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Thank you, Max! No backup knots used in this setup. This was actually the starting point of my journey towards a half-rope system: How to get around backup knots (which in my opinion will always slow me down significantly and work against a feeling of flow) without sacrificing safety margin.

Thank you!

@edokarura5773 sorry to hear that my videos haven't helped you understand my setup. Have you checked the playlist with the six videos? I'd love to learn what you have watched and what hasn't been clear enough (aka constructive feedback) and thus, if possible, improve or provide further information on my setup. Thank you.

Thank you, Christian! Great to hear this. Regarding the 'second level locking mechanism': This video shows it quite well, starting at min. 1'10": th-cam.com/video/nQ2agrKnNZg/w-d-xo.htmlfeature=shared Around min. 1'25", you'll see the second scenario, where the 'nose' cannot move upwards freely and thus the excentric shoe cannot move past the 'nose's' bulge. So, either your fall's force will rip the duct tape and you'll see the REVO locked by the nose in the upper position, or if the tape were stronger than that fall's force, then the REVO would be locked by the excentric shoe that cannot pass the nose's bulge. Does this make sense to you? Regarding seconding: I have only been using this method on multipitch climbs that I want to lead and second freely. No jumaring on such LRS climbs so far. I like the fact of not having to change anything in the setup from leading, abseiling to seconding. Of course, you could jumar back up on one rope and leave one REVO on the other rope as a backup. Aid climbers will be a better source for information on the best jumaring techniques though. :-) Cheers! Andreas

@andreastrunz2066 Thanks so much for the fast answer 🤗 Yeah! The video answers all my questions about functional behaviour 🙈 Of course I revised this video before my purchase… But after I did my first experience with it, I was simply wondering about some aspects… But now everything makes sense… Also why it feels like you have to release tension on climbers side after catching a fall dynamically with rope slip but break locks at the same time - while „nose“ is not able to move due to tight break side. Really ingenious device! But I do understand why it was never successfull at the end 😢 Apperance not as confidence inspiring as grigri for example, only nerds are willing and able to understand the working principle and its benefits, and even for nerds some datails will never be understood, i think… And my personal experience after sport belay: also not my sport device because grigri is more comfy in hangdoging and projecting ;) but anyways such a great device - so happy to own one 🤗 And best probs for the engineering! To be honest I have drawn a scetch for a device maybe 10 years ago looking almost the same. My idea was also to have a bedirectional device alowing dynamic rope slip and having dead-man function… the only difference in the idea was the principle of it. The plan was building a fluid mechanical break (turbo / retarder / converter transmission…) slowing the climber down to an acceptable constant descending speed. But I think the centrifugal lock is the better option for such a compact and cheap design anyways. Also seen in the petzl asap and the sp. Yes, I do understand your way of seconding as a climb… and until now this was my approach as well. But as I would like to go big (lenght and grade), I think I have to find the fastest and most energy saving method for seconding 🤗 and yes, industrial / tree climbers are the most promissing consultants here… meanwhile I got some inspiration from an first ascender and a sports photographer today 🤗 Yeah, again I want to say thanks for your work and maybe we will see each other in the mountains some time ;) Cheers Chris

Btw… the „second level locking“ is actually more first level :D

@andreastrunz2066 Hi again, I just realised a possible danger if blocking the nose of Revo with tape… as the nose is also activating the steel wire for holding the rope tight, the rope is able to slip through the grooves of the wheel even if the wheel is locking… this may be a bigger concern as the rope diameter used is closer to the 8.5mm (device rating: 8.5-something).

@@ChristianBehlen-fz4uz Thank you for your attentive thoughts! Two points calm my nerves in this regard: 1. The Duct Tape rips or stretches enough even through a static hang (I weigh 75kg). If you only use one or two slim strips of Duct Tape, I really don't see a chance of it resisting a fall. 2. If I remember correctly, the steel wire hasn't got a vital function for the REVO to block or not, but rather it was an answer for it to comply with the maximum slipping distance of the Norm EN 15151-1. Without the steel wire, in some cases the slippage was beyond that maximum, but not necessarily on thinner ropes - it occured rather on the stiffer ropes that produced kind of a whip lash. Personally, I am less worried about rope slippage. We are talking of a norm test fall of an 80kg steel weight producing almost a factor 2 fall. But again, due to point 1. above, all this is rather theory.

