Idk, I had never thought about it before but I think that may have drawn in the lgbtq community considering they are stranded on a deserted island. However, with Ginger & Maryann there I guess that the Professor was having more fun than the show let on.
The PRR (Pennsylvania RailRoad) actually had a small fleet of special flat cars for transporting Naval main gun barrels 12", 14", and 16" from wherever they were removed from the ship, to the gun re-lining facility at the Philadelphia Naval yard, and later at the Norfolk Naval yard in Virginia. These special cars could be dispatched from the East Coast to the West Coast, with re-lined barrels in six days, and be back in Philadelphia a little over a week later with the barrels that needed to be re-lined. I have a set of these models in HO scale on my RR. One set carrying 16" tubes, and another set carrying 14" tubes.
Anyone interested in subchasers in WW2 should read Edward P. Stanford’s book “Subchaser” about his time as CO of one before he became XO of a DE in the Pacific (which led to his book “Little Ship, Big War). Both are great reads!
Wow you got to meet Capt Brown ? A proper hero of mine and maybe the greatest pilot of all time. Was he as much a gentleman as he always seemed from his interviews ?
As somebody who also met him, I can say that he was indeed a gentleman. I had the chance to speak to him at a dinner in about 2010 or so and I asked if I could question him on a few things. Instead of his combat and testing career, I wanted to know what he had thought about Gagarin when he had the chance to interview him and his eyes lit up and he waxed on and on in great detail and then thanked me for not asking the same sorts of questions he always was and then we repaired to the bar and had a drink together
@@Boric78 It was and I am honoured to have had the chance to speak to him. The reason I think it was in 2010 or so is because the decommissioning of _Ark Royal_ was about to happen and I asked him what he thought about it and his views were rather strong
On Subchasers you should do a five minute guide on PC-1264 which not only served on anti-sub patrol in the Atlantic in WW2 but as one of 2 US Navy ships with African-American crews helped lead to the integration in the Navy post war. There is a good book written by her commander which I have a copy of and could send you if desired.
Technically the first carrier based jet was the little-known Ryan FR Fireball (though they only get half points as they were a mixed jet/propeller plane). VF-66 aboard the carrier Ranger was the first to receive them in March 1945, but due to the pilots having to get used to the handling characteristics they were never used operationally before the war ended.
Drach, if memory serves the first landing of a jet powered aircraft may have been one month earlier the Captain Brown's attempt - a Ryan FR Fireball landed on in November 1945 after the prop engine failed the pilot got the jet engine started and completed the landing recovery
For clarity. In material mechanics, strain is *defined* as the deformation of a material. Deformation is not the result of *applied* strain. It is the materials response to stress - typically, as caused by applied load(s) - ie force(s) - such as a torque.
I can expand a little on that: deformation can be expressed in length, strain is dimensionless: e.g. a percentage elongation of a material. Small stress = small strain can give large displacement / deformation if it is applied on a geometry with a long arm. E.g. a springcoil can have a relative large displacement, even thought the (torsional) strain in every piece of wire in the coil can be quite small. it is also why strength should not be confused with stiffness. Strength is a material property and local geometry, stiffness the result of both material and global geometry. E.g. a spingcoil is as strong as the weakest bit in the spring (like for instance a local crossection that is reduced due to a crack), where stiffness can be influenced by crossection of the wire diameter, the length of the coil (length, but also number of windings), overal coil diameter, etc.
Question: In an episode of the Great War covering early 1915, Indy states that the British and French were unwilling to open a campaign in the Adriatic against the Austro-Hungarians because they had "newly built dreadnoughts". This strikes me as odd, because the Tegetthoffs were not that new by comparison to what other nations had, in terms of technology and likely could be overcome. How would we define the threat that these ships pose? What constitutes a modern ship or an obsolete ship?
Very, very charitable to Max Hastings. Am not a huge fan of Monty, but he despises him repeatedly using slurs. And that's just a start, he's pretty bad.
Far from having only one or two classes in commissions in the 1980s, the US Navy had a proliferation of classes. Several people have already mention carriers so I will stick to surface combatants in comission taking 1985 as the base year. Frigates: Bronstein, Garcia, Brooke, Knox and Perry classes. All but the Perrys were originally classified as Ocean Escorts (DE) and reclassified as Frigates (FF) in 1975. Destroyers: Farragut, Adams and Spruances Classes. Cruisers: Leahy, Belknap, California, Virginia, Ticonderoga classes. The Farragut, and all but the Ticonderoga Classes were originally classified as DLG/N. However, they received that designation for their hull form and not for the naming convention. They were referred to as Frigates in the age of sail meaning. (NAVSOURCE). The Farraguts were reclassified as DDGs in 1975 and the remaining classes as cruisers in 1975. You could think of the DLGs as fhe equivalent of fifth and sixth rates in age of sail terminology or Atlanta class CLAAs of the modern era.
I generally agree with your assessment of Halsey. He built up a store of positive results pre war, the carrier raids and Solomons campaign that help his reputation. Beatty just didn’t have that store of positive results.
Halsey had built a considerable amount of public support due to his earlier results. The USN leadership did its best to avoid diminishing that reputation for years after WW II. For example, the fact that Halsey and his stuff were briefed on likely IJN deception tactics before the invasion of Leyte was not disclosed publicly until the official history was published. What went wrong at Jutland was a public debate by the day after the battle.
No, the "SC" designated hulls didn't serve in open oceans or within a fleet movement.....but- many had to cross open oceans & serve under BRUTAL conditions later on when they were given up in Soviet/US Lend/Lease programs in 1944. One such unit went down the ways, in my small home town of 10,000 people- in a tributary that leads into the Delaware Bay. 🚬😎👍
8:00 A 20-year old capital warship that is torpedoed several times and sinks more-or-less upright, and with its upper deck clear of the water, can be salvaged, especially if some or all of the main machinery and dynamo / generator spaces stay watertight. If that same warship is torpedoed even once and capsizes, it is irretrievably wrecked. Every major piece of equipment will, if not break completely free of its mountings, twist and warp all physical connections to the point that putting it right will be more work than building an entirely new ship of a modern design.
An Ammericans oppinion. Admiral Beatty strengths were not as a heroic at sea leadership. It is more difficult to admire a man that is good at paper shuffling and shmoosing polititions. Bill Halsey took a Navy that just had its teeth kicked in and successfully went on the offensive. It is a pitty that he hadn't been promoted out of command before the first typhoon.
I’ve probably heard this Drydock 4 or 5 times, and this is the first time I’ve heard you calling me out for being awake. Way to shame us sleepy time listeners! 😂 Never doubt that your videos are multipurpose; unparalleled educational material, and superb sleep aid.
Easter ....bunny's an jelly beans... ... Ham an pineapple easter? Discount chocolate easter! How ! How can it bee ! I missed easter? .. .. .. by three weeks or so , apparently..coupons!
Regarding the Japanese response to part of their force being sighted by the PBY on June 3rd, it really didn't make much difference based on their preconceived assumptions. Going into Midway, the Japanese were absolutely certain that the USN wouldn't know their plans until Nagumo actually struck Midway on the morning of the 4th, and that the American carriers would only sortie from Pearl Harbor after that happened. This was the bedrock assumption that the Japanese never seriously questioned - to the extent that during their wargames, the officer commanding the "enemy" (US) forces essentially wasn't allowed to do anything until the June 4 strike occurred. So from that perspective, a Midway-based PBY sighting part of their force a day before Nagumo was supposed to strike Midway anyway didn't really change anything. Maybe it meant the US carriers could sortie from Pearl Harbor (which was *of course* were they were) a little early, but there was still no *possible* way they could reach the Midway area on June 4. Hence being caught by surprise when it turned out their assumptions were all wrong and the US carriers actually *were* there.
