The Cave of Bad Ideas has been good for your delivery/presentation. Together with the much-appreciated compression edits, your posts deliver great content with efficiency and good humor. Thanks!
Everyone! Buy this guy a beer or all the 11s shifters! Is there anyone else that makes this kind of content that is so good and awesome? Mvh. Janne from Finland/sweden
I ran into Ratio by accident on Instagram last September... I got in touch with them and patiently awaited til they released the kit and then bought it right away. I’m loving it. Btw I put on an NX level 12-speed cassette (11-50) which fits a standard shimano/sram freehub. 12 speed mullet without the need for an XD driver
The bombora, "Snip snap, snip snap, snip snap! You have no idea the physical toll!!" You really should put together an e-book or something like that collates and documents "The Budget Mullet". I would buy that.
Dear Russ, I'm thrilled to see your videos experimenting with hacks and "mullet" combinations. Thanks so much!! 👍 For years I've been "banging my head" as I continually upgrade my 2012 SURLY Disc LHT from 9...to 10...and now 11 speeds, whilst keeping my drops and bar-end shifters and stretching the limits w/3x & 11-42t for touring when wide range cassettes were very new. I often heard "That's impossible!", so had to learn about compatibility on my own. It's great to finally have some SMART help - and to be introduced to different techniques and gadgets that will really make my bike's drivetrain and gear suit me! Thanks for all your wonderfully creative work! 💕🚴💕
It is worth noting that although you can only replace the fin on a GX or higher you can take a "donor" fin from any 11 speed Sram road derailleur even Apex1 but you have to drill the head off of the riveted pin to remove it (and maybe drill out the hole to fit the GX pin?). I only mention it because depending on where you live, what you or your LBS might have in a parts bin or what you can find searching "spares or repairs" on ebay it could be a cheaper/quicker option for you.
@@Siravingmon Oh yeah if you and you really want 12 speed, its almost a no brainer. If you just want to be able to use a MTB rear mech at 11 speed with your existing equipment though, you may already have everything you need apart from the GX rear mech of course. Then again looking at the price some used bike parts are changing hands at right now it might actually work out cheaper to sell your old rear mech and buy the £25 fin kit There is a battered apex long cage on eBay now and the bidding is up to £38!
@@Bikey_McBeardface Thanks but I'm confused now - I thought that even with a GX Eagle MTB rear mech I needed the adapter fin to use a bar end (road) shifter with it
@@Siravingmon Sorry for any confusion caused I`ll try to explain. The Adaptor fin is really just a copy of the standard fin that comes on Srams 11s road derailleurs, so it stands to reason that if you are considering this mod you are already running a compatible Sram group set (Apex, Rival....etc) and you must already have a derailleur with the fin you need, so if you don`t mind rendering the original derailleur unusable, you can just transplant the fin from it to the GX. If you are building from the ground up and buying everything separately then you would need to buy the fin, or buy a used derailleur to donate its fin (which my be cheaper if you can find a broken derailleur on eBay or something)
Hey! Just wanted to say thanks for showing us the work you did with your Crust in the stand. I’m new to working on my bike and it’s so helpful to watch other people do it.
friction shifting for life baybeeeee for real though, most modern bike stuff doesn't do it for me, but i could watch Russ nerd out for hours. thanks Russ
Very cool. It's kind of like Paul components selling the Klamper brakes with replaceable arms for standard pull, long pull, and Campy so you can use them with any lever. It would be so great if SRAM and Shimano could come out wish something similar for their derailleurs if all it takes is a slightly different shaped piece to get the right cable pull.
Excellent timing! I've been looking hard at these kids and upgrading my old SRAM Rival 10spd shifters to 11. Getting to use a MTN derailleur is just gravy. EDIT: The algorithm is working OT tonight. Just saw the date on this.
I discovered your channel a yesterday with your video about why you were going from a mullet back to a 2x set up. I thought that was a good video. I really like your placement of the jtek cable pull adapter as it puts the barrel adjuster at the cockpit so you can make derailleur adjustments on while you're riding. That's one thing about my cross bikes that I've never liked. I really miss late 90s Shimano 9 speed interchangeability between road and mtb drivetrains.
Agreed 1000% that it’s super lame of SRAM not to offer this as an OEM option. I did this hack last year on a build, and I’m planning the full 12s Ration install on my next build. I’m pretty tired of reading bike reviews that criticize supposed off road touring dropbar bikes of being geared too high from the factory when all SRAM would need to do to fix it would be to build some Eagle mechs with the road cable fin. It makes no sense. GIVE THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT!!!
I use the ratio kit to run 1x12 on the road and gravel. Two wheelsets, one with a 10-36, and one with a 10-44 cassette. Allows for one bike to act as two.
