villian instead of assassinating hans' character like that, the duke was already established as an antagonist anyway. He wouldn't be a groundbreaking villain but still better than whatever hans was, if they were too keen to get anna end up with kristoff, they could make the kiss not work.
I was thinking that too Like what if throughout the movie, we see Hans, seeing how the blizzard is affecting the with them running out of supplies and becoming more and more desperate and hopeless. With the guilt of being the reason why the storm started and Anna putting her life at risk putting more pressure on him. We could see him desperately try to help but fail as the storm makes things harder and harder to survive. Then seeing this as good opportunity the duke can come in and push him into stopping the storm himself (castle fight scene like normal). Then after hans and elsa can talk while she’s in prison there he can never her to stop and she can admit she doesn’t know how to stop it. With that info he can go to the other government ppl and tell them they don’t know how to stop it JUST THEN Anna is rushed to the castle on the brink of death (like normal). So now Before the kiss scene we can see Hans making up his mind about killing Elsa and giving the Oder to have her executed by the end of the day for the sake of the people and for Anna just for him then enter the room anna is in. So now when he goes in he has to lie to Anna that Elsa is okay and that nothing bad is gonna happen to her and that everything is gonna be okay leading to the kiss not working (bc her real true love wouldn’t lie to her and do something like executing her sister behind her back.) this causes Hans to further spiral as he sees Anna growing more lifeless by the moment leading to him coming clean and telling her he is going to kill Elsa and that it’s the only why to save her and Anna begging him to not telling him they’re could be another way and trying to stop him but Hans ultimately making up his mind and locking her in there so she couldn’t interfere. The rest of the movie can go as normal with Anna still punching hans for trying to kill her sister. Idk y’all can change it but I feel like this make some more sense then the original “oooo I’m bad now” twist I wanted to write more duke but I typed a lot
@A-Person. yeah the idea of hans getting mentally unstable through the movie is definitely more reasonable, it adds layers to the film, Also enables for more navigation for the characters and their future relationships, I know the snow queen was a difficult story to work with, but it didn't take us long-who don't have much experience in writing- to figure out what to do with hans, or another thing is that he could've been just cut from the movie, why keep a character in when you don't like it and don't bother to characterise it correctly?
Yeah, they could've explained that no, love at first sight isn't "true love" and that Hans and Anna were just searching for attention and understanding, and confused that for true love.
I even think that is really possible to Duke forsed Hans, manipulated him( wash his brain) and used to kill Elsa and takeover her kingdom for himself when Hans finish it. To achieve his goals through can't for it to someone else. For don't bleed his hands of killing the queen. The creators just not revealed it yet. But I really hope they will do it in coming FROZEN 3. And finally let Anna married Hans and Kristoff and Elsa fell in love with each other. In other case is not make sense to continue this series. At least for me.
I still think Hans was a missed opportunity to show Anna what she could become. They just needed to show some of his brothers in order to highlight their toxic relationship.
@@flynnryan I'd think that would've been brought up. Plus at the end, it's said that Hans would be sent back home and his brothers would know how to deal with him.
I know. One thing that always bugged me is that nobody calls out the fact that Elsa and Anna’s relationship is very toxic. Anna is a complete enabler to Elsa and Elsa is self centered to the point she did not care until what she does starts to affect her (Elsa). I think if they showed both sides of the coin instead of making Hans evil it would have worked better and added great character development to both Elsa and Anna.
@@lespena3722that’s not why the relationship is toxic. Literally at all lmfao. How is Elsa self centered for holing herself up in her room because of her parents and her fear of hurting Anna? What sense does that make. How is Elsa self centered because she finally doesn’t have to worry about hurting people with her powers and she doesn’t have to fear it? Or wait, you think Elsa deliberately caused the kingdom to freeze How in Anna an enabler when her whole thing is being dependent on Zelda being around? They are toxic, but not for your reasons. How could Anna even Enabler Elsa when they didn’t even grow up together because of Elsa’s powers. Maybe you’re talking about the second movie, but that’s not in the first one
@@BabyGirlTiny sorry for taking so long. But ya she is selfish and self centered. The groundwork was there before the sequel…. The sequel just made this more obvious….. One mayor example I can point out is in the castle. When Anna tells Elsa she accidentally frozen arendelle instead of saying something like “Oh no! My kingdom!” or “oh no! The people”…. Anything like that it was “Oh I am such a fool, I can’t be free”. I was like “wait!!!! You just learned your kingdom is burried in snow and all your thinking is of yourself!?” Also when she kicks Anna out she does not care if she gets hurt (what if marshmallow had thrown her off the mountain…. Literally!!!) Then there is the fact that people are there trying to help her and trying to find solutions and what does Elsa do? Run away…. And at first you think it’s because she thinks that if she leaves she will take the snow with her… yet when it’s established that leaving won’t do anything she still continues to run away. And I hate to say this…. But let’s face it… had Hans not done what he did (chase after Elsa and such) Elsa would have disappeared somewhere in the wild, Anna would have never been unthawed, Kristoff and Sven most likely would have died as well…. I felt sorry for Elsa, but there is only so much you can excuse. Even people with mental conditions and such have to acknowledge their in the wrong and such and sometimes they even need to be called out in order to start getting better.
I always thought it would make more sense if the duke was Hans' father / uncle, who pressured Hans into marrying one of the sisters of Arendelle for political and social gain. Maybe they come from a family of hunters, who pride themselves on power and wealth, and he would psychologically manipulate Hans into following his command; taking advantage of his insecurity as the youngest son and making him feel worthless unless he marries into a powerful throne. Thus, when the duke discovers that Elsa has magic powers, he organizes his men to go on a hunt in order to find and kill her. He claims that Elsa is a threat to the kingdom and must be contained / controlled, but in reality, he sees this as an opportunity to seize control of Arendelle, utilizing Elsa's death and the marriage between Anna and Hans. You could even give Hans a redemption arc towards the end, where he discovers that his father never truly loved him and only saw him as a tool to gain more power and influence. Thus, he betrays the duke and helps Anna save Elsa from execution. Afterwards, he returns home to re-evaluate his family's legacy. Anyway, thanks for coming to my Ted-talk.
@poweroffriendship2.0 It could also have some interesting possibilities for the sequel. Hans returns to Arendelle after having given up the pursuit of the throne and warns everyone about an upcoming darkness that threatens both kingdoms.
Holy crap this actually improves things a lot. Not only does this allow the story to continue the theme of "Don't marry someone you just met" but it also allows Wessleton to be a more effective antagonist because he has direct power over Hans. This would change him from a goofy side show, to a cruel and manipulative abusive parent that we would all love to hate
3:40-4:50 Great comparison! The Duke of Weaselton labeled Elsa as a "monster" as soon as he saw her ice powers exposed in Frozen just like how Judge Claude Frollo saw Esmeralda as a "witch" when she vanished at the Festival of Fools in the Hunchback of Notre Dame. Both villains saw the heroines as threats that needed to be eliminated
But frollo was different we could see how corrupted and extreme he was to be in the “right”. We see how he kills quesi’s mother because he’s racist and because of their “strange” culture. Weaselton doesn’t have much of a background where we know he’s eccentric and odd and really out of times. It seems more personal that he’s just not ok with magic and while other characters are alarmed they aren’t asking for Elsa to be published. Maybe they fear her a bit. But frollo was so mentally consumed with his extreme ideas. He fully believed he was in the right and everyone else was clearly wrong and even god as on his side.
It’s kind of interesting on Alan Tudyk’s first Disney roles for Walt Disney Animation Studios were antagonistic characters through King Candy and the Duke Of Weseleton, although with King Candy he was the villain while the Duke was an antagonistic red herring to the film’s main villain, Hans. But starting with Alistair Krei in _Big Hero 6_ although he was a Red Herring like the Duke of Weselton, but compared to his previous two characters Alan voiced (King Candy and the Duke of Weselton), Krei was not an antagonistic character and eventually Tudyk’s later roles have been usually animals (Duke Weaselton, Hei Hei the Rooster, TukTuk, Pico the Toucan, Valentino the Goat) and/or supporting and minor-incidental characters (Duke Weaselton (Again), Knowsmore in _Ralph Breaks the Internet,_ his roles in _Frozen 2_ and _Strange World)._ Definitely would love for Tudyk to play another villainous role again for a Disney animated Movie
I know. The duke being the villain makes complete sense. Not Hans. The duke had everything to gain, with Elsa and Anna out of the way he would have become king and exploited arendelle (as crazy as it sounds…. the duke and Elsa and Anna are related… so if they died the throne goes to him)
@@lespena3722I don’t count the books as often the already given material is given to someone who didn’t work on the story. The original writers are not present to consent and it’s just an attempt to tie things together after the fact of a sloppy made story. Or the author noticed these plot holes and wants to add new information because a book has to be lengthy and reach a certain amount of pages to be released. Neither Anna nor Elsa treat or act like he’s a relative even far away. I’m not too close to some relatives and I acknowledge them even if I don’t see them as close. The Duke guy doesnt even try to use family as an excuse for Elsa to be helpful to him. He’s acting like he’s completely a stranger to them trying to establish some kind of ties to arendelle. Surely Elsa would consider a relative over a stranger country to trade, do buiness, have Allie’s, etc. he doesn’t even bring up family, or the death of the family burns stranger trying to pry into their lives and find out more. If he was a relative then he would have more reason to take over arendelle over Hans after Anna supposedly died. He would be royal by blood verse some stranger who claimed he married Anna in secret behind closed doors and no one checks or cared for her body.
The Duke of weasel town would have been a great but different villain because he made his men do everything for him. He was a scared and weak guy. The ending should have gone like him hiding behind those guys he brought with him. The Anna freezing scene would still happen with her protecting Elsa but it is those three guys instead. Then they stop the trading with him and throw him into jail. Anna could have have her and Kristoff love story still. But she would see that Kristoff is a better dating option than Hans. She could have ended things by telling Hans that she doesn’t want him.
I seem to recall a Japanese trailer for Frozen that implied in the subtitles that the Duke was going to manipulate Elsa and take advantage of her power by pretending to help her control her powers. That would have made far more sense than what we got.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, he should have been a full villain rather than demoting him to a side/secondary villain and making Hans a twist villain.
I never understood how the duke suddenly cared about Anna when he didn't trust her the entire film. Also, he tried to kill Elsa - he got off easily! Feel bad for his voice actor - King Candy was a great villian. Edit: In the musical the duke does apologise personally to Elsa and he's more comic relief. So, he is used a bit better there.
I never got why they allowe his guards to go with Hans when he clearly is anti Elsa. The kingdom have their own guards and weasolton isn’t in charge of arendelle. No one was running the country properly after Elsa left and Anna left soon after. Hans was trying for manage it the best he could but technically he wasn’t one of the princesses!
tbh being killed by your sister does sound shocking, i'd say it highlights how he still thinks of himself as the normal person in how he wants to kill an "evil witch", i think he's sort of like if gaston was a much worse written character.
Ironically, even Schaffrilas Productions think Weaselton should’ve been the main villain of Frozen. I mean he was setup to be the main villain, so you could’ve had a twist there instead of forcefully make Hans Christen Anderson the bad guy.
Interesting about this is that when I first saw Frozen 10 to 9 years I thought Duke of Weasletown was the main villain due to how he was at the beginning and literally send his men with Hans to kill Elsa until it reveals that Hans was the real main villain As a kid it really subverted my expectations
Honestly they should have left elsa as the villain and made her morally dubious. In that scenario, familial love saving the day works a lot better too. Basically prince of egypt kind of family feud but where the sibling actually makes up. The next sensible choice was the duke but nooo they had to go the twist villain route....
The Duke of Weasletown makes me think of King Candy from Wreck it Ralph. Sure same voice actor and all but I would have love that a shift like we see with King Candy to Turbo. From funny man with status to monster consumed by his goal. I think it could have been pretty cool, even if it means changing the film to give the Duke a bit more backstory before the shift.
@@hunterolaughlin Yes I realise my thoughts are confusing. I was comparing him with King Candy, and you can’t pull the twist ‘This character is actually that other bad guy’ without introducing ‘that other bad guy’ in a backstory. But of course it could work without a backstory like you said !
Not defending the movie, just throwing out an alternative. What if both the duke and hans played the villains. A collaboration between the two, hans seeking his own kingdom and the duke looking for an easy trade partner. They could have played off each other with the duke nudging anna closer to hans. The first fracture in their mutual trust would have come with hans supoorting the townspeople. In the third act, the dignitaries could suspect hans, only for him to throw the duke under the bus and take the fall. And though i would prefer hans not as the villain at all, he would, of course, make the big reveal as the big bad in the scene with anna. Come on, I can't do all the writing for these guys.
The thing that will always bother me about the Hans twist is that Hans fought his way past an snow monster, nearly falling to his death from a bridge in order to get to Elsa who was being hunted by two of Weselton's men. Then he pulls some 3D chess move of deflecting a crossbow bolt into the ice chandelier, almost killing Elsa. If his goal was to kill Elsa, all he had to do was not fight his way past the snowman. Elsa dies in that scenario as she's distracted trying to kill the other guard and she's shot with a crossbow. And even if he the other guards do fight their way past the snowman and Hans gets there in time, again, all he had to do is pretend to not notice the guy about to hit Elsa with a crossbow bolt. In both scenarios, Elsa's out of the way and Hans gets to still be the good guy. Saving Elsa is clearly the most convoluted and risky plan for his goals.