TY Drachinifel , Your ocean of naval wisdom is always welcome at our house. Despite living on an Island (Vancouver Island) there is not much to document. We did build some few Flower class, and did receive tiny bombing, and shelling from minor Japanese forces, yet forgettable. Perhaps a TY for the RN forces , and Royal Marines , as they built the defenses of Fort Rodd Hill. 1896-1956.
A couple of points. First, I'm not sure if Drach's favorite word is but or however. But seriously, I think Halsey gets somewhat of a pass for his 44 and 45 screw ups because of his 42 performance.
Halsey had presided over the desperate and successful defense of Guadalcanal before going back to fleet command. He also never publicly tried to throw blame for his mistakes on his superior officers, and instead seems to have just got on with trying to remedy the situation. So - not Beatty.
Wasn't Ermie King an observer at the Sturdee versus Beatty exercise and the negative impression he got of Beatty was a major contributor to his dislike of the Royal Navy?
I thought that the last case of a US ship's crew receiving prize money was in 1941, when the USS Omaha (CL-4) took the German blockade runner SS Odenwald.
Along with the angled deck and mirror landing system another UK invention not mentioned here but which was critical to the USN was the steam catapult which was also demonstrated to the USN by Eric Brown. I can also wholeheartedly agree that for any naval enthusiast"Wings on my Sleeve"is an excellent read covering everything from his service in Martletts on the very first escort carrier HMS Audacity through his test piloting career and an interesting discussion of the air group of CVA-01 of which Brown would likely have been the first captain. It also gives a list which will never be matched of the different aircraft types(not marks of a type)that he flew
For a Navy that introduced almost every technical advance in carrier operations the Royal Navy has fielded very few first rate ships down to the present day. As was true with every British carrier afterHMS Ark Royal British carriers lacked punch compared to US and Japanese carriers. The CV-01 design continued that trend and had less striking power the an Essex class CVA.
As far as I know, the last case of prize money being paid out in the USN was actually after WW2, when the sailors of the USS Omaha claimed prize money for the boarding (afaik the last case of cutlasses being issued for a boarding action in the USN as well) and capture of the Odenwald (a German blockade runner) in November of 1941. They had to sue the US Government, and "Members of the Omaha's boarding party each won $3000, and the remainder of her crew won two months’ pay and allowances. The judgment was affirmed on appeal."
No, the crews of the Omaha and Somers along with the US government were given a reward for salvaging the Odenwald, not prize money. The United States was not at war so there was no enemy and they couldn't have taken a prize. However, as the German crew tried to scuttle her, the crews rescued a sinking vessel that had been abandoned by her crew which entitled them to compensation for salvaging the Odenwald. And far from having to sue the government, the United States government sued the owners of the Odenwald for the salvage reward for the government and the sailors.
For a book written by a submarine commander about his experiences in WWII, I agree with Drach, if it's a good book, regardless of style, I will read it. I have two recommendations: Paul Schratz: "Submarine Commander: A Story of World War II and Korea" Ignatius J. Galantin: "Take Her Deep! A Submarine Against Japan in World War II"
Being Wikipedia, I can't be sure if this is absolutely correct, but this is what they say about the US Pacific fleet: Until May 1940, the Battle Force was stationed on the West Coast of the United States. Headquarters, battleships, aircraft carriers and heavy cruisers were stationed at San Pedro close to the Long Beach Naval Shipyard. Light cruisers, destroyers and submarines were stationed at San Diego.
Monitor had a significant advantage in speed and manouverability over Virginia. Another day of combat constituted a significant mechanical risk for the Confederate's propulsion unit. If Virginia was totally subject to tide and wind, it is likely she would have been hung up on sand bank and scuttled.
Loving this - but, and this is not an April Fool's joke, when you were talking about sailor's pay being paid out to family ashore my ears perked up. You said something like 'spee kee' for "specie" but checking both my US college dictionary and the OED, the pronunciation is 'spee she' when talking about the coins of a sailor's pay.
There are several places in Scotland called Tarbert. It is derived from the Gaelic for across-carrying. They are usually on an isthmus or narrow strip between the sea and a inland Loch. They are points where the Vikings and native Scots carried ships and goods from one bit of water to another.
Who was closer laffy or some of the destroyers in Narvik? I recall in that battle mention of Pom-pom gunners taking cover from the shrapnel of their own rounds
YOU MET WINKLE? so jealous. I hope you treasure the 5 minutes- i am pretty sure you will- planes may not be your first love, but - that man was special...:)
Regarding: 00:44:50 - 'Fake fighting' at sea? and the comments about "one broadside for honour" I seem to recall reading of at least one case on land, i think during WW2 - maybe the German garrison of Cherbourg, or one of the other 'stay-behind' channel ports - of the garrison commander being willing to surrender but only on condition the allies produce at least one tank to fire a token shot at his position to 'justify' his 'honourable surrender', which is the same kind of idea albeit applied to the 'other side' rather than a shot fired as a token resistance.
The unrotated projectile was the platform on which the radar proximity fuze was first tested in the UK before being demonstrated in the USA as part of the Tizard mission.
Thanks and 👍. Asking an intelligent is beyond me, but here goes. Did you have time to visit the submarine next to the uss Olympia? If that sub is still there. P.S.if you are ever back in Philly and drunk and bored at 4:30 am you can thow pennies on Benjamin Franklin grave from standing on the sidewalk at 5th and Arch, yes it's legal. I think he had something to do with the Poor Richard so too keep with your naval theme.
Would it have been more practical, quicker and cost efficient, to reline Richelieu's and Jean Bart's guns to accept US 14 inch projectiles. Presuming the French national pride could be swallowed for practicality?
I think part of the reason Halsey is more forgiven for his errors and maintains a relatively good reputation is because of the American mindset toward his mistakes and failings. It seems like often museums in the US glorify Halsey's aggression and tenacity to a point that it almost becomes "never too much of a good thing" and the mistakes are glossed over as being an acceptable consequence for his skill. Additionally I think that many histories originating in the US depict him as being the kind of aggression and bull-headedness that America needed after Pearl Harbor and so his failures are again just glossed over as both being necessary for his command style to work and a consequence of America's "unexpected" involvement in WWII and the Navy's growing pains as it learned to fight. Lastly and somewhat related I think that some of his mistakes are actually glorified as not necessarily being mistakes. For example, his aggression in chasing the Japanese decoy fleet is good because he wanted to eliminate the Japanese fleet, there was no way he could have known what would happen and aggression was part of the American mindset. Additionally leading his forces into typhoons is a badass feat of command showing how nothing would stop the Navy now and of course there was no way he. Ould have known what would happen so hey he did his best. Not agreeing with the idea though but this seems to be a common conception in the US, that he was an excellent admiral with few if any failings.
Heh. Funnily enough, I have been reading Cain books recently and yeah, Jenet Sulla's particular brand of purple prose is pretty painful. By contrast, I quite enjoyed Silmarillion's style, although I will readily admit that it is an acquired taste.
The Battle of Hampton Roads was a tactical draw as neither vessel could end end the other as a threat to the goals each hoped to achieve. At the end of the day the Virginia was undone by events on land rather than anything to do with results of inconclusive combat. It was simply a forlorn hope that Virginia could lift the blockade in any case. While she could deny the North the use of Norfolk’s maritime facilities, and made the actual blockade more difficult , the Union forces would simply move operations off shore as they did other Confederate ports, Charleston, erc….
There are also reports of the mental state of Japanese violets after coming back from facing American anti aircraft aboard ships, indicating how they were badly mentally affected by it. Ptsd.
thanks Drach :) for more awesomeness. Also you may use skipper for reference to ships pilots when you have a captain on the bridge and a pilot on the wheel you may use skipper to reference the pilot to save on confusion.
AH that makes sense,, I notice also on smaller ships and especially very small like a PT boat or these SCs that since the CO is usually a lieutenant,, they're addressed as "Skipper" rather than captain most of the time...
