For me, Fulgrim's need to prove himself, was less about him being a "whiny bitch" but more of a need, or pressure, to live up to the name and personal aquilla of the Emperor himself. For me it was that warning of attempting to live up to the expectations that are placed on us and the blindness that can come from the seeking of improvement. When Fulgrim is alone in his primarch novel he is contemplative and thoughtful, and during the scene where he is amongst the public he is gentle and compassionate and speaks of elevating themselves and those around them
This. Chemos was on the verge of collapse and so was his legion when he first met them that he and his sons always felt that they had something to prove.
Reading "Fulgrim," 100% agree. That book set him up for a sort of revival/redemption. All to be destroyed in a short story in an anthology book. Thanks, GW.
It breaks your heart to think of the kind of man Fulgrim was at the beginning, a man who wanted to bring culture and art mankind, and now he’s so foul even his warped brothers want nothing to do with him
The idea of being too perfect to create art is pretty good. Fulgrim is incapable of the flaws which give sculptures, paintings, writings, etc... their strengths. That said, such bitterness seems to be purely a result of the Laer blade and something which GW missed a trick setting up for a rebirth arc in 40/41k
Cegorach switched Fulgrim and Jaghatai because the White Scars falling to Slaanesh would have been apocalyptic beyond anything the EC would later cause.
That or Cegorach knew the Khan would eventually enter the webway due to the Drukhari raids on Chogoris, and wanted to parlay with a primarch in the Black Library?
I mean noise marines are bad already but imagine if ALL of them had a bike and a land speeder and rather than rock and roll they killed you with Mongolian music
With 10th on its way, we'll probably see EC in the next three years. considering how beautiful the Slaanesh models for AoS are, I'm hopeful. Fulgrim is going to look like a kitbash of Sigvald and Morathi
I waiting for the super dreadnought obliterator perturabo who never actually became a demon primarch,instead burning demons as fuel for the damb near knight sized life support machine he has become
@@jmgonzales7701 i did enjoy the pre heresy Fulgrim, he's one ove my fave primarchs,but he doesnt bore me either. As long as you don't say you like Lorgar im good
One of the most depressing and dark moments for the Emperors Children was in the story "Angel Exterminatus." When the Kakophoni member Julius Kaesoron and many of the members of his party were at an eldar crone world. They started fighting for and eating Eldar Soul Stones. What happens after this is horrifying as, out of random, Julius and several THOUSAND Emperors Children members grabbed their swords and started cutting eachothsr apart, like a bunch of rapid beasts. In the end, Julius laid on his knees, hands covering his face, covering in blood and viscera. These guys are my fav chaos legion but they're so sad and sickening
But that is the best parts....the mania...the obsession..... Anyway the losses don't matter, when GW finally gets around to writing EC back into the main storyline we'll find that Fulgrim restored the legion afterall no one turned on the Primach he just went for some smokes. Then the numbers will swell with Slaaneshi Marines from all over the place. The same as happened to the equally "hopelessly" fragmented World Eaters. The fluff will change to suit whatever GW's is trying to sell at the time.
Angel Exterminatus is also....kind of hilarious, too. Perturabo and Fulgrim should have gone on more adventures together. All I could think about was that one episode of Boondocks with Grandad and Tyler Perry.
I kind of love that. Not to downplay your reaction but it's a good reminder of how giving yourself over to chaos can and will fuck you over and those closest to you. If feels like often authors just make it mean getting power as long as you act completely evil with no real downsides
@@Fifthmiraclewith the world eaters they never reformed as a legion they just kind of started following Angron and his ship around because he went to all the good battles, I’m probably wrong but this is a vague recollection of what happened, btw look up the phoenix conclave the emperors children are already beginning to reform
Fabius Bile is the last true adherent to the Emperor's Imperial Truth, which is as funny as it is depressing. He still remembers the old creed of abhoring the warp, disregarding superstition and most importantly - being the vessel that guides humanity into its dominance of the stars.
You noticed that bit about Fulgrim allowing the people to pursue hobbies... this ties into Slaneesh's grasp on him and why he went to f00k off for centuries... it's his personality, and I'm sure Slaneessh has plenty of hobbies to fall into... lol... Yeah definitely a true connoisseur of 40K lore, you got my sub... lol
Emperor's Children always felt like knowing a straight A student in high school, then something happened to turn them into a coke head and gave everything up.
@Mr. Bones 40k he never will. He was a minor plot point in a book series whos author, Josh Reynolds, no longer works for GW. As much story potential clonegrim has he existed entirely for Fabius Bile's character growth, and was disposed of as soon as the story no longer needed him.
So... imagine if you will, Jaghatai Khan returns with...young Clone-grim by his side. And Clone-grim has been exposed to all the Chogoris warrior culture "fierce honour, loyalty and ruthlessness"
Let's not forget that he failed to turn Rylanor the most stonch EC loyalists and it stuck a mortal blow on his ego where some believe that it's been eating at him to where it'll eventually kill the demon primarch
Rylanor is noncanon due to the construction of the beacon he calls Fulgrim with. There was no way for him to get Sonic Weapons on Istvaan 3 as they didn't exist during the battle.
@@PrinceOfChange it’s stated in my claim. Rylanor constructs his beacon with Sonic weapons, but those were first used during the marivaglia, an event that happened after Istvaan 3 but before Istvaan 5 as they were first used against the loyalist legions sent to quell the heresy. . Quite simply, Rylanor is wounded by and constructs a beacon out of weapons that don’t exist at that point in time. He also can’t have been discovered later as warbands would investigate what happened to a squad of suddenly dead noise marines on a planet with a population of 0 (other than Rylanor)
@@alexwilbrecht6962 Dude claim is wrong as hell, Rylanor was sent to guard a underground hangar, which he used as his home for the next 10,000 years. He could have used parts in the hangar to create the beacon and virus bomb, maybe even using parts of his dreadnought body he deemed non essential. The hangar would likely contain parts to fix ships communications systems so he could have put those parts together to build a beacon. BAM plot hole sealed, Rylanor still be canon dude.
@@lordofdefiance8174 it is stated in the story that he created the beacon out of Sonic weapon parts. . “Vistario glanced at the strange device hooked to the interior of the wrecked starship and inquired as to the device's purpose. Rylanor explained it was a Sonic Weapon of some kind. A handful of his former brothers among the Emperor's Chidren had found the hangar and sought to kill him. They failed, but the power of their weapons crippled him and left him mortally wounded. Vistario deduced that Rylanor had managed to reshape the Sonic Weapon into a distress beacon of some kind.” . If you want to talk about the story I’d recommend reading it first
@@PrinceOfChange Emperors children are a joke though, I know word bearers are awful but I cant deny they are a solid effective legion even in 40k setting
I think part of the reason the Emperor's Children are one of my top two favorite legions is because they are an excellent example of the weight of expectation leading to failure. Part of the reason I love fulgrim is because he had to work with what he had, which was functionally nothing, and turn it into something perfect for the emperor who simply doesn't care. I dunno, I think its really interesting.
Yeah the Black Templars are my favorite chapter, and of all of the emperors foes, I think they hate "the children" the most, they won't call them the emperors children, they just call them heretic and start firing.
@@TheBoneZone40k strangely I think the BT don’t hate the IW more then they hate any other legion bar the Black legion. Mainly due to Adabbon killing Sigimund the BT now seem to hate the Black legion more then the Iron warriors.
ya know what, you got a point there? I remember the canonical death of Sigismund being one of the only moments in Abaddon's life where he felt shame due to a loss. It would be funny to find out that the Black Legion is just canonically afraid of the Templars also, I feel outside of Chaos, Orks are probably high on the totem of hate.
