This discussion is very important and emcompasses profound details defining and explaining the Trinity. I like being able to go back to past videos. It is a wonderful library of discussions and presentations we can go to at any time and just listen. These messages, writings, discussions are a significant part of my journey of transformation, and I thank God for the SF and Emanuel Swedenborg.
It's such a blessing that the internet allows the building of these kinds of libraries, that can be accessed at any time from all over the world. And I'm so glad you peruse our library when the spirit moves you! I agree that a correct understanding of the Trinity is important for understanding God and how God connects with us.
I was looking through Google for explanation of the Trinity and didn’t find answers there. Weeks later I was looking for something else & just happened to stumble upon this. Thanks for posting this. And thanks to my loving God Spirit for answering this inquiry.
Thank you, Curtis and Friends! I was captivated during your interview with Matt Belair, and now I'm blessed with a new teacher in Swedenborg. Your sincerity and sense of humor magnify your usefulness!🌟💞
I agree that a sense of humor is a welcome part of our spiritual journey and Curtis brings that to the table. Kendall, we are so glad that the interview broadened your base of learning. I echo your thoughts that sincerity expands our usefulness!
Had to watch this twice and I'm still not getting some it. What I am able to understand is very enlightening. Difficult area to cover. I'll go for three times before I move on. thank you for all S&L team does.
LOL ABSOLUTELY LOVE THIS EPISODE!!! AND ESPECIALLY Blendre's video, about what this channel and Swedonborg did for his life. He was SPOT ON!!!! Everything he said, has been my exact feelings, since I found out about Swedonborg, and that would have NEVER happened, if not for this channel!!! So thank you "Off the left eye" love you guys!!❤❤❤
years ago during a pure mdma experience I ended up going into a full blown trip. I had a lot of realizations that I didn't full understand at the time. I was sitting with my friend when suddenly his face turned into every fave I had ever known. Initially this scared me because I had never experienced this. Then after I noticed his face I felt what seemed like a ton of loving beings surrounding me clapping and cheering for me. It was the strangest thing ever. I now understand I had realizes by looking at his face that we are all one. A beautiful moment. I truly feel I am being watched and helped even if sometimes I forget.
What an incredible experience, Lauren. It sounds like you've developed quite a beautiful insight into the connections we as a human family share. May that perspective aid you and inspire others into the future...
Blendre.....just how I feel! I have spent a lot of years forcing myself to understand and believe what I am tought in "church". As I study Swedenborg understanding seems to come so naturally!......Belief.... it is all just so "bonk-on-the-head" natural!
I agree. It all makes sense as explained by Swedenborg. I have been looking for any sign of a false prophet. Have not seen a one. I’m truly understanding the love that surpasses all understanding!
Glad to find and watch this episide, I plan on reading Swedenborg's The Lord next and this was a good seuguay. Many blessings to you, your efforts are heroic!
Thank you, Deena! I don't think we've gotten "heroic" before, but we are so happy you find our content meaningful and helpful. Feel free to bring up any questions with us as you dive into your next (small) volume of Swedenborg's!
this is arguably the most important message he has done thus far, Im on my 3rd watching I have to say we owe him a great deal of gratitude (not to forget his crew and the wise ones behind him)
Before I even start watching just from the intro I can say ...YES...thst is how I see it in my mind...and if you tie in the rainbow to eastern belief in chakras (rainbow as well) from our crown to our spine...can't wait to watch now!
So much potent stuff in this video. I had to pause it several times to spiritually digest what was being said...no,. make that revealed. Thank you for what you're doing. Swedenborg is so profoundly awesome! I grabbed all the free books and will study them as this has come into my life at a most appropriate time. I've got a lot more off the left eye vids to watch too but every one I've seen so far has been great.
Thanks for this enthusiastic report, Dave! Amazing that you were led to this content at such an opportune time. Glad to have you with us, and would love to hear what strikes you as you continue your studies. Blessings!
Great great show. Thanks guys so much for going over this topic. This issue of, are there or 1, has been the biggest question for me. Thanks for the clarification.
Jesus did not spend a great deal of time discoursing about the trinity or original sin or the incarnation, which have preoccupied later Christians. He went around doing good and being compassionate...
Christian leaders seem to have been OC concerning the need to explain spiritual realities in detail so that anyone who didn't agree were seen as heretics. The need to conform to one understanding with intolerance for any deviation was strong. So we now see the results.
I've discovered Swedenborg's (inadvertent, or maybe not) explanation for this: [DLW 52] In the first paragraph, he says, "There is a correspondence of our affective side and its consequent thought with everything in the animal kingdom, a correspondence of our volitional side and its consequent discernment with everything in the plant kingdom...." And he says in the same paragraph, but before this, that he's talking about the physical world. So, our thought comes from our feelings, and our discernment comes from our will. In the next paragraph, he tells us about the spiritual world, where "feelings come from their volition", and "thoughts come from their discernment". In our world people tend to have thoughts from their feelings (reactivity, for instance) and discernment from the will. We let our feelings control our thoughts and and we make our discernments based on what we want. The early church fathers wanted to control the people of the church, so they discerned ways to manipulate theology to achieve that purpose. In the spiritual world, angels think from what they discern: they love truth. And they feel based on what they will or want: "love is a verb", as they say. They want others to be well and happy.
That's really profound and important to building a society of good people. There's also a dilemma of how to affect change in society. Maybe the fruits of the old thinking have to become so obvious and scary that thought leaders will open up a public discussion of why things have gone so bad and what should we do. I think that there can be no solution until people become aware of the reality of the human soul. The traditional societies of the world usually do recognize the soul and the afterlife. I just watched a program yesterday about China, the largest officially atheist country ever to exist. They mentioned the renewed love for Buddhism with about 250 million Buddhists in the country. This renewal of belief was because people need to feel a purpose in life which they cannot get from Communism or Capitalism. This search for purpose is tied to a need to know what a human being is.
I agree. Society had to develop this way. Swedenborg teaches what the Abraham/Hicks material teaches, which is that we need to experience the opposite before we can appreciate the right thing, though I don't know where he says it. I just heard Curtis say it on the 3rd Questions video. (I think it was the 3rd, but of course, he didn't say anything about Abraham/Hicks. They call it "contrast")
How can we appreciate the light if there is no darkness? How can we appreciate the truth if there is no falsity? How can we appreciate harmony if there is no disorder? Is this what is meant by "contrast"?
So detailed and simple to understand, best way I know so far of the trinity explained. Somewhere in me I knew this but in church confusing and not taught in depth like this. Thank you... Love and blessings 😇🙏🌺
God didn't change, our perception of who He is and what He is changed. We can relate to Him more. When I pray, I picture Him as a man with all the loving, caring, sympathetic, empathetic emotions that we humans are capable of feeling. He becomes someone we can love and relate to so we want to do/be the things He wants us to do/be.
1 John 5:7 is in italics in KJV. Not accepted as part of generally accepted New testament scriptures but was addded in. If you looked into say the New Revised Standard Version of 1 John 5:7 it simply says -"There are three that testify: The Spirit, the water and the blood and these three agree" makes even less sense, but apparently is the genuine article
I too find it fascinating! The Holy Spirit is the truth or wisdom emanating from the Lord-- the teachings that reach us and help to bring about heaven in our heart/mind. Jesus transformed that truth into a more intimate pathway for loving others and facing our barriers to that lifestyle.
I was confirmed Lutheran. We studied 3 books Gog the Father God the Son God the Holy Spirit For 3 years The 3 in one kind of confused me until someone said it's like Ice Water and Steam All water, but 3 forms I have looked at this from different perspectives Sometimes even in the Mysticals Teachings I am writing this before I go lay down and listen Thank you
That is a fascinating analogy, "ice, water and steam." I had never heard that before! Did you have a chance to listen to this whole episode? If so, I'm curious to know what you thought, and whether you think that "soul, body, and action" could relate at all to "ice, water and steam."
Well, fact is I’m on a quest to understand just this, as it’s easier to “talk” to someone intimately when you know how to imagine them visually. Plus I didn’t want to break the first commandment by worshiping a Prophet (Jesus) instead of God, if I can understand Jesus IS GOD and address, in prayer, each properly. THANK YOU!
I appreciate your thoughts here! Swedenborg asserted that the Lord God is Jesus Christ, and that the trinity represents different qualities of the Lord. I hope this episode helped to clarify some things for you! And of course, if you have any comments or questions, please don't be shy! PS- I'm attaching a written recap of this episode, in case it's useful to you! swedenborg.com/recap-how-to-understand-the-trinity/
@@pamelyncaldwell4060 I hear you! If you want to read more of what Swedenborg says about it, you can search Swedenborg's works for the Trinity at newchristianbiblestudy.org and dive deep!
Swedenborg wrote a lot about the Trinity in particular in his book "True Christianity," which is also available at swedenborg.com - and please let us know if you have any questions or comments!
hello. I am knew tk Swedenborg and you're channel and I admit i am loving all all the lessons. I do have a small problem and im not sure if it is on my end but for the past few days when i try and watch a video on your TH-cam channel it stops after a few seconds and says the live event is over and to retry. however when i retry it pops up the same message. so now i can no longer watch any of your videos unless i download them. is this a setting on your end or mine? and thanks for the videos. they are very insightful. I like to think and learn. All the best
After watching this video you reminded me of an awesome book on the Holy Trininty called "The Holy Trinity and the Law of Three" by Cynthia Bourgeault. Like this video , this book goes into how intrinsic the Holy Trinity is to our everyday actions it goes onto reveal the Trinity as the "hidden driveshaft" within Christianity: the compassionate expression of the Uncreated Reality in creation. I think this book complements Swedenborg analogy of the Holy Trinity.
Thanks for sharing this with us! I haven't heard of that book or author, but it's always fun to learn about ideas out there in the world that align with Swedenborg's writings. Love/Wisdom/Use! :)
I look at Jesus as a creation of God, as we all are, but more like a personal “son” to God or God’s special spirit brought earth to observe and reorganize certain things. ...Its in the words “ we are all one” that tells me we all came from the incomprehensible intelligence of God, as well as the animals, trees, insects, the water, clouds, wind, rain, sun, planets, stars, galaxies, etc. Everything in the universe has its own unique makeup, just a like the earth is unique with its life, atmosphere and weather. Other planets in different systems may be similar? 🙂❤️
"God's spirit brought to earth" is a great way to put it, Julian. We all are unique creations that receive God's love and wisdom in different ways -- but yes, we (and everything in the universe) were created out of Infinite Love! Kind of a lot to wrap our limited minds around!
This isn't a topic that I think is relevant, but I'll listen. This is the most convoluted lecture yet. However, I'm of the mindset that if it works, keep it. Whatever works. I do admire much of Swedenborg's work, which confirms things I've learned on my own.
logic says wait till you're dead and then you'll see why your mind is convoluting that which is good & true. Afterall only you can validate what is divine & no-one else?? Hmm Nothing here to see folks...Unless you do have the will & the understanding in it's... unconvoluted form (:
Thank you very much.I am really happy i watched this episode. If my beautiful mother was aching before she had me, every man must go through it before they get past the three phases to begin their beautiful and spiritual journey, and it must be done in love and truth and enduring patiently - must be awake in this whole process.
Before Creation, God was love 💕 itself and wisdom itself, so when was before creation like when was the universe created I know I know the million dollar question lol 😂
Sure can't answer that one for you, The Cube! And I don't know off the top of my head whether Swedenborg addresses that all. I mean, I'm sure he doesn't put it on an actual timeline, "This Date in History," or anything like that. Guess this will be one of the questions you ask when you get to the Other Side, eh?
From your website :"The three terms Father, Son, and Holy Spirit relate to the process of Jesus being born and going through trials in order to save us." I have a question. As Swedenborg describes Lords Glorification is alike our Regeneration. And in some Christian mystics like Meister Eckhart it is described that God is eternally bearing his Son and that it is born in us. To what does that relate to based on the above? For it is certain that there is a correspondence between birthing Jesus in the world and Jesus being born in us.
Woops, yellow! I see you've already seen this episode that I just recommended! Yes, as some people put it, the Lord being born in our hearts IS the Second Coming, so it is happening on an individual basis all the time. "The Son" is an image of divine truth, and when that really gets into our hearts, the counterpart of the "Holy Spirit" flows out of us in the way we treat others and the way we operate in the world. Have you seen our show "Who or What is Jesus?" That might give you some insights on your question. -- th-cam.com/video/EyC1Y6GO11s/w-d-xo.html Blessings to you in pursuit of the truth of these ideas!
Our actions I view as are free gift "free will",and we know we also have another important unique feature "the ability to reason.And I believe we judge ourself ,our action via those three witness housed in our sole.As we know we are the best prosecutors of ourselves and in the best light we paint ourselves but with these internal witnesses that self judgement if you like is on a hard drive that can't be denied the truth.Access to these 3 witness's "hard drive information if you like only one has the key to and also the bottomless pit.
Serving others with these wonderful truths is what motivates us, Laurie. We sincerely hope that these videos are a way for people to be closer to God and a godly life. Here is a video that thousands of people have watched and been blessed by. It is about the Lungs. Perhaps you find them as fascinating as I do, in how they keep us alive with their quiet work.That is like how we breathe in true ideas, and they infill our minds. th-cam.com/video/bcCDiyIotI8/w-d-xo.html Take care!
I enjoyed learning Swedenborg's understanding of the Trinity. The metaphors are great. Using the sun as a metaphor for God is actually universal in many religions. A Baha'i analogy seems to be in harmony with Swedenborg's, but seems to be more universal. In this analogy the sun is God and Jesus is a Perfect Mirror reflecting the light of the Sun to mankind. If you see the reflection of the sun in a mirror, you can say that the sun is in the mirror when actually the sun never descends into the mirror. The rays of the sun represent the Holy Spirit which connects the sun to the mirror. There is only one Sun (God) which never actually becomes part of the mirror (Christ), but the Mirror of Christ reflects the Divine Attributes to mankind. This same Trinity exists within all of the major religions. The Mirrors just have different names like Zoroaster, Buddha, Krishna, etc. The Mirrors reflect the Light of God to mankind in the particular times in history and to people of differing cultures and spiritual capacities. In a sense, each of these Manifestations of God, these Mirrors, is the return of previous Manifestations. Just as the sun of June causes plants to grow and blossom, the sun of August brings the flowers to fruit. So the Sun of Moses appeared during one spiritual season but the Sun of Jesus was needed for further spiritual development. The Sun of Monday is the same Sun as the Sun of Tuesday or Wednesday. Each day has a different name but the Sun is the same. I'm sure that the Sun of Reality is also manifested through Mirrors on any of the countless worlds in the universe as a means to guide them in their journey and destiny in the material and spiritual universe. Baha'u'llah agrees with Swedenborg concerning life existing throughout the universe.
Thanks Harlan, so glad you enjoyed this episode! You're right, these ideas do seem to be in harmony, I love seeing how many connections there are, so thanks you for always taking the time to share these insightful comparisons.
I see the lord in my right eye. And he does appear as a sun. Not as a metaphor or as a reflection or mirror? Literally he appears as a sun, shining brightly in my right - not left- but right eye. Maybe he reveals himself differently to you... Or not? And the stronger my love to the lord is, the more redder his sun appears and the more brighter the light is. And yes, at times his sun is distant. The teachings the lord has passed on requires none other than your willingness to accept his love for you. His divine providence is absolute. It's inevitable, no matter what! He loves everyone.
How is the immediate after life experience of the people who physically die in medically induced anesthesia during invasive ventilation? Do you have cases where the person had NDE after being unconscious with medication then again coming back to the body?
I'm not familiar with this specific scenario, though I can point you to some relevant information! One video that comes to mind is this one: "The Framework Behind All Near Death Experiences." th-cam.com/video/xyEZCvThKdU/w-d-xo.html
Well, another one that is going to require at least 2 listens, lol. Which is okay with me as I normally listen more than once to all of them. But could not make it to the livestream (I mean, seriously, Big Bang season premiere was on at the same time). Will be with all next week and looking forward to a broadcast that won't hurt my brain so much - on a Monday night!
@@Michaelmuq Go here to our channel home page th-cam.com/channels/5kBvit8NAsLO3o-8SNGAOA.html?view_as=subscriber and you will see a list of words going across near the top: HOME, VIDEOS, PLAYLISTS, COMMUNITY.... Click on the word "community" and you will see where the polls are!