Russ - I believe the SRAM NX 12sp cassette uses standard 9-10sp hubs/ cassette body. It’s made to retrofit for 12sp. Not that you need another drivetrain option...
Any chance you would do a Shimano version of the budget mullet some things that I would like to see your opinions on: * [9|10]-46 cassette on a GRX derailleur * Garbunk cassette extender on the GRX derailleur with 50 tooth cassette
Grx rd rx400 is 10speed rear derailleur, and going to 46t maybe just need a rd extender or if you have enough budget, then go for the rd rx812, it can take 42t by default, going to 46 will be much easier perhaps just turn the b screw to max
I did this mod in August 2019 after researching it and finding someone that did it on Pink Bike forums. I had to piece it together with a donor SRAM Force RD that I took the fin and barrel adjuster off of.. I bought a thrashed Force RD on eBay to save some money. I would have really appreciated this kit then.
So a while back I bought me a touring bike and it had one of these pully devices on it and I had no clue what it was, why it was needed, or how it works. It is mounted in a place that prevents me from being able to hook my bike trailer to the bike and I was wanting to do something with it. I now know what it is way it's there, how I can more it or ultimately remove it. Thank you
I just used the ratio kit. I have a sram force shifter paired with a 12 speed eagle MTB drive train. Works perfectly. It's not super hard to modify the shifter. But if you're not mechanically inclined the fin is a much easier option.
Hi Russ I'm assuming you have a Garbaruk cassette on shimano freehub, which is supposed to be Shimano RD compatible only. I did the same setup as you with a sunrace 11s cassette and it's just not possible to index correctly 😢 I've been told by ratio tech that shimano and sram 11s mtb cassettes just don't have the same cogs spacing, so i'm wondering how you could get this to shift properly. I guess I need to go 12s to get a proprer wide range sram cassette, kind of a disappointment for me...
Are there any options for 10-52 11 speed cassettes? Thats a reason to go 12spd otherwise. So if you are going 12 speed you just need the shifter mod, not the derailleur mod?
😮 Thanks Russ! Sram is too busy focusing on electronic drivetrains to offer this as an option. Maybe someday we’ll see more mechanical stuff from them.
Hard to tell from the camera angle but how well does the derailleur keep the chain wrapped around the bottom of the cassette at each cog? It is hard to design a derailleur cage that allows the upper jockey wheel to follow the curvature of the stack of cogs. Most move along a straight line by Campy has been working on non-linear movement.
@@PathLessPedaledTV yes, I see it shifts nicely. The question is how well the chain distributes the load over the teeth of the cogs. The fewer the teeth (because the upper jockey wheel is far from the lower teeth of the cog) the more quickly the cog and chain will wear. I think this may be a difference between a road and mountain derailleur.
Offset upper pulley. The b-gap is bigger on the larger cogs and smaller on the smaller cogs so you get decent chain wrap in every gear. Google it, you'll find all the info you need.
Wow, 100k subscribers. I done 11 speed garbaruk cassette 50t w/ cage and I just couldn't get to run smoothly. It works, but not when I put power down. So I bit the bullet a week ago and got ratio with sram eagle 52t
Russ, question if you don't mind. I run a 2x8 with 50/34 and 12-46 cassette. TRP spyre calipers and either microshift or claris levers. My problem is, I can't find a good long cage derailleur. The microsift R8 I'm using is...not great. At this time I'm pretty happy with the gearing, but do you know of a better front and rear derailleur I could use without having to buy a whole new group set?
hey there, i'm trying to find your video where you paired a Shimano long cage road rear derailleur with a 40-tooth rear cassette. can you point me to that one? thanks
I have a 9 speed sram xo blackbox derailleur and it has enough range to work with an xx1 eagle 12 speed cassette. Its lighter than the xx1 derailer. I need to change the pull ratio in it to make it shift. Can anyone help? Yes ik ik I ha e other things to do to the derailer I'm not worried about that.
Russ - be good to see a video where you add a front derailleur to the Bombora. Crust claim it's doable but don't seem to share the secret suggesting it's a prime video opportunity for The Cave of Bad Ideas.
What a bummer that the mullet problem is getting solved just as I’ve been forced to convert my bikes to Jones Bars. Apparently, two bulged neck disks aren’t compatible with drop bars.
You can also modify the sram 11-Speed mechanical shifters to shift 12 and 13 speed-cassettes. There is a company in germany that does the modification for you.
@@PathLessPedaledTV Thank you for your swift replay. I'm thinking upgrading from standart 11-34 shimano to 11-46T Garbaruk. Do I also have to upgrade to long cage?
