I think the main issue with leaving the tramlines more open is that in lower levels of tennis, serves are often very weak. As a net player with a weak server behind you, your opponent can tee off the serve wherever they like. Down the line is not a low percentage shot in that context. It's sometimes better to stand at the baseline instead of the net when you have a weaker serve to defend because you'll be on the defensive immediately. Your thoughts?
They start crosscourt rallies and it ends 50/50 so no shame as it happens when you get passed, even when it is two/three times in a match as said in the video
@@StokkeTennis you'll find lots of players at a social level who can easily return weak serves down crosscourt or down the lines. The server is basically feeding them a ball.
Hello, thank you for your effort and your videos, I am trying to follow your advices and to convince my partners of the statistics in favor of guarding the middle/poaching/volleying but they are playing by guarding the tramlines and letting their partners playing crosscourt till one is faulting. They are playing better than me and I don't want to risk to ruin a crosscourt duel by missing a volley or after a long cross rally to get passed by on the tramline...And as my partner's service is relatively weak, I have the impression that the opponent has more time to adjust for a longline shot...How to change this paradigm?
I’m not sure I understand or agree with the idea of not protecting the alley first. At a low level there are certain extras issues at play but in terms of basic physics if an opponent is pushed wide and is about to return there are two elements at play. To play cross court they would have to play an inside out forehand from the left side position or turn their bodies to go cross court if they are wide right, assuming they are right handed, as most will prefer to hit a forehand rather than a backhand which would favour the cross court shot more. In both scenarios the diagonal shot when wide will either have the opposing net player central or they will be hitting cross court directly to an opponent at the baseline. To avoid hitting where there opponent is already then the easiest shot for them to hit is to keep their bodies straight and hit straight so if they are wide they will hit down the tramlines. The whole point of waiting in position wide and for this to happen is to make your opponent uncomfortable and play the shot they don’t want to. If you are standing in the tramline or towards it at the net the opponent will hit cross court over the central part of the net and you’ll be ready. Also by occupying the tram line at the net or at least favouring it then you immediately rule that shot out and you can anticipate the shot and effectively only need to move in one direction ie across the net towards the centre rather than having to possibly moved in either direction. This is the same technique that goal keepers use in penalties. Also your grip can be ready if you provoke the shot by ruling out the easier option for the opponent ie straight down the tramline. I may be missing something but surely position in doubles at the net is about blocking and inviting the shot you want them to make, this is the same in most sports. Volleyball net position is a good example. Players go wide to come inside at the last minute to block or spike centrally. Am I missing something?
Returning with your bodyweight IS easier. Hitting it in the alley (4.5 feet wide) is insanely difficult for anyone below a 5.5 level. So while we are suggesting you don't cover the alley, feel free to still cover your line. Also keep track of how many times your opponents try to go down the line vs. cross court. As always, these are just our suggestions. You need to do what you feel comfortable with, but this positioning has worked for me and all my players throughout my career. That being said, there's not just "one style of play".
@ hey thx. It’s hard to explain what I mean but you guys contradicted yourselves and made my point after making the first point about not guarding the tramline when you said to move from out to in towards the centre net chord. Exactly my point. To do that you start in the tramline or towards it as a fake. At low level rec tennis people aren’t thinking strategically they are just trying to hit the ball and hitting down the line always makes sense in doubles not least because the return at the net has half as much court to return to. I’m sorry but it is imo all pure maths and the simple truth that most players are used to hitting straight back to their opponents in singles at a low level and rarely practice cross court rally’s where there is simply a higher variation of error probability distribution. Once you accept that lower level players don’t turn to redirect the ball then it’s math and basic geometry. ??
Amateur players often hug the alley because they do not want to volley. They just want tp park and hold their racquet. If you return directly at them, they complain and whining, that you fire at them. If they get lobbed, they move to the other side and park again.
Two of my favorite coaches! I knew I’d learn something!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Awesome as usual
I think the main issue with leaving the tramlines more open is that in lower levels of tennis, serves are often very weak. As a net player with a weak server behind you, your opponent can tee off the serve wherever they like. Down the line is not a low percentage shot in that context. It's sometimes better to stand at the baseline instead of the net when you have a weaker serve to defend because you'll be on the defensive immediately. Your thoughts?
