There's no conversation between LeBron and MJ, outside of the mindset of LeBron fans. >Offensive Accolades -MJ has a record 10 scoring titles -Bron has 1 scoring title and 1 assist title >Defensive Accolades -MJ has a record 9 all defensive first teams. -Bron has 5 all defensive first teams. -This is due to the fact that Bron got lazy on the defensive end starting in 2015. >MVPs -MJ has 5 regular season MVPs to Bron's 4. -MJ has 6 finals MVPs to Bron's 4. -They both have 3 all star MVPs >Numbers -MJ averages more points, steals, blocks, minutes, a higher ft%, and less turnovers. 6 stats for MJ. -Bron averages more assists, rebounds, a higher fg%, 3p%, and less personal fouls. 5 stats for Bron. -When both players played 15 seasons, Bron only passed MJ in assists an rebounds. MJ had Bron in points, steals, and blocks. So Bron couldn't reach MJ in cumulative stats when they played the same amount of time. >Winning -MJ has 6 chips to Bron's 4. -MJ never lost in the finals, Bron has a losing finals record -MJ did it on the same team. While Bron, on 3 different occassions, has teamed up with 2 other franchise stars and traded away entire rosters to win. -MJ has a higher win percentage in the regular season (65.9% vs. 65.6%), playoffs (66.5% vs. 65.4%), and the finals (68.6% vs. 40%) >The only thing Bron has is longevity. And that can be used against him. Because that means he played for so long and is still failing to catch MJ in accomplishments. That's the reason Bron fans distract the conversation by putting emphasis on MJ fans using chips, so they can push the narrative that "it's the only argument MJ fans use" and cite "Bill Russell and Robert Horry".
Stats are a great indicator on how good someone was. However when we talk about GOAT status we mean how a player achieved their greatness and the ways they performed in various high stake situations. Those teams lived and died with that player's actions and that player always seemed to get his team a victory no matter how great the adversary. Players like Jordan, Bird, Magic, Hakeem, Kobe, Russell etc. Those type of players didn't care about stats it was all about winning, and they had too much pride to join another contemporary to win a chip. What LeBron has done by jumping ship so much to get rings hurts his legacy. It doesn't take away those rings, but it's not the same as building your own dynasty with the team that drafted you. LeBron's greatest achievement is winning that one for Cleveland. What if all his chips was just with Cleveland? He'd be looked at differently. If Giannis keeps doing what he's doing and winning for Milwaukee he's going to pass LeBron up pretty quickly. It's a reason we don't put Durant in the conversation, because of how he got his titles.
I think the issue with Lebron getting his stats, especially this season, is that it comes only on the offensive end. He almost actively avoids playing defense, often leaving his team to defend 4v5, in order to "keep his energy" to play offense. Ask your coach: "Hey coach, would you prefer it if I put up 30ppg without doing anything on defense, or if I put up 20ppg and put in the same effort on offense and defense?". What would a coach tell you? Also, the argument of "there's no other offense on his team" is not really there: LA averages 112 ppg, 43 rpg, 24apg, 7 spg, 5bpg, 14topg, 42-88fgpg, 12-353ppg, 16-22ftpg with him, 108ppg, 47rpg, 23apg; 8spg; 5bpg,14topg, 41 of 89 FGpg; without 11 of 33 3Ppg, 16 of 22 FTpg without him. So not really a big difference. And that's the point, he's no longer a big factor in team winning or losing, he just goes out there, plays, gets his average without playing D and is happy with that, knowing that by averaging 25ppg he'll catch Kareem by next year. (Talking about Kareem, that man got finals MVP at age 38, think Lebron will manage that next season? :P )
Jxmy Highroller doesn't take into consideration the intangibles that make MJ the GOAT. Intangibles that are probably more important than stats to be honest. After the 1993 season and the Bulls first three-peat the basketball world pretty much anointed MJ as the greatest. Now why was that? He had only played 9 seasons at that point and was no where close to Kareem and Wilt when it came to statistics. It was because of the story of his career. It's like Muhammad Ali being dubbed the GOAT of boxing. He doesn't have the most championships or the best win-loss record. But the story of his career, the overcoming obstacles people thought were impossible. And doing it multiple times throughout his career. Lebron ran away from the challenges in his career by joining Miami and stacking the deck in his favor with the teams he has built. Be real with me, has there been a single season since 2011 where Lebron's team wasn't predicted to reach the Finals before the season even started? Maybe you can make an argument for the 2018-2019 season, but they didn't win. He would have gained some points if he did, but not only did he not pass expectations, he under preformed. He didn't even make the playoffs when the discussion was could Lebron preform as good in the West as he did in the East. 2016 was Lebron's only season where he had a GOAT moment. He had to overcome the odds that everyone said were impossible and he over came them. Had Lebron achieved feats not seen for decades like getting a four-peat with the Cavs in 2010 to 2014 against tough competition, people would have labeled him the GOAT right then and there. No need to pass Kareem or getting in the 30k 10k 10k club. He could have retired in 2014 and it would have been a wrap. The fact that we are in year 19 for Lebron and he is still chasing MJ shows he will not ever reach that goal. At this point it's like the race is over, the audience have left the stadium and the officials are gathering the equipment and heading out, but here is Lebron still on the track running hoping someone will give his credit for the laps that are completed when the race ended hours ago.
The rules and game didn't change in Jordan's day. The game was WAY more physical which led to his decline. As well as all the other guys that were mentioned in the scoring decline chart you did. I see absolutely NO defense being played now bcuz you're not allowed to be physical on defense. This the biggest reason why he's able to be so dominate. What will make LeBron a GOAT to pass Jordan. Let him go to the Crappiest team in the NBA and TAKE THEM TO AN NBA CHAMPIONSHIP 3 TIMES. NOT a Super team.
I'm sorry Lebron fans but when Mike played there was no debate, in the World, about who was the greatest player on the planet. Both Magic and Bird anointed him. No one was asking but what about Steph or KD? Jordan was and is the Muhammad Ali of his sport. Pundits can create a debate about who is the GOAT but we all saw how MJ was greeted at the 75th All Star game. The people have spoken... His brand is the greatest, his name is the most known, his clothes, his shoes...Sorry you can't manufacture greatness it is bestowed upon you by the people. And all over the world... He is still known as the greatest!
If a player plays at a 10 for 10 years and another plays at a 8 for 20 years he at no point was better than the guy that was a 10 for 10 years. You never reached the peak of the mountain they played at for 10 years.
Take numbers, accolades, rings etc out of the equation, who would you rather watch. My eye test tells me Jordan is the greatest basketball player I have ever seen to play the game. Then add the accolades, its not even close for me. He was the first to do some many things and his record is still 100% Never beaten in a final across college, NBA, Olympics and World Finals. That's not hating on LBJ, but he not even close in my personal opinion. Again, my opinion.
