Thanks to Odoo for sponsoring this video! Visit www.odoo.com/r/TXH and get started today with a free 14-day trial from Odoo, No credit card required! What do you think? Is building the Skyline worth it? Thanks a lot for watching 💛
Please cover Riyadh metro, it's first metro in Saudi with six lines and costing 22.5 billion dollars. It will launch this month. Would love to see a video about it's delays, the project success or failure and the 7th line to Qiddiya that was announced.
The Little Andaman project is not a sustainable initiative compared to the second project located in Vizhinjam in Kerala. The Vizhinjam project is strategically positioned near an international trade route, making it a better choice for trade purposes. While the Little Andaman project raises significant environmental concerns, the Vizhinjam project does not face such issues. With the ongoing economic boom in India, the Vikas Bharat initiative appears more viable and economically promising. The Vizhinjam project, with its proximity to Thiruvananthapuram, promotes regional development and benefits nearby cities. This government-backed initiative strengthens the economy by facilitating mother ship connections, making it a key player in enhancing India's trade capabilities. Moreover, the Vizhinjam project is expected to transform the region into a shipping hub for India. The first phase of this project is set to be completed by 2024, with further developments planned to attract more investment into the region. Economically, it is a more viable and sustainable option compared to the time-consuming and resource-intensive Little Andaman project.
Back in the 1970s, the early plan was to start in Hawaii Kai. Cuz Kalanianaole was only 4 lanes (2 lanes each way), and commute traffic was a bitch. Especially if you lived in Hawaii Kai. There was also a big discussion about putting a parallel freeway off-shore on the reef. Can you imagine the environmental impact ruckus of that. Not to mention if it was even possible.
So, you like to make fun of people's accent? This reminds me of when I was trying to learn English. Btw, go teach the locals how to speak proper English.
I worked on that rail, The general contractor was STG when I left, out of my 35 years of working in construction! STG was by far the worst company I’ve ever worked for!!! Poor planning poor communication lack of accountability!!!
Silly that they didn't want to activate the Pearl Harbor and AIRPORT Stations sooner since it's track is done - those are Stations that people would use. Delaying it's opening for completion of 2 more stations is Stupid. The Dillingham Track fiasco with relocating all Street Utility lines shows Poor planning and awareness on Rail Officials. King Street/Downtown/Ala Moana track will be similar.
@@hillyseattlenarrowstreets6087 Pearl Harbour and the Airport station are just as important as the Lagoon Drive and Kalihi Transit Center stations, and the latter two are arguably even more important for commuters that actually use TheBus and Skyline right now, as they will be the stations to have express bus service into town.
The idea of pausing construction of the system before getting to the denser part of town where it's needed most would change this from super costly but worthwhile to simply a tragic waste of money.
The problem is that if you have it start in town none of the problems it's supposed to solve are addressed. The bus is already fast in town. People that don't ride public transit would feel better I guess lol.
@@meijiishin5650it makes less sense to start in the middle of nowhere, making it useful to no one at all until the final stage of the process is complete. Had they started in Ala Moana area and moved towards airport and stadium first, it would have been useful for at least SOME things. Right now you can ride it from no where to no where and it will be like that until like 2045 when they finally finish (if they ever do). Just in time for them to close sections down for repairs and section replacement.
First cost overruns showed that starting at Kapolei was to lock in the full build b/c "Hey, it's useless until we finish it all, right?". The Big Players saw this as the greatest chance at improved property values, construction contracts and graft that they'd ever have in their lifetimes and they're milking it. Waipahu- Ala Moana's better than Kapolei - Downtown b/c buses clog streets more in town, and clogged streets are what rail's supposed to fix.
@@ChancyCthis is what ive been saying this whole time. If it started from Alamoana to the airport it could have moved a significant portion of tourist traffic off the road and just more it from Ala moana to Waikiki. This makes shorter bus trips and taxis needed in that route and decreases local traffic. Then once it goes out to pearl city it can start to meaningfully take local commuter traffic off the road. Then if it went all the way to Ko Olina it could take even more tourist traffic off the road and if they made a corresponding park and ride it could take some portion of the traffic off the road from Waianae.