Elsa needed to be dragged back to the palace and confront her fears and face her sister. She wasn’t going to leave her ice palace and isolation and she was too strong for Anna to bring back. Elsa had to do it on her own or someone had to outsmart her like Hans and drag her back. He didn’t kill her because she was one of the heroes of the movie
@@whitedragoness23 That's an awful lot of words for saying Elsa had plot armor. Can't say it's the most satisfying answer, though I suppose it's the most true.
@@JonSmith-hk1bq no looking for one, those always erupt on an Elsa debate channel. I kid you not. And I actually agreed with your comment and responded my own two cents is all. But no one likes rude responses either,
I like a surprise villain, but I like it better when the story makes sense. It makes sense story-wise for the duke to be the villain, or at least the main one. If they wanted hans to be twist villain, they needed to plant in more seeds than just the words he sings in love is an open door or something like that. If they couldn't do that, they should have gone with the obvious choice and do the best with that. The duke was pretty funny so he could have been another king candy type too.
Same with me. I respect them for trying to subvert tropes, but I deem having your story make sense a higher priority. As of now, the writing for Frozen makes about as much sense as Norm of the North!
i dont think an extremist should be called a hero, maybe an aspiring hero? but still someone who loses their way trying to be well intentioned without thinking of how the way they seeks said intentions actually affects others.
I’m doing a Disney villain ranking and I wasn’t sure whether or not to include the Duke of Weselton on my list, mostly because there are those who say he is and isn’t a villain. Hands up for yes? Hands up for no?
The Duke of Weaselton would have been a much better villain than Hans. Duke of Weaselton saw Elsa as a monster that he wanted to kill her. Hans tried to kill Elsa in the end but failed. Weaselton would have made a better full proof plan to make sure Elsa is killed
Here's how I would've made Frozen. The film plays out like it does in the final version, until the scene in the library, where Anna asks Hans to kiss her after Elsa froze her heart. Instead of turning out to be the villain, like in the final version, they DO kiss. However, to both Hans' surprise, and Anna's sadness, it doesn't work. He apologizes to her, and reveals that he was just been lying to her the whole time. When asked by Anna what he means, Hans sighs, and it's revealed why he lied: he was sent to Arendelle by his father. You see, as the 'unlucky son', as he puts it, he was a disappointment to him, so he stood up for himself, and told him that he would rule his own kingdom. His brother, Lars, 'the nice one', as he puts it, told him of Arendelle and how the King and Queen died at sea, Knowing this to be his only chance of please his family, he made a bet with his father: if he could marry into the throne and rule Arendelle, he'd be accepted into the family; otherwise, they would not only dismiss him from his position as a Prince, but also banish him forever. He even goes on to reveal that he chose Anna instead of Elsa because she was so happy to see him; he heard that Elsa had always shut herself away and knew it would be a task. Having never known she had a lovely younger sister, Hans supposed Anna seemed like an easier option upon meeting her. When Anna asks him what changed his mind, why he is telling him all this, and why he plans on giving up on the kingdom. Hans kisses Anna's forehead and looking at her, tells her that he fell in love with someone, but it isn't Anna. Just as Anna is about to ask who it is, a voice calls out her name. Anna and Hans both look over at the door to see, to Anna's happiness, Olaf. The scene with Elsa breaking out of the dungeon plays out as in the final version, except no one barges in. The scene with Sven trying to get Kristoff to back plays out as in the final version, and when we cut back to the library, Anna introduces a shocked Hans to Olaf, saying that Elsa made him. The scene where Olaf reveals to Anna that Kristoff is in love with her then plays out, but after Anna and Hans decide to hurry to meet him, Olaf tells them that they must go on without him. Anna pleads for him to join them, asking if he still wants to experience the summer, but Olaf tells them that they have to leave him here; if they don't hurry, it will be too late. Anna refuses to leave him behind, but Olaf tells them that there's not much time, and that whatever happens, he'll always be with them. Since he's already starting to melt at this point, Anna knows that he's right. She goes on to hug him one last time as a way of saying goodbye - a hug that Hans joins in. We even get this exchange as Olaf passes on. *Olaf:* I love warm hugs... *Anna:* (choking back tears) I...I...I love you, Olaf. *Hans:* And we always, always will. With that, the rest then plays out like in the final version, except Hans replaces Olaf here, and instead of Hans, like in the final version, the Duke of Weaseltown (WESELTON!) scares her into thinking that she killed her own sister, and after she collapses, tries to kill her. At first, Anna is frozen up, but then thawed out a few seconds later, since her saving Elsa's life was the 'act of true love' needed to thaw her heart. She realizes this, and this is what gives Elsa the resolve needed to end the eternal winter. After Anna tells her sister that she always knew she was capable of thawing out Arendelle, Elsa said that she couldn't have...not without her. Anna then introduces Kristoff to Elsa, who welcomes him into the family with open arms. The epilogue then plays out like it does in the final version: the Duke and his men are deported, with a trade embargo between Arendelle and Weaseltown (WESELTON!) in place, Anna follows through on her promise to give Kristoff a new sled, which leads to their first kiss, and Elsa swears to never close the gates again, creating an ice rink for everyone. Here, though, there are two exceptions: Hans isn't sent back to his kingdom to await punishment, and Olaf and Sven's part in the epilogue is ommitted for obvious reasons. I think Hans should've been revealed to be good along and eventually stick to Anna and Elsa's side, having Olaf sacrifice himself to ensure Anna and Kristoff's happiness, and leaving the Duke of Weaseltown (WESELTON!) as the film's TRUE big bad. So, what did you think of this? And how would you have made Frozen?
Exactly. Not only that, but she wasn't gonna be your average Disney villain. In fact, she was gonna be a morally-gray one like John Silver from the underrated masterpiece, Treasure Planet. Can you imagine how much better Frozen would've turned out?
@@QueSeraSeraaaa Yeah. She would've been such a badass antagonist with a redemption arc just like John Silver. But I guess we can't have nice things. 😔
Exactly, there was literally no buildup to hans's villainy or betrayal. The most valid one is how he only sings "me" part in love is an open door working to show how selfish he was from the beginning, and even that is bit of a stretch because we have plenty of counter arguments like how he looked genuinely "in love" when he fell in the water and looked at anna walking away (he is all alone with his horse, realistically this is when a person or character shows their genuine feelings), or how he was first to walk to anna instead of her other staffs, or how he was reinforced to the duke the anna put him in charge in her absence, or how he aimed at the decoration and not at elsa when he was tasked to get elsa back.
Terribly under-utilized, but can we focus for a minute on how stupid and on-the-nose that line is "Open those gates so I may unlock your secrets and exploit your riches...Did I just say that out loud". Something like that. Frozen has no respect for the audience's intelligence whatsoever and needs to just up front explain everything to you. You may excuse this because it's for kids, but then A. You're admitting this is only a dumb kid's film for dumb kids B. Then why do you probably enjoy it so much and C. Even movies accessible to kids should be clever and treat their audience with respect. A clever movie, even if it appeals towards kids will stand the test of time as they grow up, leading to much more enjoyment overtime. This one line stuck with me as so particularly stupid and sank my expectations for this movie as soon as I heard it.
It might be weird that I see neither Hans or Duke a villain at all. They might have some ill intent towards the main character but considering the main plot point of Frozen of the sisters being separated and the end goal of them being together as a family again, these two characters never orchestrate an obstruction to the end result the movie is heading to. The true antagonistic element in the story, the very thing that force the sisters apart right from the beginning is the magic itself. Anna was nearly killed by it, causing separation between the sisters. The white hair on Anna's head is the strong indicator to something still unfixed. Exposing Anna to the very thing that cause her near death experience is a chance her parents will absolutely not take. Hans did try to kill Elsa but that's never his primary goal. He needs her approval to get into the royal family and if he learned sooner that Elsa doesn't want the crown, he could negotiate a peaceful transfer of power. To be fair, none of Hans's action bode ill to the people of Arendelle, only to the current administrative figures which I have to say at the very least questionable in their competency. He could be borderline villain to the sisters but he just happen to be in the position to exploit the situation that he does not create. The Duke is simply a businessman. Greedy may he seems but not exactly evil. His distrust and spiteful against sorcery is not out of place since everyone in the ball room has the similar reaction and later the people of Arendelle outside. The Duke is just louder than others. Since Elsa, the cause of everyone's problem had ran away, the situation forces the Duke to take action, or he's the one willing to take action. It isn't uncommon belief that you need to kill the witch to lift the curse. The Duke's motive to kill Elsa is understandably not out of malice. He and everyone who are trapped in frozen city just want to get the F out, by any means possible. He's not nice but not evil. The duo never orchestrate anything into their favor, rather acting according to circumstances. A villain has to do more than jut go with the flow. A bit of an underlying context, the anti witchcraft is a real article of law which I believe still exist until after WWII. Of course even with hard evidence, the Duke still has no authority to prosecute Elsa who isn't just a commoner but a foreign monarch. He needs the power of the church to dethrone her. The feud between Elsa and the Duke is considered a personal dispute. Elsa is clearly at the advantage in the matter but she chooses to escalate it into international conflict by banning business with Wesselton as a whole. Such manner of childishness would never be committed by the more considered, more compromised Anna.
I agree with your points--especially the one about the magic being the main antagonist. Hence why the sequel focused on Elsa's magic. However, I wish the trolls from the first movie had been revealed in the second film to be one of the five elemental spirits. If that had been the case, a lot more stuff would have made sense. If the rock trolls had been the "land spirits" (instead of the giant rock monsters), then the magic would have been more clearly the antagonist. One idea I had is that perhaps the five elemental powers (earth, fire, water, air, and ice) each need a physical manifestation in order to be under control. The elemental spirits, then, must work together to find a replacement when one of the five dies, or else nature will be thrown out of balance. Suppose the ice spirit has disappeared, and a terrible winter descends on Arendelle, catching Elsa and Ana (who are horse-riding) by surprise. Elsa's horse slips, and she flies off, hurting her head. Desperate to save their daughter, the King and Queen brave the storm to find the trolls (the elemental earth spirits), in hopes they may help. The trolls can only heal plants, but they don't tell the King this. Instead, they see this as a prime opportunity to restore balance to nature by finding a replacement ice spirit. Without consulting the other spirits, the trolls conduct a ritual which bestows ice powers upon Elsa, which gives her a frozen heart, thus "healing" her, since she is no longer purely flesh and blood. Although Elsa's life is saved, she is unable to control her ice powers and injures Ana. The King and Queen, along with Elsa's horse, board a ship to find answers to reverse the magic. Unfortunately, the water spirit has vanished as well, resulting in a tremendous storm at sea that sinks the royal vessel. However, the horse manages to stay afloat a bit longer, and is selected by the wind spirit to become the new water spirit. Thus the Nock (water-horse) is created, and the storm subsides. With the passing of the King and Queen, Elsa is crowned queen. The rest of the story proceeds normally, with Elsa learning to control her powers and Ana learning that true love is not the same as infatuation. Frozen II, on the other hand, begins with a terrible windstorm, which the trolls explain is due to the disappearance of the wind spirit (an albatross). Elsa grows concerned that she might disappear, too, and sets out in search of answers. Along the way, she meets the Nock, which turns out to be her beloved horse, and they meet the dangerous (but adorable) fire spirit. The story could play out somewhat similarly, with the discovery that the actions of humans are harming the spirits (a dam trapped the previous water spirit, a mine collapse hurt the trolls, etc.). Elsa and Ana are tasked with bringing harmony between the humans and the spirits before things spiral out of control. Just an idea.
@@kentslocum I doubt the people who do script in Frozen II know exactly what to do with the spirit at all. They're there for the story but has no integral part to the development of the story other than as side quests for the protagonist in an RPG style video game. Just beating one boss to get to another boss to the final boss kinda thing. The horse can be counted an important part of the story as a tool/ride to get to the next level. Otherwise the girl will have to cross the ocean on foot. It's not a challenge, it's a help. Also, calling the existence of the magical creatures/entities in the forest Nature and calling people as something else is fundamentally wrong. People is an integral part of the ecosystem and thus part of Nature. Natural forest is everywhere, so as ordinary, non-magical people. On the contrary, the magical entities in the enchanted forest is not part of the ecosystem as it evidently clear that the forest remains thriving, unaffected by the existence of the dam while the magical entities are in disarray and even destructive to their surrounding. The barrier that prevent all lifeform from traversing in and out of the forest will prevent animals from doing their seasonal migration. Withing the span if 3 decades, some animals might have gone extinct due to inability to move to their natural breeding/feeding grounds during the change of season. Nature is constantly changing and shifting so there's no static point of balance. Just because the condition is unfavorable to life doesn't mean it is unbalanced. It's just the balance point is not good for humans. Like in hard vacuum or bottom of the ocean is inhospitable doesn't mean it's unbalanced. I have zero appreciation to the second film as it's fundamental idea is absolutely senseless.