That's a great question. I feel tempted to give an easy, straight-forward answer...but I'm going to abstain and rather attach this article. It gives succinct context and a great answer to your question. It's from a notable scholar of Swedenborg: leewoof.org/2015/11/29/if-jesus-christ-is-the-one-god-why-did-he-talk-and-pray-to-the-father/ Also, check out our recent video on the psychology of Jesus for more info: leewoof.org/2015/11/29/if-jesus-christ-is-the-one-god-why-did-he-talk-and-pray-to-the-father/
Was hoping this verse would be in the game show…Luke 3:21-22. The Holy Spirit descended on Jesus in the form of a dove and a voice from heaven (the father) said, “this is my son whom I love and am well pleased.” These verses looks to support the traditional Christian understanding of the trinity (three persons, one god). How does Swedenborg explain this passage?
IamSam, I wonder whether you are asking this before or after having watched the video you are commenting under. The explanation is embedded in the video. The brief answer is that The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one, in the same way that a person has a Soul, a Body and an Influence. The quote about the baptism is one of many included in the video. Let's keep talking. Here is another video about Jesus. th-cam.com/video/EyC1Y6GO11s/w-d-xo.html&lc=UgzK8hVZQW0TWzI7LYF4AaABAg
Giving it a shot for you to clear this up but there is controversy, possible problems of the Holy Ghost being in Mathews original Hebrew text. Hm? First area of Swedenborg where I find a possible crack. I'm only at 7:47 and we'll see how this all pans out. "Eusebius tells us he saw copies of Matthew predating the Council of Nicea that had ―in my name‖ rather than the now-familiar trinitarian ―in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit."
Bob, it sounds like you are really delving in, both for answers and to see if there are cracks in the theology. Way to take your spiritual quest seriously. I am neither a Hebrew scholar nor a Greek one. Matthew would have been originally written in Greek, and my understanding is that "spirit" is the same word in Greek as "breath". Curtis quotes many places in the bible that talk about the trinity of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit and how they are aspects of one God. We are trying to capture something eternal, omniscient, and omnipresent in the inadequate vehicle of language. I see the "cracks" in that effort every time I try to express my love for my children, or the burst of hope I feel when reading God's word. It does not surprise me that we struggle to convey the ineffable. I hope to hear how the rest of the video landed for you!
@@offTheLeftEye I like how the definition of us being like a trinity. We have our soul, our body and the things we do. So we have three bits in one person. My wife says I have become obsessed with Swedenborg. I can't disagree. It has opened up new meanings to the faith of an almost 70 year old man. And Off the Left Eye is a great lesson plan.
@@BobJohnson-bx1vs It sure is fun to discover ideas that resonate! It's hard not to get obsessed for a little while. (= I'm so glad these ideas have been useful for you and bring meaning to your faith. Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts and questions with us! May this continue to enrich your spiritual path!
I'm not here to talk about religian, just for assuming we are spiritually connected and equal to any kind of humans. To see aura we must see darkness before light and the life of nature. Live life with a smile and be positive, the treasure of your own life.
I've got a question --I got the book heaven and hell from Swedenborg--not the new century edition but the original one which has alot of tiny wriitng--lol anyway in the beginning it says those that believe in a 3 God trinity are not permitted into heaven cause you cannot say 1 but think 3 as your thinking is exposed there and they would not accept this thinking, but since most Christians think of 3 so how do we get that out of our head (in time--before we go) also it says those that think their good deeds will take them to heaven is thinking is is of their own good not the Lords are not allowed.......I was kinda under the impression as long as we accept the Lord as Lord and are open to learning more divine things we go to heaven and those that want nothing to do with it gravitate to outer darkness...... Do I need to be worried about that first part---the trinity thing never made sense to me and then I read a history thing where that was introduced in only the last 500 years or less and the teachings are over 2000 years old and it was introduced by the Catholic church who got it from the pagans, mixing the two together.......
Hi DebbieJo! One of the great things about the New Century Edition is that it is thoroughly annotated by scholars. Reading your question I thought, I bet there's a note for that! Sure enough, there is! In note 18 on that number you reference it reminds us that, “Swedenborg describes judgment in the spiritual world as an internally directed process of aligning the reality of our character and most fundamental motivations with the objective realities of spiritual life. ...The chapter in §§545-550 below is headed 'The Lord Does Not Cast Anyone into Hell: People Cast Themselves In,' and he develops the notion in many contexts. Here in §2, 'not allowed' (non licet) [not permitted in the old translation], and 'sent away' (rejiceretur), refer to self-judgment. The same applies to 'let down' (demittuntur), and 'banished' (relegantur) in §3. Such terms, reflecting the appearance of external judgment, are not common in the work." It's helpful to remember that Swedenborg will use language that makes it seem like something strictly of thought could keep us out of heaven as our spiritual home, when in the greater context of how he explains spiritual reality, the truth is that once we are in the other world, our thoughts can no longer be in conflict with what we really love. Love always leads thought. And we are gradually led into honest harmony with what we really love. So someone who is a good, thoughtful person, even if they believe in a three-person trinity, will be guided in the next life to sensing the oneness of God. In short, you don't have to worry. Turning to the Lord and trying to live according to what we learn about God is what starts us on the path. Our lives in this world and beyond are a continual broadening and deepening of our understanding. The Lord is leading us and definitely doesn't hold our misconceptions against us! The Lord is always working to lead us to greater understanding if we're willing to follow.
can you talk about why Christ had to return before the Holy Spirit could be sent...given to us...and also why Jesus said..there is none Holy...save my Father...which is in Heaven...
Great questions! I will share what I understand from what Swedenborg learned. The "Holy Spirit" is the new influence that the Lord Jesus Christ would be able to have in human lives, but that new influence could not happen in people's lives until Jesus had completed his work on earth - until he had completed his teachings, had died on the cross, and was resurrected, and came back to them in that resurrected form. Then the "Holy Spirit," the new influence, could come into being. After his resurrection, Jesus breathed on his disciples and said "receive the Holy Spirit" (John 20:22). For your second question, I think you are referring to Mark 10:8 and Luke 18:19 in which Jesus is saying "Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone." The context is that he was talking to a rich young man who called him "good master" and asked him what he should do to inherit eternal life. This young man was seeing Jesus as a finite, earthly human teacher instead of seeing him as God incarnate, so, Jesus was telling him to not see finite humans as the source of goodness and truth, but God. I hope that is helpful!
This is a question muslims asks to me : "when Jesus-Christ was on earth, who were ruling the universe ? " Meaning are were the same or were they distinct ? How would you answer them?
I would say that we all are created by the same God, that this Divine Source has always and will always rule the earth as our creator, and that we have different faiths and paths so that we can relate to our creator in whatever way works for us! Check out, "The Spiritual Reality of All Faiths,' th-cam.com/video/Y-US1qib37g/w-d-xo.html
offTheLeftEye Hello! Thx for your anwer but my question was more about the trinity. Muslims used to try to show that we are wrong and try to show the triune is not rational. For them Jesus-Christ is not God. So they can t believe Jesus-Christ is God on Earth and God in heaven in the same time. And in fact, if Jesus-Christ is God taking a physical body, was he also on heaven in the same time but distinct of Jesus-Christ? It is not easy to understand also for me.
@@manuelgarrido5602 Swedenborg talked to Muslims in the afterlife who were very good people, and who objected to Christian doctrine because Christians said there were three gods, and Muslims strongly believe in one God. When Swedenborg explained a different way to understand who Jesus was, as an aspect of the One God, the Muslims were open to that belief. I realize it can be hard to understand the unity of God while Jesus was on earth. Try to think about your own mind. You have a higher mind, and a lower mind. Your higher mind can be knowing things and thinking about things and feeling things in an expansive way while your outer self and body are struggling along in a limited way. But that does not mean you are two different people. You are one person with different levels. Do you see what I mean? God the Father and Jesus are One God, but different levels of awareness in that One Person.
@@offTheLeftEye Hello, I am surprised to read that christians said there is three gods. Usully christian says that there is One God but in three aspects : The Father is God, The Son is God, The Holy-Spirit is God but They are the same and only God. Usully they call this "a mystery", but today when quantum physics and other physical truths are impossible to be represented in the human mind, this is not so surprising. The question E.S. trys to answer is , in fact : "Is the triune God understandable for the rational mind... " E.S. seems to say so. It is not clear for my mind... What I am sure is that The Lord interact with the human kind first as Abraham "The higly father", then as Isaac, The loved and sacrified son, and latter as with Jacob .. The Holy-Spirit. And Surely they are the same and only God. Thank you again for your answer.
@@manuelgarrido5602 The simplest way that Swedenborg explains it is, think of soul, body, and way of effecting people. You have all three of those, and so does God. God's soul is called "The Father." God's body that we can comprehend is called "the Son" and God's way of affecting people is called "the Holy Spirit." Does that help at all?
To whom did God say, "Let us make a human in our image"? To assisting angels, according to Secret of Heavens 1, #50. On the other hand Swedenborg says angels were and are as human as the human quoted above was, so how does " Let us make a human in our image" apply to these angels' own creation? To whom did God say those words in their case? I love Swedenborg, yet his Trinity explanation seems to be at odds with Scripture, the only point I find difficult to agree with him no matter how hard I try to. Help! (Thank you!)
Hi, Anila! Your confusion is understandable. In order to have your first question make sense, you have to understand what "becoming human" is, according to what Swedenborg learned. To become human is not just being born into a human-shaped body, but to evolve to a level of love and wisdom that is aligned with God. (For a brief explanation of that, see our Swedenborg Minute: "What it Means to Be Human", th-cam.com/video/HUHzjo81tQw/w-d-xo.html) The creation story is symbolically talking about the creation of a truly human mind, so at that point in the story, it is talking about angels assisting God in creating a truly human mind in a person, when they have evolved to opening up to God's love and wisdom, his "image and likeness." But if you are thinking about it that way and *still* wonder who would have done that helping with the minds of the very first humans, remember that the first humans were very innocent and heavenly, and did not need the kind of mental purification process that we need today, which involves many complex layers and stages. By the time humanity needed that purification process, there would have already been angels who had been those first innocent and heavenly people on earth. We also have a Swedenborg Minute about the seven days of creation th-cam.com/video/dVHseZVKFEI/w-d-xo.html and a full-length show about it th-cam.com/video/0dElLLLbUNY/w-d-xo.html in case that might be helpful as you read through "Secrets of Heaven" on your own. In Swedenborg's books "The Lord" and "True Christianity" he delves into the Trinity and always has many Bible quotes to back up what he says, so I wonder if it would be helpful to you to try one of those books.
Do you have a video about the crucifixion of Jesus. That has been the hardest part to swallow for me. Well. The fact that he did it for us. I'm interested I Swedenborg's take on this. I loved this video.
Not "people" but "persons" (persona); a Latin term since there was no word to speak of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Greeks used the word "hypotasis."
ok that was great ii understood that but ill take a stuped pill soon and forget it all, but thanks anyway i do not know how to spell brelent or i would call you that more.thanks so much.
Kerry it's a lot to take in! Sometimes it helps to read it too - there is a link to an episode re-cap here that might be good review! Check this out: swedenborg.com/recap-how-to-understand-the-trinity/
Thanks for the question, Friend. I am not familiar with Modalism though I am pretty well versed with Swedenborg. His take on the trinity rings true for me. Do you want to describe Modalism? Do you want to see more videos from Swedenborg? -Lori
Am I thinking about this correct... The Word=The Eternal Son=God's Divine Logic/Wisdom/Light/Love=Logos. The Word became manifest in flesh in the person of Jesus. The Word also became manifest in the physical creation of our world? Is it fair to say that The Word was also manifest in other people/faiths like in The Buddha?
Yes, I agree with your line of thinking here! Technically the "Love" part is what is called the "Father" in New Testament language, and that is why Jesus said he came to "show us the Father," i.e., show us Divine Love in action. The Word means Divine Truth, and yes, that Divine Truth was originally manifested in nature, or physical creation. When people lost the ability to "read" truth in nature, then a written form of the Word came into existence. At first there was something Swedenborg calls the Ancient Word, and that gradually split into many different versions that became the various sacred texts and philosophies of the different world religions (which is why Truth can be found in all religions). But when the pieces of the complete Word were getting too scattered and misunderstood, the Word was re-written as the Old Testament, and then Jesus came as the "Word made flesh" to set things back into order, so that humanity could regain the ability to understand Divine Truth and live by it.
offTheLeftEye beautiful! Thanks! John's Gospel says that this light/divine truth is written in the heart of every person. How do you differentiate between the holy Spirit and this indwelling light/Christ/divine truth ?
The way I understand it is, the Holy Spirit is when that truth actually takes action in our life, working through us to inspire useful efforts and beneficial results.
Aloha. loved this! god bless. i ordered true christianity vol1 and 2 used off of ebay. , people can also check thriftbooks if they want a 4 dollar copy of swedenborg books, and once they are older and rich they can drop a ton of dollars on the swedenborg foundation!! they deserve it. very cool videos. many thanks Aloha!!!
That's so cool! I think you'll really enjoy True Christianity. Also, did you know that we have free e-books of Swedenborg's writings? Here's the link: swedenborg.com/bookstore/swedenborgs-writings/ And the support we receive from our viewers and fans is what allows us to continue doing this work! What a blessing.
If the holy spirit is not a separate god，does it mean that it is not an actual entity? the Bible says disciples are filled with holy spirit and are able to spreak in tongues，are you talking about the same holy spirit？ people s hellish mindset can be transformed into a new healvenly mindset by holy spirit，it always seems like holy spirit is an entity
Yes, Wons, I would say the holy spirit is something that is powerful and effective, but it is not something separate. Swedenborg likens the "trinity" to three aspects in every human -- our spirit, our body, and our effect in the world. So that would line up with Jehovah, Jesus, and the effect of God's spirit and truth going out to touch all human beings. What do you think?
@@offTheLeftEye l am not sure and a bit confused now，but it will make sense if all the scriptures where holy spirits present as a entity can be interpreted appropriately in Swedenborg s theory，for example Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
@@wonsgnem4436 Yes, you're getting the idea! Think of the Holy Spirit as God's influence on us, and then these quotes become: Likewise "God's presence and influence" also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but "God's presence and influence" itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind (intentions) of "God's presence and influence"... We did a recent show about the Holy Spirit, if you are interested: "The Pentecost, Speaking in Tongues, and Receiving the Holy Spirit" th-cam.com/video/PQB05uRa79Q/w-d-xo.html
Would like to say this about the soul in a sort story.Like a potter would mould the clay you will be a vessel one day.Stand porter at your own door of thought when I say ,"there is an angel at your door to bring peace and love for this I'm sure ",your never alone.
Wow, that was deep and I took notes too. I loved this subject, I always wanted to understand correctly. But I think I'm still not understanding the Holy spirit part. I will keep watching this video until I get it. Maybe I'm trying to hard to understand that I'm missing it altogether. Still this video was a blessing with insights of beings on other planets. I always felt there is. And why do we call them aliens or extraterrestrials and not beings? I'm sure to them we act like indescribable and confused beings... Anyway thank you, love and blessings to you all at OTLE...
This is a big topic, Pamelyn! The Holy Spirit has been a hard one for me to grasp in my life as well. My simple way of understanding it now is that it is God's influence in the world. Just like we humans have a spirit and a body and the way we act in the world, the effect we have on others, so God has the aspects of Father (soul/Jehovah), Son (body/Jesus), and Holy Spirit (God's love and power and truth manifested in the world). But I'm sure others would describe their concept differently! Maybe it feels more slippery because there's not a specific image to picture in thinking about it....? As for the beings on other planets, the terms "alien" and "extraterrestrial" are earth-centric terms. "Other" terms. It is fascinating that Swedenborg considers them all humans, even if they have different physical forms. It does seem to me that the universe is WAY to big to have sentient life on only one planet! Love and blessings to you, too, Pamelyn!