Lebro has the most due to longevity. And IMO he doesn't want any real competition. With him getting good players on whatever team is his team of the month. What dynasty has he helped build from the ground up? This is a team sport. Not tennis. It takes a team to get the rings. Not an individual trying to get their stats up. Look at the accomplishments the others (Bird, Magic, Kareem, Jordan) did in the amount of time they played. In Larry's 13 yr career. He was the FOUNDING MEMBER of 50-40-90 club. 3 CONSECUTIVE MVPs. 3 rings, 2 Finals MVPs, 12 All star, 10 all NBA Teams, 3x All Defense selection. It took Bird just two seasons to get his first ring whereas it took James nine. Larry turned the Celtics around his first season. From a 29 - 53 season to 61 - 21 season. Larry's one of 8 hall of famers to win rookie of the year & be named to the all NBA first team. The only one so far to have those honors after Larry is Tim Duncan. Not even Magic, Jordan, KD or Lebron have such honors. Has Lebron even made it to the 50/40/90 club? Lebron's best season FT%,(.780) is lower than Larry's worst season FT%(.836). Larry's career FT% is higher (.886) than Lebron's (.734). Larry's career 3pt percentage (.376)is better than Lebron's(.345). Larry's career DRB% 22.37, Lebron's 18.69. In playoffs Larry's DRB% 21.38. Lebron's 21.34. Larry did all that playing 459 LESS games than Lebron. Bird was able to dominate everyone in the league. Here's a little video that explains why Larry is better than Lebron. Larry Bird Is Better Than Lebron th-cam.com/video/qyxJ02hAZOU/w-d-xo.html
James started accumulating stats at 18 and Jordan not until age 22. Jordan missed all but 18 games of his second season, he retired for virtually two years after his Father died…..in his prime and again in ‘99, ‘00. He made some of those choices but it seems like Jimmy wants to argue the benefits he thinks Jordan got out of leaving after ‘98 but doesn’t add the benefits he would have had. One can argue that Jordan wouldn’t win again in ‘99 or ‘00 but he would have accumulated more stats. You really could argue that the Knicks went to the Finals as an 8th Seed in ‘99 and the Spurs were pretty decent and would have been a good matchup for the Bulls. Let’s just say worst case scenario they lose. Jordan’s keeps climbing higher and higher up the all time lists and this accumulation argument is out the window. It really seems like the media is grasping on to the All-Time Lifetime Achievement Award as an argument for GOAT to help with ratings. If Jordan were just one of these players who’s talents just diminished early and thus he had to retire after 15 years I’d be more likely to listen to Jimmy’s argument a bit more seriously. If Lebron didn’t have a 4 year head start on Jordan and if you pencil in Jordan’s average for those fours years, plus the almost two he missed in ‘94-‘95 and again in 99-00 how high would be be? He’s only 4000 points behind James as is. He also STILL has 300 MORE steals than LeBron?! Normally I would say coulda shoulda but I think any rational mind knows Jordan’s numbers would have shut down this longevity argument so quickly. Oh, and Robert Horry is SO the same thing as Jordan. You know those 7 Finals MVP’s Horry has. 🙄
Personally, while I think it IS amazing for someone to perform well for a long time, I think that's more beneficial for the team(s) they're playing with than their actual skill. At least, for me, when I think of what makes a player great, it's how well they do across the board and sustaining that performance long enough to know that it was because of how skilled they were, not a fluke. Unfortunately, I also think there's a cloud hanging over the modern league when it comes to various stats. While it's certainly nothing new, it's become more prevalent and... engineered, I want to say. They've had decades to get various aspects of the game down to a science and it's really beginning to show, both on and off the court. And in one area in particular, it's made it possible for someone like LeBron to play as well as he has for as long as he has, if they choose to. And I think that's the main reason why I don't think longevity, in and of itself, is important. LeBron chooses to play this long because he can. And it's no surprise because it's easier to have the right diet, get the right training, know how to prevent or mitigate injury, recovering from injuries, and focusing on certain aspects of the game (especially on offense, which the league has made easier time after time) to get the points and accomplishments desired without burning oneself out. Jordan retired three times, all for understandable reasons, and I'm pretty sure that his last stint with the Wizards was for a charity, not his legacy (which did no favors for said legacy, and a lot of fans of Jordan are willing to sweep those two final years under the rug). Bird was planning on retirement after his ninth season, and he would have if Bias hadn't died, but he stuck around for the Celtics and for the chance of playing against Magic one more time, not because he was in any condition to improve his legacy. I look more favorably on these two, and especially Bird (unsurprisingly, I'm sure), than LeBron. The way I see it, LeBron is like someone chasing a high score in a video game, who will get it after emptying their pockets of quarters. The question then becomes: is it more impressive that the high score is slightly better than the second highest after many more attempts, because a high score is a high score, or that a score that's slightly worse was achieved with far fewer attempts? For me, it's the latter.
You ask a very good question, but answer this: do you think LeBron would still be this productive of the NBA was still as in the 80s and 90s or if he kept playing defense his whole career like MJ and Kobe did? Don't you think that maybe his resting on defense is the main reason why he can be impressive on the offense and be as productive?
@@HenDawgTV I agree. The point is that MJ has been the Goat for almost 3 decades and since Kobe with the mamba mentality showed even more dedication to the game as he was really focused only on basketball, compared to MJ that was also into golf and gambling, it's legit to ask if LeBron doesn't have the same mentality of MJ or Kobe, how can he be the goat? And if the answer is "Yeah but he played more season at a high level!" it doesn't answer the question. Is like compare 2 Ferraris one with a 100 gallon tank and another with 300 gallon tank, for comparison the second is not better than the first just because it has more fuel, it can drive more distance but if with that car one can't win as much as with the first that doesn't make it better. LeBron took 19 years and still maybe in this season he will get only his second scoring title, I can understand the arguement that he is a more complete player than MJ and not a mere scorer, but MJ was the best scorer in the league every seasons with the Bulls aside when he got injured or when he came back as he was not eligible, but at the same time he was also one of the best defenders and 3 times leader in steals all 11 full seasons, if LeBron is the greatest just 2 scoring titles and one assist leader in 20 years is not enough in my opinion.
@@alexlanza79 It's like hiking a mountain. If you had 10 seasons you played at a 10 and another guy plays at a 8 for 15 years. He's not better than a guy cause his span at a high level was longer. He never reached the peak of the mountain someone stayed at for 10 years.
I see it like Clayton (from the "Making the case" videos): once you reach a certain point I can't point out 1 above everyone else. MJ, Wilt, Kareem, Russell, Bird, Magic are all way too close to call it. Kobe, Dr.J, Lebron, Duncan and a couple others are slightly behind, imho.
@@HenDawgTV kobe could be in either of those two groups.... i can't give an opinion on him because his era was when basketball became unwatchable for me. Late Jordan/early kobe was when the league changed a lot of things to become more sissified and the talent was dropping off, and i just couldn't watch the sport without puking over how much they got paid with so much less all around skill than the 80s.... So, i don't know if kobe is in the top 6, or the next 4. He's the reason i don't have a set top 10. I'm hoping felix gives you an informed opinion on this. I always try to answer without bias, so i refuse to just make stuff up...😄
@@HenDawgTV as far as skills go, both are up there, Magic was the better playmaker, Kobe scored more (although with worse %). I'd say that Magic was the better team leader. But, most importantly, I agree with McHale's assessment: "I'd take big skilled over short skilled any day".