So, slight correction: Fulgrim's soul was not consumed. When the Daemon of the Laer Blade possessed his body, the Daemon forced Fulgrim's soul into a painting. Later, "Fulgrim" told his legion that he had broken out and repossessed his now Daemonic body offscreen, but I don't buy that one bit. As you probably know, daemons are pathological liars by their un-nature. Also it'd be way too anticlimactic for something like that to just happen off-screen so off-handedly. My current theory is that Fulgrim's soul broke out of the painting and possessed the clone, and that thing that masquerades as the Daemon Primarch of the Emperor's Children is the daemon of the Laer Blade still playing around with Fulgrim's warp-twisted husk.
There’s a none zero possibility that the demon was a former laer person and when “fulgrim” became a demon prince it became closer to its original laer form which is why he his current form.
I know I'm a year out of date, so forgive the necro-post. Unfortunately, while I agree that the community canon is superior to the GW canon it is just that. And I say community because everyone one I've spoken to hates the GW canon when it comes to Fulgrim. We collectively take the position that his soul is still in the painting, has been disembodied and thus bound to the clone etc. That story was written to put the idea of a loyalist Fulgrim to bed. Just like how all of Magnus's better parts are lost and thus Magnus can't ever become a loyalist again. GW and the BL writers seem to find the certain concepts forbidden. Like Olanius just being a regular human brought along by Sang (because he could see the importance) and stepping up to a demi-god. No he had to be a perpetual. Ugh.
while i like this theory, this is warhammer and what ever you wrote sounds too idealistic for Warhammer. I doubt ur right, i want you to be but i don't think GW will spoil us with such grandeur.
I’d actually really like a 3 part series of a brand new Primaris chapter, finding out they’re sons of the Phoenician, and then going on a redemption crusade only to find out Trazyn has loyalist Clonegrim in his vaults and the final book is them cutting a deal with Trazyn to free him. Then you could release an EC vs EC box with Clonegrim vs Daemongrim.
@@total_no_more they’re technically Imperial Fists successors but it’s possible that Cawl made new primaris chapters (which the Sons of the Phoenix are) with traitor gene seed, then asked Gulliman for permission to use that seed, which he said no to. In response Cawl lies and says all these primaris are made from loyal geneseed when in fact some are not. . There is no evidence for this claim though other than Cawl asking Gulliman to use traitor geneseed and that the Sons of the Phoenix sounds very emperors childreny to me. I think it would be cool if these traitor geneseed chapters (if they are traitor geneseed) fall to chaos like their brothers but that’s just my preference. The loyalist remnants of the traitor legions are so cool because there are so few and their motivations to stay loyal, having random chapters like that diminishes the coolness of Tarvitz and Garro
I think at this point, with how GW burned the Fulgrim Redemption Arc bridge in HH, it'd take more than 3 books. But 100% down for the idea. From the mainline HH books, Fulgrim almost seems to be a loyalist primarch imprisoned by the laer blade's daemon. GW kinda ruined that, but I'm entirely on board with that storyline.
200 marines were all that were left when Fulgrim was found. Fulgrim wanted to achieve the same glories as his brothers, but when the other primarchs were given legions with numbers that are legion, its kinda hard to do the same as the 100k strong ultramarines with 200 dudes but he still did his best. On 28-1 he integrated the planet in a month with 7 marines, so pretty damn impressive. Also the Laeran were estimated to take the strength of 3 legions and millions if not billions of solar auxila (imperial guard predecessor) 3-ish years. The 3rd legion did this task on their own in a matter of months, not years. To me, this feat pushes Fulgrim and his legion to being the second strongest legion and best living primarch IMO (how can you beat an army of psyker super soldiers like the Thousand Sons?) At the moment (may of 2023, arks of omen just ended, the Lion just returned) Fulgrim is active in realspace, doing "debauchery" according to one of the early Arks of Omens books (Abaddon gets mad about this) Also, stop hating on my man Lucius, its not his fault the writers don't know what to do with him and he's hella fun on the tabletop. Also check out Lord Commander Eidolon, The Risen. Really underused character. You did a really good job on this video, the EC have a lot of lore and are one of the more complex legions. Great introduction to the legion.
@@totalnerd5674 maybe? But no. Like in the fulgrim book the Laer do quite well for themselves, and without fulgrim’s intervention they would have possibly been integrated into the imperium due to their strength. If I was a chaos god planning a civil war, and the Laer are stronger than the 3rd legion, I’d rather have the Laer as my pawns than the EC noting that they are, in this hypothetical, more powerful
In the Fulgrim book, I got a sense that the 3rd was a Legion that everyone hated to love. Also when Garro is ripping Tarvitz for being a bunch of fanciful dandies. Also when Eidelon brought Tarvitz to Fabius’ lab after killing the WarSinger was a great glimpse into “why” the Legion went this direction.
Honestly, loyalist Primaris Emperor's Children sounds like a fantastic conversion/custom build project. Cause I don't think GW would do something THAT cool. :P
The Emperor Children Legion was once seen by the Imperium as the Paragons of what a Legion should conduct itself as, but there endless pursuit for perfection blinded them to flaws and corruption that their Primarch was plunging them to was a tale of how insidious Chaos can be.
If the soul of Fulgrim is forfeit and the clone is a true clone.... does that mean a perfect clone of Angron could happen? No demonhood, no butchers nails? Probably happened too long ago, but War Dog Primaris vs World Eater Astartes would also be crazy...
that is an interesting idea? Because Angron-pre nails was apparently one of the most noble and kind primarchs, with his weird primarch power being something akin to being able to experience the pain of those around him instead of them. so a clone would be interesting? not like the butchers nails would just appear
@@TheBoneZone40k Probably still have the hardest hate boner for the emperor and the imperium for they had done to him, but he also hates khorn , so i imagine he would compromise with guilliman by giving him his own planet to free and be peaceful and 100 % independent of the imperium and in return make a new world eater legions who is also independent but would also help the imperium in their of need
Fabius isn't alive because of time passing slower in the warp but rather because of his functional immorality. He spends a lot of time outside of the warp on his weird quests.
Fulgrim def fell “the hardest” of the monogod primarchs, or really any but maybe Horus. Mortarion, Kurze, Angron were basically on the edge already, Peter turbo was a sulky baby and Magnus just couldnt get over himself. Fulgrim might have been a pretty boy and a snob but he genuinely was trying to build a better place for mankind and to raise people up before he picked up the snake sword mcguffin
I love pre heresy-Fulgrim. And I think the book "Fulgrim" is one of the best in the horus heresy series. He was just a perfect walking inferiority complex, Everyone loved him and thought he was great but he had this insecurity stemming from having to fight with the Luna Wolves with his itty bitty Legion I guess. Oh and I hate Eidolon, and Lucius for what he did to Solomon Demeter. But I hate Eidolon most of all just because he is gross.
Thanks for the video. You can't really blame Fulgrim for wanting more, given how almost everything he was given from his homeworld to his legion was a pile of *redacted*, along with all the expectation that came with being the Emperor's Children. Him picking up the Laer was a result of him picking up trophies from his conquests to remind himself of his pride, or that he was just as good as his brothers depending.
The emperors children were so loved by the emperor that they were the only legion to be allowed to wear the aquilla symbol which was the personal symbol of the emperor. Even their name is has emperor in it.