So I am hella confused, Sram road and MTB is all a 1:1 pull ratio. I've been running road shifter and mtb drivetrain with no adapters for a while now. Can someone tell me what I am missing?
@@PathLessPedaledTV and, if I am correct, even 10-speed was "Exact Actuation" which is not 1:1, so 10spd shifters wouldn't work with 9spd derailleurs, etc.
@@HollyBoni So the NX/GX 11 speed and NX/GX Eagle 12 speed rear mechs are 1:1 according to my supplier website as is the 11 road & 12 speed mtb shifters. I am currently running a Force 11 speed shifter set linked to a X01 11 speed rear mech on my gravel bike. Shifts great. I am getting this info straight off the white papers from the manufacturer listed on one of my suppliers doc folders.
I run goat link 11 with 11-50 cassette and full grx rx 812 shifters. Runs smooth, but is takes some time to adjust ad the start... Which cassette arw you are running there? No goat link or something used?
Stall out? Hell no. On the MTB side 12spd has been going full steam ahead for a few years. SRAM came out with Eagle in 2016!!! 12spd is already at SX and Deore level. 12spd stuff is more widely used, available, and good there. The same thing is gonna happen in the drop bar world, and we'll only see budget groups use 11spd like Deore M5100 does now, at least from Shimano and SRAM. I don't think SRAM even a new 11spd MTB groupset. Gravel/adventure/curly bar off road stuff is simply following MTBs but it's a few steps behind. We're seeing old "inventions" released again like they're new and revolutionary. Wider tyres, suspension, droppers, clutch RDs, wider range gearing, lower gearing, wider bars etc. One of those next "inventions" is gonna be 12spd, and you'll see marketing slogans like "now your adventure bike is even more versatile and capable thanks to our revolutionary 12spd tech (that's only 5 years old), so you can go further and explore more places". Okay that was a pretty bad marketing slogan but you get the point. 😅
@@PathLessPedaledTV Can you explain the disadvantage you see with the 9-46 cassette compared to the 11-50 setup? Also, will this work for a 40T chainring and is the rear derailleur also 11-speed or 12-speed or does it even matter? Thanks Russ!
@@davidf1288 need to change the freehub to run 9 tooth. Also extreme bends in the chain wear it out faster. Also I personally don’t need a gear that high so not much to gain for me.
Thanks for this. Great clear video as always! I'm putting together my bike at the moment. Am I right in thinking I'll need this mod you describe for 11 s SRAM indexed bar end shifters to work with an Eagle GX rear derailleur and 11 tooth cassette? Otherwise I’ll have to use their (RH)non indexed bar end shifter.
Cool stuff! But Russ: why no love for the ol 'wide-step' double setup you once enjoyed?? 2X = no compromise on either the top or low end! Sugino makes a great one for the roadie types and you've reviewed SRAM's mtb doubles positively before (SRAM 10-speed road shifters talk perfectly with 1:1 rear derailers)
Because it would take 2x as much time to uncable and recable and film everything. :) These short videos actually take hours to do in a freezing garage.
Wow, rad! Thanks for bringing this to our attention and doing the work to see if it works. Unrelated question but what is that fat-looking bar tape? Is it double wrapped or just a really thick tape?
Oh man, so that's why my sram gx derailleur won't work with the rival road shifters?! Damn it - it always jumps one wear in the middle of the cassette. All the time I was wondering, why it wouldn't shift properly.
Ok this is weird. A while ago I tried this hack using a GX rear derailleur and the fin from my Rival rear derailleur, as per the bike rumor article you mentioned, and.... It didn't work. It was like the fin had no effect. So I put the rival fin back on its own rd, and swapped the cages instead.
So, I"m looking at buying a used Kona Sutra. 99% of them come with Rival 11spd. So, you're telling me that if I already have a GX rear mech laying around, I can basically pull the fin off the Rival rear, install it on my old GX, and I'm good to go?
I have two friends that have bought gravel bikes, and of course, what are they doing? Changing the gearing. This is one of the reasons I have not bought a gravel bike, I can't get over the near-road bike gearing. (I also have 5-bikes; how many do you need?) Why should I buy a bike with a "gravel" group set, and then have to perform Civil War surgery on it to get the thing to work? I have to say, there are a couple bikes that do come with the gearing I would like, that ship with 42/28 cranks and 11-36 cassettes.
Oh come on, what a new crankset, cassette, new derailer and new chain and cables and tiny extra parts among friends? OK, seriously, I agree soooo much with you.
