He was seen on Michigan sidelines with defensive coaches when opposing offenses were on the field, and with offensive coaches when opposing defenses were on the field.
@@KillasStayFly yes you can break codes during the game…but he was doing it weeks and months in advance. AND he was video recording them. How you know that it wasn’t just him is during games, when opponents call a play, the whole bench, players and coaches all look at the signs being given. They already knew…from the first play.
@@golfbuddy1969 You're basing this off the one video from early in the OSU game where everyone started signaling it was a pass play, which resulted in a TD. The thing is, OSU had already admitted to changing their signs prior to that game because they had a good idea Stalions was doing this. So did Stalions figure out their signs that quickly or did OSU lie about changing their signs?
@@boneclctr5 uh…there are tons of pictures of a guy making $50k a year speaking to coaches while plays are being called. You can justify it however you like, but videoing the sidelines of games, well in advance, is against the rules. Period. It is a breach of trust and is a competitive advantage. Furthermore, it is a complete disrespect to his own players, an admission that they can’t win without cheating.
@@golfbuddy1969 lol I wasn't justifying it. I didn't say it was ok. The example you used about the whole bench reacting was referring to the one video. That specific video shows nothing illegal especially given the fact OSU admits to changing their signs before that game. Find a different example.
@stephencjacks....I agree totally. How much of an advantage is absolutely IRRELEVANT. The fact is, IT IS CHEATING, period. And I'm so sick of people that say..."oh, everyone does it" . If that's the case, prove it. Michigan has just been proven to be absolute cheaters. No matter what they do this year, it will be FOREVER tainted. As far as I'm concerned, the past 2 wins against OSU are tainted as well. What I think is hilarious is that even after cheating, they still got DESTROYED by Georgia, and couldn't get past a TCU team that got hammered 65-7 by UGA
All coaches do it in game, not out of the confines of it. They simply turned down radios in helmets so they can try and gain an advantage by halftime. Nobody agreed upon video recording getting involved before you even saw your opponent
Plenty of smart people make what in hindsight look like dumb decisions when breaking the rules. Bring a 28 year old grad from Navy doesn’t change that. This isn’t some plant or crazy complicated thing. Not everything is as complex as the Watergate scandal.
I disagree that if Penn State and Ohio State changed their signals it would negate any advantage Michigan has. The fact that the team like Penn State and Ohio State - who have used the same signals all year - have to change them before big game is a huge disadvantage.
I like listening to Bruce he knows his stuff. Everyday after work I leave the office and listen to him on my way home, but for a guy that makes pretty good money can someone tell him to get a new pair of sneakers 😂
I agree that there will be some kind of punishment coming out of this. In my opinion, I think it's important to split two things, (a) sending a staff in person for scouting with digital equipmet and (b) stealing the sign during the game with the information acquired by (a). (a) is something that can be figured out through the investigation and it's pretty simple to check whether it happened or not (and seems like the chances are high that something happened). However, I think it's nearly impossible to prove (b) on whether Michigan used that information to steal the opponent's sign during the game or not. It could have been the case in reality but that's just a guess until it's proven to be true. Hence, if only (a) can be proven true and (b) will left as unknown, I think that a coaching staff suspension, fine, or restricting scholarship will be the most reasonable punishment and forfeiting games or banning from CFP would be an overkill but that's just my opinion.
Big Ten should step in an ban Michigan from all games from the rest of the year to limit damage. This is quickly getting out of hand and could damage the league if no action is taken immediately.
@@wwbdwwbdyou don’t understand business. This is EXACTLY what will set record viewership numbers especially for osu vs Michigan and if Michigan wins a title? Will be unheard of and you can’t even argue that it’s sign stealing because that all came out now not after the season
"Institutional corruption" No shot Harbaugh didn't know about this. Think about it. Some grad assistant spent $15k on buying tickets all by himself and no one knew? Puh leeze.
College football is a joke just thinking about how the SEC paid players all them years and nothing was done about it... now the world is on fire for sign-stealing it's just hilarious I don't think I can watch another game
Nick Saban had them boys hopping out a brand new Challengers... the funny thing is when Jimbo Fisher told him live TV you don't want to talk about paying players but it is what it is
@@SoSickRick precisely. Prime's context is all wrong. With that Cowboys team, of course you knew Smith was getting the ball, of course you knew Irvin was getting the ball, but you didn't know the exact play. His comments, IMO, are his braggadocios way of saying "we were SO good, we could tell you exactly what play we were running, and you still couldn't stop us." Yes. But you didn't *actually* do that, did you Prime?
Or he read the NCAA rule book and understood he was not committing any infraction. That's why he was so open about it. He didn't think he did anything wrong.
Also the involvement of so many people gives it a Rico feel to it. I have heard the argument that everybody does it, but not to this extent. Follow the money
What if this person implied he was a great scout but behind curtain was fact was getting data against the rules without team knowledge. Is that still a violation?
Gotta vet your staff better which Michigan hasn’t shown an aptitude for lately. They hired and fired Bo’s son this year after people found his social media and it was tons of racist rhetoric in plain sight. How they didn’t see that before hiring him? There’s no vetting going on behind the scenes.
You better believe ESPN is investigating if other schools are in person scouting. Coaches and fans would all be looking for opponents bad behavior. So far, crickets. If you read Stalions bio on what he does at Michigan it's hilarious. The fanciest way possible to say "I steal signs."
Connor Stalions wouldn't be on the field relaying info to the coordinators if he didn't make a difference. Give Michigan credit for getting it turned around after covid. It looked like OSU could have hung a hundred on them at the end of that season and poof, they became a different team moving forward.
The same thing we are seeing with USC is similar to Riley under Oklahoma. A finesse team and they struggle once they play a tougher team. He hasn’t changed his philosophy and is only going to get worse next year unless he changes. Great offensive caller but from these amateur eyes struggles to put a full team together
I think with all the sideline video evidence being uncovered, on top of the evidence reportedly uncovered from the Hard drive, I think we can pretty much rule out the theory that he was acting alone.
First, Michigan needs to immediately fire Harbaugh and his staff. Second, they need to self impose a post regular season ban. This would be the only possible good faith gestures that might keep the Big Ten and NCAA from sanctioning them into oblivion.