@@offTheLeftEye , Thank you so much, just you explaining it this way makes simple sense. I still have to learn not to be so literal. There are times things makes perfect sense to me and resonates. But the Trinity has always stumped me for some reason. Yet it should be simple. Sometimes when I'm praying I'm going from God to Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Remembering a verse in the Bible that says in John 14:6 Jesus saith unto to him (Thomas), I am the way, the truth and the life, no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (I get this part), but Jesus doesn't mention the Holy Spirit at this time. So is the Holy Spirit our conscience? In that the Holy Spirit speaks to us through our conscience. That voice of reason to not tempt fate or do wrong things? If it is I think I'm getting it. But I will search deeper to where it resonates with me. I mean it resonates but I have a disconnect for some reason. Anyway, I am determined to get it, and thank you so much for helping to understand. I am so appreciative and humble for it.😇🙏🌺
@@offTheLeftEye , I think I understand the Trinity... God - The Father - Jehovah - The Divine Creator of all Things. Son - Jesus Christ - Son of Man - God made manifest in Human Form Holy Spirit - The Comforter - Wisdom of all thing good, right and Just. The Comfort in love, goodness, compassion, forgiveness and understanding in us. Our Conscience of right and wrong, choice and consequence. The power in truth and healing... Please correct me if I'm wrong, thank you so much! Now on the subject of other beings on other planets, I agree with you. If God made we Human Beings, it would not be far fetched to understand that God created other Beings I feel are more reverent to Him than we as Human Beings. And what does it matter if they look different from us. There maybe reasons for that, I'm comfortable with them looking different from us. They don't seem to care about that more than intelligence. Who knows, maybe they think we look and act strange. In my opinion, it doesn't matter what we look like we all come in different shapes, sizes and Colors. What matters is what's in our own spirit, heart and mind. The goodness we can do to change this world around, that's upside down in values and conscience at the moment. God gave us a spirit of wisdom and truth, a heart to love and heal, a mind to bring forth ideas and principles to manifest into the world. And a physical body to carry it all out in actions. OMGOSH... I think I just described what the Trinity is. Wow, I think I get it! This is a principal I learned from Master Sha, a eastern, western Doctor and master in martial arts... That our spirit (God in us), is in our hearts (where love and wisdom live), that instructs our minds (in truth and justice), that moves our bodies (to actions/physical efforts). Balance of good and evil (equilibrium), choice and consequence and our conscience. Wow a mouth full, thank you again for your help. I think I just needed a nudge to remember! Love and blessings 😇🙏🌺
@@pamelyncaldwell4060 loved reading that comment! And you totally did describe it so well, I actually think I understand it better now, too! Thank you for sharing that! Master Sha sounds very wise, and so are you. See? You actually knew it all along - but we get stuck in confusing descriptions we grew up with, that create obstacles in finding the larger truths! And as for non-earth-based-humans, if you will, I love the idea of them looking "different." Think about how different the humans on this planet look from each other! So much incredible variety - not just broadly, but down to the details in individuals - so specific and unique that even identical twins aren't identical. What a miracle! And imagine what infinity could do with infinite planets in infinite space... I really can't imagine it, being finite, but I'm awed by the possibilities. Bless you, Pamelyn! Such a pleasure to learn with you!
@@offTheLeftEye , Awe I am grateful and humbled and find everything I learned in church was just an illusion. Meant to keep people in control and have the biggest attendance. And if you question and go against what is taught. Then you're shunned and called a rebel. And that was the reason I was never baptized. I so wished with all my heart to be. It broke my heart and I resented it and never went back to church. In my mind at the time... If this is how God and His church is, I want no part of it. All because during one Bible study my paper was corrected as all wrong. And they started questioning me with hypotheticals and I questioned them... But the Bible says this... I was in tears, stopped, stood up and simply said this... Jesus was, is, and ever shall be forever. His life was not based on hypotheticals. His life was based on truth then and now. For which this church and many other religions through the generations still don't simply grasp. Jesus was simple in His teaching, simple in His ways. But it wasn't enough still today! That He was condemned and crucified for our ignorance, selfishness and pride. So when anyone like myself who is earnestly wanting to know Him and understand. You crucify them too out of your own pride and superiority of your own ignorance. I say to you... You have no clue who God is, who His Son is. And I feel sorry for you! At least I'm earnestly seeking Him with a open heart. While you take up space in this church with your arrogance. When others more worthy and want to know God in their limited understanding of God. Have more heart and open mind than all of you put together in this church! No one spoke and all were in shock and I turned and walked out and never went back again. Yes Master Sha is an awesome teacher, he is like my Dad. He took me under his wing and I was personally taught under his tutelage. He was one of the best teachers I've had in my life! For I was blessed to have many, for which I am so humbled, grateful and thankful for all of them. Like how I feel about all of you here in OTLE... Humbled, grateful and thankful. I have never felt like learning about God could be so amazing and so welcoming as it should always be. Love and blessings to all of you at OTLE. Here at OTLE is church, home and a little bit heaven all in one. Like the Trinity, like God himself here with all who come to OTLE!
I was impressed with this until now. It's just more misunderstood Christianity. Swami Kriyananda has written that Jesus was crucified once, but his teachings are crucified every day. Please, think about what is there!
Sorry this one didn't resonate with you, Garry. I hope you always feel free to take on our channel things that make sense to you, and set aside things that don't.
I am always open to different views. Just because I don't agree with it doesn't mean I throw the baby out with the bathwater. Keep doing what you're doing; no one really knows the complete Truth.
Why not cover Isaiah 53:5 from the Masoric text also? Go back to original Greek. Would’ve made more sense of the confusion surrounding penal atonement theory and a created infused disposition between Son and Father
Thank you for your thoughts, Tyler. I am out of my depth with both Greek and the Masoric text. There is much mystery and wonder in the trinity, and keeping curious helps us go deeper.
Do you mean those phrases only as used in the Old Testament? Or the phrases as used in the Old and New Testaments? Because the way God's spirit could come to us did change after Jesus had been on earth.
Their use in the OT. You said the Holy Spirit is mentioned only 3 times in the OT, which makes it seem as if you think "the Holy Spirit" and "the spirit of God" (which appears 16 times in the OT, at least in the KJV, written that way) are not synonymous. So I was just wondering.
Indeed, the phrasing is different because the words are different. That doesn't, necessarily, mean that they refer to two different spirits. But maybe I just misunderstood what you meant and you were only talking about the wording or that specific phrase and you aren't suggesting "the Holy Spirit" is something other than "the spirit of God." If not, my mistake.
Oh, certainly not two different spirits, but the different phrasing can indicate different aspects of God's Spirit. Just as the many different names for God that you can find in the Old and New Testaments are reflecting different aspects and qualities of the One God.
That God is part of the material world 'does not compute". God is consciousness, He cannot be matter since matter does not exist. Physics has proved that matter is energy and the material world is nothing like we "see" it. That most of what is put forth here are based on the Bible is, to my mind, imperfect because men transcribed it and man is not perfect, as God is. Also, the idea that we can be saved by an act of sacrifice does not square with life itself. Can we slake our thirst by having someone else drink for us? Can our hunger be satisfied by another eating the meal? The laws of God are not different in different situations. What Swedenborg seems to be basing most of his theory on is the world of matter. How could God, who is infinite, be part of a finite world.
Thanks for these thoughts, Garry. All these thoughts are actually very aligned with what Swedenborg learned and wrote. I think this will not come through for you in this show, because it would be hard for you to not hear traditional Christian doctrine in the words, when Swedenborg actually is saying something very different. We find this happens when people have felt particularly frustrated with Christian messages they have heard in the past. They still hear us saying those same messages, when actually the concepts are different. Concerning being saved by an act of sacrifice, we agree that that doesn't make sense, and is false. If you are interested in a different take on the suffering and crucifixion of Jesus, we try to explain it in this show: "Why Did Jesus Suffer and Die? th-cam.com/video/VqsbY9gRXxo/w-d-xo.html But I don't know if there will still be too much Bible terminology in there for you. Concerning spiritual science, physical matter, spiritual energy-Swedenborg has a lot to say about the fact that physical matter is dead compared to spiritual matter or substance, which is alive. The physical is merely a temporary shell, while spiritual matter, the energy of thoughts and feelings, with the Divine as a source, is what is real and lasting. The book that delves the most deeply into this is Swedenborg's "Divine Love and Wisdom." It's a heady read for most people, but you seem like someone who could handle it, if you are interested. There is a free download available here: www.swedenborg.com/product/divine-love-wisdom-nce/ Again, no need to agree with all of it, but it might give you a better idea of where Swedenborg is coming from. Or, perhaps you could try our show "Spiritual Physics": th-cam.com/video/ndTtR9qKsH0/w-d-xo.html
Awesome. Yes, you are correct in saying I have residual negative feelings about traditional Christian dogma. Up to my 25th year, I was totally antagonistic towards Jesus. It wasn't until I learned about the true Jesus from my guru, Paramhansa Yogananda, that I truly came to really love him. I am slowly coming to see that what Swedenborg is saying has nothing to do with that "old time religion". I will watch the videos you recommend, and as to the book, I have it already. Bought from Amazon; Kindle edition. I hope I am not becoming a nuisance. I just find this incredibly interesting; not to mention informative.
The entire universe is a thought of God. We are each a spark of God descended into human form. Therefore, we are ultimately eternal in our essence state. All energy that makes up the universe is also eternal. Don't put up barriers where none actually exist. How could God, who is infinite, be part of a finite world? HOW COULD HE NOT? All that is dwells within God. There is no outside.
You missed my point. I was talking about the need for God to manifest as Jesus 2,000+ years ago. If God doesn't change, what is the need for Jesus? He would not effectuate a change because God doesn't change...
We have changed! Just like we go through stages of maturity as individuals, the human race has gone through a process of maturing. We don't teach 7 years old kids the same lessons as 15 years old kids, but the lessons for older kids are built upon the lessons of earlier ages. So even though we love our first grade teacher and all that he taught us, we need to move on to the 8th grade teacher for what we need at that stage. The teachings of Abraham were wonderful and great but then Moses was manifested. Moses could have taught everything that Jesus taught but it wasn't timely or needed at that time. So God is the Changeless and the Heavenly Father Who provides the spiritual guidance for mankind from age to age as we change and gain spiritual capacity, just like we all do as individuals. People tend to be attracted to the lamp rather than the light emanating from the lamp, and so we are tested.
That's an interesting perspective. Thank you. So we changed for the worse, and needed God to manifest as one of us in order to create a new connection to replace one that we ourselves broke at some point in our history, namely, when Adam and Eve did the deed? I have a real challenge when we ascribe a human-like personality to God. It seems to me as though God is more of an intelligent, creative force that can be mathematically calculated (just like creation itself...As Above; So Below) than an angry Sky Daddy. I wonder if biblical interpretation has been a bit too literal. That supports the church hierarchy. However, perhaps mass realization of this fact is truly the message of Revelations.
Maturing means changing. We don't want our kids to remain kids forever, even if it means going through the "change" of adolescence. We all need teachers who teach to our developmental level, or else it's a waste of time. In the same way the Manifestations of God who have appeared down through history have taught the people of their age lessons appropriate to their needs and capacities. You have a good point about the literal understanding of scripture being the problem. This literalness doesn't attract the minds of people who are searching for understanding. The Jewish leaders of Jesus' time knew their scriptures, but their literal interpretation caused them to reject Jesus. Now Christian leaders mostly follow the example of those Jewish leaders without knowing it. They worship the Lamp and not the Light emanating from the lamp. So a new Revelation of necessity conflicts with the standards of the old beliefs. This is a spiritual test which appears from age to age. I'm a Baha'i and this has been especially true in my Faith.
As you know "Jehovah" is a misnomer as the Name for GOD, being actually a translation of the Tetragammaton (YHWH), unpronounced by the Hebrews who used the vowel points of "Adonai" (Lord) and seeing YHWH pronounced "Lord" and not the Holy Name as given to Moses, ie: YaHWeH.
Have you looked at the what the Indian scriptures say about the Trinity? It has to do with AUM (or OM). Aum has to do with the constant energies being generated in creation. A-the creative force; U-the preserving force; M-the dissolving force. We can use the parallel of GOD: G-the generating force; O-the operating force; D-the destructive force. Aum is part of the Hindu Holy Trinity: Aum-Tat-Sat, which parallels the Christian Holy Trinity of Father, Son, Holy Spirit. AUM (Holy Ghost) is cosmic vibration, the Divine Mother (Mother Nature). TAT (Son) is the Christ Consciousness, a reflection of the Supreme Spirit in all creation. SAT (Father) is the vibrationless Spirit beyond creation. The universe is constantly being created by the Word (vibration) of God.
One of our staff writers, Chelsea, has often mentioned things from the Bhagavad Gita on various shows, and we have a show called "The Spiritual Reality Behind All Faiths." th-cam.com/video/Y-US1qib37g/w-d-xo.html Yes, we consider there to be value in all the many ways that different faiths see and describe God and spiritual reality.
What I'm wondering about, honestly, is how in the third millennium we still are discussing about the Trinity, which sets a world record as regards nonsense : 1. the theory states that the almighty God is HERE NOW. But this is impossible. The future is SET IN STONE. We are FREE because we do NOT know what is written there. But God would know that future instead and that future MUST COME TRUE. This means God would NOT be OMNIPOTENT: He could not even change the weather of tomorrow! He would be OBLIGED to let the future EXACTLY UNFOLD like it is, nothing can be changed. God would NOT BE FREE too, obliged to TAKE EXACTLY the God's actions already set in stone, down to the tiny detail. 2. God having a God-Son in the LITERAL SENSE is ridiculous: there is NO REASON for that. Further, that Son would be of course a "demi-God" and the people would still keep praying to the only one real God, the ONLY REAL ORIGIN of everything: his Father 3. the Son has his origin in the Father, but the Father has NOT his origin in the Son. This means that the Father is the ORIGIN of EVERYTHING, including the Son, whilst - on the other hand - the Son IS NOT THE ORIGIN of all. Thus they cannot be co-equal as stated by the doctrine. 4. it is ridiculous and OFFENSIVE to state that God is made of "substance". How can they quibble about the layout of God? It's just FANTASY. 5. therefore is NONSENSE to state that Father and Son are made of a SAME substance 6. ...and even if they were made by a same substance, MINDS MATTER not substance! They still were TWO DISTINCT Persons as long as they have two DIFFERENT MINDS (this is disclosed by the Gospels) 7. ...and since the Father teaches the Son things, they don't even share the same information. This means they surely have DIFFERENT MINDS so that they cannot be a "same God" (when Father and Son EXIST AT THE SAME TIME, but they DO NOT). 8. it's absurd having TWO almighty persons in the universe: if One of them wants the moon white-painted, what will the other Person do in this regard, could He change that color? Logic allows at most ONLY ONE omnipotent person to exist, because omnipotence is an UNCONDITIONAL power 9. it's RIDICULOUS to state that the almighty God is NOT SUFFICIENTLY ALMIGHTY and He needs to be helped by a "God's Helper" 10. In the gospels Father and Son NORMALLY TALK as it happens with TWO common different persons "thank you for hearing me...". If the Father existed now in a NORMAL form, then we surely had TWO Gods, that is POLYTHEISM. But God is ONLY ONE ! The Trinity theory is also EXTENSIVELY NOT SCRIPTURAL : 1. it's lying to state that Jesus is almighty when Jesus states exactly the opposite “ I from myself am not able to do a thing” (John 5:30). 2. the "omnipotent Lord who gives life" is an ABSURD INVENTION: an omnipotent God totally UNKNOWN in the scriptures, no one ever heard a single word from him !! 3. it's lying to state that Jesus and the Father are co-equal when Jesus states THE OPPOSITE "My Father is greater than I", the trinity inventors think to be more informed than Jesus on this topic! 4. it's FALSE to state that the Father and the Holy Spirit are co-equal when ONLY the Father know the future "..but only the Father knows", this means the Holy Spirit does NOT know the future ! 5. throughout the whole gospels disclosure it is clear that ONLY ONE RELATIONSHIP FATHER-SON EXISTS. Jesus crystal clear states: "I am not alone because the Father is with me." Without the Father, Jesus would be ALONE, NOT WITH A THIRD PERSON! Thus Jesus clearly states that GOD IS MADE BY TWO PERSONS, in other words NO TRINITY EXISTS. 6. it's lying to state that THREE Persons are in heaven, when the gospels clearly state who is there:"ye shall see (1) the SON OF MAN sitting on the right hand OF (2) POWER and appearing in the clouds of heaven." Thus, they are TWO INSTEAD, but since the POWER is not God, ONLY ONE Person is really in heaven: Jesus. THREE PERSONS ARE NOT IN HEAVEN, but the Trinity inventors don't care: they simply don't care, either of logic or scriptures. "The Son of man shall come in the glory of His Father, with His angels ". Only the Son and the angels are there ! The Trinity is a nonsensical invention, but Jesus is God and He is the only Savior. Only Jesus and the Father are here ("I am not alone because the Father is with me"). However the Father is here only in the form of a spirit. ("God is a spirit"). He is the Holy Spirit.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts, claudio! I think if you watched the episode, you find that we actually agree with you. We do not support the concept of a Trinity as three gods, but instead believe in one God. Jesus talked about the Father as as separate being, but also said, “I and the Father are one.” (John 10:30) The Bible tells us that there is one God: “Was it not I, the Lord? There is no other god besides me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is no one besides me.” (Isaiah 45:21) “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord.” (Deuteronomy 6:4; Mark 12:29) Philip said to him, “Lord, show us the Father, and we will be satisfied.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and you still do not know me? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own; but the Father who dwells in me does the works.” (John 14:8-10) Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel, and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god. (Isaiah 44:6) And the Lord will become king over all the earth; on that day the Lord will be one and his name one. (Zechariah 14:9) For a child has been born for us, a son given to us; authority rests upon his shoulders; and he is named Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. (Isaiah 9:6) Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.” (Matthew 28:18) Jesus answered, “If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father who glorifies me, he of whom you say, ‘He is our God,’ though you do not know him. But I know him; if I would say that I do not know him, I would be a liar like you. But I do know him and I keep his word. Your ancestor Abraham rejoiced that he would see my day; he saw it and was glad.” Then the Jews said to him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?” Jesus said to them, “Very truly, I tell you, before Abraham was, I am.” So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid himself and went out of the temple. (John 8:54-59) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. . . . And the Word became flesh and lived among us, and we have seen his glory. (John 1:1-3, 14) God IS; always has been, and always will be. This episode disputes the concept of three persons, and supports one God, the Divine human, who has a trinity that we all have: body, soul, and actions. Those are three aspects of one being. I think we actually agree more than disagree. But if not, that's fine, and I wish you all the best! I can see you have a strong faith and value system, and I respect that. Wishing you well, thanks for sharing your perspective!