What are some of the most over exaggerated or over stated ship careers and performances? I’d say IJN Kongo at the battle off Samar, the Iowas engaging convoys off Truk during operation Hailstone, and USS West Virginia’s performance at Surigao Strait.
Halsey was a good commander, no doubt about it. It is also true that he led his ships into a typhoon, not once but twice! While he was a good commander one might question his status as a seaman.
Even today it's hard to predict the course of these storms. There are lots of people in Florida USA who left the path of a recent hurricane based on the predicted track, only to find themselves in the center of the path when the storm shifted from the original prediction. Back then they didn't have weather satellites and tracking of big storms was a lot harder. Also note that the speed of ships goes down as the wave height increases, which makes evading the storm harder if you get caught on the edges. This is especially true for the smaller ships - which also burn fuel a lot faster when the wave height goes up. I'll also note that despite a lot of training, and paying careful attention to the weather forecast, I've been caught in an unexpected snow storm when hiking. I was accompanied by a park ranger at the same time, and we were both surprised by how fast the storm blew in. That can happen in some parts of the world. During WW2, in the Alaska campaign, some 300 US aircraft were lost. Only 60 of these were lost to enemy action, most of the others would have been lost due to bad weather blowing in unexpectedly. I don't blame Halsey for getting hit by the Typhoon, even twice. It's the price of doing business in certain parts of the Pacific certain times of year. I do blame him for failing to ensure his people were either refueled or had filled their empty tanks with seawater, failing to ensure people had constructed appropriate protection for their electrical generators to prevent them from shorting out when seawater came in, and failing to remind his people to jettison top-weight when appropriate. This means before the storm hits, as trying to go out on deck during the storm is extremely risky - though it sometimes had to be done (with extreme care) if certain things went wrong. Halsey may have expected all his people to already know all this, but I think it was still his duty to remind them. I imagine he had to know that some of his destroyers were top heavy. He also had to know that some people were promoted too fast and didn't have the experience needed to know what had to be done before the storm hit. There's a huge difference between ordinary storms and the monster storms and there's a very human tendency to assume one 'knows' what is coming if one has experienced a normal storm and never actually experienced a monster storm. Also, his people may not have realized how much more powerful a typhoon can be compared to many hurricanes - they knew the Pacific was huge, but didn't necessarily think through the full implications of that fact. He should also have explicitly authorized his people to leave formation as appropriate to protect their ships, before the storm hit. This order should not have been required, but again some of the less experienced officers might not have the judgement to make the right call before it was too late. Not all this was solely his responsibility - it was also the responsibility of lots of subordinate officers. But he was in command, and command ultimately takes responsibility. I'm suspect the Americans also didn't put enough time into talking to the Australian sailors working with them about these storms (and the appropriate precautions to take). I don't know this for sure. It always makes sense to get local knowledge and I suspect the Americans might have been remiss out of over-confidence.
Alcoholism before drydock no. 100. By 200th severe liver failure. You may not live long enough to see no. 300. Hard to call that a win, but it'd fun as hell 😂
110 foot wooden SC's were coastal craft. Harbor defense, coastal patrols - saw a lot of action in the Solomons and other island hopping campaigns. They did not have sonar and IIRC claimed no submarine kills during the war, although their presence would act as a deterrent. Most were disposed of quickly after the war. The steel hull 173 foot PC's were ocean going - capable of doing the west coast to Hawaii run for example. These were more sea worthy and better weapons platforms than the SC's and had sonar. I think they were officially credited with 10 submarine kills during the war although at least one of those was later disproved. The type continued in production after the war with examples serving into the 1990's at least. The PCE's were proper ocean going escorts and could be regarded as smaller American equivalents to the Flower class corvette. Many of these served for many decades after WWII and 6 were even built post war for the Netherlands.
As a follow on from the Question if Lion had blown up at Jutland. What would have happened if Syedlitz had blown up at Dogger Bank as it very nearly did. This would deny the HSF knowledge about their dangerous ammunition handling procedures and who would take over during that battle? Would the Kaiser be so rattled by the loss of one of his beloved ships that any future actions would be under such tight restrictions no further meetings would ever occur?
I named my daughter from one of the characters in the Silmarillion. Melian. However, we pronounce it a bit differently than the British. We were in a small library in Northern Virginia where we encountered a librarian from England that informed her that in England it was actually pronounced like Melianne. To which my daughter replied MY NAME IS MELIAN!!! The second "a" being pronounced as more of a "swah e" sound. Coincidentally like the very end of librarian. Yes, Americans definitely have a way with the English language. Sorta like some of the Brits saying "Bucknam Pellis" instead of Buckingham Palace. When I first moved to the DC area I couldn't help notice a lot of people instead of saying Washington DC somehow an "r" had gotten in & they would pronounce it as Warshington DC. And I'm not the type of person that is gonna go around & try to correct anyone's pronunciations unless it has to do with my name. But I've noticed at Chick-fil-A when Latinos ask my name they have no idea how to spell Dean when I tell them my name. Most often they spell it "Din". I've thought about using my first name Ken to make it easier for them. But I've never liked using that name mainly because of the "Barbie & Ken" dolls.
@ 02:23:39 Aviator Rescue: You forgot the other Duck! (JF & JF2 Grumman Duck, which was known to waddle when on land!). These were the "Utility" airplanes listed in Carrier Air Groups.
Speaking of mounting a Knock gun on a swivel in the fighting tops, the US Navy is known to have purchased a dozen or two of what can only be described as muzzleloading machineguns, using a cluster of barrels loaded with superposed charges linked together by an overly complex series of flame tubes that would theoretically ignite them in sequence and keep the whole thing from exploding, in the early 1800s for just that purpose. I don't know if they were ever actually used in action, though.
With regard to signaling errors: according to "The Fleet That Had to Die" by Richard Hough, while the Second Pacific Squadron was in Madagascar a destroyer group was signaled to form line abreast during an exercise and instead scatted in all directions. The subsequent enquiry found that some of the ships were still using an out-of-date version of the signal book. Could Kamchatka's "torpedo boat" signals have been made using the same out-of-date code book?
Many if the USN PC-461 (250 tons) class and PC-842 class (800 plus tons) served overseas in WW2. Acting as patrol craft and convoy escorts. A good number were converted to amphibious control craft participating in many amphibious assaults.
One correction there were Kitty Hawk class carriers still in US NAVAL service into the mid 90's I did the final deployment of USS AMERICA CV 66 in the mid 90's.
Regarding the depth charges question: if memory serves, in the Greyhound book they had some extra depth charges stowed away. But there's a long sequence in the book that was cut from the movie, where they try to sink a U-Boat in cooperation with another one of the escorts over a period of many hours (hence the cut), drop lots of depth charges including the extras, and accomplish nothing (a very common story for 1942, things would change in 1943). That's why the ship is short on depth charges for the final battle.
One other element to anti-aircraft fire that Drach didn't mention: losses to anti-aircraft fire against ground targets. By mid-1944 for example, Eighth and Fifteenth Air force losses to anti-aircraft not only became the primary reasons planes were shot down and greatly exceeded losses in 1943 to A/A fire. They greatly outstripped losses to fighters.
Near the end of "Who takes over if Lion blows up at Jutland?", probably around 56:00 - you state that the battlecruiser's normal station was at the head of the Grand Fleet but that Pakenham might choose to slot them in at the rear instead given the circumstances. I don't think you explicitly said this, but I believe the Grand Fleet Battle Orders did explicitly allow for precisely such a formation if the circumstances, as in the historical case, warranted it. So this wouldn't be a case of some wild initiative by Pakenham but rather a sensible choice between the options known to be available - the kind of sensible choice which frankly seems beyond Beatty at times!
There is an African-American comedian, it might be Dave Chappell, who was at a resort in Africa. He and an English boy were strolling near sea water (I think it was sea water) and together saw a merperson sporting impressively. Something about the entirety of the story makes me believe him.