Lol fulgrim is sulking because when he and those thousand sons marines went to answer that beacon rylanor set off, those psyker thousand sons thought he was such a dick that they let rylanors nuke go off. They literally voluntarily died because fulgrim is so unbearable as a person that they would rather die in the process of letting rylanor get his punch in rather than spend one more second with this peacock. I genuinely hate fulgrim from the moment he picked that damn sword up. Rylanor and those thousand sons embarrassed him so bad he's been hiding out on a pleasure planet for thousands of years. He is literally the least useful primarch of them all, even lorgar
I respect this take so much. you're just right. Fulgrim pre-snake sword had his issues, but he was compelling because of it. Now he's just embarrassing to be around. There is a reason I also didn't talk about Rylanor yes, that literal chad-bot is getting his own video. he deserves it
@Mr. Bones 40k I figured if you told this story you would have a rylanor video! Rylanor gave fulgrim such a slap to the face that he has been crying for like 10 thousand years. Rylanor is an absolute beast to spend so much time just waiting to nuke fulgrim, and you know that he had to know it wouldn't kill him. He just wanted to piss in his cheerios for what fulgrim did. Fulgrims whole shtick pisses me off to no end. I got my degree in fine arts and studio art and mainly an oil painter. I love fine artwork and the process of how it's made. The one single primarch they made who represents what I love has like a half of a single book talking about that stuff and then he becomes snake laer fulgrim and it all goes to shit. He makes all of us artistic people look like flaky and bored people with severe cases of ADHD. he also kind of doesn't have any special primarch ability other than he heals faster than the others minus maybe vulkan. His only purpose is to lie to people and whine a lot. He couldn't even be bothered to attend the siege of Terra because he was busy turning citizens elsewhere into coke. Useless. I kept wishing clonegrim would find a way to murder fulgrim and go back and be loyalist legionless fulgrim
@Whitlock The Revanchist fulgrims ability is dualing. He has the best winstreak and most primarch kills of any of his brothers. Hes also known for his charisma, similar to Horus and was able to take over hostile planets entirely through diplomacy. His healing isnt any better than any other primarch Also, your insecurity about your talents is showing through. Perhaps you hate fulgy so much because you see a bit of yourself in him lmao. Ill never get the hate for him, his story is one of the best tragedies in 40k and hes memed on more than any other primarch with all of his losses exaggerated and his wins ignored. Hes a badass and nothing like the whiny bitch people pretend he is
@Fugl Featherbird did you really just say my insecurity about my talents is showing through? First, that's a real dick thing to say to anybody, second you said it just to be mean because you don't actually know anything about me and I didn't actually say anything about myself, personally. I don't know if that made you feel good about yourself to talk to someone like that but honestly it just made you look like the arrogant asshole you and fulgrim are. And 3rd, these are fictional stories and people that don't actually exist and to try to judge someone like that over their dislike of a completely fictional character says a lot more about you than it does my unmentioned talents. Clearly you like fulgrim enough to be a total asshole to a stranger, that's cool man. Maybe your love for the peacock says more about you than you realize. And 4th, dueling isn't an ability, every single one of these guys was trained from the moment they were found to be a duelist. And fulgrim might have been a good swordsmen but no one thought he would be able to take ferris and the only reason he was able to match was because of the daemon shoved up his butt. So I'm not sure it's really even fulgrim that is a great duelist, maybe that daemon or later slaanesh when she turned him into that snake thing, but straight up fulgrim isn't even a top 4 or 5 duelist, so I don't think that counts as an ability. Next time if you wanna have a conversation about 40k or your apparent primarch, that's great, and I genuinely love debates about this kind of stuff, but next time be an adult and don't attack the person right out of the gate. Especially when, like here, you didn't have any reason to even say it. It just makes you look like an asshole and no one wants to talk to an asshole. Kind of how no one wants to talk to fulgrim.
@Whitlock The Revanchist learn how to take a joke. And fulgrim didnt need the blade to beat ferrus. He literally beat the shit out of ferrus with his bare hands while the blade was still on his flagship before the fight at istvaan
I remember reading somewhere that Humanity only developed actual language because our ancestors had just enough free time to figure out how to make these mouth sounds into something more coherent.
If it helps/ hasn't been said before, I think the reason why Fulgrim fled to the pleasure planet to this day is because of his inability to corrupt Rylanore, but I could be wrong
Laughing god made a power move. He knew one of these Children were gonna be at his doorstep. Better be the one looking at the mirror more than the one who would forget about the conquest once completed.
10:21 nope common believe is that the clones lack the warp spawn soul of the primarch and that to gather them big e stroke his bargains with the God's.
"some ancient xeno collector who has this massive museum" This is such an incredibly general and oversimplified description of Trazyn that it almost feels disrespectful lmao
Clonegrim didn't have or at least wasn't said to have fulgrims soul fragments. when fabius found him in a long forgotten vat from his experiments he thought clonegrim was pure and he had the potential to become an uncorrupted fulgrim, by the end of the novel fabius concludes that clonegrim has the same personality deficiencies as fulgrim and would do the same mistakes, it's that fact that makes him give him to trazyn because he is disgusted and disappointed.
But there's something to be said that he has seen what his children have become and hates it. He has seen what those choices he would have made have led to.
The reason he hasn't been active is because he is recovering his ego after Rylanor stomped on that sh!t. Oh and I guess he did have a pretty big fight with Guilliman.
To say that the emperors children fell with a flop is an understatement. A better way to put it is to say that The Emperors Children fell so hard that even Ferrus Manus's head was like "damn"
Fulgrim was my first HH novel, having known next to nothing about the EC other than they had Noise Marines, worshiped Slaanesh and Fulgrim was arrogant incarnate and wounded Guiliman, putting him in the coma and that was it. I never felt drawn to them and ignored them throughout 4th and early 5th Edition but Fulgrim opened my eyes and I saw a Primarch with so much promise but had no chance against what was infecting him, unable to save his sons who were probably more corrupted in spirit than he was before his fall (except Sol Tarvitz and Ancient Rylonor, they were good boys). Baldermort really have him the coverage I felt he needed and highlighted just how tragic his fall was for the entire Imperium. He is the Griffith of 40K.
Good work with this viedo. But how can you recount the story of the Emperor's Children and no mention the Maraviglia, it's as integral to their fall as the Laer temple?
Not really, the Laer temple is the focal point where the corruption is introduced in the legion, the maraviglia is the dramatic way the novel showcases the end point of the corruption, but in itself it's not particularly needed to explain or introduce the emperor's children
When Emperor’s Children come out in 40K, I’m gonna paint them their beautiful royal purple and gold colors and home brew a war band that’s seeking redemption and are searching for clonegrim so they can be their noble selves again like Saul Tarvitz and Rylanor.
Ah, the Emperor's Children. My favourite space marine legion, and the most real depiction of where an astartes type super soldier program would end up irl.
5:07 "His TINY Legion" Ya know, I'm not saying that the Black Library authors were heavily implying by Fulgrim's insecurity that he had a small member compared to the other primarchs because of the size of their various legions, but given it's the Emperor's Children... well if the shoe fits...
But he did see and know what they've becomes, Clonegrim even killed one, he wants to elevate them again return them to the light, every Noise marine there knelt at Clonegrim
GW seems to de-emphasize slaaneshi stuff (probably because they're afraid of the sex parts), so honestly I wouldn't be surprised if they skip straight to Perterabo
I highly doubt Clonegrim will be coming back because; 1: Fabius only avoided getting trapped in Trayzn the Infinite's collection by trading Clonegrim and the Emperor's Children warband Fabius was forced to help in exchange for a huge stock of EC geneseed, anybody trying to get in to rescue Clonegrim stands even less of a chance, 2: Even if he were able to escape, he would immediately be purged as a heretic due to the Imperial Creed only mentioning the nine loyal Primarchs and any reference to the nine traitors was entirely deleted from Imperial records, so a tenth loyal primarch would be an enormous red flag for the High Lords of Terra to demand immediate removal of such a threat to their control over the Imperium, 3: Fabius knew that Clonegrim would make the exact same mistakes as the real Fulgrim that led to their Legion collapsing into the numerous sado-masochist warbands it is now, so there's no guarantee that Clonegrim would actually be a loyalist since the original was so easily swayed by Horus into turning against The Emperor in the first place, 4: Not every Black Library story gets to be made fully canon to the game, which is why "War of the Spider" and the following Chaos Space Marine codexes have never mentioned that there are at least twelve active Fabius clones currently conscious at a time in the galaxy, which would easily speed along Abaddon's desire for Chaos Primaris that he's tasked the original Fabius with by them all working together, but even the recent CSM update hasn't added them to the roster, so we'll probably never actually see Chaos Primaris units in the physical game. But hey, the potential is still there, so I wouldn't 100% rule it out.