@@gemanscombe4985 yea that’s a lot of words to say that they chose to be financially stupid to get what they wanted. (Something you can only really do with government programs and someone else’s money)
Great video, love that you're giving this project the attention it deserves, being the first automated metro system in the US. However at 5:12, there seems to be a slight error, as the 2nd segment is actually the only one opening in 2025, while the 3rd segment is planned for 2031 and the 4th segment still has a date yet to be decided.
you seem quite well informed! I planned the earlier schedule, the operations revenue was supposed to be 2025 until Alo Moana Center. 3 years were wasted when then CEO tried to procure bids using PPP delivery method
You hit the main problem slightly at the 11:45 mark. All you need to do is ask, "why would they start at the section that is least useful and move into the more populous area? Wouldn't the smart move be to start where it does the most good and grow out?" The answer is obviously yes. The reason they did it backwards is to drastically underestimate costs and create massive sunk costs making the project financially unstoppable. If they had build a couple miles downtown, going from Ala Moana to the airport, swinging through downtown FIRST, then the rail could have been useful early on, and slowly built out as the funds became available. Since they started in the middle of nowhere, they have spent a decade and billions of dollars for something that has literally NO ONE riding it. Their estimates haven't just been wrong, they have been off by orders of magnitude. This is all to create a project that, as your last quote says "we can't stop now" I live in Hawaii and every time I see a rail car go by completely empty I get more and more annoyed. Such mismanagement that if it was a private company and not the government, it would have gone bankrupt a decade ago and half the management would have been indicted on money laundering charges. But since this is the government, we just pay more taxes for no gain.
The problem with building from the populated areas first is that they needed a rail yard and operations center. There’s no suitable land in the populated areas for a rail yard and operations/maintenance center.
@ That answer sounds nice, but the main rail yard now is by leeward college. Meaning they started like 10 miles west of their planned rail yard and spend a decade building towards it. Had they built the rail yard in the exact same position but came at it from the east, it would have been able to open up nearly the same time, but be useful. It’s all a mess. I have had a number of conversations with people who love the idea, and in the end everyone always ends up agreeing, even if under their breath, “yea it’s been mismanaged badly.”
The rail is being built to connect the new hotels in the west side as well as the new 50billion stadium that'll be the new down town in the next 50 years they told people it was for the Islanders but in reality they built them for the visitors 🤷 Don't get mad at the carts being empty 50 years before they are to actually start being used 🥴
@@ChancyC Haole boy talkin about hawaii like he got all the ideas now lol. It wasn't just budget pressure. Rail had a history of being killed at the final hour. This is the third time the project has been greenlit. Obviously they were going to build out as much as they could. Not to mention, nobody has a problem with bus in town. I'd bet $100 you've never rode bus more than 5 times, so idk why you're so mad about this project like you would have ever used it.
Overall the Slyline still can be a good project, however having the first section opened be so close to but not even connecting to the airport, and having many of the completed stations located on highways requiring an additional bus ride to get to destinations riders would actually want to travel to really makes it seem like a "train to nowhere" which makes it look quite bad in the moment.
I live in Kapolei and work in Pearl City. Since the traffic is so bad I have to leave 1 hour to travel 7 miles down H1 heading east towards Honolulu in the morning. The only riders I know use it are people who used the bus before. They never had cars to begin with. The Kapolei station was initially suppose to go all the way to the Ka Makana mall but the rail abruptly stops because they were hitting water with the pilings. It’s been very disruptive during the construction of the first phase. I see and travel along side it everyday I work.
At that time remember where the Kapolei station is located, they were allowed to build w/o a fully executed sale price agreed to. They built a** backwards to be able to use the sunk cost fallacy saying we've come this far, we can't stop now. Comedian Tumua even jokes about them not running past Kapolei into Nanakuli and Waianae due to perceptions of the people.
@@frikitiki They built backwards because firstly there's literally nowhere anywhere near town large enough to hold a railyard. Their current one was basically gifted to them and if not for that, the railyard would've been located in Kapolei. It only would've made sense to build out from the railyard itself for a phased opening like was planned. Secondly, It's significantly more convenient to build a station first, and the communities afterwards so the people that move in have an operational system from the get-go. If Hoopili was built before Skyline, they'd have to go through the same issues and inconvenience that people in Dillingham are experiencing right now.
I've been on Oahu for several years now, live in Waikiki and work downtown, have no car and ride da'bus everyday.... It works great for me... Honolulu, like many cities HAD a rail transport system, but tore up the tracks and slapped Hawaii's only highway right thru Honolulu (Ho-No-LuLu not Ha-Na-LuLu) and divided the city into two, destroying entire neighborhoods and creating constant noise, traffic congestion and ramp chaos... Absolutely TERRIBLE Urban Planning... NO MASTER PLAN leads to Bad City Life.
