Those commenting saying, " *_No bad brands are mentioned_* ," ... Two things: First, at 10:12 Josh mentions *10 brands made by Nortek* . Second, as the title states, the rest of the video is *criteria for determining good and bad HVAC brands* . Third, Josh mentions “builder grade” brands at 5:33 Finally, at 7:47, Josh mentions brands that are sold in retail stores, imported into the country, and sold online are lower quality brands. He does not mention specific brands because there are too many to name.
Back in 2009 I had to replace my Carrier system. In my research for a new system I found that the installers with brand names on their truck felt their brands were the "best on the market" and most said the other brands suck. So I talked to old HVAC repairman and got a few of his observations that changed my selection criteria completely. He said "look, there are only a few suppliers of gas valves, compressors, main control boards, etc. on the HVAC component market. The "big names" generally use the same components as the lesser name companies, and his experience was that the fancy names break just as often if not more than the unfamiliar ones." So I changed my criteria and made my selection based on the components used INSIDE the cabinet instead of the name on the outside of it. I actually bought my system over the internet and had it installed by a local HVAC company and saved a substantial amount of money. If you buy cheap, expect to get cheap, but if you buy the better or best grade of unit even from the less fancy nameplates, there is a good chance that you will get a better value for your money than the big name units. (Don't forget that those fancy brand TV commercials cost money) I found that I could even buy parts for my furnace on Amazon at a huge discount off list - imagine that!
The experienced old repairman is truly correct. Parts for cheaper units are still used in the expensive units if the task is the same. For the most part, in any appliance, the lower end models have the same parts as the high end units minus the bell and whistle. Its the marketing B.S. that you have to ignore because that is how they sell the higher end units and there's tons on money invested in marketing so the higher end units tend to have less value for the price. I think they all do something well if installed correctly so the main focus would be in how much they will cost to run on your gas and electric bill. Some folks can be good will a gravity wall furnace and a couple of window air conditioners and their gas and electric bill will amount to beans compared to a central system that costs much more to run simply because its trying its best to keep equal temps room to room. So, that's probably the area to focus on, how efficient is this or that unit when it is installed correctly. If you plan to stay in the same home for 10 or more years, get the unit that is best on the cost to run.
Years ago before everything was made in China units were very different and made at a price point. Now like Kitchen Aide has the same parts as the cheaper Whirlpool models exactly.
I was thinking of buying my condenser/evaporator on line, but none of the local AC companies would install it . I finally found 1 willing but he would not warranty it--only the labor he did. It may be different in other parts of the country.
So…. As an industry professional of 15+ years and constantly continuing my education... SOOOO much of the longevity of ANY equipment is the knowledge of and workmanship quality of the installing contractor. Understanding and properly evaluating ductwork and sizing equipment PROPERLY is ALL critical! Good video!
No way to stop the piece of shit evaporator coils to not leak refrigerant. Was at a 2019 trane yesterday and the aluminum cap tube is split down the middle, can't braze the aluminum, under a part warranty, still $900 dollar repair with refrigerant, evacuation, labor, shipping. Its a joke
@@racegrubb2152 While I don’t wholly disagree with you, I can’t help but wonder if that statement is entirely accurate. The difference I have seen in overall longevity just from systems where tight vacuums have been achieved gives me pause.
This video indicates you don't need a high IQ to be a good investor, just 2 qualities, self discipline and a lot of patience. Investing is mostly about behavioral psychology. How can I generate more income to retire with at least $3m for long term care?
It's unfortunate most people don't have such information. I don't really blame people who panic. Lack of information can be a big hurdle. I've been making more than $45k passively by just investing through an advisor, and I don't have to do much work. Doesn't matter if the economy is misbehaving, great wealth managers will always make returns.
I've experimented with a few over the past years, but I've stuck with the popularly 'Leah Foster Alderman' for about five years now, and her performance has been consistently impressive. She’s quite known in her field, look her up.
I dig this. 10 year HVAC-R service technician. The "chuck in a truck" comment was great. I work for a company full time and pull in decent cash. I've got some friends that need a heat pump, and they're ordering a 16 seer Goodman. They get that it's not the bees knees that they could get from a contractor, but having me do it as a friend and save on labor is worth it for them. They'd go two years without a system with their credit and finances, so it's worth the lack of a warranty. Remember homeowners, if they don't have an HVAC license in your state, there is no warranty from the manufacturer.
get your old buddy, a friend, a high school classmate to put your system in. See which one has priority... his full-time job or you're broke down unit on the weekend, after hours or holiday.
Bought a brand new Trane in 9/22. Trane unit was manufactured in 9/22. Panama Florida plant orgin. Model 4WCC4030A1000AB Lasted 30 days then quit. Called Trane authorized dealer that sold/installed unit. Took him 11 months to come back out. No heat during winter/ no AC during summer, 11 months no service,no show. Finally comes out and tells me unit has defective coil, will have to be replaced. Repair man tore brand new AC unit apart in yard. Brand new in pieces, 30 days of service,now scattered across yard. He was not happy , and neither was I. Fast foward 90 days ,and I hear some one drilling on my AC unit outside. I go to window ,but can see no one. I walk outside to find 2 new holes drilled into side of hvac unit... Exactly 9 11/16 from edge....Exactly where new coil had just been replaced!!!!!!! Over $5,000 for a Trane unit that operated less than 100 days total. Then was sabotaged by someone who knew exactly where the coil is sitting behind panel cover. Called 1800Trane and asked if installer had been reimbursed for labor,on the warranty claim on the defective unit. Or did he not get paid for work,and now wants revenge. Trane would not answer. Called cops,they said oh well,no witnesses, no case.
I love the thread here! I know it is all about HVAC but the same thing is happening in Residential Appliances like Refrigerators, Washer and Dryers, Dishwashers, Stoves, etc! From what I am seeing in reviews of Kitchen and Household appliances = Nothing lasts longer than a year anymore! Who is behind this stuff pushing crap out the door and taking our money? And it is BIG money they take these days! My 2 cents worth. Retired Person
They also put all these stupid sensors all over appliances now that cause then not to work and on some once you do the research is almost cheaper to throw it away and buy a new one
My Summit refrigerator was bought brand new in 2008 it never had one problem, its a BASIC fridge, no ice/water in the door krap or electronic controls. Same with my Speed Queen washer- mechanical dials NO electronics
Had a Rheem system (2 ton and 4 ton) in a 2 story that worked great for >25 years. Only replaced both systems because the 2 ton was getting fixed every year so decided to just upgrade the whole system. Was offered several of the high-end brands by several HVAC contractors. Went with another Rheem and it's been strong for 6+ years now.
Just had a 4 ton rheem installed 2 days ago. The temp can’t go below 76 in my house. My 20 yr old carrier would drop the temp to 68 or whatever the thermostat was set at.
yeah - well YMMV, the fan flew off my Rheem outside unit and caused all sorts of damage within 2 years of being new... and my Carriers eat capacitors for breakfast almost once a year (a 4 year old unit is on its third). The reality is everything built now as an appliance is mostly cr*p... regardless of brand... That's my experience...
I have a Nordyne GGRA120C-16 120,000 btu that was installed in 1999 and is still going strong (knock on wood). The only issues I've ever had are the ignitor needing to be replaced ($35), the flame sensor replaced ($12), and the motor capacitor ($11) replaced. And I did all that myself (non-hvac person) very easily. It helps to understand the order of operation for the firing sequence and how to temp bypass sensors to troubleshoot, but super easy. That being said, my new installer has an Amana 96% high efficiency with two stage burner and variable speed fan that I may go with when this Nordyne fails (knock on wood again - lol). I really think they are reliable, at least the model I have, made during the time period I bought. Companies can change and I can't comment on the warranty work because I just did the work myself - but in total this Nordyne has cost me $58 in 25 years. I do have a Honeywell whole house electronic air filter that I religiously clean every 3 months, so maybe that has helped with its longevity?
My Rheem HVAC worked flawlessly for over 24 years. The key was a professional, quality installation and routine annual maintenance! You can certainly pay for the well known names like Carrier, Trane, Lennox but you are paying for their advertising!
In 2008 in one of our facilities we installed 27 ream units all three phase. In 2014 change 21 of the evaporator coils in 2015 change the rest. Reem used to be good but apparently had problems with their evaporator coils we still use rain still having problems with those coils even in units that are 2 years old. I think the problem across the board with air conditioning units in general. Are the quality of the condenser coil or the evaporator coil everything else seems to work pretty decent. Think it has to do with manufacturers cutting corners are building them so they will break down just out of warranty. Does that sound familiar not built like yours from the past keep it
Rheem is a good unit , love their condensers,they are sooooo quiet , all you hear is the fan . Your right , quality installation and maintenance is the key . Unfortunately most people don't care .
Rheem is a well known company. They don’t advertise as much as Trane, Lennox, or Carrier. I have noticed that Goodman equipment and parts prices have really gone up. I think Goodman is having trouble recruiting employees because their factory is located in the middle of Nowhere, Texas and they pay less than other manufacturing and engineering companies.
My workplace had a "Dependable 92" furnace/ac installed, some time later the HVAC guy claimed the heat exchanger was cracked, I change the filters on all the units every Monday, he claimed the filter was dirty and that caused the crack, yet you you could see light thru it easily. I got the paperwork out about the "lifetime" or whatever it was warrantee on the heat exchanger, and here's the cute way they get out of the warrantee- the paperwork detailed the filters and that the warrantee is void blah blah blah, so basically they worm out of replacing the cracked heat exchanger under warrantee by claiming you didnt change the FILTER often enough! So I told the HVAC guy essentially something like; "So you are tying to tell me that despite the crapload of sensors for the intake air, a blocked exhaust sensor, the temperature limit and on and on, that THE most expensive part in the whole furnace doesn't have a sensor that shuts the furnace OFF if the heat exchanger gets too hot???" I said a few other choice words too and he left, suddenly the heat exchanger which worked fine, didnt need replacing after all?? The whole scene told me exactly HOW they get out of that part of the warrantee and it's IMPOSSIBLE to prove you changed the filters or changed them often enough, even sales receipts could be dismissed by claiming they arent valid, you let the filter get too dirty between changes, or you returned the filters and didnt actually install them! Basically the warrantee isnt worth the paper its printed on.
I have a Goodman and Airease system that are both 20+ years old…. I have replaced the capacitor on both but nothing else… Why would I want anything else more expensive?
Thank you. Extremely helpful. I just had a contractor over who only sells Am Standard. I know that company form a plumbing standpoint, but not HVAC. He was excellent, answered all questions including why he sells that brand. His answers and your comments here make me feel confident in choosing this contractor and brand. Thanks again.
Your videos offer excellent information. Those who complain about too much talk are missing the mark. People lack patience and have short attention spans. Don’t shorten your videos because of these kinds of complaints. Many of us appreciate thoroughness and listen patiently. Great job. I just wish your company had branches here in north Texas. I am in the market for a new AC whole house for a 3570 sq. ft. home and I feel like every company I talk to hustles and double talks constantly. Your video is helping. Thanks again.
DO NOT BUY GOODMAN AC UNITS, I purchased 2 units in 2016 (8 years ago), they gave me a Registration Certificate receipt with 10 years parts ALL PARTS warranty on paper under my name. One of the units broke and I called to have warranty honored to find out they didn't want to honor it, their excuse was that the property on tax roll was under an LLC and the Certificate is under my name (Am the owner of property and president of LLC) but this is excuse to not honor warranty, they said that they're warranty and tax roll name must match, so they seem to warranty property not appliances, what a joke..... DO NOT BUY FROM THEM if you care about warranty.
Interesting! When my 19-year-old Tempter failed I did a very detailed search for a replacement before I even called an AC contractor. What I found is that there were very little differences between most of the brands. I compared Trane, American standard, Rheem, Goodman, Daikin, Amana, Bryant Lennox and Tempstar. Trane and American standard were essentially the same item with different color chassis and badge, even the warranty was the same. Goodman, Daikin and Amana were much of the same except Daikin had a longer warranty. I ended up going with Daikin because of the warranty and I knew parts were readily available since you can get Goodman parts everywhere. It is my opinion that the installer is way more critical than the unit itself and there are some crappy installers out there. My new home came a Trane unit, and the install was subbed out to a local AC company, it stopped working twice in less than a month after we closed on the house. They also undersize the return so my grill makes noise every time it runs.