@@offTheLeftEye " and supports one God, the Divine human". I read throughout your comment, but it is not clear what you think about the relationship existing between Father and Son. Here in the following you can see my position...thanks to you too for taking your time. It's impossible for the almighty God be here now. Why? The future is SET IN STONE. We can have FREE WILL because we do NOT know what is written in the stone and do not care about that. But God would KNOW that future instead and that future MUST COME TRUE. This means God would NOT be OMNIPOTENT: He could not even change the weather of tomorrow! He would thus be OBLIGED to let the future set in stone EXACTLY UNFOLD like it is, nothing can be changed. God would NOT BE FREE too because obliged to TAKE EXACTLY the God's actions already set in stone, down to the tiny detail. How could God manage to solve that problem? The almighty God was in a very distant past, before the birth of mankind and time ("...BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN. O righteous Father, the WORLD HAS NOT KNOWN YOU....") and from that temporal point He was able to OBSERVE US in his future and to take ACTIONS in that future. But this conversely means - from our point of view - that we are REACHED BY HIM from that past. God is thus actually PRESENT HERE, but ONLY with his words and actions. It's a kind of phone communication with the past, with added possibility of omnipotent actions. In other terms we can say that God IS A SPIRIT here ("God is a spirit") because He is active but those actions are actually MADE BY NOBODY. That Spirit - who is here - is called the Holy Spirit. The almighty God - who dwells in that distant past - corresponds to the "Father" of the baptismal formula instead, no one ever saw Him ("the world has not known you")... That above is from our point of view. From GOD'S POINT OF VIEW instead things are different: when the universe started the almighty God had already done ALL HIS WORK. He already decided all his future actions so that the future was set in stone to be made AUTOMATICALLY TRUE by his power. He had thus made EVERYTHING. He could get rid of his then USELESS power to become like a NORMAL MAN: the Son. "Son" thus means that He DERIVES from God, He is not a Son in the common sense of the word. As a normal man, He also has a relationship with God (but much stronger), He has thus a relationship with a "different Himself". The Son has thus no power at all, but He sits in heaven next to the power of God. His power is thus always "borrowed" from the Father, under his consent. God has thus already lived his "mankind experience" once as the almighty God. He is now living his "mankind experience" a second time as a normal man.
@@claudiozanella256 that is a very interesting take on God's life and identity! I still think that we have a lot of ideas in common! We talk about God's presence today being in our hearts and minds - like the spirit you mentioned. "Behold, you have the kingdom of God within you." (Luke 17:21) This clip can better explain things than I can, if you're interested: "What God/Jesus Is" th-cam.com/video/5Y0q0Lw30aE/w-d-xo.html Or this episode describes our relationship with God, and how consciousness works: "The Infinite In You" th-cam.com/video/8KPZKkrijxo/w-d-xo.html Let me know what you think! Thanks for sharing your thoughts on how this all works - what a complex subject!
The Trinity in Egypt- the first civilization. Had holy mother, holy father and holy infant. Not a patriarchy? Where is the divine feminine? Creator and bringer of life?
There are many wonderful images of God as a mother in scripture. Here are a couple. "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets, and stone them which are sent unto you, how often would I have gathered your children together, even as a hen gathers her chickens under her wings, and you would not!"Matthwe 23. " “Can a woman forget her nursing child, And not have compassion on the son of her womb? Surely they may forget, Yet I will not forget you." Isaiah 49 Yes God is the Creator of life, and every way we try to capture that Creator in such a limited way as words we will fall short. Can words describe the light? Music? Love? Yet is is important that we try. Thanks for the conversation Ketherwhale.
The bible continually tells us the Lord our God is ONE. Many many parts and verses tells us their is only ONE GOD and that God came down in the flesh 1 Timothy 3:16 The Word was God the Word who was Jesus was made flesh. Jesus is God in the flesh Swedenborg was 100 per cent right 👌
The so called Trinity makes sense to me by saying: the Father and the Holy Spirits who act for the Father. They do the work of the Father and are human persons who live with God in the third heaven. The Spirit of the Father's nature and Holiness flows through them from the Father to God's other children. They help, teach, care for , give comfort, are kind plus more to all of the Creator's children. When given to be so, they not only represent God but are given to be God the Father by Devine investiture of person. Hence, Jesus, one of those Holy Spirits, could say I am the very Father. Such Holy Spirits can appear to near death experiencers and say I am God or Jesus. They are one in power and wisdom etc. in very person with God as needed. Jesus, however, was the only Holy Spirit chosen to be the Father's mortal child. He acts for the Father in mortality, to do the mortal work of the Father and the mortal Son. He was the mortal Hand and Arm of God the Father to help us. It is also true that we can all be the mortal help of the Father by doing the good things to others that a father would do for his children. This is one way God is omnipresent in a personal way to all. By this Devine investiture of very person, the Father's Kingdom is governed by the Father in all it's infinite extent. So there is an infinity of Gods but they are a composite person of the one Devine Creator and the many mortal Redeemers. There are infinite earths in God's Kingdom. Jesus was God's Only Begotten Son to us on our earth to do a mortal work for the one Eternal Father. Just trying to figure it out.
Hi Paul, I think that's an interesting take! Swedenborg does seem to stress that God is one being, albeit an infinite being - thus God can take infinite forms, in order to best connect with an infinite variety of people, on this earth and others. It is impossible to fully define the infinite, but I think you are right that God operates through the Holy Spirit and through Jesus to achieve divine ends! How did our explanation resonate? The part that made it clearer to me was in our diagram, right here: th-cam.com/video/-YbEHk2N884/w-d-xo.html Holy Spirit is our actions, the Divine Father is our soul, and the physical manifestation or body is the Son - just like as humans we have our physical self, our soul, and our actions, and those three things combine to make us who we are, they interact with each other and each part is necessary but they are also separate things.
@@offTheLeftEye The soul of my earthly father remains with me as I identify with his good attributes to achieve the same. So, if the good nature of my Heavenly Father flows to me, to some degree, with it's the attendant gifts as charity, wisdom, the much goodness that is the nature or soul of the Father is with me as an inheritance from him. There seems to be a Spirit of Holiness that flows from the Father in degrees to all his children and also Holy Spirits that work for the Father. So, the idea of the soul of the Father being in all of us resonates with me. The soul of the devil may find more or less place in others. How far advanced God is from us yet how close and personal to nurture is he with each of us especially those that have desire and take action to be closer to him! Father is such an appropriate and great name for God.
If Swedenborg compares the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit to our soul, body, and actions, then none of them are fully God. In fact, it would be hard to see whether any of them would even be persons under Swedenborg's formulation. Your mind, body, and soul are all parts of you, but *you* are not your body, nor are you your mind, nor are you your soul.
Interesting thoughts, Daniel. We are trying to wrap words around big concepts. Does the four letter word "love" contain your devotion to people in your life? Does the three letter word "joy" adequately contain the emotion you feel when you climb a mountain, or on your wedding day, or the birth of your child? We are mortal, and finite. Our attempt to describe and understand God is in some ways futile. Yet we feel an inner urge to try. Words like love, and joy, and Father and Son are small packages for such magnificent experiences and infinite concepts. They are clumsy, and yet we need them. Sometimes we can lift ourselves above the words, and feel them more deeply. When I hold a baby in my arms words are superfluous. We do not need words to validate our connection. When I feel in the stream of providence words are too small to carry the meaning. May you find your own rhythm of connecting with God, with or without the names.
@@offTheLeftEye i was reading bhagavad gita how it is and interesting in that and its just crazy and when swedenborg writes why god come down and he writes that god come down to fight hell and demons and he comes down to restore balance betwren hell earth and heaven.. thats same whats written in bhagavd gita and what krishna says.. and he s three aspects of lord jesus christ as person its same... From krishna emantes he is bhagavan lord he is paramatma as lord sitting in every ones heart as person and brahma is light holy spirit energy.. main difference is that krishnaits believe in reincarnation.. Thats crazy because bhagavad gita was not yet translated when swedenborg was alive.. even sun comparison is the same..
@@offTheLeftEye there is very strange thing when jesus was prayng alone in garden to father he says father i opened your name to them.. but we dont know any name in christianity of father so whats the name of father? What name he opened? It is jesus christ he is the father!!
@@moonbayer2323 thanks so much for sharing this, and for your questions! I love hearing your thoughts! Here are some episodes that I think you'll like! Here's a short clip: "What Does God's Name [Really] Mean?" th-cam.com/video/R1UvjU0AdoI/w-d-xo.html and you might like this longer episode on the subject: "The Spiritual Meaning of Names" th-cam.com/video/df07hn8wMok/w-d-xo.html Also in reference to the similarities between Swedenborg and the Bhagavad Gita, check out this episode about religions: "The Spiritual Reality Behind All Faiths" th-cam.com/video/Y-US1qib37g/w-d-xo.html
Our government seems to be based on the ambition of the biggest egos the country can produce. It's not spiritual in any way that I can see. The best people to run our affairs are the humble ones who would never push themselves forward as being the best choice. It's a real dilemma.
Time :37 Yes," it's hard to get used to no matter how I try" as the same words sing in a timely way on the radio as I try to put the confusion into words. It's hard to be. I am NOT JESUS CHRIST although I am there with him as one mostly doing the miracles and being the one giving the breath that brought his dead body back to life. I AM NOT THE FATHER GOD, the True one (true just said on the radio as I typed the word "true") is SO HOLY. . BUT there are a lot of false saying they are HE. What a mess! I AM THE HOLY SPIRIT. Stop saying you are Me, I am not open to having you in MY SELF. AT ALL. in fact, it is a sin you are committing against US.
God is one not three. If there were three Gods then which one would take the throne? There would just be chaos everywhere and there wouldn't be any order in the universe. The reason why some people believe in this is because this is the result or Jesus Christ's original message becoming corrupt overtime. And even if it does talk about the trinity in the Bible, this doesn't matter because there are over 200 different versions of the Bible and it is not in its original form. The final prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was sent to clear up these misconceptions and to re-establish the same pure message that all of the other prophets and messengers in the past have preached before people corrupted it. He was sent with the last revelation until the day of judgement which is the Quran. This book is the criterion over all religion and it is a historical fact that not a single letter has changed ever since revelation. And there is nowhere in here that says God is three. May God guide you all to the straight path :)
Hi Sam, thanks for reaching out! It's cool to note the harmony between you and Swedenborg with regards to the trinity. And thanks so much for sharing about your faith...we really encourage this type of dialogue. May God bless your path, my friend.
If you had watched the video you would know that this video does not claim that God is three. The Trinity of God is simply a way to represent 3 aspects of 1 God. In the same sense, each human can be described as a Trinity, such as Mind, Soul, Body or Soul Body and Action. Your faith in 1 book has made you unable to simply watch and digest the facts presented here. People who are Bible Thumpers or Quran Thumpers can be dangerous. Calm down (something I would say to the entire Muslim world) and open your mind.
And God said let (US) make man in (OUR) image, after (OUR) likeness. for there are 'three' which bear record in heaven, the (father), the (Word), and the (Holy Ghost): and these 'three' are 'one'. Genesis 1: 26, 1 John 5:7
This discussion is very important and emcompasses profound details defining and explaining the Trinity. I like being able to go back to past videos. It is a wonderful library of discussions and presentations we can go to at any time and just listen. These messages, writings, discussions are a significant part of my journey of transformation, and I thank God for the SF and Emanuel Swedenborg.
It's such a blessing that the internet allows the building of these kinds of libraries, that can be accessed at any time from all over the world. And I'm so glad you peruse our library when the spirit moves you! I agree that a correct understanding of the Trinity is important for understanding God and how God connects with us.
I was looking through Google for explanation of the Trinity and didn’t find answers there. Weeks later I was looking for something else & just happened to stumble upon this. Thanks for posting this.
And thanks to my loving God Spirit for answering this inquiry.
You're very welcome! I'm so glad this video was helpful to you. God bless!
Thank you, Curtis and Friends! I was captivated during your interview with Matt Belair, and now I'm blessed with a new teacher in Swedenborg. Your sincerity and sense of humor magnify your usefulness!🌟💞
I agree that a sense of humor is a welcome part of our spiritual journey and Curtis brings that to the table. Kendall, we are so glad that the interview broadened your base of learning. I echo your thoughts that sincerity expands our usefulness!
I'm so grateful this video exists
And we're so grateful that this video is useful to you! Thanks so much for reaching out, Patricia :)
OF ALL THE ONES I HAVE STUDED ALL YOU GUYS ARE THE VERY BEST. THANK YOU ALL.
Thanks Kerry! We are so lucky to have you in our community!
Had to watch this twice and I'm still not getting some it. What I am able to understand is very enlightening. Difficult area to cover. I'll go for three times before I move on. thank you for all S&L team does.
Thank you ! Curtis and team for caring and sharing..its truly wonderful to be part of it every week.
Thanks for clearing up lots of things I never understood all my life. Appreciate the wisdom you share with us on a daily basis.
G, so glad you're here and soaking it in! Thank you for sharing your enthusiasm and insights with us! God bless!
The best program yet! I now feel secure in my belief about the trinity, although I never really thought that "God in three persons"
was correct.
I loooooove this! It is fun. Curtis and Jonathan have wonderful energy. Really good presentation and discussion.
Thanks! We always enjoy having Jonathan on the show, and are thankful for his knowledge and energy!
LOL ABSOLUTELY LOVE THIS EPISODE!!! AND ESPECIALLY Blendre's video, about what this channel and Swedonborg did for his life. He was SPOT ON!!!! Everything he said, has been my exact feelings, since I found out about Swedonborg, and that would have NEVER happened, if not for this channel!!! So thank you "Off the left eye" love you guys!!❤❤❤
Thanks again, Amy, for your love and encouragement! So glad these ideas are making a difference for you!
years ago during a pure mdma experience I ended up going into a full blown trip. I had a lot of realizations that I didn't full understand at the time. I was sitting with my friend when suddenly his face turned into every fave I had ever known. Initially this scared me because I had never experienced this. Then after I noticed his face I felt what seemed like a ton of loving beings surrounding me clapping and cheering for me. It was the strangest thing ever. I now understand I had realizes by looking at his face that we are all one. A beautiful moment. I truly feel I am being watched and helped even if sometimes I forget.
What an incredible experience, Lauren. It sounds like you've developed quite a beautiful insight into the connections we as a human family share. May that perspective aid you and inspire others into the future...
Blendre.....just how I feel! I have spent a lot of years forcing myself to understand and believe what I am tought in "church". As I study Swedenborg understanding seems to come so naturally!......Belief.... it is all just so "bonk-on-the-head" natural!
How ever. you. slice. It! God in Heaven. Is. seen. as. Three. different. Persons !KAT. Kerr. saw. The. Person. of. Jesus,. The. Person. of. the. Father. and. the. Person. of. The. HOLY. Spirt.!
I agree. It all makes sense as explained by Swedenborg. I have been looking for any sign of a false prophet. Have not seen a one. I’m truly understanding the love that surpasses all understanding!
Catching up with the latest; thanks Carl and team.
Glad to find and watch this episide, I plan on reading Swedenborg's The Lord next and this was a good seuguay. Many blessings to you, your efforts are heroic!
Thank you, Deena! I don't think we've gotten "heroic" before, but we are so happy you find our content meaningful and helpful. Feel free to bring up any questions with us as you dive into your next (small) volume of Swedenborg's!