Coming from a PSU fan, two things can be true at once: 1. UM is really good. They've accumulated good talent and even without stealing signs, they probably win the B1G last year and this year. I'd love to say "we would've beaten them if they didn't cheat" but i think they're just a better team than us regardless. 2. Their cheating gave them an advantage. Yes Deion is correct that "you've still gotta stop them", but it absolutely gives an advantage. If you don't think it does, then ask why UM would go through the trouble in the first place. I don't understand the "we can fix this" mindset when discussing moving to an NFL model of headsets in the helmets. Why does it need fixing? If the argument is the headsets in the helmets make the game better, then ok, make that argument (I personally like CFB being unique with massive posterboard and players getting rhe play from signals but that's just me). But the answer to people cheating isn't to change the whole concept of the sport? When there's a speed limit of 35mph on a road and everyone does 50, we don't just go "oh well, can't stop them. Just change it to 60", we enforce the rule unless a good argument can be made for why it should be changed. The "people are cheating, let's take away their ability to do that by changing the entire sport" argument is so bizaree. Just enforce the rules that are on the books or make a legitimate argument on how changing the rules makes the game better
The question isn’t whether it gave them an advantage or not anyways. It is cheating, they knew it was cheating…and of course it gives them a competitive advantage! If not, they wouldn’t have cheated in the first place. Correct.
@@golfbuddy1969also…there have been lawyers comment that if the current knowledge stands true and this kid Stalions didn’t attend these games and some other person that’s not a UM staffer went to these games…the ncaa has no standing by the way they wrote the rule in 1994.
@@golfbuddy1969 You can steal signs without sending a scout. Even the expert unbiased college analysts have stated you can see all you need to see from All22 and other sources of video from the games. All big time programs have people watching the film and trying to break down signs. And also schools have admitted to changing their signs regularly because they know other teams are trying to figure their signs out. Another reason why sending anyone to scout doesn’t make sense. The schools don’t need to do that. It’s probably less labor intensive than studying hours of video from a few sources, but it’s all the same. Makes me wonder if this Stalions kid was just trying to take the easy way out by doing it this way. According to rule 11.6.1, it’s has to be a staff member, and as of now, Stalions was not the one attending these games. That’s where this gets into a real gray area. There are a lot of important unanswered questions that still need to be answered.
As a Michigan fan, I really appreciate the measured take. It's been a rough couple days on the internet. I think Michigan needs to be punished over this, although what level I think that should be at will depend a lot on what the story looks like when we actually know the facts rather than these constant leaks. That said, on the helmet thing, a lot of teams attempt to steal signs, do other teams have people in the stands of games reading signs? I don't know, maybe? I've heard that alleged by people who know football. I know the next team that does it/ is doing it won't be as hilariously easy to catch doing it as Michigan. It's probably easier to take away the opportunity to cheat than to hope you'll catch all the cheaters even if you did catch one (and it's possible we're the only program who was doing this, who knows?)
Deion Sanders comments are foolish. Knowing a team is going to run the ball is one thing. Knowing exactly where and what run is a world's different thing. Knowing a receiver is going to run a route is significantly different from knowing the exact route. You can certainly plan on all of that. Sure is odd Michigan lost to TCU a team they probably didn't cheat against, isn't it? Blaming the grad assistant who made $55k and spent $15k on tickets for all of this is what makes me totally dislike what is going on here. Michigan coaching staff 100% knew and funded this.
Wow, the denial here is thick. Stop kidding yourselves. You Michigan fans are gonna wake up one morning with all your awards and wins of the last 3 years erased from history. We got an entire season because some kids bought some tattoos with their own stuff. A whole season! Who knows. Good luck either way. See you in November!
Bruce just skipping over 99% of the NCAA’s shameful actions in the USC “investigation.” Well done…and I type that with a significant amount of sarcasm…
Ok, I’ll play. What exactly did he do? And while you’re attempting that illustrate how the University knew of any improprieties. Please provide facts and documentation to support your claims. Citations will suffice. I’ll save you time. You’ll find nothing. Zero. 😂😂😂😂
We knew they were guilty because of the circumstances of Michigan football after 2020 did not add up. You can quit, pretending they did. TCU hung half a hundred because they hadn’t scouted them.
They came back against TCU oh wait a minute they came back because they was cheating right... two interceptions in two times we didn't get in from the 1 yard line and lose by 6... you idiot act like it was 50 to 0
They hung 6 more points lol the defense held them to 37. The two pick sixs and the missed targeting call the 2 called back touchdowns and myriad of other bad calls and they only lost by 6. Stop the smooth brain takes
Dude I don’t think you realize how lil signs actually matter. Yes it’s a competitive advantage. Old school football tactics. They broke the rules and should be punished but this isn’t like knowing the playbook. Michigans good because they built a great team over those years. First two years, the focus was strictly on Ohio state. The second year maybe alil more thought on the bowl but not like this year. You can spin it how you want but Ohio state admitted they change signs for Michigan and still lost. And we will really see the rest of this season won’t we haha
@@mich9876543 Listen to your coaches who say it is the biggest advantage possible. Like playing poker and your opponent is told your cards. A couple of days ago you clowns said this was made up. Now that it is true, you have moved the goal posts.
I’ll just say this - IF what the WAPO reported is accurate the only deniability he can claim will fall solidly and neatly into the implausible category.
That’s a worthwhile point. People trying to contextualize this under “sign stealing” , as most understand that phrase, are soft peddling what this really is in a significant way.
@@zacharypaulus6028 but they definitely could. I think one reason this is such a drama for Michigan is they are number one or should be number one in the rankings and that is bringing on the heat with all the extra scrutiny. And what does the NCAA and BT do if they win the BT or NC. If they are out no one cares about this sign issue.
Every team has been doing it. Look no further than TCU win the college football championship series. I said in the 1st quarter they were stealing plays like they had the playbook.
20:01 can someone explain this to me? How can you win the national championship and then lose the national championship? Also neither one of them (OSU or Michigan) is 2-5 right?
It's all being done this way to try and slow down the football machine that is meeeechigan! And look at the people involved with espn and reporters connected to myer and slohio State! Get a life. Every team steals or tries to steal signs!
