I read all the books.... and if you are an experienced reader, you imagine the personaes and compares with actual or historic actors. In fact, Peter Dinklage came in my mind for Miles, also Gabriel Byrne as Aral Vorkosigan and Maura Tierney (Abby Lochart of "Emergency Room) as Cordelia. And would a younger Jean Reno (Leon: The Professionel) not a perfect Cast for Sgt. Bothari ?
I encountered a short story, "The Mountains of Mourning" in Analog, I think it was. I sat there crying!! Don't usually do that. This lady gets inside of your heart, your mind, and sometimes your soul. What a wonderful writer.
My first exposure to Bujold was also through the pages of _Analog._ First I read _Falling Free_ there, then “Mountains of Mourning,” whithout realizing it was by the same author. A few months later, _Analog_ published “Labyrinth,” and I recognized Miles, but wondered how the heck he went from being a freshly minted ensign to a mercenary admiral. Then Nicole showed up and I realized this was the same ‘verse as _Falling Free._ A bit later _Analog_ published “Weatherman” and after reading it I went to a bookstore and bought everything there with Bujold’s name on it (which I then proceeded to read in pretty much reverse order.)
Nice perspective. Just noting that I read them in publication order because I read them as they were published. Yes, I'm that old. However, internal order does make more sense, keeping in mind the publication history, since Bujold's writing improves as the series progresses. Of course, her writing was already pretty good at the start. As Jo Walton observed, "Barrayar" was the book where Bujold's prose "really started to sing". I agree that "Falling Free" can be left out of the reading order. As wonderful as it is, it's not essential.
I agree that readin the Cordelia books not only let you know a lot more of Miles parents, but also a lot of the cultural background of the Vors and the Barrayar. Also Cordelia is one amazing character. But you can actually read them later too. I started reading with the Warriors aprentice, and almost kept in order (I read Civil campaign earlier by mistake which got me confused as why was Miles no longer in space) so when I got to read the Cordelia's books in the middle it was like a nice flashback to give extra background to the characters.
Love this series and have reread it many times. I first discovered Miles in Warriors Apprentice, then went back and read Shards and Barrayar. I have gone on to read everything Lois writes. She is an outstanding writer. Thanks for this video. .
In favor of internal chronology, I can offer my experience starting w/ Warrior's Apprentice [mild spoilers]. I loved it, but the reveal about Bothari's background and Elena's parentage seemed to come out of nowhere. But when I re-read it with the benefit of the Cordelia novels, it played out much more coherently. And I think you're cheating yourself if you go too far into the Miles novels w/o knowing the full history of Cordelia, Aral, and the Vordarian Pretendership. Just about any scene w/ Miles and his parents loses some nuance if you're only able to see them from his perspective. Also, Barrayar is the best book in the series. If you read it out of sequence, as I did, it's still great, but don't skip it.
I agree so much, Christopher! Thanks for sharing your experience. There really is a lot of depth added to situations if you've read the Cordelia books. (And Barrayar is still one of my absolute favorites of the series!)
Sirnonenath The next book, Barrayar, has some of the most serious badass events ever with Cordelia! The "shopping" scene at the end... yeah, I need to re-read that book already :-) I hope you enjoy continuing with the series!
I know you posted this review years ago. I am such a fan of this series. Mild spoiler below: Like Miles I fell in love with the character of Taura. And besides Winterfare Gifts, which was so romantic. It was Taura's journey that really effected me. I bloody cried when she died. Not something that has happened often reading SF. Sigh.. Time to read the series again. Damn, watching your back catalogue of reviews Rachel has turned my reading plans for the next year, upside down.
Thanks for this, Rachel! I started with Shards of Honor and didn't love it, and was thinking maybe I wouldn't continue on with the series - but your video is making me think of just jumping ahead to Miles' story and giving it another try.
TheReadingOutlaw Oh yeah, if you want something different from Shards of Honor, then jump to The Warrior's Apprentice and experience Miles' BS-ing his way through *everything* and accidentally setting up a mercenary fleet!