For the ship outshining her sisters, my mind also went to Prinz first. Then I would say HMS Terror and Erebus are probably the most famous bomb vessels ever, let alone of their classes. Terror is part of the US national anthem and has a national park named for her, what other ship can claim that?
2:55:00 I wouldn't give much weight to Hastings conclusions on recent conflicts either -the "cos I was there". scenario, as what, a reporter, not as a senior commander makes any conclusion moot. for example when Hastings wrote on the Falklands nothing had been released on advanced technology, only that a lot of landside A/A was compromised by the loss of Atlantic Conveyor, and at the time of his writing nothing was known for example about the limited use of laser weapons and even now what exactly were their purpose, which is still an open question, hence the reason Drac has the line drawn in the sand with his ancient cutlass, because if you know what was going on you're still covered by op-sec, and before anyone asked I don't, but I can't get my head around not using A/A surface /ship to air missiles against A 4 Skyhawks (1950s tech) until they had pressed home their attack, and that said was that even really the case. As to Lasers -were they anti personnel to dazzle throw off aim or were they meant to throw off guided weapons, or even range and aim systems, similar to Shtora-1 seen on "modernish" armoured vehicles in Ukraine. As to his view of the paucity of A/A fire during the likes of Pedestal. Most Warship sinkings - Eagle & Cairo by Submarine and Manchester by TMB and several of the Merchant ship losses were also to submarine, and although significant losses over 60 axis aircraft were destroyed, many damaged, a loss rate of 10% with an untold damage rate, significantly the loss of Eagle and Cairo (A/A Cruiser) may have saved many aircraft. So in the Pacific okay what can be said in 1945 opinion was that 5 inch (and British heavy A/A) fire was ineffective something that has changed markedly in the nearly 80 years since, but the shear weight of 40mm and 20 mm fire meant that Kamikaze was significantly less effective (and that is from Japanese opinion) than was first supposed when the likes of SS John Burke was attacked off Mindoro in December 1944, the Japaneses expected to do such damage each sortie, but by June July most Japanese commanders knew the allies had the measure, and it was only a matter of resolve and whether allied resolve might break.
Nock Volly gun, you need to do a meetup with Jonathan Ferguson, the keeper of firearms and artillery at the Royal Armories Museum in the UK, which houses a collection of thousands of iconic weapons from throughout history. he has everything up in Leeds, so be interesting to see what Naval Stuff he has ( he has a Nock) can we make this meetup happen, Jonathan and Drach, the Internet gods demand it
3:02:58 I agree on the assessment of WW2 however in modern warfare the phycological impact is huge still and now aircraft are worth so much it's even more of a factor. Especially because you can't see it until it'a too late, the evasive manovours will already be implemented, rather than waiting for that firat shell to burst. For example in the NATO bombings of 1999, NATO pilots would fly above 15,000 ft above the range of a Strela-2 they would fly 5km away from any road and would only fly perpendicular to road to cross it or do an attack run on the road to reduce the chance of AA fire as the AA guns were on vehicles that were not good off road and had damaged a number of aircraft at the start of the conflict. Due to the shoot and schoot tactics of yugoslavia, they rarely shot aircraft down but NATO planes were unable to disrupt the anti air capabilities as they barely hit any of the SAM systems and therefore had to adopt these all these tactics that reduced the effectiveness of their aircraft. Therefore these threats meant most bombs and missiles were not fired from their optimum height and combined with deception and dummies. In the end this meant that they thought they had destroyed 120 tanks 220 APC's and 400 Artillery pieces when in reality they had destroyed 13 tanks, 6 APC's and 6 Artillery pieces. We have seen the same in Ukraine the threat of Ukrainian's upgraded and huge number of S-300 SAM's has practically stopped the Russian air force for conducting any sort of meaningful air campaign in the war.
You really think you’d load a knock gun like that? It’s close range spray. And they were tossing two grenades at a time at admiral lord Nelson. Get #jonathanferguson
Regarding Packenham, Churchill had an admiral sacked for not engaging a superior German force... so I doubt that he would be inclined to slow down or fall back given that he could see the reinforcements coming up. But he would very likely make sure that the 5th turns right after the BCF, presenting a consolidated line to 1st SG and no target to the KM battleline.
1:28:15 if you look at the Spanish Navy they seemed to find 18 pounders not that much of a downgrade as many of their larger ships would use 18 pounders on the decks other navies at the same period would have 24 pounders on them. Although as mentioned before pounds in different countries are different weight so maybe a Spanish 18 pounders was more like a 24.
You are spot on as to the what the engineering crew would experience during battle. As to off duty crew there would be none since all would be at their General Quarters station. In the USN the Engineers would be split with half at operating stations and half at repair lockers. In this way there would be crew not only to fight fire and restore the casualty, but also replace killed and wounded crew. The issue of fire flaring back out of the boiler as the result of punching a hole in the fire room is the main reason most USN combatants by WW2 had boilers with fully enclosed air casings that were connected directly to the forced draft blowers. A separate ventilation system was provided for crew "comfort".
The volley flintlock might have made more sense if it had been fitted with a structural under-gun bracing 'hook' as wall guns were for use in fortifications. That way, the hook could be set over some structural part of the ship, which would then eat the recoil rather than the wielder. Given that structural parts of the ship are generally going to be available in a boarding action.
Is it okay to call the Captain "Skipper" if he calls you "Little Buddy?"
😂
Run!... ( Or swim !)
How many people today know anything about "Gilligan's Island" I wonder?
Just sit right back & you'll hear a tell, A tell of a faithful ship
Idk, I had never thought about it before but I think that may have drawn in the lgbtq community considering they are stranded on a deserted island. However, with Ginger & Maryann there I guess that the Professor was having more fun than the show let on.
The PRR (Pennsylvania RailRoad) actually had a small fleet of special flat cars for transporting Naval main gun barrels 12", 14", and 16" from wherever they were removed from the ship, to the gun re-lining facility at the Philadelphia Naval yard, and later at the Norfolk Naval yard in Virginia. These special cars could be dispatched from the East Coast to the West Coast, with re-lined barrels in six days, and be back in Philadelphia a little over a week later with the barrels that needed to be re-lined.
I have a set of these models in HO scale on my RR. One set carrying 16" tubes, and another set carrying 14" tubes.
My head is full of interesting naval facts that I probably have no use for, except to say, “Wow, I never knew that.” Thank you Mr. D.
My head is at peace and calm.
Drach has an astoundingly well paced and yet relatively neutral voice so I may well use the Drydock for a nap or two.
Always up early on Sunday for Perun's weekly PowerPoint, and Uncle Drach obviously.
Perun is awsome
Nine Drydocks to 300. I say again, NINE Drydocks to 300!!!
I might well ask a question based on a certain RN ship name
It's hard to believe that he started out with robo voices and no drydock to this in such a relatively short period of time.
@@bull614 And given us so many good jokes - for example, I convinced two royal navy officers there really was an HMS _By Jove!_
@Trek001 thats hilarious. Well done lmao
It doesn't seem that long ago he was celebrating 50
Anyone interested in subchasers in WW2 should read Edward P. Stanford’s book “Subchaser” about his time as CO of one before he became XO of a DE in the Pacific (which led to his book “Little Ship, Big War). Both are great reads!
My brain has been to rotted by the interwebs to read books like that these days I'm sorry to say
@@Legitpenguins99 I don’t understand.
Wow you got to meet Capt Brown ? A proper hero of mine and maybe the greatest pilot of all time. Was he as much a gentleman as he always seemed from his interviews ?
As somebody who also met him, I can say that he was indeed a gentleman. I had the chance to speak to him at a dinner in about 2010 or so and I asked if I could question him on a few things. Instead of his combat and testing career, I wanted to know what he had thought about Gagarin when he had the chance to interview him and his eyes lit up and he waxed on and on in great detail and then thanked me for not asking the same sorts of questions he always was and then we repaired to the bar and had a drink together
Lovely man, very happy to talk, the more esoteric the question the better.
@@Trek001 Amazing.