@BaltoPitt My home was not built by Ryan Homes but even if you go custom the builders here all share the sames trades. Crappy trades = crappy house regardless of what you pay. My builder used block on a stem wall and 2x6's and 2x4's for the roof. Fl requires hurricane straps for all residential builds. If you want a good home. Get to know the foreman and the trades and go to the site daily if you can to check their work.
I have two Goodmans on my residence; original builder installed units. Bought this house new.... in 1991. 'Nuf said. I have done nothing special in maintaining these units- if fact, if anything, grossly under-maintained by HVAC industry standards- one of the units has never, and I mean never been touched (completely free of A/C tech sabotage). The other is on its 3rd condenser fan motor- that's it! Oh, and I suppose it's worth mentioning that they churn in 100 to110+ summertime temps- Las Vegas. I find it hard to justify replacing them other than for efficiency reasons.
My 20 year old Kenmore 3 ton condenser unit and 26 year old Nordyne Evaporator coil never saw a maint. tech to clean, adjust, or as you say, tech sabotage although I would clean the condenser myself every other year or so.
It is all a game and we consumers are the pawn pieces. Most companies push the brand/brands that they sell or most likely get a cut on when they sell them. It’s deceitful but unfortunately we don’t have much choice when most of us is just trying to get an affordable system to keep warm and cool.
Great video ,we live in the costal region of Alabama. HVAC is big down here. We found a contractor down here that a friend who rental property. They sell Trane. We have a Trane condensing unit that is over 25 years old and still runs like a champ. The air handler was replaced in 08 and is an American Standard. The evaporator coil is rusting but what don't rust down here. We bought the house about 2 years ago and I don't think the previous owners took care of the unit very well. When it goes ,we will go with the contractor we use and get a Trane.
I live in Nevada (the Reno area) and it gets hot in the summer - I have a Trane and, just like their commercial says, "You can't stop a Trane." Six years it's been in the side yard and not a single glitch ...
My Rheem 2.5 ton A/C with scroll was installed in 1995........I do maint every year and its never worked better. I called a company for a quote and they came out and told me these old Rheems are tanks and they don't build units like these anymore. He said they have replaced these units that have lasted 35 years so im going to let it run!!
Having worked in this field, nearly all brands are super reliable built to last up to 25 years. Nearly all brands have competitive specs, performance, and warranties. The end customer (homeowner) will never know the difference. The real differences are serviceability and customer service experienced by the direct customer (dealer/installer). For example, if you look at modern furnaces made within the past few years, Trane/American Standard are the best for service as they are easy to take apart and put back together very quickly. Goodman are the best for purchase price, but it will take ALOT of work to replace major components because of the # of things you need to move out of the way. Therefore, Goodman labor costs will be higher.
@@MrGrenade121 Avoid Lennox. I have their highest line unit that came with my home here in Texas. The iComfort system thermostat broke and they want over $1,000.00 to replace it. Also since it's a "connected/communicating" thermostat and you can't replace it with a generic or nest thermostat. Connected doesn't mean wifi...it means communicating with the blower. I wish these videos would address a situation like this and if everybody knew, nobody would be a sucker enough to by Lennox. In other words, Lennox does NOT stand by it's product.
If they won't take care of a pro they won't give a rat's posterior about me. I'm upfront about all my experiences with automotive and other equipment and it's a joy to see contractors express their preferences. A contractor who doesn't market anything and works on everything (like my HVACbro who taught me how to replace heat pump compressors) and is highly experience is my preference.
Thanks for calling a spade a spade. I had a new dealer installed Nutone system (which I think is part of the Nordyne/Nortek dysfunctional family), and they claimed my dealer didn't submit the paperwork for the warranty. When I pointed out that I had my original receipt showing when it was installed, and it was a Nutone dealer, they still refused to honor the part or labor.
I've been around this industry over 35 years - and currently 90% of a quality HVAC installation, 100% relies on the person installing the system! There so many ways to skimp on an HVAC job. And since this industry is "regulated" I will inform you that is 100% BS as far as protecting the consumer in a "Licensed" industry. There is an enormous # of people that ARE NOT LICENSED and are not even properly setup to run an HVAC business - and government doesn't even have the capacity to regulate this kind of an industry and there not really even interested in trying; Yes, they do put on a good show!. The best advise realistically, is go with a company who has a STORE FRONT. This is by far your best safety net!
I've worked on commercial building automation systems since 1979. Here are my opinions of the most common problems, in order. Bad engineering for the specific use. (usually due to copy/paste methods). Bad installation (always due to lack of experience). Bad maintenance (usually due to penny pinching). ======================================================================================================== As the video said: do the research, consult with multiple contractors, go with simple systems, and don't be dazzled by claimed energy savings (they are calculated from idealized factory test beds). One repair can wipe out years of savings.
I have never heard someone say so much, without actually saying anything. Just sayin. Name the names. Call them out good or bad. You have one company that sells a few brands. There has to be more. You are supposed to be the pro. No help from you whatsoever. Sorry.
YOU SURE DO A LOT OF TALKING OF THINGS THAT ARE NOT RELATED TO THE SUBJECT OF BRANDS THAT SUCK. PLEASE STICK TO THE SUBJECT AND TELL PEOPLE THE BRANDS THAT SUCK. YOU ALMOST SOUND LIKE A USED CAR SALESMAN TALKING ABOUT OTHER THINGS OTHER THAN BRANDS THAT SUCK. THEREFORE I HAVE LEARNED NOTHING OTHER THAN ASKING MY NEIGHBORS.
Great video! I would like to add Ruud/Rheem as a recommended brand. I am a AC contractor in the Tampa area and have had very few callbacks after installation. That being said, I agree with your assesment of Nordyne. As for Goodman or Daiken or whatever they call it now, to me it will always be Janijunk😂
Are you in St Pete by any chance? Not real happy with the company I went with. They're sending someone out tomorrow, it might be their last chance. LMK
The Goodman AC I purchased in 2001 was reliable. I replaced it after 21 years. The compressor was still going strong but the evap coil developed a leak so I decided to part with. I can’t speak for the ones they are making today.
Here’s my 2 cents worth as a service tech, MOST brands are going to be ok, someone out there will have a really bad experience with every brand, even when it’s installed correctly. Here are some points for me -availability, can you get the part? This is why I avoid Lennox and anything under them. You can only get Lennox parts if you are a Lennox dealer. So if you are a small company (or a big one) that sells something else. Well, to bad! You have to call the Lennox specific guy, and they might not even have it! -I worked on 4 major brands carrier, rheem, trane, and Lennox. Rheem & trane have been the best in my experience ( a lot less major fixes) Carrier has had BIG problems in the past 5-10 years and seem to have fixed some of them. Although, I still do not trust them. And Lennox? Well they are good, but a pain to fix over all other brands (if you go with a company that doesn’t sell Lennox) There you go!
Big 4.. includes those plus Lennox. Goodman is the largest selling brand in North America based on its quality to price ratio. Trane and American Standard have the best coils and compressors which happen to be the most expensive components in any brand split system repair. Lennox parts are the most expensive after you’re outside of the original manufactures warranty. Goodman and Carrier/Bryant parts are the cheapest of the top 4. FWIW the longevity and the performance of the system is 50% the equipment and 50% the technician that puts it in. In other words, I’d rather have a Goodman system perfectly installed than a Trane system slopped in by somebody who’s cutting corners and doesn’t know what they’re doing. Sad thing is you probably won’t know until a few years or as much is seven or eight years later if you’re paying the price of a poor installation or a inferior product. 😎
I was pretty set on getting a 2 stage trane, but then starting seeing all these things about their compressors not being great anymore amd that they are using LG. I've been stuck between bosch 2.0, trane xl17i, and maybe goodman gszc18. Last 2 are 2 stage which I feel like will prove to be more reliable? I see hate on bosch but I also see a lot of praise given its installed and sized properly. Not sure you'll see this but just trying to gwt all the input possible.
It's really sad to me that Maytag was the finest ever, that is, until Whirlpool bought the company. The only washer I'd let in the house today is a Speed Queen, and I'm facing having to do that being my Maytags had their 30th birthday, and the parts prices have been run intentionally through the roof.
American Standard / Trane for me. Unfortunately, like the rest of the assembled in the USA brands, seeing made in China or Mexico on some part labels sucks. They all do that though. Thankful to see made in the USA on the Trane / Copeland Alliance compressor. Improper installation and set up can detrimental to performance and longevity of any brand.
I just took pics of my last American Standard install. There were no "Made in the USA" labels on any parts. We just assemble a bunch of junk from around the world. No wonder were going down the tubes.
Just replaced a 15 year old Rheem that was working (not sure how efficient but it cooled and heated the 1661' home) with a 4T 16 seer Carrier that sucks. Installed 1/6/23 and the tech has come back once to 'adjust' and then to replace the stat. It still blows cool air on heat and tho it is a dual speed it only kicks on high if the stat is upped a few notches which is manual. Still short cycling on high and air is warm but not 'hot' on 72 degrees.
Great videos, thanks for helping us with a home's most complex investment! I saw a local contractor offer their own "branded" HVAC system. Does that say anything, good or bad, about their units? I might ask them who is actually providing their equipment - maybe they will say and maybe they won't - but slapping their own name on equipment seems like they would stand behind it, but may limit warranty stuff to them, things like that...
My house was built in 1997 came with with a Rheem system it has performed very well every year in 26 years with oem parts i am just replacing parts now, not because it needs to but of the age the fan, the contact switch, capacitor
I had a Coleman (which I heard was bought out by Goodman now?), installed on the 4th of July weekend in 2005. By the second year, some valve went out and we didn’t have any heat in the winter….but the AC still worked. We went on that way for several years, just using room heaters in the winter, it is Arizona after all, so we didn’t need heat as much as we needed the AC. Finally, after a few years, we had the repairman come to fix the central heat, and he said that he ‘welded’ the new valve on so that it shouldn’t do that again. Guess what? It didn’t even last that whole winter! We were back to room heaters again…..and still are as I write this. We still have the same ac unit here in 2024, and I’m hoping it still holds out. We’ve never had any problems with it cooling….but heating? Ha! That’s non-existent!
thank you for creating this channel. Your content is quite useful and informative for people like me who are less close to this type of technology. Keep up the good work!
A second point: There’s little sense in having the best equipment installed by a hack contractor. Installation details can erase any expected efficiency gains or reliability.
@@debidee5548 I have a 2006 Goodman 13 seer 5 ton running in Tucson AZ. Just cap changed this year. It’s been very reliable. Furnace is mid 90’s Carrier Weathermaker. It had a board changed about 10 years ago.
No matter the brand. The equipment is only as good as it’s installed. That’s only as good as the Company to honor the warranty. The best brand is the one I can get parts locally at 2am on a 0° night.
Your not the only one who mentioned Nortek. I've inquired with a view HVAC techs about replacing my system (Trane). Nortek came up about warranty. They said stay away. Thanks for backing that up.
I have always stood behind, it’s not so much the brand but the installation that matters most. A poor installation will effect any brand. A Goodman installation to spec will last a lifetime. Second is the maintenance of the unit. Poor maintenance will effect any brand and any installation. Have seen many installers who don’t check airflow, static pressure or properly check charge. Many installations have poor duct installation habits, which goes back to the installation. I’ve seen 45 year old Goodmans still working and some top names fail in a year or less of installation. Is the installer professional, neat and clean. Truck organized and clean. A installer who can print a report showing it’s running to specs including SEER / SEER2 ratings shows they are more dedicated to doing a good professional installation for starters. Are they checking airflow in each room, addressing code or hot room problems or did they blame the duct work.