I think Lebron gets alot of the negativity because of the "colluding" issue and team hopping that has happened and because many feel the game today is officiated in a manner where it is easier to put up numbers. I say that with regard to the lack of travelling calls and dribbling violations = cupping the ball when changing direction and the step back where both feet leave the floor is lifting your pivot foot. And IMO defense was much more physical. With that being said we should not hate on Lebron but enjoy the last few years he has left. For me Jordan is #1 as he dominated with offensive creativity like nobody else ( 9 scoring titles?) and his Bulls 6 wins in 6 Finals without ever going to a game 7 and Jordan getting 6 FMVP awards was exceptional. I have Kareem as my #2 because we should remember he spent 4 years at UCLA and as a freshman could not play BUT his squad beat the Varsity squad in practice and that Varsity squad won the NCAA title. The next 3 years he = Lew Alcindor = was 3 time player of the year and 3 time NCAA champ and UCLA only lost 1 or 2 games? If Kareem had started his play in the NBA at 18 like Lebron, where would his total number be? In his first 10 years in the NBA Kareem averaged 14.8 rebound per game! He won 6 MVP awards and 6 rings and should actually have 3 FMVP's ( he was robbed of the 80 FMVP). I think Lebron for me will be #3 and then Bird at #4 and Magic at #5 and that also happens to be my all time starting 5.
Here is a video to react to that will explain to you why Mike is considered by most to be the GOAT. "Michael Jordan is the most popular former athlete in the world" - The Herd
I think he is still over-rating Lebron. Lebron isn't 95 percent of what Jordan was. He's more like 80 percent. Because he's forgetting about the things you can't measure. The intangibles. Lebron's intangibles don't compare to Jordan's. And you have to take in to account that today's league makes it much easier to rack up stats.
Lebron is playing in a softer league than Michael. the lane is more open today than in the past. You have the Jordan Rules on defense but not the Lebron Rules. Teams leave Lebron open to shoot longer Jump Shots. Would a Team leave Michael Jordan open to Shoot. If you had to Choose a player to win a Game I would Choose Michael Jordan and Larry Bird and Magic Johnson over Lebron James.
His longevity is not why people say he stat pads. Those are two different criticisms. For the last 8 years or so lebron has went from just playing the game to forcing the action. It used to look more natural when he ran the system. Now it’s just him hoarding the offense and stagnating everyone’s game because he wants full control over everything.. he’s a control freak.How many players have came to his teams and looked like a worse player next to him? That’s a testament to his leadership style and inability to adapt to his teammates needs. It’s his way of the highway. That’s why his teams have been so inconsistent in winning in both the regular season and playoffs.. Think about it. Kevin Love comes, game changes. Bosh same thing. Wade same thing. Etc. he doesn’t play in any system that takes the ball out of his hands and he’s unwilling to do anything that would alter his numbers or role. He’s not gonna play consistent d because he’d be too tired. He’s not gonna play off ball sometimes. He’s not gonna move the ball and get guys easy looks unless he’s the one giving it to them so he can get his assist. In blowouts against weak teams he stays in instead of taking a break even tho he claims he’s tired. it’s just a lot of the little antics that he has at times and all the drama that turn people off. Every great star has had that moment of selfishness that they eventually corrected and learned to trust their guys and allow them to grow. Wilt was similar to bron with people saying he was a stat padder. But he eventually figured it out in La and Philly. Mike, Hakeem, and Kobe had the ball hog narratives that they worked passer and learned to play in a natural and free flowing system. Russell and Duncan had it from day one. Bird and magic brought the best out of everyone. Kareem never had that issue. Shaq figure it out as well in LA. Lebron is the only top 10 great who has not changed his game or adapted to a real system to better the guys around him and sacrifice his own stats for better results. It’s always give me the ball, 5 out, drive and kick. Every single time.
Also, the question of should team accolades matter in a goat debate doesn’t make sense. Goat debates are not just about talent. The game is played as a team and the individual is not playing for himself. He’s playing for a team. Who’s on those teams is irrelevant if the level of impact provided by the individual still leads them to success in some form or fashion. While it may be difficult to win without a great team. It’s not impossible. U can’t separate a player as an individual and ignore the entire purpose of their role as a teammate as if this was track and field. The goal of all that talent is to use it to impact winning for the team. So how do u erase that from a conversation when it’s the main goal of the entire game in the first place? U play to win the game. Good team bad team, whatever. U PLAY TO WIN THE GAME. That’s always first and foremost. If brons goal every year is to stack up numbers and individual success, he’s gonna be shit out of luck trying to supplant winners. That’s just how life goes. The people that win get to tell the story.
LeBron James becomes the only member of the 30K-10K-10K club. The Lakers' superstar is the only player ever to reach at least 10,000 points, 10,000 rebounds and 10,000 assists. THE ONLY MEMBER EVER!!!!!!! AND WHEN HE BREAKS Kareem Abdul-Jabbar scoring record. its obviuos that where there are haters, lebron must be doing something right. 5× NBA All-Defensive First Team (2009-2013), 13× All-NBA First Team (2006, 2008-2018, 2020). i still believe you can't compare apples to oranges meaning guards to small forwards and if your going to do this than longevity at a high level plays a part of it. and i'm not a jordan hater i watched all of his nba games. he played 8 years and lost to better teams. he finally got a good team and coach and start winning. the same thing happened to kobi. but jordon could not sustain a high level and longevity. kobi had longevity but could not sustain that high level of play.. lets face it lebron is a athletic GOD.
I would take Bird over Lebron in this Era without a doubt. You cant touch him and the game is more focused on 3s. Its easier to dunk layup now so even being less athletic hes going to be versatile on a different level.
LeBron is awesome, but to me, the GOAT choice isn't between MJ and LeBron... it's between MJ and Kareem. My all-time team roster (in alphabetical order): Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (5) Larry Bird (3/4) Kobe Bryant (2/3) Wilt Chamberlain (5) Steph Curry (1/2) Tim Duncan (4/5) Kevin Durant (3/4) LeBron James (1/2/3/4) Magic Johnson (1/2/3/4) Michael Jordan (2) Chris Paul (1) Bill Russell (4/5)
LeBron my GOAT. I just feel like the competition he played all the great teams/defenders he’s faced,the career saving games he’s had and the fact that he is still going at an elite level and didn’t take breaks like Michael I mean I just can’t ignore his greatness. This is also coming from a guy who hated him for at least 6 years of his career.