@@offTheLeftEye yes, and I love autocorrect. Segue. I don't even know what the misspelling represents....have to look that one up
@@deenahome2060 Haha, good old autocorrect. 😂
I have watched 3 times so far and I think I will do that again :)
this is arguably the most important message he has done thus far, Im on my 3rd watching I have to say we owe him a great deal of gratitude (not to forget his crew and the wise ones behind him)
Miss you guys. I am happy you're back.
Before I even start watching just from the intro I can say ...YES...thst is how I see it in my mind...and if you tie in the rainbow to eastern belief in chakras (rainbow as well) from our crown to our spine...can't wait to watch now!
Observe how "chakras" have exactly opposite direction of rainbow colors.
Thanks for the outstanding presentation! The bulb became a bit brighter. For that I am truly thankful!
That's wonderful, Ken! I'm elated to hear of your experience with this episode.
Wonderful explanation of the Trinity. God bless you and continue spreading the great work!
Thank you Agnes!
welcome back. i was starting to have withdrawals.
much love.
So much potent stuff in this video. I had to pause it several times to spiritually digest what was being said...no,. make that revealed. Thank you for what you're doing. Swedenborg is so profoundly awesome! I grabbed all the free books and will study them as this has come into my life at a most appropriate time. I've got a lot more off the left eye vids to watch too but every one I've seen so far has been great.
Thanks for this enthusiastic report, Dave! Amazing that you were led to this content at such an opportune time. Glad to have you with us, and would love to hear what strikes you as you continue your studies. Blessings!
Your eyes are lighten up....praise God.
Thanks for the kind words, Juanita :)
God led me here to understand. Thanks!
Edgar Cayce pointed out, it also relates to the 3 dimensions, physical/mental/spiritual, and time/space/patience, and perhaps other overtones...
Interesting, Dan -- the time/space/patience concept is a new one for me!
i lovve to sit back all week and watch.
So glad you're enjoying it, Kerry!
Great great show. Thanks guys so much for going over this topic. This issue of, are there or 1, has been the biggest question for me. Thanks for the clarification.
You're very welcome, Monique! So glad you found it helpful!
Thank you so much. This helped me a lot to get a better understanding of the Trinity. I appreciate all that you at OTLE do.
You're very welcome, Carla. I'm so glad this video was helpful. We greatly appreciate having you in the audience!
Great episode! Reminds me of Fr. Richard Rohr's view of the trinity, with the emphasis on relationship.
Jesus did not spend a great deal of time discoursing about the trinity or original sin or the incarnation, which have preoccupied later Christians. He went around doing good and being compassionate...
Christian leaders seem to have been OC concerning the need to explain spiritual realities in detail so that anyone who didn't agree were seen as heretics. The need to conform to one understanding with intolerance for any deviation was strong. So we now see the results.
I've discovered Swedenborg's (inadvertent, or maybe not) explanation for this: [DLW 52] In the first paragraph, he says, "There is a correspondence of our affective side and its consequent thought with everything in the animal kingdom, a correspondence of our volitional side and its consequent discernment with everything in the plant kingdom...." And he says in the same paragraph, but before this, that he's talking about the physical world. So, our thought comes from our feelings, and our discernment comes from our will. In the next paragraph, he tells us about the spiritual world, where "feelings come from their volition", and "thoughts come from their discernment". In our world people tend to have thoughts from their feelings (reactivity, for instance) and discernment from the will. We let our feelings control our thoughts and and we make our discernments based on what we want. The early church fathers wanted to control the people of the church, so they discerned ways to manipulate theology to achieve that purpose. In the spiritual world, angels think from what they discern: they love truth. And they feel based on what they will or want: "love is a verb", as they say. They want others to be well and happy.
That's really profound and important to building a society of good people. There's also a dilemma of how to affect change in society. Maybe the fruits of the old thinking have to become so obvious and scary that thought leaders will open up a public discussion of why things have gone so bad and what should we do. I think that there can be no solution until people become aware of the reality of the human soul. The traditional societies of the world usually do recognize the soul and the afterlife. I just watched a program yesterday about China, the largest officially atheist country ever to exist. They mentioned the renewed love for Buddhism with about 250 million Buddhists in the country. This renewal of belief was because people need to feel a purpose in life which they cannot get from Communism or Capitalism. This search for purpose is tied to a need to know what a human being is.
I agree. Society had to develop this way. Swedenborg teaches what the Abraham/Hicks material teaches, which is that we need to experience the opposite before we can appreciate the right thing, though I don't know where he says it. I just heard Curtis say it on the 3rd Questions video. (I think it was the 3rd, but of course, he didn't say anything about Abraham/Hicks. They call it "contrast")
How can we appreciate the light if there is no darkness? How can we appreciate the truth if there is no falsity? How can we appreciate harmony if there is no disorder? Is this what is meant by "contrast"?
So detailed and simple to understand, best way I know so far of the trinity explained. Somewhere in me I knew this but in church confusing and not taught in depth like this. Thank you... Love and blessings 😇🙏🌺
So glad it resonated so well with you, Pamelyn. It really does make more sense to me than other approaches I've heard....
@@offTheLeftEye ,
I agree...
Thank you! Im grateful for everyone who made this channel possible. I can sense this explanation is true. 🥰🌈🤩❤🙏
I'm so glad these ideas are resonating with you, Veronica! We're grateful to have you in the audience. 💗
God didn't change, our perception of who He is and what He is changed. We can relate to Him more. When I pray, I picture Him as a man with all the loving, caring, sympathetic, empathetic emotions that we humans are capable of feeling. He becomes someone we can love and relate to so we want to do/be the things He wants us to do/be.
Amen, Simsane!
1 John 5:7 is in italics in KJV. Not accepted as part of generally accepted New testament scriptures but was addded in. If you looked into say the New Revised Standard Version of 1 John 5:7 it simply says -"There are three that testify: The Spirit, the water and the blood and these three agree" makes even less sense, but apparently is the genuine article
Thanks for bringing this to our attention, Sirfroz!
Very well explained. Thank you.
Love your videos Curtis. 🙏🏻
Thanks for letting us know, Linda! And thanks for being here!
Thank you for explaining this concept! :)
Swedenborg's view of the Trinity resonates with me.
Thanks for letting us know, 36Kite36. Glad it feels helpful!
That is interesting about the Holy Spirit having a changed role because of Jesus. I like the scripture where he calls the Holy Spirit the "comforter".
I too find it fascinating! The Holy Spirit is the truth or wisdom emanating from the Lord-- the teachings that reach us and help to bring about heaven in our heart/mind. Jesus transformed that truth into a more intimate pathway for loving others and facing our barriers to that lifestyle.
I was confirmed Lutheran.
We studied 3 books
Gog the Father
God the Son
God the Holy Spirit
For 3 years
The 3 in one kind of confused me until someone said it's like
Ice
Water and Steam
All water, but 3 forms
I have looked at this from different perspectives
Sometimes even in the Mysticals Teachings
I am writing this before I go lay down and listen
Thank you
That is a fascinating analogy, "ice, water and steam." I had never heard that before! Did you have a chance to listen to this whole episode? If so, I'm curious to know what you thought, and whether you think that "soul, body, and action" could relate at all to "ice, water and steam."
@@offTheLeftEye yes, because soul body and action is similar as putting the three together.
@@princessncg1 Agreed!
Well, fact is I’m on a quest to understand just this, as it’s easier to “talk” to someone intimately when you know how to imagine them visually. Plus I didn’t want to break the first commandment by worshiping a Prophet (Jesus) instead of God, if I can understand Jesus IS GOD and address, in prayer, each properly. THANK YOU!
I appreciate your thoughts here! Swedenborg asserted that the Lord God is Jesus Christ, and that the trinity represents different qualities of the Lord. I hope this episode helped to clarify some things for you! And of course, if you have any comments or questions, please don't be shy! PS- I'm attaching a written recap of this episode, in case it's useful to you! swedenborg.com/recap-how-to-understand-the-trinity/
Me too!
@@offTheLeftEye ,
That is awesome and thank you. I think I'm gonna need a few or more recaps... Lol.
@@pamelyncaldwell4060 I hear you! If you want to read more of what Swedenborg says about it, you can search Swedenborg's works for the Trinity at newchristianbiblestudy.org and dive deep!
Swedenborg wrote a lot about the Trinity in particular in his book "True Christianity," which is also available at swedenborg.com - and please let us know if you have any questions or comments!
hello. I am knew tk Swedenborg and you're channel and I admit i am loving all all the lessons. I do have a small problem and im not sure if it is on my end but for the past few days when i try and watch a video on your TH-cam channel it stops after a few seconds and says the live event is over and to retry. however when i retry it pops up the same message. so now i can no longer watch any of your videos unless i download them. is this a setting on your end or mine? and thanks for the videos. they are very insightful. I like to think and learn. All the best
thanks for so much information.. love these episodes..
You're welcome, Linda. Glad to see your continued passion for Swedenborg.
After watching this video you reminded me of an awesome book on the Holy Trininty called "The Holy Trinity and the Law of Three" by Cynthia Bourgeault. Like this video , this book goes into how intrinsic the Holy Trinity is to our everyday actions it goes onto reveal the Trinity as the "hidden driveshaft" within Christianity: the compassionate expression of the Uncreated Reality in creation. I think this book complements Swedenborg analogy of the Holy Trinity.
Thanks for sharing this with us! I haven't heard of that book or author, but it's always fun to learn about ideas out there in the world that align with Swedenborg's writings. Love/Wisdom/Use! :)
I look at Jesus as a creation of God, as we all are, but more like a personal “son” to God or God’s special spirit brought earth to observe and reorganize certain things. ...Its in the words “ we are all one” that tells me we all came from the incomprehensible intelligence of God, as well as the animals, trees, insects, the water, clouds, wind, rain, sun, planets, stars, galaxies, etc. Everything in the universe has its own unique makeup, just a like the earth is unique with its life, atmosphere and weather. Other planets in different systems may be similar? 🙂❤️
"God's spirit brought to earth" is a great way to put it, Julian. We all are unique creations that receive God's love and wisdom in different ways -- but yes, we (and everything in the universe) were created out of Infinite Love! Kind of a lot to wrap our limited minds around!
This isn't a topic that I think is relevant, but I'll listen. This is the most convoluted lecture yet. However, I'm of the mindset that if it works, keep it. Whatever works. I do admire much of Swedenborg's work, which confirms things I've learned on my own.
I think it's relevant because so many Christians, especially in Swedenborg's time, believe it to be part of their core beliefs.
Well, if you're a devout Christian and can't understand other aspects of spirituality, then it behooves you to follow this path.
Why the time account down? Am gone!
logic says wait till you're dead and then you'll see why your mind is convoluting that which is good & true. Afterall only you can validate what is divine & no-one else?? Hmm Nothing here to see folks...Unless you do have the will & the understanding in it's... unconvoluted form (:
Thank you very much.I am really happy i watched this episode.
If my beautiful mother was aching before she had me, every man must go through it before they get past the three phases to begin their beautiful and spiritual journey, and it must be done in love and truth and enduring patiently - must be awake in this whole process.
Yes, labor before physical birth certainly is a metaphor for the stages we all must go through, for spiritual growth and rebirth!
Before Creation, God was love 💕 itself and wisdom itself, so when was before creation like when was the universe created I know I know the million dollar question lol 😂
Sure can't answer that one for you, The Cube! And I don't know off the top of my head whether Swedenborg addresses that all. I mean, I'm sure he doesn't put it on an actual timeline, "This Date in History," or anything like that. Guess this will be one of the questions you ask when you get to the Other Side, eh?
From your website :"The three terms Father, Son, and Holy Spirit relate to the process of Jesus being born and going through trials in order to save us." I have a question. As Swedenborg describes Lords Glorification is alike our Regeneration. And in some Christian mystics like Meister Eckhart it is described that God is eternally bearing his Son and that it is born in us. To what does that relate to based on the above? For it is certain that there is a correspondence between birthing Jesus in the world and Jesus being born in us.
Woops, yellow! I see you've already seen this episode that I just recommended!
Yes, as some people put it, the Lord being born in our hearts IS the Second Coming, so it is happening on an individual basis all the time. "The Son" is an image of divine truth, and when that really gets into our hearts, the counterpart of the "Holy Spirit" flows out of us in the way we treat others and the way we operate in the world.
Have you seen our show "Who or What is Jesus?" That might give you some insights on your question. -- th-cam.com/video/EyC1Y6GO11s/w-d-xo.html
Blessings to you in pursuit of the truth of these ideas!
@@offTheLeftEye Very helpful answer! Thanks
You're welcome!
for I count three.
Who is Faith/Hope/Love.
Our actions I view as are free gift "free will",and we know we also have another important unique feature "the ability to reason.And I believe we judge ourself ,our action via those three witness housed in our sole.As we know we are the best prosecutors of ourselves and in the best light we paint ourselves but with these internal witnesses that self judgement if you like is on a hard drive that can't be denied the truth.Access to these 3 witness's "hard drive information if you like only one has the key to and also the bottomless pit.
Wow you are amazing :) thank you
Serving others with these wonderful truths is what motivates us, Laurie. We sincerely hope that these videos are a way for people to be closer to God and a godly life. Here is a video that thousands of people have watched and been blessed by. It is about the Lungs. Perhaps you find them as fascinating as I do, in how they keep us alive with their quiet work.That is like how we breathe in true ideas, and they infill our minds.
th-cam.com/video/bcCDiyIotI8/w-d-xo.html
Take care!
Very well explained, Trinity.
Curtis is super smart and funny. And what a nice guy?
Glad this made sense to you, 60vfranco! And yes -- we all think Curtis is pretty cool, too!
Thank you
You're very welcome! I'm glad this episode was helpful to you.
I enjoyed learning Swedenborg's understanding of the Trinity. The metaphors are great. Using the sun as a metaphor for God is actually universal in many religions. A Baha'i analogy seems to be in harmony with Swedenborg's, but seems to be more universal. In this analogy the sun is God and Jesus is a Perfect Mirror reflecting the light of the Sun to mankind. If you see the reflection of the sun in a mirror, you can say that the sun is in the mirror when actually the sun never descends into the mirror. The rays of the sun represent the Holy Spirit which connects the sun to the mirror. There is only one Sun (God) which never actually becomes part of the mirror (Christ), but the Mirror of Christ reflects the Divine Attributes to mankind. This same Trinity exists within all of the major religions. The Mirrors just have different names like Zoroaster, Buddha, Krishna, etc. The Mirrors reflect the Light of God to mankind in the particular times in history and to people of differing cultures and spiritual capacities. In a sense, each of these Manifestations of God, these Mirrors, is the return of previous Manifestations. Just as the sun of June causes plants to grow and blossom, the sun of August brings the flowers to fruit. So the Sun of Moses appeared during one spiritual season but the Sun of Jesus was needed for further spiritual development. The Sun of Monday is the same Sun as the Sun of Tuesday or Wednesday. Each day has a different name but the Sun is the same. I'm sure that the Sun of Reality is also manifested through Mirrors on any of the countless worlds in the universe as a means to guide them in their journey and destiny in the material and spiritual universe. Baha'u'llah agrees with Swedenborg concerning life existing throughout the universe.
Thanks Harlan, so glad you enjoyed this episode! You're right, these ideas do seem to be in harmony, I love seeing how many connections there are, so thanks you for always taking the time to share these insightful comparisons.
I see the lord in my right eye. And he does appear as a sun. Not as a metaphor or as a reflection or mirror? Literally he appears as a sun, shining brightly in my right - not left- but right eye. Maybe he reveals himself differently to you... Or not? And the stronger my love to the lord is, the more redder his sun appears and the more brighter the light is. And yes, at times his sun is distant. The teachings the lord has passed on requires none other than your willingness to accept his love for you. His divine providence is absolute. It's inevitable, no matter what! He loves everyone.
Hey +Mark Te Tane Hohaia! Actually, Swedenborg describes that exact phenomenon! We did a show about it here: th-cam.com/video/bOJxMGQWdy8/w-d-xo.html
How is the immediate after life experience of the people who physically die in medically induced anesthesia during invasive ventilation? Do you have cases where the person had NDE after being unconscious with medication then again coming back to the body?
I'm not familiar with this specific scenario, though I can point you to some relevant information! One video that comes to mind is this one: "The Framework Behind All Near Death Experiences." th-cam.com/video/xyEZCvThKdU/w-d-xo.html
Well, another one that is going to require at least 2 listens, lol. Which is okay with me as I normally listen more than once to all of them. But could not make it to the livestream (I mean, seriously, Big Bang season premiere was on at the same time). Will be with all next week and looking forward to a broadcast that won't hurt my brain so much - on a Monday night!