Thank you! I really appreciate your feedback. It sometimes does feel like a lot of effort for filming just a few sequences but good to hear that it's worth it. Happy rope-soloing! Cheers!

Thank you for these interesting thoughts. Congratulations for your Palmares! Why not share some of your experience in some form to help others progress? I think a lot of LRS climbers would appreciate learning from your vast experience. So you have been LRS climbing for a total of 82 years?! Grigri appeared in 1991 if I am not mistaken. I do have some concerns about safety argumentation ending with 'it has never failed'. Would be interesting to see the Eddy tested systematically in LRS setup. If you have any info to share, I'd love to hear from you. My email: info@auftriib.com Thanks!

I just can't see a possibility of an LRS system being up to a third faster than a team climb. Since we're talking about belaying systems, let's take the climbers' personal climbing skills out of the game and assume the classic setup to consist of two climbers with exactly your climbing skills. How can you be faster alone? 1. Leading: The perfect LRS setup would be just as fast on lead as a classic lead (belayed by your partner), but in reality will most likely be a bit slower, since you have some rope handling to manage that otherwise your partner manages while you progress). 2. Abseiling: let's assume you're down at the anchor just as fast as you'd pull in the slack and start belaying your seconding partner. 3. Seconding: Again, I assume an LRS seconding to be equally fast as when belayed from your partner. 4. Switching to the next lead: While I can swap leads with my seconding partner (who virtually doesn't need to stop at the anchor), on LRS you'll also have to bring your rope back up (and into the bag), right? In short, I see more elements to handle on LRS than with a partner. Or do I completely ignore something about your system that's so much faster than all other LRS setups? Would love to learn! Thank you!

Thank you. As this method provokes lots of questions, I decided to create a few videos to explain it in detail. Here's the playlist for them: th-cam.com/play/PLCWUb6uN8LiBwkFlNUr7X9WS53aUtNRHR.html&feature=shared Does this help?

Thank you! Or better say, thank my friend and filmer, Dominic. :-)

Hoi Peter, danke Dir! Zu Deinen Fragen empfehle ich Dir gerne die Playlist mit allen meinen Erklärvideos dazu: th-cam.com/play/PLCWUb6uN8LiBwkFlNUr7X9WS53aUtNRHR.html&feature=shared Zudem: Nein, keine REVO-Modifikationen (kann ich als ehemaliger Wild Country Vertreter nicht verantworten und sehe als Kletterer und Stürzender auch keine Notwendigkeit dazu. Bei einem Sturz blockieren die REVOs ganz normal, wie beim Vorstiegssichern, wenn das Seil zu schlapp gehalten wird. Dann ziehst Du einfach beide Seile (am freien Ende) nach unten, um die beiden REVOs wieder zu 'deblockieren' und kannst entweder abseilen oder gleich weiterklettern. Hoffe das hilft! LG Andy

Thank you! And I fully agree on your point regarding falls. The system must absolutely be solid for taking falls, be it expected ones when working on a crux or unexpected ones (for example when ripping a hold). I wouldn't have shared my system if I hadn't tested it with several falls as well. We actually have footage of a few falls but haven't found time for editing yet. Will publish them asap!

*self-camming, not auto belay *devices😂

@coryupton669 I do this so as to prevent the REVOs from locking off involuntarily during the lead climb when moving very closely to the rock. The duct tape prevents the nose from catching on the rock but will rip in case of a fall (and even if it didn't, the REVO would still lock off, there are two locking 'modes' as you probably know).

These are rather cheap 8.5mm Tendon half ropes. I haven't done any systematic testing of different half ropes. Except for Edelrids Protect Line (with Aramid fibers in their sheaths which cause too much friction in the REVO and can actually fail in a norm fall), the REVO has been tested with various ropes available on the market and I would feel comfortable using any standard 8.5mm dynamic half rope from the market, like Edelrid Kestrel or Beal Opera.

ideally, I would test a rope with the REVO in a couple of hard falls (with a backup) to see if it remains without traces on the sheath. That helps me to feel safe on bigger climbs afterwards.