@@Drachinifel Glad he was as nice as he seemed.
@@Boric78 It was and I am honoured to have had the chance to speak to him.
The reason I think it was in 2010 or so is because the decommissioning of _Ark Royal_ was about to happen and I asked him what he thought about it and his views were rather strong
On Subchasers you should do a five minute guide on PC-1264 which not only served on anti-sub patrol in the Atlantic in WW2 but as one of 2 US Navy ships with African-American crews helped lead to the integration in the Navy post war. There is a good book written by her commander which I have a copy of and could send you if desired.
Technically the first carrier based jet was the little-known Ryan FR Fireball (though they only get half points as they were a mixed jet/propeller plane). VF-66 aboard the carrier Ranger was the first to receive them in March 1945, but due to the pilots having to get used to the handling characteristics they were never used operationally before the war ended.
Drach, if memory serves the first landing of a jet powered aircraft may have been one month earlier the Captain Brown's attempt - a Ryan FR Fireball landed on in November 1945 after the prop engine failed the pilot got the jet engine started and completed the landing recovery
Of course I'm awake! Preview said you answered my question about Virginia at Hampton Roads in this episode! :D
Thanks!
For clarity. In material mechanics, strain is *defined* as the deformation of a material. Deformation is not the result of *applied* strain. It is the materials response to stress - typically, as caused by applied load(s) - ie force(s) - such as a torque.
I can expand a little on that: deformation can be expressed in length, strain is dimensionless: e.g. a percentage elongation of a material. Small stress = small strain can give large displacement / deformation if it is applied on a geometry with a long arm.
E.g. a springcoil can have a relative large displacement, even thought the (torsional) strain in every piece of wire in the coil can be quite small.
it is also why strength should not be confused with stiffness. Strength is a material property and local geometry, stiffness the result of both material and global geometry.
E.g. a spingcoil is as strong as the weakest bit in the spring (like for instance a local crossection that is reduced due to a crack), where stiffness can be influenced by crossection of the wire diameter, the length of the coil (length, but also number of windings), overal coil diameter, etc.
Question: In an episode of the Great War covering early 1915, Indy states that the British and French were unwilling to open a campaign in the Adriatic against the Austro-Hungarians because they had "newly built dreadnoughts". This strikes me as odd, because the Tegetthoffs were not that new by comparison to what other nations had, in terms of technology and likely could be overcome. How would we define the threat that these ships pose? What constitutes a modern ship or an obsolete ship?
Started listening around Drydock 60. Thank you Drach from Oregon, USA!
Very, very charitable to Max Hastings. Am not a huge fan of Monty, but he despises him repeatedly using slurs. And that's just a start, he's pretty bad.
The correct pronunciation of "specie" is like "species" without the s.
Far from having only one or two classes in commissions in the 1980s, the US Navy had a proliferation of classes. Several people have already mention carriers so I will stick to surface combatants in comission taking 1985 as the base year.
Frigates: Bronstein, Garcia, Brooke, Knox and Perry classes. All but the Perrys were originally classified as Ocean Escorts (DE) and reclassified as Frigates (FF) in 1975.
Destroyers: Farragut, Adams and Spruances Classes.
Cruisers: Leahy, Belknap, California, Virginia, Ticonderoga classes.
The Farragut, and all but the Ticonderoga Classes were originally classified as DLG/N. However, they received that designation for their hull form and not for the naming convention. They were referred to as Frigates in the age of sail meaning. (NAVSOURCE). The Farraguts were reclassified as DDGs in 1975 and the remaining classes as cruisers in 1975. You could think of the DLGs as fhe equivalent of fifth and sixth rates in age of sail terminology or Atlanta class CLAAs of the modern era.
Nothing better then playing world of warships and listening to warships
Exactly what I’ve been doing for the past few hours
I generally agree with your assessment of Halsey. He built up a store of positive results pre war, the carrier raids and Solomons campaign that help his reputation. Beatty just didn’t have that store of positive results.
Halsey had built a considerable amount of public support due to his earlier results. The USN leadership did its best to avoid diminishing that reputation for years after WW II. For example, the fact that Halsey and his stuff were briefed on likely IJN deception tactics before the invasion of Leyte was not disclosed publicly until the official history was published. What went wrong at Jutland was a public debate by the day after the battle.
No, the "SC" designated hulls didn't serve in open oceans or within a fleet movement.....but- many had to cross open oceans & serve under BRUTAL conditions later on when they were given up in Soviet/US Lend/Lease programs in 1944. One such unit went down the ways, in my small home town of 10,000 people- in a tributary that leads into the Delaware Bay.
🚬😎👍
8:00
A 20-year old capital warship that is torpedoed several times and sinks more-or-less upright, and with its upper deck clear of the water, can be salvaged, especially if some or all of the main machinery and dynamo / generator spaces stay watertight.
If that same warship is torpedoed even once and capsizes, it is irretrievably wrecked. Every major piece of equipment will, if not break completely free of its mountings, twist and warp all physical connections to the point that putting it right will be more work than building an entirely new ship of a modern design.
An Ammericans oppinion.
Admiral Beatty strengths were not as a heroic at sea leadership. It is more difficult to admire a man that is good at paper shuffling and shmoosing polititions.
Bill Halsey took a Navy that just had its teeth kicked in and successfully went on the offensive. It is a pitty that he hadn't been promoted out of command before the first typhoon.
I’ve probably heard this Drydock 4 or 5 times, and this is the first time I’ve heard you calling me out for being awake. Way to shame us sleepy time listeners! 😂 Never doubt that your videos are multipurpose; unparalleled educational material, and superb sleep aid.
To be honest, sometimes I put this on when I go to bed. Then snap. I'm out! 😴
@@j.d.broockerd8717 me too lol
It's a problem when I do, because then I get interested and can't sleep
One might try geologist for inducing sleep....do avoid the stone chipping folks ...
I'm glad I'm not the only one lol
Currently sitting through the first of two Easter celebrations. I cannot WAIT to get home and have a 6 hour Drach marathon while I unwind :)
Easter ....bunny's an jelly beans... ... Ham an pineapple easter? Discount chocolate easter! How ! How can it bee ! I missed easter? .. .. .. by three weeks or so , apparently..coupons!
Regarding the Japanese response to part of their force being sighted by the PBY on June 3rd, it really didn't make much difference based on their preconceived assumptions. Going into Midway, the Japanese were absolutely certain that the USN wouldn't know their plans until Nagumo actually struck Midway on the morning of the 4th, and that the American carriers would only sortie from Pearl Harbor after that happened. This was the bedrock assumption that the Japanese never seriously questioned - to the extent that during their wargames, the officer commanding the "enemy" (US) forces essentially wasn't allowed to do anything until the June 4 strike occurred.
So from that perspective, a Midway-based PBY sighting part of their force a day before Nagumo was supposed to strike Midway anyway didn't really change anything. Maybe it meant the US carriers could sortie from Pearl Harbor (which was *of course* were they were) a little early, but there was still no *possible* way they could reach the Midway area on June 4. Hence being caught by surprise when it turned out their assumptions were all wrong and the US carriers actually *were* there.
TY Drachinifel , Your ocean of naval wisdom is always welcome at our house.
Despite living on an Island (Vancouver Island) there is not much to document.
We did build some few Flower class, and did receive tiny bombing, and shelling from minor Japanese forces, yet forgettable. Perhaps a TY for the RN forces , and Royal Marines , as they built the defenses of Fort Rodd Hill. 1896-1956.
Greetings fellow Islander!
What living or not living on an island has to do with the amount of things to document?! 🤣🤣
A couple of points. First, I'm not sure if Drach's favorite word is but or however. But seriously, I think Halsey gets somewhat of a pass for his 44 and 45 screw ups because of his 42 performance.
Halsey had presided over the desperate and successful defense of Guadalcanal before going back to fleet command. He also never publicly tried to throw blame for his mistakes on his superior officers, and instead seems to have just got on with trying to remedy the situation. So - not Beatty.