I foolishly bought into the Trane hype for a gas furnace. Noisy inducer fan because it came with a chipped blade. $800 control board failed just before end warranty. But they forgot to include a new igniter because the new board supplies 120v instead of the previous 80v. That is their practice, but they failed to follow it. Therefore the old igniter fried days after warranty. Their computer database updates are delayed, so they sent out another 80v for my serial #! It also fried! Off the shelf, same silicon nitride unit, about $40. Trane price I had to pay, $120. I fought them because they made the mistakes. They pretend to have a customer complaint department, but all you get is boilerplate answers. In my case, they replied with a boilerplate letter that explained that they have no control over the FREON supplier! I replied that they have my GAS FURNACE file mixed up with another AIR CONDITIONING customer. They replied that they have responded and that therefore my file is closed! I had to eat the hundreds in costs to fix their mistakes.
I hve a 20+ year old York Stellar Plus 92.5% efficiency, still working but is now showing signs that it might be time to invest in a new one soon, but I heard York no longer do residential HVAC and are now exclusively industrial. I had Costco do a free estimate on a new unit and the contractor quoted me over $13K for a 96% efficiency Lennox for a 1100 sq ft house. A buddy of mine told me that a lot of contractors go with brands that give them the most profit margin and sell units that their company get discounts on. That is sad for the industry if HVAC contractors are the new "used car dealers".
I was in HVAC supply house an heard a tech say Goodman sucks. Lol oh ok I had a Goodman 2 ton package heat pump last 21 yrs all original parts except for fan delay circuit board. What can cause any brand to suck is half ass installation thermostat set wrong in extreme temps. That's the suck .
Great point. Often its the techs who SUCK, not always the system or parts. Rellance Mckenzie SUCKS. They killed the compressor on a perfectly good functioning goodman. Its techs that SUCK. The lousy rushed negligent techs back to back being the first one upon a reinstall, left a leak in the line set near the condensor not checked for leaks before he left, then resulting in it having stopped cooling the next year from refrigerant loss, the next guy who recharged it didnt seal or reweld the visible leak he or anyone would have to be blind to not see, then that third sucky tech coming to reweld the leaky join i had to point out to him, didn't even vacuum the line out completely of air or moisture in the line before adding the refrigerant back into the line, this after spraying leak sealer, a non-condensable, into the line the previous week against my will, now the compressor is making a repetitious sporatic "grinding" noise like metal on metal. Could have been even overcharged or under. Who would know? The elderly lady owning it not privy to anything he did or didn't do? So it was the tech who sucked damaging a perfectly well maintained solid zero problem Goodman, not the unit itself!! Swallow that one before comparing or biaming equipment.
Here's my 2024 Update on this question: The most important thing about HVAC is getting a company who is going to do a professional job of the installation. Still be in business for the ten year warranty period after the install and have written warranties and guarantees for emergency service and satisfaction of the installation. You probably already guessed that this won't be the cheapest quote but instead will be one of the major brands which in my 21-years in the industry would mean; Carrier/Bryant, Rheem/Ruud, Trane/Am Standard, and Lennox. Nevermind Lennox told everybody to F-off during the covid era. The best companies usually install a major brand and seperate themselves with; Transitions with sheet metal not metal tape. Install non-proprietary Air-Filter systems-(that you can buy the media for at any hardware store instead of having to purchase from them). They braze the refrigerant lines instead of crimping or other even worse methods. (I don't trust plumbers who can't sweat-solder either). Good companies set new AC units on new leveled pads and replace the electrical disconnect and whip, replace the line-set whenever possible and pull a vacuum to 500 microns before adding the new refrigerant charge into the system. And so-on and so-forth. Those things are more important than brands, however, stay with a major brand if you can because cheap brands are usually installed by cheap companies that do not install with the procedures outlined above. Finally, this stuff is getting so ridiculously expensive and higher and higher efficiencies are being federally mandated that the equipment does not last near as long as older less efficient systems did, so look to basic value systems instead of high-end systems as you'll be looking at replacing them soon after the ten year part warranties expire. The cost to repair out of warranty parts is ridiculous unless you can do it yourself, so value over sales marketing and bells and whistles is the way to go and it's only going to get worse. I really enjoyed a call I ran yesterday where the customer was looking for an AC Only on top a 1960's era Low-Boy Rheem furnace with cast-iron burners, heat-exchanger and a belt-drive blower-motor with actual oil ports for the motor bearings. I unfortunately, had to shake my head and tell him we would have to replace the full system as the furnace was simply too old even though it was built much better than anything that would replace it today. They're not meant to last 30-40 years anymore they're meant to last as long as your refrigerator, about 10-years, or die as close to after the ten year part warranty expires as possible.
I just got a new payne ! Really actually impressed with the quality. Last of the psc motors . So I grabbed it . Rental house that has a trane in it now that has done well for 15 years . Setting the manometer gas pressure is the key for a long life in my opinion. Have a few ducting issues but that's why I wanted the psc again.
In the winter time and your heat exchanger goes out and your told it will take 4 months for it to come in and it under 20 years warranty. This just happened they said to get the heat exchanger that was under 20 year warranty and recall I had to pay the parts house $2250.00 and in 3 months they would issue me a store credit. I let the customer listen in on the call so they know it is not me screwing them. This customer had nothing better to do then stay on the phone all day. When she disturbed the vice president of the company on his vacation the parts house called me and waved the $2250.00. The company try's to make it impossible for the company trying to do the warranty work so the customer has to get a new furnace and the warranty work is not done.
Gimicks drive up the price while lowering the reliability. My son bought a Nest thermostat. Then found only certain furnace models were compatible with it. The pricy ones. Some models have all kinds of stuff added in pursuit of a couple points in efficiency. No variable stuff for me. Hi/lo gas valve is nice. Simple and dependable. Simple dependable thermostats. I’d choose a brand that didn’t have an expensive advertising campaign. One with a full louvre a/c cabinet with powder coat paint. Not wire mesh.
Purchased a Daikin variable speed A/C. Top of the line. Been through 3 compressor control boards, and am waiting for the arrival of my second control board for the air handler. Also, i'm on my fourth compressor coil and have replaced the condensor coil, and the thermistor. In each case the arrival for the parts took days so no a/c here in Florida. While I'm waiting for the control board, the tech cannot even check the compressor for a suspected refrigerant leak, because the board won't allow the proper pressure to develop. So, days for the board, and I might have to replace the coil again. Daikin has a good warranty. You'll need it. Oh, it's great on electricity because it doesn't run much of the time. Many contractors in my area but now none of them will sell Daikins. The unit is less than five years old.
I don’t think Daikin is the problem based on your story. Of the hundreds of Daikins I have installed, I haven’t replaced as many of the the parts you’re saying have failed on this one unit.
More about the installation than the unit, but I agree there are some sucky units out there. Stick with the name brands, but make sure the installing company is reputable. Too many jack legs who don't do things necessary to make a good clean install. The piping should be new and kept as clean as possible during the install. As few as possible joints should be used and tubing should be reamed. Nitrogen should *always* be used on a new install. Leak inspection should always be completed and a good vacuum run when no leaks are found. Instrumentation should be used to charge the unit properly by someone who knows how to use it. If these steps are followed by the installer, quality brands should give 15-20 years service. I think one of the most important things about the unit itself is the compressor used. Should look for a condensing units which use Copeland compressors.
Flex ducts are disposable with a life span of about 20 years. Very difficult to clean the inner plastic. Usually installed improperly and will leak. Put your ducts in conditioned spaces like a soffit. Or use mini splits.
I think Goodman is fine. The reason they sometimes get bad reviews is because they sell to the public and anyone can install which IS the problem. So I like Goodman because it’s not as expensive and I don’t need all the fancy breakdown stuff nor that price. You can’t recover the cost. Seer 15-16 is enough as is a 95 gas furnace. 2 stage perhaps
Consumers Union had a hard time finding any difference between brands. The industry does all it can to eliminate any market accountability. Contractors are typically limited to who they represent (restricted trade agreements with protected territories) or who the local suppler carries.
10 years ago I turned something into the FTC and they are still working on the case no word back yet. Since the company is worth billions I don't think I will ever hear what happened even though I am to get a certified letter telling what their finding are when the case is closed.
So, I am getting ready to redo my system. My AC, furnace and water heater are all 20 years old. I am in Central California and my contractor likes Ruud, Rheem. Or even suggested Bosch. He is going to send me a couple of quotes this week. I am also kicking around going to and air handler instead of a furnace. Does any near my area have an air handler, and if so how do you like it? How do you like how it heats the house as opposed a furnace? It seems like it may be more expensive in the long electricity wise but I have also seen that it might actually be better as it is quieter and keeps the temp in your house more stable. Any info on AC and heater/furnace would be appreciated.
There are no bad units...only bad installers and bad maintenance. HVAC is shady business. If it's installed properly customer wins and the installer loses. Properly installed system never needs recharging....just like your refrigerator or your freezer. They run 24/7/365 for years and years. So installers will do a poor job to ensure future service calls. I always check my service valves after the recharge. Many times they are left open...on purpose.
Had a Trane system that I finally had to replace in 2020 after a faithful 55 years. When calling around, I told one contractor that the unit was over 50 years old, and they said yeah-right. While waiting for them to come out, I found the original paperwork from the original home owner and it was actually 55 years old. Needless to say, I went with a new American Standard (Trane). If this one lasts that long, it will be way past how long I last! Hoping this one will be my end of life unit.
You are making me feel stupid. I had a Trane heat pump that gave very few minor issues and it was 26 years old. I live in the hot humid South and was afraid it was at the end of its life and replaced it, terrified it would break down in the summer and I would have to wait weeks to get a new unit. Thinking now, it wasn't the best decision.
We replaced our split air conditioner system Trane units after 23 years with Trane. We didn't want to be caught with the older teams needing parts, and the air handlers were just starting to leak coolant. Was it a waste of money? We don't think so because it's hot and we have had zero issues.
@@bogieman101 It might have been a good decision! Your old unit uses R22 that is no longer used and very expensive if you can find it. Plus, the newer one will use less power.
Goodman, is your favorite? I don't know I'm no Goodman hater I install them, however That affordability comes at the cost of quality in manufacturing. Also where I live I can buy Payne equipment for cheaper than Goodman equipment, and the Payne is in my opinion just way better manufactured. However I will say since Goodman has fixed the issues with their evaporative coils leaking, their not horrible air conditioning equipment I just would not put one on my house.
@@brianwhite167 I'm not saying your wrong I just haven't run into many problems with Goodman and it seems like they build there equipment about as tech friendly as possible. It also can be climate I live in south mississippi it's hot 9 to 10 months out of the year Goodman is made better for the heat in my opinion though everyone's different
@@brianwhite167 now Rheem would probably be the best down here the reversing value energizes in heat so it's alot more efficient for hotter climates. I just personally love Goodman they are easy to work on and seem to run well for me.
@@familyman1071 I agree 100% about Rheem equipment I love it, and if you're installing a heat pump I don't see why people go with anything else. If your reversing valve solenoid coil fails, which I know isn't a common issue but does still happen with a Rheem unit you still have an AC, and a heater.
My favorite is the Goodman bashing, primarily by the dealers of the name brands. I have two Goodmans, one 20 years old and another 14 years old. Looking inside we have: 1) A Copeland compressor. Copeland is a major and respected compressor manufacture. 2) A GE condenser fan motor. Nobody ever accused General Electric as a poor choice. 3) The coil is all copper with aluminum fins - easy to repair a leak. So what exactly is junk about a Goodman? The sheet metal housing? The easily replaced $25 capacitor?
I have had the exact same performance from my 21 year old Goodman, and am delighted with it. Only two failures in 24 years, none of which made by Goodman. It took me a year of research to decide to buy, and I have never regretted it. I just regret all the bashing Goodman takes only because they put dents in the dealer's profits. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a Goodman HVAC, and they don't deserve the beatings they get from the whole industry.
i had a good men package heat pump Bristol Compressor, e22. it was vert great at cooling , i dont see how it was Goodmens problem the Compressor got destroyed by Lighting, some times in life there is a thank you god Moment in life , a HVAC company drop a 3 ton goodman gas pack, it could no be installed because of a big dent in the Condenser coil or be Warrantied, the company gave it to me for free, only 1 cap failed 10 dollars in parts and 1 pressure Switch failed 15 dollars great units for the money and parts are every where
I have worked on and replaced more Trane motors than any other unit. Not saying at all they are not good. I have replaced less Goodmans than others. With that said it’s not as much the brand as the installation. A Good installers can install a Goodman and outlast manner others, a bad installation can kill a Trane in months. It’s really bad installation methods, the quick in and out guy vs the guy that truly understands airflow, good lineset installation methods, nitrogen purge and flow, pulling a quality vacuum etc. installers and techs needs to be better trained and take a little more pride in their work. Yes their is a big difference in a quality built unit but you also need a installer that just as good. Ask your installer about a commissioned installation report of all pressures, temps and voltages, pressure test results and vacuum decay test results. If they can’t or won’t provide such they are probably not the best qualified to install your unit. Or they simply know they are not installing it to industry standards.
