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This is used in many applications, why would you use it in an environment where there is rockfall. I work offshore there’s no rocks

As in the description is to show the versatility of this knot. if we need a system that moves then we make a system that moves! there is ofcourse a backup rope involved, and as long as the anchors are less than 1m apart then a single anchor is acceptable either side, if greater than this there will be two either side. So if failure in the rope occurred then nothing changes as the backup is there. If the anchor itself failed then we haven't done anything right as the anchor has not been assessed correctly. I work in the industrial world, so anchors are always bob=mb proof, so in my opinion the know as shown has many pros, and of course some flaws, but we have to stop shooting at clouds and make failures up, or we may indeed shoot down the plane that crashes into our rigging and cuts the rope.... because that's as likely!!

When you build any rigging system you build understanding system analysis! ie good anchors, no hazards, and good equipment. so don't shoot at clouds thinking what if? any system would fail if the anchor (what you attached to) failed, redundancy is for the anchorage (whats is attached to the anchor) thanks for the comment.

Irata require cowstails to be no longer than arms reach, and the manufacturer of the duck say 800mm including connector for that lanyards, so independent cowstails for us is best, I have never found the bulls nose or short connector useful Al att in my 23 years

For sure you could do a clove hitch, as it kinda works. The only reason for the Alpine was its a knot and not a rolling typy hitch, but sure it will work

You clearly miss the point of it then,

@@chrisdavies5515 nope I understand the system perfectly, it’s just pointless once you introduce the butterfly …… there’s less gear and less time to simply adjust your standard bunny ears to the new position using the common loop. Once I introduce the alpine it’s no longer self adjusting, it’s no longer faster than simply adjusting your bunny ears and it’s used more gear …… so what’s the actual point of it? If you are going to use a self adjusting system, accept the risk of shock loading it or don’t bother. The moment you introduce the bunny ears you’re negating the very reason you chose that system in the first place….. you’re quite literally choosing a self adjusting system, then decided it’s not safe because it’s self adjusting and you’re control measure is introduced more knots and karabiners to make it non-self adjusting…… honestly it’s now a completely pointless system which offers absolutely no advantages to a standard Y-hang 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️

@@daveloch905 The point is for the critics.... you clearly wouldn't make this system this small, but larger (I have used this >10m anchor apart) where I needed to move from left t right, once in place the alpine is to lock in place, its very easy to remove and re-adjust. The idea about the Alpine is to mitigate total failure on the effected rope due to being cut etc... yes I know the rope shouldn't get cut or damages, but again that's not the point here, it simply showing ho to lock off. the typical 8 and alpine is for sure good for fixed system then there isn't much movement, but as an educated man I am sure, you will see I was demonstrating the flexibility of this stsyem rather then what you literally see in front of you with a single point system and size. Also the typical Bunnies is for sure good, but really not that east to adjust, common loop is often tied not in the common place Its the way many FRS ERT teams use around the world, but ofcourse there are other methods..

@@applusropeaccesstraining1179 dude, you’re supposed to be an IRATA instructor, even if you did use this on anchors spread 10m apart, you should be sticking to ICOP on social media and talking about a wide y-hang. You’re supposed to train to best practice not ERT and Recreational techniques which accept higher levels of risk

If I was showing the knot as a 10m anchor I would have used 2 anchors either side as I am guessing you realise! I am not teaching IRATA on this video. The reason for the clip was to show the knot, maybe come on a course and with us, and see, or shoot from the sideline, I am very happy with my ability and competency. Pleasure chatting,

I agree, used in the right application its fantastic.

What on earth do you mean? I am not showing the backup at all!

In rope access you're always attached to a backup line. So if the main line fails you don't fall.

Hello, it has ti be dynamic rope and typically 11mm, the length we use is 2300mm so you can did a fig 8 both ends and you will end up with around a 700mm lanyard (arms reach)

@@chrisdavies5515 Thank you!

They are from SAR, but they don't make them, and we don't use them anymore as they were not great to be honest. We use the singing rock footer now that is fantastic

That’s why it’s a good system, nothing is bullet proof, and used in the right application is very safe,

2.3m

Our device lanyard lengths are 2030mm (2.3m) this will allow you to tie a fig of 8 on either end and have a 700mm lanyard, with a 100mm connector if suitable for a STEC Duck lanyard length. Or tie a fig of 8 and barrel know, this is a long lanyard but you can shorten to the users length with an alpine butterfly.

@@applusropeaccesstraining1179 Thank you ☺️🙏

Your not looking at the system correctly, this is to show the flexibility of the knot and we use a twin system so if failure occurred you would simply drop to the back up, if the anchor point failed, then you chose the wrong anchor to start with and haven’t applied system analysis, thanks for the comment

@@applusropeaccesstraining1179 I am taking my L3 test next week and have been a L2 close to 9 years. I know that there is a backup but if the large loop is cut on the one line, then the liklyehood is that the backup is cut too. Not talking about the anchor failing but the rope being cut. The backup bolt will be usless without the alpine to hold the secondary loop intact

Anything could happen. Say your bolts are on a ledge balcony and some poor resident living above accidentally drops their ceramic pot plant 3 stories directly onto the one anchor, severing both lines running through it. Would be over without the alpine.

@@stephendosson246 this is not the system for you then, having taught technical rescue in irata and fire service not many years there are many setups for many scenarios, this is just one, I have used this on a large scale many times and it was suitable, not the right system for hanging on the side of a building! You will be wrong to think, there’s one system for everything, And the point about one rope being cut, so would the other applies to all systems, especially tensioned lines, do we stop using them or do we rig them where there’s no foreseeable potential risk? Thanks for the comments again

@@applusropeaccesstraining1179 if both the backup and mainline are cut off just the one anchor then bunny ears or other y hang configurations will still catch on the 2nd anchor. This without the alpine will not catch

It’s Marlow dynamic, we get it cut ti 2300mm lengths so you can choose the most suitable knot either end, ultimately the overall length being ushered reach, or when using the stec duck 800mm inclusive of connection

we use 10mm diameter ropes here , also the lanyards we make them from dynamic rope ..while your main rope and backup rope are static.(even the static is elastic a bit...just a bit ) :)

Sorry, what do you mean?

Well done! Please don’t watch then

@@applusropeaccesstraining1179 was asking for more videos as I didn’t see any more, but yes I won’t watch anymore as you indirectly answered my question

Well we all have an opinion, for me in the 20 years using this it’s always worked, 8’s on the ends make for a universal knot and about 20mm bigger than a barrel knot that only hold the karabiner in the incorrect orientation. The bulls nose serves no purpose and I know of only a few training centres teaching this, and most who use this nose have no real use for it, Thanks for your comment though

@@chrisdavies5515 a bull nose is a lot easier when aid climbing or passing a re-belay, it's just shorter and it saves messing about having an alpine on your middle rope. Each to there own I guess

Figure 8s are an extremely common and standard termination; you haven’t mentioned the major advantage of a barrel - and it’s not because it’s “short”. A bullnose does not guarantee redundancy.

@adaptivo yer it’s personal preference I guess

What is? Having redundancy in your lanyards? That’s subjective, but usually you’re bound by some kind of procedure or code of practice.