Well, it is good to know that you were able to figure out the problem and find a solution. Despite the frustration it is good that you were able to get things going. I would not have thought that the surge protector would be responsible for the problem, interesting. I commend you for your perseverance! Thanks, Art, for sharing all of this. Bill B.
Great video. Thanks so much for sharing. Appreciate seeing the good and the bad. It’s so helpful for troubleshooting and seeing that you’re not alone when running into issues on your layout.
I use the high dollar s p's from home depot. Also everybody's going to have to wait to hook up Lionel to the wtiu, mth doesn't have the cord adapter in hands yet. They say month or so. Nice video Art, I ordered my wtiu monday😊
@@TwistedMacGyversTrains let me know if you get a buzz when you hook up to the variable tracks, that is my last issue I'm working on, but it is not loud enough for me to hear when I'm running trains so not a show stopper
Thanks for taking the time to share your solutions. Still waiting for my unit. Can’t Wait to have that type of fun. It just may have to wait until after the new year’s hangover.
Hello Art! Great job discovering and resolving your signal issue. Sounds like there was possibly a “Ground” issue where your surge protector didn’t provide the signal through the ground. The surge protector brand I’ve had excellent results with is “Belkin”. I have mine for many years, and I’ve never encountered any signal problems with either my TMCC, Legacy, DCS, LCS, or WIU. I’ve got everything working and playing in the sandbox absolutely perfectly. So, if you’re in the market for a good surge protector, I recommend a “Belkin” surge protector. Again, this is my go to brand, other people may have other ideas, but I can honestly say, I’ve never had and signal issues with any of my equipment. Tom
Good deal! It seems that the new WTIU may be a bit 'sensitive', as far as how you hook-up the power. As I mentioned before, there needs to be and in-depth demonstration on how to hook everything up properly. At least you got one bugaboo out of the way. Keep us informed, as everything proceeds.
Thanks for this video Art, I'm sorry that it took so long to figure this problem out but looks like you "nailed it". I certainly understand track and power issues and the number of hours it might take to solve them. Good luck and a very Happy Thanksgiving.
I don't use surge protectors. To protect electronics I use an APC UPS (Uninterruptible Power Supply) that cleans up BOTH spikes and dips in the sine wave. Once in awhile I hear it kick in, so in theory it's cleaning up the output and again in theory it protects anything plugged into it. Some may think it's overkill, but I had some issues many years ago and haven't had an issue once I started using it. I should mention that when I bought mine years ago, most UPS units only cleaned up the spikes and I had to look at the details in order to ensure it addressed both 'spikes' and 'brown outs'.
Awesome Art 👍 good to know I might just go ahead and get me a new surge protector before I get my wtiu great video glad you did one 👍 Happy Thanksgiving
Good news Art Thanks , I like Tripp-Lite protectors, amazon a little pricey i use them in my Amateur Radio station and the current Layout i run the non W TIU and MTH Z4000 so not sure if the ZWL will like this brand of protector either but it has saved my radio station several times.Jim Teeple Warren Ohio
I haven’t had issues getting the two fixed ports to work with my ZW-L, but the variable ports don’t like it - they don’t like an older CW-80 either from 2006. They work fine with an old ZW, which leads me to believe it doesn’t like the waveform that “modern” Lionel transformers put out.
Yeah same here, I paid for the app upgrade, changed the variable outputs to fixed and when I use them I get a loud buzz. When I'm running trains I don't hear it so I've let it for now. I agree, I have heard it has to do with he choppy wave from the ZW-L.
@@ArtsModelTrainsMTH stuff has always been finicky with these newer Lionel transformers, but my prior TIU didn’t have these issues - wonder if a firmware update will fix this?
Yeah the zwl is polarized so that wasn't it. I used to have reception issues with my tmcc set in the same surge protector, so now this all makes sense, there is some sort of ground issue that is causing the problem which would effect the tmcc signal too.
I don't think it is a "polarity" issue, I think it is a "phasing" issue. Polarity is a simple reversal of positive and negative, whereas phasing involves a time delay between signals causing potential cancellation effects when combined
A funky surge protector would not have entered my flow chart for troubleshooting. I am waiting on my WTIU for my current ceiling loop. I plan to purchase another for future layout which will also be using the new Lionel ZWL. Like you, I am also using smart plugs to control my layouts. Will be curious to learn if that was an issue or not, or if it was just due to a funky surge protector issue.
@@matthewtaylor2020 ok I have the new belkin surge protector installed and everything works great, no issues. So smart plug is still there and no issues with it.