@@victorstr9396 You make excellent points. The Frozen series had a great opportunity to portray the magic as a destabilizing force and have the humans realize their role in nature. Too bad the Frozen team didn't really stop and think about the story they wanted to tell. 😢
You know what would of probably saved this character to some extent? What if he went up to Anna and Elsa and apologized for being a lil weasel and admit he was acting on fear. Idea that popped up in my head.
honestly it make sense for the duke to be a red herring, the problem its more that he is too forgettable... like this is the first time i remember he was there xD also for some reason i guessed it before that he wasnt the main villain becuase how goofy he looked (also becuase i watched the movie a year later and hans was already "advertised" everywhere as a villain so i wasnt that shocked xD)
What if the duke of Weselton is the one to try and kill Elsa? Maybe Hans could have revealed that he didn’t truly love Anna but it isn’t a plot twist as a villian. Rather… they have platonic feelings but he is filling a Void with Anna. Anna is now in love with Kristof. Anna had the choice. And she loves Kristof Ultimately, Hans and Olaf help Anna to scape and try to find Kristof, saving herself. But she sacrifices to save her sister from the Duke or one of his henchmen. The ending is similar, just Hans isn’t portrayed as a villian and the duke is punished with not being able to come back to Arrendel, not even for negotiations
@@greenstarlover1 because they THINK is love They NEED eachother They feel alone in their own ways and think that, with eachother, they Can be complete But that isn’t How love is Love is about both parts learning and bonding Not the “Ideal” love
I honestly think that Hans could've just been a coward. He could've just been a sceptic who might've seen Elsa's magic but didn't quite believe that the "magic of true love" could save Anna purely because his own experience was relatively loveless (being the youngest of thirteen siblings and, apparently not treated that great) and now he's trying to emulate love genuinely because Anna wants it and he finds Anna interesting, and likes her attention, but isn't inherently evil, cowering out and abandoning her but not going off to kill else, where Duke Weselton actually does, then Anna stops the Duke and then gets thawed by her own act of self-sacrifice, or "true love". Hans still gets to be a subversion of expectations, while Duke still gets to be the standard Disney villain.
I thought the duke was a secondary main villain against Hans to see who would overthrow the queen and her sister 1st; a political game where both use manipulation, one being quirky, another emotionally with both sisters. Just like there are two sisters there would be two villains for them to fight against, who win with the power of their sisterly love for each other.
What might have been interesting would have been if Hans really was a good person who just wasn't Ana's love. The kiss could have not worked and perhaps then the Duke turns on them all, saying that the Queen has killed the Princess because Hans didn't let her die earlier. He might then arrest Hans and plan to execute Elsa to end the winter, 'save' Ana and or Arendel and increase his prestige with the Kingdom. He would be the final enemy while Hans would take a role similar to Quasimodo in relation to Esmerelda and Tiberius.
I hate Disney's twist villains. But I could go into a long diatribe about that. Suffice to say that a fairytale movie doesn't need to be complex. I agree with what "Everything Wrong With" said in their video.... “Wouldn't it be logical for the ice-loving Kristoff to fall in love with the ice Queen? Two perfect guys, two perfect girls, and the sniveling Weselton guy could have been the villain trying to overthrow Arendelle.
Can you please do a video on the problems of the rise of girl bosses and what could make the next ones better? I also think we need to look at Disney Junior like the Lion Guard, Jake and the Neverland Pirates, and Little Einsteins.
Frozen didn't need a villain. But if it did, this mofo should have been it instead of Prince Hans. ISTG this movie is *full of wasted potential and opportunities* 😫
Duke Weselton should have been the villain they built him up. Or they should have kept Elsa as the villain. It makes me so mad that they did Hans so dirty.
Hans being a twist villain is idiotic because he realistically cannot be king unless he is married to one of the sisters or the closest relative to the sisters. Even if anna named him the new king, this would have legit caused a civil war among aranedelle's nobility due to hans's weak claim (anna was not married to him nor was anna a queen so her so called appointment has less weight). And since his family was not introduced as a close relative to the royal family in the beginning, him later acting like just killing anna and elsa would solve everything was absolutely idiotic. Kids falling for this? I mean they are kids, it's somewhat understandable. But disney writers and executives? They know better, they should have either known this or have researched this and implemented it into the plot, but they did not. This means either everyone in disney are dumb af OR they definitely did not plan hans to be the villain, and I am pretty sure not everyone in disney is that dumb, which is why I always bash frozen for poor story telling and planning.
Yeah. It really makes you wonder how the movie managed to become such a massive blockbuster hit worldwide, when it's plagued with too many issues that they can't ever be ignored nor overlooked. The majority of the world's population should've known better and shouldn't have allowed themselves to be emotionally-manipulated into believing that it's an "amazing, beautiful, powerful, timeless, unique, clever, subversive, unforgettable, meaningful, wholesome, genuine, well-made, well-written, and well-executed masterpiece". It's a perfect example of style over substance and the same things can be said about it's undeserving cash-grab sequel.
@1992disney You ever seen The Return of Harmony? If not, in that episode of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic, Rarity gets brainwashed by Discord into seeing what looks like a giant diamond and becomes obsessed with it, even taking it everywhere with her. Except it turns out to actually be a huge boulder with a spell cast on it by Discord. Frozen is like that boulder. Even though it's really just a big shabby rock of a film, somehow, some way, people were brainwashed into seeing it as a flawless gem, just like Rarity was.
What the video is about the non-villain character in Disney such as Denahi in Brother Bear, Namari from Raya and the Last Dragon, and Alma from Encanto.
My theory, please read and use: Hans should of been an anti villain. If they wanted to avoid looking like Enchanted, when Edward kissing Giselle failed: let Hans kissing Anna failing be the motivation for him to kill Elsa. The love he may thinks he feels for Anna may not be true, but he still feels protective of her, and responsible for her. So, out of immediate options, running out of time, and despite pleading from Anna, he goes to kill Elsa, since he's out of options. I can still see Elsa being so distraught the snow storm stops, and Hans being reluctant gives Anna a better chance to rush and cover Elsa, despite being so weak. Add Hans looking distraught when Anna freezes, and that scene hits harder. Once everything thaws, I can see an awkward goodbye scene happening, since he was only doing it to try and save Anna. If you add the duke succeeding at making Hans paranoid after the kiss, and encouraging him to kill Elsa, it gives the jail bird ending to the duke. Hans doesn't have a great family, and blew his chance with Anna, so him leaving Arendelle, but not going back to the Southern Isles, and ceasing trade with him and giving it to one of his brothers, is a better ending.
He could've been a Villain who Plans to Stage a Coup D'etat or Regicide in the Film, and then Appoint someone to Run Arendelle so that Wesselton can Exploit the Resources to Enrich His Homeland and Himself, Via Robbing the the Natives of their Ownership of Property, Resources, and Land, As well as Controlling Everything. It's like how it Functions to Real Life. Kinda like Political-Economic History where there is an Imperial Periphery and an Imperial Core that Reflects Similarly to Our History. But Hey; It's my Idea! [Although I Think that somewhat lacks Relevance to the Rest of the Plot in Frozen.]
I'd actually like it more if he was actually a twist perfectly fine person, not heroic per say but just an old man with good enough intentions. At first when it's clear Anna isn't interested with dancing with him he takes a some what correct guess with what's bothering her, being her love of both Elsa and Hans with him giving Anna some honestly good advice. The rest of the scene is basically the same with him frightful at Elsa's Magic. But now the Duke instead of yelling at Hans for handing out clothes is instead gearing up to kill Elsa, with Hans not wanting him to go but he keeps insisting, Han begrudgingly agrees, however right before he can kill Elsa he's knocked out, he wakes up feeling weak as Hans tells him the lie of Anna having died as he goes to kill Elsa and asks for him to join him to make it easier. He agrees apologizing for not thinking Hans was a strong leader. But right after Hans knocks him out again, then the "If only someone loved you" scene plays with him in it too, so now Hans gets to rule over both Kingdoms. He tries to find a way for both Anna and himself to escape but is too weak from everything. Anna then tells everything to him, and all the pain both her and Elsa felt from all of this, but rather then being discussed he fully understands what he believed was wrong(ish) then he freaks out over Olaf a bit but then starts to warm up to him, reminding Anna of how she can cure herself. Then for the sequel he can be in it too telling everyone about why he was so afraid of the magic to begin with, also he can enhance Kristoff's subplot by... well literally anything would work.
Now that I think about it the Duke was in the right for his actions. He only ordered his men to kill Elsa because he was terrified. He didn't act out of villainous intent. In the eyes of any normal person he was doing the right thing.
I feel it would have made more sense if he was a accomplice of Hans rather then a competing villain, a bit of underhanded plotting and ruthless manoeuvring of men and opinion with Hans being the inside man who pretends to support Elisa in order to stab her in the back.
When i watched the frozen for first time in forever i literally feel like duke sense thi villianous energy , but nope its hans . Yet whats happening around here ?.
my problem with this dude is that he is visiting another country to meet the new queen, and as soon as he sees Elsa has magic powers starts treating her like a witch. Like wtf? thats the queen you are addressing, the dude can start a war with that bullshit, and he has no power there in her castle. The servants and guards are on her side, trying to start a witch hunt is the worst possible thing the dude can try to do.
Disney should really loose the distribution rights to The Muppets and Bear in the big blue house along with the rights to The Muppet productions with the exception of the Disney produced content to Sony Pictures and The Muppets Studio to The Jim Henson Company, Marvel Comics with the characters to Penguin Random House, the entertainment rights to Iron Man,Thor,Captain America and Hulk along with the rights to the Marvel Studios produced content to Paramount Pictures and Universal Pictures Hulk only and Sony Pictures should gain full entertainment rights to Spiderman and Lucasfilm to Sport1 Medien along with Indiana Jones and Willow movie and tv series along with it and I mean all that for real.
I don’t know, you have some good points but the duke was boring me to tears because he’s the kind of villain we’ve seen over and over before. I’m happy that they chose to set him aside. He’s a greedy coward looking out for number one. He could’ve done a lot of damage but he wasn’t the main threat, and that’s okay.
Duke of weaslton was weak as an villian. He practically screams out Elsa is a witch and no one kicks him out. Why didn’t anyone kick him out sooner when it’s their kingdom??? That part got me that why waited til the very end when he was a clear danger! and he was sooo weak that they just had to close the door in his face and he would of died!
As cinemasins said it best why not just have Anna marry Hans Elsa get with kristoff and make the weaselton guy the villain trying to overthrow arendelle would that be too easy
I remember sometime after Frozen was out on DVD and Blu-Ray making jokes over the Duke of Weasleton being a terrible villain like having a villain lounge where the Disney Villains, live-action and animated, hang out and the Duke constantly being turned out due to his Villain Suck status and throwing a fit when other Disney villains of lesser quality like Sergeant Calhoun and Bellweather were allowed into the lounge. Kind of a parody of how in the Super Cafe segments of the HISHE videos Toby Maguire’s Spider-Man would be kept out of the titular cafe and at the end of the episode How The Amazing Spider-Man Should Have Ended, him popping up and crying over the fact Andrew Garfield’s Spider-Man was allowed into the cafe. It’s been a long time since I watched any of HISHE’s videos, but hopefully Tobey’s Spider-Man was allowed in the Super Cafe since the HISHE episode of Spider-Man: No Way Home. But yeah, no way Duke you’re ever getting a chance of hanging out with the Disney Villains in the Disney Villain Lounge.
