I loved playing this game, even more fun when they let us play eastern side of things of course was a fox forgot their names now but it was nothing but fun times lol Honestly just friends playing silliest things but I think this game has great promise in my adult life now
As someone who grew up playing this pretty young and then having a long span of time before diving in again, I highly recommend it. We got up to absolute nonsense that is so different than my current games, but I love the range of experiences I've had in the World of Darkness.
I think the big problem with V5 vs older versions is V5 ignored old lore and gutted every tribe except for glasswalkers. Based on what ive seen, im not certain V5 will ever take off. basically all the V5's have made the game a little less complicated but also detonated the lore due to real world politics
Every new edition of their games changed aspects and lore from the editions before it. This edition less so than some others. This is a common practice in nearly all ttrpg companies. Real world politics are also heavily featured in every World of Darkness game so I'm not sure why it is now an issue. The correlations aren't correct. It's okay to not like 5th edition because of personal preferences without the dramatics.
We just made up characters (3 person Pack) last night. I've played most of the previous iterations so this looks familiar. Game is based in/around Detroit. Character is a Silver Fang, a Guerilla Gardener who set up in a 'lost' secret bunker in a county park. Ahroun and Moon-Riled. Person of Interest (Gardener), Secure and secret base. We all know each other from before we graduated from High School. It's several years later. Also a Child of Gaia Theurge, and a Silver Fang Wolf-Born Philodox. Fun stuff.
Hello my friend. I am from Brazil I have been noticing that Werewolf is not that popular as Vampire here on TH-cam too eh. I mean… I don’t see people commenting about the W5 or streaming they playing the game with their friends as I see with Vampire. What do you think about that? I feel W5 so much more rich!
Werewolf is much less popular than Vampire of the World of Darkness games. Lore changes upset some very fragile and loud fans of old editions. Pretty big blunders involving the production process created controversy that probably made potential new players avoid it too. I agree that there is some rich material that lots of players would love. I think the game ended up pretty solid, but it will take time for it to find its audience. Also it does not have the large production flagship show like L.A. By Night was for V5. I hope WoD gives that treatment to their other games, but we'll see.
Honestly, I never liked Werewolf much because it always struck me as Conan the Barbarian more then a WoD game. That's why I never got into it, I don't really know, or care much about any so called controversies that the internet can think up. That shit is a dime a dozen anyway. The way I understand Werewolf after 20 years of playing WoD games is: They are a bunch of rage monsters fighting some cosmic struggle between a triad of weird eldritch gods where the entropy god has gone of the deep end. They are desperately trying to glue a vase back together that has been broken. The only real relationship I've seen with humanity is as breeding stock for potential new cannon fodder to perpetuate their religious war. A war they fight in the name of yet an other eldritch god they call Gaia. All presented through some Robert E Howard type art with fur covered Barbarians. That's as far as I understand Werewolf and why I never cared to play it.
English is not my first language, so, I may be mistaken. You mention the change always happens after "the age of maturity", that sounds strange to me. Because: first, "age of maturity" if I understand well the expression is a juridic expression. It has to do with human law, and will change in time, also from one country to another. Are you referring to 18 years old, or 21? The age of consent for sex in Brasil is 14, does that count? Up to some point in my live people would only became adults here, as far as the civil decisions are concerned (marriage, sell and buy real state) when they reached 21, but criminal law used 18 as relevant reference. Eventually the 21 limit was abolished, so, when that happened the first change of Garrou in Brasil started taking place sooner? Or was always 18? Or 14? Second, because as far as my memory goes the first change would usually happen during puberty. More often than not. Not always, it could happen sooner, or much later, but usually was during puberty. I believe that was third edition. It always felt reasonable to me. Had the advantage of being the same rule for all 3 races. Don't get me wrong, I have no intention to "attack" the channel, or disrespect the person speaking in the video. And if that's application of Golden Rule, I will NOT, under any circumstance, suggest that is not your right to place that rule in your game! Obviously it is your right as narrator. And I am able to imagine one reason why that rule could be a good idea in an adventure happening in open, public, spaces. Like internet. Nowadays. That said, I really have to ask. Is this rule intended to be an element of the setting, part of the actual worldbuilding, or is a mere matter of real life diplomacy of self-preservation?