This game show segment should be a short clip!
Great idea! I'll add that to our poll options for people to vote on...do you see those on our community tab, Michael?
@@offTheLeftEye I see the polls but not sure what or where is your community tab
@@Michaelmuq Go here to our channel home page th-cam.com/channels/5kBvit8NAsLO3o-8SNGAOA.html?view_as=subscriber and you will see a list of words going across near the top: HOME, VIDEOS, PLAYLISTS, COMMUNITY.... Click on the word "community" and you will see where the polls are!
This question doesn't really apply to this video, but I'm wondering -- do we sleep and dream in the afterlife?
Yes! Maybe you would enjoy our episode "Where Dreams Come From" th-cam.com/video/9bfbNf3OpmU/w-d-xo.html
Who was Jesus praying to when he was constantly praying to the father? Are you saying Jesus was praying to himself?
That's a great question. I feel tempted to give an easy, straight-forward answer...but I'm going to abstain and rather attach this article. It gives succinct context and a great answer to your question. It's from a notable scholar of Swedenborg: leewoof.org/2015/11/29/if-jesus-christ-is-the-one-god-why-did-he-talk-and-pray-to-the-father/
Also, check out our recent video on the psychology of Jesus for more info: leewoof.org/2015/11/29/if-jesus-christ-is-the-one-god-why-did-he-talk-and-pray-to-the-father/
Was hoping this verse would be in the game show…Luke 3:21-22. The Holy Spirit descended on Jesus in the form of a dove and a voice from heaven (the father) said, “this is my son whom I love and am well pleased.”
These verses looks to support the traditional Christian understanding of the trinity (three persons, one god).
How does Swedenborg explain this passage?
IamSam, I wonder whether you are asking this before or after having watched the video you are commenting under. The explanation is embedded in the video. The brief answer is that The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one, in the same way that a person has a Soul, a Body and an Influence. The quote about the baptism is one of many included in the video. Let's keep talking. Here is another video about Jesus. th-cam.com/video/EyC1Y6GO11s/w-d-xo.html&lc=UgzK8hVZQW0TWzI7LYF4AaABAg
Giving it a shot for you to clear this up but there is controversy, possible problems of the Holy Ghost being in Mathews original Hebrew text. Hm? First area of Swedenborg where I find a possible crack. I'm only at 7:47 and we'll see how this all pans out. "Eusebius tells us he saw copies of Matthew predating the Council of Nicea that had ―in my name‖
rather than the now-familiar trinitarian ―in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit."
Bob, it sounds like you are really delving in, both for answers and to see if there are cracks in the theology. Way to take your spiritual quest seriously. I am neither a Hebrew scholar nor a Greek one. Matthew would have been originally written in Greek, and my understanding is that "spirit" is the same word in Greek as "breath". Curtis quotes many places in the bible that talk about the trinity of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit and how they are aspects of one God. We are trying to capture something eternal, omniscient, and omnipresent in the inadequate vehicle of language. I see the "cracks" in that effort every time I try to express my love for my children, or the burst of hope I feel when reading God's word. It does not surprise me that we struggle to convey the ineffable.
I hope to hear how the rest of the video landed for you!
@@offTheLeftEye I like how the definition of us being like a trinity. We have our soul, our body and the things we do. So we have three bits in one person. My wife says I have become obsessed with Swedenborg. I can't disagree. It has opened up new meanings to the faith of an almost 70 year old man. And Off the Left Eye is a great lesson plan.
@@BobJohnson-bx1vs It sure is fun to discover ideas that resonate! It's hard not to get obsessed for a little while. (= I'm so glad these ideas have been useful for you and bring meaning to your faith. Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts and questions with us! May this continue to enrich your spiritual path!
I'm not here to talk about religian, just for assuming we are spiritually connected and equal to any kind of humans. To see aura we must see darkness before light and the life of nature. Live life with a smile and be positive, the treasure of your own life.
I've got a question --I got the book heaven and hell from Swedenborg--not the new century edition but the original one which has alot of tiny wriitng--lol anyway in the beginning it says those that believe in a 3 God trinity are not permitted into heaven cause you cannot say 1 but think 3 as your thinking is exposed there and they would not accept this thinking, but since most Christians think of 3 so how do we get that out of our head (in time--before we go) also it says those that think their good deeds will take them to heaven is thinking is is of their own good not the Lords are not allowed.......I was kinda under the impression as long as we accept the Lord as Lord and are open to learning more divine things we go to heaven and those that want nothing to do with it gravitate to outer darkness...... Do I need to be worried about that first part---the trinity thing never made sense to me and then I read a history thing where that was introduced in only the last 500 years or less and the teachings are over 2000 years old and it was introduced by the Catholic church who got it from the pagans, mixing the two together.......
Hi DebbieJo! One of the great things about the New Century Edition is that it is thoroughly annotated by scholars. Reading your question I thought, I bet there's a note for that! Sure enough, there is! In note 18 on that number you reference it reminds us that, “Swedenborg describes judgment in the spiritual world as an internally directed process of aligning the reality of our character and most fundamental motivations with the objective realities of spiritual life. ...The chapter in §§545-550 below is headed 'The Lord Does Not Cast Anyone into Hell: People Cast Themselves In,' and he develops the notion in many contexts. Here in §2, 'not allowed' (non licet) [not permitted in the old translation], and 'sent away' (rejiceretur), refer to self-judgment. The same applies to 'let down' (demittuntur), and 'banished' (relegantur) in §3. Such terms, reflecting the appearance of external judgment, are not common in the work." It's helpful to remember that Swedenborg will use language that makes it seem like something strictly of thought could keep us out of heaven as our spiritual home, when in the greater context of how he explains spiritual reality, the truth is that once we are in the other world, our thoughts can no longer be in conflict with what we really love. Love always leads thought. And we are gradually led into honest harmony with what we really love. So someone who is a good, thoughtful person, even if they believe in a three-person trinity, will be guided in the next life to sensing the oneness of God. In short, you don't have to worry. Turning to the Lord and trying to live according to what we learn about God is what starts us on the path. Our lives in this world and beyond are a continual broadening and deepening of our understanding. The Lord is leading us and definitely doesn't hold our misconceptions against us! The Lord is always working to lead us to greater understanding if we're willing to follow.
SHREWWW---Thanks so much !! I will be ordering the New Century ones as it was very confusing for me and the print is all jammed in there real tiny !!
can you talk about why Christ had to return before the Holy Spirit could be sent...given to us...and also why Jesus said..there is none Holy...save my Father...which is in Heaven...
Great questions! I will share what I understand from what Swedenborg learned.
The "Holy Spirit" is the new influence that the Lord Jesus Christ would be able to have in human lives, but that new influence could not happen in people's lives until Jesus had completed his work on earth - until he had completed his teachings, had died on the cross, and was resurrected, and came back to them in that resurrected form. Then the "Holy Spirit," the new influence, could come into being. After his resurrection, Jesus breathed on his disciples and said "receive the Holy Spirit" (John 20:22).
For your second question, I think you are referring to Mark 10:8 and Luke 18:19 in which Jesus is saying "Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone." The context is that he was talking to a rich young man who called him "good master" and asked him what he should do to inherit eternal life. This young man was seeing Jesus as a finite, earthly human teacher instead of seeing him as God incarnate, so, Jesus was telling him to not see finite humans as the source of goodness and truth, but God.
I hope that is helpful!
This is a question muslims asks to me : "when Jesus-Christ was on earth, who were ruling the universe ? " Meaning are were the same or were they distinct ? How would you answer them?
I would say that we all are created by the same God, that this Divine Source has always and will always rule the earth as our creator, and that we have different faiths and paths so that we can relate to our creator in whatever way works for us! Check out, "The Spiritual Reality of All Faiths,' th-cam.com/video/Y-US1qib37g/w-d-xo.html
offTheLeftEye
Hello! Thx for your anwer but my question was more about the trinity. Muslims used to try to show that we are wrong and try to show the triune is not rational. For them Jesus-Christ is not God. So they can t believe Jesus-Christ is God on Earth and God in heaven in the same time. And in fact, if Jesus-Christ is God taking a physical body, was he also on heaven in the same time but distinct of Jesus-Christ? It is not easy to understand also for me.
@@manuelgarrido5602 Swedenborg talked to Muslims in the afterlife who were very good people, and who objected to Christian doctrine because Christians said there were three gods, and Muslims strongly believe in one God. When Swedenborg explained a different way to understand who Jesus was, as an aspect of the One God, the Muslims were open to that belief.
I realize it can be hard to understand the unity of God while Jesus was on earth. Try to think about your own mind. You have a higher mind, and a lower mind. Your higher mind can be knowing things and thinking about things and feeling things in an expansive way while your outer self and body are struggling along in a limited way. But that does not mean you are two different people. You are one person with different levels. Do you see what I mean? God the Father and Jesus are One God, but different levels of awareness in that One Person.
@@offTheLeftEye
Hello,
I am surprised to read that christians said there is three gods. Usully christian says that there is One God but in three aspects : The Father is God, The Son is God, The Holy-Spirit is God but They are the same and only God. Usully they call this "a mystery", but today when quantum physics and other physical truths are impossible to be represented in the human mind, this is not so surprising. The question E.S. trys to answer is , in fact : "Is the triune God understandable for the rational mind... " E.S. seems to say so.
It is not clear for my mind... What I am sure is that The Lord interact with the human kind first as Abraham "The higly father", then as Isaac, The loved and sacrified son, and latter as with Jacob .. The Holy-Spirit. And Surely they are the same and only God.
Thank you again for your answer.
@@manuelgarrido5602 The simplest way that Swedenborg explains it is, think of soul, body, and way of effecting people. You have all three of those, and so does God. God's soul is called "The Father." God's body that we can comprehend is called "the Son" and God's way of affecting people is called "the Holy Spirit." Does that help at all?
To whom did God say, "Let us make a human in our image"? To assisting angels, according to Secret of Heavens 1, #50. On the other hand Swedenborg says angels were and are as human as the human quoted above was, so how does " Let us make a human in our image" apply to these angels' own creation? To whom did God say those words in their case? I love Swedenborg, yet his Trinity explanation seems to be at odds with Scripture, the only point I find difficult to agree with him no matter how hard I try to. Help! (Thank you!)
Hi, Anila! Your confusion is understandable. In order to have your first question make sense, you have to understand what "becoming human" is, according to what Swedenborg learned. To become human is not just being born into a human-shaped body, but to evolve to a level of love and wisdom that is aligned with God. (For a brief explanation of that, see our Swedenborg Minute: "What it Means to Be Human", th-cam.com/video/HUHzjo81tQw/w-d-xo.html) The creation story is symbolically talking about the creation of a truly human mind, so at that point in the story, it is talking about angels assisting God in creating a truly human mind in a person, when they have evolved to opening up to God's love and wisdom, his "image and likeness."
But if you are thinking about it that way and *still* wonder who would have done that helping with the minds of the very first humans, remember that the first humans were very innocent and heavenly, and did not need the kind of mental purification process that we need today, which involves many complex layers and stages. By the time humanity needed that purification process, there would have already been angels who had been those first innocent and heavenly people on earth.
We also have a Swedenborg Minute about the seven days of creation th-cam.com/video/dVHseZVKFEI/w-d-xo.html and a full-length show about it th-cam.com/video/0dElLLLbUNY/w-d-xo.html in case that might be helpful as you read through "Secrets of Heaven" on your own.
In Swedenborg's books "The Lord" and "True Christianity" he delves into the Trinity and always has many Bible quotes to back up what he says, so I wonder if it would be helpful to you to try one of those books.
The way you explain it, makes perfect sense.Thank you so much!
Oh, glad that helped. You are very welcome!
Do you have a video about the crucifixion of Jesus. That has been the hardest part to swallow for me. Well. The fact that he did it for us. I'm interested I Swedenborg's take on this. I loved this video.
It can be a difficult concept to hold. We do in fact have a video that may help you! th-cam.com/video/VqsbY9gRXxo/w-d-xo.html
Not "people" but "persons" (persona); a Latin term since there was no word to speak of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Greeks used the word "hypotasis."
Hypostasis for the idea of persons?
ok that was great ii understood that but ill take a stuped pill soon and forget it all, but thanks anyway i do not know how to spell brelent or i would call you that more.thanks so much.
Kerry it's a lot to take in! Sometimes it helps to read it too - there is a link to an episode re-cap here that might be good review! Check this out: swedenborg.com/recap-how-to-understand-the-trinity/
How is Swendenborg's view of the Trinity not an example of Modalism?
Thanks for the question, Friend. I am not familiar with Modalism though I am pretty well versed with Swedenborg. His take on the trinity rings true for me. Do you want to describe Modalism? Do you want to see more videos from Swedenborg? -Lori
Am I thinking about this correct... The Word=The Eternal Son=God's Divine Logic/Wisdom/Light/Love=Logos. The Word became manifest in flesh in the person of Jesus. The Word also became manifest in the physical creation of our world? Is it fair to say that The Word was also manifest in other people/faiths like in The Buddha?
Yes, I agree with your line of thinking here! Technically the "Love" part is what is called the "Father" in New Testament language, and that is why Jesus said he came to "show us the Father," i.e., show us Divine Love in action. The Word means Divine Truth, and yes, that Divine Truth was originally manifested in nature, or physical creation. When people lost the ability to "read" truth in nature, then a written form of the Word came into existence. At first there was something Swedenborg calls the Ancient Word, and that gradually split into many different versions that became the various sacred texts and philosophies of the different world religions (which is why Truth can be found in all religions). But when the pieces of the complete Word were getting too scattered and misunderstood, the Word was re-written as the Old Testament, and then Jesus came as the "Word made flesh" to set things back into order, so that humanity could regain the ability to understand Divine Truth and live by it.
offTheLeftEye beautiful! Thanks! John's Gospel says that this light/divine truth is written in the heart of every person. How do you differentiate between the holy Spirit and this indwelling light/Christ/divine truth ?
The way I understand it is, the Holy Spirit is when that truth actually takes action in our life, working through us to inspire useful efforts and beneficial results.
Aloha.
loved this!
god bless.
i ordered true christianity vol1 and 2 used off of ebay. , people can also check thriftbooks if they want a 4 dollar copy of swedenborg books, and once they are older and rich they can drop a ton of dollars on the swedenborg foundation!! they deserve it.
very cool videos.
many thanks
Aloha!!!
That's so cool! I think you'll really enjoy True Christianity. Also, did you know that we have free e-books of Swedenborg's writings? Here's the link: swedenborg.com/bookstore/swedenborgs-writings/
And the support we receive from our viewers and fans is what allows us to continue doing this work! What a blessing.
If the holy spirit is not a separate god，does it mean that it is not an actual entity? the Bible says disciples are filled with holy spirit and are able to spreak in tongues，are you talking about the same holy spirit？ people s hellish mindset can be transformed into a new healvenly mindset by holy spirit，it always seems like holy spirit is an entity
Yes, Wons, I would say the holy spirit is something that is powerful and effective, but it is not something separate. Swedenborg likens the "trinity" to three aspects in every human -- our spirit, our body, and our effect in the world. So that would line up with Jehovah, Jesus, and the effect of God's spirit and truth going out to touch all human beings. What do you think?
@@offTheLeftEye l am not sure and a bit confused now，but it will make sense if all the scriptures where holy spirits present as a entity can be interpreted appropriately in Swedenborg s theory，for example
Romans
8:26
Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
8:27
And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
@@wonsgnem4436 Yes, you're getting the idea! Think of the Holy Spirit as God's influence on us, and then these quotes become:
Likewise "God's presence and influence" also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but "God's presence and influence" itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind (intentions) of "God's presence and influence"...
We did a recent show about the Holy Spirit, if you are interested:
"The Pentecost, Speaking in Tongues, and Receiving the Holy Spirit" th-cam.com/video/PQB05uRa79Q/w-d-xo.html
@@offTheLeftEye thanks team，
I will.watch this the second time
@@wonsgnem4436 You're very welcome! Our pleasure.
Would like to say this about the soul in a sort story.Like a potter would mould the clay you will be a vessel one day.Stand porter at your own door of thought when I say ,"there is an angel at your door to bring peace and love for this I'm sure ",your never alone.
Wow, that was deep and I took notes too. I loved this subject, I always wanted to understand correctly. But I think I'm still not understanding the Holy spirit part. I will keep watching this video until I get it. Maybe I'm trying to hard to understand that I'm missing it altogether. Still this video was a blessing with insights of beings on other planets. I always felt there is. And why do we call them aliens or extraterrestrials and not beings? I'm sure to them we act like indescribable and confused beings... Anyway thank you, love and blessings to you all at OTLE...