Before the last mayor of Honolulu left office, he opted to not renew the ceo of HARTs contract. He worked on multiple well known transit projects. The former mayor then brought in his own friend as the replacement … her experience is trash management. Whole project stinks of corruption & red tape.
@@slimkhalifa766 funnily enough the trash management lady saved the rail project more money than the actual rail guy though lol. Mauka shift was Lori's idea.
As a local in O'ahu, this is a very well detailed and researched video. As also a government employee for the City and County of Honolulu, I would say in the long run once the rail is completed and hopefully extended to its original plan from Kapolei Hale to University of Hawai'i at Mānoa it will be truly beneficial and utilized much more. Right now due to the limited stops it's not being utilized but once completed you will be seeing a lot more locals and students using this transit! Mahalo nui loa!
This isn't well researched at all. The TH-camr incorrectly states twice in the video that Honolulu Rail Transit will end at Ala Moana Shopping Center. The Ala Moana segment was cancelled in 2022, after Mayor Rick Blangiardi proposed trimming it, and the Federal Transit Authority (FTA) approved the change. But even if it did reach Ala Moana a hundred years from now, it is IMPOSSIBLE to extend it to the University of Hawai‘i at Mānoa. This is because of a 45-story high rise condominium being built at 1631 Kapi‘olani Boulevard - as well as a new 36-story building closer to the Convention Center - physically block any extension. The Honolulu Department of Planning and Permitting (DPP) - who approved these towers - apparently knew very early on that a UH Mānoa segment was just “fake news” designed to attract support for the train. 🚆💰☠️
I live in Vancouver, and this looks a lot like our Skytrain system. Elevated rail, light rail, commuter system automated trains, its got everything our skytrain system has.
Except that the one in Vancouver actually connects the downtown with the airport; Oahu’s train thus far has been pretty useless as it stands in the middle of several little suburbs
How can such a relatively simple civic project can cause such discord? Corruption, Incompetence, Ancient Tribal Burial Ground!? King Kamehameha is shaking his head…
VERY much need to extend this to Nanakuli via the Ko Olina Resorts!! The H1 is a nightmare to the west here! Also need to go East to the University area!!
They could easily build the rail at grade on the old sugar cane rail road tracks. It would save a ton if money. I don't know what they were thinking. The rail could've easily went all the way to nanakuli and the resorts out there also. There's so much space, it should also have a small extension that actually goes all the way to Kapolei.
@@aaronkamakaze2967 A lot of those tracks are owned by the railway society, the city doesn't have the right-of-way to do it in some areas. Would be nice though.
loved this video! I think you've done a great job explaining the rail issue on our island. I'm hoping somehow in the future we can get an extension to UH and further west, and that when the new stadium is built the rail will be prioritized instead of personal transport by car. I've taken the rail a fair amount of times already and I really like how safe and clean it feels, especially given the automated platform doors.
Corruption and idiocy are major reasons. Doesn't take much thought to see that when a project's price tag increases ten fold from when it started there are some serious questions about those in control.
Can't remember if it was for everywhere or just USA... I saw an article or maybe video that showed that all or nearly all rail projects go over budget... At this time, Hart had the contract & approval, but didn't start work yet, iirc. But they were trying to convince the public, that they wouldn't blow up the budget.
For all the troubles that rail transport suffers, especially passenger rail, the automotive industry and energy corporations can be directly blamed, as sell as the airline industry in certain cases.
The cracks in the columns comes from what they did to them; they were designed and built properly but then after the fact they decided "Oh hey, let's take a few inches off to carve in a design along DBZ way." Which, as you could imagine caused structural problems.
Ayo a video on Hawaii ?! Let's goooo ! Personally this thing doesn't come anywhere remotely near where I live so it serves next to zero purpose for me . I still think it's for the best in the long run (the way the project went about could've been VASTLY more thought out and better executed) . Once the rails get expanded and more places get a station for access is when I'll consider using it .
@@AL-lh2ht Oahu has a population of a little less than one million. That means that for ever single adult and child on Oahu they have a tax burden of over 11K just to build the Skyline. That ignores the fact that the Skyline will never generate a profit so it will need to be subsidized each year. Then there is the fact that this only serves a fairly small part of the population of the island as it goes along less than 20 miles of the island and will only have 19 stops. This isn't a fairly robust system like the Metro in NYC, Sound / King transit in Seattle or JR in Japan. All of those I have used and are excellent. I cannot see Skyline approaching anything even remotely as effective as those systems. Remember that 11B is for a shortened version that was approved by tax payers. That provides stations that lack basic amenities like toilets open to the public.