Pre-Heresy Fulgrim was a total chad imo and was up there with Vulkan and Sanguinius. He was all about lifting up humanity, no matter if they were regular humans or not, to be the best they possibly could be. People like Tarvitz show what his legion and philosophy could have been
Im not gonna argue the emperors children where ever without their flaws, but they are my favourite for a very clear reason, their potential. I feel like they fell harder than other legions in part because they where willing to try any depraved activity, but that openess to change also makes them have the most potential for improvement. In one of the heresy books you can see the diferences between Dorn and Alpharius, and you can see how stubborn they both are, Dorn will never use covert tactics like Alpharius, even if it would save lives, essentially because he finds it dishonorable, and Alpharius will never use a conventional frontal assault because he has an obsession with challenging himself with absurdly complicated rules. No matter how much time you give these two, and most primarchs for that matter, they will never step out of their comfort zones. Fulgrim however, doesnt have that, his legion has no special genetic power nor a specific inclination when it comes to combat, they are a bit more well known for dueling, but the most important part is that they aspire to be the best in every regard, they will never look down upon a different set of strategies, they will always try to learn and grow, and i feel like given enough time they would become by far the best by combining everything they can learn. Personally i think pound for pound, marine for marine, pre heresy they had the best troops, they worked with other legions as elite troops, special forces. Its a shame for me how they are seen as vanity fueled narcissists, while so much potential goes unseen.
im just getting into 40k lore. gonna have to pick up some books soon. theres many legions and chapters. what are some cool obscure ones to look into. im tired of hearingnof dpace wolves, my god.
Fulgrim was almost murdered as a baby because that's how they handled orphans on chemos and he was spared only because his adoptive father decided that he had potential. So of course, Fulgrum was incredibly insecure about his small lesion and the fact that he was falling behind his brother s. Because fulgrim had lived his entire life having to justify his own existence. This was just the first time it had been even remotely difficult for him. He's a Primark after all. But now he's competing against other primarks with much less resources than his brothers have . As pompous and hoity toity as he is that could all have been a mask that he hid behind as it became harder and harder for him to Cope with not being the best because being the best was how he justified him living when others in his situation were murdered
I’m not even religious but the Emperor’s Children remind me the most of this verse in the Bible, Isaiah 14: “How you have fallen from heaven, O morning star, son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations!”
I have one thing to say; they still have a shred of honor and know that a duel is sacrosanct. (Fabius Bile Clone lord, chapter 3 I *Think*? I'm not sure about the chapter, but it was Clone Lord this shred of lore comes from. )
Haha yeah a loyalists chapter of Emperor's Children would be crazy haha. ... no, sir, Inquisitor, sir I wasn't thinking about the Sons of the Phoenix. No, sir. Yes, sir, noble sons of Dorn, of course, sir.
I tend to think the lamenters are actually made from emperors children geneseed and not the blood angels and that is why they dont suffer from the black rage or blood thirst. this is also why they suffer from HORRIFIC luck... because emperors children always suffered from horrible luck
I've come around to the idea that their geneseed could be a spliced variant of the Blood Angels and the seed of one of the Missing primarchs. This would explain why even an *inquisitor* was stonewalled from studying their origins during the Badaab war.
It’s just sad tome that these guys were supposed to be like a shining beacon of culture but they became sick twisted monsters and the worst part is they’ve become an ever dwindling circle of degenerates fated to be forgotten.
The Emperors Children are one of the more tragic falls in my opinion. Like all the other chaos legions had some sorta tell, like you know the world eaters aren’t lasting very long as a loyalist legion cause of how angry they all are, you know perturabo isn’t falling that far from the tree. But like, fulgrim was nice, the emperors children were a kind well raised well brought up legion, they were friendly with humans and humbled by their primarchs home planet conditions. It sucks cause you see how far they fall, they could’ve easily been one of the nicest one of the best loyalists if not for that one encounter with the sneks. Now they’re just this depraved legion of slaaneshi puppets going around doing increasingly more excessive actions
Ok, you are calling the EC a Chapter. Chapter structure did not come about until after the heresy. Pre-heresy they were called Legions. Also, the Legions consisted of Imperial Guard, Imperial Navies, Titans, etc., giving each Legion a vast amount of power. When the Chapters were formed all of those auxiliary forces were separated so that something to the magnitude of what happened at the start of the Heresy could not happen again.
For me, Fulgrim's need to prove himself, was less about him being a "whiny bitch" but more of a need, or pressure, to live up to the name and personal aquilla of the Emperor himself. For me it was that warning of attempting to live up to the expectations that are placed on us and the blindness that can come from the seeking of improvement. When Fulgrim is alone in his primarch novel he is contemplative and thoughtful, and during the scene where he is amongst the public he is gentle and compassionate and speaks of elevating themselves and those around them
This. Chemos was on the verge of collapse and so was his legion when he first met them that he and his sons always felt that they had something to prove.
Reading "Fulgrim," 100% agree. That book set him up for a sort of revival/redemption.
All to be destroyed in a short story in an anthology book.
Thanks, GW.
Plus, we all know Perturabo is the "whiny bitch" Primarch.
It breaks your heart to think of the kind of man Fulgrim was at the beginning, a man who wanted to bring culture and art mankind, and now he’s so foul even his warped brothers want nothing to do with him
The idea of being too perfect to create art is pretty good. Fulgrim is incapable of the flaws which give sculptures, paintings, writings, etc... their strengths. That said, such bitterness seems to be purely a result of the Laer blade and something which GW missed a trick setting up for a rebirth arc in 40/41k
@@Mr.LaughingDuck argel tal is just a brainwashed guts let's be honest
@@igooog i doubt they wanted to give him a rebirth or even a redemption. This is warhammer everything just sucks.
Even back then, a lot of them didn’t like him very much. Fulgrim was always pretty eccentric even when he was a good guy.
Cegorach switched Fulgrim and Jaghatai because the White Scars falling to Slaanesh would have been apocalyptic beyond anything the EC would later cause.
That or Cegorach knew the Khan would eventually enter the webway due to the Drukhari raids on Chogoris, and wanted to parlay with a primarch in the Black Library?
Or he did it for the lolz 🤷🏼♂️
What novel is this stated in?
And he thought it was funny that the only Asian primarch landed on a planet full of Asian people
I mean noise marines are bad already but imagine if ALL of them had a bike and a land speeder and rather than rock and roll they killed you with Mongolian music
I'm just waiting for the Emperor's Children and Iron Hands overhaul. Poor fellas need more love than they're getting.
They should have a box set with both of them battling with a new model line
Id buy one for sure
With 10th on its way, we'll probably see EC in the next three years. considering how beautiful the Slaanesh models for AoS are, I'm hopeful. Fulgrim is going to look like a kitbash of Sigvald and Morathi
Iron Hands by far my favorite legion, and by far the least developed.
I waiting for the super dreadnought obliterator perturabo who never actually became a demon primarch,instead burning demons as fuel for the damb near knight sized life support machine he has become
Saying that Fulgrim was "insecure about his tiny legion" sounds like a very unwarranted euphemism
it's true though
@@elysia3294 he was flawed thou he was a top tier primarch.
@@jmgonzales7701 i did enjoy the pre heresy Fulgrim, he's one ove my fave primarchs,but he doesnt bore me either. As long as you don't say you like Lorgar im good
@@elysia3294 i mean, who tf in their right mind likes lorgar...
@@jmgonzales7701 i actually know a guy irl.... xD
One of the most depressing and dark moments for the Emperors Children was in the story "Angel Exterminatus." When the Kakophoni member Julius Kaesoron and many of the members of his party were at an eldar crone world.
