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In his book 'A Wing And A Prayer' Harry H Crosby stresses how incompetent he felt leading the group to Tronheim. All the congradulations he received after the mission left him dismayed. Being switched from Brady's crew to Blakely's was the best thing that could happen to him. Blakely was all about practice. Every day they would fly practice missions to and from Scotland. Sometimes just an individual aeroplane and sometimes in formation with other Forts. Soon Crosby worked out the kinks and built up his confidence. Not only him, but the whole outfit. By the end of the War he was regarded as the best navigator in the whole eighth army air corps.
1) After a crash, they call their base 2) The base sends vehicle(s) to pick up the crew 3) a 'salvage crew' is sent to get the remains of the aircraft. 4) Admin/reperations officer goes and gives the (in this case) farmer & family some money to cover the damages.
Also, they landed in the garden of a RAF training airfield's commander. First the locals were pretty hostile since they've never seen an American bomber or crew, but they got along pretty soon after. :D
@@gergelykallai1351 After they got to know them, the Brits took a very strong liking to the Yanks. Common language, common roots, you know the story. But it was not unusual for the townsfolk to feed the boys in their homes and give them treats and the such. Never mind all the ones that had daughters that fell for those dashing Yanks in their leather jackets.
I'm living i Trondheim now . The submarine pen called "Dora" they bombed áre still here. It's used as a part of the National archives and a bowling alley.
My grandmother lost her brother and his family from a British bombing run over Belgium that missed their German target, bombing the entire street for some miraculous reason missing my grandma's house, who at that point no longer bothered to seek shelter when the alarms went off. And answering your question about bombers being shot down above enemy territory, my grandma again was part of the resistance in Belgium who hid downed aircrew and smuggled them through France to Spain, where they could rejoin the Allied forces. The ones that were captured were sent off to pow work camps.
In regards to "Actual Footage". On and from the British isle had extremely regulated media recording, the Entire British Ilse was under media and information blackout... "Loose Lips sink ships". You could not even have lights on. All information coming out of Britain was to be totally controlled, the only information the enemy were to know was what Britain and the Allies wanted the enemy to know. There is footage, but not much. Interviews are short in number also.
You might want to check out “Memphis Belle” with Matthew Modine, Sean Austin, Eric Stoltz, among others, about a WWII B17 crew, based on true events. Amazing film, incredibly underrated
A much better film is "Target For Today", filmed in 1943. 300+ Heavy and Medium Bombers on a 'Maximum Effort' Strike against multiple Targets in East Prussia. You get the entire Mission, from Planning to Executing the Strike. Plus, it's THE REAL THING.
I actually got to go on the Belle when she was still touring. First time setting foot inside a B-17 and it was sobering as a kid realizing it’s just sheet metal on the sides, pretty much the same as nothing at all, plus the little tunnel to the tail gun was crazy too.
As a resident of Trondheim, I can inform you that I instantly recognized every part of the town from the footage in this episode, and I could tell that every one of the bombs dropped missed their target. As a matter of fact, the German U-boat facilities, called Dora, are still in Trondheim today. They were so solidly built that it was considered way too expensive to tear them down, and today they house the Norwegian state archives. And a bowling alley.
Just a little story about bomb dumping, there were designated zones on maps over the Channel. The famous musician Glen Miller disappeared over the Channel while flying from Britain to France. It was later determined that a bomber crew saw an aircraft of the type Glen was a passenger being struck by dumped bombs and crashing into the sea. On Norway submarine pens, it's on the coast. So the return trip is over the sea, no flack. But when they go into Germany navigating the return route is very critical. They must go around other major industrial areas or ports as there will be lots of flack. So avoiding known hot spots complicates the route plans.
Harry Crosby actually goes into detail about his air sickness in his book. He actually said it was worse below 10'000 feet and normally when he had his mask on etc it was fine.
Note this is. broadly, correct. However, life expectancy and survival rate do not indicate that 75% of aircrew died. It indicates that in 1943-44 75% of aircraft were shot down or crippled (made it to the UK or a neutral country severely damaged) before they finished a full 25-flight tour, with a significant portion of aircrew KIA/MIA, but also many injured (like the frostbite casualties you see) or captured and POW. One way or the other the chances of an aircrew surviving a 25-mission tour during 1943-44 were very low, which is why in the (fictional/based on events) movie Memphis Belle the 25th flight of that aircrew was a huge propaganda push.
@@cleekmaker00 True. Add to that we've seen the risk of simple accidents, mechanical failures, the risk of landing in bad weather, and the danger of collision in clouds or fog. The show Time Team has an episode that explores the tragedy of an in-air bomber collision.
@tileux Yes mate, So, a Bombardment Group (like the 100th) in 1943 had an establishment strength of nearly 300 officers and 1,500 other ranks who flew and a total strength of over 4,000 with ground crew. So they had a theoretical starting strength (not including many replacements) of around 1,800 aircrew in 1943. By mid-1945 they had lost around 175 aircraft in action and another about 50 to other causes (so in total maybe 2,300 aircrew lost their planes to all causes). According to records they had about 730 KIA, about another 900 POWs, and a large number of seriously wounded. So, while heavy losses overall, they did not lose 75% of their men KIA.
@tileux For comparison on the disastrous Nuremberg Raid 30/31 March 1944 British Bomber Command sent nearly 800 aircraft on a night raid to Nuremberg. They lost just under 100 aircraft shot down, around 10 more wrecked - over 11% of the force sent. Total aircrew missing at over 700. Schweinfurt-Regensburg (Aug 1943) was the infamous raid you are refering to. The 8th Airforce sent over nearly 400 bombers and lost about 60 with another around 20 wrecked (about 20% of the force) and a total of more than 600 aircrew killed, missing (mostly POWs) or wounded in action. The 100th suffered the worst losing 9 aircraft of the 21 flown out on the mission. But again that does not approach 75% KIA (even assuming every airmen in all 9 aircraft died, which is unlikely) and that was the unit's heaviest single loss of the War to my knowledge.