It's worse in mountain bikes - finding a modern MTB hardtail frame that can take a front derailleur in the first place is a nightmare at this stage, so you're stuck with 520% as the max range (Or 510% if you want a reliable setup that doesn't cost a fortune and stay with Shimano). I have found literally 2 fairly high end bikes (One is €1299, one is €2000) in total across the entire market that appear to be front derailleur compatible - nothing ships with a front derailleur at that price anymore. I also found one Ritchey hardtail frame that's not sold as a complete bike and then you're in to custom frame territory. In full suspension bikes I'm not sure there's anything at all.
@@peglor I hear you! People rib me about my old Haro Mary steel framed hardtail. It has a 9-speed, 44-32-22 triple coupled to an 11-34 cassette, and for gravel rides, mixed with hard pack trails, smooth single track, and paved multi-use paths, it works fine. Sometimes I'd like to get a more modern hardtail, but the drivetrain I would like to install, say the Deore 10 speed 2x system, I'm not sure will fit anything produced.
So to built one. My suggested combination is 3x9 with FC-T4010 44-32-22 and RD-T4000 with a 11-34 9s cassette shifted by ST-R3030/3000 and give 618% range and all operate within specification. The only adapter you need is the JTek-7 for a 3x MTB FD on the 50mm chainline and the 3x road pull ratios.
I just swapped out my GX derailleur off of my MTB (got tired of 12 speed and XD driver causing problems). I swapped the cable fins with my rival derailleur and now have the GX on my gravel/bikepacking rig! Dang it SRAM, why didn't you tell us at least? Why don't they sell the cable fins?
I don't know if I am going to offend you :-\ But is there some info on doing some sort of thing to 105 race shifters , combining it with an SLX rear derrailer. Yes I mean Shimano.... :-| Great videos btw :-)
The Cave of Bad Ideas has been good for your delivery/presentation. Together with the much-appreciated compression edits, your posts deliver great content with efficiency and good humor. Thanks!
Everyone! Buy this guy a beer or all the 11s shifters! Is there anyone else that makes this kind of content that is so good and awesome? Mvh. Janne from Finland/sweden
Buy him whiskey!
I ran into Ratio by accident on Instagram last September... I got in touch with them and patiently awaited til they released the kit and then bought it right away. I’m loving it. Btw I put on an NX level 12-speed cassette (11-50) which fits a standard shimano/sram freehub. 12 speed mullet without the need for an XD driver
The bombora, "Snip snap, snip snap, snip snap! You have no idea the physical toll!!"
You really should put together an e-book or something like that collates and documents "The Budget Mullet". I would buy that.
Thank you so much for making this video. Sacrificing your crust for the betterment of mankind is a noble task.
Hey, that's a great looking stack of spacers!
😂😂😂
Hell yeah! Looks like mine. I feel like a stack of spacers is a badge of DIY honor.
0:54 the sign lighted up at the perfect time 💯
Dear Russ, I'm thrilled to see your videos experimenting with hacks and "mullet" combinations. Thanks so much!! 👍
For years I've been "banging my head" as I continually upgrade my 2012 SURLY Disc LHT from 9...to 10...and now 11 speeds, whilst keeping my drops and bar-end shifters and stretching the limits w/3x & 11-42t for touring when wide range cassettes were very new. I often heard "That's impossible!", so had to learn about compatibility on my own.
It's great to finally have some SMART help - and to be introduced to different techniques and gadgets that will really make my bike's drivetrain and gear suit me!
Thanks for all your wonderfully creative work! 💕🚴💕
It is worth noting that although you can only replace the fin on a GX or higher you can take a "donor" fin from any 11 speed Sram road derailleur even Apex1 but you have to drill the head off of the riveted pin to remove it (and maybe drill out the hole to fit the GX pin?). I only mention it because depending on where you live, what you or your LBS might have in a parts bin or what you can find searching "spares or repairs" on ebay it could be a cheaper/quicker option for you.
@@Siravingmon Oh yeah if you and you really want 12 speed, its almost a no brainer. If you just want to be able to use a MTB rear mech at 11 speed with your existing equipment though, you may already have everything you need apart from the GX rear mech of course.
Then again looking at the price some used bike parts are changing hands at right now it might actually work out cheaper to sell your old rear mech and buy the £25 fin kit There is a battered apex long cage on eBay now and the bidding is up to £38!