You have hardcovers?!? My heart...can't take the envy. After the hair scarf comments from a few days ago the braid on your cardigan looks similar. If only long hair could be easily woven into clothing fabrics like those cloth robes from Anathem. Anyways. Barrayar was SO DANG GOOD! So stoked to continue the rest of the series.
Let's Read Someone somewhere has crafted clothing out of their own hair and now that sounds creepy :-) The hardcovers are excellent! They are published by NESFA, though they haven't released editions for the entire series, just the older ones I think.
I read them between the ages of 12 and 14 (started up again at the age of 21) and had 0 order to reading the books. I jumped around the series because I was just grabbing whatever one was on the shelf at the library that I had not read yet. I miss those days, back when I could still count (with some difficulty, but still could count) the number of series I had read. Now, not a chance, I think it is under 100 but then again, it might not be (that is series not books, not even trying to guess how many books I have read).
Thanks for the explanation! Ever since I start watching you and you mentioned reading this saga I thought it sounded interesting. But with so many books the series is a bit overwhelming. Now I at least now a couple places to begin and see what I think of it.
TravelingInFocus That is the problem with starting a long series - if the books aren't written in order or numbered, you don't know where to start! I hope this helps you get into the Vorkosigan adventures :-)
I am enjoying Shards of Honor more on the re-read then I did the first time. I think it’s because now I know all these characters much better, having read a lot of the Vorkosigan books in the interim.
Ah, thanks for this video! I'm really looking forward to starting this series this year after you and Katherine really enjoying it. :D I may just pick up Falling Free because it sounds really nice.
Crispers BookNook Falling Free is an excellent standalone if you want to experience Bujold's SF writing! My enjoyment of it was heightened by knowing beforehand that the main character is based on her father. I think that was just so sweet!
Growing up, I did not enjoy science fiction. I sampled all of the famous authors, but always felt disappointed. About thirty-five years ago, my wife and I visited an island in the Caribbean. The people who occupied our room before us had left behind a copy of the magazine Argosy (science fiction and science fact). I picked it up and began reading a short story titled Labyrinth. After three pages, I said to myself, "There is something wrong here. This is good." Bujold became the only fiction author, other than Shakespeare, whose work I read with pencil in hand to mark and underline. Some of her works I did not enjoy, but the Vorkosigan Saga and the first two books of the "Five Gods" series have been read by me a half-dozen times or more. Serendipity, I suppose.
I think there are several possible intro points to the series if you think of it as "Intro and then series". For example, A Civil Campaign is a perfectly reasonable first book to start with as it is an internally self sustaining story. It certainly references other events and what-not, but it is a stand alone book in the proper sense and it has the advantage of nominally covering several genres, so it's going to be a more comfy intro for a wider range of people. From there, readers can go back and jump in wherever they want on the 3 points you mentioned. The same could be said for Captain Vorpatril's Alliance. It's entirely stand alone in the same way ACC is and allows introduction to the series while covering several genres for reader entry.
@@oxoelfoxo "not as enjoyable" is not the same thing as "functions as a stand alone book". It's a perfectly good book all by itself. Knowing the background *adds* to it all, but it's not *necessary*.
Thanks for the review. Cordelia is kick ass. I didn't really care about Miles at first. Military stuff doesn't interest me. So I read the initial two Cordelia books, then somehow I started on A Civil Campaign, and only then did I get into Miles. Then I went back and re-read chronologically. They are books that I read and re-read regularly - comfort reading. (As is the Sharing Knife series.) This afternoon I will burn an offering, in Barrayar style, for my mother, who died two years ago today.
I started with Shards of Honor, mostly because I didn't know Free Falling existed (I haven't read that one.) I think when I restart the series I'll use the order you talk about.
Nicole's Adventures in SFF Yeah, Falling Free is one of the earliest published novels and I think for a long time it might not have had a connection to the rest of the series. The next book that references it in any way was published 15 years after! It's really interesting to compare the publication order with chronological order...somehow Bujold makes it work.