Thank you @coryupton669 - I appreciate your feedback!

@coryupton669 the MicroTraxions are my cache loop managers. Please check out the rest of this video tutorial series for more details on that. The route in this video here was too short for them to come into play (usually I need them after about 20m of climbing).

No? Does this feeling result from your personal experience? Have you seen any rope damages in real climbing environments? Personally I have never seen any signs of damage nor wear on my ropes after normal falls. I have seen the reports of damaged ropes in very hard test setups (for example concrete blocks being dropped) but never had any issues myself. Will do further testing though.

avs.edelrid.com/images/attribut/EN_15151-1.pdf

i bought one and did a test drop with myself....i got me in the end but the rope didnt look good. it didnt brake because i droped from a smal distance. i will never use Revo ever again. For the TRS i have more confidence in the Goblin and i want to buy El Modo to see if it is better

Yes I feel safe, especially having two REVOs on two separate ropes. Never seen any signs of damage on my ropes after my falls. I don't see many realistic scenarios that could result in forces greater than the ones from the EN 15151-1 norm testing. Do you?

i did one test with 10 mm beal rope. not a big fall, but it didnt go very well, and the rope was damaged. i never trust Revo , ever

Thank you, @bashermus8314! Glad to hear if it inspires new ideas. Regarding the most important question: I can highly recommend Appenzeller Beer. :-) Their sealing rings are perfectly elastic. Plus, getting to 15 rings doesn't feel like work. :-)

No modification made to the REVOs.

No, I do not like the idea of modifying this device.

Thank you @emilianorosso1113 for bringing up this idea. I am not sure, though, if I understand it completely. Would you have to create a loop? I mean would the rope have to be directed through a karabiner at the belay?

@@andreastrunz2066 I have a picture for you but I can't post it here . Have you a facebook account? Thanks.

Sorry, I am not sure I do understand your setup right… But if I do, I cant imagine a worse system 🙈 … As I understand you want to attach one of the ends of your single rope to your harnes, loop the rope through all quick-draws, the last belay and back to you through all quickdraws again, and then in your revo!? This would become the rope drag nightmare. And safety… no redundancy at all: single rope cut-> fall to ground; revo fails-> fall to the ground Maybe I did not understand… but what i understand 🙈🙈🙈

Thank you @novadea1643 . Have you checked my other videos of this series? There's more about the WHY and also the gear used (half ropes, 8.5mm, but other types may work as well). Regarding the PAS: This is a basic rule in my eyes (not to risk a fall into your PAS of whatever type, ever). Personally, I see one rather hypothetical advantage of the Connect Adjust and one practical disadvantage for my personal use, that's why I stick to the looped daisy chain (works better for me for clipping the bag onto it when stacking the ropes).

​@@andreastrunz2066 Yes I did check out a bit of the other videos after making the comment but it was already late so didn't have time to watch them fully. Thank you for the answers, especially regarding the use of daisy chain as PAS. It's a very good rule of thumb to never risk falling on your PAS (of course accidents do happen) and indeed assumed you're fully aware of all the risks involved and have a good reason for using a daisy chain etc.. The Connect Adjust suggestion was meant more as a general "if you're thinking of doing this, might also want to consider getting a PAS with dynamic rope" than specifically at you, thou granted anyone that would benefit from that suggestion probably shouldn't be thinking about lead soloing with any kind of setup 🤔. Thank you for the in depth explanation and demonstration of your setup, safe sendings💪.

I would say €400 max., counting the regular gear like half ropes, harness, quickdraws, locking karabiners etc. as given. So the €400 refer to the two REVOs, two Micro Traxions and 5 Anti-Twist HMS (backfeed brakes). Not counting the dozen of bottles of beer needed for the rubber rings!