Where do you live? There's bus connections to almost any neighbourhood along its route and during commuter hours buses that come as frequently as the trains do.
@@Komainu959 And why does Skyline have to generate a profit in order for it to be useful? Freeways are 100% subsidised, yet we don't question them. It also does, in fact, serve a sizable amount of the population, and it is not a standalone system and never was intended to be. Oahu has a robust and expansive bus system that will get you from every neighbourhood along its alignment to the nearest station, and from my experience it is more than sufficient for general commuting needs. The "shortened" version in question is only two stops less, and while admittedly this cuts off service to the largest transit hub on the island, most commuters would likely only go as far as the central business district to begin with, and there is more than adequate bus service from there.
This is why I hate so much bureaucracy. The USA is the worst offender of bureaucracy for infrastructure projects. We are so behind the rest of the world in terms of high speed rail.
Yet when it comes to throwing bad money after worse when building and maintaining stuperhighways, there appears to be an endless budget for some reason....
It's only a good call if it gets riders. The problem is it could be replaced with a bus line with how few riders it is getting, and they keep trimming stations off the end (which was all the important stops like the university of Hawaii and Ala Moana Shopping Center, which has the facilities and space to be the main bus hub of the city). Even if it goes to Civic center, Civic center doesn't have the space to be the main bus hub like Ala Moana is, and you've already lost the ten thousand potential bus riders from the university. No one would have gone elevated rail for this route back when it was $5.2 billion. Now that the cost has doubled and expected ridership is swirling the toilet the only thing keeping this project going is "it is too late to stop" and the Federal government is paying for the last piece since $600 million in federal funding is reserved for the final stage. But even that might be at risk given how far out of compliance the project has gone and the incoming Trump administration might be aggressive in cutting costs even if it gets the Federal and state government into a lawsuit.
@accordiongordon But they aren't building all of it. In fact they aren't even building the most important stops. This is like building a baseball diamond with only enough money to make the infield, and then counting on crowds to show up.
We are a small island. Projects like this will cost 10x more than other places. Plus may be a lot of corruption and folks creating challenges for the project.
Size is NOT a factor. Look at the rails systems in Singapore and Hong Kong. Singapore is half the size of Oahu. 6 lines and adding 2 more. More than 140 stations. Clean, safe, efficient, fast and frequent. Trains run every 6 minutes. 2 to 4 minute during peak periods.
@@daviejz6698 You are forgetting about density and population. The current population of Oahu doesn't support the cost of the rail. It is a money pit that the tax payers are going to pay forever.
@@CraigFThompson Straw man argument.. So wasting resources for Stuper Rail projects in Hawaii is justifiable b/c of other stuper highways in other states? Ask yourself, who was going to ride the rail first? Answer, hardly anyone
Welcome to 1980s technology. Vancouver has had a driverless LRT system since 1986 in the form of the SkyTrain. Probably the most successful LRT in all of North America
This can be compared to a fairly long nine-mile expansion of the light rail SAN DIEGO TROLLEY system that was recently completed in my hometown of San Diego, connecting Old Town with an extension that largely was built elevated for seven of the nine miles up through parts of La Jolla and through the sprawling campus of University of California San Diego in La Jolla…unlike the Hawaii Skyline, however, the process went smoothly here (as it was an extension of an extensive and well run transit system that had been extended several times in its forty year history and now stretches more than twenty five miles north from the US Mexico border up to the UCSD campus and 15 miles east into El Cajon)..It was finished three months EARLY as well as almost $100 million UNDER its $4 billion budget
in many ways it reminds me of the mess that is Rome's Line C. Costs have ballooned astronomically, archaeological remains have stumped the project (leading to the loss of one station and the dramatic redesigning of several others), the construction was subdivided in segments (instead of doing the whole thing in one go) and they started with the least useful bit.
It's a good future proof project but it needs to run 24/7/365 and have Transit Oriented Developments built at each station site for it to really get use like Vancouver or Hong Kong...
absolutely right. No money is spent on TOD. I worked with Japanese funded project in Manila, they thoughtfully planned TOD. In Honolulu, we dont plan for TOD
@@jimotto1134 Which is exactly what the stuperhighways have always been since the first cupful of concrete was placed for their initial construction; the "Hitler strips" have never earned so much as one red cent in tolls or special motorist taxes, but have guzzled more than a trillion dollars annually in general tax funds....