Thanks to you two, and to everyone in the comments section sharing your stories and family history! Makes the veiwing of this show even more impactful, cheers ✌
You gotta remember Masters of The Air is true life and pretty dead on to the book so far. 1 plane had 10 guys. and bomber formations had up to 1000 bombers on max effort raids. Also you have to factor in compared to land warfare, you cant hide up there. and they had to fly in line on raids, no fox holes, no buildings, nothing but just a hollow aluminum tube. flying at 150mph, with 6000 lbs of explosives, in -50 degree temperatures 5 miles in the air. against hundreds of anti aircraft guns shooting up at you, 50-60 fighters with machine guns and cannons attacking you at 3-400 mph. there is no comparison to bob and pacific it was WWII yes but 3 wars within . the 8th Airforce Almost all the bomber units in england, lost almost 10,000 more men than all of the Marine Corps losses in WWII and in only 2 years of combat, 43-45 versus 41-45... like 29,000 to 19,000 something like that, and almost the same amount were POW. easy company lost about 50 men kia in WWII the 100th lost 60 on 1 mission. and these guys had to fly 25 to go home, which actually ended up being 35 toward the end.
The actor (Anythony Boyle) playing Crosby is doing a great job - in reality the actor has a very strong Northrrn Ireland accent but seems to have nailed an American accent.
So the briefings, they absolutely were theatrical and dramatic. Crosby touches on it in his book. But most, if not all bomber groups did a similar thing where they pull back the curtain and reveal what the target for today was. It was met with cheers, like you see depicted, or groans if it looked like a tough mission.
they'd leave one of the gunners outside the briefing room to listen to the reaction of the officers. The gunners were out at the ships when armament dropped of the .50's to get them assembled and ready for action.
Great reaction guys like always. I like that is actor that portrait Lt. Harry Crosby (The guy that is always throwing up) the narrator of this series, and the real Lt. Harry Crosby was a author and writer of many books and stories about the 100th bomb group, and the producers use many of his stories as material for this series. Keep up the good work
as for precision bombing it didn't exist, which is why they didn't share it (they were fleecing the US taxpayer)...and eventually the US bombed the same way the rest of the allies were. it wasn't just the brits it was the commenwealth and like the brits they were not toffs. the inaccuracies are piling up
At this time they Navigated by Dead Reckoning a process of calculating the current position of a moving object by using a previously determined position, or fix, and incorporating estimates of speed, heading and elapsed time. so his job is actually harder then you might think especially traveling over the ocean with zero landmarks
Something to be said about vet interviews. I know there are recorded interviews with a few of them. "Rosie" and "Croz" have interviews in the documentary but I'm unsure about the others. I loved the show because my husband's grandfather was an 8th B17 pilot shot down over Holland and sent to Stalag Lift III. This gave me such an insight into his experiences.
Although it looked destructive those submarine pens still exist and now offices etc. The Americans didn't have bombs large enough to actually penetrate them. Only the British did with the blockbuster/ cookie bombs which were 4000lb and above. The Americans and the b17 in theory could carry them weight wise but it would only be one or 2 bombs in the bomb bay.
@lindaharding9092 the 12k lb yes we did but not until 1944. Even then only for specially modified Lancasters and 2 squadrons used them. Think the were only 900ish made and 30ish missions used on. The was also the grand slam bomb at 22k lb
I'm really enjoying your input on this series, which of the subject matter is near and dear to me, keep up the good work, I for one, appreciate your thoughts and viewpoint
as someone else mentions, "Twelve O'Clock High" (1949) is one of the previous best films about the air war and what it does to those who wait with an outstanding performance by Gregory Peck and it would be very relevant to this series to watch it in between episodes.
In the absence of documentary interviews with veteran survivors (sadly time has taken almost all of them away) John Orloff has written narration based on the book by Harry Crosby. Stick with it and I think you'll find he grows on you. The few remaining survivors of the bloody Hundredth (you can count them on the fingers of your hands) are not necessarily the guys featured on screen, so interviews with them would not be as impactful as the ineterviews were in Band Of Brothers or The Pacific.
I think they'll do something at the of the series like the Pacific did with pictures and histories at the end. Band of Brothers was incredibly lucky that there were still so many vets left when it was filmed. Always loved seeing the interviews with the vets.
Hopp-ing in for the masters of the algorithm! I'm slowly falling into the pull of the milieu in the deft intro talks! 🎉 for a little bit, then boning out... until I catch the series first!
Just prior to boarding a C-47's Sky Trains that took the paratroopers of the 101st to their objectives in Normandy, the medics, under orders from the Regimental Surgeons, issued air sickness pills to them. These pills had a lot of unwanted side effects like making them extremely sleepy, dizzy ,it got them excited but made them nauseous and terrified.
Ya, its hard not to make comparisons between all the series, but as you said take it for what it is - different kind of war from the guys on the ground. My late granddad Harold Sorenson was an aircraft engine mechanic in the 9th Air Force during WWII. His BG and Squadrons were in twin engine attack Bombers like the Douglas A-20 Havoc, and the Douglas A-26 Invader. Wrench turners keep em flyin!
Minor point - these men are "airmen," not "soldiers." I highly recommend "Twelve O'Clock High" (1949). It is used as a study in leadership and is very gripping.
So, Biddick (Barry Keoghan) is actually from Wisconsin, not New York. And as someone from Wisconsin, I’m just like “c’mon, why’d you guys have to change that.” 😂
The Brits used radar to help them bomb at night and in overcast weather. Was just as accurate if not more so than the Norden Bomb sight. The Americans despite all the Brits gave them research wise didn't get access to the bomb sight till post war and found it wasn't really an improvement on their own equipment. Also the Americans end up using radar to help themselves bomb targets in the end.
Precision bombing is a bit of an illusion since most of the targets were in or next to built up areas. But the distinction of the strategy between Area Bombing and Precision Bombing is more moralistic than about its effectiveness. Neither the US or UK's air forces achieved their goal of ending their war. They both contributed to blunting the Germans ability to fight it and therefore assisted in shortening the war.
Greetings from Hungary! At 12:07 "Did they make it entertaining like this in actual?" You two are yet to watch a Bridge too far, where General Brian Horrocks(played by Edward Fox) shows the mission details for Operation Market Garden to his COs. He had a less theatrical but still cheerful style.
bomber command did both day and night raids, it was eisenhower who told bomber command that the usaaf would do day light raids and for the raf to concentrate on nights, greatest night precision raid was dam busters, flying at 60ft no lower guns, no bomb sight, they had to improvise.
You can have an interview with members of the 100th as some are still living today. As well as other members of various units. There are 120k WW2 veterans alive, today.
I agree with both of you about the interviews in the other series. After watching the first episode I went searching for old interviews with pilots and came across a few. There was an interesting interview with John Lucky Luckadoo who said the planes weren't pressurized and it was so cold that if your gloves came off your fingers would be amputated. Was interesting and would have been good to have some of these old interviews at the start of each episode.