It's "Keystone cops" because for Harbaugh to go along with it, he probably REQUIRED Stalions to leave a paper-trail that would ONLY lead back to him! Don't buy tickets surreptitiously, because if they get caught, the questions immediately to do Harbaugh. But...by Harbaugh's thinking, per my theory...if the origin of the ticket purchases, etc was SO obviously Stalions, then that would presumably give Harbaugh plausible deniability. And since Stalions was a virtually NOBODY, but wanted to climb into Harbaugh's good graces, he was like "Sure, no problem.". Hence why he's been suspended WITH PAY, versus just being fired outright. Either way, this thing still smells fishy. And I"m not inclined to believe Harbaugh didn't know about it. Not by a long shot.
As a michigan fan i think we stole signs. I also don't care because it's legal to steal signs just not "how we did it". If its a simple fix of the headsets then do that but to claim that because of the signs is why we smoked penn state and ohio state you didnt watch those games. It was because on the field those kids played their heart out. I didnt care when OSU kids got tattoos or SEC/Big 10/Pac12 schools got caught paying their players, because those were good for the kids and the NCAA has wacky rules sometimes. This is one of those wacky ones: "Stealing is okay but how you do it isn't" is just wild
Michigan should have any/all wins vacated for this year and banned from CFP/Bowl considerations. Harbaugh knew where this info was coming from and willingly used it.
It's so frustrating listening to these national media types dance around the issue. Big Ten coaches are going to pissed. It's not comparable to shady recruiting which, yes, everyone does. This is thumb-on-the-scale dishonesty. Opposing coaches are fired for losing games like they have been to Michigan. Jobs are lost. Opposing players look bad on film. Powerful universities are not going to stick their head in the sand. And Michigan flagrantly, obviously, repeatedly broke the rule on filming. A Michigan coach (we see him on the sideline during games), who brags about code-breaking (he's not a TE coach), bought tickets to 20+ games (with his own CC), and had his minions film the opposing sidelines (not the playing field). Then they undoubtedly watched the tape, cracked the codes and used it in the first quarter of the game when they played these teams. This isn't about "advanced scouting". Michigan apologists and some National Media types are misdirecting. It's about video taping opposing sidelines signals. All these games should be vacated. Michigan loses bowl eligibility for this year and 2 more years. Gavel hit. Next case.
First of all, if it wasn't helping them win, then why were they doing it. Funny, they were losing, and then they started cheating, and miraculously, they were winning alot it was night and day! I'm sorry there must be serious consequences for this level of unfair cheating. This is definitely bad!
I’m not going to be shocked when it comes out that they were doing this before the last two years. Harbaugh was on the hot seat before the last two seasons. He did this to save his job. The idea that Stalions is smart? Hilarious. He stole signs? Wow, that’s NOT impressive. Seriously there’s no way he’s not in the cryptography department if he’s that good. Clearly he’s not that intelligent.
"CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE, LORD GOD, Please forgive me for any lust, gluttony, greed, sloth, wrath, envy, and pride I have had, and I thank you for everything! Amen" 🙏🙏🙏🙏 Please pray these words now, pray them as you read them if you cannot look and remember them 🙏😊
Notince the frantic spin work ESPN is now engaged in...lots of articles deflecting, dismissing or minimizing the impact of the cheating. Because Michigan is a major ESPN TV product. And getting them into the playoffs is a BIG payday.
@@stiggiestigwood3310 So you're on hold, waiting for the 'conference call' to start. Jokes aside......the Big 10 knows who butters its bread. And bread slathered in gobs of butter is all this is about. ESPN doesn't need to tell them what it expects from its food bank clients.
Good ending. Both Michigan fans and Ohio State fans would agree with that. You can lose all of your games except one, the rivalry game. If you win that one, = a winning season, and you are happy. Better that, than win all of your games except that one = losing season, and you are mad and sad. They hate each other that much, while also respecting and admiring each other. No rivalry in ALL OF SPORTS comes close to the Michigan vs Ohio State football rivalry. That is why the call it "THE GAME".
Michigan is a huge draw on a expanded conference next year. Networks paid a massive price to show these big matchups. They want Michigan in there. Sorry..but its a business now. Kansas basketball scandal took SIX years to conclude. They're a marquee name as well. NCAA works SLOW. Michigan WILL get dinged...just not right now.
The only reason some big ten team are upset is that Michigan is out performing their respective programs, with that said NIL is a bigger problem the the NCAA should be paying Attention to, not a coach who is afraid of Michigan (Ryan Day) who is scheduled to play. What a wuss! Just as they pointed out change the signals and stop letting yourself be pushed around on the field! Oh that right, you can’t because your team is soft and Harbaugh and his staff are better at coaching!
Nope. But I do think the degree to which the cheating figured in Michigan’s success is a legit concern. Certainly that’s not possible to quantify and anyone who thinks they can do is being ridiculous. It would just be way cooler all the ‘round if they hadn’t felt the need
The coaches that are saying that this is not giving UofM a competitive advantage are saying that because they are stealing signs because it is giving them an advantage and they don't want headsets in the helmets which will take their advantage away. I coached youth football and knowing what the other team was fixing to run on offense or defense would be a huge advantage. It is complete nonsense to say that it doesn't give them an advantage. Before Stalions got on staff in three years they lost 11 games, after they have only lost three. They are video and photos of him standing next to the DC when they were on defense and next to OC when they have the ball. Harbaugh was getting skull dragged by OSU for multiple seasons and with the same deficit of talent beats OSU at home and then routs them at the Shoe. Walks like a duck and quacks like a duck. They knew they were cheating and did it anyway. Examine what has happened to programs that broke the rules and didn't really get a competitive advantage but got the hammer dropped on them. This was deliberately cheating to get an advantage. This is sadly going to be punishment to players on the roster who were not there when the rules were broken but paying for it like they did. This is going to end badly.
Everyone bitches and complain about Michigan’s “soft” schedule and that they don’t really play anyone and now people think that Michigan is winning because of this sign stealing, completely discounting the progress this team has made over the past few years. The success is because of sign stealing. This team is very good, they have dealt with losses and have worked hard. I hope the NCAA doesn’t turn this into overkill. I am sure that Michigan has not gotten to where they are today because of sign stealing. Some coaches can admit defeat while others will look for an excuse. Its frustrating to see this Whole situation. Sorry for the players, and the fans. I try to live my life taking the moral high road, even if it’s uncomfortable. That’s something that is dying out. Many people don’t even understand why it is important for society. I’m about done with sports, the gambling, money money money, the love of which is the ROOT OF ALL BADNESS.