Wasn't Ermie King an observer at the Sturdee versus Beatty exercise and the negative impression he got of Beatty was a major contributor to his dislike of the Royal Navy?
Pearl Harbor water temperature is quite mild. It's Hawaii, after all. Scapa Flow is not a recreational swimming destination.
I thought that the last case of a US ship's crew receiving prize money was in 1941, when the USS Omaha (CL-4) took the German blockade runner SS Odenwald.
Along with the angled deck and mirror landing system another UK invention not mentioned here but which was critical to the USN was the steam catapult which was also demonstrated to the USN by Eric Brown. I can also wholeheartedly agree that for any naval enthusiast"Wings on my Sleeve"is an excellent read covering everything from his service in Martletts on the very first escort carrier HMS Audacity through his test piloting career and an interesting discussion of the air group of CVA-01 of which Brown would likely have been the first captain. It also gives a list which will never be matched of the different aircraft types(not marks of a type)that he flew
For a Navy that introduced almost every technical advance in carrier operations the Royal Navy has fielded very few first rate ships down to the present day. As was true with every British carrier afterHMS Ark Royal British carriers lacked punch compared to US and Japanese carriers. The CV-01 design continued that trend and had less striking power the an Essex class CVA.
As far as I know, the last case of prize money being paid out in the USN was actually after WW2, when the sailors of the USS Omaha claimed prize money for the boarding (afaik the last case of cutlasses being issued for a boarding action in the USN as well) and capture of the Odenwald (a German blockade runner) in November of 1941. They had to sue the US Government, and "Members of the Omaha's boarding party each won $3000, and the remainder of her crew won two months’ pay and allowances. The judgment was affirmed on appeal."
No, the crews of the Omaha and Somers along with the US government were given a reward for salvaging the Odenwald, not prize money.
The United States was not at war so there was no enemy and they couldn't have taken a prize. However, as the German crew tried to scuttle her, the crews rescued a sinking vessel that had been abandoned by her crew which entitled them to compensation for salvaging the Odenwald.
And far from having to sue the government, the United States government sued the owners of the Odenwald for the salvage reward for the government and the sailors.
10:10 The water in Hawaii is incredibly warm.
For a book written by a submarine commander about his experiences in WWII, I agree with Drach, if it's a good book, regardless of style, I will read it.
I have two recommendations:
Paul Schratz: "Submarine Commander: A Story of World War II and Korea"
Ignatius J. Galantin: "Take Her Deep! A Submarine Against Japan in World War II"
I just noticed the Sulla comparison at 2:50:00. I'm very pleased to know Drach is a Cain enjoyer (although I really shouldn't be surprised).
re sub chasers - The RN used armed trawlers and drifters in many of the roles described
Being Wikipedia, I can't be sure if this is absolutely correct, but this is what they say about the US Pacific fleet:
Until May 1940, the Battle Force was stationed on the West Coast of the United States. Headquarters, battleships, aircraft carriers and heavy cruisers were stationed at San Pedro close to the Long Beach Naval Shipyard. Light cruisers, destroyers and submarines were stationed at San Diego.
The US Navy of the 1980s had four classes of fleet carriers: M8DWAY, FORRESTAL, KITTY HAW, and NIMITZ
Sgt. Harper never seemedto have trouble using the Nock volley gun.
AND he was able to reload all seven barrels in mere seconds.
If anyone can answer for me. Was the entire QE class to receive major restructuring? But the war cut that short for Warspite, Barham and Malaya
The war cut it short for Barham and Malaya. Warspite was first out of the gate, which is why her major refit looks so different from QE and Valiant.
Monitor had a significant advantage in speed and manouverability over Virginia. Another day of combat constituted a significant mechanical risk for the Confederate's propulsion unit. If Virginia was totally subject to tide and wind, it is likely she would have been hung up on sand bank and scuttled.
Worked on 688 sub where an EM last name was Skipper.
There's Dan Skipper, a college football offensive lineman. Razorbacks to Detroit Lions.
Loving this - but, and this is not an April Fool's joke, when you were talking about sailor's pay being paid out to family ashore my ears perked up. You said something like 'spee kee' for "specie" but checking both my US college dictionary and the OED, the pronunciation is 'spee she' when talking about the coins of a sailor's pay.
I've also heard skipper used among the Marines to refer to their company commander which is usually a "Captain O-3."
There are several places in Scotland called Tarbert. It is derived from the Gaelic for across-carrying. They are usually on an isthmus or narrow strip between the sea and a inland Loch. They are points where the Vikings and native Scots carried ships and goods from one bit of water to another.
I hope when he gets to Drydock 2001, it shows the HAL 9000 and talks in HAL's voice for the entire episode.
Who was closer laffy or some of the destroyers in Narvik? I recall in that battle mention of Pom-pom gunners taking cover from the shrapnel of their own rounds
YOU MET WINKLE?
so jealous. I hope you treasure the 5 minutes- i am pretty sure you will- planes may not be your first love, but - that man was special...:)
Regarding: 00:44:50 - 'Fake fighting' at sea? and the comments about "one broadside for honour"
I seem to recall reading of at least one case on land, i think during WW2 - maybe the German garrison of Cherbourg, or one of the other 'stay-behind' channel ports - of the garrison commander being willing to surrender but only on condition the allies produce at least one tank to fire a token shot at his position to 'justify' his 'honourable surrender', which is the same kind of idea albeit applied to the 'other side' rather than a shot fired as a token resistance.
"You're awake"😂😂
The unrotated projectile was the platform on which the radar proximity fuze was first tested in the UK before being demonstrated in the USA as part of the Tizard mission.
Thanks and 👍. Asking an intelligent is beyond me, but here goes. Did you have time to visit the submarine next to the uss Olympia? If that sub is still there.
P.S.if you are ever back in Philly and drunk and bored at 4:30 am you can thow pennies on Benjamin Franklin grave from standing on the sidewalk at 5th and Arch, yes it's legal. I think he had something to do with the Poor Richard so too keep with your naval theme.
Would it have been more practical, quicker and cost efficient, to reline Richelieu's and Jean Bart's guns to accept US 14 inch projectiles. Presuming the French national pride could be swallowed for practicality?
I think part of the reason Halsey is more forgiven for his errors and maintains a relatively good reputation is because of the American mindset toward his mistakes and failings.
It seems like often museums in the US glorify Halsey's aggression and tenacity to a point that it almost becomes "never too much of a good thing" and the mistakes are glossed over as being an acceptable consequence for his skill.
Additionally I think that many histories originating in the US depict him as being the kind of aggression and bull-headedness that America needed after Pearl Harbor and so his failures are again just glossed over as both being necessary for his command style to work and a consequence of America's "unexpected" involvement in WWII and the Navy's growing pains as it learned to fight.
Lastly and somewhat related I think that some of his mistakes are actually glorified as not necessarily being mistakes. For example, his aggression in chasing the Japanese decoy fleet is good because he wanted to eliminate the Japanese fleet, there was no way he could have known what would happen and aggression was part of the American mindset. Additionally leading his forces into typhoons is a badass feat of command showing how nothing would stop the Navy now and of course there was no way he. Ould have known what would happen so hey he did his best.
Not agreeing with the idea though but this seems to be a common conception in the US, that he was an excellent admiral with few if any failings.
Heh. Funnily enough, I have been reading Cain books recently and yeah, Jenet Sulla's particular brand of purple prose is pretty painful. By contrast, I quite enjoyed Silmarillion's style, although I will readily admit that it is an acquired taste.
My favorite tug designations are ATT (auxility tug transport) and ATST (auxility tug ship training).
Yeah, I kinda gave up on the second one.
The Battle of Hampton Roads was a tactical draw as neither vessel could end end the other as a threat to the goals each hoped to achieve.
At the end of the day the Virginia was undone by events on land rather than anything to do with results of inconclusive combat.
