There is also a real presence aspect to the supper. The Calvinist position is that worthy recipients really do receive, in a spiritual sense, the true body and blood of Christ.
At our wedding we had the foot washing for the ceremony, then during the reception when everyone else was eating the wedding party had communion as our first communion as husband and wife. Everyone in the wedding party had professed Christ as Lord at the time. We also did it that way because the wedding was being held in a church building that is not our denomination, and as such we did not know the rules as far as who could administer the Lord's supper or not. In addition to that not everyone who attended our wedding was saved.
Is it not so that the Lord's supper was a carrying on of the passover memorial? An ordinance of God to be kept as instructed forever? The eating of the sacrificed lamb who protects them from death. They eat the body together only the faithful, not strangers with you. So if the faithful only then in the Lord's house. As we are His family if we do the will of holy God Yehovah His father in heaven.
@@RightResponseMinistries If we happen to attend a church where wine is offered in communion, my husband, who has been free from alcohol use for 42 years, will not partake of the wine, only the bread. He does not use mouthwash or cold medications that contain alcohol.
What about a church member who becomes so informed that they can no longer attend church? I assume that it is OK for a few members/elders to take bread and wine and have communion with them?
Also Jesus said what we are to partake of: bread and wine, not grape juice. The oft cited reason to use juice-to not tempt drunkards, is irrelevant. God surely can oversee the effect of obeying Christ’s command without causing you to sin as a result.
Is this a salvific issue? Is it actual sin for a church to not offer wine for communion? What did Paul say about the "weaker brother" in Romans 14? Should we place temptation (knowingly or unknowingly) in front of a brother or sister?
No, marriage is not a sacrament. But when it's done by a church (which, IMO, it should be for a Christian couple), a wedding is an event (specifically, a public worship service) of the church. Therefore, the RPW applies, and at least the other elements of public worship (the Word read/preached/prayed/sung, and lawful oaths and vows taken) ought to be present. While I agree with your conclusion that taking the Lord's Supper at a wedding is improper, or at least not advisable, I don't believe this is a good basis for it.
St Paul says explicitly that marriage is a sacrament in Ephesians 5:32. It says, “This is a great sacrament; but I speak in Christ and in the Church” DRV I know Protestant translations use the word “Mystery”. But that is the Greek word for the Latin term sacrament. Mystery and sacrament mean the same. Marriage is a great sacrament/mystery as St Paul says
@@StAnthonyPaduaRadTrad It's interesting, then, that even in the DRV, "sacrament" appears only once in the entire Bible--at Eph 5:32. Everywhere else, it translates musterion as mystery. Wonder why that is? The Latin is far from consistent here either. Mark 4:11 uses musterion in the Greek; the Vulgate translates it "mysterium." Same is true in Luke 8:10, Romans 11:25, and 1 Corinthians 2:7 (OK, the latter uses "mysterio" instead). There are some places where it does use "sacramentum" instead (Ephesians 1:9, 3:3 (but not 3:4), 5:32; 1 Tim 3:16 (but not 3:9); Revelation 1:20, 17:7 (but not 10:7 or 17:5)), but it's the minority translation; the other 20+ places in the NT where musterion appears in the Greek are translated mysterium or another form of that word. So, (1) no, sacrament isn't the only, or even the primary, Latin translation of the Greek musterion; and (2) even from the six places where the Vulgate uses sacramentum, the DRV only translates one of them (Eph. 5:32) as sacrament; the others it renders as mystery. And if literally no other English translation renders it that way, it may be the DRV that's in error.
Why is this even a question. Is this a controversy in the Reformed Church? Never mind I checked, apparently it is, go figure. Confessional Lutheran and Catholics have Holy communion at weddings, it is an added liturgical rite during Mass, it comes before the Introit (technically it’s before Mass begins). If used at the beginning of the Daily Office (Matins, Morning prayer, Vespers, or Evening prayer) it proceeds the opening versicles or psalmody. The Homily/sermon does not change, the priest still preaches on the text of the day from either one or three year lectionary, which is separate from the readings heard for Holy matrimony. There is not a sermon on marriage and not everyone would receive Holy Communion because confessional Lutherans and Catholics practice closed communion. Holy matrimony, it awesome, to see two kneeling before the Altar, saying their marriage vows together with a crucifix’s, candles, statues and sacred art in the background. Then kneeling at the Altar to receiving the true corporal body and blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sins for the first time as husband and wife. It absolutely beautiful, in front of your parish. I saw a wedding at a Divine Service (Mass) on August 15th, the feast of the Blessed Virgin St. Mary (Mother of God), what a cool day to get married, on the feast of our Lady, the blessed virgin St. Mary. What a great way to start a marriage, the smell of incense, receiving Holy absolution and the true corporal body and blood of Christ, for the forgiveness of sins, before your home parish and church family.
You are overthinking this. First, “being served” is a false concept . They are acknowledging their covenant as God ask and that covenant like Christ covenant withHis Church parallels! The Lord said as often as you do this. You postulate way too much on God’ behalf!
There is also a real presence aspect to the supper. The Calvinist position is that worthy recipients really do receive, in a spiritual sense, the true body and blood of Christ.
At our wedding we had the foot washing for the ceremony, then during the reception when everyone else was eating the wedding party had communion as our first communion as husband and wife. Everyone in the wedding party had professed Christ as Lord at the time.