So what you can watch as a sort of companion if you are craving a little of the real world footage and inter views is the documentary series WWII The Air War. It is narrated by Gary Sinise. FYI Lt. Curtis Biddick, played by Barry Keoghan, (the one that Bucky makes punch him) is NOT from NY. He was from Wisconsin.
A lot of crews died because they got lost. Wether it's ending up over ennemy territory or just running out of fuel far from intended destination. The fate of some crews were discovered only decades later.
At the time, without friendly fighters, the idea was that mass formations could pint as many guns at incoming fighters as possible with 13 machine guns per plane, (not all able to fire in all directions) A lone bomber was considered easy prey to enemy fighters.
american crews did 25 missions then they where finished . bomber command went on and on there was no limit. wing commander guy gibson of dam busters had done 147 missions at the time of the raid he was killed a year later 1944
Yep I didn't like the comical portrayal of the Brits in Bomber Command, they suffered a higher KIA rate but they had to fly at night because the Lancasters carried nearly four times the bomb load of a B-24 and twice that of a B-17 at the expense of crew and guns.
There was a lot of talk about Austin Butler having issues getting rid of "Elvis" after doing that movie, and I feel like you can see that in this. But funnily enough i think it lends to his role here as well
I don’t know why they chose to make Crosby look like a Barney Fife character in this show. And I don’t know why the creators of the show are saying Lt. Biddick was a New York Irishman. He was born in Wisconsin.
Yeah... that's true! he flew over England and straight towards France! It also shows how the weather dictated so much of what happened during the war! Cloud cover during that time would have been the worst thing... unless you're in a dog fight and want to lose the enemy!
I still think one solitary vet giving firsthand account of the European Air War at the least would’ve put this great show over the top. In BoB The Pacific and Hacksaw Ridge, it was so impactful to feel like they’re the storytellers bc it is their story to tell more than anyone; it also drives into us deeper that what we are about to see or just seen isn’t that much dramatized if at all or not enough. Barring that this show is blowing me away just like the first two WW2 series did! P.s. I understand Covid and industry strikes etc affect things but this thing has been in the works for like a decade so I wonder why they didn’t start getting those interviews back then while the project was still in production hell. Anybody who knows the industry I’m truly wondering why they didn’t do it.
So the crashed B17 would have probably been dismantled and returned via Road for repair. My Grandmother lived near Warrington in England which was home to one of the biggest US Bases in the World RAF Burtonwood - they would repair B17s and other Army Airforce planes there. Lots of stuff online, sadly now an Industrial Storage site.
Biopic of RAF Group Captain Douglas Bader who, after having lost both legs, flew a British fighter plane during WW2. Reach for the Sky (1956) - Trailer
They say statistics never lie; statisticians always lie. The British with nighttime bombing hit upwards of 90% of their targets while the Americans with their daylight bombing only hit 65-70% of their targets, statistics. But, for bombing a factory the British counted it as a hit if the bombs fell within the city of the location of the factory. Even if the bombs fell nowhere near the factory, the target was the city itself. For the Americans the target was the third building in the second row from the right of the factory complex. And upwards of 70% of their bombs hit the target. A lot less collateral damage to the civil population and more to the actual target.
Bucky is the best character so far Buck seems trying to hard to be tough and cool looking. I saw another person say he still has the Elvis mentality left over
The crazy aspect of what those pilots experiences was the conditions. It would be -60 degrees in those planes. If you took your gloves off your fingers would fall off to the knuckle.
the JU 88s they ran into on the return home, were not fighters, but actually mid-range bombers. The gunners on the German bomber were taking shots at them as they passed by,
There were especially effective radar equipped fighter variants of the JU-88, they were extremely effective at night. Roald Dahl (author of Charlie And The Chocolate Factory and far more) writes about tangling with JU-88s during the day when he was a fighter pilot. They could certainly dog fight.
4,805 views and 348 likes? C'mon now people, what gives? This was a great reaction vid so, uh...you know what, whatever. GG Steven and Nikki. Keep it up guys.
Unfortunately I have one gripe with this episode. Bomb sight or not, the allies and the US specifically bombed civilian targets just as much and more than the Germans. Thats not an attack, there is a lot of context to consider from both angles. I just dont understand why Spielberg felt like he had to throw that in there. And before you reply angrily to me, im American myself. It’s not really a secret to the history buffs.
11:15 One thing to remember about the different strategies between the British Night bombings & the American Day bombings is the Americans considered it indiscriminate killing of civilians but they hadn't lived with civilians being bombed day & night by the Germans for nearly 4 years as the British had. No one in East England had not lost family or friends to bombings by this time in the war. When England accidentally bombed a German city thinking it was the target at night, Hitler changed the airforce bombing sites from military to civilian targets & declared "If they drop 1,000 bombs on our cities, we will 5,000 on theirs & if they destroy 1 German city we will destroy 5 of theirs!" England started it but Germany escalated it.
I can't believe you guys haven't connected with Bucky even more. He's my favourite character and my personality is not like his in any way. I also think Callum Turner is doing an incredible job portraying him.
Great idea on splicing in interviews of others who were there. Since it won’t be the actual persons involved in this project, maybe you just use them as a voiceover with generic RL footage so that no one confuses the faces with the people portrayed.
I dont understand peoples infatuation with comparing these shows with each other. They’re different shows, different actors, mostly different writers, based on completely different books by completely different people.
@@NikkiStevenReact I've watched Band of Brothers and The Pacific probably 50+ times each, easily, and I disagree. I think they feel completely different. Spielberg directed Jaws, ET, and Jurassic Park but no one feels the need to compare those. They should all be reviewed completely as independent entities, which they are.
Different yes but Band of Brothers and The Pacific both have a certain charm and production elements you can tell the same people are overseeing the production. Just like with Mike Flanagan. All his content is different but you can tell all is stuff has his finger prints all over it. Through 2 episodes, Masters of the Air doesn’t feel like Hanks and Spielberg put their touch on it. And that’s fine, I literally said in this video I’m not going to compare them anymore but guess you missed that part?