But at lower levels the accuracy of baseline shots and returns is much lower as well.
@@roypeterka Bingo
Yes, but we don't keep statistics or register the difference when we miss from the baseline, we feel only when we get passed
They start crosscourt rallies and it ends 50/50 so no shame as it happens when you get passed, even when it is two/three times in a match as said in the video
@@StokkeTennis you'll find lots of players at a social level who can easily return weak serves down crosscourt or down the lines. The server is basically feeding them a ball.
Great content as usual. Thanks Jonathan.
Hello, thank you for your effort and your videos, I am trying to follow your advices and to convince my partners of the statistics in favor of guarding the middle/poaching/volleying but they are playing by guarding the tramlines and letting their partners playing crosscourt till one is faulting. They are playing better than me and I don't want to risk to ruin a crosscourt duel by missing a volley or after a long cross rally to get passed by on the tramline...And as my partner's service is relatively weak, I have the impression that the opponent has more time to adjust for a longline shot...How to change this paradigm?
I’m not sure I understand or agree with the idea of not protecting the alley first. At a low level there are certain extras issues at play but in terms of basic physics if an opponent is pushed wide and is about to return there are two elements at play. To play cross court they would have to play an inside out forehand from the left side position or turn their bodies to go cross court if they are wide right, assuming they are right handed, as most will prefer to hit a forehand rather than a backhand which would favour the cross court shot more. In both scenarios the diagonal shot when wide will either have the opposing net player central or they will be hitting cross court directly to an opponent at the baseline. To avoid hitting where there opponent is already then the easiest shot for them to hit is to keep their bodies straight and hit straight so if they are wide they will hit down the tramlines. The whole point of waiting in position wide and for this to happen is to make your opponent uncomfortable and play the shot they don’t want to. If you are standing in the tramline or towards it at the net the opponent will hit cross court over the central part of the net and you’ll be ready. Also by occupying the tram line at the net or at least favouring it then you immediately rule that shot out and you can anticipate the shot and effectively only need to move in one direction ie across the net towards the centre rather than having to possibly moved in either direction. This is the same technique that goal keepers use in penalties. Also your grip can be ready if you provoke the shot by ruling out the easier option for the opponent ie straight down the tramline. I may be missing something but surely position in doubles at the net is about blocking and inviting the shot you want them to make, this is the same in most sports. Volleyball net position is a good example. Players go wide to come inside at the last minute to block or spike centrally. Am I missing something?
Returning with your bodyweight IS easier. Hitting it in the alley (4.5 feet wide) is insanely difficult for anyone below a 5.5 level. So while we are suggesting you don't cover the alley, feel free to still cover your line. Also keep track of how many times your opponents try to go down the line vs. cross court. As always, these are just our suggestions. You need to do what you feel comfortable with, but this positioning has worked for me and all my players throughout my career. That being said, there's not just "one style of play".
@ hey thx. It’s hard to explain what I mean but you guys contradicted yourselves and made my point after making the first point about not guarding the tramline when you said to move from out to in towards the centre net chord. Exactly my point. To do that you start in the tramline or towards it as a fake. At low level rec tennis people aren’t thinking strategically they are just trying to hit the ball and hitting down the line always makes sense in doubles not least because the return at the net has half as much court to return to. I’m sorry but it is imo all pure maths and the simple truth that most players are used to hitting straight back to their opponents in singles at a low level and rarely practice cross court rally’s where there is simply a higher variation of error probability distribution. Once you accept that lower level players don’t turn to redirect the ball then it’s math and basic geometry. ??
@@KenFlanagan Yep! Thoughts can be difficult to articulate in one TH-cam comment. All the best!
I believe getting hit (specially by your partner's serve) is the biggest reason to stay closer to the alleys
Bend those legs!!
Isn’t the root cause the server not being able to reliably serve where they want to. ie the net player expecting a T serve and it ends up a wide one.
Not necessarily. A quality net player can adjust quickly.
Amateur players often hug the alley because they do not want to volley. They just want tp park and hold their racquet. If you return directly at them, they complain and whining, that you fire at them. If they get lobbed, they move to the other side and park again.