Quick question, I see that you have in your layout the Lionel Base 3. Between this new WTIU and the Lionel Base 3, which would you recommend? I have an understanding that the Lionel base 3 is not compatible with MTH locomotives. However, does the new WTIU allow me to access all the features (or most important ones) on a legacy Lionel engine? Thank you sooo much for your time!
Yeah which system you choose is all about which brand locomotives you have. The Base3 will give you access to all the latest functionality of legacy locomotives. So will the WTIU for MTH locomotives but depending on your locomotive you might have to buy the app upgrade too.
Not yet the new cable is in production right now, not sure mth has given out product info yet. From what I have heard it will be available early next year.
@@ArtsModelTrains I called MTH today and guess who picked up the phone?...., Rich Foster himself, and had a good conversation about wtiu and the serial port/usb cable. He told me he was going to talk to Mike w and light a fire under his rump
@@ArtsModelTrains my bad total brain fart. Yep signal output on the Legacy base😂, i've only had the leg base for 14 years. But you can't run legacy without the serial/usb adapter not on shelves yet cord - correct.
I wanted to buy one at Edison,last Saturday I'm a coward I know absolutely nothing about DCS.This is what keeps me away from MTH engines. I only have one, that I run conventional
Well, it is good to know that you were able to figure out the problem and find a solution. Despite the frustration it is good that you were able to get things going. I would not have thought that the surge protector would be responsible for the problem, interesting. I commend you for your perseverance! Thanks, Art, for sharing all of this. Bill B.
Thanks for the update. Sometimes it's the simplest things that give us the biggest headaches. lol. Kudos for your efforts in this endeavor.
Ahhh the “Art” of Troubleshooting
I'm new to MTH wanted to get the new WTIU how do you change the variable channel 2 a fixed channel?
Great video. Thanks so much for sharing. Appreciate seeing the good and the bad. It’s so helpful for troubleshooting and seeing that you’re not alone when running into issues on your layout.
Thanks for your help on the forum, Art! 💪🏾
No problem, trying to help out as much as I can, I don't want people to be as frustrated as I was with the WTIU lol
All's well that ends well! Glad you got it working, happy Thanksgiving! 🦃
Awesome! Crazy that was it. But good note for all of us going forward.
I use the high dollar s p's from home depot. Also everybody's going to have to wait to hook up Lionel to the wtiu, mth doesn't have the cord adapter in hands yet. They say month or so. Nice video Art, I ordered my wtiu monday😊
Thanks so much for the information Art! My WTIU has just arrived. Now it’s my turn to hook it up to my ZW-L. Happy Thanksgiving! 💯👍
@@TwistedMacGyversTrains let me know if you get a buzz when you hook up to the variable tracks, that is my last issue I'm working on, but it is not loud enough for me to hear when I'm running trains so not a show stopper
@@ArtsModelTrains I will let you know how I make out for sure. Fingers crossed I don’t have any issues.
Thanks for taking the time to share your solutions. Still waiting for my unit. Can’t Wait to have that type of fun. It just may have to wait until after the new year’s hangover.
Hello Art! Great job discovering and resolving your signal issue. Sounds like there was possibly a “Ground” issue where your surge protector didn’t provide the signal through the ground. The surge protector brand I’ve had excellent results with is “Belkin”. I have mine for many years, and I’ve never encountered any signal problems with either my TMCC, Legacy, DCS, LCS, or WIU. I’ve got everything working and playing in the sandbox absolutely perfectly. So, if you’re in the market for a good surge protector, I recommend a “Belkin” surge protector. Again, this is my go to brand, other people may have other ideas, but I can honestly say, I’ve never had and signal issues with any of my equipment. Tom
Thanks, I ordered a belkin and should have it today to set up tonight!
I hear that Belkin makes some good stuff. I have a few friends that use Belkin products and they never have a problem.
I’m glad you got it working! Hopefully you’ll get that buzz resolved.
Good deal! It seems that the new WTIU may be a bit 'sensitive', as far as how you hook-up the power. As I mentioned before, there needs to be and in-depth demonstration on how to hook everything up properly. At least you got one bugaboo out of the way. Keep us informed, as everything proceeds.
@@johnandrus3901 agree the manual and online directions aren't very helpful
Thanks for documenting this troubleshooting and resolution! I hope to add DCS to my layout soon!
Thanks for this video Art, I'm sorry that it took so long to figure this problem out but looks like you "nailed it". I certainly understand track and power issues and the number of hours it might take to solve them. Good luck and a very Happy Thanksgiving.
Awesome working it out.
I don't use surge protectors. To protect electronics I use an APC UPS (Uninterruptible Power Supply) that cleans up BOTH spikes and dips in the sine wave. Once in awhile I hear it kick in, so in theory it's cleaning up the output and again in theory it protects anything plugged into it.