3 years with under ten wins. He has added a few more wins in the past couple of years; MSU, OSU. He has also added higher caliber players and had finally re-established Michigan culture. This mis-step is extremely unfortunate and I don’t think they benefited from sign stealing. Don’t forget that every team has both players and coaches that can read offense and defense formations. Also, if you’re older that 30yrs you may remember UM as extremely dominant in the Big 10. It has been a long, painful drought.
5:32 but he’s so stupid he forgot that the team he was playing against doesn’t know when Irving is getting the ball… when Smith is getting it… when it was a run action to throw to Irving…. Deion might have CTE with that level of critical thinking
She never said that. She reported what was said. And honestly THAT IS THE QUESTION. Not every school has the same finances. In the NFL they are run by billionaires.
Nonsense. A guy got half a game for this, it’s seen as a minimal competitive advantage at best, stripping a title over that if we win one? Lol. Wait til you find out what everyone else does and if someone committed a felony accessing our computers.
@@SoSickRick prove no one isn’t sending anyone to film other games? That’s the game we’re playing here…accusing others of wrong doing before the “investigation” is even complete. Complete opposite of our standard here in the U.S…”innocent until proven guilty”.
@@SoSickRick no it’s really not much of an advantage to do this vs using public broadcasts and you’re ignoring statement after on record statement by prominent college coaches.
They’re assuming everyone is smart and would never leave a trace. People don’t think they’re going to get caught so it’s totally believable that he was this stupid.
@hotdangers It is also a well-known fact that OSU changed their signs before the game last year in the shoe. 45-23 was the result of Michigan not knowing their signs. The stupidity of ESPN showing the Michigan coaches in the Ohio State game last year along the sidelines was so special ed like. That play went for a touchdown for OSU. Yeah, that helped Michigan knowing that sign. What a bunch of Crying Ryan babies.
@@hotdangers wonder if Ohio State will be under investigation because of Brent Zdebski. That is also rumored of him doing the same as Connor. Could get interesting then after OSU find the ones for Georgia, Alabama and all the other 131 teams.
@hotdangers if you had another team's signs, and they changed their signs before the game. Do you still have that advantage? C'mon, genius, let's hear it. Keep it organized and not sloppy now.
He was seen on Michigan sidelines with defensive coaches when opposing offenses were on the field, and with offensive coaches when opposing defenses were on the field.
He was the code breaker of course he was on the sidelines. The problem is how he was doing it.
@@KillasStayFly yes you can break codes during the game…but he was doing it weeks and months in advance. AND he was video recording them. How you know that it wasn’t just him is during games, when opponents call a play, the whole bench, players and coaches all look at the signs being given. They already knew…from the first play.
@@golfbuddy1969 You're basing this off the one video from early in the OSU game where everyone started signaling it was a pass play, which resulted in a TD. The thing is, OSU had already admitted to changing their signs prior to that game because they had a good idea Stalions was doing this. So did Stalions figure out their signs that quickly or did OSU lie about changing their signs?
@@boneclctr5 uh…there are tons of pictures of a guy making $50k a year speaking to coaches while plays are being called. You can justify it however you like, but videoing the sidelines of games, well in advance, is against the rules. Period. It is a breach of trust and is a competitive advantage. Furthermore, it is a complete disrespect to his own players, an admission that they can’t win without cheating.
@@golfbuddy1969 lol I wasn't justifying it. I didn't say it was ok. The example you used about the whole bench reacting was referring to the one video. That specific video shows nothing illegal especially given the fact OSU admits to changing their signs before that game. Find a different example.
You know who thinks it's an advantage? Clearly Michigan or they wouldn't do it.
All coaches do it or it would have been changed 2 years ago when they tried to overturn it internally
@stephencjacks....I agree totally. How much of an advantage is absolutely IRRELEVANT. The fact is, IT IS CHEATING, period. And I'm so sick of people that say..."oh, everyone does it" . If that's the case, prove it. Michigan has just been proven to be absolute cheaters. No matter what they do this year, it will be FOREVER tainted. As far as I'm concerned, the past 2 wins against OSU are tainted as well. What I think is hilarious is that even after cheating, they still got DESTROYED by Georgia, and couldn't get past a TCU team that got hammered 65-7 by UGA
All coaches do it in game, not out of the confines of it. They simply turned down radios in helmets so they can try and gain an advantage by halftime. Nobody agreed upon video recording getting involved before you even saw your opponent
All schools have used it. Even urban Meyer admitted to stealing Michigan’s signs. 🤷🏼♂️
@@101stairassault5no team is sending scouts to opposing games of upcoming opponents
Somewhere Bill Belichick is smiling
@@hotdangers no but we have evidence of cheating and spying lol
Best guest, period!
Plenty of smart people make what in hindsight look like dumb decisions when breaking the rules. Bring a 28 year old grad from Navy doesn’t change that. This isn’t some plant or crazy complicated thing. Not everything is as complex as the Watergate scandal.
Learned something new, never had the idea, to connect 'being military' with 'brightness'.
Strange new concept!
Oh, and Harbough is gone. Next season for sure. Fired or leaves first, you pick
You hope
Jimmy H. might be scouting for a nice mansion around LA within driving distance of SoFi stadium and the Chargers complex.
13 of 14 big ten schools are not happy about this. It's pretty clear everyone on the Michigan staff knew about this.
Schuster and Eisen running interference for Michigan.
I disagree that if Penn State and Ohio State changed their signals it would negate any advantage Michigan has. The fact that the team like Penn State and Ohio State - who have used the same signals all year - have to change them before big game is a huge disadvantage.
There’s no question about that.
I like listening to Bruce he knows his stuff. Everyday after work I leave the office and listen to him on my way home, but for a guy that makes pretty good money can someone tell him to get a new pair of sneakers 😂
I agree that there will be some kind of punishment coming out of this.
In my opinion, I think it's important to split two things, (a) sending a staff in person for scouting with digital equipmet and (b) stealing the sign during the game with the information acquired by (a).
(a) is something that can be figured out through the investigation and it's pretty simple to check whether it happened or not (and seems like the chances are high that something happened).
However, I think it's nearly impossible to prove (b) on whether Michigan used that information to steal the opponent's sign during the game or not. It could have been the case in reality but that's just a guess until it's proven to be true.