What this video proves is the addition of a brand new category of sustained ability. It has already told us who was the purely "greatest" basketball player during their time. What Lebron is achieving is something separate, BUT, it is on par and needs its own name that describes the length and degree of dominance and ascribes it a concrete number. "Reign", maybe?... Either way you would put this new title, for sake of convenience, "REIGN", alongside "G.O.A.T." but not together. Whether it's 95%, 99%, whatever, the fact that MJ put on the visibly better showing still stands, but that does not mean that Lebron's enormous achievement should not be given the absolute highest praise and allow him to have a stat\accolade on the charts that he himself caused. Similar to Larry Bird, when he founded the 50\40\90 club. ("Micheal Joe Bird" gang, represent!)
@@HenDawgTV I've always been in a tight spot choosing my top 10, there are too many players I like who make up for each other's weaknesses. MJ and Bird, for instance, had their strongest gifts in opposing aspects of the game and had the same competitive streak. MJ with his ungodly athleticism and overall brilliance Bird with his shooting, passing and court awareness. I have to wonder if Bird had grown up with a reason to practice the 3-point shot as an option rather than it only coming into existence when he was already 23 years old. Bird and Magic's 1970s American Team performance together was awe-inspiring. Many current generation players are absolutely amazing and make their case well.
He is in my top ten. Great player but he can't be the goat at this point. I agree he is a great player but Wilt was a better scorer, Russell has more rings, Kareem scored more and he and Magic both have more rings. Bird was a better small forward. That is not even putting MJ in yet. Killer instinct is an intangible but I put Kobe, Bird, Magic and MJ way ahead there. So LeBron isn't in my starting five or even my sixth man but he is in my top 10.
@@dlo3165 Unless of course you watch both of them play. LeBron is sometimes unstoppable and other times he plays no defense, can't make a free throw and seems scared to make the play when the game is on the line. Trouble is you never know which LeBron is going to show up. Larry only cared about winning. He could rebound, throw a no look or outlet pass, shoot over or around most defenders and in the fourth quarter with the game on the line he could take over and there wasn't anything you could do about it.
@@tobiasgonzalez7431 Bird played against a better balanced league with three other legit goats. MJ, Kareem and Magic. LeBron joins them to make superteams to win titles.
He can never get there. MJ all the way. Lebron left his team to go title surfing. He LOST too many finals to be holding a candle to Mike, and, he plays in a league where nobody touches anyone. So, I don't care about points. I care about that will to win. This year proves he doesn't believe to be called, "the greatest". The greatest wouldn't go down like that. You show me 1 game where Mike EVER gave up before there was no time left, until then....
Lebron is just not one of the two choices for goat. there also are not only two choices for the goat. if I'm ahead by 2 points in the closing seconds and Lebron has the ball, I just foul him. He'll miss a free throw and lose the game. At worst, he'll tie it ... maybe. but he won't be able to pass to a good 3 pt shooter or dish underneath for a layup...
Is there a youtube ball commentator who says more unsubstantiated shit than this guy. Small nuances with nothing to back it up. He was so much better when he backed his stuff up. Sad where this guy's channel has gone. Keep it up Hen. With the best nba youtube analysts falling by the wayside, maybe there's room for you to step beyond reaction
lebron cant be the goat, he doesnt have the greatest gene. lebron is great, and will go down in history as so, his legacy is already cemented but he shouldnt even be in the conversation for goat. theres more to that than stats. to be the goat you only need one thing, that thing is something unexplainable. that thing cant be given or taken away. that thing is "IT" and lebron doesnt have "IT". For example, a mayweather fight just doesnt hit the same way as a tyson or ali fight. it should, stats say hes the greatest boxer to ever do it, but no. key things that i feel are wrapped into "IT" are but not limited to - you and your whole team knowing that when the game is on the line you can be trusted to make that shot so the ball is coming to you - FEAR! This is a big one i think. the mental aspects of it are endless. - Lastly, i couldnt ever think of lebron as a monster, a menace, a beast, the goat because players like kobe and jordan exist that even on defense they were attacking, looking for ways to punish players and break their spirit, a true warriors game. Lebron doesnt have it.
If you are a diehard statistic fans lebron is your goat that’s what he do from the beginning of his career,he become the all time leader in scoring and his is not better scorer than MJ period,he is in the all time rebounds list and for his position he is a bad rebounder and in the all time in assis,and he’s not better than Magic,Lebron is supposed to win at lease 8 ships he always play with the best team in the conference,6 loses in final is too much for goat conversation for goat means how you dominance the league and MJ Went 6 for 6 in final With 6 mvp ,5 regular season mvp 9 times defensive team 2 times slam dunk champion ROY, DPY 10 times scoring champion and all his playoffs record never meltdown in final he took the playoffs to another level he beat the best player,Lebron play with the best two threepeat in just 11 full season with the bulls and for me that’s is a goat stats you take the numbers i got the peak another very important thing for me is the defense and lebron is a poor flopping defender.
What video should I react to next?! 🤔
3rd quarter of the Dr J Bird fight game please.
THIS is the Jordan vs Lebron video you must watch. It’s really good. m.th-cam.com/video/tl3mR6eoEa8/w-d-xo.html
Why Larry Bird Is Better Than Lebron
th-cam.com/video/qyxJ02hAZOU/w-d-xo.html
There's no conversation between LeBron and MJ, outside of the mindset of LeBron fans.
>Offensive Accolades
-MJ has a record 10 scoring titles
-Bron has 1 scoring title and 1 assist title
>Defensive Accolades
-MJ has a record 9 all defensive first teams.
-Bron has 5 all defensive first teams.
-This is due to the fact that Bron got lazy on the defensive end starting in 2015.
>MVPs
-MJ has 5 regular season MVPs to Bron's 4.
-MJ has 6 finals MVPs to Bron's 4.
-They both have 3 all star MVPs
>Numbers
-MJ averages more points, steals, blocks, minutes, a higher ft%, and less turnovers. 6 stats for MJ.
-Bron averages more assists, rebounds, a higher fg%, 3p%, and less personal fouls. 5 stats for Bron.
-When both players played 15 seasons, Bron only passed MJ in assists an rebounds. MJ had Bron in points, steals, and blocks. So Bron couldn't reach MJ in cumulative stats when they played the same amount of time.
>Winning
-MJ has 6 chips to Bron's 4.
-MJ never lost in the finals, Bron has a losing finals record
-MJ did it on the same team. While Bron, on 3 different occassions, has teamed up with 2 other franchise stars and traded away entire rosters to win.
-MJ has a higher win percentage in the regular season (65.9% vs. 65.6%), playoffs (66.5% vs. 65.4%), and the finals (68.6% vs. 40%)
>The only thing Bron has is longevity. And that can be used against him. Because that means he played for so long and is still failing to catch MJ in accomplishments. That's the reason Bron fans distract the conversation by putting emphasis on MJ fans using chips, so they can push the narrative that "it's the only argument MJ fans use" and cite "Bill Russell and Robert Horry".