@@NikkiStevenReact You can get as snappy as you want but the fact you've brought up that you shouldnt compare the two means that you are. Completely different shows, 23 years apart, about a completely different aspect of the war with different characters, actors, stories, writers, novels that they're based on, CGI techniques, etc etc. Hope you'll enjoy it more as you go. Cheers
Could you please react to The Society of The Snow? There are almost no reactions to this movie even though it is so incredibly good and was nominated for an Oscar
Beginning Placard with facts about what was that was. Which I would have done either at the beginning or at the end of the episode. I am going to like it as my dad 😢 was there ha was Colonel LaMays Crew Chief.
I'm glad they aren't trying to make everything like Band of Brothers. Let this stand on it's own instead of doing interviews and documentary stuff like that.
You'll be happy to know that a companion documentary, called "The Bloody 100th," will be released as well, probably around the airing of the last episode!
Yeah, the documentary style of storytelling is a great way to ground us in the historical reality of what we're about to watch. That being said, this is still a strong series so far. Band of Brothers is a masterpiece. The Pacific is great. This so far seems it will slot itself as a good edition to the family. I'm looking forward to the next 7 episodes.
Band of Brothers IS one of the best if not THE best mini-series of all time. The Pacific was good, but I never made the connections that I felt with BoB. This show seems to be hitting somewhere between. But it's almost unfair to compare...the "type" of combat is completely different. It seems strange that the flyers in the 100th come back to base and are able to attend parties, have "bike races", etc, while the men of Easy slogged from location to location across Europe, and the solders in the Pacific endured horrible conditions. But...while they may have had it easier "between" combat events...the flyers depicted in Masters of the Air had an over 70% change of being killed, severely wounded, or captured as a POW. I suspect the "Norway raid" (ep 2) is literally the calm before the storm. Hang on.
@@youknownothing8226 Did you really think Mighty Eighth and Masters of the Air were the only Books that this series got it's information? Personal Memoirs and correspondence, were just the tip of the iceberg of the countless hours of prep and research that made this show possible.
As I wrote in another reactor section: RAF wasn't dropping bombs everywhere just because Brits had been longer in the fight than their USAAF counterpart. Even if I assume some crews saw it as a payback for the Blitz over English cities... But Churchill and head of the RAF Bomber command* truly believed that by bombing every major German cities its population would put so much pressure on the Nazis. At a point Hitler wouldn't had any other options than surrender... *Air Chief Marshal Harris (who was either nicknamed Bomber, Butch or Carpet bombing.. Yep that said a lot.) said: We are going to scourge the 3rd Reich from end to end. We are bombing Germany city by city and ever more terribly in order to make it impossible for them to go on with the war. That is our object; we shall pursue it relentlessly... Also the RAF did it by night because there weren't many night fighters (Nachtjad) with radar in the Luftwaffe at the beginning (1942 was a pivotal year.. and at the end of the war in Europe RAF increased loss during night raids were far superior than those of the 8th USAAF). And Lancaster or Halifax crews didn't have to face Focke-Wulf 190..
It's completely comical in terms of historical accuracy. But like the Pacific and Band Of Brothers they've got to make Allies look bad for the sake of drama because the US audience loves it.
While the british did practice night time bombing the inaccuracy at this point of british officers all being posh voiced queens english is annoying. Lot of bomber and fighter pilot's at this point from all walks of life many promoted from the ranks etc.
This is a US show, and Americans often struggle to understand UK regional accents. The filmmakers likely decided it was more important that every word they were saying was easily understood. One of the American pilots had a thick Irish accent in real life, and they changed that, too.
The only thing I don’t like in this episode is the stereotype RAF man .. unlike the fighter pilots most of RAF bomber command came from the middle and working classes especially by this point of the war when most the pre war professional flyers who did come from the upper class had been killed, just seems rather easy to make him a stereotypical upper class twit and rather denigrates the brave men of bomber command who suffered appalling casualties throughout the war.
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In his book 'A Wing And A Prayer' Harry H Crosby stresses how incompetent he felt leading the group to Tronheim. All the congradulations he received after the mission left him dismayed. Being switched from Brady's crew to Blakely's was the best thing that could happen to him. Blakely was all about practice. Every day they would fly practice missions to and from Scotland. Sometimes just an individual aeroplane and sometimes in formation with other Forts. Soon Crosby worked out the kinks and built up his confidence. Not only him, but the whole outfit. By the end of the War he was regarded as the best navigator in the whole eighth army air corps.
During his memorial service in 2010, then Governor Michael Dukakis eulogized Harry Crosby.
one thing you forgot to mention. This was also his first combat mission.
1) After a crash, they call their base
2) The base sends vehicle(s) to pick up the crew
3) a 'salvage crew' is sent to get the remains of the aircraft.
4) Admin/reperations officer goes and gives the (in this case) farmer & family some money to cover the damages.
Also, they landed in the garden of a RAF training airfield's commander. First the locals were pretty hostile since they've never seen an American bomber or crew, but they got along pretty soon after. :D
@@gergelykallai1351 After they got to know them, the Brits took a very strong liking to the Yanks. Common language, common roots, you know the story. But it was not unusual for the townsfolk to feed the boys in their homes and give them treats and the such. Never mind all the ones that had daughters that fell for those dashing Yanks in their leather jackets.
Those letters Buck wrote to the families were written by hand, not typewriter, and no copies were made. That's the type of leader he was.
I'm living i Trondheim now . The submarine pen called "Dora" they bombed áre still here. It's used as a part of the National archives and a bowling alley.
That struck me very funny. The National Archives, oh, and a bowling alley. I mean, a bowling alley? That's so random.
My grandmother lost her brother and his family from a British bombing run over Belgium that missed their German target, bombing the entire street for some miraculous reason missing my grandma's house, who at that point no longer bothered to seek shelter when the alarms went off.
And answering your question about bombers being shot down above enemy territory, my grandma again was part of the resistance in Belgium who hid downed aircrew and smuggled them through France to Spain, where they could rejoin the Allied forces. The ones that were captured were sent off to pow work camps.
In regards to "Actual Footage". On and from the British isle had extremely regulated media recording, the Entire British Ilse was under media and information blackout... "Loose Lips sink ships". You could not even have lights on. All information coming out of Britain was to be totally controlled, the only information the enemy were to know was what Britain and the Allies wanted the enemy to know.
There is footage, but not much. Interviews are short in number also.
You might want to check out “Memphis Belle” with Matthew Modine, Sean Austin, Eric Stoltz, among others, about a WWII B17 crew, based on true events. Amazing film, incredibly underrated
A good film.