Hence, if only (a) can be proven true and (b) will left as unknown, I think that a coaching staff suspension, fine, or restricting scholarship will be the most reasonable punishment and forfeiting games or banning from CFP would be an overkill but that's just my opinion.
Big Ten should step in an ban Michigan from all games from the rest of the year to limit damage. This is quickly getting out of hand and could damage the league if no action is taken immediately.
@@wwbdwwbdits not going to damage the league lol people still watch the games
@@wwbdwwbd Bro, I think that's overreacting and is an overkill.
@@wwbdwwbdyou don’t understand business. This is EXACTLY what will set record viewership numbers especially for osu vs Michigan and if Michigan wins a title? Will be unheard of and you can’t even argue that it’s sign stealing because that all came out now not after the season
"Institutional corruption" No shot Harbaugh didn't know about this. Think about it. Some grad assistant spent $15k on buying tickets all by himself and no one knew? Puh leeze.
College football is a joke just thinking about how the SEC paid players all them years and nothing was done about it... now the world is on fire for sign-stealing it's just hilarious I don't think I can watch another game
Buh-bye.
@@armandopena2906 ✌😅🤣😂
Damn. This is crazy. The SEC teams don't even go this far and they made up the term, "If you aint cheatin, you aint tryin"
Nick Saban had them boys hopping out a brand new Challengers... the funny thing is when Jimbo Fisher told him live TV you don't want to talk about paying players but it is what it is
Your team cheated and got caught. Ha Ha😂 Deal with it!
It appears that the UM community doesn’t dispute the allegations, but, how the info was obtained.
U mean they don’t like the way they got busted. Or it should be flakey jake okay to cheat this way
I call bs on Coach Prime. Huge difference if you know they’re passing or running. Also if you know their blitzing or in a zone or man defense.
Coach Prime is a moron, that is reality.
No he's spot on...
@@MooseGoBluehe stupidly wrong. Imagine knowing a team is running a play action pass and you don’t key on the run at all….
@@SoSickRick precisely. Prime's context is all wrong. With that Cowboys team, of course you knew Smith was getting the ball, of course you knew Irvin was getting the ball, but you didn't know the exact play. His comments, IMO, are his braggadocios way of saying "we were SO good, we could tell you exactly what play we were running, and you still couldn't stop us." Yes. But you didn't *actually* do that, did you Prime?
Yup.
Plain and simple: he didn't think he would get caught and he didn't think like a criminal does.
Or he read the NCAA rule book and understood he was not committing any infraction. That's why he was so open about it. He didn't think he did anything wrong.
Also the involvement of so many people gives it a Rico feel to it. I have heard the argument that everybody does it, but not to this extent. Follow the money
What if this person implied he was a great scout but behind curtain was fact was getting data against the rules without team knowledge. Is that still a violation?
Gotta vet your staff better which Michigan hasn’t shown an aptitude for lately. They hired and fired Bo’s son this year after people found his social media and it was tons of racist rhetoric in plain sight. How they didn’t see that before hiring him? There’s no vetting going on behind the scenes.
Info was disseminated to coaches…don’t know which ones
You better believe ESPN is investigating if other schools are in person scouting. Coaches and fans would all be looking for opponents bad behavior. So far, crickets. If you read Stalions bio on what he does at Michigan it's hilarious. The fanciest way possible to say "I steal signs."
Michigan should forfeit all the games where they have done this.
You should forfeit your moms dirty undies 😂😂
That would be 75% of all teams 😂😂😂
Connor Stalions wouldn't be on the field relaying info to the coordinators if he didn't make a difference. Give Michigan credit for getting it turned around after covid. It looked like OSU could have hung a hundred on them at the end of that season and poof, they became a different team moving forward.
Didn't mention the footage of Stallions standing beside coordinators and Harbaugh on sidelines in game
with huge laminated card of OSU's signal that would had to have been made pre game.
@@andrewmueller9986 Arrogant? Stupid? Little bit of both?
Sign stealing is legal in game dopey...
Ohio state changed their signs before the Michigan game.
@@MooseGoBlue It's only gonna get worse, MMM. Keep your rationales sharp.
The same thing we are seeing with USC is similar to Riley under Oklahoma. A finesse team and they struggle once they play a tougher team. He hasn’t changed his philosophy and is only going to get worse next year unless he changes. Great offensive caller but from these amateur eyes struggles to put a full team together
I think with all the sideline video evidence being uncovered, on top of the evidence reportedly uncovered from the Hard drive, I think we can pretty much rule out the theory that he was acting alone.
If Michigan's data was obtained illegally the obtainers are going to be in some serious legal trouble!
Sideline evidence lol
First, Michigan needs to immediately fire Harbaugh and his staff. Second, they need to self impose a post regular season ban. This would be the only possible good faith gestures that might keep the Big Ten and NCAA from sanctioning them into oblivion.
Coming from a PSU fan, two things can be true at once:
1. UM is really good. They've accumulated good talent and even without stealing signs, they probably win the B1G last year and this year. I'd love to say "we would've beaten them if they didn't cheat" but i think they're just a better team than us regardless.
2. Their cheating gave them an advantage. Yes Deion is correct that "you've still gotta stop them", but it absolutely gives an advantage. If you don't think it does, then ask why UM would go through the trouble in the first place.
I don't understand the "we can fix this" mindset when discussing moving to an NFL model of headsets in the helmets. Why does it need fixing? If the argument is the headsets in the helmets make the game better, then ok, make that argument (I personally like CFB being unique with massive posterboard and players getting rhe play from signals but that's just me). But the answer to people cheating isn't to change the whole concept of the sport? When there's a speed limit of 35mph on a road and everyone does 50, we don't just go "oh well, can't stop them. Just change it to 60", we enforce the rule unless a good argument can be made for why it should be changed. The "people are cheating, let's take away their ability to do that by changing the entire sport" argument is so bizaree. Just enforce the rules that are on the books or make a legitimate argument on how changing the rules makes the game better
The question isn’t whether it gave them an advantage or not anyways. It is cheating, they knew it was cheating…and of course it gives them a competitive advantage! If not, they wouldn’t have cheated in the first place. Correct.
@@golfbuddy1969also…there have been lawyers comment that if the current knowledge stands true and this kid Stalions didn’t attend these games and some other person that’s not a UM staffer went to these games…the ncaa has no standing by the way they wrote the rule in 1994.