I've read them a bunch of times, in a bunch of different orders. Honestly, for books set before Memory, I don't really think it matters much what order you read them - they are very self contained. I'd probably read Warrior's Apprentice before the rest of the early Miles books, but that's about it, and not entirely required. From Memory on, I do think they benefit a great deal from reading them in order.
I would like to share my experience and why I recommend reading 📚 Miles story first and in chronological order. This will give you a perspective of achievement (which you'll also get if you read his parents story first). But, and here is where I differ, whilst you're reading Miles adventures you get to see his society and his parents from his own perspective... how he sees it... and THAT is what made me want to read his parents story. Otherwise I think you start Miles story with an already made up perspective on his society, his parents (and how the influenced him) and take away a lot the surprise of the story. Besides, books 📚 try to recap some of the background whenever it is required. And remember, you are getting Miles side of the story so don't spoil it by getting an introduction first. I hope you enjoy these books. I read all Miles, then read his parents and re-read Warrior's Apprentice
Yo empecé con "Barrayar," y aprendiz de guerrero ", y lego retrocedi a" Fragmentos de Honor ", luego seguí con los contactos de Miles, con su padre, cuando es enviado a cumplir una misión como juez de comarca, en" las montañas de la afliccion", y"laberinto, y su fascinante mujer /soldado experimental, y su cruce con Miles, para mi gusto, el que menos me llamó la atención, fue(aunque no era malo), el planeta de sólo hombres , y su sociedad tan particular , cuando la autora buscaba elegir protagonista, dudando entre los padres de Miles, la comandante Ellen, y Miles, que finalmente se decantó por este minisoldado y genial estratega, enamorado, y con un fuerte sentido del deber, y el honor personal, y familiar, su enfoque, actitudes y resultados, son geniales(hasta me gusta su sombrío guardaespaldas /
Lo siento, no se que pasó, se duplicó mi comentario (o se cono en el planeta que se dedica a ellos! (Cmo ven, adoro al personaje, y su manera de triunfar, a base de inteligencia, y genialidad), me leí todo lo publicado en español (mi inglés de escuela es pésimo), y estoy a la, espera de nuevas publicaciones suyas!! (que ya salieron en el mercado anglo).
I started with The Warrior's apprentice, recommended by my dad. I don't even know why I'm watching this, since I am about to start reading Memory;). Anyway, my question is do you think it's a good idea to read Falling free, Shards of honor and Barrayar after finishing all the other books?
+MoMakesMovies Oh yes! Falling Free has very little bearing on the rest of the Vorkosigan books (other than the quaddies showing up again, but hundreds of years later), but it's a good book. Shards of Honor and Barrayar cover history that's embedded throughout the series, and at least heavily recapped in the latest books (Gentleman Jole and the Red Queen). I'm terribly biased, though, because they are all favorites of mine in the series!
I usually slow the name down. More as if it was two words Vor Kosigan. Linke Von in German or de in French or Spanish or Mc and Mac in Scotland or Ireland.
When I started reading the Miles books, I immediately thought, ‘Tyrion Lannister’, but then I realized that Bujold wrote first.
I read all the books.... and if you are an experienced reader, you imagine the personaes and compares with actual or historic actors. In fact, Peter Dinklage came in my mind for Miles, also Gabriel Byrne as Aral Vorkosigan and Maura Tierney (Abby Lochart of "Emergency Room) as Cordelia. And would a younger Jean Reno (Leon: The Professionel) not a perfect Cast for Sgt. Bothari ?
I encountered a short story, "The Mountains of Mourning" in Analog, I think it was. I sat there crying!! Don't usually do that. This lady gets inside of your heart, your mind, and sometimes your soul. What a wonderful writer.
My first exposure to Bujold was also through the pages of _Analog._ First I read _Falling Free_ there, then “Mountains of Mourning,” whithout realizing it was by the same author. A few months later, _Analog_ published “Labyrinth,” and I recognized Miles, but wondered how the heck he went from being a freshly minted ensign to a mercenary admiral. Then Nicole showed up and I realized this was the same ‘verse as _Falling Free._ A bit later _Analog_ published “Weatherman” and after reading it I went to a bookstore and bought everything there with Bujold’s name on it (which I then proceeded to read in pretty much reverse order.)