Although entertaining, it was a silly Hollywood-ized movie that was very loosely based on facts.
A much better film is "Target For Today", filmed in 1943. 300+ Heavy and Medium Bombers on a 'Maximum Effort' Strike against multiple Targets in East Prussia. You get the entire Mission, from Planning to Executing the Strike. Plus, it's THE REAL THING.
I actually got to go on the Belle when she was still touring. First time setting foot inside a B-17 and it was sobering as a kid realizing it’s just sheet metal on the sides, pretty much the same as nothing at all, plus the little tunnel to the tail gun was crazy too.
As a resident of Trondheim, I can inform you that I instantly recognized every part of the town from the footage in this episode, and I could tell that every one of the bombs dropped missed their target.
As a matter of fact, the German U-boat facilities, called Dora, are still in Trondheim today. They were so solidly built that it was considered way too expensive to tear them down, and today they house the Norwegian state archives. And a bowling alley.
Just a little story about bomb dumping, there were designated zones on maps over the Channel.
The famous musician Glen Miller disappeared over the Channel while flying from Britain to France.
It was later determined that a bomber crew saw an aircraft of the type Glen was a passenger being struck by dumped bombs and crashing into the sea.
On Norway submarine pens, it's on the coast.
So the return trip is over the sea, no flack.
But when they go into Germany navigating the return route is very critical.
They must go around other major industrial areas or ports as there will be lots of flack.
So avoiding known hot spots complicates the route plans.
Harry Crosby actually goes into detail about his air sickness in his book. He actually said it was worse below 10'000 feet and normally when he had his mask on etc it was fine.
The life expectancy of a flight crew member in the 8th was six weeks. The overall survival rate of Bomber Command was roughly 25% survived
Note this is. broadly, correct. However, life expectancy and survival rate do not indicate that 75% of aircrew died. It indicates that in 1943-44 75% of aircraft were shot down or crippled (made it to the UK or a neutral country severely damaged) before they finished a full 25-flight tour, with a significant portion of aircrew KIA/MIA, but also many injured (like the frostbite casualties you see) or captured and POW. One way or the other the chances of an aircrew surviving a 25-mission tour during 1943-44 were very low, which is why in the (fictional/based on events) movie Memphis Belle the 25th flight of that aircrew was a huge propaganda push.
@@cyberdan42They could fly to somewhere like Schweinfurt or Bremen and not get so much as a scratch, yet buy the farm on a 'milk run' a week later.
@@cleekmaker00 True. Add to that we've seen the risk of simple accidents, mechanical failures, the risk of landing in bad weather, and the danger of collision in clouds or fog. The show Time Team has an episode that explores the tragedy of an in-air bomber collision.
@tileux Yes mate, So, a Bombardment Group (like the 100th) in 1943 had an establishment strength of nearly 300 officers and 1,500 other ranks who flew and a total strength of over 4,000 with ground crew. So they had a theoretical starting strength (not including many replacements) of around 1,800 aircrew in 1943. By mid-1945 they had lost around 175 aircraft in action and another about 50 to other causes (so in total maybe 2,300 aircrew lost their planes to all causes). According to records they had about 730 KIA, about another 900 POWs, and a large number of seriously wounded. So, while heavy losses overall, they did not lose 75% of their men KIA.
@tileux For comparison on the disastrous Nuremberg Raid 30/31 March 1944 British Bomber Command sent nearly 800 aircraft on a night raid to Nuremberg. They lost just under 100 aircraft shot down, around 10 more wrecked - over 11% of the force sent. Total aircrew missing at over 700.
Schweinfurt-Regensburg (Aug 1943) was the infamous raid you are refering to. The 8th Airforce sent over nearly 400 bombers and lost about 60 with another around 20 wrecked (about 20% of the force) and a total of more than 600 aircrew killed, missing (mostly POWs) or wounded in action. The 100th suffered the worst losing 9 aircraft of the 21 flown out on the mission. But again that does not approach 75% KIA (even assuming every airmen in all 9 aircraft died, which is unlikely) and that was the unit's heaviest single loss of the War to my knowledge.
Thanks to you two, and to everyone in the comments section sharing your stories and family history! Makes the veiwing of this show even more impactful, cheers ✌
Mission count was initially 25. The odds of getting there was so low, that if you got to 11, statistically you were on borrowed time.
You gotta remember Masters of The Air is true life and pretty dead on to the book so far. 1 plane had 10 guys. and bomber formations had up to 1000 bombers on max effort raids. Also you have to factor in compared to land warfare, you cant hide up there. and they had to fly in line on raids, no fox holes, no buildings, nothing but just a hollow aluminum tube. flying at 150mph, with 6000 lbs of explosives, in -50 degree temperatures 5 miles in the air. against hundreds of anti aircraft guns shooting up at you, 50-60 fighters with machine guns and cannons attacking you at 3-400 mph. there is no comparison to bob and pacific it was WWII yes but 3 wars within . the 8th Airforce Almost all the bomber units in england, lost almost 10,000 more men than all of the Marine Corps losses in WWII and in only 2 years of combat, 43-45 versus 41-45... like 29,000 to 19,000 something like that, and almost the same amount were POW. easy company lost about 50 men kia in WWII the 100th lost 60 on 1 mission. and these guys had to fly 25 to go home, which actually ended up being 35 toward the end.
My grandpa was a navigator for the Australian Air Force, WWII.
I'm scared of heights. 😁
The actor (Anythony Boyle) playing Crosby is doing a great job - in reality the actor has a very strong Northrrn Ireland accent but seems to have nailed an American accent.
That's what Ive noticed that most British/Irish actors nailed their American accent when portraying American characters
So the briefings, they absolutely were theatrical and dramatic. Crosby touches on it in his book. But most, if not all bomber groups did a similar thing where they pull back the curtain and reveal what the target for today was. It was met with cheers, like you see depicted, or groans if it looked like a tough mission.
they'd leave one of the gunners outside the briefing room to listen to the reaction of the officers. The gunners were out at the ships when armament dropped of the .50's to get them assembled and ready for action.