@@golfbuddy1969 You can steal signs without sending a scout. Even the expert unbiased college analysts have stated you can see all you need to see from All22 and other sources of video from the games. All big time programs have people watching the film and trying to break down signs.
And also schools have admitted to changing their signs regularly because they know other teams are trying to figure their signs out.
Another reason why sending anyone to scout doesn’t make sense. The schools don’t need to do that. It’s probably less labor intensive than studying hours of video from a few sources, but it’s all the same.
Makes me wonder if this Stalions kid was just trying to take the easy way out by doing it this way.
According to rule 11.6.1, it’s has to be a staff member, and as of now, Stalions was not the one attending these games. That’s where this gets into a real gray area.
There are a lot of important unanswered questions that still need to be answered.
I like Deion but his take really makes no sense.
As a Michigan fan, I really appreciate the measured take. It's been a rough couple days on the internet. I think Michigan needs to be punished over this, although what level I think that should be at will depend a lot on what the story looks like when we actually know the facts rather than these constant leaks.
That said, on the helmet thing, a lot of teams attempt to steal signs, do other teams have people in the stands of games reading signs? I don't know, maybe? I've heard that alleged by people who know football. I know the next team that does it/ is doing it won't be as hilariously easy to catch doing it as Michigan. It's probably easier to take away the opportunity to cheat than to hope you'll catch all the cheaters even if you did catch one (and it's possible we're the only program who was doing this, who knows?)
It’s as bad as 2017 Astros
What happens if UM finds out it was an insider that turned rat. One of the own might be trying to make things right.
Deion Sanders comments are foolish. Knowing a team is going to run the ball is one thing. Knowing exactly where and what run is a world's different thing. Knowing a receiver is going to run a route is significantly different from knowing the exact route. You can certainly plan on all of that. Sure is odd Michigan lost to TCU a team they probably didn't cheat against, isn't it?
Blaming the grad assistant who made $55k and spent $15k on tickets for all of this is what makes me totally dislike what is going on here. Michigan coaching staff 100% knew and funded this.
Someone should have followed up with Deion “why does your OC call play action passes?”
Wow, the denial here is thick. Stop kidding yourselves. You Michigan fans are gonna wake up one morning with all your awards and wins of the last 3 years erased from history. We got an entire season because some kids bought some tattoos with their own stuff. A whole season! Who knows. Good luck either way. See you in November!
🍼🍼🍼😭😭😭
Seriously go touch grass!
🤣
Follow the money. No low level staffer could afford tickets to that many games without backing. Then there's the list that was discovered.
Bruce just skipping over 99% of the NCAA’s shameful actions in the USC “investigation.” Well done…and I type that with a significant amount of sarcasm…
ncaa witch hunt
You probably think what Reggie Bush did would be legal now huh? 😂
Ok, I’ll play. What exactly did he do? And while you’re attempting that illustrate how the University knew of any improprieties. Please provide facts and documentation to support your claims. Citations will suffice.
I’ll save you time. You’ll find nothing. Zero. 😂😂😂😂
@@SoSickRick what Reggie's stepdad did. Reggie did nothing wrong.
We knew they were guilty because of the circumstances of Michigan football after 2020 did not add up. You can quit, pretending they did. TCU hung half a hundred because they hadn’t scouted them.
They came back against TCU oh wait a minute they came back because they was cheating right... two interceptions in two times we didn't get in from the 1 yard line and lose by 6... you idiot act like it was 50 to 0
They hung 6 more points lol the defense held them to 37. The two pick sixs and the missed targeting call the 2 called back touchdowns and myriad of other bad calls and they only lost by 6. Stop the smooth brain takes
@@ImBackItsDad they hate Michigan so much they'll just say anything it's hilarious but don't nobody want to play us tho cowards
Dude I don’t think you realize how lil signs actually matter. Yes it’s a competitive advantage. Old school football tactics. They broke the rules and should be punished but this isn’t like knowing the playbook. Michigans good because they built a great team over those years. First two years, the focus was strictly on Ohio state. The second year maybe alil more thought on the bowl but not like this year. You can spin it how you want but Ohio state admitted they change signs for Michigan and still lost. And we will really see the rest of this season won’t we haha
@@mich9876543 Listen to your coaches who say it is the biggest advantage possible. Like playing poker and your opponent is told your cards. A couple of days ago you clowns said this was made up. Now that it is true, you have moved the goal posts.
9:01 was he connected to harbaugh lol, he’s beside him and both coordinators on the sideline, so you tell me
Michigan football had budgeted for this whole operation.
Until you actually know that you’re speculating. Which is no better than a high school girls locker room spreading rumors.
@@101stairassault5 Read the WAPo article, it discusses their budget.
You must be a Michigan fan hiding under a rock! Do your homework work girl.
@@101stairassault5 Sorry, it is a fact.
Yeah, you really know that 🙄
You know how I know harbough knew? He knew enough that he had perfect plausible deniability. He knew just enough to stop asking, cuz he knew
You hope he knew
@@cangle37 why?
I’ll just say this - IF what the WAPO reported is accurate the only deniability he can claim will fall solidly and neatly into the implausible category.
Better see what the professionals in the comments have to say
Change the headlines from "sign stealing" to "advanced in-game scouting"
That’s a worthwhile point. People trying to contextualize this under “sign stealing” , as most understand that phrase, are soft peddling what this really is in a significant way.
Need Penn State and Ohio State to beat Michigan then all will be well.
But they won’t lol.
@@zacharypaulus6028 but they definitely could. I think one reason this is such a drama for Michigan is they are number one or should be number one in the rankings and that is bringing on the heat with all the extra scrutiny. And what does the NCAA and BT do if they win the BT or NC. If they are out no one cares about this sign issue.
Every team has been doing it. Look no further than TCU win the college football championship series. I said in the 1st quarter they were stealing plays like they had the playbook.
Love ya Rich...keep your annoying Karen away from the mic...
Did these idiots just say if you are going to cheat, cheat better. These people are so bias.
I think that was missed by many.....not by me....
You mean biasED
He's on the sidelines in coach ears cheating is cheating where hell is you're morals
20:01 can someone explain this to me? How can you win the national championship and then lose the national championship? Also neither one of them (OSU or Michigan) is 2-5 right?