Stats are a great indicator on how good someone was. However when we talk about GOAT status we mean how a player achieved their greatness and the ways they performed in various high stake situations. Those teams lived and died with that player's actions and that player always seemed to get his team a victory no matter how great the adversary. Players like Jordan, Bird, Magic, Hakeem, Kobe, Russell etc. Those type of players didn't care about stats it was all about winning, and they had too much pride to join another contemporary to win a chip. What LeBron has done by jumping ship so much to get rings hurts his legacy. It doesn't take away those rings, but it's not the same as building your own dynasty with the team that drafted you. LeBron's greatest achievement is winning that one for Cleveland. What if all his chips was just with Cleveland? He'd be looked at differently. If Giannis keeps doing what he's doing and winning for Milwaukee he's going to pass LeBron up pretty quickly. It's a reason we don't put Durant in the conversation, because of how he got his titles.
I think the issue with Lebron getting his stats, especially this season, is that it comes only on the offensive end. He almost actively avoids playing defense, often leaving his team to defend 4v5, in order to "keep his energy" to play offense.
Ask your coach: "Hey coach, would you prefer it if I put up 30ppg without doing anything on defense, or if I put up 20ppg and put in the same effort on offense and defense?". What would a coach tell you?
Also, the argument of "there's no other offense on his team" is not really there: LA averages 112 ppg, 43 rpg, 24apg, 7 spg, 5bpg, 14topg, 42-88fgpg, 12-353ppg, 16-22ftpg with him, 108ppg, 47rpg, 23apg; 8spg; 5bpg,14topg, 41 of 89 FGpg; without 11 of 33 3Ppg, 16 of 22 FTpg without him. So not really a big difference. And that's the point, he's no longer a big factor in team winning or losing, he just goes out there, plays, gets his average without playing D and is happy with that, knowing that by averaging 25ppg he'll catch Kareem by next year. (Talking about Kareem, that man got finals MVP at age 38, think Lebron will manage that next season? :P )
Damn that’s real 💯
Exactly. He even takes his time getting back on offense now, too. It drives me crazy when people don’t point this out more.
Jxmy Highroller doesn't take into consideration the intangibles that make MJ the GOAT. Intangibles that are probably more important than stats to be honest. After the 1993 season and the Bulls first three-peat the basketball world pretty much anointed MJ as the greatest. Now why was that? He had only played 9 seasons at that point and was no where close to Kareem and Wilt when it came to statistics. It was because of the story of his career. It's like Muhammad Ali being dubbed the GOAT of boxing. He doesn't have the most championships or the best win-loss record. But the story of his career, the overcoming obstacles people thought were impossible. And doing it multiple times throughout his career.
Lebron ran away from the challenges in his career by joining Miami and stacking the deck in his favor with the teams he has built. Be real with me, has there been a single season since 2011 where Lebron's team wasn't predicted to reach the Finals before the season even started? Maybe you can make an argument for the 2018-2019 season, but they didn't win. He would have gained some points if he did, but not only did he not pass expectations, he under preformed. He didn't even make the playoffs when the discussion was could Lebron preform as good in the West as he did in the East. 2016 was Lebron's only season where he had a GOAT moment. He had to overcome the odds that everyone said were impossible and he over came them.
Had Lebron achieved feats not seen for decades like getting a four-peat with the Cavs in 2010 to 2014 against tough competition, people would have labeled him the GOAT right then and there. No need to pass Kareem or getting in the 30k 10k 10k club. He could have retired in 2014 and it would have been a wrap. The fact that we are in year 19 for Lebron and he is still chasing MJ shows he will not ever reach that goal. At this point it's like the race is over, the audience have left the stadium and the officials are gathering the equipment and heading out, but here is Lebron still on the track running hoping someone will give his credit for the laps that are completed when the race ended hours ago.
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The rules and game didn't change in Jordan's day. The game was WAY more physical which led to his decline. As well as all the other guys that were mentioned in the scoring decline chart you did. I see absolutely NO defense being played now bcuz you're not allowed to be physical on defense. This the biggest reason why he's able to be so dominate.
What will make LeBron a GOAT to pass Jordan. Let him go to the Crappiest team in the NBA and TAKE THEM TO AN NBA CHAMPIONSHIP 3 TIMES. NOT a Super team.
I'm sorry Lebron fans but when Mike played there was no debate, in the World, about who was the greatest player on the planet. Both Magic and Bird anointed him. No one was asking but what about Steph or KD? Jordan was and is the Muhammad Ali of his sport. Pundits can create a debate about who is the GOAT but we all saw how MJ was greeted at the 75th All Star game. The people have spoken... His brand is the greatest, his name is the most known, his clothes, his shoes...Sorry you can't manufacture greatness it is bestowed upon you by the people. And all over the world... He is still known as the greatest!
Good point
If a player plays at a 10 for 10 years and another plays at a 8 for 20 years he at no point was better than the guy that was a 10 for 10 years. You never reached the peak of the mountain they played at for 10 years.
10 years from now
most NBA fans will be saying that Lebron is a Karl Malone who can pass
and be only in the top 6 to 10 all-time players list
Karl Malone tho lol
Take numbers, accolades, rings etc out of the equation, who would you rather watch. My eye test tells me Jordan is the greatest basketball player I have ever seen to play the game. Then add the accolades, its not even close for me. He was the first to do some many things and his record is still 100% Never beaten in a final across college, NBA, Olympics and World Finals. That's not hating on LBJ, but he not even close in my personal opinion. Again, my opinion.
Good point tho!
Michael Jordan was 35 in '98, and returned with Washington at age 38 until 40 (which played a big role in the production graph dip).
I saw that. It just went down straight through those two years with no break in it.
Jordan and Horry comp was where he totally lost me.
If your a fan of Kobe you need to respect Jordan
I do!!
Lebro has the most due to longevity. And IMO he doesn't want any real competition. With him getting good players on whatever team is his team of the month. What dynasty has he helped build from the ground up? This is a team sport. Not tennis. It takes a team to get the rings. Not an individual trying to get their stats up. Look at the accomplishments the others (Bird, Magic, Kareem, Jordan) did in the amount of time they played. In Larry's 13 yr career. He was the FOUNDING MEMBER of 50-40-90 club. 3 CONSECUTIVE MVPs. 3 rings, 2 Finals MVPs, 12 All star, 10 all NBA Teams, 3x All Defense selection. It took Bird just two seasons to get his first ring whereas it took James nine. Larry turned the Celtics around his first season. From a 29 - 53 season to 61 - 21 season. Larry's one of 8 hall of famers to win rookie of the year & be named to the all NBA first team. The only one so far to have those honors after Larry is Tim Duncan. Not even Magic, Jordan, KD or Lebron have such honors. Has Lebron even made it to the 50/40/90 club? Lebron's best season FT%,(.780) is lower than Larry's worst season FT%(.836). Larry's career FT% is higher (.886) than Lebron's (.734). Larry's career 3pt percentage (.376)is better than Lebron's(.345). Larry's career DRB% 22.37, Lebron's 18.69. In playoffs Larry's DRB% 21.38. Lebron's 21.34.