@@Bikey_McBeardface Thanks but I'm confused now - I thought that even with a GX Eagle MTB rear mech I needed the adapter fin to use a bar end (road) shifter with it
@@Siravingmon Sorry for any confusion caused I`ll try to explain. The Adaptor fin is really just a copy of the standard fin that comes on Srams 11s road derailleurs, so it stands to reason that if you are considering this mod you are already running a compatible Sram group set (Apex, Rival....etc) and you must already have a derailleur with the fin you need, so if you don`t mind rendering the original derailleur unusable, you can just transplant the fin from it to the GX. If you are building from the ground up and buying everything separately then you would need to buy the fin, or buy a used derailleur to donate its fin (which my be cheaper if you can find a broken derailleur on eBay or something)
@@Bikey_McBeardface Thanks that's clear now. I'm building from scratch so I've just ordered the Ratio fin
Hey! Just wanted to say thanks for showing us the work you did with your Crust in the stand. I’m new to working on my bike and it’s so helpful to watch other people do it.
Love your perspective and down-to-earth rational approach to everything Bikes! Once again a great video!
friction shifting for life baybeeeee
for real though, most modern bike stuff doesn't do it for me, but i could watch Russ nerd out for hours.
thanks Russ
All this rerouting and parts surgery makes me appreciate my 9 speed Advent system just a little more!
The party pace lighting timing absolutely spot on.
This is a brilliant solution to the "big problem" SRAM & Shimano have handed us. Thanks Russ!
The only thing the industry hadn't lied about is tubeless tires.
Very cool. It's kind of like Paul components selling the Klamper brakes with replaceable arms for standard pull, long pull, and Campy so you can use them with any lever. It would be so great if SRAM and Shimano could come out wish something similar for their derailleurs if all it takes is a slightly different shaped piece to get the right cable pull.
Your shifting performance will be more immune to friction interfering if you mount the jtech shifter closer to your shifter with your combo.
My man's seeming over winter and being locked in a cold shed. It's been a long winter. This spring will be one of the best to ride ever!
Someone or some company needs to donate a dedicated Cave of Bad Ideas bike to Russ. The Crust is too beautiful to live on the stand
Excellent timing! I've been looking hard at these kids and upgrading my old SRAM Rival 10spd shifters to 11. Getting to use a MTN derailleur is just gravy. EDIT: The algorithm is working OT tonight. Just saw the date on this.
I discovered your channel a yesterday with your video about why you were going from a mullet back to a 2x set up. I thought that was a good video. I really like your placement of the jtek cable pull adapter as it puts the barrel adjuster at the cockpit so you can make derailleur adjustments on while you're riding. That's one thing about my cross bikes that I've never liked. I really miss late 90s Shimano 9 speed interchangeability between road and mtb drivetrains.
Such a great video. Just ordered the fin! Thanks Russ. Can't wait til the ride review!
So glad to hear Archer.....it’s not cheap but I’ve been using it for years!
friction shifters work on all...but i like that this product exists.
Agreed 1000% that it’s super lame of SRAM not to offer this as an OEM option. I did this hack last year on a build, and I’m planning the full 12s Ration install on my next build. I’m pretty tired of reading bike reviews that criticize supposed off road touring dropbar bikes of being geared too high from the factory when all SRAM would need to do to fix it would be to build some Eagle mechs with the road cable fin. It makes no sense. GIVE THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT!!!
Greed on the part of SRAM, when sales of eTAP/AXIS groupsets taper off, then they'll think about offering mechanical 1x12. :(
I use the ratio kit to run 1x12 on the road and gravel. Two wheelsets, one with a 10-36, and one with a 10-44 cassette. Allows for one bike to act as two.
Cave of Good Ideas!
I see that oval chainring. When are you going to talk about that? Our did I miss it already?
Russ - I believe the SRAM NX 12sp cassette uses standard 9-10sp hubs/ cassette body. It’s made to retrofit for 12sp. Not that you need another drivetrain option...
I love the kickstand! ;)
Microshifter has road shifters that works with their rear derailleur. Think you can go 11-46 at least.
Any idea if this will work with a 2x GX derailleur? Ratio said it was not designed to but wondering if anyone has tried it.
Any chance you would do a Shimano version of the budget mullet some things that I would like to see your opinions on:
* [9|10]-46 cassette on a GRX derailleur
* Garbunk cassette extender on the GRX derailleur with 50 tooth cassette
Grx rd rx400 is 10speed rear derailleur, and going to 46t maybe just need a rd extender or if you have enough budget, then go for the rd rx812, it can take 42t by default, going to 46 will be much easier perhaps just turn the b screw to max
I did this mod in August 2019 after researching it and finding someone that did it on Pink Bike forums. I had to piece it together with a donor SRAM Force RD that I took the fin and barrel adjuster off of.. I bought a thrashed Force RD on eBay to save some money. I would have really appreciated this kit then.
I forgot to mention, at the time I used Sram Apex 1 shifter, Sram GX Eagle RD, and Sun-Race 11-50.