They started fighting for and eating Eldar Soul Stones. What happens after this is horrifying as, out of random, Julius and several THOUSAND Emperors Children members grabbed their swords and started cutting eachothsr apart, like a bunch of rapid beasts. In the end, Julius laid on his knees, hands covering his face, covering in blood and viscera.
These guys are my fav chaos legion but they're so sad and sickening
But that is the best parts....the mania...the obsession..... Anyway the losses don't matter, when GW finally gets around to writing EC back into the main storyline we'll find that Fulgrim restored the legion afterall no one turned on the Primach he just went for some smokes. Then the numbers will swell with Slaaneshi Marines from all over the place. The same as happened to the equally "hopelessly" fragmented World Eaters. The fluff will change to suit whatever GW's is trying to sell at the time.
Angel Exterminatus is also....kind of hilarious, too. Perturabo and Fulgrim should have gone on more adventures together. All I could think about was that one episode of Boondocks with Grandad and Tyler Perry.
I kind of love that. Not to downplay your reaction but it's a good reminder of how giving yourself over to chaos can and will fuck you over and those closest to you. If feels like often authors just make it mean getting power as long as you act completely evil with no real downsides
Kaesoron is the first captain right? The one that c*med after being hit by Santhar?
@@Fifthmiraclewith the world eaters they never reformed as a legion they just kind of started following Angron and his ship around because he went to all the good battles, I’m probably wrong but this is a vague recollection of what happened, btw look up the phoenix conclave the emperors children are already beginning to reform
Fabius Bile is the last true adherent to the Emperor's Imperial Truth, which is as funny as it is depressing. He still remembers the old creed of abhoring the warp, disregarding superstition and most importantly - being the vessel that guides humanity into its dominance of the stars.
You noticed that bit about Fulgrim allowing the people to pursue hobbies... this ties into Slaneesh's grasp on him and why he went to f00k off for centuries... it's his personality, and I'm sure Slaneessh has plenty of hobbies to fall into... lol... Yeah definitely a true connoisseur of 40K lore, you got my sub... lol
Emperor's Children always felt like knowing a straight A student in high school, then something happened to turn them into a coke head and gave everything up.
Clonegrim: exists. And just about everyone liked it.
I mean, new fulgrim is better than old fulgrim by a mile and he hasn't even done anything yet
@Mr. Bones 40k he never will. He was a minor plot point in a book series whos author, Josh Reynolds, no longer works for GW.
As much story potential clonegrim has he existed entirely for Fabius Bile's character growth, and was disposed of as soon as the story no longer needed him.
Nope, I hate him. OG fulgrim and lucius ftw.
we want a loyalist fulgrim however it aint happening
The loyalist EC genuinely have some of the coolest aesthetics of any legion, they need to come back in some way
So... imagine if you will, Jaghatai Khan returns with...young Clone-grim by his side. And Clone-grim has been exposed to all the Chogoris warrior culture "fierce honour, loyalty and ruthlessness"
wait, vashtor has taken necron tech into the web way, where jaghatai is. Really they just need a reason for the two to meet.
I like this idea!
@@Nyctophora would just like them to have the normal phonecian culture and fulgrim good persona.
Let's not forget that he failed to turn Rylanor the most stonch EC loyalists and it stuck a mortal blow on his ego where some believe that it's been eating at him to where it'll eventually kill the demon primarch
Rylanor is noncanon due to the construction of the beacon he calls Fulgrim with. There was no way for him to get Sonic Weapons on Istvaan 3 as they didn't exist during the battle.
Proof?
@@PrinceOfChange it’s stated in my claim. Rylanor constructs his beacon with Sonic weapons, but those were first used during the marivaglia, an event that happened after Istvaan 3 but before Istvaan 5 as they were first used against the loyalist legions sent to quell the heresy.
.
Quite simply, Rylanor is wounded by and constructs a beacon out of weapons that don’t exist at that point in time. He also can’t have been discovered later as warbands would investigate what happened to a squad of suddenly dead noise marines on a planet with a population of 0 (other than Rylanor)
@@alexwilbrecht6962 Dude claim is wrong as hell, Rylanor was sent to guard a underground hangar, which he used as his home for the next 10,000 years. He could have used parts in the hangar to create the beacon and virus bomb, maybe even using parts of his dreadnought body he deemed non essential. The hangar would likely contain parts to fix ships communications systems so he could have put those parts together to build a beacon. BAM plot hole sealed, Rylanor still be canon dude.
@@lordofdefiance8174 it is stated in the story that he created the beacon out of Sonic weapon parts.
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“Vistario glanced at the strange device hooked to the interior of the wrecked starship and inquired as to the device's purpose. Rylanor explained it was a Sonic Weapon of some kind. A handful of his former brothers among the Emperor's Chidren had found the hangar and sought to kill him. They failed, but the power of their weapons crippled him and left him mortally wounded. Vistario deduced that Rylanor had managed to reshape the Sonic Weapon into a distress beacon of some kind.”
.
If you want to talk about the story I’d recommend reading it first
"The first chaos legion."
Word bearers: Am I a joke to you?
yes
I was thinking that 😅
Sorry, the first non shit chaos legion.
@@PrinceOfChange Emperors children are a joke though, I know word bearers are awful but I cant deny they are a solid effective legion even in 40k setting
i assume its meant as "first numerical chaos legion", since the dark angels stayed loyalist and the 2nd are, well, the 2nd
I can't give a real reason, but I need to put the phrase, "War-twink," into the world.
I think part of the reason the Emperor's Children are one of my top two favorite legions is because they are an excellent example of the weight of expectation leading to failure. Part of the reason I love fulgrim is because he had to work with what he had, which was functionally nothing, and turn it into something perfect for the emperor who simply doesn't care. I dunno, I think its really interesting.
Yeah the Black Templars are my favorite chapter, and of all of the emperors foes, I think they hate "the children" the most, they won't call them the emperors children, they just call them heretic and start firing.
I do feel the Iron Warriors probably are slightly higher ranked than the Emperor's Children in terms of hate.
for personal reasons ya know
@@TheBoneZone40k strangely I think the BT don’t hate the IW more then they hate any other legion bar the Black legion.
Mainly due to Adabbon killing Sigimund the BT now seem to hate the Black legion more then the Iron warriors.
ya know what, you got a point there?
I remember the canonical death of Sigismund being one of the only moments in Abaddon's life where he felt shame due to a loss.
It would be funny to find out that the Black Legion is just canonically afraid of the Templars
also, I feel outside of Chaos, Orks are probably high on the totem of hate.
After becoming traitors, they became known as the lords of profligacy
So, slight correction: Fulgrim's soul was not consumed. When the Daemon of the Laer Blade possessed his body, the Daemon forced Fulgrim's soul into a painting.
Later, "Fulgrim" told his legion that he had broken out and repossessed his now Daemonic body offscreen, but I don't buy that one bit. As you probably know, daemons are pathological liars by their un-nature. Also it'd be way too anticlimactic for something like that to just happen off-screen so off-handedly.
My current theory is that Fulgrim's soul broke out of the painting and possessed the clone, and that thing that masquerades as the Daemon Primarch of the Emperor's Children is the daemon of the Laer Blade still playing around with Fulgrim's warp-twisted husk.
There’s a none zero possibility that the demon was a former laer person and when “fulgrim” became a demon prince it became closer to its original laer form which is why he his current form.
Would also explain why the Fulgrim Clone is perfect in contrast to the other clones Bile made.
Don't think that tracks with the timeline we know.