If NCAA would vacate the natty win
It's all being done this way to try and slow down the football machine that is meeeechigan! And look at the people involved with espn and reporters connected to myer and slohio State! Get a life. Every team steals or tries to steal signs!
Lmao delusional much? Take your medicine, and sit down!;)
🙉🙈🛑
It's "Keystone cops" because for Harbaugh to go along with it, he probably REQUIRED Stalions to leave a paper-trail that would ONLY lead back to him! Don't buy tickets surreptitiously, because if they get caught, the questions immediately to do Harbaugh. But...by Harbaugh's thinking, per my theory...if the origin of the ticket purchases, etc was SO obviously Stalions, then that would presumably give Harbaugh plausible deniability. And since Stalions was a virtually NOBODY, but wanted to climb into Harbaugh's good graces, he was like "Sure, no problem.". Hence why he's been suspended WITH PAY, versus just being fired outright.
Either way, this thing still smells fishy. And I"m not inclined to believe Harbaugh didn't know about it. Not by a long shot.
As a michigan fan i think we stole signs. I also don't care because it's legal to steal signs just not "how we did it". If its a simple fix of the headsets then do that but to claim that because of the signs is why we smoked penn state and ohio state you didnt watch those games. It was because on the field those kids played their heart out. I didnt care when OSU kids got tattoos or SEC/Big 10/Pac12 schools got caught paying their players, because those were good for the kids and the NCAA has wacky rules sometimes. This is one of those wacky ones: "Stealing is okay but how you do it isn't" is just wild
Very few folks adopted that laissez-faire a stance with the tats for their own effing trinkets “scandal” at OSU. Like a bunch of jackals, honestly.
Michigan should have any/all wins vacated for this year and banned from CFP/Bowl considerations. Harbaugh knew where this info was coming from and willingly used it.
That's the point. They dominated everyone in part as a result of competitive advantage.
relative morality is now ok b/c it's Michigan? Puhleeeeeze.
Well said!
Oh we’ve been on the wrong side of that for twenty years, so yeah, you can get f’d
It's so frustrating listening to these national media types dance around the issue.
Big Ten coaches are going to pissed. It's not comparable to shady recruiting which, yes, everyone does. This is thumb-on-the-scale dishonesty.
Opposing coaches are fired for losing games like they have been to Michigan. Jobs are lost. Opposing players look bad on film. Powerful universities are not going to stick their head in the sand.
And Michigan flagrantly, obviously, repeatedly broke the rule on filming. A Michigan coach (we see him on the sideline during games), who brags about code-breaking (he's not a TE coach), bought tickets to 20+ games (with his own CC), and had his minions film the opposing sidelines (not the playing field). Then they undoubtedly watched the tape, cracked the codes and used it in the first quarter of the game when they played these teams.
This isn't about "advanced scouting". Michigan apologists and some National Media types are misdirecting. It's about video taping opposing sidelines signals.
All these games should be vacated. Michigan loses bowl eligibility for this year and 2 more years. Gavel hit. Next case.
You’re a tough judge, not an unreasonable one. Cogent lucid take. Some of these clowns on TV could benefit from reading it.
First of all, if it wasn't helping them win, then why were they doing it. Funny, they were losing, and then they started cheating, and miraculously, they were winning alot it was night and day! I'm sorry there must be serious consequences for this level of unfair cheating. This is definitely bad!
He left behind a whole hot mess of NCAA championships.... Gtfohwtbs....
VENDETTAGATE doesn’t make us play any less. Look out ,now we’re mad. Speculation makes you look bad Bruce.
🛑🤡
I’m not going to be shocked when it comes out that they were doing this before the last two years.
Harbaugh was on the hot seat before the last two seasons. He did this to save his job.
The idea that Stalions is smart? Hilarious. He stole signs? Wow, that’s NOT impressive. Seriously there’s no way he’s not in the cryptography department if he’s that good. Clearly he’s not that intelligent.
"CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE, LORD GOD,
Please forgive me for any lust, gluttony, greed, sloth, wrath, envy, and pride I have had, and I thank you for everything! Amen"
🙏🙏🙏🙏
Please pray these words now, pray them as you read them if you cannot look and remember them 🙏😊
From what I read, I would hope that you are appalled by the actions of the football program.
Notince the frantic spin work ESPN is now engaged in...lots of articles deflecting, dismissing or minimizing the impact of the cheating.
Because Michigan is a major ESPN TV product.
And getting them into the playoffs is a BIG payday.
Conference will make the call.
@@stiggiestigwood3310 So you're on hold, waiting for the 'conference call' to start.
Jokes aside......the Big 10 knows who butters its bread. And bread slathered in gobs of butter is all this is about.
ESPN doesn't need to tell them what it expects from its food bank clients.
Good ending. Both Michigan fans and Ohio State fans would agree with that. You can lose all of your games except one, the rivalry game. If you win that one, = a winning season, and you are happy. Better that, than win all of your games except that one = losing season, and you are mad and sad. They hate each other that much, while also respecting and admiring each other. No rivalry in ALL OF SPORTS comes close to the Michigan vs Ohio State football rivalry. That is why the call it "THE GAME".
Michigan would pretend they have two rivalry games. OSU has ONE.
It’s honestly not a good game. It’s not competitive.
Michigan is a huge draw on a expanded conference next year. Networks paid a massive price to show these big matchups. They want Michigan in there. Sorry..but its a business now. Kansas basketball scandal took SIX years to conclude. They're a marquee name as well. NCAA works SLOW. Michigan WILL get dinged...just not right now.
The only reason some big ten team are upset is that Michigan is out performing their respective programs, with that said NIL is a bigger problem the the NCAA should be paying Attention to, not a coach who is afraid of Michigan (Ryan Day) who is scheduled to play. What a wuss! Just as they pointed out change the signals and stop letting yourself be pushed around on the field! Oh that right, you can’t because your team is soft and Harbaugh and his staff are better at coaching!