Nice vid, just doing the adaptation myself, plus credit for the Seiko turtle or Willard? I can't see it properly..😉
The jtek by the handlebars is amazing. That's where mine is going now.
Love the videos . Keep up the great work!!!
So a while back I bought me a touring bike and it had one of these pully devices on it and I had no clue what it was, why it was needed, or how it works. It is mounted in a place that prevents me from being able to hook my bike trailer to the bike and I was wanting to do something with it. I now know what it is way it's there, how I can more it or ultimately remove it.
Thank you
Love it! Thank you Russ! I personally just ditch my grx rear derailleur and switch to sram seeing all the possibilities you can do on a budget.
I just used the ratio kit. I have a sram force shifter paired with a 12 speed eagle MTB drive train. Works perfectly. It's not super hard to modify the shifter. But if you're not mechanically inclined the fin is a much easier option.
If I use an Eagle GX 12 speed RD. What is the lowest tier SRAM RB brifters I can use with this modification? Will the Apex work? Thanks!
The wound makes the hack more personal. Including Russ's blood in the drivetrain
Hi Russ
I'm assuming you have a Garbaruk cassette on shimano freehub, which is supposed to be Shimano RD compatible only.
I did the same setup as you with a sunrace 11s cassette and it's just not possible to index correctly 😢
I've been told by ratio tech that shimano and sram 11s mtb cassettes just don't have the same cogs spacing, so i'm wondering how you could get this to shift properly. I guess I need to go 12s to get a proprer wide range sram cassette, kind of a disappointment for me...
Are there any options for 10-52 11 speed cassettes? Thats a reason to go 12spd otherwise.
So if you are going 12 speed you just need the shifter mod, not the derailleur mod?
My Apex shifters worked fine with X7 front and rear derailleurs many years ago, 10 speed
What size cassette is that one?
Do you think you could dremel off and tap the fin on the lower-level derailleur so you can bolt on the part from Ratio?
Nice! I was wondering when you were going to review this!
😮 Thanks Russ! Sram is too busy focusing on electronic drivetrains to offer this as an option. Maybe someday we’ll see more mechanical stuff from them.
I wonder if you can drill out the rivet on an NX and tap the hole to mount the Ratio Fin?
Which frame bag is that?
Hard to tell from the camera angle but how well does the derailleur keep the chain wrapped around the bottom of the cassette at each cog? It is hard to design a derailleur cage that allows the upper jockey wheel to follow the curvature of the stack of cogs. Most move along a straight line by Campy has been working on non-linear movement.
Well enough to work.
@@PathLessPedaledTV yes, I see it shifts nicely. The question is how well the chain distributes the load over the teeth of the cogs. The fewer the teeth (because the upper jockey wheel is far from the lower teeth of the cog) the more quickly the cog and chain will wear. I think this may be a difference between a road and mountain derailleur.
Offset upper pulley. The b-gap is bigger on the larger cogs and smaller on the smaller cogs so you get decent chain wrap in every gear. Google it, you'll find all the info you need.
@@HollyBoni thanks!!
Wow, 100k subscribers. I done 11 speed garbaruk cassette 50t w/ cage and I just couldn't get to run smoothly. It works, but not when I put power down. So I bit the bullet a week ago and got ratio with sram eagle 52t
Can you tell me what Brake/Shifter combo you are using? I have a Rival setup and want to know if this would work? Thanks, Russ!
Russ, question if you don't mind. I run a 2x8 with 50/34 and 12-46 cassette. TRP spyre calipers and either microshift or claris levers. My problem is, I can't find a good long cage derailleur. The microsift R8 I'm using is...not great. At this time I'm pretty happy with the gearing, but do you know of a better front and rear derailleur I could use without having to buy a whole new group set?
hey there, i'm trying to find your video where you paired a Shimano long cage road rear derailleur with a 40-tooth rear cassette. can you point me to that one? thanks
I have a 9 speed sram xo blackbox derailleur and it has enough range to work with an xx1 eagle 12 speed cassette. Its lighter than the xx1 derailer. I need to change the pull ratio in it to make it shift. Can anyone help? Yes ik ik I ha e other things to do to the derailer I'm not worried about that.
Friction shifter.
Russ - be good to see a video where you add a front derailleur to the Bombora. Crust claim it's doable but don't seem to share the secret suggesting it's a prime video opportunity for The Cave of Bad Ideas.
So what is the shifter? Could a shimano 9 speed shifter work on an 11 speed?
No. SRAM only.
Does this only work with eagle? Or a standard gx 1x derailleur
To my knowledge gx eagle and above. Could work if your fin is removable.
why dont they do this for the GX stuff? It would compete with their force lineup
So does he just use a 12x rear derailleur with a 11x cassette and it just works? Can someone clarify?