Great question and I don't take this as an attack at all. I believe "age of maturity" is purposefully vague so Storytellers and their players can interpret it however best suits their game. This is less of a mechanical rule and more a choice not to have shifting Garou children in the setting by the writers. What exactly that means is up to the people playing the game. I definitely don't think it is intended to be tied to any government system or age of majority laws though.
About 10:17, I am surprised to not see the "no males allowed" detail in regard to the Furies. I would ratter say "hate men" than "oppose injustice", but that's of course open for debate, I admit. But I do remember they used to not allow men, pushing their baby boys to some other tribe. Children of Gaia mostly, I think. That seems to me something important to mention in the general description, so we don't have to say to a player he cannot make a character in this tribe (or has to make his character a female) after he made his choice. Like that restaurant that keeps a lot of options in the menu that are there just for the waiter to say "we don't have the ingredients for that one today". Do your Black Furies accept both sexes? Has the canon tribe always done that, and my memory is playing tricks on me?
You are correct that the Black Furies only accepted woman in past editions. That is not the case with 5th edition. Since tribes are essentially chosen by a Garou making a pact with the appropriate Patron Spirit, or a Patron Spirit connecting to a Garou, there aren't really restrictions to who can join what tribe anymore. I understand that some are nostalgic for a well-defined list of traits one must have to be part of certain tribes and they're still allowed to follow that lore. I've always preferred a character-first approach to character creation. That means a player creating a unique character then figuring out where they fit rather than pick a tribe and be stuck with a template of required characteristics. I really like the change this edition made in that regard. Since the Garou Nation is defunct, pack politics will be more in play than tribe ones too. I think it is much more interesting to have tension between packs of Black Furies that strictly forbid men and those who take a more open-minded approach. This would also have fascinating implications between a firmly matriarch pack and their Patron Spirit who allowed a man in the tribe.
Thanks for your kind answer,@@SummonedStories . I stopped in third edition, gave a few looks in fourth. The fifth I only saw the cover. I believe I would stay with the old way, if I was going to narrate an adventure now. I always considered that was the Tribe Spirit that imposed the restrictions, like is Lolth herself who don't accept male clerics. On the other hand, you make a strong argument when you mention the interesting conflicts that may emerge between traditionalist, full feminine and matriarchal, packs and those more "open-minded". Those are supposed to be extreme circumstances, the "End of Days" some even say. Pragmatically, one could easily argue that cut of half the potential warriors the tribe could have is not viable anymore. It is a luxury too expensive to be afforded. Conflicts like that, huge, epic, and irreconciliable, are the where Werewolf the Apocalipse shines the most. I still see the hard core of Black Furies Tribe choosing to die true to their ways, rater than survive 'like that', tainted by the inclusion of males. There is only 1 Garou tribe that makes survival the core of their self-identity, and that 1 is not the Furies. Still, I can see the logic in your ways. And there is some beauty in it.
Everything they say and do is to fight injustice, even if they used to have that hang up arout non metis males. Writers doing matriarchal societies almost always seem to fall into that parody without understanding the nuance so I don't blame you too much for just seeing Black Furies as man hating, even if I am sure the original writers went very 'woman wronged, so they're hateful' with their concept. Their patron is gorgon after all.