We also did it that way because the wedding was being held in a church building that is not our denomination, and as such we did not know the rules as far as who could administer the Lord's supper or not. In addition to that not everyone who attended our wedding was saved.
I did have the Housel at my wedding, and we didn't have the entire congregation participate for sake of time, not for barring them from the Housel.
1:48
Interesting.
I agree. I just never felt it was needed and a bit show-offy. God Bless
Is it not so that the Lord's supper was a carrying on of the passover memorial? An ordinance of God to be kept as instructed forever? The eating of the sacrificed lamb who protects them from death. They eat the body together only the faithful, not strangers with you. So if the faithful only then in the Lord's house. As we are His family if we do the will of holy God Yehovah His father in heaven.
Joel, does your church use wine for communion? Why or why not? (Please see the comment below regarding this issue.)
We use wine because that’s what We believe the Scripture teaches.
@@RightResponseMinistries If we happen to attend a church where wine is offered in communion, my husband, who has been free from alcohol use for 42 years, will not partake of the wine, only the bread. He does not use mouthwash or cold medications that contain alcohol.
What about a church member who becomes so informed that they can no longer attend church? I assume that it is OK for a few members/elders to take bread and wine and have communion with them?
So informed? Informed of what? What information prevents you from gathering with the Saints?
@@justanotherbaptistjew5659 I think he meant infirm, elderly shut-ins.
Also Jesus said what we are to partake of: bread and wine, not grape juice. The oft cited reason to use juice-to not tempt drunkards, is irrelevant. God surely can oversee the effect of obeying Christ’s command without causing you to sin as a result.
Is this a salvific issue? Is it actual sin for a church to not offer wine for communion?
What did Paul say about the "weaker brother" in Romans 14? Should we place temptation (knowingly or unknowingly) in front of a brother or sister?
No, marriage is not a sacrament. But when it's done by a church (which, IMO, it should be for a Christian couple), a wedding is an event (specifically, a public worship service) of the church. Therefore, the RPW applies, and at least the other elements of public worship (the Word read/preached/prayed/sung, and lawful oaths and vows taken) ought to be present. While I agree with your conclusion that taking the Lord's Supper at a wedding is improper, or at least not advisable, I don't believe this is a good basis for it.
St Paul says explicitly that marriage is a sacrament in Ephesians 5:32.
It says, “This is a great sacrament; but I speak in Christ and in the Church” DRV
I know Protestant translations use the word “Mystery”. But that is the Greek word for the Latin term sacrament. Mystery and sacrament mean the same.
Marriage is a great sacrament/mystery as St Paul says
Marriage is 100% a sacrament
@@StAnthonyPaduaRadTrad It's interesting, then, that even in the DRV, "sacrament" appears only once in the entire Bible--at Eph 5:32. Everywhere else, it translates musterion as mystery. Wonder why that is?
The Latin is far from consistent here either. Mark 4:11 uses musterion in the Greek; the Vulgate translates it "mysterium." Same is true in Luke 8:10, Romans 11:25, and 1 Corinthians 2:7 (OK, the latter uses "mysterio" instead). There are some places where it does use "sacramentum" instead (Ephesians 1:9, 3:3 (but not 3:4), 5:32; 1 Tim 3:16 (but not 3:9); Revelation 1:20, 17:7 (but not 10:7 or 17:5)), but it's the minority translation; the other 20+ places in the NT where musterion appears in the Greek are translated mysterium or another form of that word.
So, (1) no, sacrament isn't the only, or even the primary, Latin translation of the Greek musterion; and (2) even from the six places where the Vulgate uses sacramentum, the DRV only translates one of them (Eph. 5:32) as sacrament; the others it renders as mystery. And if literally no other English translation renders it that way, it may be the DRV that's in error.
@@mikes.8120 Thanks for your opinion, which is exactly as authoritative as mine. On what authority do you base it?
@@danbrown586 what authority do you base yours? Your fallible interpretation of the scriptures?
Why is this even a question. Is this a controversy in the Reformed Church? Never mind I checked, apparently it is, go figure. Confessional Lutheran and Catholics have Holy communion at weddings, it is an added liturgical rite during Mass, it comes before the Introit (technically it’s before Mass begins). If used at the beginning of the Daily Office (Matins, Morning prayer, Vespers, or Evening prayer) it proceeds the opening versicles or psalmody. The Homily/sermon does not change, the priest still preaches on the text of the day from either one or three year lectionary, which is separate from the readings heard for Holy matrimony. There is not a sermon on marriage and not everyone would receive Holy Communion because confessional Lutherans and Catholics practice closed communion.
Holy matrimony, it awesome, to see two kneeling before the Altar, saying their marriage vows together with a crucifix’s, candles, statues and sacred art in the background. Then kneeling at the Altar to receiving the true corporal body and blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sins for the first time as husband and wife. It absolutely beautiful, in front of your parish.
I saw a wedding at a Divine Service (Mass) on August 15th, the feast of the Blessed Virgin St. Mary (Mother of God), what a cool day to get married, on the feast of our Lady, the blessed virgin St. Mary. What a great way to start a marriage, the smell of incense, receiving Holy absolution and the true corporal body and blood of Christ, for the forgiveness of sins, before your home parish and church family.
You are overthinking this. First, “being served” is a false concept . They are acknowledging their covenant as God ask and that covenant like Christ covenant withHis Church parallels! The Lord said as often as you do this. You postulate way too much on God’ behalf!