I don’t think the Duke of Western is a wasted villain, because at least he got a design at all, but there is One Villain who didn’t even get a design only an evil personality that was later adapted into many fanfics her name is Chort
I just hope that in the movie of Shrek 5, once Disney buys DreamWorks, all the Official Disney Princes and all the Official Disney Princesses from their respective movies appear, especially all the characters from the movie of Rise of the Guardians, from the movies of Frozen, from the movies of How to Train Your Dragon, from the movie of Brave, from the movie of Tangled, from the movie of Moana, from the movie of Raya and the Last Dragon, from the movie of Encanto and the most important character in the movie of The Little Mermaid 2: Return to the Sea, Melody, the daughter of Prince Eric and Princess Ariel, and besides, they will be the new main characters of the movie of Shrek 5 so that they help Shrek, Princess Fiona, Donkey, Dragon, Puss in Boots, Kitty Softpaws, Perrito, Goldilocks, the Three Bears, Prince Lancelot, Princess Tiffany, King Artie, Princess Guinevere, the children of Shrek and Princess Fiona: Fergus, Farkle and Felicia, the children of Donkey and Dragon: Bananas, Parfait, Peanut, Eclair, Coco and Debbie and the others to defeat Rumpelstiltskin, Death, all the Official Villains of Disney and all the Official Villains of DreamWorks, as Queen Grimhilde, Lady Tremaine, Maleficent, Marina del Rey, Ursula, Gaston LeGume, Jafar, John Ratcliffe, Shan Yu, Dr. Facilier, Zhan Tiri, Judge Claude Frollo, Mother Gothel, Tamatoa, Drago Bludvist, Grimmel the Grisly, Mor'du, Prince Hans, King Runeard, Pitch Black, the Druun, the Soldiers, Dr. Zara, Queen Nerissa, King Magnifico, Morgana and Drizella Tremaine, and to prevent Rumpelstiltskin, Death, all the other Official Villains of Disney and all the other Official Villains of DreamWorks from ruling and destroying the kingdom of Far Far Away and all the Multiverse, Shrek along with his wife named Princess Fiona will need help from their new friends which are all the Official Disney Princes and all the Official Disney Princesses, as Prince Florian, Princess Snow White, Prince Charming, Princess Cinderella, Prince Philip, Princess Aurora, Prince Eric, Princess Ariel, Prince Adam, Princess Belle, Prince Aladdin, Princess Jasmine, Prince John Smith, Princess Pocahontas, Prince Li Shang, Princess Fa Mulan, Prince Naveen, Princess Tiana, Prince Flynn Rider, Princess Rapunzel, Maui, Queen Moana Waialiki, Hiccup Haddock, Princess Merida, Kristoff Bjorgman, Queen Anna, Jack Frost, Princess Elsa, Varian, Cassandra, Jin, Yi, Connor, Ruby Gillman, Lathyn, Anastasia Tremaine, Princess Raya, Princess Mirabel Madrigal, Princess Asha, Namaari and Melody, although in reality, Melody is the first and only that she is not a true Official Disney Princess along with Namaari, Cassandra and Anastasia Tremaine, because Cassandra and Anastasia Tremaine they were not born to royalty, while, Namaari is an Unofficial Disney Princess and Melody made her debut in the movie of The Little Mermaid 2: Return to the Sea and it is also because she is the first and only daughter of an Official Disney Princess, but Shrek, Princess Fiona, Donkey, Dragon, Puss in Boots, Kitty Softpaws, Perrito, Goldilocks, the Three Bears, Prince Lancelot, Princess Tiffany, King Artie, Princess Guinevere, the children of Shrek and Princess Fiona: Fergus, Farkle, and Felicia, the children of Donkey and Dragon: Bananas, Parfait, Peanut, Eclair, Coco and Debbie and the others also need Anastasia Tremaine, Cassandra, Namaari and Melody's help to protect and save their kingdom of Far Far Away and all the Multiverse away from Rumpelstiltskin, Death, all the other Official Villains of Disney and all the other Official Villains of DreamWorks, because Anastasia Tremaine, Cassandra and Namaari are now good people and Melody is the daughter of Prince Eric and Princess Ariel, but I also want to see the death of Queen Lillian, because since her husband named King Harold passed away in the movie of Shrek 3, she has felt heartbroken and that caused her own death in her kingdom of Far Far Away, and all the inhabitants of the kingdom of Far Far Away are saddened by the death of Queen Lillian, because now she is with her husband named King Harold in heaven, and now they have lost their queen, that means now the kingdom of Far Far Away needs a new queen and King Artie said that his love interest, girlfriend, fiancée and former classmate from Worcestershire school called Princess Guinevere would be the one to be the new Queen of Far Far Away, so King Artie decided to return to his old school called Worcestershire along with Shrek, with his older cousin Princess Fiona, with Donkey, with Dragon, with Puss in Boots, with Kitty Softpaws, with Perrito, with Goldilocks, with the Three Bears, with the children of Shrek and Princess Fiona: Fergus, Farkle and Felicia, with the children of Donkey and Dragon: Bananas, Parfait, Peanut, Eclair, Coco and Debbie and with the others to meet again with their friends from their school who are actually Prince Lancelot, Princess Tiffany and their love interest, girlfriend and fiancée Princess Guinevere to take them back to his kingdom of Far Far Away, and I also want to see the romance of all the Official Disney Princes and all the Official Disney Princesses from their respective movies, especially the romance of Maui and Queen Moana Waialiki, the romance of Hiccup Haddock and Princess Merida, the romance of Jack Frost and Princess Elsa, the romance of Varian and Cassandra, the romance of Prince Lancelot and Princess Tiffany and the romance of King Artie and Princess Guinevere, because I think that Maui will be Queen Moana Waialiki's love interest, boyfriend and fiancé, while Hiccup Haddock will be Princess Merida's love interest and boyfriend, Princess Tiffany will be Prince Lancelot's love interest, girlfriend and fiancée and Princess Guinevere will be King Artie's love interest, girlfriend and fiancée, because Queen Moana Waialiki is going to fall in love with Maui, Princess Merida is going to fall in love Hiccup Haddock, Princess Tiffany is going to fall in love with Prince Lancelot and Princess Guinevere is going to fall in love with King Artie, but they don't know how to tell them their feelings towards them and neither how to win their hearts, because every time Queen Moana Waialiki gets too close to Maui when it comes to true love, she gets very nervous with him, while which in the case of Princess Merida is also the same, because whenever Princess Merida gets too close to Hiccup Haddock when it comes to true love, she also gets very nervous with him, in the case of Princess Tiffany it is also the same, because whenever Princess Tiffany gets too close to Prince Lancelot when it comes to true love, she also gets very nervous around him, and in the case of Princess Guinevere too, because every time Princess Guinevere gets too close to King Artie when it comes to true love, she also gets very nervous around him, but luckily for them, Princess Fiona will help Queen Moana Waialiki to win the heart of Maui, also Princess Merida to win the heart of Hiccup Haddock, also Princess Tiffany to win the heart of Prince Lancelot and also Princess Guinevere to win the heart of King Artie, and I also want that Jack Frost will be Princess Elsa's love interest and boyfriend and Varian will be Cassandra's love interest and boyfriend, because Jack Frost leaves fall in love with Princess Elsa, but he doesn't know how to tell her his feelings and how to win her heart, because every time Jack Frost gets too close to Princess Elsa when it comes to true love, he gets very nervous with her, because Varian leaves fall in love with Cassandra, but he doesn't know how to tell her his feelings and how to win her heart, because every time Varian gets too close to Cassandra when it comes to true love, he gets very nervous with her, but fortunately for they, Shrek will help Jack Frost to win the heart of Princess Elsa and also Varian to win the heart of Cassandra, except Goldilocks, Namaari, Princess Raya, Princess Mirabel Madrigal and Princess Asha, because now they will be the only Official Disney Princesses who do not need to have love interests and who can remain single forever, and I also say the same for Melody, the daughter of Prince Eric and Princess Ariel, because like her adoptive aunts Goldilocks, Namaari, Princess Raya, Princess Mirabel Madrigal and Princess Asha, she doesn't need a love interest either, but I also want to see the rivalry between King Artie and Queen Anna because they both want to compete in a challenge to see who is the best ruler of a kingdom, because both want to do what is best for their own kingdom, because King Artie wants to do the best for his kingdom of Far Far Away because now he is the new King of Far Far Away and Queen Anna wants to do the best for her kingdom of Arendelle because now she is the new Queen of Arendelle, but at the end, King Artie and Queen Anna become best friends in the world, because at the end, they both learned from their mistakes that they have made since their challenge to compete to see who is the best ruler of a kingdom, and that at the end, King Artie and Princess Guinevere see their first true love kiss and that they become a romantic couple, just like Prince Lancelot and Princess Tiffany, and also that at the end of the movie of Shrek 5, Maui, Hiccup Haddock, Kristoff Bjorgman, Jack Frost, Varian, Jin, Connor, Lathyn, Prince Lancelot and King Artie become the new official members of the Official Disney Princes, while Queen Anna, Princess Elsa, Cassandra, Yi, Ruby Gillman, Anastasia Tremaine, Goldilocks, Namaari, Princess Mirabel Madrigal, Princess Asha, Princess Tiffany and Princess Guinevere become the new official members of the Official Disney Princesses and that one day, Princess Tiffany will be the wife of Prince Lancelot and that they have a family in the future, and that also Princess Guinevere is the wife of King Artie, that they also have a family and that she becomes the new Queen of Far Far Away in the future.
Honestly I think they learned from Star Wars that having your main conflict be about trade disputes and treaties isn’t good viewing for kids. I could see him being the villain of a young adult or adult story about a naive young princess or queen having to learn to navigate geopolitical power structures with Duke Wessleton being the far more wise and experienced negotiator for a foreign state looking to capitalize on the princess’s naïveté. The problem is that’s hard to make exciting for kids so I think he was just the wrong villain for the type of story kids like. To me what this story actually needed is another Frollo: a character who is motivated by his religious convictions who would naturally see Elsa as a witch and seek to burn her at the stake. Then again that would definitely be too dark for the gutless modern Disney.
It reminds me of the villains from the Androids Saga of Dragon Ball. Originally, Akira Toriyama wanted Android 19 and 20 (Dr. Gero) as the main threat after Frieza. But his editor didn't like the idea of an old man and a fat clown being the villains of the story, so he forced him to create others: Android 17 and 18. Again he hates them because they are teenagers. Until he managed to create an incredibly threatening villain: Cell. Of course, he has to undergo some modifications. Changing from reptilian, to silly, and finally, to the one we know best. I think that's how Kristen Bell changed the villains during production. Changing from Elsa, to Duke of Weselton and finally to Hans. Presumably due to the ideology that princesses can handle themselves rather than being saved by some handsome one-dimensional prince at the end.
@briana8088 Well, the idea is a good one, but the execution leaves a lot to be desired. There was pretty much no foreshadowing for it, and it just feels like it comes completely out of left field. Even when I first saw the movie, when that part came, I was like, "Huh? This doesn't feel right!"
Duke of Weasletown, what a wasted opportunity. He just weasled out of Disney's hands to be crafted as a menacing and hilarious red herring.
WESELTON! IT’S WESELTON!!!
@@spongebobdisneymariofan3715Basil: Whatever.
@@spongebobdisneymariofan3715😂😂😂😂😂
Duke weswlton probably to be in the Disney emoji blitz next month
Such wasted potential
Honestly, the best villain theory I've heard to this day is the one about how the rock trolls are the real villains of the movie. It explains all the weird stuff Hans does in the end and while Weaselton demonstrates the typical paranoia of small thinking, he never came across like a real villain. His reasoning for being suspicious of Arendelle and not liking Elsa actually makes a lot of sense from a political perspective. He's trying to protect his people from, as far as he knows, an evil sorceress of the isolated kingdom who's tried to attack foreign dignitaries at the first ball the kingdom has held in years after being closed for so long.
Trolls also in the mythology of where Frozen takes place are not benevolent entities. The most common one is they steal children, then replace them with fake wood ones that die early so the parents dont realize what really happened. Now obviously they didnt replace Kristoff that way but they did just take him. If I remember it basically gave them access to the Royalty of Arendelle although Im not too sure what they would do with that as the typical theme with magical creatures are otherworldly motives or ones that are just really simple.
@@Corsair-Mandrake I assume the wood babies are to make them not think the child is in the hands of the trolls. Didn't Kristoff find them after getting separated from the rest of the workers?
@@Drave_Jr. Yes thats why I said it was a little different as they didn't do that, but it was a similarity of taking a child from his previous caretakers that I noticed that gave a little credence to the particular type of troll they are
That could make sense. In the original Snow Queen story the trolls are actually the ones that cause the conflict in the story by creating an evil magic mirror that will show a distorted and hateful world to whoever looks into it. However when they’re carrying it to heaven to force God to look in it (these guys dream big lol) they get shot down and the mirror falls to earth and shatters, scattering tiny shards to the winds. In the book Kai accidentally gets infected by two of these shards with one landing in his eye, forcing him to see the world as far crueler than it is, and the other lodges in his heart, causing him to become cold hearted and cruel to others.
In the original book the Snow Queen isn’t actually a villain, arguably the mirror is the main villain with the trolls being the originators of the mirror. The Snow Queen simply takes Kai away when he starts causing trouble after becoming cursed by the mirror and Gerta, the protagonist, ends up saving Kai when her warm love melts the mirror shards, after which the Snow Queen either simply lets them go.
I was just about to comment this theory! It also makes sense with their grand father and parents being so suspicious of magic that the trolls quite possibly lost all their influence with the previous generations to the point of being forgotten. Only now with two new heirs having never heard of them, that theyd again find sway in royal family, even trusted enough to watch over the kingdom during the last film.
Also a villain who could possibly see the future like the lead troll did with else, could have a lot of potential
I'll never understand why they didn't make him a villian instead of assassinating hans' character like that, the duke was already established as an antagonist anyway. He wouldn't be a groundbreaking villain but still better than whatever hans was, if they were too keen to get anna end up with kristoff, they could make the kiss not work.
I was thinking that too
Like what if throughout the movie, we see Hans, seeing how the blizzard is affecting the with them running out of supplies and becoming more and more desperate and hopeless. With the guilt of being the reason why the storm started and Anna putting her life at risk putting more pressure on him. We could see him desperately try to help but fail as the storm makes things harder and harder to survive. Then seeing this as good opportunity the duke can come in and push him into stopping the storm himself (castle fight scene like normal). Then after hans and elsa can talk while she’s in prison there he can never her to stop and she can admit she doesn’t know how to stop it. With that info he can go to the other government ppl and tell them they don’t know how to stop it JUST THEN Anna is rushed to the castle on the brink of death (like normal). So now Before the kiss scene we can see Hans making up his mind about killing Elsa and giving the Oder to have her executed by the end of the day for the sake of the people and for Anna just for him then enter the room anna is in. So now when he goes in he has to lie to Anna that Elsa is okay and that nothing bad is gonna happen to her and that everything is gonna be okay leading to the kiss not working (bc her real true love wouldn’t lie to her and do something like executing her sister behind her back.) this causes Hans to further spiral as he sees Anna growing more lifeless by the moment leading to him coming clean and telling her he is going to kill Elsa and that it’s the only why to save her and Anna begging him to not telling him they’re could be another way and trying to stop him but Hans ultimately making up his mind and locking her in there so she couldn’t interfere. The rest of the movie can go as normal with Anna still punching hans for trying to kill her sister. Idk y’all can change it but I feel like this make some more sense then the original “oooo I’m bad now” twist
I wanted to write more duke but I typed a lot
@@A-Person. it even sound ridiculous when Olaf recaps the first movie in the second. "I'm the bad guy now"
@A-Person. yeah the idea of hans getting mentally unstable through the movie is definitely more reasonable, it adds layers to the film, Also enables for more navigation for the characters and their future relationships, I know the snow queen was a difficult story to work with, but it didn't take us long-who don't have much experience in writing- to figure out what to do with hans, or another thing is that he could've been just cut from the movie, why keep a character in when you don't like it and don't bother to characterise it correctly?