Nice perspective. Just noting that I read them in publication order because I read them as they were published. Yes, I'm that old. However, internal order does make more sense, keeping in mind the publication history, since Bujold's writing improves as the series progresses. Of course, her writing was already pretty good at the start. As Jo Walton observed, "Barrayar" was the book where Bujold's prose "really started to sing".
I agree that "Falling Free" can be left out of the reading order. As wonderful as it is, it's not essential.
I agree that readin the Cordelia books not only let you know a lot more of Miles parents, but also a lot of the cultural background of the Vors and the Barrayar. Also Cordelia is one amazing character. But you can actually read them later too. I started reading with the Warriors aprentice, and almost kept in order (I read Civil campaign earlier by mistake which got me confused as why was Miles no longer in space) so when I got to read the Cordelia's books in the middle it was like a nice flashback to give extra background to the characters.
Love this series and have reread it many times. I first discovered Miles in Warriors Apprentice, then went back and read Shards and Barrayar. I have gone on to read everything Lois writes. She is an outstanding writer. Thanks for this video. .
I too am finding that I enjoy them more the second time around. Now I know all the characters, and I get all the references to other books.
In favor of internal chronology, I can offer my experience starting w/ Warrior's Apprentice [mild spoilers]. I loved it, but the reveal about Bothari's background and Elena's parentage seemed to come out of nowhere. But when I re-read it with the benefit of the Cordelia novels, it played out much more coherently. And I think you're cheating yourself if you go too far into the Miles novels w/o knowing the full history of Cordelia, Aral, and the Vordarian Pretendership. Just about any scene w/ Miles and his parents loses some nuance if you're only able to see them from his perspective. Also, Barrayar is the best book in the series. If you read it out of sequence, as I did, it's still great, but don't skip it.
I agree so much, Christopher! Thanks for sharing your experience. There really is a lot of depth added to situations if you've read the Cordelia books. (And Barrayar is still one of my absolute favorites of the series!)
Thanks so much. Just finished Shards of Honor and I had no idea which to read next. Now I'm set. Much thanks!
Sirnonenath The next book, Barrayar, has some of the most serious badass events ever with Cordelia! The "shopping" scene at the end... yeah, I need to re-read that book already :-) I hope you enjoy continuing with the series!
I know you posted this review years ago. I am such a fan of this series. Mild spoiler below:
Like Miles I fell in love with the character of Taura. And besides Winterfare Gifts, which was so romantic. It was Taura's journey that really effected me. I bloody cried when she died. Not something that has happened often reading SF. Sigh.. Time to read the series again. Damn, watching your back catalogue of reviews Rachel has turned my reading plans for the next year, upside down.
Thanks for this, Rachel! I started with Shards of Honor and didn't love it, and was thinking maybe I wouldn't continue on with the series - but your video is making me think of just jumping ahead to Miles' story and giving it another try.
TheReadingOutlaw Oh yeah, if you want something different from Shards of Honor, then jump to The Warrior's Apprentice and experience Miles' BS-ing his way through *everything* and accidentally setting up a mercenary fleet!
Thanks for this Rachel. I love your edition of the books you got a few months ago too. So pretty.
Common Touch of Fantasy They are really pretty. I shouldn't impulse buy because of covers, but I don't regret those!
I read them as they came out . It is much better using the internal order .
I have bookmarked the order, and will hopefully pick up my first one later this year maybe??!? I need to read this because you love it so much, lol.
You have hardcovers?!? My heart...can't take the envy. After the hair scarf comments from a few days ago the braid on your cardigan looks similar. If only long hair could be easily woven into clothing fabrics like those cloth robes from Anathem. Anyways. Barrayar was SO DANG GOOD! So stoked to continue the rest of the series.
Let's Read Someone somewhere has crafted clothing out of their own hair and now that sounds creepy :-)
The hardcovers are excellent! They are published by NESFA, though they haven't released editions for the entire series, just the older ones I think.
Thank you ❤️ I love these books
Thanks for this! Very helpful and informative. Love those hardcovers.