A pretty good summary of the HART system but you left out the fact the system was to serve the University of Hawaii, Manoa but it was short-stopped at Ala Moana . UHM is the number one commuter destination , not downtown. Also you left out the fact that SIDA (State Independent Taxi Association) tied up the project in lawsuits to prevent the rail from serving the airport. And thereby cutting into their lucrative. Waikiki to HNL business. I was there when convicted felon and city counsel woman, Rene Mansho cast the killer vote to prevent funding the project 30 years ago. The vote was to impose a ½ of 1% tax increase for 10 years to fund the project . No doubt the project would have been already completed by now at considerable savings if not for her. The project does not terminate at Kapolei but in a deserted sugar cane field. What were they thinking? I suspect lack of service to Waikiki has something to do with those pesky taxi drivers.
The worst planning and filled with criticism in general, research and more research should have been done to prevent delays for more then 15 years and still not finished since 2009 and public input by tax payers should have voted or given a right of choice. The Public in general had no choice it was forced by government . People knows it 😊will be more then 40 years to build completely, let alone Aloha Stadium is another issue other's dont realize it take an eternity for Hawaii project to build anything on Small little island.
Similar situation in Las Vegas with the LV Monorail. It was supposed to go to McCarren Airport, but it didn't go to the airport cause of the Taxi Lobby there.
Most of the video was correct but I have one correction. At 12:07, that 19,000 number is the estimate for phase 2. Not phase 1. Phase 1 was for around 10k riders. The number has climbed to around 4k in recent months but it's still pretty off the mark.
Construction started long before 2011. I live in Waipahu, the rail bridge over the H-1 at Waipahu and the line west to Kapolei was already under construction by 2007.
You should look at the final environmental impact statement, table 3-12. It projected that after 10 years of full time operation of the full 20 mile Kapolei to Ala Moana route, the rail will reduce daily car trips by ~48k, but it also projected that total daily car trips would be ~2.8 million, giving you a total improvement of… drum roll please, 1.7%. Woohoo! Also note that was with daily ridership of 116k. Now that the route has been shortened to just east of downtown, 1.2 miles short of Ala Moana, the ridership estimate has dropped to 84k, more than 27% less, so the 1.7% improvement is undoubtedly overstated. Great deal for $525 to $565 million per mile and $94 million in operating costs in 2024, increasing to over $150 million per year in 2030, even before the shortened route to the imaginary “civic center” is completed.
Having just returned from Honolulu today, I was wondering what the heck was up with this thing. This video explains things perfectly! From my perspective and what I saw, I think the main issue is it simply just doesn’t run anywhere worth riding. You still need a car or bus to drive to the stops. So you certainly aren’t going to have many tourists taking this thing in its current state. You can also make the argument that the above ground system is a bit of an eyesore and disrupts some previous beautiful landscapes. Clearly lot of issues behind the scenes that need to be fixed- government incompetence and poor planning at the frontline of these problems. Great video!
I live in oahu as well and yeah so far it's not being used but I mean Me and my friends use it all the time, but I wish it went to Milllani and then all the way to town.
The issue with the rail is it just doesn't go to a lot of places where people actually want to go. If it can be expanded into the city, with off shoots to places like Salt Lake and UH it would really help with traffic
Hainan in China. Exists. 600km ring high speed rail on a tropical island with same conditions. Ironically often called as "Hawaii of China". Same elevated design. Same huricanes, mountains and complicated soil. Not mentioning, that it's connected to the mainland rail system with ferry. Yes. Trains are entering the ferry, crossing the sea, and reentering the rail system.
The ferry trains are not that uncommon. That's how Sicily is connected to mainland Italy. There also is a train between Stockholm and Berlin, that takes the ferry across the Baltic sea. There even used to be a ferry train on the lake Constance between Austria, Germany and Switzerland. But that's in the past.
The key ingredients are China's weak property rights, small chances to fight the government and overall much cheaper construction costs. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if some corners may have been cut, since it's, sadly, still a common occurrence in China. Of course, the US is on the other end of the spectrum, together with the UK and Canada, for building extremely slow and extremely expensive, being basically a joke at this point. Any democratic country has better examples than China. There's France, Spain, Japan and Korea.
The key ingredients are China's weak property rights, small chances to fight the government and overall much cheaper construction costs. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if some corners may have been cut, since it's, sadly, still a common occurrence in China. Of course, the US is on the other end of the spectrum, together with the UK and Canada, for building extremely slow and extremely expensive, being basically a joke at this point. Any democratic country has better examples than China. There's France, Spain, Japan and Korea.