Yeah, they could've explained that no, love at first sight isn't "true love" and that Hans and Anna were just searching for attention and understanding, and confused that for true love.
I even think that is really possible to Duke forsed Hans, manipulated him( wash his brain) and used to kill Elsa and takeover her kingdom for himself when Hans finish it. To achieve his goals through can't for it to someone else. For don't bleed his hands of killing the queen. The creators just not revealed it yet. But I really hope they will do
it in coming FROZEN 3. And finally let Anna married Hans and Kristoff and Elsa fell in love with each other. In other case is not make sense to continue this series. At least for me.
I still think Hans was a missed opportunity to show Anna what she could become. They just needed to show some of his brothers in order to highlight their toxic relationship.
The Duke's guards may have been two of Hans' unspecified brothers. As well as the two in Tangled.
@@flynnryan I'd think that would've been brought up. Plus at the end, it's said that Hans would be sent back home and his brothers would know how to deal with him.
I know. One thing that always bugged me is that nobody calls out the fact that Elsa and Anna’s relationship is very toxic.
Anna is a complete enabler to Elsa and Elsa is self centered to the point she did not care until what she does starts to affect her (Elsa).
I think if they showed both sides of the coin instead of making Hans evil it would have worked better and added great character development to both Elsa and Anna.
@@lespena3722that’s not why the relationship is toxic. Literally at all lmfao.
How is Elsa self centered for holing herself up in her room because of her parents and her fear of hurting Anna? What sense does that make. How is Elsa self centered because she finally doesn’t have to worry about hurting people with her powers and she doesn’t have to fear it? Or wait, you think Elsa deliberately caused the kingdom to freeze
How in Anna an enabler when her whole thing is being dependent on Zelda being around?
They are toxic, but not for your reasons. How could Anna even Enabler Elsa when they didn’t even grow up together because of Elsa’s powers. Maybe you’re talking about the second movie, but that’s not in the first one
@@BabyGirlTiny sorry for taking so long. But ya she is selfish and self centered. The groundwork was there before the sequel…. The sequel just made this more obvious…..
One mayor example I can point out is in the castle. When Anna tells Elsa she accidentally frozen arendelle instead of saying something like
“Oh no! My kingdom!” or “oh no! The people”…. Anything like that it was “Oh I am such a fool, I can’t be free”.
I was like “wait!!!! You just learned your kingdom is burried in snow and all your thinking is of yourself!?”
Also when she kicks Anna out she does not care if she gets hurt (what if marshmallow had thrown her off the mountain…. Literally!!!)
Then there is the fact that people are there trying to help her and trying to find solutions and what does Elsa do? Run away….
And at first you think it’s because she thinks that if she leaves she will take the snow with her… yet when it’s established that leaving won’t do anything she still continues to run away.
And I hate to say this…. But let’s face it… had Hans not done what he did (chase after Elsa and such) Elsa would have disappeared somewhere in the wild, Anna would have never been unthawed, Kristoff and Sven most likely would have died as well….
I felt sorry for Elsa, but there is only so much you can excuse. Even people with mental conditions and such have to acknowledge their in the wrong and such and sometimes they even need to be called out in order to start getting better.
I always thought it would make more sense if the duke was Hans' father / uncle, who pressured Hans into marrying one of the sisters of Arendelle for political and social gain. Maybe they come from a family of hunters, who pride themselves on power and wealth, and he would psychologically manipulate Hans into following his command; taking advantage of his insecurity as the youngest son and making him feel worthless unless he marries into a powerful throne. Thus, when the duke discovers that Elsa has magic powers, he organizes his men to go on a hunt in order to find and kill her. He claims that Elsa is a threat to the kingdom and must be contained / controlled, but in reality, he sees this as an opportunity to seize control of Arendelle, utilizing Elsa's death and the marriage between Anna and Hans. You could even give Hans a redemption arc towards the end, where he discovers that his father never truly loved him and only saw him as a tool to gain more power and influence. Thus, he betrays the duke and helps Anna save Elsa from execution. Afterwards, he returns home to re-evaluate his family's legacy.
Anyway, thanks for coming to my Ted-talk.
This alone would’ve made Frozen go from a 6.5-7/10 movie for me to easily an 8 or higher
Yeah. Imagine if Kristoff and Hans (after his redemption arc) teamed up to save the day. That would've been cool.
@poweroffriendship2.0 It could also have some interesting possibilities for the sequel. Hans returns to Arendelle after having given up the pursuit of the throne and warns everyone about an upcoming darkness that threatens both kingdoms.
This is my new head cannon. It gives me Princess Diaries 2 vibes and I am all for it.
Holy crap this actually improves things a lot. Not only does this allow the story to continue the theme of "Don't marry someone you just met" but it also allows Wessleton to be a more effective antagonist because he has direct power over Hans. This would change him from a goofy side show, to a cruel and manipulative abusive parent that we would all love to hate
3:40-4:50
Great comparison! The Duke of Weaselton labeled Elsa as a "monster" as soon as he saw her ice powers exposed in Frozen just like how Judge Claude Frollo saw Esmeralda as a "witch" when she vanished at the Festival of Fools in the Hunchback of Notre Dame. Both villains saw the heroines as threats that needed to be eliminated
True.
But frollo was different we could see how corrupted and extreme he was to be in the “right”. We see how he kills quesi’s mother because he’s racist and because of their “strange” culture.
Weaselton doesn’t have much of a background where we know he’s eccentric and odd and really out of times. It seems more personal that he’s just not ok with magic and while other characters are alarmed they aren’t asking for Elsa to be published.
Maybe they fear her a bit. But frollo was so mentally consumed with his extreme ideas. He fully believed he was in the right and everyone else was clearly wrong and even god as on his side.
It’s kind of interesting on Alan Tudyk’s first Disney roles for Walt Disney Animation Studios were antagonistic characters through King Candy and the Duke Of Weseleton, although with King Candy he was the villain while the Duke was an antagonistic red herring to the film’s main villain, Hans. But starting with Alistair Krei in _Big Hero 6_ although he was a Red Herring like the Duke of Weselton, but compared to his previous two characters Alan voiced (King Candy and the Duke of Weselton), Krei was not an antagonistic character and eventually Tudyk’s later roles have been usually animals (Duke Weaselton, Hei Hei the Rooster, TukTuk, Pico the Toucan, Valentino the Goat) and/or supporting and minor-incidental characters (Duke Weaselton (Again), Knowsmore in _Ralph Breaks the Internet,_ his roles in _Frozen 2_ and _Strange World)._
Definitely would love for Tudyk to play another villainous role again for a Disney animated Movie
Love to see him take over as the new voice of The Mad Hatter. After the taste we got in Once Upon a Studio, I want to see more.
I know. The duke being the villain makes complete sense. Not Hans.
The duke had everything to gain, with Elsa and Anna out of the way he would have become king and exploited arendelle (as crazy as it sounds…. the duke and Elsa and Anna are related… so if they died the throne goes to him)
Wait, they're related?
@@greenstarlover1no, they said if they were related to him.
@@greenstarlover1 sadly yes they are…. Apparently he is their uncle from their father’s side.
@@whitedragoness23 sadly yes they are related to him. It was explained in one of the frozen books.
@@lespena3722I don’t count the books as often the already given material is given to someone who didn’t work on the story. The original writers are not present to consent and it’s just an attempt to tie things together after the fact of a sloppy made story. Or the author noticed these plot holes and wants to add new information because a book has to be lengthy and reach a certain amount of pages to be released.
Neither Anna nor Elsa treat or act like he’s a relative even far away. I’m not too close to some relatives and I acknowledge them even if I don’t see them as close. The Duke guy doesnt even try to use family as an excuse for Elsa to be helpful to him. He’s acting like he’s completely a stranger to them trying to establish some kind of ties to arendelle. Surely Elsa would consider a relative over a stranger country to trade, do buiness, have Allie’s, etc.
he doesn’t even bring up family, or the death of the family burns stranger trying to pry into their lives and find out more. If he was a relative then he would have more reason to take over arendelle over Hans after Anna supposedly died. He would be royal by blood verse some stranger who claimed he married Anna in secret behind closed doors and no one checks or cared for her body.
The Duke of weasel town would have been a great but different villain because he made his men do everything for him. He was a scared and weak guy. The ending should have gone like him hiding behind those guys he brought with him. The Anna freezing scene would still happen with her protecting Elsa but it is those three guys instead. Then they stop the trading with him and throw him into jail. Anna could have have her and Kristoff love story still. But she would see that Kristoff is a better dating option than Hans. She could have ended things by telling Hans that she doesn’t want him.
I seem to recall a Japanese trailer for Frozen that implied in the subtitles that the Duke was going to manipulate Elsa and take advantage of her power by pretending to help her control her powers. That would have made far more sense than what we got.
I remember seeing Frozen on Broadway and in that version the Duke has a change of heart at the end, pledging his loyalty to Elsa.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, he should have been a full villain rather than demoting him to a side/secondary villain and making Hans a twist villain.
I quite agree.
I never understood how the duke suddenly cared about Anna when he didn't trust her the entire film. Also, he tried to kill Elsa - he got off easily! Feel bad for his voice actor - King Candy was a great villian. Edit: In the musical the duke does apologise personally to Elsa and he's more comic relief. So, he is used a bit better there.
I never got why they allowe his guards to go with Hans when he clearly is anti Elsa. The kingdom have their own guards and weasolton isn’t in charge of arendelle. No one was running the country properly after Elsa left and Anna left soon after. Hans was trying for manage it the best he could but technically he wasn’t one of the princesses!
tbh being killed by your sister does sound shocking, i'd say it highlights how he still thinks of himself as the normal person in how he wants to kill an "evil witch", i think he's sort of like if gaston was a much worse written character.
They should had him & Hans as the Villains.
Him out in the open & Hans behind the scenes plotting...
Ironically, even Schaffrilas Productions think Weaselton should’ve been the main villain of Frozen. I mean he was setup to be the main villain, so you could’ve had a twist there instead of forcefully make Hans Christen Anderson the bad guy.
“Holy trinity of villains” just made me think of The Last Wish and wonder whether Frozen could have pulled off a similar approach.
Interesting about this is that when I first saw Frozen 10 to 9 years I thought Duke of Weasletown was the main villain due to how he was at the beginning and literally send his men with Hans to kill Elsa until it reveals that Hans was the real main villain
As a kid it really subverted my expectations
As a kid teen myself it subverted my expectation but I also thought it was just stupid and did not make sense.
1:07 AND that Frozen recently celebrated 10 years since its release
Honestly they should have left elsa as the villain and made her morally dubious. In that scenario, familial love saving the day works a lot better too. Basically prince of egypt kind of family feud but where the sibling actually makes up. The next sensible choice was the duke but nooo they had to go the twist villain route....
The Duke of Weasletown makes me think of King Candy from Wreck it Ralph. Sure same voice actor and all but I would have love that a shift like we see with King Candy to Turbo. From funny man with status to monster consumed by his goal. I think it could have been pretty cool, even if it means changing the film to give the Duke a bit more backstory before the shift.
To be fair, you could do the villain shift with the Duke of Weselton without giving him a backstory.
@@hunterolaughlin
Yes I realise my thoughts are confusing.
I was comparing him with King Candy, and you can’t pull the twist ‘This character is actually that other bad guy’ without introducing ‘that other bad guy’ in a backstory.
But of course it could work without a backstory like you said !
Not defending the movie, just throwing out an alternative. What if both the duke and hans played the villains. A collaboration between the two, hans seeking his own kingdom and the duke looking for an easy trade partner. They could have played off each other with the duke nudging anna closer to hans. The first fracture in their mutual trust would have come with hans supoorting the townspeople.
In the third act, the dignitaries could suspect hans, only for him to throw the duke under the bus and take the fall. And though i would prefer hans not as the villain at all, he would, of course, make the big reveal as the big bad in the scene with anna. Come on, I can't do all the writing for these guys.
The thing that will always bother me about the Hans twist is that Hans fought his way past an snow monster, nearly falling to his death from a bridge in order to get to Elsa who was being hunted by two of Weselton's men. Then he pulls some 3D chess move of deflecting a crossbow bolt into the ice chandelier, almost killing Elsa.
If his goal was to kill Elsa, all he had to do was not fight his way past the snowman. Elsa dies in that scenario as she's distracted trying to kill the other guard and she's shot with a crossbow. And even if he the other guards do fight their way past the snowman and Hans gets there in time, again, all he had to do is pretend to not notice the guy about to hit Elsa with a crossbow bolt.
In both scenarios, Elsa's out of the way and Hans gets to still be the good guy. Saving Elsa is clearly the most convoluted and risky plan for his goals.