Nope. But I do think the degree to which the cheating figured in Michigan’s success is a legit concern. Certainly that’s not possible to quantify and anyone who thinks they can do is being ridiculous. It would just be way cooler all the ‘round if they hadn’t felt the need
The coaches that are saying that this is not giving UofM a competitive advantage are saying that because they are stealing signs because it is giving them an advantage and they don't want headsets in the helmets which will take their advantage away. I coached youth football and knowing what the other team was fixing to run on offense or defense would be a huge advantage. It is complete nonsense to say that it doesn't give them an advantage. Before Stalions got on staff in three years they lost 11 games, after they have only lost three. They are video and photos of him standing next to the DC when they were on defense and next to OC when they have the ball. Harbaugh was getting skull dragged by OSU for multiple seasons and with the same deficit of talent beats OSU at home and then routs them at the Shoe. Walks like a duck and quacks like a duck. They knew they were cheating and did it anyway. Examine what has happened to programs that broke the rules and didn't really get a competitive advantage but got the hammer dropped on them. This was deliberately cheating to get an advantage. This is sadly going to be punishment to players on the roster who were not there when the rules were broken but paying for it like they did. This is going to end badly.
True, but this year will be very telling with everything locked down tight. Do they still win out v. OSU. We’ll see.
Everyone bitches and complain about Michigan’s “soft” schedule and that they don’t really play anyone and now people think that Michigan is winning because of this sign stealing, completely discounting the progress this team has made over the past few years. The success is because of sign stealing.
This team is very good, they have dealt with losses and have worked hard. I hope the NCAA doesn’t turn this into overkill. I am sure that Michigan has not gotten to where they are today because of sign stealing. Some coaches can admit defeat while others will look for an excuse.
Its frustrating to see this Whole situation. Sorry for the players, and the fans. I try to live my life taking the moral high road, even if it’s uncomfortable. That’s something that is dying out. Many people don’t even understand why it is important for society.
I’m about done with sports, the gambling, money money money, the love of which is the ROOT OF ALL BADNESS.
Well no go look at Jim’s W/L record before and after the timeline of events
3 years with under ten wins. He has added a few more wins in the past couple of years; MSU, OSU.
He has also added higher caliber players and had finally re-established Michigan culture. This mis-step is extremely unfortunate and I don’t think they benefited from sign stealing. Don’t forget that every team has both players and coaches that can read offense and defense formations. Also, if you’re older that 30yrs you may remember UM as extremely dominant in the Big 10. It has been a long, painful drought.
Please god Jim Harbaugh save my Chargers, and my boy, Justin Herbert. FREE US
Connor will probably surface in a non extradition country, like Argentina .. or after statutes of limitations runs out.
Is this a propaganda show for Michigan?
Why would they bother playing the ninnows they have. I'm not saying it didn't happen, it's seems so weak
I knew it was all too good to be true. Way to go, Jim.😢
49-0 too?
Michigan didn't trust the talent they had to win on their own skills that's a bigger issue imo
The word anonymous tipster definition is : Lier !!!
Feldman. Always pretending to be reluctant to judge, but he ain't. He loves to judge. And his whining weasely delivery is just so sanctimonious.
5:32 but he’s so stupid he forgot that the team he was playing against doesn’t know when Irving is getting the ball… when Smith is getting it… when it was a run action to throw to Irving…. Deion might have CTE with that level of critical thinking
This is a billion dollar business and Suzy says they can’t go to the helmet signals because of money? She can’t really be that clueless, can she?
She never said that. She reported what was said.
And honestly THAT IS THE QUESTION. Not every school has the same finances. In the NFL they are run by billionaires.
Right, Don't the sideline coaches already talk to the coaches in the press box? It's ridiculous. There is plenty of money.
Of course Connor used his own credit card, I'm sure he was encouraged that he use his own credit card.
Nonsense. A guy got half a game for this, it’s seen as a minimal competitive advantage at best, stripping a title over that if we win one? Lol.
Wait til you find out what everyone else does and if someone committed a felony accessing our computers.
No one else is sending people to record sidelines…
It’s also a huge advantage to know exactly what play is coming… it’s Astros 2017 bad
@@SoSickRick prove no one isn’t sending anyone to film other games? That’s the game we’re playing here…accusing others of wrong doing before the “investigation” is even complete. Complete opposite of our standard here in the U.S…”innocent until proven guilty”.
@@SoSickRick no it’s really not much of an advantage to do this vs using public broadcasts and you’re ignoring statement after on record statement by prominent college coaches.
Everything was intentional. He found a loophole and exploited it. Thats why he didnt bother covering up. Thata why it doesnt add up. Lmao.
Cope
They’re assuming everyone is smart and would never leave a trace. People don’t think they’re going to get caught so it’s totally believable that he was this stupid.
Michigan is not winning 🏆 the national championship this year. Go Dawgs!😂
😮
Bruce is not the one to listen to on this. He knows not much on sign steeling or he is just not being open . bad content.
Poverty program not suprised what so ever TTUN had to do this smh
You are desperate for this to be something it's not
So let's get this straight, you can steal in college sports, but you've got to steal in a fair way.
@hotdangers It is also a well-known fact that OSU changed their signs before the game last year in the shoe. 45-23 was the result of Michigan not knowing their signs. The stupidity of ESPN showing the Michigan coaches in the Ohio State game last year along the sidelines was so special ed like. That play went for a touchdown for OSU. Yeah, that helped Michigan knowing that sign. What a bunch of Crying Ryan babies.
@@hotdangers wonder if Ohio State will be under investigation because of Brent Zdebski. That is also rumored of him doing the same as Connor. Could get interesting then after OSU find the ones for Georgia, Alabama and all the other 131 teams.
@hotdangers if you had another team's signs, and they changed their signs before the game. Do you still have that advantage? C'mon, genius, let's hear it. Keep it organized and not sloppy now.
@hotdangers it is not against the rules to steal signs either, you non OSU fan. Whatever program you come from must be an ignorant bunch.
@hotdangers the only thing I've seen against the rules was the channel 10 electronic surveillance of the Michigan sidelines acting on behalf of OSU.
Bruce is not the one to listen to on this. He knows not much on sign steeling or he is just not being open . Get lost bad content.
It is increasingly apparent Rich’s coach is simply a liar and a cheater - no matter how small the potatoes .
Why is this woman on here
Eisen’s wife?
Michigan is the only team in all of college sports doing this😅. Jim Harbaugh time to go to your coaching talents to the NFL
Michigan should not be aloud to play
Spelling class
How come so many people can't call it what it is - cheating on the highest level and gives the ttun a decided edge period. Who has balls?