"Everything they say and do is to fight injustice" exact same thing can be said about German Nazis during Hitler administration, @@sparkleghost. And, as a matter of fact was said about them. At the time. By Nazis. Change Hitler for Staling, same thing. Change Staling for Netanyahu, all those children being murdered in Gaza right now is all "to fight injustice". All the people starving to death, the unarmed men being hit by missiles targeted at them on purpose, by someone who could see they were unarmed, "to fight injustice"', every bit of that. Goes without saying, if you walk only a few kilometres and ask the other side the Operation Al Aqsa was to do nothing else, but "to fight injustice". That's the beautiful and tricky thing about Justice, and by extension injustice, @sparkleghost. I cannot think about a better environment to explore it than tabletop RPG. Since the very nature of that linguistic game implies the exercise of look at the world from the point of view of different people. The same player can experience the point of view of a typical Red Talon, and ask himself "what I would do in this circumstances if I was my character, someone who honestly believes that all human (males and females alike) are a corrupt desease that should be cured" today. And look at the same world as a typical Glass Walker in the next story. Make the same exercise, but looking at this world from a very different window. The suffering someone experiences does not excuse the suffering this person causes. Up to some extent, it can explain it. Many victims of torture grow up to be torturers themselves. Many, but not all of them. The way to know someone moral high is not to look at this person past. It is not to hear this person's justifications or intentions. Is to have this person in a position of power, free from accountability, and just look. We are seem the moral High of Zionists in Gaza, and we have been seem the moral high of third wave feminists in US and US satellite nations since this century started. Each one of us is free to reach whatever conclusions we judge to be according to our sense of Justice. My conclusion leads me to define myself as antifeminist. And right now as an antifeminist not very sympathetic towards Zionism.
![ผัวเถื่อน - ยูริ โตเกียวมิวสิค [ OFFICIAL MUSIC VIDEO ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/P08ORRVDGl8/mqdefault.jpg)
brave of you to call out the Lone Wolf and Murder Hobo tropes right at the beginning but completely agreed! Great video
I am nothing if I am not brave (and cool and smart and beautiful and tough and kind)
I think they lone wolf can be fine if your character growth is becoming part of a family (the players party/Pack).
Oh, as a newbie to the 3 5e ttrpgs. This is so useful.
Glad to hear it. The goal is to make it as easy as possible for players to jump into the World of Darkness and get stuck here with the rest of us.
I loved playing this game, even more fun when they let us play eastern side of things of course was a fox forgot their names now but it was nothing but fun times lol Honestly just friends playing silliest things but I think this game has great promise in my adult life now
As someone who grew up playing this pretty young and then having a long span of time before diving in again, I highly recommend it. We got up to absolute nonsense that is so different than my current games, but I love the range of experiences I've had in the World of Darkness.
I think the big problem with V5 vs older versions is V5 ignored old lore and gutted every tribe except for glasswalkers. Based on what ive seen, im not certain V5 will ever take off. basically all the V5's have made the game a little less complicated but also detonated the lore due to real world politics
Every new edition of their games changed aspects and lore from the editions before it. This edition less so than some others. This is a common practice in nearly all ttrpg companies. Real world politics are also heavily featured in every World of Darkness game so I'm not sure why it is now an issue. The correlations aren't correct. It's okay to not like 5th edition because of personal preferences without the dramatics.
Nice shirt.
Nice explanation.
Nice video.
We just made up characters (3 person Pack) last night. I've played most of the previous iterations so this looks familiar. Game is based in/around Detroit. Character is a Silver Fang, a Guerilla Gardener who set up in a 'lost' secret bunker in a county park. Ahroun and Moon-Riled. Person of Interest (Gardener), Secure and secret base. We all know each other from before we graduated from High School. It's several years later. Also a Child of Gaia Theurge, and a Silver Fang Wolf-Born Philodox. Fun stuff.
Hello my friend. I am from Brazil I have been noticing that Werewolf is not that popular as Vampire here on TH-cam too eh. I mean… I don’t see people commenting about the W5 or streaming they playing the game with their friends as I see with Vampire. What do you think about that? I feel W5 so much more rich!