Elsa needed to be dragged back to the palace and confront her fears and face her sister. She wasn’t going to leave her ice palace and isolation and she was too strong for Anna to bring back. Elsa had to do it on her own or someone had to outsmart her like Hans and drag her back. He didn’t kill her because she was one of the heroes of the movie
@@whitedragoness23 That's an awful lot of words for saying Elsa had plot armor.
Can't say it's the most satisfying answer, though I suppose it's the most true.
@@JonSmith-hk1bq I ain’t here to please u, that’s for someone else. Nothing would please your moodiness
@@whitedragoness23 You shouldn't go looking for a TH-cam argument. No one wins.
@@JonSmith-hk1bq no looking for one, those always erupt on an Elsa debate channel. I kid you not. And I actually agreed with your comment and responded my own two cents is all. But no one likes rude responses either,
Him to be the one to try to kill Elsa would’ve been a lot better than Hans
Yes, yes, yes!!
I like a surprise villain, but I like it better when the story makes sense. It makes sense story-wise for the duke to be the villain, or at least the main one. If they wanted hans to be twist villain, they needed to plant in more seeds than just the words he sings in love is an open door or something like that. If they couldn't do that, they should have gone with the obvious choice and do the best with that. The duke was pretty funny so he could have been another king candy type too.
Same with me. I respect them for trying to subvert tropes, but I deem having your story make sense a higher priority. As of now, the writing for Frozen makes about as much sense as Norm of the North!
In my opinion, The Duke of Weselton should have been the Hero Antagonist of the film and fallen into the category of Well Intentioned Extremist.
i dont think an extremist should be called a hero, maybe an aspiring hero? but still someone who loses their way trying to be well intentioned without thinking of how the way they seeks said intentions actually affects others.
I’m doing a Disney villain ranking and I wasn’t sure whether or not to include the Duke of Weselton on my list, mostly because there are those who say he is and isn’t a villain.
Hands up for yes?
Hands up for no?
The Duke of Weaselton would have been a much better villain than Hans. Duke of Weaselton saw Elsa as a monster that he wanted to kill her. Hans tried to kill Elsa in the end but failed. Weaselton would have made a better full proof plan to make sure Elsa is killed
I keep forgetting he was in the movie.
Here's how I would've made Frozen.
The film plays out like it does in the final version, until the scene in the library, where Anna asks Hans to kiss her after Elsa froze her heart. Instead of turning out to be the villain, like in the final version, they DO kiss. However, to both Hans' surprise, and Anna's sadness, it doesn't work. He apologizes to her, and reveals that he was just been lying to her the whole time. When asked by Anna what he means, Hans sighs, and it's revealed why he lied: he was sent to Arendelle by his father. You see, as the 'unlucky son', as he puts it, he was a disappointment to him, so he stood up for himself, and told him that he would rule his own kingdom. His brother, Lars, 'the nice one', as he puts it, told him of Arendelle and how the King and Queen died at sea, Knowing this to be his only chance of please his family, he made a bet with his father: if he could marry into the throne and rule Arendelle, he'd be accepted into the family; otherwise, they would not only dismiss him from his position as a Prince, but also banish him forever. He even goes on to reveal that he chose Anna instead of Elsa because she was so happy to see him; he heard that Elsa had always shut herself away and knew it would be a task. Having never known she had a lovely younger sister, Hans supposed Anna seemed like an easier option upon meeting her. When Anna asks him what changed his mind, why he is telling him all this, and why he plans on giving up on the kingdom. Hans kisses Anna's forehead and looking at her, tells her that he fell in love with someone, but it isn't Anna. Just as Anna is about to ask who it is, a voice calls out her name. Anna and Hans both look over at the door to see, to Anna's happiness, Olaf. The scene with Elsa breaking out of the dungeon plays out as in the final version, except no one barges in. The scene with Sven trying to get Kristoff to back plays out as in the final version, and when we cut back to the library, Anna introduces a shocked Hans to Olaf, saying that Elsa made him. The scene where Olaf reveals to Anna that Kristoff is in love with her then plays out, but after Anna and Hans decide to hurry to meet him, Olaf tells them that they must go on without him. Anna pleads for him to join them, asking if he still wants to experience the summer, but Olaf tells them that they have to leave him here; if they don't hurry, it will be too late. Anna refuses to leave him behind, but Olaf tells them that there's not much time, and that whatever happens, he'll always be with them. Since he's already starting to melt at this point, Anna knows that he's right. She goes on to hug him one last time as a way of saying goodbye - a hug that Hans joins in. We even get this exchange as Olaf passes on.
*Olaf:* I love warm hugs...
*Anna:* (choking back tears) I...I...I love you, Olaf.
*Hans:* And we always, always will.
With that, the rest then plays out like in the final version, except Hans replaces Olaf here, and instead of Hans, like in the final version, the Duke of Weaseltown (WESELTON!) scares her into thinking that she killed her own sister, and after she collapses, tries to kill her. At first, Anna is frozen up, but then thawed out a few seconds later, since her saving Elsa's life was the 'act of true love' needed to thaw her heart. She realizes this, and this is what gives Elsa the resolve needed to end the eternal winter. After Anna tells her sister that she always knew she was capable of thawing out Arendelle, Elsa said that she couldn't have...not without her. Anna then introduces Kristoff to Elsa, who welcomes him into the family with open arms. The epilogue then plays out like it does in the final version: the Duke and his men are deported, with a trade embargo between Arendelle and Weaseltown (WESELTON!) in place, Anna follows through on her promise to give Kristoff a new sled, which leads to their first kiss, and Elsa swears to never close the gates again, creating an ice rink for everyone. Here, though, there are two exceptions: Hans isn't sent back to his kingdom to await punishment, and Olaf and Sven's part in the epilogue is ommitted for obvious reasons.
I think Hans should've been revealed to be good along and eventually stick to Anna and Elsa's side, having Olaf sacrifice himself to ensure Anna and Kristoff's happiness, and leaving the Duke of Weaseltown (WESELTON!) as the film's TRUE big bad. So, what did you think of this? And how would you have made Frozen?
That sounds much better than what we got!
Frozen should have kept the early concept of the evil Elza, Hans was clearly not the best replacement..
Exactly. Not only that, but she wasn't gonna be your average Disney villain. In fact, she was gonna be a morally-gray one like John Silver from the underrated masterpiece, Treasure Planet. Can you imagine how much better Frozen would've turned out?
@@1992disney much better, i felt robbed here.
She would have been like the witch from Narnia, but what we got is... disappointment.
Actually, the Duke of Wesleton would’ve been a better replacement if this video demonstrates.
@@hunterolaughlin Eh, not really.
@@QueSeraSeraaaa Yeah. She would've been such a badass antagonist with a redemption arc just like John Silver. But I guess we can't have nice things. 😔
Duke of Wesletown would be a way better villain than Hans
Cause there was nothing building up Hans.
Exactly, there was literally no buildup to hans's villainy or betrayal. The most valid one is how he only sings "me" part in love is an open door working to show how selfish he was from the beginning, and even that is bit of a stretch because we have plenty of counter arguments like how he looked genuinely "in love" when he fell in the water and looked at anna walking away (he is all alone with his horse, realistically this is when a person or character shows their genuine feelings), or how he was first to walk to anna instead of her other staffs, or how he was reinforced to the duke the anna put him in charge in her absence, or how he aimed at the decoration and not at elsa when he was tasked to get elsa back.
Terribly under-utilized, but can we focus for a minute on how stupid and on-the-nose that line is "Open those gates so I may unlock your secrets and exploit your riches...Did I just say that out loud". Something like that. Frozen has no respect for the audience's intelligence whatsoever and needs to just up front explain everything to you. You may excuse this because it's for kids, but then A. You're admitting this is only a dumb kid's film for dumb kids B. Then why do you probably enjoy it so much and C. Even movies accessible to kids should be clever and treat their audience with respect. A clever movie, even if it appeals towards kids will stand the test of time as they grow up, leading to much more enjoyment overtime. This one line stuck with me as so particularly stupid and sank my expectations for this movie as soon as I heard it.
"Any children's story that can only be enjoyed by children is not a good children's story in the slightest."
--C.S. Lewis
Prince Hans would have worked better if he was giving more of an Alejandro charzarion.
It might be weird that I see neither Hans or Duke a villain at all. They might have some ill intent towards the main character but considering the main plot point of Frozen of the sisters being separated and the end goal of them being together as a family again, these two characters never orchestrate an obstruction to the end result the movie is heading to. The true antagonistic element in the story, the very thing that force the sisters apart right from the beginning is the magic itself. Anna was nearly killed by it, causing separation between the sisters. The white hair on Anna's head is the strong indicator to something still unfixed. Exposing Anna to the very thing that cause her near death experience is a chance her parents will absolutely not take.
Hans did try to kill Elsa but that's never his primary goal. He needs her approval to get into the royal family and if he learned sooner that Elsa doesn't want the crown, he could negotiate a peaceful transfer of power. To be fair, none of Hans's action bode ill to the people of Arendelle, only to the current administrative figures which I have to say at the very least questionable in their competency. He could be borderline villain to the sisters but he just happen to be in the position to exploit the situation that he does not create.
The Duke is simply a businessman. Greedy may he seems but not exactly evil. His distrust and spiteful against sorcery is not out of place since everyone in the ball room has the similar reaction and later the people of Arendelle outside. The Duke is just louder than others. Since Elsa, the cause of everyone's problem had ran away, the situation forces the Duke to take action, or he's the one willing to take action. It isn't uncommon belief that you need to kill the witch to lift the curse. The Duke's motive to kill Elsa is understandably not out of malice. He and everyone who are trapped in frozen city just want to get the F out, by any means possible. He's not nice but not evil.
The duo never orchestrate anything into their favor, rather acting according to circumstances. A villain has to do more than jut go with the flow.
A bit of an underlying context, the anti witchcraft is a real article of law which I believe still exist until after WWII. Of course even with hard evidence, the Duke still has no authority to prosecute Elsa who isn't just a commoner but a foreign monarch. He needs the power of the church to dethrone her.
The feud between Elsa and the Duke is considered a personal dispute. Elsa is clearly at the advantage in the matter but she chooses to escalate it into international conflict by banning business with Wesselton as a whole. Such manner of childishness would never be committed by the more considered, more compromised Anna.
I agree with your points--especially the one about the magic being the main antagonist. Hence why the sequel focused on Elsa's magic. However, I wish the trolls from the first movie had been revealed in the second film to be one of the five elemental spirits. If that had been the case, a lot more stuff would have made sense. If the rock trolls had been the "land spirits" (instead of the giant rock monsters), then the magic would have been more clearly the antagonist. One idea I had is that perhaps the five elemental powers (earth, fire, water, air, and ice) each need a physical manifestation in order to be under control. The elemental spirits, then, must work together to find a replacement when one of the five dies, or else nature will be thrown out of balance. Suppose the ice spirit has disappeared, and a terrible winter descends on Arendelle, catching Elsa and Ana (who are horse-riding) by surprise. Elsa's horse slips, and she flies off, hurting her head. Desperate to save their daughter, the King and Queen brave the storm to find the trolls (the elemental earth spirits), in hopes they may help. The trolls can only heal plants, but they don't tell the King this. Instead, they see this as a prime opportunity to restore balance to nature by finding a replacement ice spirit. Without consulting the other spirits, the trolls conduct a ritual which bestows ice powers upon Elsa, which gives her a frozen heart, thus "healing" her, since she is no longer purely flesh and blood. Although Elsa's life is saved, she is unable to control her ice powers and injures Ana. The King and Queen, along with Elsa's horse, board a ship to find answers to reverse the magic. Unfortunately, the water spirit has vanished as well, resulting in a tremendous storm at sea that sinks the royal vessel. However, the horse manages to stay afloat a bit longer, and is selected by the wind spirit to become the new water spirit. Thus the Nock (water-horse) is created, and the storm subsides. With the passing of the King and Queen, Elsa is crowned queen. The rest of the story proceeds normally, with Elsa learning to control her powers and Ana learning that true love is not the same as infatuation. Frozen II, on the other hand, begins with a terrible windstorm, which the trolls explain is due to the disappearance of the wind spirit (an albatross). Elsa grows concerned that she might disappear, too, and sets out in search of answers. Along the way, she meets the Nock, which turns out to be her beloved horse, and they meet the dangerous (but adorable) fire spirit. The story could play out somewhat similarly, with the discovery that the actions of humans are harming the spirits (a dam trapped the previous water spirit, a mine collapse hurt the trolls, etc.). Elsa and Ana are tasked with bringing harmony between the humans and the spirits before things spiral out of control. Just an idea.
This is why frozen should have kept elsa as the villain (a morally grey one but still) OR gone the there is no real villain kind of story.
@@kentslocum I doubt the people who do script in Frozen II know exactly what to do with the spirit at all. They're there for the story but has no integral part to the development of the story other than as side quests for the protagonist in an RPG style video game. Just beating one boss to get to another boss to the final boss kinda thing. The horse can be counted an important part of the story as a tool/ride to get to the next level. Otherwise the girl will have to cross the ocean on foot. It's not a challenge, it's a help. Also, calling the existence of the magical creatures/entities in the forest Nature and calling people as something else is fundamentally wrong. People is an integral part of the ecosystem and thus part of Nature. Natural forest is everywhere, so as ordinary, non-magical people. On the contrary, the magical entities in the enchanted forest is not part of the ecosystem as it evidently clear that the forest remains thriving, unaffected by the existence of the dam while the magical entities are in disarray and even destructive to their surrounding. The barrier that prevent all lifeform from traversing in and out of the forest will prevent animals from doing their seasonal migration. Withing the span if 3 decades, some animals might have gone extinct due to inability to move to their natural breeding/feeding grounds during the change of season.