This is a big topic, Pamelyn! The Holy Spirit has been a hard one for me to grasp in my life as well. My simple way of understanding it now is that it is God's influence in the world. Just like we humans have a spirit and a body and the way we act in the world, the effect we have on others, so God has the aspects of Father (soul/Jehovah), Son (body/Jesus), and Holy Spirit (God's love and power and truth manifested in the world). But I'm sure others would describe their concept differently! Maybe it feels more slippery because there's not a specific image to picture in thinking about it....?
As for the beings on other planets, the terms "alien" and "extraterrestrial" are earth-centric terms. "Other" terms. It is fascinating that Swedenborg considers them all humans, even if they have different physical forms. It does seem to me that the universe is WAY to big to have sentient life on only one planet! Love and blessings to you, too, Pamelyn!
@@offTheLeftEye ,
Thank you so much, just you explaining it this way makes simple sense. I still have to learn not to be so literal. There are times things makes perfect sense to me and resonates. But the Trinity has always stumped me for some reason. Yet it should be simple. Sometimes when I'm praying I'm going from God to Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Remembering a verse in the Bible that says in John 14:6
Jesus saith unto to him (Thomas), I am the way, the truth and the life, no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
(I get this part), but Jesus doesn't mention the Holy Spirit at this time. So is the Holy Spirit our conscience? In that the Holy Spirit speaks to us through our conscience. That voice of reason to not tempt fate or do wrong things? If it is I think I'm getting it. But I will search deeper to where it resonates with me. I mean it resonates but I have a disconnect for some reason. Anyway, I am determined to get it, and thank you so much for helping to understand. I am so appreciative and humble for it.😇🙏🌺
@@offTheLeftEye ,
I think I understand the Trinity...
God - The Father - Jehovah - The Divine Creator of all Things.
Son - Jesus Christ - Son of Man - God made manifest in Human Form
Holy Spirit - The Comforter - Wisdom of all thing good, right and Just. The Comfort in love, goodness, compassion, forgiveness and understanding in us. Our Conscience of right and wrong, choice and consequence. The power in truth and healing...
Please correct me if I'm wrong, thank you so much!
Now on the subject of other beings on other planets, I agree with you. If God made we Human Beings, it would not be far fetched to understand that God created other Beings I feel are more reverent to Him than we as Human Beings. And what does it matter if they look different from us. There maybe reasons for that, I'm comfortable with them looking different from us. They don't seem to care about that more than intelligence. Who knows, maybe they think we look and act strange. In my opinion, it doesn't matter what we look like we all come in different shapes, sizes and Colors. What matters is what's in our own spirit, heart and mind. The goodness we can do to change this world around, that's upside down in values and conscience at the moment. God gave us a spirit of wisdom and truth, a heart to love and heal, a mind to bring forth ideas and principles to manifest into the world. And a physical body to carry it all out in actions. OMGOSH... I think I just described what the Trinity is. Wow, I think I get it! This is a principal I learned from Master Sha, a eastern, western Doctor and master in martial arts... That our spirit (God in us), is in our hearts (where love and wisdom live), that instructs our minds (in truth and justice), that moves our bodies (to actions/physical efforts). Balance of good and evil (equilibrium), choice and consequence and our conscience. Wow a mouth full, thank you again for your help. I think I just needed a nudge to remember! Love and blessings 😇🙏🌺
@@pamelyncaldwell4060 loved reading that comment! And you totally did describe it so well, I actually think I understand it better now, too! Thank you for sharing that! Master Sha sounds very wise, and so are you. See? You actually knew it all along - but we get stuck in confusing descriptions we grew up with, that create obstacles in finding the larger truths!
And as for non-earth-based-humans, if you will, I love the idea of them looking "different." Think about how different the humans on this planet look from each other! So much incredible variety - not just broadly, but down to the details in individuals - so specific and unique that even identical twins aren't identical. What a miracle! And imagine what infinity could do with infinite planets in infinite space... I really can't imagine it, being finite, but I'm awed by the possibilities.
Bless you, Pamelyn! Such a pleasure to learn with you!
@@offTheLeftEye ,
Awe I am grateful and humbled and find everything I learned in church was just an illusion. Meant to keep people in control and have the biggest attendance. And if you question and go against what is taught. Then you're shunned and called a rebel. And that was the reason I was never baptized. I so wished with all my heart to be. It broke my heart and I resented it and never went back to church. In my mind at the time... If this is how God and His church is, I want no part of it. All because during one Bible study my paper was corrected as all wrong. And they started questioning me with hypotheticals and I questioned them... But the Bible says this... I was in tears, stopped, stood up and simply said this... Jesus was, is, and ever shall be forever. His life was not based on hypotheticals. His life was based on truth then and now. For which this church and many other religions through the generations still don't simply grasp. Jesus was simple in His teaching, simple in His ways. But it wasn't enough still today! That He was condemned and crucified for our ignorance, selfishness and pride. So when anyone like myself who is earnestly wanting to know Him and understand. You crucify them too out of your own pride and superiority of your own ignorance. I say to you... You have no clue who God is, who His Son is. And I feel sorry for you! At least I'm earnestly seeking Him with a open heart. While you take up space in this church with your arrogance. When others more worthy and want to know God in their limited understanding of God. Have more heart and open mind than all of you put together in this church! No one spoke and all were in shock and I turned and walked out and never went back again.
Yes Master Sha is an awesome teacher, he is like my Dad. He took me under his wing and I was personally taught under his tutelage. He was one of the best teachers I've had in my life! For I was blessed to have many, for which I am so humbled, grateful and thankful for all of them. Like how I feel about all of you here in OTLE... Humbled, grateful and thankful. I have never felt like learning about God could be so amazing and so welcoming as it should always be. Love and blessings to all of you at OTLE.
Here at OTLE is church, home and a little bit heaven all in one. Like the Trinity, like God himself here with all who come to OTLE!
What about all the earlier depictions of Jesus-like beings (such as Horus) though?
I was impressed with this until now. It's just more misunderstood Christianity. Swami Kriyananda has written that Jesus was crucified once, but his teachings are crucified every day. Please, think about what is there!
Sorry this one didn't resonate with you, Garry. I hope you always feel free to take on our channel things that make sense to you, and set aside things that don't.
I am always open to different views. Just because I don't agree with it doesn't mean I throw the baby out with the bathwater. Keep doing what you're doing; no one really knows the complete Truth.
Why not cover Isaiah 53:5 from the Masoric text also? Go back to original Greek. Would’ve made more sense of the confusion surrounding penal atonement theory and a created infused disposition between Son and Father
Thank you for your thoughts, Tyler. I am out of my depth with both Greek and the Masoric text. There is much mystery and wonder in the trinity, and keeping curious helps us go deeper.
Are you suggesting that "the Holy Spirit" and "the spirit of God" are not synonymous in the OT?
Do you mean those phrases only as used in the Old Testament? Or the phrases as used in the Old and New Testaments? Because the way God's spirit could come to us did change after Jesus had been on earth.
Their use in the OT. You said the Holy Spirit is mentioned only 3 times in the OT, which makes it seem as if you think "the Holy Spirit" and "the spirit of God" (which appears 16 times in the OT, at least in the KJV, written that way) are not synonymous. So I was just wondering.
Yes, that is my understanding. That the original Hebrew phrasing is different in the places translated "Holy Spirit" and "spirit of God."
Indeed, the phrasing is different because the words are different. That doesn't, necessarily, mean that they refer to two different spirits. But maybe I just misunderstood what you meant and you were only talking about the wording or that specific phrase and you aren't suggesting "the Holy Spirit" is something other than "the spirit of God." If not, my mistake.
Oh, certainly not two different spirits, but the different phrasing can indicate different aspects of God's Spirit. Just as the many different names for God that you can find in the Old and New Testaments are reflecting different aspects and qualities of the One God.
That God is part of the material world 'does not compute". God is consciousness, He cannot be matter since matter does not exist. Physics has proved that matter is energy and the material world is nothing like we "see" it. That most of what is put forth here are based on the Bible is, to my mind, imperfect because men transcribed it and man is not perfect, as God is. Also, the idea that we can be saved by an act of sacrifice does not square with life itself. Can we slake our thirst by having someone else drink for us? Can our hunger be satisfied by another eating the meal? The laws of God are not different in different situations. What Swedenborg seems to be basing most of his theory on is the world of matter. How could God, who is infinite, be part of a finite world.
Thanks for these thoughts, Garry. All these thoughts are actually very aligned with what Swedenborg learned and wrote. I think this will not come through for you in this show, because it would be hard for you to not hear traditional Christian doctrine in the words, when Swedenborg actually is saying something very different. We find this happens when people have felt particularly frustrated with Christian messages they have heard in the past. They still hear us saying those same messages, when actually the concepts are different. Concerning being saved by an act of sacrifice, we agree that that doesn't make sense, and is false. If you are interested in a different take on the suffering and crucifixion of Jesus, we try to explain it in this show: "Why Did Jesus Suffer and Die? th-cam.com/video/VqsbY9gRXxo/w-d-xo.html But I don't know if there will still be too much Bible terminology in there for you. Concerning spiritual science, physical matter, spiritual energy-Swedenborg has a lot to say about the fact that physical matter is dead compared to spiritual matter or substance, which is alive. The physical is merely a temporary shell, while spiritual matter, the energy of thoughts and feelings, with the Divine as a source, is what is real and lasting. The book that delves the most deeply into this is Swedenborg's "Divine Love and Wisdom." It's a heady read for most people, but you seem like someone who could handle it, if you are interested. There is a free download available here: www.swedenborg.com/product/divine-love-wisdom-nce/ Again, no need to agree with all of it, but it might give you a better idea of where Swedenborg is coming from. Or, perhaps you could try our show "Spiritual Physics": th-cam.com/video/ndTtR9qKsH0/w-d-xo.html
Awesome. Yes, you are correct in saying I have residual negative feelings about traditional Christian dogma. Up to my 25th year, I was totally antagonistic towards Jesus. It wasn't until I learned about the true Jesus from my guru, Paramhansa Yogananda, that I truly came to really love him. I am slowly coming to see that what Swedenborg is saying has nothing to do with that "old time religion". I will watch the videos you recommend, and as to the book, I have it already. Bought from Amazon; Kindle edition. I hope I am not becoming a nuisance. I just find this incredibly interesting; not to mention informative.
That's great, Garry. You're not a nuisance. It's good to be on this journey with you!
The entire universe is a thought of God. We are each a spark of God descended into human form. Therefore, we are ultimately eternal in our essence state. All energy that makes up the universe is also eternal. Don't put up barriers where none actually exist. How could God, who is infinite, be part of a finite world? HOW COULD HE NOT? All that is dwells within God. There is no outside.
I taught my Sunday school class trinity by example of an egg, it takes 3 to make a whole, one without the other is not complete
I have a house built for three and that house is me,that is my church.
Curtis what is your i q?? you must of been to collage??
Hey Kerry! I’m not sure, never had it tested 😄 yes I did get college degree in Communications.
Beautiful words, Robert! Thanks for sharing that!
If God is the same yesterday, today, and always, why do we need a NEW connection to the Lord?
he is not new --he is from the 1700-1800's, very old--had wonderful insight into heaven , hell angels, the inner meaning of the bible.
You missed my point. I was talking about the need for God to manifest as Jesus 2,000+ years ago. If God doesn't change, what is the need for Jesus? He would not effectuate a change because God doesn't change...
We have changed! Just like we go through stages of maturity as individuals, the human race has gone through a process of maturing. We don't teach 7 years old kids the same lessons as 15 years old kids, but the lessons for older kids are built upon the lessons of earlier ages. So even though we love our first grade teacher and all that he taught us, we need to move on to the 8th grade teacher for what we need at that stage. The teachings of Abraham were wonderful and great but then Moses was manifested. Moses could have taught everything that Jesus taught but it wasn't timely or needed at that time. So God is the Changeless and the Heavenly Father Who provides the spiritual guidance for mankind from age to age as we change and gain spiritual capacity, just like we all do as individuals. People tend to be attracted to the lamp rather than the light emanating from the lamp, and so we are tested.
That's an interesting perspective. Thank you. So we changed for the worse, and needed God to manifest as one of us in order to create a new connection to replace one that we ourselves broke at some point in our history, namely, when Adam and Eve did the deed?
I have a real challenge when we ascribe a human-like personality to God. It seems to me as though God is more of an intelligent, creative force that can be mathematically calculated (just like creation itself...As Above; So Below) than an angry Sky Daddy. I wonder if biblical interpretation has been a bit too literal. That supports the church hierarchy. However, perhaps mass realization of this fact is truly the message of Revelations.
Maturing means changing. We don't want our kids to remain kids forever, even if it means going through the "change" of adolescence. We all need teachers who teach to our developmental level, or else it's a waste of time. In the same way the Manifestations of God who have appeared down through history have taught the people of their age lessons appropriate to their needs and capacities. You have a good point about the literal understanding of scripture being the problem. This literalness doesn't attract the minds of people who are searching for understanding. The Jewish leaders of Jesus' time knew their scriptures, but their literal interpretation caused them to reject Jesus. Now Christian leaders mostly follow the example of those Jewish leaders without knowing it. They worship the Lamp and not the Light emanating from the lamp. So a new Revelation of necessity conflicts with the standards of the old beliefs. This is a spiritual test which appears from age to age. I'm a Baha'i and this has been especially true in my Faith.
As you know "Jehovah" is a misnomer as the Name for GOD, being actually a translation of the Tetragammaton (YHWH), unpronounced by the Hebrews who used the vowel points of "Adonai" (Lord) and seeing YHWH pronounced "Lord" and not the Holy Name as given to Moses, ie: YaHWeH.
Yes -- fascinating history to the name. I've recently seen it described as "in breath" (Yah) and "out breath" (weh). Pretty powerful!
Have you looked at the what the Indian scriptures say about the Trinity? It has to do with AUM (or OM). Aum has to do with the constant energies being generated in creation. A-the creative force; U-the preserving force; M-the dissolving force. We can use the parallel of GOD: G-the generating force; O-the operating force; D-the destructive force. Aum is part of the Hindu Holy Trinity: Aum-Tat-Sat, which parallels the Christian Holy Trinity of Father, Son, Holy Spirit. AUM (Holy Ghost) is cosmic vibration, the Divine Mother (Mother Nature). TAT (Son) is the Christ Consciousness, a reflection of the Supreme Spirit in all creation. SAT (Father) is the vibrationless Spirit beyond creation. The universe is constantly being created by the Word (vibration) of God.
One of our staff writers, Chelsea, has often mentioned things from the Bhagavad Gita on various shows, and we have a show called "The Spiritual Reality Behind All Faiths." th-cam.com/video/Y-US1qib37g/w-d-xo.html Yes, we consider there to be value in all the many ways that different faiths see and describe God and spiritual reality.
What I'm wondering about, honestly, is how in the third millennium we still are discussing about the Trinity, which sets a world record as regards nonsense :
1. the theory states that the almighty God is HERE NOW. But this is impossible. The future is SET IN STONE. We are FREE because we do NOT know what is written there. But God would know that future instead and that future MUST COME TRUE. This means God would NOT be OMNIPOTENT: He could not even change the weather of tomorrow! He would be OBLIGED to let the future EXACTLY UNFOLD like it is, nothing can be changed. God would NOT BE FREE too, obliged to TAKE EXACTLY the God's actions already set in stone, down to the tiny detail.
2. God having a God-Son in the LITERAL SENSE is ridiculous: there is NO REASON for that.
Further, that Son would be of course a "demi-God" and the people would still keep praying to the only one real God, the ONLY REAL ORIGIN of everything: his Father
3. the Son has his origin in the Father, but the Father has NOT his origin in the Son. This means that the Father is the ORIGIN of EVERYTHING, including the Son, whilst - on the other hand - the Son IS NOT THE ORIGIN of all. Thus they cannot be co-equal as stated by the doctrine.
4. it is ridiculous and OFFENSIVE to state that God is made of "substance". How can they quibble about the layout of God? It's just FANTASY.
5. therefore is NONSENSE to state that Father and Son are made of a SAME substance
6. ...and even if they were made by a same substance, MINDS MATTER not substance! They still were TWO DISTINCT Persons as long as they have two DIFFERENT MINDS (this is disclosed by the Gospels)
7. ...and since the Father teaches the Son things, they don't even share the same information. This means they surely have DIFFERENT MINDS so that they cannot be a "same God" (when Father and Son EXIST AT THE SAME TIME, but they DO NOT).