Yes with the ratio cable fin.
What a bummer that the mullet problem is getting solved just as I’ve been forced to convert my bikes to Jones Bars. Apparently, two bulged neck disks aren’t compatible with drop bars.
What shoe do u like for all day cycling touring northern tier Seattle to MI
Hey Russ, could you share the video you mentioned where someone does a 12-speed conversion with this kit?
th-cam.com/video/Kw1LyfkGZ_8/w-d-xo.html
You can also modify the sram 11-Speed mechanical shifters to shift 12 and 13 speed-cassettes. There is a company in germany that does the modification for you.
Hi, superb video! Are there similar solution available for Shimano GRX 11 speed?
Wolftooth TanPan
@@PathLessPedaledTV Thank you for your swift replay. I'm thinking upgrading from standart 11-34 shimano to 11-46T Garbaruk. Do I also have to upgrade to long cage?
Russ, are you using a Garbaruk oval chainring? Is there a video where you review it?
Absolute Black
Pretty slick set up for sure!!
I love this channel
What kind of rear cog set is that?
Answered that in the video.
So I am hella confused, Sram road and MTB is all a 1:1 pull ratio. I've been running road shifter and mtb drivetrain with no adapters for a while now. Can someone tell me what I am missing?
It’s not anymore. Compatibility stopped after 10spd. 11 above don’t talk to each other.
@@PathLessPedaledTV and, if I am correct, even 10-speed was "Exact Actuation" which is not 1:1, so 10spd shifters wouldn't work with 9spd derailleurs, etc.
Yep, you're not up to date. 1:1 was in the 9spd days. SRAM changed up the cable pull ratio a few times since then.
@@HollyBoni So the NX/GX 11 speed and NX/GX Eagle 12 speed rear mechs are 1:1 according to my supplier website as is the 11 road & 12 speed mtb shifters. I am currently running a Force 11 speed shifter set linked to a X01 11 speed rear mech on my gravel bike. Shifts great. I am getting this info straight off the white papers from the manufacturer listed on one of my suppliers doc folders.
Great stuff Russ! 👌
I run goat link 11 with 11-50 cassette and full grx rx 812 shifters. Runs smooth, but is takes some time to adjust ad the start... Which cassette arw you are running there? No goat link or something used?
I literally answer all those questions in the video.
I wonder if 12 and 13 speed parts and groups will stall out a bit because 11 speed is so well used, so available and so good?
Stall out? Hell no. On the MTB side 12spd has been going full steam ahead for a few years. SRAM came out with Eagle in 2016!!! 12spd is already at SX and Deore level. 12spd stuff is more widely used, available, and good there. The same thing is gonna happen in the drop bar world, and we'll only see budget groups use 11spd like Deore M5100 does now, at least from Shimano and SRAM. I don't think SRAM even a new 11spd MTB groupset.
Gravel/adventure/curly bar off road stuff is simply following MTBs but it's a few steps behind. We're seeing old "inventions" released again like they're new and revolutionary. Wider tyres, suspension, droppers, clutch RDs, wider range gearing, lower gearing, wider bars etc. One of those next "inventions" is gonna be 12spd, and you'll see marketing slogans like "now your adventure bike is even more versatile and capable thanks to our revolutionary 12spd tech (that's only 5 years old), so you can go further and explore more places".
Okay that was a pretty bad marketing slogan but you get the point. 😅
Thanks! That was very helpful. Subscribed!
Hey Russ, are you using an E Thirteen 9-46 cassette for greater range over the SRAM?
No. 9teeth weirds me out. Garbaruk 11-50
@@PathLessPedaledTV Can you explain the disadvantage you see with the 9-46 cassette compared to the 11-50 setup? Also, will this work for a 40T chainring and is the rear derailleur also 11-speed or 12-speed or does it even matter?
Thanks Russ!
@@davidf1288 need to change the freehub to run 9 tooth. Also extreme bends in the chain wear it out faster. Also I personally don’t need a gear that high so not much to gain for me.
great video! so, you are using GX 12s RD with no problems with a 11s cassette/chain?
yeah, works well enough.
Thanks for this. Great clear video as always! I'm putting together my bike at the moment. Am I right in thinking I'll need this mod you describe for 11 s SRAM indexed bar end shifters to work with an Eagle GX rear derailleur and 11 tooth cassette? Otherwise I’ll have to use their (RH)non indexed bar end shifter.
Thanks for hacking through the hack jungle to discover this, Russ. This is gold.
Russ, which setup did you feel worked better; this one or the Rival derailleur + Garbaruk cage?
Thanks Russ!
Please @ratiotechnology make a version which works with Shimano STIs!