My response to that is two things... First, I did bash one particular manufacturer and all of their brands. So if you missed that, watch the video again 🙂. And second, the entire video is meant to help homeowners decide which brands suck in their market using the guidelines set forth in this video. In some markets, a brand may suck that may be better in other markets.
Installed a Lennox Heat Pump in my home. 5 yr parts/10 yr compressor warranty. 5 1/2 years later it needed a valve. The parts are proprietary, so a part that might have been $200 plus installation, ended up costing $1,200 and took two weeks in the middle of winter to get it from the company. Buyer beware.
Having to recently purchase a new system, previous heat pump system came with the house and was only 6 years OLD and had 2 leaks in the evap coil and 1 at the compressor, why isn't there more transparency in the price of these units? I had quotes as much as $6K different for the same system. Many industries/trades provide cost the system and cost of the labor. HVAC just seem to provide a total with limited info on what they are going to do. What was I getting for the extra $6K from the highest quote over the lowest quote? I had to really ask a ton of questions and become more than an expert to decide what to do.
I just got a new lennox variable speed. I have mixed feeling, it’s had problems already within the first 8 months of ownership. The heater kept saying something like some exhaust valve or whatever was an issue and in late summer last year the air conditioner kept saying stuff about over pressure. The thermostats kept saying “unable to communicate with equipment” also when I run the “fan” the fan circulates the air on one unit but with fan “on” with the other unit it doesn’t circulate the air. I’m hoping it’s just all little bugs that have to be worked through BUT I’m not excited for the years ahead of this keeps up. As for in house comfort it’s amazing and they are so soooo quiet.
I worked for a company that installed Lennox and the amount of issues that the Lennox communicating systems would have for seemingly no apparent reason was astounding. I started refusing to sell the stuff because I would go into homes of customers that were unhappy with their purchase years later. They would have to have us come out routinely to fix issues and as soon as it would seem the system was working properly it would have some new error code. Lennox never had any answers either even if we did everything they would tell us to. Some of the systems did work well but many of them seemed to always have issues. The sales guys at that company were clueless to this issues and actually incentivized to sell more via a higher commission rate. Good luck to you
@@NewHVACGuide it’s all good, you didn’t install it lol and the company that did install it has been responsive. So far. The only issue that’s still left is the one where I turn on “fan” and one of the units doesn’t circulate. It’s funny because the fan comes on for heating and cooling but when I turn on the fan the fan doesnt respond. Thank you for the video! Also I didn’t buy Lennox because I’m hooked on some brand. I got it because I had multiple vendors out to my house and I really wanted fully variable speed because it’s HOT like 6 months a year where I live and wanted the comfort and energy savings. So I had a Goodman installer come out and they didn’t even know Goodman had a variable speed, I had to tell them about it. Then I had a contractor come out that was a trane installer. I told him I want variable speed and he said “if you want variable speed I will only install a heat pump” I have natural gas, it’s cheaper than running the air conditioner (heat pump) in the winter for me. I asked him why he wouldn’t install a trane variable speed, he said because the variable speed gas furnaces have lots of problems. There is no way I wanted a heat pump. I called another contractor out and they didn’t show up. Then another contractor came out to give me a quote and they were very clearly on something, the guy twice forgot why he was even at my house. Then the final contractor, the one who put my system in my house was the most professional of them all, provided multiple detailed quotes for me to consider between different systems and options and gave detailed expectations for me to have. So it was more of, I didn’t really have a choice, Lennox was the only brand they sold. They have had excellent customer service, when the heater wasn’t working mid-winter they were out next day. When the thermostat was messing up, they were out next day. They are coming out soon for the one year complimentary service, I’m hoping they’ll figure out the fan issue.
@@alexsystems2001 I’m glad to hear they are taking care of you. Makes a difference. Even the best companies have a unit that gives them issues sometimes.
I dont think it was necessary to go into all this rambling to come out with the conclusion that the more you spend, the better it is. Well, freakin DUH!
I live in a location that gets a lot of lightning strikes. The power is underground, but to be safe I just put an Intermatic AG3000 HVAC surge protector on the compressor unit. In your experience, how useful are surge protectors, either whole house or dedicated? My Goodman is well past warranty, so I'll have to pay for the parts and labor. I figured that if it prevented a single problem, that $76 was well spent.
I always make the contractor break out the cost of the unit, and labor. So I can decide which is the best option. I like simple controls one stage maybe two with no complex control boards. I like copper coils. I also hate digital txv(EEV) valves. I also don’t care about brands
@@NewHVACGuide yep in the North there is almost no savings($3k over 15 years) that is large enough to offset the crazy install cost that contractors want(high end install).
I'm getting my AC replaced in my Condo, the contractor wants to replace with a Ruud condenser paired with a First CO UCQB series air handler I can't find many reviews online about them but I see they are made in the USA, but only offers a 1 year warranty. Should I go with the first co?
Personally, I like Comfort Maker, even though they sold out to Carrier many years ago. I'm a duct guy and not an HVAC tech, but I have HVAC techs working for me and we've been installing Comfort Maker since the early 1990's. I've never had a call back for something failing within the first year. They've been very reliable units. Likewise, I believe in Comfort Maker enough that it's all I've ever put in my homes, my family's homes, my friend's homes and customer's homes/businesses (unless the business is just adamant about another brand). That being said, it IS true that a lot of these systems share components like boards, motors and whatnot. So, like a Trane we recently worked on, the board in it needed to be replaced, and the part number was the exact same as a Goodman. The only difference between buying the board from Trane or from Goodman was the price. Daikin is a brand I've had very bad experiences with. We do a lot of installs and repairs at a local AFB, and they were adamant about Daikin. However, in system after system, their coils kept failing and we were always changing out coils. Some of the Daikin units were even showing up with bad coils straight off the truck and we had to change them out before we ever installed them. We finally convinced the AFB to let us use a Comfort Maker in lieu of Daikin due to all the failing coils, and after seeing the reliability of Comfort Maker, they don't want Daikin units installed anymore. It's been over five years since we last installed a Daikin, so maybe they've got their quality control fixed and are no longer having the coil issues, but I'm in no hurry to find out. Beyond that, can't say I'm a Lennox fan. Maybe it's just Lennox in our area, but they are an absolute pain in the ass to deal with. I have nothing bad to say about their units, but the company (here locally) is horrendous. I can't speak for other markets, maybe they're ok there? Don't know. I just know I avoid Lennox here locally because I don't need the headaches, and they've been this way here for over 25 years. Trane: Great experiences, they're just pricey. Rheem and Ruud: NOT A FAN, especially when talking about their roof top units and package units. Goodman: Well, they've gotten much better, but I still wouldn't install one in my house. All things considered, I do believe some brands are better than others. However, I do have to agree that a majority of the problems are caused by the contractor that installs them. Shoddy workmanship will kill even the very best unit, and there's a LOT of shoddy HVAC companies to be had. Sadly, most homeowners don't know how to spot the difference between a good install and a bad one; all they know is Contractor A is this price, and Contractor B is that price. Last thought: If you're buying a new home and you think the fact that it's been "inspected" means your system is installed properly, think again. We get a lot of calls from frustrated individuals with new homes asking us to come out and see if we can figure out what's wrong with their systems. OMG, I could write a book about the nightmare installs we've seen..... New home installs are by far and away some of the absolute worst we see.
bought place had no ducts lol built 1950. Basic blowing dirt floor air into condo. I terminated whole fn system. Went up draft no vents. No more dirt priceless
You forgot about Lennox. Lennox should be compared to Trane/American Standard & Carrier/Bryant. Those are way above Daikin/Goodman for lots of reasons. I've been doing this for 30+ years and have had my own business for 15 years and I've always seen the worse product support with Goodman/Daikin. Alot of issues come from installation as much as anything.
Gotcha. I’ve talked to guys that feel the same way you do but I’ve talked to just as many that feel the opposite. Honestly, I’ve never been a fan of Lennox but to each their own. I tell homeowners to find a company that believes in what they’re installing and they will usually be okay
I have had a Janitrol in since 1999. Only had to change the glow plug a few times. The pressure switch just went. Only issues I have had. I know Goodman doesn't have the greatest reputation but it has worked for me. Anyone ever install an Ox Box?
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Those commenting saying, " *_No bad brands are mentioned_* ," ...
Two things:
First, at 10:12 Josh mentions *10 brands made by Nortek* .
Second, as the title states, the rest of the video is *criteria for determining good and bad HVAC brands* .
Third, Josh mentions “builder grade” brands at 5:33
Finally, at 7:47, Josh mentions brands that are sold in retail stores, imported into the country, and sold online are lower quality brands. He does not mention specific brands because there are too many to name.
I think if you badge a video with "HVAC brands that suck" you should give us brands that suck!
right, eh, not give us a headache & wasted time of watching the video..Get to the point..Mention the brands ffs..
Back in 2009 I had to replace my Carrier system. In my research for a new system I found that the installers with brand names on their truck felt their brands were the "best on the market" and most said the other brands suck. So I talked to old HVAC repairman and got a few of his observations that changed my selection criteria completely. He said "look, there are only a few suppliers of gas valves, compressors, main control boards, etc. on the HVAC component market. The "big names" generally use the same components as the lesser name companies, and his experience was that the fancy names break just as often if not more than the unfamiliar ones." So I changed my criteria and made my selection based on the components used INSIDE the cabinet instead of the name on the outside of it. I actually bought my system over the internet and had it installed by a local HVAC company and saved a substantial amount of money. If you buy cheap, expect to get cheap, but if you buy the better or best grade of unit even from the less fancy nameplates, there is a good chance that you will get a better value for your money than the big name units. (Don't forget that those fancy brand TV commercials cost money) I found that I could even buy parts for my furnace on Amazon at a huge discount off list - imagine that!
Nice. Sounds like you made out well
The experienced old repairman is truly correct. Parts for cheaper units are still used in the expensive units if the task is the same. For the most part, in any appliance, the lower end models have the same parts as the high end units minus the bell and whistle. Its the marketing B.S. that you have to ignore because that is how they sell the higher end units and there's tons on money invested in marketing so the higher end units tend to have less value for the price. I think they all do something well if installed correctly so the main focus would be in how much they will cost to run on your gas and electric bill. Some folks can be good will a gravity wall furnace and a couple of window air conditioners and their gas and electric bill will amount to beans compared to a central system that costs much more to run simply because its trying its best to keep equal temps room to room. So, that's probably the area to focus on, how efficient is this or that unit when it is installed correctly. If you plan to stay in the same home for 10 or more years, get the unit that is best on the cost to run.
Years ago before everything was made in China units were very different and made at a price point. Now like Kitchen Aide has the same parts as the cheaper Whirlpool models exactly.
I was thinking of buying my condenser/evaporator on line, but none of the local AC companies would install it . I finally found 1 willing but he would not warranty it--only the labor he did. It may be different in other parts of the country.
@@captinbeyond smart, I wouldn’t warranty it either.
So…. As an industry professional of 15+ years and constantly continuing my education... SOOOO much of the longevity of ANY equipment is the knowledge of and workmanship quality of the installing contractor. Understanding and properly evaluating ductwork and sizing equipment PROPERLY is ALL critical! Good video!
I’ve seen completely issue free 10+ yr old ‘builder grade’ and catastrophic failures very early on with the highest end equipment.
Thanks pal! Probably the only positive response I’ve received yet. I think everyone wanted me to just get on here and bash A bunch of brands
Evacuating the system down to the proper Micron is essential to compressor life.