I know I'm a year out of date, so forgive the necro-post. Unfortunately, while I agree that the community canon is superior to the GW canon it is just that. And I say community because everyone one I've spoken to hates the GW canon when it comes to Fulgrim. We collectively take the position that his soul is still in the painting, has been disembodied and thus bound to the clone etc. That story was written to put the idea of a loyalist Fulgrim to bed. Just like how all of Magnus's better parts are lost and thus Magnus can't ever become a loyalist again. GW and the BL writers seem to find the certain concepts forbidden. Like Olanius just being a regular human brought along by Sang (because he could see the importance) and stepping up to a demi-god. No he had to be a perpetual. Ugh.
while i like this theory, this is warhammer and what ever you wrote sounds too idealistic for Warhammer. I doubt ur right, i want you to be but i don't think GW will spoil us with such grandeur.
I’d actually really like a 3 part series of a brand new Primaris chapter, finding out they’re sons of the Phoenician, and then going on a redemption crusade only to find out Trazyn has loyalist Clonegrim in his vaults and the final book is them cutting a deal with Trazyn to free him.
Then you could release an EC vs EC box with Clonegrim vs Daemongrim.
The "Sons of the Phoenix" are a chapter already
The third shall reclaim their lost glory!
@@alexwilbrecht6962 so what you're telling me is there's a chance?
@@total_no_more they’re technically Imperial Fists successors but it’s possible that Cawl made new primaris chapters (which the Sons of the Phoenix are) with traitor gene seed, then asked Gulliman for permission to use that seed, which he said no to. In response Cawl lies and says all these primaris are made from loyal geneseed when in fact some are not.
.
There is no evidence for this claim though other than Cawl asking Gulliman to use traitor geneseed and that the Sons of the Phoenix sounds very emperors childreny to me.
I think it would be cool if these traitor geneseed chapters (if they are traitor geneseed) fall to chaos like their brothers but that’s just my preference. The loyalist remnants of the traitor legions are so cool because there are so few and their motivations to stay loyal, having random chapters like that diminishes the coolness of Tarvitz and Garro
I think at this point, with how GW burned the Fulgrim Redemption Arc bridge in HH, it'd take more than 3 books.
But 100% down for the idea. From the mainline HH books, Fulgrim almost seems to be a loyalist primarch imprisoned by the laer blade's daemon. GW kinda ruined that, but I'm entirely on board with that storyline.
200 marines were all that were left when Fulgrim was found.
Fulgrim wanted to achieve the same glories as his brothers, but when the other primarchs were given legions with numbers that are legion, its kinda hard to do the same as the 100k strong ultramarines with 200 dudes but he still did his best. On 28-1 he integrated the planet in a month with 7 marines, so pretty damn impressive.
Also the Laeran were estimated to take the strength of 3 legions and millions if not billions of solar auxila (imperial guard predecessor) 3-ish years. The 3rd legion did this task on their own in a matter of months, not years. To me, this feat pushes Fulgrim and his legion to being the second strongest legion and best living primarch IMO (how can you beat an army of psyker super soldiers like the Thousand Sons?)
At the moment (may of 2023, arks of omen just ended, the Lion just returned) Fulgrim is active in realspace, doing "debauchery" according to one of the early Arks of Omens books (Abaddon gets mad about this)
Also, stop hating on my man Lucius, its not his fault the writers don't know what to do with him and he's hella fun on the tabletop.
Also check out Lord Commander Eidolon, The Risen. Really underused character.
You did a really good job on this video, the EC have a lot of lore and are one of the more complex legions. Great introduction to the legion.
It could potentially be that Slaneesh forced the Laer to easily die to the EC so that Fulgrim could access their temple...
@@totalnerd5674 maybe? But no. Like in the fulgrim book the Laer do quite well for themselves, and without fulgrim’s intervention they would have possibly been integrated into the imperium due to their strength. If I was a chaos god planning a civil war, and the Laer are stronger than the 3rd legion, I’d rather have the Laer as my pawns than the EC noting that they are, in this hypothetical, more powerful
@@alexwilbrecht6962 Ah, that would make sense.
In the Fulgrim book, I got a sense that the 3rd was a Legion that everyone hated to love. Also when Garro is ripping Tarvitz for being a bunch of fanciful dandies. Also when Eidelon brought Tarvitz to Fabius’ lab after killing the WarSinger was a great glimpse into “why” the Legion went this direction.
Honestly, loyalist Primaris Emperor's Children sounds like a fantastic conversion/custom build project. Cause I don't think GW would do something THAT cool. :P
Quickly becoming one of my favorite 40k channels
The Emperor Children Legion was once seen by the Imperium as the Paragons of what a Legion should conduct itself as, but there endless pursuit for perfection blinded them to flaws and corruption that their Primarch was plunging them to was a tale of how insidious Chaos can be.
i just learned that Fulgrim gave a big ahh 👍to the use of pyskers in the Nikaea Council
despite his legion had 0 librarians back then
If the soul of Fulgrim is forfeit and the clone is a true clone.... does that mean a perfect clone of Angron could happen? No demonhood, no butchers nails?
Probably happened too long ago, but War Dog Primaris vs World Eater Astartes would also be crazy...
that is an interesting idea?
Because Angron-pre nails was apparently one of the most noble and kind primarchs, with his weird primarch power being something akin to being able to experience the pain of those around him instead of them.
so a clone would be interesting?
not like the butchers nails would just appear
@@TheBoneZone40k Probably still have the hardest hate boner for the emperor and the imperium for they had done to him, but he also hates khorn , so i imagine he would compromise with guilliman by giving him his own planet to free and be peaceful and 100 % independent of the imperium and in return make a new world eater legions who is also independent but would also help the imperium in their of need
Fabius isn't alive because of time passing slower in the warp but rather because of his functional immorality.
He spends a lot of time outside of the warp on his weird quests.
I saw this video in my feed this morning and though “my god didn’t he just put one up yesterday?” And to no detriment in quality. This stuff is great.
hehe
wait till you see that I have a third video already uploaded and queued up for publishing on Friday about Daemon princes
Talk about a breakneck pace of releasing videos. This is quickly becoming one of my favorite new 40k channels 👌
Fulgrim def fell “the hardest” of the monogod primarchs, or really any but maybe Horus. Mortarion, Kurze, Angron were basically on the edge already, Peter turbo was a sulky baby and Magnus just couldnt get over himself. Fulgrim might have been a pretty boy and a snob but he genuinely was trying to build a better place for mankind and to raise people up before he picked up the snake sword mcguffin
I love pre heresy-Fulgrim. And I think the book "Fulgrim" is one of the best in the horus heresy series. He was just a perfect walking inferiority complex, Everyone loved him and thought he was great but he had this insecurity stemming from having to fight with the Luna Wolves with his itty bitty Legion I guess. Oh and I hate Eidolon, and Lucius for what he did to Solomon Demeter. But I hate Eidolon most of all just because he is gross.
Thanks for the video. You can't really blame Fulgrim for wanting more, given how almost everything he was given from his homeworld to his legion was a pile of *redacted*, along with all the expectation that came with being the Emperor's Children. Him picking up the Laer was a result of him picking up trophies from his conquests to remind himself of his pride, or that he was just as good as his brothers depending.
The emperors children were so loved by the emperor that they were the only legion to be allowed to wear the aquilla symbol which was the personal symbol of the emperor. Even their name is has emperor in it.
I love the emperors children. Do world eaters
Lol fulgrim is sulking because when he and those thousand sons marines went to answer that beacon rylanor set off, those psyker thousand sons thought he was such a dick that they let rylanors nuke go off. They literally voluntarily died because fulgrim is so unbearable as a person that they would rather die in the process of letting rylanor get his punch in rather than spend one more second with this peacock. I genuinely hate fulgrim from the moment he picked that damn sword up. Rylanor and those thousand sons embarrassed him so bad he's been hiding out on a pleasure planet for thousands of years. He is literally the least useful primarch of them all, even lorgar
I respect this take so much.
you're just right.
Fulgrim pre-snake sword had his issues, but he was compelling because of it. Now he's just embarrassing to be around.