Nature is constantly changing and shifting so there's no static point of balance. Just because the condition is unfavorable to life doesn't mean it is unbalanced. It's just the balance point is not good for humans. Like in hard vacuum or bottom of the ocean is inhospitable doesn't mean it's unbalanced.
I have zero appreciation to the second film as it's fundamental idea is absolutely senseless.
@@victorstr9396 You make excellent points. The Frozen series had a great opportunity to portray the magic as a destabilizing force and have the humans realize their role in nature. Too bad the Frozen team didn't really stop and think about the story they wanted to tell. 😢
@@msk-qp6fnhonestly they missed the opportunity for there to be no villian except fear
You know what would of probably saved this character to some extent? What if he went up to Anna and Elsa and apologized for being a lil weasel and admit he was acting on fear.
Idea that popped up in my head.
That's exactly what they do in the musical, which is one of the minor tweaks I like
honestly it make sense for the duke to be a red herring, the problem its more that he is too forgettable... like this is the first time i remember he was there xD also for some reason i guessed it before that he wasnt the main villain becuase how goofy he looked (also becuase i watched the movie a year later and hans was already "advertised" everywhere as a villain so i wasnt that shocked xD)
What if the duke of Weselton is the one to try and kill Elsa?
Maybe Hans could have revealed that he didn’t truly love Anna but it isn’t a plot twist as a villian. Rather… they have platonic feelings but he is filling a Void with Anna. Anna is now in love with Kristof. Anna had the choice. And she loves Kristof
Ultimately, Hans and Olaf help Anna to scape and try to find Kristof, saving herself. But she sacrifices to save her sister from the Duke or one of his henchmen. The ending is similar, just Hans isn’t portrayed as a villian and the duke is punished with not being able to come back to Arrendel, not even for negotiations
If the feeling's platonic, then why the love song at the beginning?
@@greenstarlover1 because they THINK is love
They NEED eachother
They feel alone in their own ways and think that, with eachother, they Can be complete
But that isn’t How love is
Love is about both parts learning and bonding
Not the “Ideal” love
I honestly think that Hans could've just been a coward. He could've just been a sceptic who might've seen Elsa's magic but didn't quite believe that the "magic of true love" could save Anna purely because his own experience was relatively loveless (being the youngest of thirteen siblings and, apparently not treated that great) and now he's trying to emulate love genuinely because Anna wants it and he finds Anna interesting, and likes her attention, but isn't inherently evil, cowering out and abandoning her but not going off to kill else, where Duke Weselton actually does, then Anna stops the Duke and then gets thawed by her own act of self-sacrifice, or "true love". Hans still gets to be a subversion of expectations, while Duke still gets to be the standard Disney villain.
Yeah, he could've been a complex character like Anxiety from Inside Out 2. But noooo, we just GOTTA have a mustache-twirling villain here! 🙄
I thought the duke was a secondary main villain against Hans to see who would overthrow the queen and her sister 1st; a political game where both use manipulation, one being quirky, another emotionally with both sisters. Just like there are two sisters there would be two villains for them to fight against, who win with the power of their sisterly love for each other.
You have a lot of Frozen videos, will you do other franchises too? Or the underrated films from early 2000s like Atlantis and Treasure Planet?
I cannot overstate how much I hope the third Frozen gives Anna glass shards
He wasn't even a villain. Man got screed almost as badly as Hans was.
What might have been interesting would have been if Hans really was a good person who just wasn't Ana's love. The kiss could have not worked and perhaps then the Duke turns on them all, saying that the Queen has killed the Princess because Hans didn't let her die earlier. He might then arrest Hans and plan to execute Elsa to end the winter, 'save' Ana and or Arendel and increase his prestige with the Kingdom. He would be the final enemy while Hans would take a role similar to Quasimodo in relation to Esmerelda and Tiberius.
I always thought he should have been a vilain and Hans becomes an ally to Elsa and Anna to fight him
I hate Disney's twist villains. But I could go into a long diatribe about that. Suffice to say that a fairytale movie doesn't need to be complex.
I agree with what "Everything Wrong With" said in their video....
“Wouldn't it be logical for the ice-loving Kristoff to fall in love with the ice Queen? Two perfect guys, two perfect girls, and the sniveling Weselton guy could have been the villain trying to overthrow Arendelle.
Can you please do a video on the problems of the rise of girl bosses and what could make the next ones better? I also think we need to look at Disney Junior like the Lion Guard, Jake and the Neverland Pirates, and Little Einsteins.
Frozen didn't need a villain. But if it did, this mofo should have been it instead of Prince Hans.
ISTG this movie is *full of wasted potential and opportunities* 😫
Duke Weselton should have been the villain they built him up. Or they should have kept Elsa as the villain. It makes me so mad that they did Hans so dirty.
Wasted, is the word
Hans being a twist villain is idiotic because he realistically cannot be king unless he is married to one of the sisters or the closest relative to the sisters. Even if anna named him the new king, this would have legit caused a civil war among aranedelle's nobility due to hans's weak claim (anna was not married to him nor was anna a queen so her so called appointment has less weight). And since his family was not introduced as a close relative to the royal family in the beginning, him later acting like just killing anna and elsa would solve everything was absolutely idiotic. Kids falling for this? I mean they are kids, it's somewhat understandable. But disney writers and executives? They know better, they should have either known this or have researched this and implemented it into the plot, but they did not. This means either everyone in disney are dumb af OR they definitely did not plan hans to be the villain, and I am pretty sure not everyone in disney is that dumb, which is why I always bash frozen for poor story telling and planning.
Yeah. It really makes you wonder how the movie managed to become such a massive blockbuster hit worldwide, when it's plagued with too many issues that they can't ever be ignored nor overlooked. The majority of the world's population should've known better and shouldn't have allowed themselves to be emotionally-manipulated into believing that it's an "amazing, beautiful, powerful, timeless, unique, clever, subversive, unforgettable, meaningful, wholesome, genuine, well-made, well-written, and well-executed masterpiece". It's a perfect example of style over substance and the same things can be said about it's undeserving cash-grab sequel.
@1992disney You ever seen The Return of Harmony? If not, in that episode of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic, Rarity gets brainwashed by Discord into seeing what looks like a giant diamond and becomes obsessed with it, even taking it everywhere with her. Except it turns out to actually be a huge boulder with a spell cast on it by Discord.
Frozen is like that boulder. Even though it's really just a big shabby rock of a film, somehow, some way, people were brainwashed into seeing it as a flawless gem, just like Rarity was.
The Duke of Weasalton was ultimately just a victim & a pawn in Hans' game.
You’re right I didn’t even know he was a villain I thought it was only Hans
He is really interesting in the series Once Upon A Time 😁
What happens with him in OUAT?
@@mane53017 we discover in this version that he knew Elsa and Anna's maternal aunts in their youth
What the video is about the non-villain character in Disney such as Denahi in Brother Bear, Namari from Raya and the Last Dragon, and Alma from Encanto.
What would this guy's heartless look like? We have Skoll for Hans and Grim Guardianess for Mother Gothel, so what would this guy's be?
He’s kinda cute
4:10 Talking about Frollo YET AGAIN!😁😁
I love Frollo
I wouldn't call him wasted, he was a side mini-villain who was meant to serve as a red herring for the real villain.
You know who did that better? Alistair Krei.
Duke Weasletown gave me henchman vibes, so I didn’t expect him to be the big bad.
My theory, please read and use: Hans should of been an anti villain.
If they wanted to avoid looking like Enchanted, when Edward kissing Giselle failed: let Hans kissing Anna failing be the motivation for him to kill Elsa. The love he may thinks he feels for Anna may not be true, but he still feels protective of her, and responsible for her. So, out of immediate options, running out of time, and despite pleading from Anna, he goes to kill Elsa, since he's out of options. I can still see Elsa being so distraught the snow storm stops, and Hans being reluctant gives Anna a better chance to rush and cover Elsa, despite being so weak. Add Hans looking distraught when Anna freezes, and that scene hits harder. Once everything thaws, I can see an awkward goodbye scene happening, since he was only doing it to try and save Anna. If you add the duke succeeding at making Hans paranoid after the kiss, and encouraging him to kill Elsa, it gives the jail bird ending to the duke. Hans doesn't have a great family, and blew his chance with Anna, so him leaving Arendelle, but not going back to the Southern Isles, and ceasing trade with him and giving it to one of his brothers, is a better ending.
He could've been a Villain who Plans to Stage a Coup D'etat or Regicide in the Film, and then Appoint someone to Run Arendelle so that Wesselton can Exploit the Resources to Enrich His Homeland and Himself, Via Robbing the the Natives of their Ownership of Property, Resources, and Land, As well as Controlling Everything.
It's like how it Functions to Real Life.
Kinda like Political-Economic History where there is an Imperial Periphery and an Imperial Core that Reflects Similarly to Our History.
But Hey; It's my Idea!
[Although I Think that somewhat lacks Relevance to the Rest of the Plot in Frozen.]
And Yeah, I'd Referred to Him as "Wesselton".
Just to Keep it Simple.
I'd actually like it more if he was actually a twist perfectly fine person, not heroic per say but just an old man with good enough intentions.
At first when it's clear Anna isn't interested with dancing with him he takes a some what correct guess with what's bothering her, being her love of both Elsa and Hans with him giving Anna some honestly good advice. The rest of the scene is basically the same with him frightful at Elsa's Magic.
But now the Duke instead of yelling at Hans for handing out clothes is instead gearing up to kill Elsa, with Hans not wanting him to go but he keeps insisting, Han begrudgingly agrees, however right before he can kill Elsa he's knocked out, he wakes up feeling weak as Hans tells him the lie of Anna having died as he goes to kill Elsa and asks for him to join him to make it easier. He agrees apologizing for not thinking Hans was a strong leader.
But right after Hans knocks him out again, then the "If only someone loved you" scene plays with him in it too, so now Hans gets to rule over both Kingdoms. He tries to find a way for both Anna and himself to escape but is too weak from everything. Anna then tells everything to him, and all the pain both her and Elsa felt from all of this, but rather then being discussed he fully understands what he believed was wrong(ish) then he freaks out over Olaf a bit but then starts to warm up to him, reminding Anna of how she can cure herself.
Then for the sequel he can be in it too telling everyone about why he was so afraid of the magic to begin with, also he can enhance Kristoff's subplot by... well literally anything would work.
Now that I think about it the Duke was in the right for his actions. He only ordered his men to kill Elsa because he was terrified. He didn't act out of villainous intent. In the eyes of any normal person he was doing the right thing.
Alan Tudyk was also King River in Svtfoe.
I think the Duke as the villain of Frozen may have been better idea than Hans. However, I think Alistair Keri works better as a red herring.
Agreed!
He was supposed to be the villain?
Potentially, I mean he already got some villain vibes.
I think so
I feel it would have made more sense if he was a accomplice of Hans rather then a competing villain, a bit of underhanded plotting and ruthless manoeuvring of men and opinion with Hans being the inside man who pretends to support Elisa in order to stab her in the back.
@@Wolf-oc6tx that would be clean.
@@rossjones8656 And would give the other dignitaries someone to confront rather then passively watch events unfold.
Wasn’t King Candy also voice by Alan Tudyk iirc?
When i watched the frozen for first time in forever i literally feel like duke sense thi villianous energy , but nope its hans . Yet whats happening around here ?.
Bad writing, that's what.
This was years ago, leave the movie alone 😭🙏
Shares the same Alistair cray and turbo
my problem with this dude is that he is visiting another country to meet the new queen, and as soon as he sees Elsa has magic powers starts treating her like a witch. Like wtf? thats the queen you are addressing, the dude can start a war with that bullshit, and he has no power there in her castle. The servants and guards are on her side, trying to start a witch hunt is the worst possible thing the dude can try to do.
He should have been the big bad. Like have him get rid of Hans by putting him in a cell and then try to kill Ana and Elsa to take over Arendel
Disney should really loose the distribution rights to The Muppets and Bear in the big blue house along with the rights to The Muppet productions with the exception of the Disney produced content to Sony Pictures and The Muppets Studio to The Jim Henson Company, Marvel Comics with the characters to Penguin Random House, the entertainment rights to Iron Man,Thor,Captain America and Hulk along with the rights to the Marvel Studios produced content to Paramount Pictures and Universal Pictures Hulk only and Sony Pictures should gain full entertainment rights to Spiderman and Lucasfilm to Sport1 Medien along with Indiana Jones and Willow movie and tv series along with it and I mean all that for real.
I don’t know, you have some good points but the duke was boring me to tears because he’s the kind of villain we’ve seen over and over before. I’m happy that they chose to set him aside. He’s a greedy coward looking out for number one. He could’ve done a lot of damage but he wasn’t the main threat, and that’s okay.
Still woulda made more sense than having Hans be a twist villain out of nowhere!