Larry did all that playing 459 LESS games than Lebron. Bird was able to dominate everyone in the league. Here's a little video that explains why Larry is better than Lebron.
Larry Bird Is Better Than Lebron
th-cam.com/video/qyxJ02hAZOU/w-d-xo.html
💯💯💯 reacting to that next for sure
#1 Michael Jordan #2 Larry Bird #3 Magic Johnson
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James started accumulating stats at 18 and Jordan not until age 22. Jordan missed all but 18 games of his second season, he retired for virtually two years after his Father died…..in his prime and again in ‘99, ‘00. He made some of those choices but it seems like Jimmy wants to argue the benefits he thinks Jordan got out of leaving after ‘98 but doesn’t add the benefits he would have had.
One can argue that Jordan wouldn’t win again in ‘99 or ‘00 but he would have accumulated more stats.
You really could argue that the Knicks went to the Finals as an 8th Seed in ‘99 and the Spurs were pretty decent and would have been a good matchup for the Bulls.
Let’s just say worst case scenario they lose. Jordan’s keeps climbing higher and higher up the all time lists and this accumulation argument is out the window.
It really seems like the media is grasping on to the All-Time Lifetime Achievement Award as an argument for GOAT to help with ratings.
If Jordan were just one of these players who’s talents just diminished early and thus he had to retire after 15 years I’d be more likely to listen to Jimmy’s argument a bit more seriously.
If Lebron didn’t have a 4 year head start on Jordan and if you pencil in Jordan’s average for those fours years, plus the almost two he missed in ‘94-‘95 and again in 99-00 how high would be be? He’s only 4000 points behind James as is. He also STILL has 300 MORE steals than LeBron?!
Normally I would say coulda shoulda but I think any rational mind knows Jordan’s numbers would have shut down this longevity argument so quickly.
Oh, and Robert Horry is SO the same thing as Jordan. You know those 7 Finals MVP’s Horry has. 🙄
Good points!! 🔥🔥🔥
Personally, while I think it IS amazing for someone to perform well for a long time, I think that's more beneficial for the team(s) they're playing with than their actual skill. At least, for me, when I think of what makes a player great, it's how well they do across the board and sustaining that performance long enough to know that it was because of how skilled they were, not a fluke.
Unfortunately, I also think there's a cloud hanging over the modern league when it comes to various stats. While it's certainly nothing new, it's become more prevalent and... engineered, I want to say. They've had decades to get various aspects of the game down to a science and it's really beginning to show, both on and off the court. And in one area in particular, it's made it possible for someone like LeBron to play as well as he has for as long as he has, if they choose to.
And I think that's the main reason why I don't think longevity, in and of itself, is important. LeBron chooses to play this long because he can. And it's no surprise because it's easier to have the right diet, get the right training, know how to prevent or mitigate injury, recovering from injuries, and focusing on certain aspects of the game (especially on offense, which the league has made easier time after time) to get the points and accomplishments desired without burning oneself out.
Jordan retired three times, all for understandable reasons, and I'm pretty sure that his last stint with the Wizards was for a charity, not his legacy (which did no favors for said legacy, and a lot of fans of Jordan are willing to sweep those two final years under the rug). Bird was planning on retirement after his ninth season, and he would have if Bias hadn't died, but he stuck around for the Celtics and for the chance of playing against Magic one more time, not because he was in any condition to improve his legacy. I look more favorably on these two, and especially Bird (unsurprisingly, I'm sure), than LeBron.
The way I see it, LeBron is like someone chasing a high score in a video game, who will get it after emptying their pockets of quarters. The question then becomes: is it more impressive that the high score is slightly better than the second highest after many more attempts, because a high score is a high score, or that a score that's slightly worse was achieved with far fewer attempts? For me, it's the latter.
Not to mention James got to start in the league at 18 and Jordan not until 22.
Damn those good ass points
And... MJ got 2 olympic golds, 2 National Championships, he was single handedly responsible for a bunch of college kids beating the NBA all star team!
You ask a very good question, but answer this: do you think LeBron would still be this productive of the NBA was still as in the 80s and 90s or if he kept playing defense his whole career like MJ and Kobe did? Don't you think that maybe his resting on defense is the main reason why he can be impressive on the offense and be as productive?
Great point. And yeah idk it’s hard to tell. I don’t think LeBron has the mental toughness that Kobe and MJ had so honestly no
@@HenDawgTV I agree. The point is that MJ has been the Goat for almost 3 decades and since Kobe with the mamba mentality showed even more dedication to the game as he was really focused only on basketball, compared to MJ that was also into golf and gambling, it's legit to ask if LeBron doesn't have the same mentality of MJ or Kobe, how can he be the goat? And if the answer is "Yeah but he played more season at a high level!" it doesn't answer the question. Is like compare 2 Ferraris one with a 100 gallon tank and another with 300 gallon tank, for comparison the second is not better than the first just because it has more fuel, it can drive more distance but if with that car one can't win as much as with the first that doesn't make it better. LeBron took 19 years and still maybe in this season he will get only his second scoring title, I can understand the arguement that he is a more complete player than MJ and not a mere scorer, but MJ was the best scorer in the league every seasons with the Bulls aside when he got injured or when he came back as he was not eligible, but at the same time he was also one of the best defenders and 3 times leader in steals all 11 full seasons, if LeBron is the greatest just 2 scoring titles and one assist leader in 20 years is not enough in my opinion.
@@alexlanza79 It's like hiking a mountain. If you had 10 seasons you played at a 10 and another guy plays at a 8 for 15 years. He's not better than a guy cause his span at a high level was longer. He never reached the peak of the mountain someone stayed at for 10 years.
Great video
Thank you!!
I see it like Clayton (from the "Making the case" videos): once you reach a certain point I can't point out 1 above everyone else.
MJ, Wilt, Kareem, Russell, Bird, Magic are all way too close to call it. Kobe, Dr.J, Lebron, Duncan and a couple others are slightly behind, imho.
very well spoken
💯💯💯 but what makes Magic better than Kobe?!
@@HenDawgTV kobe could be in either of those two groups.... i can't give an opinion on him because his era was when basketball became unwatchable for me. Late Jordan/early kobe was when the league changed a lot of things to become more sissified and the talent was dropping off, and i just couldn't watch the sport without puking over how much they got paid with so much less all around skill than the 80s.... So, i don't know if kobe is in the top 6, or the next 4. He's the reason i don't have a set top 10.
I'm hoping felix gives you an informed opinion on this. I always try to answer without bias, so i refuse to just make stuff up...😄
@@HenDawgTV as far as skills go, both are up there, Magic was the better playmaker, Kobe scored more (although with worse %). I'd say that Magic was the better team leader.
But, most importantly, I agree with McHale's assessment: "I'd take big skilled over short skilled any day".