Great reaction guys like always. I like that is actor that portrait Lt. Harry Crosby (The guy that is always throwing up) the narrator of this series, and the real Lt. Harry Crosby was a author and writer of many books and stories about the 100th bomb group, and the producers use many of his stories as material for this series. Keep up the good work
as for precision bombing it didn't exist, which is why they didn't share it (they were fleecing the US taxpayer)...and eventually the US bombed the same way the rest of the allies were. it wasn't just the brits it was the commenwealth and like the brits they were not toffs. the inaccuracies are piling up
At this time they Navigated by Dead Reckoning a process of calculating the current position of a moving object by using a previously determined position, or fix, and incorporating estimates of speed, heading and elapsed time. so his job is actually harder then you might think especially traveling over the ocean with zero landmarks
Something to be said about vet interviews. I know there are recorded interviews with a few of them. "Rosie" and "Croz" have interviews in the documentary but I'm unsure about the others. I loved the show because my husband's grandfather was an 8th B17 pilot shot down over Holland and sent to Stalag Lift III. This gave me such an insight into his experiences.
Although it looked destructive those submarine pens still exist and now offices etc.
The Americans didn't have bombs large enough to actually penetrate them. Only the British did with the blockbuster/ cookie bombs which were 4000lb and above.
The Americans and the b17 in theory could carry them weight wise but it would only be one or 2 bombs in the bomb bay.
One account described the American 500lb bombs bouncing off the reinforced concrete sub pens like “ping-pong balls”.
@@geekstradamus1548 yep seen many accounts like that
didn,t we the raf also have the tallboy bomb
@lindaharding9092 the 12k lb yes we did but not until 1944. Even then only for specially modified Lancasters and 2 squadrons used them. Think the were only 900ish made and 30ish missions used on.
The was also the grand slam bomb at 22k lb
@@lindaharding9092 the tallboy and grand slam were British bombs. Americans didn't have their own version of tall boy until korea
I'm really enjoying your input on this series, which of the subject matter is near and dear to me, keep up the good work, I for one, appreciate your thoughts and viewpoint
Fun fact, that's me under the plane at 8:04
this is going to be a great spring! so excited you guys are reacting to this! and can't wait fot we're the ones who live!!!😃
as someone else mentions, "Twelve O'Clock High" (1949) is one of the previous best films about the air war and what it does to those who wait with an outstanding performance by Gregory Peck and it would be very relevant to this series to watch it in between episodes.
If you do a Google Search on Buck's B-17 tail number in the show? It's actually Buck Cleven's plane. And lists the entire story of that plane & crew.
In the absence of documentary interviews with veteran survivors (sadly time has taken almost all of them away) John Orloff has written narration based on the book by Harry Crosby. Stick with it and I think you'll find he grows on you. The few remaining survivors of the bloody Hundredth (you can count them on the fingers of your hands) are not necessarily the guys featured on screen, so interviews with them would not be as impactful as the ineterviews were in Band Of Brothers or The Pacific.
I think they'll do something at the of the series like the Pacific did with pictures and histories at the end. Band of Brothers was incredibly lucky that there were still so many vets left when it was filmed. Always loved seeing the interviews with the vets.
Hopp-ing in for the masters of the algorithm! I'm slowly falling into the pull of the milieu in the deft intro talks! 🎉 for a little bit, then boning out... until I catch the series first!
Just prior to boarding a C-47's Sky Trains that took the paratroopers of the 101st to their objectives in Normandy, the medics, under orders from the Regimental Surgeons, issued air sickness pills to them. These pills had a lot of unwanted side effects like making them extremely sleepy, dizzy ,it got them excited but made them nauseous and terrified.
Ya, its hard not to make comparisons between all the series, but as you said take it for what it is - different kind of war from the guys on the ground.
My late granddad Harold Sorenson was an aircraft engine mechanic in the 9th Air Force during WWII. His BG and Squadrons were in twin engine attack Bombers like the Douglas A-20 Havoc, and the Douglas A-26 Invader. Wrench turners keep em flyin!
Minor point - these men are "airmen," not "soldiers." I highly recommend "Twelve O'Clock High" (1949). It is used as a study in leadership and is very gripping.
So, Biddick (Barry Keoghan) is actually from Wisconsin, not New York.
And as someone from Wisconsin, I’m just like “c’mon, why’d you guys have to change that.” 😂
The Brits used radar to help them bomb at night and in overcast weather. Was just as accurate if not more so than the Norden Bomb sight. The Americans despite all the Brits gave them research wise didn't get access to the bomb sight till post war and found it wasn't really an improvement on their own equipment.
Also the Americans end up using radar to help themselves bomb targets in the end.
Precision bombing is a bit of an illusion since most of the targets were in or next to built up areas. But the distinction of the strategy between Area Bombing and Precision Bombing is more moralistic than about its effectiveness. Neither the US or UK's air forces achieved their goal of ending their war. They both contributed to blunting the Germans ability to fight it and therefore assisted in shortening the war.
Greetings from Hungary!
At 12:07 "Did they make it entertaining like this in actual?"
You two are yet to watch a Bridge too far, where General Brian Horrocks(played by Edward Fox) shows the mission details for Operation Market Garden to his COs. He had a less theatrical but still cheerful style.
bomber command did both day and night raids, it was eisenhower who told bomber command that the usaaf would do day light raids and for the raf to concentrate on nights, greatest night precision raid was dam busters, flying at 60ft no lower guns, no bomb sight, they had to improvise.
You can have an interview with members of the 100th as some are still living today. As well as other members of various units. There are 120k WW2 veterans alive, today.
I agree with both of you about the interviews in the other series. After watching the first episode I went searching for old interviews with pilots and came across a few. There was an interesting interview with John Lucky Luckadoo who said the planes weren't pressurized and it was so cold that if your gloves came off your fingers would be amputated. Was interesting and would have been good to have some of these old interviews at the start of each episode.
Episode 10 will have veterans interviews apparently.
Navigator with constant air sickness is a danger to crew and mission.
Happy birthday, Nikki
This reminds me so much of "Airplane!" when the passengers assumed crash positions.
So what you can watch as a sort of companion if you are craving a little of the real world footage and inter views is the documentary series WWII The Air War. It is narrated by Gary Sinise.
FYI Lt. Curtis Biddick, played by Barry Keoghan, (the one that Bucky makes punch him) is NOT from NY. He was from Wisconsin.
A lot of crews died because they got lost.
Wether it's ending up over ennemy territory or just running out of fuel far from intended destination.
The fate of some crews were discovered only decades later.
At the time, without friendly fighters, the idea was that mass formations could pint as many guns at incoming fighters as possible with 13 machine guns per plane, (not all able to fire in all directions) A lone bomber was considered easy prey to enemy fighters.