There is a reason I also didn't talk about Rylanor yes, that literal chad-bot is getting his own video.
he deserves it
@Mr. Bones 40k I figured if you told this story you would have a rylanor video! Rylanor gave fulgrim such a slap to the face that he has been crying for like 10 thousand years. Rylanor is an absolute beast to spend so much time just waiting to nuke fulgrim, and you know that he had to know it wouldn't kill him. He just wanted to piss in his cheerios for what fulgrim did.
Fulgrims whole shtick pisses me off to no end. I got my degree in fine arts and studio art and mainly an oil painter. I love fine artwork and the process of how it's made. The one single primarch they made who represents what I love has like a half of a single book talking about that stuff and then he becomes snake laer fulgrim and it all goes to shit. He makes all of us artistic people look like flaky and bored people with severe cases of ADHD. he also kind of doesn't have any special primarch ability other than he heals faster than the others minus maybe vulkan. His only purpose is to lie to people and whine a lot. He couldn't even be bothered to attend the siege of Terra because he was busy turning citizens elsewhere into coke. Useless. I kept wishing clonegrim would find a way to murder fulgrim and go back and be loyalist legionless fulgrim
@Whitlock The Revanchist fulgrims ability is dualing. He has the best winstreak and most primarch kills of any of his brothers. Hes also known for his charisma, similar to Horus and was able to take over hostile planets entirely through diplomacy. His healing isnt any better than any other primarch
Also, your insecurity about your talents is showing through. Perhaps you hate fulgy so much because you see a bit of yourself in him lmao. Ill never get the hate for him, his story is one of the best tragedies in 40k and hes memed on more than any other primarch with all of his losses exaggerated and his wins ignored. Hes a badass and nothing like the whiny bitch people pretend he is
@Fugl Featherbird did you really just say my insecurity about my talents is showing through? First, that's a real dick thing to say to anybody, second you said it just to be mean because you don't actually know anything about me and I didn't actually say anything about myself, personally. I don't know if that made you feel good about yourself to talk to someone like that but honestly it just made you look like the arrogant asshole you and fulgrim are. And 3rd, these are fictional stories and people that don't actually exist and to try to judge someone like that over their dislike of a completely fictional character says a lot more about you than it does my unmentioned talents. Clearly you like fulgrim enough to be a total asshole to a stranger, that's cool man. Maybe your love for the peacock says more about you than you realize.
And 4th, dueling isn't an ability, every single one of these guys was trained from the moment they were found to be a duelist. And fulgrim might have been a good swordsmen but no one thought he would be able to take ferris and the only reason he was able to match was because of the daemon shoved up his butt. So I'm not sure it's really even fulgrim that is a great duelist, maybe that daemon or later slaanesh when she turned him into that snake thing, but straight up fulgrim isn't even a top 4 or 5 duelist, so I don't think that counts as an ability.
Next time if you wanna have a conversation about 40k or your apparent primarch, that's great, and I genuinely love debates about this kind of stuff, but next time be an adult and don't attack the person right out of the gate. Especially when, like here, you didn't have any reason to even say it. It just makes you look like an asshole and no one wants to talk to an asshole. Kind of how no one wants to talk to fulgrim.
@Whitlock The Revanchist learn how to take a joke.
And fulgrim didnt need the blade to beat ferrus. He literally beat the shit out of ferrus with his bare hands while the blade was still on his flagship before the fight at istvaan
Nice background music, the caretaker has great depressive but soothing calm music
"Bitter Marines"😭
Am I wrong?
@@TheBoneZone40k hit the nail right on the head. Had to sub just for that.
If only the Emperor said "Say no to drugs and penis shaped swords" this could have been avoidable...
the champions are al still around, not just lucius: ahirman->tzeentch, typhos->nurgle, kharn->khorne
I remember reading somewhere that Humanity only developed actual language because our ancestors had just enough free time to figure out how to make these mouth sounds into something more coherent.
I need me loyalist emps children
If it helps/ hasn't been said before, I think the reason why Fulgrim fled to the pleasure planet to this day is because of his inability to corrupt Rylanore, but I could be wrong
My Emperor's Children Legionary kill team will crush down and inhale the heart of this "clonegrim". We await the Phoenician's true reveal in 40k.
Laughing god made a power move. He knew one of these Children were gonna be at his doorstep. Better be the one looking at the mirror more than the one who would forget about the conquest once completed.
They had nowhere to fall, they just accepted what they were.
Perfect
10:21 nope common believe is that the clones lack the warp spawn soul of the primarch and that to gather them big e stroke his bargains with the God's.
"some ancient xeno collector who has this massive museum" This is such an incredibly general and oversimplified description of Trazyn that it almost feels disrespectful lmao
Clonegrim didn't have or at least wasn't said to have fulgrims soul fragments. when fabius found him in a long forgotten vat from his experiments he thought clonegrim was pure and he had the potential to become an uncorrupted fulgrim, by the end of the novel fabius concludes that clonegrim has the same personality deficiencies as fulgrim and would do the same mistakes, it's that fact that makes him give him to trazyn because he is disgusted and disappointed.
But there's something to be said that he has seen what his children have become and hates it. He has seen what those choices he would have made have led to.
If they released a loyalist Fulgrim army I would finally have absolutely no excuse to not waste my money buying GW's plastic crack.
And they were straight-up based on hair metal musicians
The reason he hasn't been active is because he is recovering his ego after Rylanor stomped on that sh!t. Oh and I guess he did have a pretty big fight with Guilliman.
Thank you for saying Rustlung !
RIP DOM AND MARIA 🪦
Well, Papa Fabius Bile traded away Clonegrim because he started showing similar tendencies to Fulgrim, and he doesn't want another split.
2:16 Isn't the biggest chapter the Space Wolves since they have 12 great companies of over a 1000 Marines each?
I can't wait for you to get to the orks! And I hope we end up with a playlist of Mr Bones ork content.
Puuuuhleeeeese?
To say that the emperors children fell with a flop is an understatement. A better way to put it is to say that The Emperors Children fell so hard that even Ferrus Manus's head was like "damn"
Has anyone found the Human Blade? We know that the People's Elbow has already been discovered.
Interesting image for the introduction of the snake people. It’s not even that far off tbh.
Fulgrim was my first HH novel, having known next to nothing about the EC other than they had Noise Marines, worshiped Slaanesh and Fulgrim was arrogant incarnate and wounded Guiliman, putting him in the coma and that was it. I never felt drawn to them and ignored them throughout 4th and early 5th Edition but Fulgrim opened my eyes and I saw a Primarch with so much promise but had no chance against what was infecting him, unable to save his sons who were probably more corrupted in spirit than he was before his fall (except Sol Tarvitz and Ancient Rylonor, they were good boys). Baldermort really have him the coverage I felt he needed and highlighted just how tragic his fall was for the entire Imperium.
He is the Griffith of 40K.
Good work with this viedo. But how can you recount the story of the Emperor's Children and no mention the Maraviglia, it's as integral to their fall as the Laer temple?
Not really, the Laer temple is the focal point where the corruption is introduced in the legion, the maraviglia is the dramatic way the novel showcases the end point of the corruption, but in itself it's not particularly needed to explain or introduce the emperor's children
When Emperor’s Children come out in 40K, I’m gonna paint them their beautiful royal purple and gold colors and home brew a war band that’s seeking redemption and are searching for clonegrim so they can be their noble selves again like Saul Tarvitz and Rylanor.
I could hear your wallet screaming through your voice at 11:35 hahahaa
Ah, the Emperor's Children. My favourite space marine legion, and the most real depiction of where an astartes type super soldier program would end up irl.
Also Eidolon is still alive in 40k (at least pre 13th Black Crusade) from what the second or third Fabius Bile book goes by.