I think Lebron gets alot of the negativity because of the "colluding" issue and team hopping that has happened and because many feel the game today is officiated in a manner where it is easier to put up numbers. I say that with regard to the lack of travelling calls and dribbling violations = cupping the ball when changing direction and the step back where both feet leave the floor is lifting your pivot foot. And IMO defense was much more physical. With that being said we should not hate on Lebron but enjoy the last few years he has left. For me Jordan is #1 as he dominated with offensive creativity like nobody else ( 9 scoring titles?) and his Bulls 6 wins in 6 Finals without ever going to a game 7 and Jordan getting 6 FMVP awards was exceptional. I have Kareem as my #2 because we should remember he spent 4 years at UCLA and as a freshman could not play BUT his squad beat the Varsity squad in practice and that Varsity squad won the NCAA title. The next 3 years he = Lew Alcindor = was 3 time player of the year and 3 time NCAA champ and UCLA only lost 1 or 2 games? If Kareem had started his play in the NBA at 18 like Lebron, where would his total number be? In his first 10 years in the NBA Kareem averaged 14.8 rebound per game! He won 6 MVP awards and 6 rings and should actually have 3 FMVP's ( he was robbed of the 80 FMVP). I think Lebron for me will be #3 and then Bird at #4 and Magic at #5 and that also happens to be my all time starting 5.
Good points 💯💯
Here is a video to react to that will explain to you why Mike is considered by most to be the GOAT. "Michael Jordan is the most popular former athlete in the world" - The Herd
Link?
I think he is still over-rating Lebron. Lebron isn't 95 percent of what Jordan was. He's more like 80 percent. Because he's forgetting about the things you can't measure. The intangibles. Lebron's intangibles don't compare to Jordan's. And you have to take in to account that today's league makes it much easier to rack up stats.
Yeah i was thinking that too lol 95% is a little too close to Jordan
Lebron is playing in a softer league than Michael. the lane is more open today than in the past. You have the Jordan Rules on defense but not the Lebron Rules. Teams leave Lebron open to shoot longer Jump Shots. Would a Team leave Michael Jordan open to Shoot.
If you had to Choose a player to win a Game I would Choose Michael Jordan and Larry Bird and Magic Johnson over Lebron James.
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I would choose jordan over everyone but Lebron over everyone else because he is clutch that no clutch gene stuff is a myth he is very much clutch
His longevity is not why people say he stat pads. Those are two different criticisms. For the last 8 years or so lebron has went from just playing the game to forcing the action. It used to look more natural when he ran the system. Now it’s just him hoarding the offense and stagnating everyone’s game because he wants full control over everything.. he’s a control freak.How many players have came to his teams and looked like a worse player next to him? That’s a testament to his leadership style and inability to adapt to his teammates needs. It’s his way of the highway. That’s why his teams have been so inconsistent in winning in both the regular season and playoffs.. Think about it. Kevin Love comes, game changes. Bosh same thing. Wade same thing. Etc. he doesn’t play in any system that takes the ball out of his hands and he’s unwilling to do anything that would alter his numbers or role. He’s not gonna play consistent d because he’d be too tired. He’s not gonna play off ball sometimes. He’s not gonna move the ball and get guys easy looks unless he’s the one giving it to them so he can get his assist. In blowouts against weak teams he stays in instead of taking a break even tho he claims he’s tired. it’s just a lot of the little antics that he has at times and all the drama that turn people off. Every great star has had that moment of selfishness that they eventually corrected and learned to trust their guys and allow them to grow. Wilt was similar to bron with people saying he was a stat padder. But he eventually figured it out in La and Philly. Mike, Hakeem, and Kobe had the ball hog narratives that they worked passer and learned to play in a natural and free flowing system. Russell and Duncan had it from day one. Bird and magic brought the best out of everyone. Kareem never had that issue. Shaq figure it out as well in LA. Lebron is the only top 10 great who has not changed his game or adapted to a real system to better the guys around him and sacrifice his own stats for better results. It’s always give me the ball, 5 out, drive and kick. Every single time.
Ahhh gotcha good points!!!
Also, the question of should team accolades matter in a goat debate doesn’t make sense. Goat debates are not just about talent. The game is played as a team and the individual is not playing for himself. He’s playing for a team. Who’s on those teams is irrelevant if the level of impact provided by the individual still leads them to success in some form or fashion. While it may be difficult to win without a great team. It’s not impossible. U can’t separate a player as an individual and ignore the entire purpose of their role as a teammate as if this was track and field. The goal of all that talent is to use it to impact winning for the team. So how do u erase that from a conversation when it’s the main goal of the entire game in the first place? U play to win the game. Good team bad team, whatever. U PLAY TO WIN THE GAME. That’s always first and foremost. If brons goal every year is to stack up numbers and individual success, he’s gonna be shit out of luck trying to supplant winners. That’s just how life goes. The people that win get to tell the story.
Good points
i think he was saying that the 2 best modern nba teams were the bulls and warriors its not a knock on the lakers but yeah
He skipped over the Kobe/Shaq Lakers.
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LeBron James becomes the only member of the 30K-10K-10K club. The Lakers' superstar is the only player ever to reach at least 10,000 points, 10,000 rebounds and 10,000 assists. THE ONLY MEMBER EVER!!!!!!! AND WHEN HE BREAKS Kareem Abdul-Jabbar scoring record. its obviuos that where there are haters, lebron must be doing something right. 5× NBA All-Defensive First Team (2009-2013), 13× All-NBA First Team (2006, 2008-2018, 2020). i still believe you can't compare apples to oranges meaning guards to small forwards and if your going to do this than longevity at a high level plays a part of it. and i'm not a jordan hater i watched all of his nba games. he played 8 years and lost to better teams. he finally got a good team and coach and start winning. the same thing happened to kobi. but jordon could not sustain a high level and longevity. kobi had longevity but could not sustain that high level of play.. lets face it lebron is a athletic GOD.
I would take Bird over Lebron in this Era without a doubt. You cant touch him and the game is more focused on 3s. Its easier to dunk layup now so even being less athletic hes going to be versatile on a different level.
Bird is and was the 🐐Wilt is the model and Michael is the mold. Kareem is the outlier and Timmy is the facts. Bill Russel is the Man🏀
It's easy.
In the running for GOAT
Jordan
Russell
Bird
Kareem
in the running for 2nd or less:
Bron
Magic
Kobe
Etc
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The only reason people are putting LeBum in the convo is because MJ let it happen. Thank MJ for retiring twice too early kids...
Lmao 💯💯
LeBron is awesome, but to me, the GOAT choice isn't between MJ and LeBron... it's between MJ and Kareem.
My all-time team roster (in alphabetical order):
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (5)
Larry Bird (3/4)
Kobe Bryant (2/3)
Wilt Chamberlain (5)
Steph Curry (1/2)
Tim Duncan (4/5)
Kevin Durant (3/4)
LeBron James (1/2/3/4)
Magic Johnson (1/2/3/4)
Michael Jordan (2)
Chris Paul (1)
Bill Russell (4/5)
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LeBron my GOAT. I just feel like the competition he played all the great teams/defenders he’s faced,the career saving games he’s had and the fact that he is still going at an elite level and didn’t take breaks like Michael I mean I just can’t ignore his greatness. This is also coming from a guy who hated him for at least 6 years of his career.