Disney literally had the perfect villain for Frozen RIGHT THERE!!! the Duke is villain type defined by political corruption and bigotry.
he would've made a better/more sensical villain than Hans, and all the money this franchise is making won't change my mind
Yeah, it goes to show how money means nothing!
Another Frozen video
Duke of weaslton was weak as an villian. He practically screams out Elsa is a witch and no one kicks him out. Why didn’t anyone kick him out sooner when it’s their kingdom??? That part got me that why waited til the very end when he was a clear danger!
and he was sooo weak that they just had to close the door in his face and he would of died!
You dont know what the word "treason" means do you?
As cinemasins said it best why not just have Anna marry Hans Elsa get with kristoff and make the weaselton guy the villain trying to overthrow arendelle would that be too easy
I see this Mook has never heard of a minor secondary antagonist.
I remember sometime after Frozen was out on DVD and Blu-Ray making jokes over the Duke of Weasleton being a terrible villain like having a villain lounge where the Disney Villains, live-action and animated, hang out and the Duke constantly being turned out due to his Villain Suck status and throwing a fit when other Disney villains of lesser quality like Sergeant Calhoun and Bellweather were allowed into the lounge. Kind of a parody of how in the Super Cafe segments of the HISHE videos Toby Maguire’s Spider-Man would be kept out of the titular cafe and at the end of the episode How The Amazing Spider-Man Should Have Ended, him popping up and crying over the fact Andrew Garfield’s Spider-Man was allowed into the cafe. It’s been a long time since I watched any of HISHE’s videos, but hopefully Tobey’s Spider-Man was allowed in the Super Cafe since the HISHE episode of Spider-Man: No Way Home.
But yeah, no way Duke you’re ever getting a chance of hanging out with the Disney Villains in the Disney Villain Lounge.
799th
I don’t think the Duke of Western is a wasted villain, because at least he got a design at all, but there is One Villain who didn’t even get a design only an evil personality that was later adapted into many fanfics her name is Chort
I just hope that in the movie of Shrek 5, once Disney buys DreamWorks, all the Official Disney Princes and all the Official Disney Princesses from their respective movies appear, especially all the characters from the movie of Rise of the Guardians, from the movies of Frozen, from the movies of How to Train Your Dragon, from the movie of Brave, from the movie of Tangled, from the movie of Moana, from the movie of Raya and the Last Dragon, from the movie of Encanto and the most important character in the movie of The Little Mermaid 2: Return to the Sea, Melody, the daughter of Prince Eric and Princess Ariel, and besides, they will be the new main characters of the movie of Shrek 5 so that they help Shrek, Princess Fiona, Donkey, Dragon, Puss in Boots, Kitty Softpaws, Perrito, Goldilocks, the Three Bears, Prince Lancelot, Princess Tiffany, King Artie, Princess Guinevere, the children of Shrek and Princess Fiona: Fergus, Farkle and Felicia, the children of Donkey and Dragon: Bananas, Parfait, Peanut, Eclair, Coco and Debbie and the others to defeat Rumpelstiltskin, Death, all the Official Villains of Disney and all the Official Villains of DreamWorks, as Queen Grimhilde, Lady Tremaine, Maleficent, Marina del Rey, Ursula, Gaston LeGume, Jafar, John Ratcliffe, Shan Yu, Dr. Facilier, Zhan Tiri, Judge Claude Frollo, Mother Gothel, Tamatoa, Drago Bludvist, Grimmel the Grisly, Mor'du, Prince Hans, King Runeard, Pitch Black, the Druun, the Soldiers, Dr. Zara, Queen Nerissa, King Magnifico, Morgana and Drizella Tremaine, and to prevent Rumpelstiltskin, Death, all the other Official Villains of Disney and all the other Official Villains of DreamWorks from ruling and destroying the kingdom of Far Far Away and all the Multiverse, Shrek along with his wife named Princess Fiona will need help from their new friends which are all the Official Disney Princes and all the Official Disney Princesses, as Prince Florian, Princess Snow White, Prince Charming, Princess Cinderella, Prince Philip, Princess Aurora, Prince Eric, Princess Ariel, Prince Adam, Princess Belle, Prince Aladdin, Princess Jasmine, Prince John Smith, Princess Pocahontas, Prince Li Shang, Princess Fa Mulan, Prince Naveen, Princess Tiana, Prince Flynn Rider, Princess Rapunzel, Maui, Queen Moana Waialiki, Hiccup Haddock, Princess Merida, Kristoff Bjorgman, Queen Anna, Jack Frost, Princess Elsa, Varian, Cassandra, Jin, Yi, Connor, Ruby Gillman, Lathyn, Anastasia Tremaine, Princess Raya, Princess Mirabel Madrigal, Princess Asha, Namaari and Melody, although in reality, Melody is the first and only that she is not a true Official Disney Princess along with Namaari, Cassandra and Anastasia Tremaine, because Cassandra and Anastasia Tremaine they were not born to royalty, while, Namaari is an Unofficial Disney Princess and Melody made her debut in the movie of The Little Mermaid 2: Return to the Sea and it is also because she is the first and only daughter of an Official Disney Princess, but Shrek, Princess Fiona, Donkey, Dragon, Puss in Boots, Kitty Softpaws, Perrito, Goldilocks, the Three Bears, Prince Lancelot, Princess Tiffany, King Artie, Princess Guinevere, the children of Shrek and Princess Fiona: Fergus, Farkle, and Felicia, the children of Donkey and Dragon: Bananas, Parfait, Peanut, Eclair, Coco and Debbie and the others also need Anastasia Tremaine, Cassandra, Namaari and Melody's help to protect and save their kingdom of Far Far Away and all the Multiverse away from Rumpelstiltskin, Death, all the other Official Villains of Disney and all the other Official Villains of DreamWorks, because Anastasia Tremaine, Cassandra and Namaari are now good people and Melody is the daughter of Prince Eric and Princess Ariel, but I also want to see the death of Queen Lillian, because since her husband named King Harold passed away in the movie of Shrek 3, she has felt heartbroken and that caused her own death in her kingdom of Far Far Away, and all the inhabitants of the kingdom of Far Far Away are saddened by the death of Queen Lillian, because now she is with her husband named King Harold in heaven, and now they have lost their queen, that means now the kingdom of Far Far Away needs a new queen and King Artie said that his love interest, girlfriend, fiancée and former classmate from Worcestershire school called Princess Guinevere would be the one to be the new Queen of Far Far Away, so King Artie decided to return to his old school called Worcestershire along with Shrek, with his older cousin Princess Fiona, with Donkey, with Dragon, with Puss in Boots, with Kitty Softpaws, with Perrito, with Goldilocks, with the Three Bears, with the children of Shrek and Princess Fiona: Fergus, Farkle and Felicia, with the children of Donkey and Dragon: Bananas, Parfait, Peanut, Eclair, Coco and Debbie and with the others to meet again with their friends from their school who are actually Prince Lancelot, Princess Tiffany and their love interest, girlfriend and fiancée Princess Guinevere to take them back to his kingdom of Far Far Away, and I also want to see the romance of all the Official Disney Princes and all the Official Disney Princesses from their respective movies, especially the romance of Maui and Queen Moana Waialiki, the romance of Hiccup Haddock and Princess Merida, the romance of Jack Frost and Princess Elsa, the romance of Varian and Cassandra, the romance of Prince Lancelot and Princess Tiffany and the romance of King Artie and Princess Guinevere, because I think that Maui will be Queen Moana Waialiki's love interest, boyfriend and fiancé, while Hiccup Haddock will be Princess Merida's love interest and boyfriend, Princess Tiffany will be Prince Lancelot's love interest, girlfriend and fiancée and Princess Guinevere will be King Artie's love interest, girlfriend and fiancée, because Queen Moana Waialiki is going to fall in love with Maui, Princess Merida is going to fall in love Hiccup Haddock, Princess Tiffany is going to fall in love with Prince Lancelot and Princess Guinevere is going to fall in love with King Artie, but they don't know how to tell them their feelings towards them and neither how to win their hearts, because every time Queen Moana Waialiki gets too close to Maui when it comes to true love, she gets very nervous with him, while which in the case of Princess Merida is also the same, because whenever Princess Merida gets too close to Hiccup Haddock when it comes to true love, she also gets very nervous with him, in the case of Princess Tiffany it is also the same, because whenever Princess Tiffany gets too close to Prince Lancelot when it comes to true love, she also gets very nervous around him, and in the case of Princess Guinevere too, because every time Princess Guinevere gets too close to King Artie when it comes to true love, she also gets very nervous around him, but luckily for them, Princess Fiona will help Queen Moana Waialiki to win the heart of Maui, also Princess Merida to win the heart of Hiccup Haddock, also Princess Tiffany to win the heart of Prince Lancelot and also Princess Guinevere to win the heart of King Artie, and I also want that Jack Frost will be Princess Elsa's love interest and boyfriend and Varian will be Cassandra's love interest and boyfriend, because Jack Frost leaves fall in love with Princess Elsa, but he doesn't know how to tell her his feelings and how to win her heart, because every time Jack Frost gets too close to Princess Elsa when it comes to true love, he gets very nervous with her, because Varian leaves fall in love with Cassandra, but he doesn't know how to tell her his feelings and how to win her heart, because every time Varian gets too close to Cassandra when it comes to true love, he gets very nervous with her, but fortunately for they, Shrek will help Jack Frost to win the heart of Princess Elsa and also Varian to win the heart of Cassandra, except Goldilocks, Namaari, Princess Raya, Princess Mirabel Madrigal and Princess Asha, because now they will be the only Official Disney Princesses who do not need to have love interests and who can remain single forever, and I also say the same for Melody, the daughter of Prince Eric and Princess Ariel, because like her adoptive aunts Goldilocks, Namaari, Princess Raya, Princess Mirabel Madrigal and Princess Asha, she doesn't need a love interest either, but I also want to see the rivalry between King Artie and Queen Anna because they both want to compete in a challenge to see who is the best ruler of a kingdom, because both want to do what is best for their own kingdom, because King Artie wants to do the best for his kingdom of Far Far Away because now he is the new King of Far Far Away and Queen Anna wants to do the best for her kingdom of Arendelle because now she is the new Queen of Arendelle, but at the end, King Artie and Queen Anna become best friends in the world, because at the end, they both learned from their mistakes that they have made since their challenge to compete to see who is the best ruler of a kingdom, and that at the end, King Artie and Princess Guinevere see their first true love kiss and that they become a romantic couple, just like Prince Lancelot and Princess Tiffany, and also that at the end of the movie of Shrek 5, Maui, Hiccup Haddock, Kristoff Bjorgman, Jack Frost, Varian, Jin, Connor, Lathyn, Prince Lancelot and King Artie become the new official members of the Official Disney Princes, while Queen Anna, Princess Elsa, Cassandra, Yi, Ruby Gillman, Anastasia Tremaine, Goldilocks, Namaari, Princess Mirabel Madrigal, Princess Asha, Princess Tiffany and Princess Guinevere become the new official members of the Official Disney Princesses and that one day, Princess Tiffany will be the wife of Prince Lancelot and that they have a family in the future, and that also Princess Guinevere is the wife of King Artie, that they also have a family and that she becomes the new Queen of Far Far Away in the future.
They could have made both The Duke and Prince Hans the Main villains like in Pinocchio, Spider Men 3 and Last Wish
I messed up the 420 likes :]
Honestly I think they learned from Star Wars that having your main conflict be about trade disputes and treaties isn’t good viewing for kids. I could see him being the villain of a young adult or adult story about a naive young princess or queen having to learn to navigate geopolitical power structures with Duke Wessleton being the far more wise and experienced negotiator for a foreign state looking to capitalize on the princess’s naïveté. The problem is that’s hard to make exciting for kids so I think he was just the wrong villain for the type of story kids like. To me what this story actually needed is another Frollo: a character who is motivated by his religious convictions who would naturally see Elsa as a witch and seek to burn her at the stake. Then again that would definitely be too dark for the gutless modern Disney.
Elsa being a villain might happen in Frozen 3.
Shrek: (chuckles) Like THAT could ever happen! What a load of… (toilet flush)
He's lame though
It reminds me of the villains from the Androids Saga of Dragon Ball. Originally, Akira Toriyama wanted Android 19 and 20 (Dr. Gero) as the main threat after Frieza. But his editor didn't like the idea of an old man and a fat clown being the villains of the story, so he forced him to create others: Android 17 and 18. Again he hates them because they are teenagers. Until he managed to create an incredibly threatening villain: Cell. Of course, he has to undergo some modifications. Changing from reptilian, to silly, and finally, to the one we know best. I think that's how Kristen Bell changed the villains during production. Changing from Elsa, to Duke of Weselton and finally to Hans. Presumably due to the ideology that princesses can handle themselves rather than being saved by some handsome one-dimensional prince at the end.
Duke of Weselton could have been a decent villian; he wanted to exploit Arendelle's riches as their trade partner
Elsa shoulda become the villain.
I don't care what anyone says, Hans was a great twist villain.
You obviously haven't watched Aldone's video on him and refuse to. 🤡
OK, good for you.
@artbytesia What did you think of the twist?
@briana8088 Well, the idea is a good one, but the execution leaves a lot to be desired. There was pretty much no foreshadowing for it, and it just feels like it comes completely out of left field. Even when I first saw the movie, when that part came, I was like, "Huh? This doesn't feel right!"