Thank you, @jansveen. I know it's a lot to explain in order for the whole picture to make sense. Probably the best way will be to show the entire process 'live' on a real climb (will be a lot of work for my filmmaker friend...). Have you checked out my other videos of this LRS playlist? Like this one: th-cam.com/video/GITTiX4keNo/w-d-xo.html Maybe that helps already.

Cheers! No cans though! :-)

Oui il en existent plusieurs vidéos sur TH-cam qui montrent le fonctionnement lors d'une chute. Mais je vais filmer une chute et le montrer ici dès que possible.

@@andreastrunz2066 merci+++++++++

Thank you @pauldavies5541 for bringing this up. 1. This is not about Top Rope Soloing. I can recommend @YannCamusBlissClimbing 's TRS course if interested. 2. I wouldn't recommend the REVO for TRS either. 3. REVO locks at 4m/s. 4. I don't understand your theory about the rope passing through the REVO faster on a classic partner belay? Can you explain? 5. The REVO's locking speed is my least concern on lead. --> I recommend testing this (any) setup on lead with a top rope backup: tie into the backup rope with the amount of slack you're comfortable with falling (remember rope stretch vs. the ground!).

What are you talking about? Everything falls with the same acceleration, the rope doesn't magically extend 2x just because it's clipped on the other side of the rope

The two. Please check out this series' first episode about the WHY: th-cam.com/video/Df0o2Kk2UkU/w-d-xo.html

No it's in Eastern Switzerland, St. Gallen. Wanted to film on a multi pitch route in the Alpstein, but it was all wet on that day.

@@andreastrunz2066 gotcha! looks exactly like a climb here in the states.

​@@andreastrunz2066Wo in SG ist dieser Brückenpfeiler? Würde das gerne auch einmal klettern.

@pie8882 thanks for pointing out questions that may arise when watching this episode alone. Or did you watch the other episodes (1-3) as well? Those should answer your questions. If not, please get back to me and I'll see how I can explain better.

My filmmaker friend and I thought it'd be better to split the content into six episodes since there's so many facets to the method. What we didn't cover is the basics of LRS (backfeeding, cache management etc.), there's so much content out there on those already. Maybe there's a way of linking the individual episodes to each other so people don't take any of them as a standalone message.

And no, there's no belayer of course. :-) Just my filmmaker friend and me. The spot wasn't ideal for filming as mentioned in the description. Hope we can deliver an update from a real multi pitch wall.

Thank you @nomorepoliticians! Cya on the wall!

Depending on the route. 50m x 8.5mm in most cases.

Depending on the route. 50m x 8.5mm in most cases.

Does it work with thicker ropes?

Thank you, @andicolera3922!

Thank you, @1STstream. Regarding your questions: Please check out the other videos from this series. Should answer three of your questions. Yes I have fallen on this setup. No twisting, no damage to the ropes' sheath so far. There are reports of really hard (close to factor 2) falls where the single rope got damaged inside the locked REVO. With this setup I see ways of handling situations with a high risk of a hard fall (half rope technique, separating the two strands or providing some slack on only one rope to have some energy absorbed by the first rope's stretch and then the 'fresh' second rope). I haven't tested such techniques in real life yet; I mainly use this setup for easier long routes.

The Eddy and Taz Lov and El Mudo are all acceptable solutions that in many ways far surpass the Silent Partner in terms of functionality.

@@RickyHarlineyes but the Revo is the only device that will lock in an inverted upside down fall.

@@Sierranite I've used it quite a bit for LRS, it's nice but rapping on it sucks as does following on it. Makes for a great secondary device IMO but I want more functionality out of my primary.

Haha, no need to promote my channel. Just sharing my niche method for a niche discipline within climbing. :-)

No I don’t use backup knots. The quest for a setup that doesn’t require backup knots for me to feel safe was the actual motivation and reason for this method. For me, backup knots were the main ‚flow killers‘.

@Andreas Trunz fair point! I absolutely agree that it's a flow killer. Great video btw! Hope to see more contents like this.

Thank you, @aelena74. Yes exactly, double fisherman knot. The cord has a dyneema core and a PA sheath.

Yes I have taken falls. We can take some falls on camera next time we get to film some more climbing sequences.