25:03 Scotland is physically connected to Britain so it’s a car or train ride back for Biddick
american crews did 25 missions then they where finished . bomber command went on and on there was no limit. wing commander guy gibson of dam busters had done 147 missions at the time of the raid he was killed a year later 1944
Yep I didn't like the comical portrayal of the Brits in Bomber Command, they suffered a higher KIA rate but they had to fly at night because the Lancasters carried nearly four times the bomb load of a B-24 and twice that of a B-17 at the expense of crew and guns.
There was a lot of talk about Austin Butler having issues getting rid of "Elvis" after doing that movie, and I feel like you can see that in this. But funnily enough i think it lends to his role here as well
I don’t know why they chose to make Crosby look like a Barney Fife character in this show. And I don’t know why the creators of the show are saying Lt. Biddick was a New York Irishman. He was born in Wisconsin.
Yeah... that's true! he flew over England and straight towards France! It also shows how the weather dictated so much of what happened during the war! Cloud cover during that time would have been the worst thing... unless you're in a dog fight and want to lose the enemy!
Checkov's helmet lmao. I knew that puke was going on someone's head 🤣
My grandpa was on a destroyer in ww2, he never wanted people to know what he saw.
They would have sent a C-47 like the ones Easy Company jumped out of to go pick up the stranded crew. The RAF had bases all throughout the home isles.
FYI, FLAK was the German abbreviation for "Flug Abwehr Kannonnen"
Love your channel. This show is really good so far.
I still think one solitary vet giving firsthand account of the European Air War at the least would’ve put this great show over the top. In BoB The Pacific and Hacksaw Ridge, it was so impactful to feel like they’re the storytellers bc it is their story to tell more than anyone; it also drives into us deeper that what we are about to see or just seen isn’t that much dramatized if at all or not enough. Barring that this show is blowing me away just like the first two WW2 series did!
P.s. I understand Covid and industry strikes etc affect things but this thing has been in the works for like a decade so I wonder why they didn’t start getting those interviews back then while the project was still in production hell. Anybody who knows the industry I’m truly wondering why they didn’t do it.
So the crashed B17 would have probably been dismantled and returned via Road for repair. My Grandmother lived near Warrington in England which was home to one of the biggest US Bases in the World RAF Burtonwood - they would repair B17s and other Army Airforce planes there. Lots of stuff online, sadly now an Industrial Storage site.
Biopic of RAF Group Captain Douglas Bader who, after having lost both legs, flew a British fighter plane during WW2. Reach for the Sky (1956) - Trailer
Just watched part 3…… oh god… how many parts is this? Steven better stock up on tissues for Nikki
They say statistics never lie; statisticians always lie. The British with nighttime bombing hit upwards of 90% of their targets while the Americans with their daylight bombing only hit 65-70% of their targets, statistics. But, for bombing a factory the British counted it as a hit if the bombs fell within the city of the location of the factory. Even if the bombs fell nowhere near the factory, the target was the city itself. For the Americans the target was the third building in the second row from the right of the factory complex. And upwards of 70% of their bombs hit the target. A lot less collateral damage to the civil population and more to the actual target.
Different doctrine, Harris said that bombs landing on the houses next to the factory meant those workers weren't showing up to work in the morning.
Navigation is spherical trig, they used function tables and slide rules ... no calculators. Navy by this time were using analog computers.
Bucky is the best character so far Buck seems trying to hard to be tough and cool looking. I saw another person say he still has the Elvis mentality left over
The bombing run to trondheim was a 1900 mile trip
The crazy aspect of what those pilots experiences was the conditions. It would be -60 degrees in those planes. If you took your gloves off your fingers would fall off to the knuckle.
Yeah, that’s horrifying
Timing + preparation = GREAT OPPORTUNITY … luck 🍀 is the 3rd factor in the equation
the JU 88s they ran into on the return home, were not fighters, but actually mid-range bombers. The gunners on the German bomber were taking shots at them as they passed by,
For what it's worth there were heavy fighter variants of the JU88.
There were especially effective radar equipped fighter variants of the JU-88, they were extremely effective at night. Roald Dahl (author of Charlie And The Chocolate Factory and far more) writes about tangling with JU-88s during the day when he was a fighter pilot. They could certainly dog fight.
Frieden, Freiheit, Glückseligkeit, Freude und Wohlstand für alle Menschen
4,805 views and 348 likes?
C'mon now people, what gives? This was a great reaction vid so, uh...you know what, whatever.
GG Steven and Nikki. Keep it up guys.
Unfortunately I have one gripe with this episode. Bomb sight or not, the allies and the US specifically bombed civilian targets just as much and more than the Germans. Thats not an attack, there is a lot of context to consider from both angles. I just dont understand why Spielberg felt like he had to throw that in there. And before you reply angrily to me, im American myself. It’s not really a secret to the history buffs.
Yep, but US audiences love to see other Allies looking stupid. They did the same in Band Of Brothers and The Pacific.
I really wish more shows would show the complexity of the decisions going into terror bombing.
11:15 One thing to remember about the different strategies between the British Night bombings & the American Day bombings is the Americans considered it indiscriminate killing of civilians but they hadn't lived with civilians being bombed day & night by the Germans for nearly 4 years as the British had. No one in East England had not lost family or friends to bombings by this time in the war. When England accidentally bombed a German city thinking it was the target at night, Hitler changed the airforce bombing sites from military to civilian targets & declared "If they drop 1,000 bombs on our cities, we will 5,000 on theirs & if they destroy 1 German city we will destroy 5 of theirs!" England started it but Germany escalated it.
"England started it but Germany escalated it."
Germany started it in Spain in the Civil War then Warsaw then Rotterdam.
When Iron Claw comes out on digital, you guys HAVE to react to it. If you think Nikki's cried hard before...
The flak you seen wasn't a problem. It was the one you didn't see was the one that got you
I just know Barry, as an Irish Lad, had a LOT of fun hitting that British dude.
I can't believe you guys haven't connected with Bucky even more. He's my favourite character and my personality is not like his in any way. I also think Callum Turner is doing an incredible job portraying him.
Great idea on splicing in interviews of others who were there.
Since it won’t be the actual persons involved in this project, maybe you just use them as a voiceover with generic RL footage so that no one confuses the faces with the people portrayed.
Those veterans are mostly not with us anymore. BoB was 20 years ago, and only a few were still alive then.