Werewolf is much less popular than Vampire of the World of Darkness games. Lore changes upset some very fragile and loud fans of old editions. Pretty big blunders involving the production process created controversy that probably made potential new players avoid it too. I agree that there is some rich material that lots of players would love. I think the game ended up pretty solid, but it will take time for it to find its audience. Also it does not have the large production flagship show like L.A. By Night was for V5. I hope WoD gives that treatment to their other games, but we'll see.
Honestly, I never liked Werewolf much because it always struck me as Conan the Barbarian more then a WoD game. That's why I never got into it, I don't really know, or care much about any so called controversies that the internet can think up. That shit is a dime a dozen anyway.
The way I understand Werewolf after 20 years of playing WoD games is: They are a bunch of rage monsters fighting some cosmic struggle between a triad of weird eldritch gods where the entropy god has gone of the deep end. They are desperately trying to glue a vase back together that has been broken. The only real relationship I've seen with humanity is as breeding stock for potential new cannon fodder to perpetuate their religious war. A war they fight in the name of yet an other eldritch god they call Gaia. All presented through some Robert E Howard type art with fur covered Barbarians.
That's as far as I understand Werewolf and why I never cared to play it.
@@patrickmulder2450 Oh man Werewolf can be so so much more than that, and Gaia is more Mother Earth than an eldritch god.
Your awesome dude and awesome video be safe out there
English is not my first language, so, I may be mistaken. You mention the change always happens after "the age of maturity", that sounds strange to me. Because: first, "age of maturity" if I understand well the expression is a juridic expression. It has to do with human law, and will change in time, also from one country to another. Are you referring to 18 years old, or 21? The age of consent for sex in Brasil is 14, does that count? Up to some point in my live people would only became adults here, as far as the civil decisions are concerned (marriage, sell and buy real state) when they reached 21, but criminal law used 18 as relevant reference. Eventually the 21 limit was abolished, so, when that happened the first change of Garrou in Brasil started taking place sooner? Or was always 18? Or 14?
Second, because as far as my memory goes the first change would usually happen during puberty. More often than not. Not always, it could happen sooner, or much later, but usually was during puberty. I believe that was third edition. It always felt reasonable to me.
Had the advantage of being the same rule for all 3 races.
Don't get me wrong, I have no intention to "attack" the channel, or disrespect the person speaking in the video. And if that's application of Golden Rule, I will NOT, under any circumstance, suggest that is not your right to place that rule in your game! Obviously it is your right as narrator. And I am able to imagine one reason why that rule could be a good idea in an adventure happening in open, public, spaces. Like internet. Nowadays.
That said, I really have to ask. Is this rule intended to be an element of the setting, part of the actual worldbuilding, or is a mere matter of real life diplomacy of self-preservation?
Great question and I don't take this as an attack at all. I believe "age of maturity" is purposefully vague so Storytellers and their players can interpret it however best suits their game. This is less of a mechanical rule and more a choice not to have shifting Garou children in the setting by the writers. What exactly that means is up to the people playing the game. I definitely don't think it is intended to be tied to any government system or age of majority laws though.
About 10:17, I am surprised to not see the "no males allowed" detail in regard to the Furies. I would ratter say "hate men" than "oppose injustice", but that's of course open for debate, I admit. But I do remember they used to not allow men, pushing their baby boys to some other tribe. Children of Gaia mostly, I think. That seems to me something important to mention in the general description, so we don't have to say to a player he cannot make a character in this tribe (or has to make his character a female) after he made his choice. Like that restaurant that keeps a lot of options in the menu that are there just for the waiter to say "we don't have the ingredients for that one today".
Do your Black Furies accept both sexes? Has the canon tribe always done that, and my memory is playing tricks on me?