It was simply a forlorn hope that Virginia could lift the blockade in any case. While she could deny the North the use of Norfolk’s maritime facilities, and made the actual blockade more difficult , the Union forces would simply move operations off shore as they did other Confederate ports, Charleston, erc….
@ 02:42:21 Russian Navy: Could it be Old (Flag) Code Book .vs. New (Flag) Code Book? -- Or -- too much Vodka?
There are also reports of the mental state of Japanese violets after coming back from facing American anti aircraft aboard ships, indicating how they were badly mentally affected by it. Ptsd.
As a side on American SC and PC, a number of them were employed as landing craft control craft for major amphibious operations.
Where can I find an example or two to read about the captains talking oh so cleverly about allowing the smaller shift to do a fake broadside?
Also rail transport from the Rocky Mountains to the west coast involves a *lot* of tunnels in both the Rockies and the Sierra Nevada.
Oh good I’m awake.. NOT FOR LONG! The best sleeping material on the internet.
Old 666 loaded tracers every second round instead of the standard every fifth to do psychological damage to opposing pilots.
thanks Drach :) for more awesomeness. Also you may use skipper for reference to ships pilots when you have a captain on the bridge and a pilot on the wheel you may use skipper to reference the pilot to save on confusion.
AH that makes sense,, I notice also on smaller ships and especially very small like a PT boat or these SCs that since the CO is usually a lieutenant,, they're addressed as "Skipper" rather than captain most of the time...
1:20:25 is that the pocket battleship Admiral Hipper, famously armed with 11" triple turrets?
1:17:48 did Drach have a dyslexic moment, or do I have plastic and elastic deformation confused?
25:15 "Full scale prints"? That must be a huge sheet of paper I reckon.
Was AA fire ever used in a attempt to disable running torpedo's? 🧐
What are some of the most over exaggerated or over stated ship careers and performances?
I’d say IJN Kongo at the battle off Samar, the Iowas engaging convoys off Truk during operation Hailstone, and USS West Virginia’s performance at Surigao Strait.
Do you think that BB 62 could defeat Godzilla?
Halsey was a good commander, no doubt about it. It is also true that he led his ships into a typhoon, not once but twice! While he was a good commander one might question his status as a seaman.
Even today it's hard to predict the course of these storms. There are lots of people in Florida USA who left the path of a recent hurricane based on the predicted track, only to find themselves in the center of the path when the storm shifted from the original prediction. Back then they didn't have weather satellites and tracking of big storms was a lot harder.
Also note that the speed of ships goes down as the wave height increases, which makes evading the storm harder if you get caught on the edges. This is especially true for the smaller ships - which also burn fuel a lot faster when the wave height goes up.
I'll also note that despite a lot of training, and paying careful attention to the weather forecast, I've been caught in an unexpected snow storm when hiking. I was accompanied by a park ranger at the same time, and we were both surprised by how fast the storm blew in. That can happen in some parts of the world. During WW2, in the Alaska campaign, some 300 US aircraft were lost. Only 60 of these were lost to enemy action, most of the others would have been lost due to bad weather blowing in unexpectedly.
I don't blame Halsey for getting hit by the Typhoon, even twice. It's the price of doing business in certain parts of the Pacific certain times of year.
I do blame him for failing to ensure his people were either refueled or had filled their empty tanks with seawater, failing to ensure people had constructed appropriate protection for their electrical generators to prevent them from shorting out when seawater came in, and failing to remind his people to jettison top-weight when appropriate. This means before the storm hits, as trying to go out on deck during the storm is extremely risky - though it sometimes had to be done (with extreme care) if certain things went wrong. Halsey may have expected all his people to already know all this, but I think it was still his duty to remind them.
I imagine he had to know that some of his destroyers were top heavy. He also had to know that some people were promoted too fast and didn't have the experience needed to know what had to be done before the storm hit. There's a huge difference between ordinary storms and the monster storms and there's a very human tendency to assume one 'knows' what is coming if one has experienced a normal storm and never actually experienced a monster storm. Also, his people may not have realized how much more powerful a typhoon can be compared to many hurricanes - they knew the Pacific was huge, but didn't necessarily think through the full implications of that fact.
He should also have explicitly authorized his people to leave formation as appropriate to protect their ships, before the storm hit. This order should not have been required, but again some of the less experienced officers might not have the judgement to make the right call before it was too late.
Not all this was solely his responsibility - it was also the responsibility of lots of subordinate officers. But he was in command, and command ultimately takes responsibility.
I'm suspect the Americans also didn't put enough time into talking to the Australian sailors working with them about these storms (and the appropriate precautions to take). I don't know this for sure. It always makes sense to get local knowledge and I suspect the Americans might have been remiss out of over-confidence.
I love the dry dock game. Drink every time drach says *et cetera* and you never lose
Alcoholism before drydock no. 100. By 200th severe liver failure. You may not live long enough to see no. 300.
Hard to call that a win, but it'd fun as hell 😂
@@Ansset0 we’re at 293 or something don’t jinx me. I’m seeing New Jersey in dry dock for 300 hopefully she falls on me hahahaa
110 foot wooden SC's were coastal craft. Harbor defense, coastal patrols - saw a lot of action in the Solomons and other island hopping campaigns. They did not have sonar and IIRC claimed no submarine kills during the war, although their presence would act as a deterrent. Most were disposed of quickly after the war.
The steel hull 173 foot PC's were ocean going - capable of doing the west coast to Hawaii run for example. These were more sea worthy and better weapons platforms than the SC's and had sonar. I think they were officially credited with 10 submarine kills during the war although at least one of those was later disproved. The type continued in production after the war with examples serving into the 1990's at least.
The PCE's were proper ocean going escorts and could be regarded as smaller American equivalents to the Flower class corvette. Many of these served for many decades after WWII and 6 were even built post war for the Netherlands.
Of course I’m awake. I’m at the gym!
As a follow on from the Question if Lion had blown up at Jutland.
What would have happened if Syedlitz had blown up at Dogger Bank as it very nearly did.
This would deny the HSF knowledge about their dangerous ammunition handling procedures and who would take over during that battle?
Would the Kaiser be so rattled by the loss of one of his beloved ships that any future actions would be under such tight restrictions no further meetings would ever occur?
If VIRGINIA had sunk or driven off the blockade fleet, MONITOR likely wouldn't have been able to catch up to the blockade runners to sink them.
New desire: Drach to tell us the career of Cochrane in the style of the Silmarillion :)
I named my daughter from one of the characters in the Silmarillion. Melian. However, we pronounce it a bit differently than the British. We were in a small library in Northern Virginia where we encountered a librarian from England that informed her that in England it was actually pronounced like Melianne. To which my daughter replied MY NAME IS MELIAN!!! The second "a" being pronounced as more of a "swah e" sound. Coincidentally like the very end of librarian. Yes, Americans definitely have a way with the English language. Sorta like some of the Brits saying "Bucknam Pellis" instead of Buckingham Palace. When I first moved to the DC area I couldn't help notice a lot of people instead of saying Washington DC somehow an "r" had gotten in & they would pronounce it as Warshington DC. And I'm not the type of person that is gonna go around & try to correct anyone's pronunciations unless it has to do with my name. But I've noticed at Chick-fil-A when Latinos ask my name they have no idea how to spell Dean when I tell them my name. Most often they spell it "Din". I've thought about using my first name Ken to make it easier for them. But I've never liked using that name mainly because of the "Barbie & Ken" dolls.
@ 02:23:39 Aviator Rescue: You forgot the other Duck! (JF & JF2 Grumman Duck, which was known to waddle when on land!). These were the "Utility" airplanes listed in Carrier Air Groups.
Speaking of mounting a Knock gun on a swivel in the fighting tops, the US Navy is known to have purchased a dozen or two of what can only be described as muzzleloading machineguns, using a cluster of barrels loaded with superposed charges linked together by an overly complex series of flame tubes that would theoretically ignite them in sequence and keep the whole thing from exploding, in the early 1800s for just that purpose. I don't know if they were ever actually used in action, though.