@@martinbruhn5274 i was about to mention Sicily. Done that crossing many many times, i am looking forward to the bridge though, cause it normally takes over an hour between disconnecting the cars, fitting them piece by piece in the ferry and then putting them back together on the other side, and if you're doing this trip in the summer, the whole time you have no electricity and so no AC. The bridge would cut all that down to a few minutes, especially on HSR.
@@martinbruhn5274 They are. Train system of Europe are good too indeed. I added it to highlight infrastructure of railway system of tropical island of China, of almost same Latitude and weather conditions, compared to Hawaii.
This rail is a huge headache due to many different diverse factors, but i am impressed that they were able to accomplish what they did. I really hope that this reduces my traffic.
I've been following this since the very beginning (from afar) and still scratch my head as to why they didn't start from the city centre. Aloha Stadium to Ala Moana Center... instead, it became a vanity project. It has to be completed for everyone's interests, but good luck convincing Congress to fund future rail projects.
Mate, as soon as they started explanaing where construction began, within 30 seconds I thought to myself. "Well they started at the wrong end of the track" 🤦♂️ Something so glaringly obvious! How can that be overlooked? Start at the city, establish an instant clientele after stage one where the population is greatest, then use those profits to pour back into stage 2 and only build as the demand increases from the city towards the outskirts. This is how every city has been built since the beginning of time, they have done this entire project backwards 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🚝 No coincidence that the train itself doesn't distinguish from front or back, because it even looks like it could be driving backwards. Also it doesn't have a pilot in the actual train, when it appears that the entire project doesn't have a pilot. The train mimicks the project. Backwards. and driverless. Painful to watch. poor locals. ❤️🩹🚝🤦♂️👑
I get that the outer population wants to get into the city, but essentially they are trying to build a bridge 32km long. That is what I call a bridge too far. 🚟🌁🏝
They started far outside of the city's centre because it would've been too costly finding a place to put a railyard anywhere near Honolulu proper. The stations were built in "the middle of open fields" because those areas are currently under heavy development and it would be significantly easier to build the station first and have the rest of the communities built around it. Yes, there are many things that could've been done better, but as someone who uses it (in all of its limited fashion) regularly to commute now, I only hold support for this project and push for its completion, at all costs.
They (the proponents of the rail) did it strategically to keep the costs down until they were at a point where the project couldn't be canceled. They under reported what the costs were gonna be and they knew when the construction got into the urban areas, the prices were gonna go thru the roof. If they had started logically from Ala Moana to the airport.... it would have been shut down years ago. They knew exactly what they were doing starting the project backwards.
@@smizu1442 If they started in Ala Moana, we wouldn't HAVE any sort of system because there's literally no room to put a railyard anywhere near town. Their current baseyard next to LCC was practically gifted to them, and if not for that, the contingent baseyard would've been in Kapolei, exactly where they started building it.
It was my understanding that the initial plan was to run the rail between UH Manoa and UH West Oahu so that students could easily transit between campuses if they had classes at both campuses.
8 freeway lanes only being able to move 40,000 people per day is just pathetic. The Shinjuku Station in Tokyo moves 3,000,000+ through it per day. Cars are just too expensive and space inefficient to make any sense as the only mode of transit unless you like being broke and in traffic all the time.
I remember being very young and seeing places before the rail was built. I remember a lot of caution signs and stuff, and being scared that something happened because I didn't understand what was up. I basically grew up with it, I saw it getting longer and longer as I grew. I never rode it before, I always wondered what it'd be like, but the cracking and unstable roads always scared me off.
0:35 My father served as the press secretary for Mayor Fasi and led this ambitious project. His name is Jack Teehan, and you can find information about him. The project progressed to a final vote, where it was decided by a single individual, Ben Cayetano, a name well-known in Hawaii. At that time, he was the head of Hawaii's Department of Transportation and rejected the project, asserting that the existing bus system was adequate.
@@PeterTeehan We could have quadrupled bus transportation and made all the fares free for a small fraction of this disgusting, backward disaster. Corruption, theft, bribery, etc. Cayetano knew what a fiasco this would be. In time, though, with enough lies, incompetence, and graft this unmitigated disaster was foisted upon residents. If I had a relative even remotely connected to this disaster the last thing I would do is admit my association.