No way to stop the piece of shit evaporator coils to not leak refrigerant. Was at a 2019 trane yesterday and the aluminum cap tube is split down the middle, can't braze the aluminum, under a part warranty, still $900 dollar repair with refrigerant, evacuation, labor, shipping. Its a joke
@@racegrubb2152 While I don’t wholly disagree with you, I can’t help but wonder if that statement is entirely accurate. The difference I have seen in overall longevity just from systems where tight vacuums have been achieved gives me pause.
This video indicates you don't need a high IQ to be a good investor, just 2 qualities, self discipline and a lot of patience. Investing is mostly about behavioral psychology. How can I generate more income to retire with at least $3m for long term care?
investors like you should be cautious of the bull run, its best you connect with a well-qualified adviser to meet your growth goals and avoid blunder.
It's unfortunate most people don't have such information. I don't really blame people who panic. Lack of information can be a big hurdle. I've been making more than $45k passively by just investing through an advisor, and I don't have to do much work. Doesn't matter if the economy is misbehaving, great wealth managers will always make returns.
I've been looking to get one, but have been kind of relaxed about it. Could you recommend your advis0r? I'll be happy to use some help
I've experimented with a few over the past years, but I've stuck with the popularly 'Leah Foster Alderman' for about five years now, and her performance has been consistently impressive. She’s quite known in her field, look her up.
Wow, her track record looks really good from what I found online. I'll take a chance and see how it goes. Thanks for the info
I dig this. 10 year HVAC-R service technician. The "chuck in a truck" comment was great. I work for a company full time and pull in decent cash. I've got some friends that need a heat pump, and they're ordering a 16 seer Goodman. They get that it's not the bees knees that they could get from a contractor, but having me do it as a friend and save on labor is worth it for them. They'd go two years without a system with their credit and finances, so it's worth the lack of a warranty.
Remember homeowners, if they don't have an HVAC license in your state, there is no warranty from the manufacturer.
Thanks pal
It’s get to it, not get too it.
get your old buddy, a friend, a high school classmate to put your system in. See which one has priority... his full-time job or you're broke down unit on the weekend, after hours or holiday.
I like most of your content, but this video teased more than my first high school girlfriend.
I have to agreed. Nothing I can usexwhen I'm trying to do some research trying to decide on a brand.
Wasted my time dude… All I get from this video is stay away from trunk slammers. Got it.
Bought a brand new Trane in 9/22.
Trane unit was manufactured in 9/22.
Panama Florida plant orgin.
Model 4WCC4030A1000AB
Lasted 30 days then quit.
Called Trane authorized dealer that sold/installed unit.
Took him 11 months to come back out.
No heat during winter/ no AC during summer, 11 months no service,no show.
Finally comes out and tells me unit has defective coil, will have to be replaced.
Repair man tore brand new AC unit apart in yard. Brand new in pieces, 30 days of service,now scattered across yard.
He was not happy , and neither was I.
Fast foward 90 days ,and I hear some one drilling on my AC unit outside.
I go to window ,but can see no one.
I walk outside to find 2 new holes drilled into side of hvac unit...
Exactly 9 11/16 from edge....Exactly where new coil had just been replaced!!!!!!!
Over $5,000 for a Trane unit that operated less than 100 days total.
Then was sabotaged by someone who knew exactly where the coil is sitting behind panel cover.
Called 1800Trane and asked if installer had been reimbursed for labor,on the warranty claim on the defective unit.
Or did he not get paid for work,and now wants revenge.
Trane would not answer.
Called cops,they said oh well,no witnesses, no case.
Why not take that contractor to court? Call BBB. Call someone! That’s outrageous!
I love the thread here! I know it is all about HVAC but the same thing is happening in Residential Appliances like Refrigerators, Washer and Dryers, Dishwashers, Stoves, etc! From what I am seeing in reviews of Kitchen and Household appliances = Nothing lasts longer than a year anymore! Who is behind this stuff pushing crap out the door and taking our money? And it is BIG money they take these days! My 2 cents worth. Retired Person
They also put all these stupid sensors all over appliances now that cause then not to work and on some once you do the research is almost cheaper to throw it away and buy a new one
My Summit refrigerator was bought brand new in 2008 it never had one problem, its a BASIC fridge, no ice/water in the door krap or electronic controls. Same with my Speed Queen washer- mechanical dials NO electronics
Had a Rheem system (2 ton and 4 ton) in a 2 story that worked great for >25 years. Only replaced both systems because the 2 ton was getting fixed every year so decided to just upgrade the whole system. Was offered several of the high-end brands by several HVAC contractors. Went with another Rheem and it's been strong for 6+ years now.
Just had a 4 ton rheem installed 2 days ago. The temp can’t go below 76 in my house. My 20 yr old carrier would drop the temp to 68 or whatever the thermostat was set at.
just replaced my Rheem with another Rheem because it lasted 22 years!
@@Iraqveteran-ke6qu Have your installation come back out and take a look.
yeah - well YMMV, the fan flew off my Rheem outside unit and caused all sorts of damage within 2 years of being new... and my Carriers eat capacitors for breakfast almost once a year (a 4 year old unit is on its third). The reality is everything built now as an appliance is mostly cr*p... regardless of brand... That's my experience...
Pay me now or pay me later ? 2023 / part replacers ? limited warranties/
I have a Nordyne GGRA120C-16 120,000 btu that was installed in 1999 and is still going strong (knock on wood). The only issues I've ever had are the ignitor needing to be replaced ($35), the flame sensor replaced ($12), and the motor capacitor ($11) replaced. And I did all that myself (non-hvac person) very easily. It helps to understand the order of operation for the firing sequence and how to temp bypass sensors to troubleshoot, but super easy. That being said, my new installer has an Amana 96% high efficiency with two stage burner and variable speed fan that I may go with when this Nordyne fails (knock on wood again - lol). I really think they are reliable, at least the model I have, made during the time period I bought. Companies can change and I can't comment on the warranty work because I just did the work myself - but in total this Nordyne has cost me $58 in 25 years. I do have a Honeywell whole house electronic air filter that I religiously clean every 3 months, so maybe that has helped with its longevity?
My Rheem HVAC worked flawlessly for over 24 years. The key was a professional, quality installation and routine annual maintenance! You can certainly pay for the well known names like Carrier, Trane, Lennox but you are paying for their advertising!
Totally agree. Plus very expensive repairs when out of warranty!
In 2008 in one of our facilities we installed 27 ream units all three phase. In 2014 change 21 of the evaporator coils in 2015 change the rest. Reem used to be good but apparently had problems with their evaporator coils we still use rain still having problems with those coils even in units that are 2 years old. I think the problem across the board with air conditioning units in general. Are the quality of the condenser coil or the evaporator coil everything else seems to work pretty decent. Think it has to do with manufacturers cutting corners are building them so they will break down just out of warranty. Does that sound familiar not built like yours from the past keep it
Rheem sorry for the misspelling I hate autocorrect.
Rheem is a good unit , love their condensers,they are sooooo quiet , all you hear is the fan .
Your right , quality installation and maintenance is the key . Unfortunately most people don't care .
Rheem is a well known company. They don’t advertise as much as Trane, Lennox, or Carrier. I have noticed that Goodman equipment and parts prices have really gone up. I think Goodman is having trouble recruiting employees because their factory is located in the middle of Nowhere, Texas and they pay less than other manufacturing and engineering companies.
Spoiler alert: Nortec Brands (which includes Gibson, Maytag, Broan and others (see10:39) tries to avoid warranty responsibility, so beware.
Thanks!
My workplace had a "Dependable 92" furnace/ac installed, some time later the HVAC guy claimed the heat exchanger was cracked, I change the filters on all the units every Monday, he claimed the filter was dirty and that caused the crack, yet you you could see light thru it easily.
I got the paperwork out about the "lifetime" or whatever it was warrantee on the heat exchanger, and here's the cute way they get out of the warrantee- the paperwork detailed the filters and that the warrantee is void blah blah blah, so basically they worm out of replacing the cracked heat exchanger under warrantee by claiming you didnt change the FILTER often enough!
So I told the HVAC guy essentially something like;
"So you are tying to tell me that despite the crapload of sensors for the intake air, a blocked exhaust sensor, the temperature limit and on and on, that THE most expensive part in the whole furnace doesn't have a sensor that shuts the furnace OFF if the heat exchanger gets too hot???" I said a few other choice words too and he left, suddenly the heat exchanger which worked fine, didnt need replacing after all??
The whole scene told me exactly HOW they get out of that part of the warrantee and it's IMPOSSIBLE to prove you changed the filters or changed them often enough, even sales receipts could be dismissed by claiming they arent valid, you let the filter get too dirty between changes, or you returned the filters and didnt actually install them! Basically the warrantee isnt worth the paper its printed on.
I have a Goodman and Airease system that are both 20+ years old….
I have replaced the capacitor on both but nothing else…
Why would I want anything else more expensive?
Thank you. Extremely helpful. I just had a contractor over who only sells Am Standard. I know that company form a plumbing standpoint, but not HVAC. He was excellent, answered all questions including why he sells that brand. His answers and your comments here make me feel confident in choosing this contractor and brand. Thanks again.
Your videos offer excellent information. Those who complain about too much talk are missing the mark. People lack patience and have short attention spans. Don’t shorten your videos because of these kinds of complaints. Many of us appreciate thoroughness and listen patiently. Great job. I just wish your company had branches here in north Texas. I am in the market for a new AC whole house for a 3570 sq. ft. home and I feel like every company I talk to hustles and double talks constantly. Your video is helping. Thanks again.
Thank you for your kind words!
DO NOT BUY GOODMAN AC UNITS, I purchased 2 units in 2016 (8 years ago), they gave me a Registration Certificate receipt with 10 years parts ALL PARTS warranty on paper under my name.
One of the units broke and I called to have warranty honored to find out they didn't want to honor it, their excuse was that the property on tax roll was under an LLC and the Certificate is under my name (Am the owner of property and president of LLC) but this is excuse to not honor warranty, they said that they're warranty and tax roll name must match, so they seem to warranty property not appliances, what a joke..... DO NOT BUY FROM THEM if you care about warranty.
Weird. I’ve never had a single warranty issue with Goodman
Interesting! When my 19-year-old Tempter failed I did a very detailed search for a replacement before I even called an AC contractor. What I found is that there were very little differences between most of the brands. I compared Trane, American standard, Rheem, Goodman, Daikin, Amana, Bryant Lennox and Tempstar. Trane and American standard were essentially the same item with different color chassis and badge, even the warranty was the same. Goodman, Daikin and Amana were much of the same except Daikin had a longer warranty. I ended up going with Daikin because of the warranty and I knew parts were readily available since you can get Goodman parts everywhere. It is my opinion that the installer is way more critical than the unit itself and there are some crappy installers out there. My new home came a Trane unit, and the install was subbed out to a local AC company, it stopped working twice in less than a month after we closed on the house. They also undersize the return so my grill makes noise every time it runs.
Installer is most important. No one disputes that 🙂
mine lasted 21 years with a capacitor and fan replacement on the outside unit only.
@@DS-fb9te yes and no.
My Trane is 25 years old and still going strong
@BaltoPitt My home was not built by Ryan Homes but even if you go custom the builders here all share the sames trades. Crappy trades = crappy house regardless of what you pay. My builder used block on a stem wall and 2x6's and 2x4's for the roof. Fl requires hurricane straps for all residential builds. If you want a good home. Get to know the foreman and the trades and go to the site daily if you can to check their work.
I have two Goodmans on my residence; original builder installed units. Bought this house new.... in 1991. 'Nuf said. I have done nothing special in maintaining these units- if fact, if anything, grossly under-maintained by HVAC industry standards- one of the units has never, and I mean never been touched (completely free of A/C tech sabotage). The other is on its 3rd condenser fan motor- that's it! Oh, and I suppose it's worth mentioning that they churn in 100 to110+ summertime temps- Las Vegas. I find it hard to justify replacing them other than for efficiency reasons.
My 20 year old Kenmore 3 ton condenser unit and 26 year old Nordyne Evaporator coil never saw a maint. tech to clean, adjust, or as you say, tech sabotage although I would clean the condenser myself every other year or so.