Great video!
You only need 11 gears? What a retrogrouch!
Cool stuff! But Russ: why no love for the ol 'wide-step' double setup you once enjoyed?? 2X = no compromise on either the top or low end! Sugino makes a great one for the roadie types and you've reviewed SRAM's mtb doubles positively before (SRAM 10-speed road shifters talk perfectly with 1:1 rear derailers)
Because it would take 2x as much time to uncable and recable and film everything. :) These short videos actually take hours to do in a freezing garage.
Russ would be interested if this would work on a 2x with your favorite 40/24
No. 1x derailleurs won’t work with a 2x.
@@PathLessPedaledTV Thank you Russ whats your paypal?
Wow, rad! Thanks for bringing this to our attention and doing the work to see if it works. Unrelated question but what is that fat-looking bar tape? Is it double wrapped or just a really thick tape?
Wolftooth Supple Bar Tape
@@PathLessPedaledTV of course! Thanks again.
Oh man, so that's why my sram gx derailleur won't work with the rival road shifters?! Damn it - it always jumps one wear in the middle of the cassette. All the time I was wondering, why it wouldn't shift properly.
woah, so the cable enters the derailleur from the underside?? wild
What is a mullet setup
Mountain bike rear, road shifters front.
@@PathLessPedaledTV ah ok thx. I get a grx setup with a 2x 24/34 deore crank. That works fine for me.
Ok this is weird. A while ago I tried this hack using a GX rear derailleur and the fin from my Rival rear derailleur, as per the bike rumor article you mentioned, and.... It didn't work. It was like the fin had no effect. So I put the rival fin back on its own rd, and swapped the cages instead.
7:18 hahahaha! i had to watch that 3 times! go russ!!!
The bombora has been personified. Now I feel bad for it lol.
I’m more of a flat bar guy but it is cool to know this exists if I go drop bar.
So, I"m looking at buying a used Kona Sutra. 99% of them come with Rival 11spd. So, you're telling me that if I already have a GX rear mech laying around, I can basically pull the fin off the Rival rear, install it on my old GX, and I'm good to go?
Or put the Eagle cage onto the Rival derailleur. You'll get the same result either way.
I have two friends that have bought gravel bikes, and of course, what are they doing? Changing the gearing. This is one of the reasons I have not bought a gravel bike, I can't get over the near-road bike gearing. (I also have 5-bikes; how many do you need?) Why should I buy a bike with a "gravel" group set, and then have to perform Civil War surgery on it to get the thing to work? I have to say, there are a couple bikes that do come with the gearing I would like, that ship with 42/28 cranks and 11-36 cassettes.
Oh come on, what a new crankset, cassette, new derailer and new chain and cables and tiny extra parts among friends? OK, seriously, I agree soooo much with you.
It's worse in mountain bikes - finding a modern MTB hardtail frame that can take a front derailleur in the first place is a nightmare at this stage, so you're stuck with 520% as the max range (Or 510% if you want a reliable setup that doesn't cost a fortune and stay with Shimano). I have found literally 2 fairly high end bikes (One is €1299, one is €2000) in total across the entire market that appear to be front derailleur compatible - nothing ships with a front derailleur at that price anymore. I also found one Ritchey hardtail frame that's not sold as a complete bike and then you're in to custom frame territory. In full suspension bikes I'm not sure there's anything at all.
@@peglor I hear you! People rib me about my old Haro Mary steel framed hardtail. It has a 9-speed, 44-32-22 triple coupled to an 11-34 cassette, and for gravel rides, mixed with hard pack trails, smooth single track, and paved multi-use paths, it works fine. Sometimes I'd like to get a more modern hardtail, but the drivetrain I would like to install, say the Deore 10 speed 2x system, I'm not sure will fit anything produced.
So to built one. My suggested combination is 3x9 with FC-T4010 44-32-22 and RD-T4000 with a 11-34 9s cassette shifted by ST-R3030/3000 and give 618% range and all operate within specification. The only adapter you need is the JTek-7 for a 3x MTB FD on the 50mm chainline and the 3x road pull ratios.
Russ, are you going to do a review of you Washburn tires?
Eventually
Just got a GRX bike 🥰
I just swapped out my GX derailleur off of my MTB (got tired of 12 speed and XD driver causing problems). I swapped the cable fins with my rival derailleur and now have the GX on my gravel/bikepacking rig! Dang it SRAM, why didn't you tell us at least? Why don't they sell the cable fins?
I don't know if I am going to offend you :-\ But is there some info on doing some sort of thing to 105 race shifters , combining it with an SLX rear derrailer. Yes I mean Shimano.... :-|
Great videos btw :-)