I'm not seeking God. I'm seeking the truth. If God is real, then I want to know that, but _only_ if he's real. _"Many, many people do find God."_ Sure. Typically, they find the god they were taught to believe as a child. Usually, they find the god of their tribe, of their childhood culture. Of course, that's indistinguishable from wishful-thinking. And if there really _was_ a god who wanted people to know him, that makes no sense. Religiously, the world looks exactly as we'd expect if all gods are just imaginary. And how can that make sense to you? I really don't get it. _"All of us are blind to all of our unconscious motivations"_ Well, at least you're including yourself in that, apparently. And I agree. That's why I ask for evidence that your god - or _anyone's_ god - is real, rather than just imaginary. Evidence is how we distinguish reality from delusion and wishful-thinking. And sure, you _want_ a particular god to be real. Typically, you want the god of your tribe to be real, the god of your family, the god of your cultural background. As you say, we tend to be blind to our unconscious motivations. And that definitely includes Christians, not just Muslims, Hindus, atheists, etc. _"What are the things we need to do in order to seek a relationship with God?"_ Again, I am *not* seeking a relationship with God. I am seeking to know the truth. If "God" is real, then I want to know that, yes. But I have no interest in having a 'relationship' with an imaginary friend. _"We're dealing with an omniscient, omnipotent being who has a plan not just for our lives, but for the whole universe."_ *Evidence?* After all, that's easy to _claim._ But that's just because claims _are_ easy. That's why _every_ religion makes claims, not just yours. So why should I believe your claims. Why should I believe _your_ claims, but not the claims of any other religion? After all, this sounds very much like an excuse - an excuse for why "God" seems to be imaginary. And you know, there's a much more likely explanation for why "God" seems imaginary. _"the testimony of Jesus"_ There _is_ no testimony of Jesus. Jesus left behind nothing in writing, himself, and neither did anyone who'd ever _met_ Jesus, as far as we can tell. You're just talking about the stories. But stories aren't always true. _"God did make himself known"_ *Evidence?* _"When some atheists are asked about this"_ Yeah, I don't believe you. Theists make claims about atheists all the time. And you know, it doesn't even _matter_ to me what some other atheist thinks. Why would it? We atheists have very little in common. We have no pope, no prophet, no priests, pastors, or mullahs, no dogma, no magic book, and _no required beliefs, whatsoever._ You can believe anything - literally _anything_ - and still be an atheist as long as you don't believe in a god or gods. It's a very narrow label. _"It is much more likely that there is a mind behind all of this"_ Is it? According to whom? Scientists don't think so. Scientists are far _less_ likely to believe in a god or gods than people who know little or nothing about science. Philosophers don't think so. Philosophers are also far _less_ likely to believe in a god or gods than people who know little or nothing about philosophy. As for myself, I have yet to see even *one* piece of good evidence, specific enough and in enough detail that I can judge it for myself, that a god is real, rather than just imaginary - _any_ god. I _am_ using my mind here. And I have yet to hear anything but vague claims. Sorry, but I need more than that.
I'm not seeking God. I'm seeking the truth. If God is real, then I want to know that, but _only_ if he's real.
_"Many, many people do find God."_
Sure. Typically, they find the god they were taught to believe as a child. Usually, they find the god of their tribe, of their childhood culture. Of course, that's indistinguishable from wishful-thinking. And if there really _was_ a god who wanted people to know him, that makes no sense. Religiously, the world looks exactly as we'd expect if all gods are just imaginary.
And how can that make sense to you? I really don't get it.
_"All of us are blind to all of our unconscious motivations"_
Well, at least you're including yourself in that, apparently. And I agree. That's why I ask for evidence that your god - or _anyone's_ god - is real, rather than just imaginary. Evidence is how we distinguish reality from delusion and wishful-thinking.
And sure, you _want_ a particular god to be real. Typically, you want the god of your tribe to be real, the god of your family, the god of your cultural background. As you say, we tend to be blind to our unconscious motivations. And that definitely includes Christians, not just Muslims, Hindus, atheists, etc.
_"What are the things we need to do in order to seek a relationship with God?"_
Again, I am *not* seeking a relationship with God. I am seeking to know the truth. If "God" is real, then I want to know that, yes. But I have no interest in having a 'relationship' with an imaginary friend.
_"We're dealing with an omniscient, omnipotent being who has a plan not just for our lives, but for the whole universe."_
*Evidence?* After all, that's easy to _claim._ But that's just because claims _are_ easy. That's why _every_ religion makes claims, not just yours. So why should I believe your claims. Why should I believe _your_ claims, but not the claims of any other religion?
After all, this sounds very much like an excuse - an excuse for why "God" seems to be imaginary. And you know, there's a much more likely explanation for why "God" seems imaginary.
_"the testimony of Jesus"_
There _is_ no testimony of Jesus. Jesus left behind nothing in writing, himself, and neither did anyone who'd ever _met_ Jesus, as far as we can tell. You're just talking about the stories. But stories aren't always true.
_"God did make himself known"_
*Evidence?*
_"When some atheists are asked about this"_
Yeah, I don't believe you. Theists make claims about atheists all the time.
And you know, it doesn't even _matter_ to me what some other atheist thinks. Why would it? We atheists have very little in common. We have no pope, no prophet, no priests, pastors, or mullahs, no dogma, no magic book, and _no required beliefs, whatsoever._ You can believe anything - literally _anything_ - and still be an atheist as long as you don't believe in a god or gods. It's a very narrow label.
_"It is much more likely that there is a mind behind all of this"_
Is it? According to whom? Scientists don't think so. Scientists are far _less_ likely to believe in a god or gods than people who know little or nothing about science. Philosophers don't think so. Philosophers are also far _less_ likely to believe in a god or gods than people who know little or nothing about philosophy.
As for myself, I have yet to see even *one* piece of good evidence, specific enough and in enough detail that I can judge it for myself, that a god is real, rather than just imaginary - _any_ god.
I _am_ using my mind here. And I have yet to hear anything but vague claims. Sorry, but I need more than that.