You are correct that the Black Furies only accepted woman in past editions. That is not the case with 5th edition. Since tribes are essentially chosen by a Garou making a pact with the appropriate Patron Spirit, or a Patron Spirit connecting to a Garou, there aren't really restrictions to who can join what tribe anymore. I understand that some are nostalgic for a well-defined list of traits one must have to be part of certain tribes and they're still allowed to follow that lore. I've always preferred a character-first approach to character creation. That means a player creating a unique character then figuring out where they fit rather than pick a tribe and be stuck with a template of required characteristics. I really like the change this edition made in that regard. Since the Garou Nation is defunct, pack politics will be more in play than tribe ones too. I think it is much more interesting to have tension between packs of Black Furies that strictly forbid men and those who take a more open-minded approach. This would also have fascinating implications between a firmly matriarch pack and their Patron Spirit who allowed a man in the tribe.
Thanks for your kind answer,@@SummonedStories . I stopped in third edition, gave a few looks in fourth. The fifth I only saw the cover. I believe I would stay with the old way, if I was going to narrate an adventure now. I always considered that was the Tribe Spirit that imposed the restrictions, like is Lolth herself who don't accept male clerics. On the other hand, you make a strong argument when you mention the interesting conflicts that may emerge between traditionalist, full feminine and matriarchal, packs and those more "open-minded".
Those are supposed to be extreme circumstances, the "End of Days" some even say. Pragmatically, one could easily argue that cut of half the potential warriors the tribe could have is not viable anymore. It is a luxury too expensive to be afforded.
Conflicts like that, huge, epic, and irreconciliable, are the where Werewolf the Apocalipse shines the most.
I still see the hard core of Black Furies Tribe choosing to die true to their ways, rater than survive 'like that', tainted by the inclusion of males. There is only 1 Garou tribe that makes survival the core of their self-identity, and that 1 is not the Furies.
Still, I can see the logic in your ways. And there is some beauty in it.
@@SummonedStories
Sorry to interfere with this conversation, but Metis are the only males permitted in the Furies from what I've read.
Everything they say and do is to fight injustice, even if they used to have that hang up arout non metis males. Writers doing matriarchal societies almost always seem to fall into that parody without understanding the nuance so I don't blame you too much for just seeing Black Furies as man hating, even if I am sure the original writers went very 'woman wronged, so they're hateful' with their concept. Their patron is gorgon after all.
"Everything they say and do is to fight injustice" exact same thing can be said about German Nazis during Hitler administration, @@sparkleghost. And, as a matter of fact was said about them. At the time. By Nazis. Change Hitler for Staling, same thing. Change Staling for Netanyahu, all those children being murdered in Gaza right now is all "to fight injustice". All the people starving to death, the unarmed men being hit by missiles targeted at them on purpose, by someone who could see they were unarmed, "to fight injustice"', every bit of that. Goes without saying, if you walk only a few kilometres and ask the other side the Operation Al Aqsa was to do nothing else, but "to fight injustice".
That's the beautiful and tricky thing about Justice, and by extension injustice, @sparkleghost.
I cannot think about a better environment to explore it than tabletop RPG. Since the very nature of that linguistic game implies the exercise of look at the world from the point of view of different people.
The same player can experience the point of view of a typical Red Talon, and ask himself "what I would do in this circumstances if I was my character, someone who honestly believes that all human (males and females alike) are a corrupt desease that should be cured" today. And look at the same world as a typical Glass Walker in the next story. Make the same exercise, but looking at this world from a very different window.
The suffering someone experiences does not excuse the suffering this person causes. Up to some extent, it can explain it. Many victims of torture grow up to be torturers themselves. Many, but not all of them.
The way to know someone moral high is not to look at this person past. It is not to hear this person's justifications or intentions. Is to have this person in a position of power, free from accountability, and just look. We are seem the moral High of Zionists in Gaza, and we have been seem the moral high of third wave feminists in US and US satellite nations since this century started.
Each one of us is free to reach whatever conclusions we judge to be according to our sense of Justice.
My conclusion leads me to define myself as antifeminist. And right now as an antifeminist not very sympathetic towards Zionism.