It is all a game and we consumers are the pawn pieces. Most companies push the brand/brands that they sell or most likely get a cut on when they sell them. It’s deceitful but unfortunately we don’t have much choice when most of us is just trying to get an affordable system to keep warm and cool.
Great video ,we live in the costal region of Alabama. HVAC is big down here. We found a contractor down here that a friend who rental property. They sell Trane. We have a Trane condensing unit that is over 25 years old and still runs like a champ. The air handler was replaced in 08 and is an American Standard. The evaporator coil is rusting but what don't rust down here. We bought the house about 2 years ago and I don't think the previous owners took care of the unit very well. When it goes ,we will go with the contractor we use and get a Trane.
I live in Nevada (the Reno area) and it gets hot in the summer - I have a Trane and, just like their commercial says, "You can't stop a Trane." Six years it's been in the side yard and not a single glitch ...
My Rheem 2.5 ton A/C with scroll was installed in 1995........I do maint every year and its never worked better. I called a company for a quote and they came out and told me these old Rheems are tanks and they don't build units like these anymore. He said they have replaced these units that have lasted 35 years so im going to let it run!!
I have a 1997 Rheem. Not one hiccup. Northest, so summer is maybe 10 weeks strong. I maintain it the best I can. I'll try 10 more years.
Having worked in this field, nearly all brands are super reliable built to last up to 25 years. Nearly all brands have competitive specs, performance, and warranties. The end customer (homeowner) will never know the difference. The real differences are serviceability and customer service experienced by the direct customer (dealer/installer). For example, if you look at modern furnaces made within the past few years, Trane/American Standard are the best for service as they are easy to take apart and put back together very quickly. Goodman are the best for purchase price, but it will take ALOT of work to replace major components because of the # of things you need to move out of the way. Therefore, Goodman labor costs will be higher.
What about Lennox? Is it pretty easy to replace parts?
@@MrGrenade121 Avoid Lennox. I have their highest line unit that came with my home here in Texas. The iComfort system thermostat broke and they want over $1,000.00 to replace it. Also since it's a "connected/communicating" thermostat and you can't replace it with a generic or nest thermostat. Connected doesn't mean wifi...it means communicating with the blower. I wish these videos would address a situation like this and if everybody knew, nobody would be a sucker enough to by Lennox. In other words, Lennox does NOT stand by it's product.
If they won't take care of a pro they won't give a rat's posterior about me. I'm upfront about all my experiences with automotive and other equipment and it's a joy to see contractors express their preferences. A contractor who doesn't market anything and works on everything (like my HVACbro who taught me how to replace heat pump compressors) and is highly experience is my preference.
I just want something that doesn't break all the time
Heads up - If your coolant gas leaks out - That is not under warranty - Have a leak check as part of the installation!
Thanks for calling a spade a spade. I had a new dealer installed Nutone system (which I think is part of the Nordyne/Nortek dysfunctional family), and they claimed my dealer didn't submit the paperwork for the warranty. When I pointed out that I had my original receipt showing when it was installed, and it was a Nutone dealer, they still refused to honor the part or labor.
I've been around this industry over 35 years - and currently 90% of a quality HVAC installation, 100% relies on the person installing the system! There so many ways to skimp on an HVAC job. And since this industry is "regulated" I will inform you that is 100% BS as far as protecting the consumer in a "Licensed" industry. There is an enormous # of people that ARE NOT LICENSED and are not even properly setup to run an HVAC business - and government doesn't even have the capacity to regulate this kind of an industry and there not really even interested in trying; Yes, they do put on a good show!. The best advise realistically, is go with a company who has a STORE FRONT. This is by far your best safety net!
I've worked on commercial building automation systems since 1979. Here are my opinions of the most common problems, in order.
Bad engineering for the specific use. (usually due to copy/paste methods).
Bad installation (always due to lack of experience).
Bad maintenance (usually due to penny pinching).
========================================================================================================
As the video said: do the research, consult with multiple contractors, go with simple systems, and don't be dazzled by claimed energy savings (they are calculated from idealized factory test beds).
One repair can wipe out years of savings.
What specific maintenance is recommended? How often? It's an honest question.
I have never heard someone say so much, without actually saying anything. Just sayin. Name the names. Call them out good or bad. You have one company that sells a few brands. There has to be more. You are supposed to be the pro. No help from you whatsoever. Sorry.
Sorry pal
YOU SURE DO A LOT OF TALKING OF THINGS THAT ARE NOT RELATED TO THE SUBJECT OF BRANDS THAT SUCK. PLEASE STICK TO THE SUBJECT AND TELL PEOPLE THE BRANDS THAT SUCK.
YOU ALMOST SOUND LIKE A USED CAR SALESMAN TALKING ABOUT OTHER THINGS OTHER THAN BRANDS THAT SUCK. THEREFORE I HAVE LEARNED NOTHING OTHER THAN ASKING MY NEIGHBORS.
Great video! I would like to add Ruud/Rheem as a recommended brand. I am a AC contractor in the Tampa area and have had very few callbacks after installation. That being said, I agree with your assesment of Nordyne. As for Goodman or Daiken or whatever they call it now, to me it will always be Janijunk😂
What are your thoughts on the Bosh Units?
I am scared to say my Rudd is going strong for 25 years now , lucky
Are you in St Pete by any chance? Not real happy with the company I went with. They're sending someone out tomorrow, it might be their last chance. LMK
The Goodman AC I purchased in 2001 was reliable. I replaced it after 21 years. The compressor was still going strong but the evap coil developed a leak so I decided to part with. I can’t speak for the ones they are making today.
Their furnaces aren’t bad but Goodman seems to have a problem with their evap coils.
So who were the brands that sucked? I must have missed that part.
Here’s my 2 cents worth as a service tech, MOST brands are going to be ok, someone out there will have a really bad experience with every brand, even when it’s installed correctly. Here are some points for me
-availability, can you get the part? This is why I avoid Lennox and anything under them. You can only get Lennox parts if you are a Lennox dealer. So if you are a small company (or a big one) that sells something else. Well, to bad! You have to call the Lennox specific guy, and they might not even have it!
-I worked on 4 major brands carrier, rheem, trane, and Lennox.
Rheem & trane have been the best in my experience ( a lot less major fixes)
Carrier has had BIG problems in the past 5-10 years and seem to have fixed some of them. Although, I still do not trust them.
And Lennox? Well they are good, but a pain to fix over all other brands (if you go with a company that doesn’t sell Lennox)
There you go!
i agree Lennox is a PITA!
Big 4.. includes those plus Lennox.
Goodman is the largest selling brand in North America based on its quality to price ratio.
Trane and American Standard have the best coils and compressors which happen to be the most expensive components in any brand split system repair.
Lennox parts are the most expensive after you’re outside of the original manufactures warranty.
Goodman and Carrier/Bryant parts are the cheapest of the top 4.
FWIW the longevity and the performance of the system is 50% the equipment and 50% the technician that puts it in. In other words, I’d rather have a Goodman system perfectly installed than a Trane system slopped in by somebody who’s cutting corners and doesn’t know what they’re doing. Sad thing is you probably won’t know until a few years or as much is seven or eight years later if you’re paying the price of a poor installation or a inferior product. 😎
I was pretty set on getting a 2 stage trane, but then starting seeing all these things about their compressors not being great anymore amd that they are using LG. I've been stuck between bosch 2.0, trane xl17i, and maybe goodman gszc18. Last 2 are 2 stage which I feel like will prove to be more reliable? I see hate on bosch but I also see a lot of praise given its installed and sized properly. Not sure you'll see this but just trying to gwt all the input possible.
Good thing about Maytag is that they are consistence across the board with oven ,washer machine and etc, they suck
It's really sad to me that Maytag was the finest ever, that is, until Whirlpool bought the company. The only washer I'd let in the house today is a Speed Queen, and I'm facing having to do that being my Maytags had their 30th birthday, and the parts prices have been run intentionally through the roof.
THANKS for taking the time to help others, You helped me decide to go with Daikin, thanks
You're welcome!
Join us every Tuesday night on our live show! www.youtube.com/@hvacguideliveshow
American Standard / Trane for me. Unfortunately, like the rest of the assembled in the USA brands, seeing made in China or Mexico on some part labels sucks. They all do that though. Thankful to see made in the USA on the Trane / Copeland Alliance compressor. Improper installation and set up can detrimental to performance and longevity of any brand.
I just took pics of my last American Standard install. There were no "Made in the USA" labels on any parts. We just assemble a bunch of junk from around the world. No wonder were going down the tubes.
Just replaced a 15 year old Rheem that was working (not sure how efficient but it cooled and heated the 1661' home) with a 4T 16 seer Carrier that sucks. Installed 1/6/23 and the tech has come back once to 'adjust' and then to replace the stat. It still blows cool air on heat and tho it is a dual speed it only kicks on high if the stat is upped a few notches which is manual. Still short cycling on high and air is warm but not 'hot' on 72 degrees.
@@joepetreng471 Believe it or not I did tell the HVAC professional that I needed a 3.5 ton based on my online 'reserarch'. He disagreed.
Great videos, thanks for helping us with a home's most complex investment! I saw a local contractor offer their own "branded" HVAC system. Does that say anything, good or bad, about their units? I might ask them who is actually providing their equipment - maybe they will say and maybe they won't - but slapping their own name on equipment seems like they would stand behind it, but may limit warranty stuff to them, things like that...
My house was built in 1997 came with with a Rheem system it has performed very well every year in 26 years with oem parts i am just replacing parts now, not because it needs to but of the age the fan, the contact switch, capacitor
I had a Coleman (which I heard was bought out by Goodman now?), installed on the 4th of July weekend in 2005. By the second year, some valve went out and we didn’t have any heat in the winter….but the AC still worked. We went on that way for several years, just using room heaters in the winter, it is Arizona after all, so we didn’t need heat as much as we needed the AC.
Finally, after a few years, we had the repairman come to fix the central heat, and he said that he ‘welded’ the new valve on so that it shouldn’t do that again. Guess what? It didn’t even last that whole winter! We were back to room heaters again…..and still are as I write this.
We still have the same ac unit here in 2024, and I’m hoping it still holds out. We’ve never had any problems with it cooling….but heating? Ha! That’s non-existent!
I hope you don't take that long installing a unit. Did you actually ever tell us the brand that sucks? I only heard one
thank you for creating this channel. Your content is quite useful and informative for people like me who are less close to this type of technology. Keep up the good work!
Thanks pal!
While I'm young.
Sorry pal
Don’t ask any questions, I’m out of time
A second point:
There’s little sense in having the best equipment installed by a hack contractor. Installation details can erase any expected efficiency gains or reliability.
If you’ve compared Goodman to Daikin, I would love to see the video as I just thought the difference was color and a slightly longer warranty.
Goodman, Daikin, & Amana are all the same since Daikin bought Amana. Most say they're middle to lower in reliability.
@@debidee5548 I have a 2006 Goodman 13 seer 5 ton running in Tucson AZ. Just cap changed this year. It’s been very reliable. Furnace is mid 90’s Carrier Weathermaker. It had a board changed about 10 years ago.
@@znrctrnn but are they still good nowadays ?
completely useless info, WHY put this on line????
No matter the brand. The equipment is only as good as it’s installed. That’s only as good as the Company to honor the warranty. The best brand is the one I can get parts locally at 2am on a 0° night.
Your not the only one who mentioned Nortek. I've inquired with a view HVAC techs about replacing my system (Trane). Nortek came up about warranty. They said stay away. Thanks for backing that up.
Glad I could help 🙂
I have always stood behind, it’s not so much the brand but the installation that matters most. A poor installation will effect any brand. A Goodman installation to spec will last a lifetime. Second is the maintenance of the unit. Poor maintenance will effect any brand and any installation. Have seen many installers who don’t check airflow, static pressure or properly check charge. Many installations have poor duct installation habits, which goes back to the installation.
I’ve seen 45 year old Goodmans still working and some top names fail in a year or less of installation. Is the installer professional, neat and clean. Truck organized and clean. A installer who can print a report showing it’s running to specs including SEER / SEER2 ratings shows they are more dedicated to doing a good professional installation for starters. Are they checking airflow in each room, addressing code or hot room problems or did they blame the duct work.