@@TheTroyallen23 Most of the funding from the original was going to be federally funded. Not entirely sure what this idiotic plan is. I left home in 1995. We go back every couple of years or so. Always reminds me why I left. Aloha Nui Loa.
@@PeterTeehan The HOV line could have been made exclusively for buses and emergency vehicles. As this has turned out, almost nobody will ride it. The county says they have only 3,000 riding the rail now using the 65 percent that is finished. I know for sure this is a lie because my house is in visible space of the line. My son sat on our porch one day, all day, because he wanted to count riders. He says that most runs have 0 or 1 person riding. The most riders he say was 5 or 6. I realize that people can get on and off at different points, but the county numbers just don't add up. . I don't think anyone really believes anything they say with a culture of lies and deceipt.
The mistake was starting in the area least busy first. While more expensive initially, starting in the city then going west would already have a population center that could use the service more often than what it is now.
They did this because they needed a place to build a railyard, and the areas they started are being developed, so those communities could be built around the Skyline stations instead of the other way around.
As someone who has lived on Oahu their whole life, I couldn't help myself but laugh anytime he mentioned the traffic getting worse, and H1 being an absolute nightmare 😂 because facts
The biggest challenge with certain locations of Oahu is everything of note is in Honolulu increasing ease of access to Honolulu from areas like Waikiki would easily make my life better
The state should build a bridge from Hickam to ewa and fix the punaho exit. The bridge would fix afternoon traffic giving alternate routes to go westbound. It would also help morning traffic allowing commuters to get to work faster. Fixing the punaho exit would get rid of a majority of morning traffic allowing traffic to flow to past without stopping. Even when the rail is complete it won’t work because of poor planning. Parking is limited, stops are poorly planned out and there won’t be enough coverage to meet peoples schedules. We’re billions of dollars invested in this thing and on top of that it’s not finished. Please help spread the word about the bridge and punaho exit if you truly care about the traffic issue.
@@RK-my3lq don't they add alternative transit like buses, trams, biking, etc. for last the leg/last mile of the trip. If the various schools have the highest traffic dedicated shuttle services and perhaps dedicated bus/tram lanes during peak hours from the closest station might be the play
@ We do have that. In the morning we have a zipper lane allowing only buses, motorcycles and multi passenger cars in. And theres still traffic in that lane. Dedicating it to only buses wouldn’t do much either because once they reach the end of the zipper they will just have to sit in traffic.
Ultimately the whole thing needs to reach the University of Hawai'i at Manoa in order to cut down on traffic. Commuter students will use it and won't have to worry about parking, as well as faculty and staff. Even the federal government commented as much in one of the earlier proposals on the project.
Haha, at $366 million per kilometer, this railway better be made out of gold, diamonds, and a little bit of magic! ✨ I mean, at that price, the tracks should come with built-in Wi-Fi, air conditioning, and maybe even a personal butler for each passenger, right? 😅
Now that you mention it, I just realized that the HART Skyline is more expensive than the Jakarta-Bandung HSR that was completed last year. For context, it went over budget up to US$7,3 Billion for a 142 km HSR and that is around US$50 Million per km.
I use to live in Pearl City, this was going to be an improvement over the 1-2hr drives I made to work. When I left in '09, the station across from Sam's was getting started, so I was looking forward to it being done when I came back. Well here we are, 15 years later, still not done, still having issues. I closed my business due to all the regulations, unions, etc., and moved elsewhere. I have my own heartburn, but this does not surprise me one bit.
The cost is way out of line. In round numbers, $11,000 million/20 miles = $550 million/mile. The Oakland Airport BART Connector is a driverless elevated railway that cost $500 million for 3.2 miles = $156 million/mile. I bet there are a lot of Hawaii construction folks with new Tesla's in their three car garage.
As far as transportation costs are concerned, there should be more attention paid to all the excessive governmental oversubsidization dumped on stuperhighways and air travel....