💯💯💯 but why you hated him?
What this video proves is the addition of a brand new category of sustained ability. It has already told us who was the purely "greatest" basketball player during their time. What Lebron is achieving is something separate, BUT, it is on par and needs its own name that describes the length and degree of dominance and ascribes it a concrete number. "Reign", maybe?... Either way you would put this new title, for sake of convenience, "REIGN", alongside "G.O.A.T." but not together. Whether it's 95%, 99%, whatever, the fact that MJ put on the visibly better showing still stands, but that does not mean that Lebron's enormous achievement should not be given the absolute highest praise and allow him to have a stat\accolade on the charts that he himself caused. Similar to Larry Bird, when he founded the 50\40\90 club. ("Micheal Joe Bird" gang, represent!)
💯💯💯 #JordanGang
@@HenDawgTV I've always been in a tight spot choosing my top 10, there are too many players I like who make up for each other's weaknesses. MJ and Bird, for instance, had their strongest gifts in opposing aspects of the game and had the same competitive streak. MJ with his ungodly athleticism and overall brilliance Bird with his shooting, passing and court awareness. I have to wonder if Bird had grown up with a reason to practice the 3-point shot as an option rather than it only coming into existence when he was already 23 years old. Bird and Magic's 1970s American Team performance together was awe-inspiring. Many current generation players are absolutely amazing and make their case well.
Good points 🔥
On a side note, I'm kinda disappointed that Bird's(televised) half-court shot isn't on more highlight videos.
Michael Jordan and the Bulls could have possibly had 8 Straight NBA Championships if he had not retired the First time,
You think they would’ve did it?
He is in my top ten. Great player but he can't be the goat at this point. I agree he is a great player but Wilt was a better scorer, Russell has more rings, Kareem scored more and he and Magic both have more rings. Bird was a better small forward.
That is not even putting MJ in yet.
Killer instinct is an intangible but I put Kobe, Bird, Magic and MJ way ahead there.
So LeBron isn't in my starting five or even my sixth man but he is in my top 10.
In no way in maybe other than shooting is Larry bird better than LeBron
@@dlo3165 Unless of course you watch both of them play. LeBron is sometimes unstoppable and other times he plays no defense, can't make a free throw and seems scared to make the play when the game is on the line. Trouble is you never know which LeBron is going to show up.
Larry only cared about winning. He could rebound, throw a no look or outlet pass, shoot over or around most defenders and in the fourth quarter with the game on the line he could take over and there wasn't anything you could do about it.
💯💯💯
@@marykuettner752 yeah y’all can say all that but Lebron has more ring than bird but y’all come here and say bird like to win more
@@tobiasgonzalez7431 Bird played against a better balanced league with three other legit goats. MJ, Kareem and Magic. LeBron joins them to make superteams to win titles.
For me Lebron is the goat the competition he’s playing is way tougher than anything jordan has ever played against
Lebron is a great player just not MJ great no one will remember lebron 20 years from now MJ will never be forgotten
He can never get there. MJ all the way. Lebron left his team to go title surfing. He LOST too many finals to be holding a candle to Mike, and, he plays in a league where nobody touches anyone. So, I don't care about points. I care about that will to win. This year proves he doesn't believe to be called, "the greatest". The greatest wouldn't go down like that. You show me 1 game where Mike EVER gave up before there was no time left, until then....
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🍀😒 This Sucks! The Numbers CAN'T Lie!😒🍀 LARRY ... fuck... No it's still Larry! I'm pickin Magic & Larry
☘️☘️☘️
@@HenDawgTV 🍀I would Rather have 2 Great Teammates Vs. 2 AssHole Individuals!😡🍀 Fuck both those 2 Bums!😂
LeBron is the most complete player of all time but i think that Kobe and Jordan are the GOATS
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The only way Hes better is if he 3 peats because that's 13 finals and 7 rings more than mj but if he don't mj better
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Lebron is just not one of the two choices for goat. there also are not only two choices for the goat. if I'm ahead by 2 points in the closing seconds and Lebron has the ball, I just foul him. He'll miss a free throw and lose the game. At worst, he'll tie it ... maybe. but he won't be able to pass to a good 3 pt shooter or dish underneath for a layup...
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Jordan took a couple years off to go play baseball otherwise he'd have eight titles... The arguments for LeBron are interesting but get real...lol
Lol 💯💯💯
Is there a youtube ball commentator who says more unsubstantiated shit than this guy. Small nuances with nothing to back it up. He was so much better when he backed his stuff up. Sad where this guy's channel has gone.
Keep it up Hen. With the best nba youtube analysts falling by the wayside, maybe there's room for you to step beyond reaction
Lmao 💯💯💯
lebron cant be the goat, he doesnt have the greatest gene. lebron is great, and will go down in history as so, his legacy is already cemented but he shouldnt even be in the conversation for goat. theres more to that than stats. to be the goat you only need one thing, that thing is something unexplainable. that thing cant be given or taken away. that thing is "IT" and lebron doesnt have "IT". For example, a mayweather fight just doesnt hit the same way as a tyson or ali fight. it should, stats say hes the greatest boxer to ever do it, but no. key things that i feel are wrapped into "IT" are but not limited to - you and your whole team knowing that when the game is on the line you can be trusted to make that shot so the ball is coming to you - FEAR! This is a big one i think. the mental aspects of it are endless. - Lastly, i couldnt ever think of lebron as a monster, a menace, a beast, the goat because players like kobe and jordan exist that even on defense they were attacking, looking for ways to punish players and break their spirit, a true warriors game. Lebron doesnt have it.
Good points!!
If you are a diehard statistic fans lebron is your goat that’s what he do from the beginning of his career,he become the all time leader in scoring and his is not better scorer than MJ period,he is in the all time rebounds list and for his position he is a bad rebounder and in the all time in assis,and he’s not better than Magic,Lebron is supposed to win at lease 8 ships he always play with the best team in the conference,6 loses in final is too much for goat conversation for goat means how you dominance the league and MJ Went 6 for 6 in final With 6 mvp ,5 regular season mvp 9 times defensive team 2 times slam dunk champion ROY, DPY 10 times scoring champion and all his playoffs record never meltdown in final he took the playoffs to another level he beat the best player,Lebron play with the best two threepeat in just 11 full season with the bulls and for me that’s is a goat stats you take the numbers i got the peak another very important thing for me is the defense and lebron is a poor flopping defender.
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Michael Jordan 🐐🐐🐐
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Lebron could never play on my team. He ain't in my starting five, nor in my top ten all time.
Sheesh
For me it's not even a debate. Jordan is the goat.
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@@HenDawgTV 😁
95% hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahaaaaaaaaaaaa
Jordan #1
Facts
My Goat is Lebron James
Ewwww
mike and kobe 1a and 1b
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#birdgang
☘️☘️☘️☘️
I feel like Jordan will always be the goat Bc the olds can’t let go off him and live in the past