I foolishly bought into the Trane hype for a gas furnace. Noisy inducer fan because it came with a chipped blade. $800 control board failed just before end warranty. But they forgot to include a new igniter because the new board supplies 120v instead of the previous 80v. That is their practice, but they failed to follow it. Therefore the old igniter fried days after warranty. Their computer database updates are delayed, so they sent out another 80v for my serial #! It also fried! Off the shelf, same silicon nitride unit, about $40. Trane price I had to pay, $120. I fought them because they made the mistakes. They pretend to have a customer complaint department, but all you get is boilerplate answers. In my case, they replied with a boilerplate letter that explained that they have no control over the FREON supplier! I replied that they have my GAS FURNACE file mixed up with another AIR CONDITIONING customer. They replied that they have responded and that therefore my file is closed! I had to eat the hundreds in costs to fix their mistakes.
Wow! That’s some Bullshit right there! Any company that thinks it’s too big to deal fairly with it’s customers is a company i want to avoid!
Excellent videos, and clearly you know what you're doing and are smart. One question - do you serve Spotsylvania County? Thanks!
I hve a 20+ year old York Stellar Plus 92.5% efficiency, still working but is now showing signs that it might be time to invest in a new one soon, but I heard York no longer do residential HVAC and are now exclusively industrial. I had Costco do a free estimate on a new unit and the contractor quoted me over $13K for a 96% efficiency Lennox for a 1100 sq ft house. A buddy of mine told me that a lot of contractors go with brands that give them the most profit margin and sell units that their company get discounts on. That is sad for the industry if HVAC contractors are the new "used car dealers".
I was in HVAC supply house an heard a tech say Goodman sucks. Lol oh ok I had a Goodman 2 ton package heat pump last 21 yrs all original parts except for fan delay circuit board. What can cause any brand to suck is half ass installation thermostat set wrong in extreme temps. That's the suck .
Great point. Often its the techs who SUCK, not always the system or parts. Rellance Mckenzie SUCKS. They killed the compressor on a perfectly good functioning goodman. Its techs that SUCK. The lousy rushed negligent techs back to back being the first one upon a reinstall, left a leak in the line set near the condensor not checked for leaks before he left, then resulting in it having stopped cooling the next year from refrigerant loss, the next guy who recharged it didnt seal or reweld the visible leak he or anyone would have to be blind to not see, then that third sucky tech coming to reweld the leaky join i had to point out to him, didn't even vacuum the line out completely of air or moisture in the line before adding the refrigerant back into the line, this after spraying leak sealer, a non-condensable, into the line the previous week against my will, now the compressor is making a repetitious sporatic "grinding" noise like metal on metal. Could have been even overcharged or under. Who would know? The elderly lady owning it not privy to anything he did or didn't do?
So it was the tech who sucked damaging a perfectly well maintained solid zero problem Goodman, not the unit itself!!
Swallow that one before comparing or biaming equipment.
did I miss what brands suck? much to do about nothing video
Here's my 2024 Update on this question: The most important thing about HVAC is getting a company who is going to do a professional job of the installation. Still be in business for the ten year warranty period after the install and have written warranties and guarantees for emergency service and satisfaction of the installation. You probably already guessed that this won't be the cheapest quote but instead will be one of the major brands which in my 21-years in the industry would mean; Carrier/Bryant, Rheem/Ruud, Trane/Am Standard, and Lennox. Nevermind Lennox told everybody to F-off during the covid era. The best companies usually install a major brand and seperate themselves with; Transitions with sheet metal not metal tape. Install non-proprietary Air-Filter systems-(that you can buy the media for at any hardware store instead of having to purchase from them). They braze the refrigerant lines instead of crimping or other even worse methods. (I don't trust plumbers who can't sweat-solder either). Good companies set new AC units on new leveled pads and replace the electrical disconnect and whip, replace the line-set whenever possible and pull a vacuum to 500 microns before adding the new refrigerant charge into the system. And so-on and so-forth. Those things are more important than brands, however, stay with a major brand if you can because cheap brands are usually installed by cheap companies that do not install with the procedures outlined above. Finally, this stuff is getting so ridiculously expensive and higher and higher efficiencies are being federally mandated that the equipment does not last near as long as older less efficient systems did, so look to basic value systems instead of high-end systems as you'll be looking at replacing them soon after the ten year part warranties expire. The cost to repair out of warranty parts is ridiculous unless you can do it yourself, so value over sales marketing and bells and whistles is the way to go and it's only going to get worse. I really enjoyed a call I ran yesterday where the customer was looking for an AC Only on top a 1960's era Low-Boy Rheem furnace with cast-iron burners, heat-exchanger and a belt-drive blower-motor with actual oil ports for the motor bearings. I unfortunately, had to shake my head and tell him we would have to replace the full system as the furnace was simply too old even though it was built much better than anything that would replace it today. They're not meant to last 30-40 years anymore they're meant to last as long as your refrigerator, about 10-years, or die as close to after the ten year part warranty expires as possible.
I just got a new payne ! Really actually impressed with the quality. Last of the psc motors . So I grabbed it . Rental house that has a trane in it now that has done well for 15 years . Setting the manometer gas pressure is the key for a long life in my opinion. Have a few ducting issues but that's why I wanted the psc again.
Awesome
What's the deal with the PSC motors? Aren't the newest variable speed DC motors just as good?
You really love to hear yourself talk. I don't believe you've help one person here.
Can't stand our Lennox system from 2010 nothing but problems. Horrible
In the winter time and your heat exchanger goes out and your told it will take 4 months for it to come in and it under 20 years warranty. This just happened they said to get the heat exchanger that was under 20 year warranty and recall I had to pay the parts house $2250.00 and in 3 months they would issue me a store credit. I let the customer listen in on the call so they know it is not me screwing them. This customer had nothing better to do then stay on the phone all day. When she disturbed the vice president of the company on his vacation the parts house called me and waved the $2250.00. The company try's to make it impossible for the company trying to do the warranty work so the customer has to get a new furnace and the warranty work is not done.
Gimicks drive up the price while lowering the reliability.
My son bought a Nest thermostat. Then found only certain furnace models were compatible with it. The pricy ones.
Some models have all kinds of stuff added in pursuit of a couple points in efficiency.
No variable stuff for me. Hi/lo gas valve is nice. Simple and dependable. Simple dependable thermostats.
I’d choose a brand that didn’t have an expensive advertising campaign.
One with a full louvre a/c cabinet with powder coat paint. Not wire mesh.
Purchased a Daikin variable speed A/C. Top of the line. Been through 3 compressor control boards, and am waiting for the arrival of my second control board for the air handler. Also, i'm on my fourth compressor coil and have replaced the condensor coil, and the thermistor. In each case the arrival for the parts took days so no a/c here in Florida. While I'm waiting for the control board, the tech cannot even check the compressor for a suspected refrigerant leak, because the board won't allow the proper pressure to develop. So, days for the board, and I might have to replace the coil again. Daikin has a good warranty. You'll need it. Oh, it's great on electricity because it doesn't run much of the time. Many contractors in my area but now none of them will sell Daikins. The unit is less than five years old.
I don’t think Daikin is the problem based on your story. Of the hundreds of Daikins I have installed, I haven’t replaced as many of the the parts you’re saying have failed on this one unit.
More about the installation than the unit, but I agree there are some sucky units out there. Stick with the name brands, but make sure the installing company is reputable. Too many jack legs who don't do things necessary to make a good clean install. The piping should be new and kept as clean as possible during the install. As few as possible joints should be used and tubing should be reamed. Nitrogen should *always* be used on a new install. Leak inspection should always be completed and a good vacuum run when no leaks are found. Instrumentation should be used to charge the unit properly by someone who knows how to use it. If these steps are followed by the installer, quality brands should give 15-20 years service. I think one of the most important things about the unit itself is the compressor used. Should look for a condensing units which use Copeland compressors.
Flex ducts are disposable with a life span of about 20 years. Very difficult to clean the inner plastic. Usually installed improperly and will leak. Put your ducts in conditioned spaces like a soffit. Or use mini splits.
Flex is warranty is 50 yrs, can't mess up the install, window units last twice as long as mini splits, most are garbage
I think Goodman is fine. The reason they sometimes get bad reviews is because they sell to the public and anyone can install which IS the problem. So I like Goodman because it’s not as expensive and I don’t need all the fancy breakdown stuff nor that price. You can’t recover the cost. Seer 15-16 is enough as is a 95 gas furnace. 2 stage perhaps
Consumers Union had a hard time finding any difference between brands.
The industry does all it can to eliminate any market accountability. Contractors are typically limited to who they represent (restricted trade agreements with protected territories) or who the local suppler carries.
10 years ago I turned something into the FTC and they are still working on the case no word back yet. Since the company is worth billions I don't think I will ever hear what happened even though I am to get a certified letter telling what their finding are when the case is closed.
Not true. Consumer Reports found that Trane (and American Standard - a Trane brand) stood out for reliability and customer satisfaction.
So, I am getting ready to redo my system. My AC, furnace and water heater are all 20 years old.
I am in Central California and my contractor likes Ruud, Rheem. Or even suggested Bosch. He is going to send me a couple of quotes this week.
I am also kicking around going to and air handler instead of a furnace. Does any near my area have an air handler, and if so how do you like it? How do you like how it heats the house as opposed a furnace?
It seems like it may be more expensive in the long electricity wise but I have also seen that it might actually be better as it is quieter and keeps the temp in your house more stable.
Any info on AC and heater/furnace would be appreciated.
There are no bad units...only bad installers and bad maintenance.
HVAC is shady business. If it's installed properly customer wins and the installer loses.
Properly installed system never needs recharging....just like your refrigerator or your freezer. They run 24/7/365 for years and years. So installers will do a poor job to ensure future service calls.
I always check my service valves after the recharge. Many times they are left open...on purpose.
Had a Trane system that I finally had to replace in 2020 after a faithful 55 years. When calling around, I told one contractor that the unit was over 50 years old, and they said yeah-right. While waiting for them to come out, I found the original paperwork from the original home owner and it was actually 55 years old. Needless to say, I went with a new American Standard (Trane). If this one lasts that long, it will be way past how long I last! Hoping this one will be my end of life unit.
You are making me feel stupid. I had a Trane heat pump that gave very few minor issues and it was 26 years old. I live in the hot humid South and was afraid it was at the end of its life and replaced it, terrified it would break down in the summer and I would have to wait weeks to get a new unit. Thinking now, it wasn't the best decision.
We replaced our split air conditioner system Trane units after 23 years with Trane. We didn't want to be caught with the older teams needing parts, and the air handlers were just starting to leak coolant. Was it a waste of money? We don't think so because it's hot and we have had zero issues.
@@bogieman101 It might have been a good decision! Your old unit uses R22 that is no longer used and very expensive if you can find it. Plus, the newer one will use less power.
I'm a tech . My favorite is Goodman. I have a Goodman and it's a all around affordable .
Awesome! I’ve got one too
Goodman, is your favorite? I don't know I'm no Goodman hater I install them, however That affordability comes at the cost of quality in manufacturing. Also where I live I can buy Payne equipment for cheaper than Goodman equipment, and the Payne is in my opinion just way better manufactured. However I will say since Goodman has fixed the issues with their evaporative coils leaking, their not horrible air conditioning equipment I just would not put one on my house.
@@brianwhite167 I'm not saying your wrong I just haven't run into many problems with Goodman and it seems like they build there equipment about as tech friendly as possible. It also can be climate I live in south mississippi it's hot 9 to 10 months out of the year Goodman is made better for the heat in my opinion though everyone's different
@@brianwhite167 now Rheem would probably be the best down here the reversing value energizes in heat so it's alot more efficient for hotter climates. I just personally love Goodman they are easy to work on and seem to run well for me.
@@familyman1071 I agree 100% about Rheem equipment I love it, and if you're installing a heat pump I don't see why people go with anything else. If your reversing valve solenoid coil fails, which I know isn't a common issue but does still happen with a Rheem unit you still have an AC, and a heater.
One minute's worth of useful information in a 13 minute video.
My favorite is the Goodman bashing, primarily by the dealers of the name brands. I have two Goodmans, one 20 years old and another 14 years old.