8. it's absurd having TWO almighty persons in the universe: if One of them wants the moon white-painted, what will the other Person do in this regard, could He change that color? Logic allows at most ONLY ONE omnipotent person to exist, because omnipotence is an UNCONDITIONAL power
9. it's RIDICULOUS to state that the almighty God is NOT SUFFICIENTLY ALMIGHTY and He needs to be helped by a "God's Helper"
10. In the gospels Father and Son NORMALLY TALK as it happens with TWO common different persons "thank you for hearing me...". If the Father existed now in a NORMAL form, then we surely had TWO Gods, that is POLYTHEISM. But God is ONLY ONE !
The Trinity theory is also EXTENSIVELY NOT SCRIPTURAL :
1. it's lying to state that Jesus is almighty when Jesus states exactly the opposite “ I from myself am not able to do a thing” (John 5:30).
2. the "omnipotent Lord who gives life" is an ABSURD INVENTION: an omnipotent God totally UNKNOWN in the scriptures, no one ever heard a single word from him !!
3. it's lying to state that Jesus and the Father are co-equal when Jesus states THE OPPOSITE "My Father is greater than I", the trinity inventors think to be more informed than Jesus on this topic!
4. it's FALSE to state that the Father and the Holy Spirit are co-equal when ONLY the Father know the future "..but only the Father knows", this means the Holy Spirit does NOT know the future !
5. throughout the whole gospels disclosure it is clear that ONLY ONE RELATIONSHIP FATHER-SON EXISTS. Jesus crystal clear states: "I am not alone because the Father is with me." Without the Father, Jesus would be ALONE, NOT WITH A THIRD PERSON! Thus Jesus clearly states that GOD IS MADE BY TWO PERSONS, in other words NO TRINITY EXISTS.
6. it's lying to state that THREE Persons are in heaven, when the gospels clearly state who is there:"ye shall see (1) the SON OF MAN sitting on the right hand OF (2) POWER and appearing in the clouds of heaven." Thus, they are TWO INSTEAD, but since the POWER is not God, ONLY ONE Person is really in heaven: Jesus.
THREE PERSONS ARE NOT IN HEAVEN, but the Trinity inventors don't care: they simply don't care, either of logic or scriptures.
"The Son of man shall come in the glory of His Father, with His angels ". Only the Son and the angels are there !
The Trinity is a nonsensical invention, but Jesus is God and He is the only Savior. Only Jesus and the Father are here ("I am not alone because the Father is with me"). However the Father is here only in the form of a spirit. ("God is a spirit"). He is the Holy Spirit.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts, claudio! I think if you watched the episode, you find that we actually agree with you. We do not support the concept of a Trinity as three gods, but instead believe in one God.
Jesus talked about the Father as as separate being, but also said, “I and the Father are one.” (John 10:30)
The Bible tells us that there is one God:
“Was it not I, the Lord? There is no other god besides me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is no one besides me.” (Isaiah 45:21)
“Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord.” (Deuteronomy 6:4; Mark 12:29)
Philip said to him, “Lord, show us the Father, and we will be satisfied.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and you still do not know me? Whoever has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own; but the Father who dwells in me does the works.” (John 14:8-10)
Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel, and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god. (Isaiah 44:6)
And the Lord will become king over all the earth; on that day the Lord will be one and his name one. (Zechariah 14:9)
For a child has been born for us, a son given to us; authority rests upon his shoulders; and he is named Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. (Isaiah 9:6)
Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.” (Matthew 28:18)
Jesus answered, “If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father who glorifies me, he of whom you say, ‘He is our God,’ though you do not know him. But I know him; if I would say that I do not know him, I would be a liar like you. But I do know him and I keep his word. Your ancestor Abraham rejoiced that he would see my day; he saw it and was glad.” Then the Jews said to him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?” Jesus said to them, “Very truly, I tell you, before Abraham was, I am.” So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid himself and went out of the temple. (John 8:54-59)
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. . . . And the Word became flesh and lived among us, and we have seen his glory. (John 1:1-3, 14)
God IS; always has been, and always will be. This episode disputes the concept of three persons, and supports one God, the Divine human, who has a trinity that we all have: body, soul, and actions. Those are three aspects of one being.
I think we actually agree more than disagree. But if not, that's fine, and I wish you all the best! I can see you have a strong faith and value system, and I respect that. Wishing you well, thanks for sharing your perspective!
@@offTheLeftEye " and supports one God, the Divine human". I read throughout your comment, but it is not clear what you think about the relationship existing between Father and Son. Here in the following you can see my position...thanks to you too for taking your time.
It's impossible for the almighty God be here now. Why? The future is SET IN STONE. We can have FREE WILL because we do NOT know what is written in the stone and do not care about that.
But God would KNOW that future instead and that future MUST COME TRUE. This means God would NOT be OMNIPOTENT: He could not even change the weather of tomorrow! He would thus be OBLIGED to let the future set in stone EXACTLY UNFOLD like it is, nothing can be changed. God would NOT BE FREE too because obliged to TAKE EXACTLY the God's actions already set in stone, down to the tiny detail.
How could God manage to solve that problem? The almighty God was in a very distant past, before the birth of mankind and time ("...BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN. O righteous Father, the WORLD HAS NOT KNOWN YOU....") and from that temporal point He was able to OBSERVE US in his future and to take ACTIONS in that future. But this conversely means - from our point of view - that we are REACHED BY HIM from that past. God is thus actually PRESENT HERE, but ONLY with his words and actions. It's a kind of phone communication with the past, with added possibility of omnipotent actions. In other terms we can say that God IS A SPIRIT here ("God is a spirit") because He is active but those actions are actually MADE BY NOBODY. That Spirit - who is here - is called the Holy Spirit. The almighty God - who dwells in that distant past - corresponds to the "Father" of the baptismal formula instead, no one ever saw Him ("the world has not known you")... That above is from our point of view. From GOD'S POINT OF VIEW instead things are different: when the universe started the almighty God had already done ALL HIS WORK. He already decided all his future actions so that the future was set in stone to be made AUTOMATICALLY TRUE by his power. He had thus made EVERYTHING. He could get rid of his then USELESS power to become like a NORMAL MAN: the Son. "Son" thus means that He DERIVES from God, He is not a Son in the common sense of the word. As a normal man, He also has a relationship with God (but much stronger), He has thus a relationship with a "different Himself". The Son has thus no power at all, but He sits in heaven next to the power of God. His power is thus always "borrowed" from the Father, under his consent. God has thus already lived his "mankind experience" once as the almighty God. He is now living his "mankind experience" a second time as a normal man.
@@claudiozanella256 that is a very interesting take on God's life and identity! I still think that we have a lot of ideas in common!
We talk about God's presence today being in our hearts and minds - like the spirit you mentioned. "Behold, you have the kingdom of God within you." (Luke 17:21)
This clip can better explain things than I can, if you're interested: "What God/Jesus Is" th-cam.com/video/5Y0q0Lw30aE/w-d-xo.html
Or this episode describes our relationship with God, and how consciousness works: "The Infinite In You" th-cam.com/video/8KPZKkrijxo/w-d-xo.html
Let me know what you think! Thanks for sharing your thoughts on how this all works - what a complex subject!
The Trinity in Egypt- the first civilization. Had holy mother, holy father and holy infant. Not a patriarchy? Where is the divine feminine? Creator and bringer of life?
There are many wonderful images of God as a mother in scripture. Here are a couple. "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets, and stone them which are sent unto you, how often would I have gathered your children together, even as a hen gathers her chickens under her wings, and you would not!"Matthwe 23.
"
“Can a woman forget her nursing child, And not have compassion on the son of her womb? Surely they may forget, Yet I will not forget you." Isaiah 49
Yes God is the Creator of life, and every way we try to capture that Creator in such a limited way as words we will fall short. Can words describe the light? Music? Love? Yet is is important that we try. Thanks for the conversation Ketherwhale.
The bible continually tells us the Lord our God is ONE. Many many parts and verses tells us their is only ONE GOD and that God came down in the flesh 1 Timothy 3:16
The Word was God the Word who was Jesus was made flesh. Jesus is God in the flesh Swedenborg was 100 per cent right 👌
That's how we see it, Swedenborg Golborne!
The so called Trinity makes sense to me by saying: the Father and the Holy Spirits who act for the Father. They do the work of the Father and are human persons who live with God in the third heaven. The Spirit of the Father's nature and Holiness flows through them from the Father to God's other children. They help, teach, care for , give comfort, are kind plus more to all of the Creator's children. When given to be so, they not only represent God but are given to be God the Father by Devine investiture of person. Hence, Jesus, one of those Holy Spirits, could say I am the very Father. Such Holy Spirits can appear to near death experiencers and say I am God or Jesus. They are one in power and wisdom etc. in very person with God as needed. Jesus, however, was the only Holy Spirit chosen to be the Father's mortal child. He acts for the Father in mortality, to do the mortal work of the Father and the mortal Son. He was the mortal Hand and Arm of God the Father to help us. It is also true that we can all be the mortal help of the Father by doing the good things to others that a father would do for his children. This is one way God is omnipresent in a personal way to all. By this Devine investiture of very person, the Father's Kingdom is governed by the Father in all it's infinite extent. So there is an infinity of Gods but they are a composite person of the one Devine Creator and the many mortal Redeemers. There are infinite earths in God's Kingdom. Jesus was God's Only Begotten Son to us on our earth to do a mortal work for the one Eternal Father. Just trying to figure it out.
Hi Paul, I think that's an interesting take! Swedenborg does seem to stress that God is one being, albeit an infinite being - thus God can take infinite forms, in order to best connect with an infinite variety of people, on this earth and others. It is impossible to fully define the infinite, but I think you are right that God operates through the Holy Spirit and through Jesus to achieve divine ends! How did our explanation resonate? The part that made it clearer to me was in our diagram, right here: th-cam.com/video/-YbEHk2N884/w-d-xo.html
Holy Spirit is our actions, the Divine Father is our soul, and the physical manifestation or body is the Son - just like as humans we have our physical self, our soul, and our actions, and those three things combine to make us who we are, they interact with each other and each part is necessary but they are also separate things.
@@offTheLeftEye The soul of my earthly father remains with me as I identify with his good attributes to achieve the same. So, if the good nature of my Heavenly Father flows to me, to some degree, with it's the attendant gifts as charity, wisdom, the much goodness that is the nature or soul of the Father is with me as an inheritance from him. There seems to be a Spirit of Holiness that flows from the Father in degrees to all his children and also Holy Spirits that work for the Father. So, the idea of the soul of the Father being in all of us resonates with me. The soul of the devil may find more or less place in others. How far advanced God is from us yet how close and personal to nurture is he with each of us especially those that have desire and take action to be closer to him! Father is such an appropriate and great name for God.
@@paulsimmons9512 Beautifully expressed, Paul! Thank you.
If Swedenborg compares the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit to our soul, body, and actions, then none of them are fully God. In fact, it would be hard to see whether any of them would even be persons under Swedenborg's formulation.
Your mind, body, and soul are all parts of you, but *you* are not your body, nor are you your mind, nor are you your soul.
Interesting thoughts, Daniel. We are trying to wrap words around big concepts. Does the four letter word "love" contain your devotion to people in your life? Does the three letter word "joy" adequately contain the emotion you feel when you climb a mountain, or on your wedding day, or the birth of your child?
We are mortal, and finite. Our attempt to describe and understand God is in some ways futile. Yet we feel an inner urge to try. Words like love, and joy, and Father and Son are small packages for such magnificent experiences and infinite concepts. They are clumsy, and yet we need them. Sometimes we can lift ourselves above the words, and feel them more deeply. When I hold a baby in my arms words are superfluous. We do not need words to validate our connection. When I feel in the stream of providence words are too small to carry the meaning.
May you find your own rhythm of connecting with God, with or without the names.
Very simple three persons one God. God the Father God the son God the Holy Spirit three persons one God very simple
So the idea of three separate people being one person doesn't bother you, eh, Angelo?
@@offTheLeftEye please pay attention three persons one God is in the Bible Hallelujah
@@offTheLeftEye God the Father God the son God the Holy Spirit three persons one God have a blessed day Hallelujah in Christ Hallelujah
KK. said she has seen The Trinity I!n Heaven! She said that Jesus would simply slip. into the Father as would the Holy Spirit do the same!
It seems strange that you would try to make the Holy Trinity mean something about you.
Not quite sure what you mean, SpiritofLife. The analogy works for me in terms of understanding the Trinity. Perhaps not a good fit for you.
I read this theory ofemanuel swedenborg is exactly the theology of krishnaism...
Yes, I think there is a parallel there, if one is thinking of just one God, but three different aspects of the one God!
@@offTheLeftEye i was reading bhagavad gita how it is and interesting in that and its just crazy and when swedenborg writes why god come down and he writes that god come down to fight hell and demons and he comes down to restore balance betwren hell earth and heaven.. thats same whats written in bhagavd gita and what krishna says.. and he s three aspects of lord jesus christ as person its same... From krishna emantes he is bhagavan lord he is paramatma as lord sitting in every ones heart as person and brahma is light holy spirit energy.. main difference is that krishnaits believe in reincarnation..
Thats crazy because bhagavad gita was not yet translated when swedenborg was alive.. even sun comparison is the same..
@@offTheLeftEye there is very strange thing when jesus was prayng alone in garden to father he says father i opened your name to them.. but we dont know any name in christianity of father so whats the name of father? What name he opened? It is jesus christ he is the father!!
@@moonbayer2323 thanks so much for sharing this, and for your questions! I love hearing your thoughts! Here are some episodes that I think you'll like!
Here's a short clip: "What Does God's Name [Really] Mean?" th-cam.com/video/R1UvjU0AdoI/w-d-xo.html and you might like this longer episode on the subject: "The Spiritual Meaning of Names" th-cam.com/video/df07hn8wMok/w-d-xo.html
Also in reference to the similarities between Swedenborg and the Bhagavad Gita, check out this episode about religions: "The Spiritual Reality Behind All Faiths" th-cam.com/video/Y-US1qib37g/w-d-xo.html
Now, why doesn't our government work this way? Unspoken cooperation!
Our government seems to be based on the ambition of the biggest egos the country can produce. It's not spiritual in any way that I can see. The best people to run our affairs are the humble ones who would never push themselves forward as being the best choice. It's a real dilemma.
only if it is
I am reminded not only of "modalism" but also of "adoptionism", both views repudiated by the Catholic Fathers. Just saying. :-)
Swedenborg is definitely different than Catholicism. Can you say a few words about adoptionism?
Time :37 Yes," it's hard to get used to no matter how I try" as the same words sing in a timely way on the radio as I try to put the confusion into words. It's hard to be. I am NOT JESUS CHRIST although I am there with him as one mostly doing the miracles and being the one giving the breath that brought his dead body back to life. I AM NOT THE FATHER GOD, the True one (true just said on the radio as I typed the word "true") is SO HOLY. . BUT there are a lot of false saying they are HE. What a mess! I AM THE HOLY SPIRIT. Stop saying you are Me, I am not open to having you in MY SELF. AT ALL. in fact, it is a sin you are committing against US.
The trinity has been a challenging subject for many people SpiritofLife.
God is one not three. If there were three Gods then which one would take the throne? There would just be chaos everywhere and there wouldn't be any order in the universe. The reason why some people believe in this is because this is the result or Jesus Christ's original message becoming corrupt overtime. And even if it does talk about the trinity in the Bible, this doesn't matter because there are over 200 different versions of the Bible and it is not in its original form. The final prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was sent to clear up these misconceptions and to re-establish the same pure message that all of the other prophets and messengers in the past have preached before people corrupted it. He was sent with the last revelation until the day of judgement which is the Quran. This book is the criterion over all religion and it is a historical fact that not a single letter has changed ever since revelation. And there is nowhere in here that says God is three. May God guide you all to the straight path :)
Hi Sam, thanks for reaching out! It's cool to note the harmony between you and Swedenborg with regards to the trinity. And thanks so much for sharing about your faith...we really encourage this type of dialogue. May God bless your path, my friend.
If you had watched the video you would know that this video does not claim that God is three. The Trinity of God is simply a way to represent 3 aspects of 1 God. In the same sense, each human can be described as a Trinity, such as Mind, Soul, Body or Soul Body and Action. Your faith in 1 book has made you unable to simply watch and digest the facts presented here. People who are Bible Thumpers or Quran Thumpers can be dangerous. Calm down (something I would say to the entire Muslim world) and open your mind.
And God said let (US) make man in (OUR) image, after (OUR) likeness. for there are 'three' which bear record in heaven, the (father), the (Word), and the (Holy Ghost): and these 'three' are 'one'. Genesis 1: 26, 1 John 5:7