Some may think it's overkill, but I had some issues many years ago and haven't had an issue once I started using it.
I should mention that when I bought mine years ago, most UPS units only cleaned up the spikes and I had to look at the details in order to ensure it addressed both 'spikes' and 'brown outs'.
Awesome Art 👍 good to know I might just go ahead and get me a new surge protector before I get my wtiu great video glad you did one 👍 Happy Thanksgiving
@@ELWtrains I picked up a belkin off Amazon same day shipping, have it installed with no issues
Good news Art Thanks , I like Tripp-Lite protectors, amazon a little pricey i use them in my Amateur Radio station and the current Layout i run the non W TIU and MTH Z4000 so not sure if the ZWL will like this brand of protector either but it has saved my radio station several times.Jim Teeple Warren Ohio
I have a wtiu in my hands👏
I haven’t had issues getting the two fixed ports to work with my ZW-L, but the variable ports don’t like it - they don’t like an older CW-80 either from 2006. They work fine with an old ZW, which leads me to believe it doesn’t like the waveform that “modern” Lionel transformers put out.
Yeah same here, I paid for the app upgrade, changed the variable outputs to fixed and when I use them I get a loud buzz. When I'm running trains I don't hear it so I've let it for now. I agree, I have heard it has to do with he choppy wave from the ZW-L.
@@ArtsModelTrainsMTH stuff has always been finicky with these newer Lionel transformers, but my prior TIU didn’t have these issues - wonder if a firmware update will fix this?
Also my variable ports trip the internal breaker frequently.
@alexart6237 wow that is interesting, wonder what is going on there?
Is it possible it was a polarity issue and not the surge strip? Is the plug for the ZWL polarized?
Yeah the zwl is polarized so that wasn't it. I used to have reception issues with my tmcc set in the same surge protector, so now this all makes sense, there is some sort of ground issue that is causing the problem which would effect the tmcc signal too.
@@ArtsModelTrains good to know. I’m using some very old surge protectors. Maybe it’s time for an upgrade.
I don't think it is a "polarity" issue, I think it is a "phasing" issue.
Polarity is a simple reversal of positive and negative, whereas phasing involves a time delay between signals causing potential cancellation effects when combined
@ I frequently use the wrong word in a situation like this, my brain is mush, lol.
A funky surge protector would not have entered my flow chart for troubleshooting. I am waiting on my WTIU for my current ceiling loop. I plan to purchase another for future layout which will also be using the new Lionel ZWL. Like you, I am also using smart plugs to control my layouts. Will be curious to learn if that was an issue or not, or if it was just due to a funky surge protector issue.
@@matthewtaylor2020 ok I have the new belkin surge protector installed and everything works great, no issues. So smart plug is still there and no issues with it.
We use upc.
Quick question, I see that you have in your layout the Lionel Base 3. Between this new WTIU and the Lionel Base 3, which would you recommend? I have an understanding that the Lionel base 3 is not compatible with MTH locomotives. However, does the new WTIU allow me to access all the features (or most important ones) on a legacy Lionel engine? Thank you sooo much for your time!
Yeah which system you choose is all about which brand locomotives you have. The Base3 will give you access to all the latest functionality of legacy locomotives. So will the WTIU for MTH locomotives but depending on your locomotive you might have to buy the app upgrade too.
Does anyone know if MTH has a product number for the serial to usb cord that is needed for tmcc/Legacy
Not yet the new cable is in production right now, not sure mth has given out product info yet. From what I have heard it will be available early next year.
@ I ran across marcs o scale trains short video, jumper wire on out black terminals to get lionel power to track😳
@@ArtsModelTrains I called MTH today and guess who picked up the phone?...., Rich Foster himself, and had a good conversation about wtiu and the serial port/usb cable. He told me he was going to talk to Mike w and light a fire under his rump
@conductorjohnmthtrains2239 yes, or I just run a wire to my distribution blocks from my legacy base to get the signal out
@@ArtsModelTrains my bad total brain fart. Yep signal output on the Legacy base😂, i've only had the leg base for 14 years. But you can't run legacy without the serial/usb adapter not on shelves yet cord - correct.
I wanted to buy one at Edison,last Saturday
I'm a coward
I know absolutely nothing about DCS.This is what keeps me away from MTH engines.
I only have one, that I run conventional
Yeah dcs is more complex to set up vs legacy and obviously conventional
First
Go run some Wrath of KhanRail 😂
Don'y buy cheap surge protecters
Don’t you hate man made problems it’s nothing you did watch out for Tokyo tuffies