Matthew Clanahan Glad it was helpful! The NESFA hardcovers are really great. I hope they reprint more of the series soon!
Thanks! That was really helpful. The massive number of books in this series is kind of overwhelming.
Le Mocchiato Yeah, figuring out where to start so you can chip away at all 15 (soon to be 16!) books is daunting. It's well worth it though! :-)
I read them between the ages of 12 and 14 (started up again at the age of 21) and had 0 order to reading the books. I jumped around the series because I was just grabbing whatever one was on the shelf at the library that I had not read yet. I miss those days, back when I could still count (with some difficulty, but still could count) the number of series I had read. Now, not a chance, I think it is under 100 but then again, it might not be (that is series not books, not even trying to guess how many books I have read).
Thanks for the explanation! Ever since I start watching you and you mentioned reading this saga I thought it sounded interesting. But with so many books the series is a bit overwhelming. Now I at least now a couple places to begin and see what I think of it.
TravelingInFocus That is the problem with starting a long series - if the books aren't written in order or numbered, you don't know where to start! I hope this helps you get into the Vorkosigan adventures :-)
I am enjoying Shards of Honor more on the re-read then I did the first time. I think it’s because now I know all these characters much better, having read a lot of the Vorkosigan books in the interim.
I'm reading Warrior's Apprentice first followed by Ethan of Athos because those were the only two that my local used bookstore had.
Ah, thanks for this video! I'm really looking forward to starting this series this year after you and Katherine really enjoying it. :D
I may just pick up Falling Free because it sounds really nice.
Crispers BookNook Falling Free is an excellent standalone if you want to experience Bujold's SF writing! My enjoyment of it was heightened by knowing beforehand that the main character is based on her father. I think that was just so sweet!
Growing up, I did not enjoy science fiction. I sampled all of the famous authors, but always felt disappointed. About thirty-five years ago, my wife and I visited an island in the Caribbean. The people who occupied our room before us had left behind a copy of the magazine Argosy (science fiction and science fact). I picked it up and began reading a short story titled Labyrinth. After three pages, I said to myself, "There is something wrong here. This is good." Bujold became the only fiction author, other than Shakespeare, whose work I read with pencil in hand to mark and underline. Some of her works I did not enjoy, but the Vorkosigan Saga and the first two books of the "Five Gods" series have been read by me a half-dozen times or more. Serendipity, I suppose.
I think there are several possible intro points to the series if you think of it as "Intro and then series". For example, A Civil Campaign is a perfectly reasonable first book to start with as it is an internally self sustaining story. It certainly references other events and what-not, but it is a stand alone book in the proper sense and it has the advantage of nominally covering several genres, so it's going to be a more comfy intro for a wider range of people. From there, readers can go back and jump in wherever they want on the 3 points you mentioned. The same could be said for Captain Vorpatril's Alliance. It's entirely stand alone in the same way ACC is and allows introduction to the series while covering several genres for reader entry.
nooo, i don't agree that ACC is stand-alone. it's not as enjoyable if you don't already know the characters involved
@@oxoelfoxo "not as enjoyable" is not the same thing as "functions as a stand alone book". It's a perfectly good book all by itself. Knowing the background *adds* to it all, but it's not *necessary*.
Thanks for the review.
Cordelia is kick ass. I didn't really care about Miles at first. Military stuff doesn't interest me. So I read the initial two Cordelia books, then somehow I started on A Civil Campaign, and only then did I get into Miles. Then I went back and re-read chronologically. They are books that I read and re-read regularly - comfort reading. (As is the Sharing Knife series.)
This afternoon I will burn an offering, in Barrayar style, for my mother, who died two years ago today.
Hey Kalanadi! I just got into the Vorkosigan Sagas. I am enjoying them infinitely! What are your thoughts on the Chalion series?
Great stuff 👍👍👍
I started with Shards of Honor, mostly because I didn't know Free Falling existed (I haven't read that one.) I think when I restart the series I'll use the order you talk about.