Looking inside we have:
1) A Copeland compressor. Copeland is a major and respected compressor manufacture.
2) A GE condenser fan motor. Nobody ever accused General Electric as a poor choice.
3) The coil is all copper with aluminum fins - easy to repair a leak.
So what exactly is junk about a Goodman? The sheet metal housing? The easily replaced $25 capacitor?
I agree, I have had Goodman since 2004 and haven’t had a single issue.
I have had the exact same performance from my 21 year old Goodman, and am delighted with it. Only two failures in 24 years, none of which made by Goodman. It took me a year of research to decide to buy, and I have never regretted it. I just regret all the bashing Goodman takes only because they put dents in the dealer's profits. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a Goodman HVAC, and they don't deserve the beatings they get from the whole industry.
i had a good men package heat pump Bristol Compressor, e22. it was vert great at cooling , i dont see how it was Goodmens problem the Compressor got destroyed by Lighting, some times in life there is a thank you god Moment in life , a HVAC company drop a 3 ton goodman gas pack, it could no be installed because of a big dent in the Condenser coil or be Warrantied, the company gave it to me for free, only 1 cap failed 10 dollars in parts and 1 pressure Switch failed 15 dollars great units for the money and parts are every where
I have a Goodman that has been running seventeen years. An earlier Carrier ran twenty-five years.
I have worked on and replaced more Trane motors than any other unit. Not saying at all they are not good. I have replaced less Goodmans than others. With that said it’s not as much the brand as the installation. A Good installers can install a Goodman and outlast manner others, a bad installation can kill a Trane in months. It’s really bad installation methods, the quick in and out guy vs the guy that truly understands airflow, good lineset installation methods, nitrogen purge and flow, pulling a quality vacuum etc. installers and techs needs to be better trained and take a little more pride in their work. Yes their is a big difference in a quality built unit but you also need a installer that just as good. Ask your installer about a commissioned installation report of all pressures, temps and voltages, pressure test results and vacuum decay test results. If they can’t or won’t provide such they are probably not the best qualified to install your unit. Or they simply know they are not installing it to industry standards.
Had a Goodman for 10 years and at 9 years 6 months they warranted a compressor for me. I'm a Goodman fan after that experience.
How do you feel about MITS AIR Side Discharge Inverter Air Conditioners? I'm considering buying it for the lower noise.
I think the new Daikin equipment pretty damn good, but a system is only as good as the installer who installed it.
Please be specific. You tapped danced around the topic making this video less useful.
My response to that is two things...
First, I did bash one particular manufacturer and all of their brands. So if you missed that, watch the video again 🙂.
And second, the entire video is meant to help homeowners decide which brands suck in their market using the guidelines set forth in this video. In some markets, a brand may suck that may be better in other markets.
Installed a Lennox Heat Pump in my home. 5 yr parts/10 yr compressor warranty. 5 1/2 years later it needed a valve. The parts are proprietary, so a part that might have been $200 plus installation, ended up costing $1,200 and took two weeks in the middle of winter to get it from the company. Buyer beware.
never gave a list of bad brands
i got 2 goodman 1 for 20 year and the other for 7 year not a single problem
Having to recently purchase a new system, previous heat pump system came with the house and was only 6 years OLD and had 2 leaks in the evap coil and 1 at the compressor, why isn't there more transparency in the price of these units? I had quotes as much as $6K different for the same system. Many industries/trades provide cost the system and cost of the labor. HVAC just seem to provide a total with limited info on what they are going to do. What was I getting for the extra $6K from the highest quote over the lowest quote? I had to really ask a ton of questions and become more than an expert to decide what to do.
Holy Crap! GET TO THE POINT!!!!!!!!
I just got a new lennox variable speed. I have mixed feeling, it’s had problems already within the first 8 months of ownership. The heater kept saying something like some exhaust valve or whatever was an issue and in late summer last year the air conditioner kept saying stuff about over pressure. The thermostats kept saying “unable to communicate with equipment” also when I run the “fan” the fan circulates the air on one unit but with fan “on” with the other unit it doesn’t circulate the air. I’m hoping it’s just all little bugs that have to be worked through BUT I’m not excited for the years ahead of this keeps up. As for in house comfort it’s amazing and they are so soooo quiet.
I’m sorry to hear you’ve had so many issues. Hopefully they get that all straight
I worked for a company that installed Lennox and the amount of issues that the Lennox communicating systems would have for seemingly no apparent reason was astounding. I started refusing to sell the stuff because I would go into homes of customers that were unhappy with their purchase years later. They would have to have us come out routinely to fix issues and as soon as it would seem the system was working properly it would have some new error code. Lennox never had any answers either even if we did everything they would tell us to. Some of the systems did work well but many of them seemed to always have issues. The sales guys at that company were clueless to this issues and actually incentivized to sell more via a higher commission rate. Good luck to you
@@NewHVACGuide it’s all good, you didn’t install it lol and the company that did install it has been responsive. So far. The only issue that’s still left is the one where I turn on “fan” and one of the units doesn’t circulate. It’s funny because the fan comes on for heating and cooling but when I turn on the fan the fan doesnt respond. Thank you for the video! Also I didn’t buy Lennox because I’m hooked on some brand. I got it because I had multiple vendors out to my house and I really wanted fully variable speed because it’s HOT like 6 months a year where I live and wanted the comfort and energy savings. So I had a Goodman installer come out and they didn’t even know Goodman had a variable speed, I had to tell them about it. Then I had a contractor come out that was a trane installer. I told him I want variable speed and he said “if you want variable speed I will only install a heat pump” I have natural gas, it’s cheaper than running the air conditioner (heat pump) in the winter for me. I asked him why he wouldn’t install a trane variable speed, he said because the variable speed gas furnaces have lots of problems. There is no way I wanted a heat pump. I called another contractor out and they didn’t show up. Then another contractor came out to give me a quote and they were very clearly on something, the guy twice forgot why he was even at my house. Then the final contractor, the one who put my system in my house was the most professional of them all, provided multiple detailed quotes for me to consider between different systems and options and gave detailed expectations for me to have. So it was more of, I didn’t really have a choice, Lennox was the only brand they sold. They have had excellent customer service, when the heater wasn’t working mid-winter they were out next day. When the thermostat was messing up, they were out next day. They are coming out soon for the one year complimentary service, I’m hoping they’ll figure out the fan issue.
@@alexsystems2001 I’m glad to hear they are taking care of you. Makes a difference. Even the best companies have a unit that gives them issues sometimes.
@@redsadventures5654 Eeek! That sounds awful pal. What's your goto brand now?
My home came with a Comfortair system it lasted 10 years in lightly used New England.
I’m halfway through it. I haven’t got to the ones that suck. Not watching anymore.
I dont think it was necessary to go into all this rambling to come out with the conclusion that the more you spend, the better it is. Well, freakin DUH!
I live in a location that gets a lot of lightning strikes. The power is underground, but to be safe I just put an Intermatic AG3000 HVAC surge protector on the compressor unit. In your experience, how useful are surge protectors, either whole house or dedicated? My Goodman is well past warranty, so I'll have to pay for the parts and labor. I figured that if it prevented a single problem, that $76 was well spent.
Please let me know if Grand air is a good system
I always make the contractor break out the cost of the unit, and labor. So I can decide which is the best option. I like simple controls one stage maybe two with no complex control boards. I like copper coils. I also hate digital txv(EEV) valves. I also don’t care about brands
If you don’t mind paying higher utility bills, no problem!
@@NewHVACGuide yep in the North there is almost no savings($3k over 15 years) that is large enough to offset the crazy install cost that contractors want(high end install).
Gotcha. Unfortunately in a few years, I’m afraid you probably won’t have a choice. Single stage systems are going to become a thing of the past
Now that ducted inverter mini split systems can heat a home in -22 degrees. I also think single stage systems time is about to expire.
a little savings in efficiency is negated when problems arise..wives really get verbose when ac don't work
The video title states "HVAC brands that suck," yet, you only mentioned one brand in your entire 12 minute video.
I'm getting my AC replaced in my Condo, the contractor wants to replace with a Ruud condenser paired with a First CO UCQB series air handler I can't find many reviews online about them but I see they are made in the USA, but only offers a 1 year warranty. Should I go with the first co?
@scottdawson9337 Firstco is Pure Junk.
I have a Goodmen been solid so far 5 years now.
From my Hvac tech parts for them are easy to come by if I ever need something
Personally, I like Comfort Maker, even though they sold out to Carrier many years ago. I'm a duct guy and not an HVAC tech, but I have HVAC techs working for me and we've been installing Comfort Maker since the early 1990's. I've never had a call back for something failing within the first year. They've been very reliable units. Likewise, I believe in Comfort Maker enough that it's all I've ever put in my homes, my family's homes, my friend's homes and customer's homes/businesses (unless the business is just adamant about another brand). That being said, it IS true that a lot of these systems share components like boards, motors and whatnot. So, like a Trane we recently worked on, the board in it needed to be replaced, and the part number was the exact same as a Goodman. The only difference between buying the board from Trane or from Goodman was the price.
Daikin is a brand I've had very bad experiences with. We do a lot of installs and repairs at a local AFB, and they were adamant about Daikin. However, in system after system, their coils kept failing and we were always changing out coils. Some of the Daikin units were even showing up with bad coils straight off the truck and we had to change them out before we ever installed them. We finally convinced the AFB to let us use a Comfort Maker in lieu of Daikin due to all the failing coils, and after seeing the reliability of Comfort Maker, they don't want Daikin units installed anymore. It's been over five years since we last installed a Daikin, so maybe they've got their quality control fixed and are no longer having the coil issues, but I'm in no hurry to find out.
Beyond that, can't say I'm a Lennox fan. Maybe it's just Lennox in our area, but they are an absolute pain in the ass to deal with. I have nothing bad to say about their units, but the company (here locally) is horrendous. I can't speak for other markets, maybe they're ok there? Don't know. I just know I avoid Lennox here locally because I don't need the headaches, and they've been this way here for over 25 years.
Trane: Great experiences, they're just pricey. Rheem and Ruud: NOT A FAN, especially when talking about their roof top units and package units. Goodman: Well, they've gotten much better, but I still wouldn't install one in my house. All things considered, I do believe some brands are better than others. However, I do have to agree that a majority of the problems are caused by the contractor that installs them. Shoddy workmanship will kill even the very best unit, and there's a LOT of shoddy HVAC companies to be had. Sadly, most homeowners don't know how to spot the difference between a good install and a bad one; all they know is Contractor A is this price, and Contractor B is that price.
Last thought: If you're buying a new home and you think the fact that it's been "inspected" means your system is installed properly, think again. We get a lot of calls from frustrated individuals with new homes asking us to come out and see if we can figure out what's wrong with their systems. OMG, I could write a book about the nightmare installs we've seen..... New home installs are by far and away some of the absolute worst we see.
bought place had no ducts lol built 1950. Basic blowing dirt floor air into condo. I terminated whole fn system. Went up draft no vents. No more dirt priceless
ALL TALK- NO INFO
You forgot about Lennox. Lennox should be compared to Trane/American Standard & Carrier/Bryant. Those are way above Daikin/Goodman for lots of reasons. I've been doing this for 30+ years and have had my own business for 15 years and I've always seen the worse product support with Goodman/Daikin. Alot of issues come from installation as much as anything.
Gotcha. I’ve talked to guys that feel the same way you do but I’ve talked to just as many that feel the opposite. Honestly, I’ve never been a fan of Lennox but to each their own. I tell homeowners to find a company that believes in what they’re installing and they will usually be okay
I would never buy a Lennox. Propriety parts are expensive and hard to get sometimes.
You can skip the first 10 minutes.
In my area there are a lot of York units.
Why don't I ever hear you mention them ?
I have a York working since 2007 and have had little problems although in the extreme weather of Canada .
@@mariec.2776 Glad to hear that, I just installed a York package unit.
So far it's good
I have had a Janitrol in since 1999. Only had to change the glow plug a few times.
The pressure switch just went. Only issues I have had. I know Goodman doesn't have the greatest reputation but it has worked for me.
Anyone ever install an Ox Box?