5:07 "His TINY Legion" Ya know, I'm not saying that the Black Library authors were heavily implying by Fulgrim's insecurity that he had a small member compared to the other primarchs because of the size of their various legions, but given it's the Emperor's Children... well if the shoe fits...
i think it'd be really interesting to see how clonegrim would react to seeing what his legion had become
But he did see and know what they've becomes, Clonegrim even killed one, he wants to elevate them again return them to the light, every Noise marine there knelt at Clonegrim
To be honest.... as far as chaos goes.... i do love them.
In the upcoming Iron Warriors episode will you include the “Siege/Fortify” meme from TTS?
GW seems to de-emphasize slaaneshi stuff (probably because they're afraid of the sex parts), so honestly I wouldn't be surprised if they skip straight to Perterabo
thats what i was thinking brother There is a reason the Noise marines upgrades is the same as from 3rd edition
I highly doubt Clonegrim will be coming back because;
1: Fabius only avoided getting trapped in Trayzn the Infinite's collection by trading Clonegrim and the Emperor's Children warband Fabius was forced to help in exchange for a huge stock of EC geneseed, anybody trying to get in to rescue Clonegrim stands even less of a chance,
2: Even if he were able to escape, he would immediately be purged as a heretic due to the Imperial Creed only mentioning the nine loyal Primarchs and any reference to the nine traitors was entirely deleted from Imperial records, so a tenth loyal primarch would be an enormous red flag for the High Lords of Terra to demand immediate removal of such a threat to their control over the Imperium,
3: Fabius knew that Clonegrim would make the exact same mistakes as the real Fulgrim that led to their Legion collapsing into the numerous sado-masochist warbands it is now, so there's no guarantee that Clonegrim would actually be a loyalist since the original was so easily swayed by Horus into turning against The Emperor in the first place,
4: Not every Black Library story gets to be made fully canon to the game, which is why "War of the Spider" and the following Chaos Space Marine codexes have never mentioned that there are at least twelve active Fabius clones currently conscious at a time in the galaxy, which would easily speed along Abaddon's desire for Chaos Primaris that he's tasked the original Fabius with by them all working together, but even the recent CSM update hasn't added them to the roster, so we'll probably never actually see Chaos Primaris units in the physical game.
But hey, the potential is still there, so I wouldn't 100% rule it out.
7:42
I read "I can provide a femboy voice changer" instead of "I can't", which is honestly funnier when tsking the image into account.
Pre-Heresy Fulgrim was a total chad imo and was up there with Vulkan and Sanguinius. He was all about lifting up humanity, no matter if they were regular humans or not, to be the best they possibly could be. People like Tarvitz show what his legion and philosophy could have been
you forgot that Eidolon is also fucking around with Lucius
Clone Fulgrim should come back and lead the Iron Hands.
Im not gonna argue the emperors children where ever without their flaws, but they are my favourite for a very clear reason, their potential.
I feel like they fell harder than other legions in part because they where willing to try any depraved activity, but that openess to change also makes them have the most potential for improvement.
In one of the heresy books you can see the diferences between Dorn and Alpharius, and you can see how stubborn they both are, Dorn will never use covert tactics like Alpharius, even if it would save lives, essentially because he finds it dishonorable, and Alpharius will never use a conventional frontal assault because he has an obsession with challenging himself with absurdly complicated rules. No matter how much time you give these two, and most primarchs for that matter, they will never step out of their comfort zones.
Fulgrim however, doesnt have that, his legion has no special genetic power nor a specific inclination when it comes to combat, they are a bit more well known for dueling, but the most important part is that they aspire to be the best in every regard, they will never look down upon a different set of strategies, they will always try to learn and grow, and i feel like given enough time they would become by far the best by combining everything they can learn. Personally i think pound for pound, marine for marine, pre heresy they had the best troops, they worked with other legions as elite troops, special forces. Its a shame for me how they are seen as vanity fueled narcissists, while so much potential goes unseen.
im just getting into 40k lore. gonna have to pick up some books soon. theres many legions and chapters. what are some cool obscure ones to look into. im tired of hearingnof dpace wolves, my god.
Fulgrim was almost murdered as a baby because that's how they handled orphans on chemos and he was spared only because his adoptive father decided that he had potential. So of course, Fulgrum was incredibly insecure about his small lesion and the fact that he was falling behind his brother s. Because fulgrim had lived his entire life having to justify his own existence. This was just the first time it had been even remotely difficult for him. He's a Primark after all. But now he's competing against other primarks with much less resources than his brothers have . As pompous and hoity toity as he is that could all have been a mask that he hid behind as it became harder and harder for him to Cope with not being the best because being the best was how he justified him living when others in his situation were murdered
Emperors Children V Noise Marines
😇 Fulgrim V 😈 Fulgrim
The Children were the best of the pre-Heresy Space Marines.
They needed to be, because only from the greatest height can you have the greatest fall.
when they get their own Codex i might start my 7th 40k army :D
I’m not even religious but the Emperor’s Children remind me the most of this verse in the Bible, Isaiah 14: “How you have fallen from heaven, O morning star, son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations!”
Okay hear me out; Perfect clone-Angron with brain intact
I think about that.
I think about that concept a lot
Don't forget DOOM RIDER!
Lucius the eternal is kinda the main person that made me want to learn more
“I AM A SURGEON” - Fabius Bile
I did *not* expect to see alice in a 40k video of all places.
I have one thing to say; they still have a shred of honor and know that a duel is sacrosanct. (Fabius Bile Clone lord, chapter 3 I *Think*? I'm not sure about the chapter, but it was Clone Lord this shred of lore comes from. )
Bit simplistic explanation of the 3rd legion but good job overall! Subbed.
Haha yeah a loyalists chapter of Emperor's Children would be crazy haha.
... no, sir, Inquisitor, sir I wasn't thinking about the Sons of the Phoenix. No, sir. Yes, sir, noble sons of Dorn, of course, sir.
I tend to think the lamenters are actually made from emperors children geneseed and not the blood angels and that is why they dont suffer from the black rage or blood thirst. this is also why they suffer from HORRIFIC luck... because emperors children always suffered from horrible luck
I've come around to the idea that their geneseed could be a spliced variant of the Blood Angels and the seed of one of the Missing primarchs. This would explain why even an *inquisitor* was stonewalled from studying their origins during the Badaab war.
It’s just sad tome that these guys were supposed to be like a shining beacon of culture but they became sick twisted monsters and the worst part is they’ve become an ever dwindling circle of degenerates fated to be forgotten.
Loving these mate 👍 learning a lot 👊
Fulgrim would be still Fulgrim if he didn't touch the No-No sword.
The Emperors Children are one of the more tragic falls in my opinion. Like all the other chaos legions had some sorta tell, like you know the world eaters aren’t lasting very long as a loyalist legion cause of how angry they all are, you know perturabo isn’t falling that far from the tree. But like, fulgrim was nice, the emperors children were a kind well raised well brought up legion, they were friendly with humans and humbled by their primarchs home planet conditions. It sucks cause you see how far they fall, they could’ve easily been one of the nicest one of the best loyalists if not for that one encounter with the sneks. Now they’re just this depraved legion of slaaneshi puppets going around doing increasingly more excessive actions
12:27 ain't that a feeling.
All you loyalist fans wishing you could have him back, I like my emperors children pure and nasty thanks
Man, I hope Clonegrim starts a Loyalist EC. That'd be dope.
Ok, you are calling the EC a Chapter. Chapter structure did not come about until after the heresy. Pre-heresy they were called Legions. Also, the Legions consisted of Imperial Guard, Imperial Navies, Titans, etc., giving each Legion a vast amount of power. When the Chapters were formed all of those auxiliary forces were separated so that something to the magnitude of what happened at the start of the Heresy could not happen again.
6:30 ah yess the men of culture XD
i feel so sorry for the emperor's children 🥺🥺🥺
same id show them all how sorry i feel for each one of them