Nicole's Adventures in SFF Yeah, Falling Free is one of the earliest published novels and I think for a long time it might not have had a connection to the rest of the series. The next book that references it in any way was published 15 years after! It's really interesting to compare the publication order with chronological order...somehow Bujold makes it work.
Thank you for the information, very helpful!
Thank you! That was a great explanation. I'll give this another try at some point.
Bitten by a radioactive book Awesome - I'm glad it was helpful!
Great video!
I've read them a bunch of times, in a bunch of different orders. Honestly, for books set before Memory, I don't really think it matters much what order you read them - they are very self contained. I'd probably read Warrior's Apprentice before the rest of the early Miles books, but that's about it, and not entirely required. From Memory on, I do think they benefit a great deal from reading them in order.
I would like to share my experience and why I recommend reading 📚 Miles story first and in chronological order. This will give you a perspective of achievement (which you'll also get if you read his parents story first). But, and here is where I differ, whilst you're reading Miles adventures you get to see his society and his parents from his own perspective... how he sees it... and THAT is what made me want to read his parents story. Otherwise I think you start Miles story with an already made up perspective on his society, his parents (and how the influenced him) and take away a lot the surprise of the story. Besides, books 📚 try to recap some of the background whenever it is required.
And remember, you are getting Miles side of the story so don't spoil it by getting an introduction first. I hope you enjoy these books. I read all Miles, then read his parents and re-read Warrior's Apprentice
Ah! This is a very helpful video! Yay helpful Rachel.
Victoria Harris I do my best to serve! ^_^
I only read Falling Free but I loved that one!
Yo empecé con "Barrayar," y aprendiz de guerrero ", y lego retrocedi a" Fragmentos de Honor ", luego seguí con los contactos de Miles, con su padre, cuando es enviado a cumplir una misión como juez de comarca, en" las montañas de la afliccion", y"laberinto, y su fascinante mujer /soldado experimental, y su cruce con Miles, para mi gusto, el que menos me llamó la atención, fue(aunque no era malo), el planeta de sólo hombres , y su sociedad tan particular , cuando la autora buscaba elegir protagonista, dudando entre los padres de Miles, la comandante Ellen, y Miles, que finalmente se decantó por este minisoldado y genial estratega, enamorado, y con un fuerte sentido del deber, y el honor personal, y familiar, su enfoque, actitudes y resultados, son geniales(hasta me gusta su sombrío guardaespaldas /
Thanks Rachel. I am going to get to this soon. I am. I am.
yesmissjane Yay! I want to know what you think of Aral, Cordelia, and Miles! :-)
Well, my month's book budget re-ups this week, so we'll see if I can not waste all of it in one go this time!!!
Lo siento, no se que pasó, se duplicó mi comentario (o se cono en el planeta que se dedica a ellos! (Cmo ven, adoro al personaje, y su manera de triunfar, a base de inteligencia, y genialidad), me leí todo lo publicado en español (mi inglés de escuela es pésimo), y estoy a la, espera de nuevas publicaciones suyas!! (que ya salieron en el mercado anglo).
I started with The Warrior's apprentice, recommended by my dad. I don't even know why I'm watching this, since I am about to start reading Memory;). Anyway, my question is do you think it's a good idea to read Falling free, Shards of honor and Barrayar after finishing all the other books?
+MoMakesMovies Oh yes! Falling Free has very little bearing on the rest of the Vorkosigan books (other than the quaddies showing up again, but hundreds of years later), but it's a good book. Shards of Honor and Barrayar cover history that's embedded throughout the series, and at least heavily recapped in the latest books (Gentleman Jole and the Red Queen). I'm terribly biased, though, because they are all favorites of mine in the series!
Awesome this is just what I needed thank you thank you thank you :)
Elena Reads Books You're very welcome! :-D
I usually slow the name down. More as if it was two words Vor Kosigan. Linke Von in German or de in French or Spanish or Mc and Mac in Scotland or Ireland.
I read Mirror Dance first. It worked for me. 😉
I liked Falling Free, Shards of Honour and Barrayar more than The Warrior's Apprentice.
caught be off guard to hear you pronounce bah-RAY-yar instead of BAR-RAH-yar