With regard to signaling errors: according to "The Fleet That Had to Die" by Richard Hough, while the Second Pacific Squadron was in Madagascar a destroyer group was signaled to form line abreast during an exercise and instead scatted in all directions. The subsequent enquiry found that some of the ships were still using an out-of-date version of the signal book. Could Kamchatka's "torpedo boat" signals have been made using the same out-of-date code book?
Many if the USN PC-461 (250 tons) class and PC-842 class (800 plus tons) served overseas in WW2. Acting as patrol craft and convoy escorts. A good number were converted to amphibious control craft participating in many amphibious assaults.
One correction there were Kitty Hawk class carriers still in US NAVAL service into the mid 90's I did the final deployment of USS AMERICA CV 66 in the mid 90's.
Regarding the depth charges question: if memory serves, in the Greyhound book they had some extra depth charges stowed away. But there's a long sequence in the book that was cut from the movie, where they try to sink a U-Boat in cooperation with another one of the escorts over a period of many hours (hence the cut), drop lots of depth charges including the extras, and accomplish nothing (a very common story for 1942, things would change in 1943). That's why the ship is short on depth charges for the final battle.
One other element to anti-aircraft fire that Drach didn't mention: losses to anti-aircraft fire against ground targets. By mid-1944 for example, Eighth and Fifteenth Air force losses to anti-aircraft not only became the primary reasons planes were shot down and greatly exceeded losses in 1943 to A/A fire. They greatly outstripped losses to fighters.
Near the end of "Who takes over if Lion blows up at Jutland?", probably around 56:00 - you state that the battlecruiser's normal station was at the head of the Grand Fleet but that Pakenham might choose to slot them in at the rear instead given the circumstances. I don't think you explicitly said this, but I believe the Grand Fleet Battle Orders did explicitly allow for precisely such a formation if the circumstances, as in the historical case, warranted it. So this wouldn't be a case of some wild initiative by Pakenham but rather a sensible choice between the options known to be available - the kind of sensible choice which frankly seems beyond Beatty at times!
Is there any sea monster story which is so well documented that's it's kinda true.
There is an African-American comedian, it might be Dave Chappell, who was at a resort in Africa. He and an English boy were strolling near sea water (I think it was sea water) and together saw a merperson sporting impressively. Something about the entirety of the story makes me believe him.
For the ship outshining her sisters, my mind also went to Prinz first. Then I would say HMS Terror and Erebus are probably the most famous bomb vessels ever, let alone of their classes. Terror is part of the US national anthem and has a national park named for her, what other ship can claim that?
2:55:00 I wouldn't give much weight to Hastings conclusions on recent conflicts either -the "cos I was there". scenario, as what, a reporter, not as a senior commander makes any conclusion moot. for example when Hastings wrote on the Falklands nothing had been released on advanced technology, only that a lot of landside A/A was compromised by the loss of Atlantic Conveyor, and at the time of his writing nothing was known for example about the limited use of laser weapons and even now what exactly were their purpose, which is still an open question, hence the reason Drac has the line drawn in the sand with his ancient cutlass, because if you know what was going on you're still covered by op-sec, and before anyone asked I don't, but I can't get my head around not using A/A surface /ship to air missiles against A 4 Skyhawks (1950s tech) until they had pressed home their attack, and that said was that even really the case. As to Lasers -were they anti personnel to dazzle throw off aim or were they meant to throw off guided weapons, or even range and aim systems, similar to Shtora-1 seen on "modernish" armoured vehicles in Ukraine.
As to his view of the paucity of A/A fire during the likes of Pedestal. Most Warship sinkings - Eagle & Cairo by Submarine and Manchester by TMB and several of the Merchant ship losses were also to submarine, and although significant losses over 60 axis aircraft were destroyed, many damaged, a loss rate of 10% with an untold damage rate, significantly the loss of Eagle and Cairo (A/A Cruiser) may have saved many aircraft.
So in the Pacific okay what can be said in 1945 opinion was that 5 inch (and British heavy A/A) fire was ineffective something that has changed markedly in the nearly 80 years since, but the shear weight of 40mm and 20 mm fire meant that Kamikaze was significantly less effective (and that is from Japanese opinion) than was first supposed when the likes of SS John Burke was attacked off Mindoro in December 1944, the Japaneses expected to do such damage each sortie, but by June July most Japanese commanders knew the allies had the measure, and it was only a matter of resolve and whether allied resolve might break.
18:40 Fun fact in American baseball (aka sensible Cricket) "Managers -- also commonly referred to as "skippers""
Nock Volly gun, you need to do a meetup with Jonathan Ferguson, the keeper of firearms and artillery at the Royal Armories Museum in the UK, which houses a collection of thousands of iconic weapons from throughout history.
he has everything up in Leeds, so be interesting to see what Naval Stuff he has ( he has a Nock)
can we make this meetup happen, Jonathan and Drach, the Internet gods demand it
Drachminifel Spotted
3:02:58 I agree on the assessment of WW2 however in modern warfare the phycological impact is huge still and now aircraft are worth so much it's even more of a factor. Especially because you can't see it until it'a too late, the evasive manovours will already be implemented, rather than waiting for that firat shell to burst. For example in the NATO bombings of 1999, NATO pilots would fly above 15,000 ft above the range of a Strela-2 they would fly 5km away from any road and would only fly perpendicular to road to cross it or do an attack run on the road to reduce the chance of AA fire as the AA guns were on vehicles that were not good off road and had damaged a number of aircraft at the start of the conflict. Due to the shoot and schoot tactics of yugoslavia, they rarely shot aircraft down but NATO planes were unable to disrupt the anti air capabilities as they barely hit any of the SAM systems and therefore had to adopt these all these tactics that reduced the effectiveness of their aircraft. Therefore these threats meant most bombs and missiles were not fired from their optimum height and combined with deception and dummies. In the end this meant that they thought they had destroyed 120 tanks 220 APC's and 400 Artillery pieces when in reality they had destroyed 13 tanks, 6 APC's and 6 Artillery pieces.
We have seen the same in Ukraine the threat of Ukrainian's upgraded and huge number of S-300 SAM's has practically stopped the Russian air force for conducting any sort of meaningful air campaign in the war.
You really think you’d load a knock gun like that? It’s close range spray. And they were tossing two grenades at a time at admiral lord Nelson. Get #jonathanferguson
What about Farragut of Mobile bay.
Regarding Packenham, Churchill had an admiral sacked for not engaging a superior German force... so I doubt that he would be inclined to slow down or fall back given that he could see the reinforcements coming up.
But he would very likely make sure that the 5th turns right after the BCF, presenting a consolidated line to 1st SG and no target to the KM battleline.
1:28:15 if you look at the Spanish Navy they seemed to find 18 pounders not that much of a downgrade as many of their larger ships would use 18 pounders on the decks other navies at the same period would have 24 pounders on them. Although as mentioned before pounds in different countries are different weight so maybe a Spanish 18 pounders was more like a 24.
You are spot on as to the what the engineering crew would experience during battle. As to off duty crew there would be none since all would be at their General Quarters station. In the USN the Engineers would be split with half at operating stations and half at repair lockers. In this way there would be crew not only to fight fire and restore the casualty, but also replace killed and wounded crew. The issue of fire flaring back out of the boiler as the result of punching a hole in the fire room is the main reason most USN combatants by WW2 had boilers with fully enclosed air casings that were connected directly to the forced draft blowers. A separate ventilation system was provided for crew "comfort".
The volley flintlock might have made more sense if it had been fitted with a structural under-gun bracing 'hook' as wall guns were for use in fortifications. That way, the hook could be set over some structural part of the ship, which would then eat the recoil rather than the wielder. Given that structural parts of the ship are generally going to be available in a boarding action.