That’s why I mentioned the idea of using interviews from other documentaries
Suggest you do not forget the same people put this together as put together Band of brothers, so I would trust the judgement of Hanks and Spielberg!
Exactly. Thats why I won’t be judging completely till the end.
I dont understand peoples infatuation with comparing these shows with each other. They’re different shows, different actors, mostly different writers, based on completely different books by completely different people.
With the same executive producers over seeing all three projects. Band of Brothers and The Pacific have the same feel. Why wouldn’t this one?
@@NikkiStevenReact I've watched Band of Brothers and The Pacific probably 50+ times each, easily, and I disagree. I think they feel completely different. Spielberg directed Jaws, ET, and Jurassic Park but no one feels the need to compare those. They should all be reviewed completely as independent entities, which they are.
Different yes but Band of Brothers and The Pacific both have a certain charm and production elements you can tell the same people are overseeing the production. Just like with Mike Flanagan. All his content is different but you can tell all is stuff has his finger prints all over it. Through 2 episodes, Masters of the Air doesn’t feel like Hanks and Spielberg put their touch on it. And that’s fine, I literally said in this video I’m not going to compare them anymore but guess you missed that part?
@@NikkiStevenReact You can get as snappy as you want but the fact you've brought up that you shouldnt compare the two means that you are. Completely different shows, 23 years apart, about a completely different aspect of the war with different characters, actors, stories, writers, novels that they're based on, CGI techniques, etc etc. Hope you'll enjoy it more as you go. Cheers
You think that was snappy?
Remember what happened to Blyth in Bamd of nrothers....the pills for sickness knocked him out
You guys should watch “the Memphis belle” 1990. Also a great movie
Could you please react to The Society of The Snow? There are almost no reactions to this movie even though it is so incredibly good and was nominated for an Oscar
Beginning Placard with facts about what was that was. Which I would have done either at the beginning or at the end of the episode. I am going to like it as my dad 😢 was there ha was Colonel LaMays Crew Chief.
Their unit came to be known as the “Bloody 100th” due to the extremely high rates of losses.
Pretty much all of them have been dead for years so footage might be hard to come by.
If you haven’t seen it yet watch Memphis Belle.
I'm glad they aren't trying to make everything like Band of Brothers. Let this stand on it's own instead of doing interviews and documentary stuff like that.
You'll be happy to know that a companion documentary, called "The Bloody 100th," will be released as well, probably around the airing of the last episode!
Yeah, the documentary style of storytelling is a great way to ground us in the historical reality of what we're about to watch.
That being said, this is still a strong series so far.
Band of Brothers is a masterpiece. The Pacific is great. This so far seems it will slot itself as a good edition to the family.
I'm looking forward to the next 7 episodes.
Band of Brothers IS one of the best if not THE best mini-series of all time. The Pacific was good, but I never made the connections that I felt with BoB. This show seems to be hitting somewhere between. But it's almost unfair to compare...the "type" of combat is completely different. It seems strange that the flyers in the 100th come back to base and are able to attend parties, have "bike races", etc, while the men of Easy slogged from location to location across Europe, and the solders in the Pacific endured horrible conditions. But...while they may have had it easier "between" combat events...the flyers depicted in Masters of the Air had an over 70% change of being killed, severely wounded, or captured as a POW. I suspect the "Norway raid" (ep 2) is literally the calm before the storm. Hang on.
Quite sure the guy narrating the episodes is Crosby. So I'm guessing he gets thru the whole shebang.
It's not like he wrote a book about his experiences. Oh wait.
@@brucechmiel7964 Except Donald L. Miller (Author who's book is the basis) wasn't born until 1944 but I know what you mean.
@@youknownothing8226I'm referring to A Wing and a Prayer by Harry H. Crosby.
@@brucechmiel7964 thing we're moving into spoilers now 😀
@@youknownothing8226 Did you really think Mighty Eighth and Masters of the Air were the only Books that this series got it's information? Personal Memoirs and correspondence, were just the tip of the iceberg of the countless hours of prep and research that made this show possible.
They show "Corporal" Ken Levins and he has like six stripes on his jacket.. Continuity much?
As I wrote in another reactor section: RAF wasn't dropping bombs everywhere just because Brits had been longer in the fight than their USAAF counterpart. Even if I assume some crews saw it as a payback for the Blitz over English cities...
But Churchill and head of the RAF Bomber command* truly believed that by bombing every major German cities its population would put so much pressure on the Nazis. At a point Hitler wouldn't had any other options than surrender...
*Air Chief Marshal Harris (who was either nicknamed Bomber, Butch or Carpet bombing.. Yep that said a lot.) said: We are going to scourge the 3rd Reich from end to end. We are bombing Germany city by city and ever more terribly in order to make it impossible for them to go on with the war. That is our object; we shall pursue it relentlessly...
Also the RAF did it by night because there weren't many night fighters (Nachtjad) with radar in the Luftwaffe at the beginning (1942 was a pivotal year.. and at the end of the war in Europe RAF increased loss during night raids were far superior than those of the 8th USAAF). And Lancaster or Halifax crews didn't have to face Focke-Wulf 190..
Really hoping we get more "interactions" between the USAAF and the RAF. I always enjoy that stuff.
This was clichéd stereotypical nonsense though.
It's completely comical in terms of historical accuracy. But like the Pacific and Band Of Brothers they've got to make Allies look bad for the sake of drama because the US audience loves it.
@@goodshipkaraboudjan
There seems to be a pattern to these American productions. It's annoying.
@@lyndoncmp5751I know, I would prefer to see them getting along.
@@lyndoncmp5751...And no way would I want to antagonize them.
I wonder who Steven's cousin is 😂
While the british did practice night time bombing the inaccuracy at this point of british officers all being posh voiced queens english is annoying.
Lot of bomber and fighter pilot's at this point from all walks of life many promoted from the ranks etc.
This is a US show, and Americans often struggle to understand UK regional accents. The filmmakers likely decided it was more important that every word they were saying was easily understood. One of the American pilots had a thick Irish accent in real life, and they changed that, too.
Watch WWII in HD: The Air War.
The only thing I don’t like in this episode is the stereotype RAF man .. unlike the fighter pilots most of RAF bomber command came from the middle and working classes especially by this point of the war when most the pre war professional flyers who did come from the upper class had been killed, just seems rather easy to make him a stereotypical upper class twit and rather denigrates the brave men of bomber command who suffered appalling casualties throughout the war.
4:38
Odd comment....very few have done sin city. Please do