They lied to the population from the start. They said there would be all these local jobs but locals didn't have the industrial knowledge so many mainland contractors were brought in. They started a tax they said would sunset after 20 years for the construction and the operating costs would be covered by fares. They they said they needed the tax permanently to cover the operations expense. You used the term at grade and elevated but they kept saying it would be light rail meaning at grade. I went to meetings where they kept saying light rail and I didn't open my mouth. At the end of the meeting I asked the rail "expert" and he said yeah, he should have been calling in heavy rail. We were told a larger plan going into Waikiki and UH was going to be $4B and then they cut those two lines and you mention the costs overrun. In order to get the plan, they started in the really easy area for land to come into the city center thereby using the sunk cost fallacy to keep up with the building. They also lied to get one of the city council people to vote for it. It was supposed to run into a heavy residential area called Salt Lake near the airport to bring workers into Waikiki. Once Ron Menor gave his approval for the plan and it was signed by the Mayor, the route through Salt Lake was removed. The terminus now Ala Moana center with expected 24K/day passengers. The next most populous stop was downtown with 11K/day so more than double. Since they removed the routes into Waikiki and UH, they would need busses every 8 minutes in the AM and every 4 minutes in the afternoon to get people to/from UH and Waikiki to Ala Moana. I could go on with other items but I'll leave with this last item. Panos who ran for many is a UH Civil Engineering professor who is sought after world wide for projects dealing with rail. The construction and bus union did EVERYTHING in their power to make sure he didn't get in because he pointed out how bad of a plan it was.
Light rail just means that the trains themselves are theoretically capable of running at grade, although many transit lines will run them on elevated or underground tracks. But yeah it makes no sense to do extra construction and serve fewer people.
You should make a video about the Newcastle Australia and all the big construction projects that are happening there e.g. the airport and the new container port
So many inaccuracies in this video, but let's start with the basics: 1) The rail line is not going to Ala Moana (which would still leave it missing the last mile to get to Waikiki). While that was the original plan, that has now been abandoned. Even the part past Middle Street is now off the table due to funding and land ownership issues. Among other things, 40-story buildings have been built on the original proposed path for the rail (their construction actually enabled by the hypothetical rail line). The part of the rail that was built is the easy part, over agricultural land. It has now reached the city, where land ownership is entangled under several centuries of history going back to the Kingdom days. 2) HART's own estimates are now that rail will not remove even 5% of the current traffic from city streets. 3) When the plebiscite was taken for the rail, it just said "Should there be a rail line?". At that time projected cost was about $3B, of which the feds would pay half. It was also implied that the rail line would reach the University of Hawaii, a major contributor to traffic. The rail is now coming in at a finished cost closer to $20B, with no increase in the federal contribution. That leaves Hawaii on the hook for the bill. 4) Honolulu is actually quite a small city, similar in size to Toledo, Ohio. We lack the tax base of, say, California, to be able to pay for projects of this magnitude. The greater than $100M/yr operating budget will be taken at a loss. In reality, the rail system is the largest land scam in Hawaii in the last 100 years. It's purpose is actually to rezone tracts of land around the rail stations as transit-oriented development. As a result, relatively worthless, generally industrial land suddenly became worth billions per acre. This has given rise to a frenzy of construction of 40-story (the tallest in the state) ultraluxury condo projects. These reach costs of millions of dollars per unit, far beyond local affordability, and are mostly sold to foreign investors. A handful of people got very, very rich from this rail system, and the locals just got extra taxes.
I remember the councilman of salt lake didn't approve of the project so they made a rail line that passed through salt lake. The rail was approved and salt lake was cut out of the line for the airport. This entire project was a money laundering operation headed by Mufi.
So many inaccuracies in your fact check. Skyline was never planned to go to Waikiki or UH Manoa, that was only explored as a further option once we got to Ala Moana. The part past middle street will be completed and is still on the table. The last sections of land needed for the stations are currently undergoing eminent domain. There are no buildings that obstruct the construction of Skyline, with one hypothetical building (it's been an empty lot for the past decade) being in the way of any future planned route. The "worthless" industrial land you are talking about is in Kakaako, and yes while it is being developed into ultraluxury housing for foreign investors, it was never meant to be a transit oriented development. In fact the developers (Howard Hughes) have been in court with HART trying to demand more money out of them for the land that they acquired through eminent domain. The "Ward Village" development would have happened whether or not Skyline was being built, because it was started before Skyline was a serious topic. While their own estimates state that Skyline won't remove any more than 5% of traffic, that is still a lot of cars nonetheless. Anyone would be foolish *to* drive knowing the time and money they could've saved by taking Skyline and TheBus instead of being stuck in traffic congestion. As someone who almost regularly uses it, commuting using it and TheBus is in most cases significantly faster than driving during peak rush hour. And even if so, what would the reality be if the hadn't built it? We don't have the space for more freeway lanes, and ultimately more freeway lanes would induce more traffic to begin with, since most housing growth is happening out in the west side. The Skyline project was estimated to be ~4B dollars, with the feds contributing slightly less than a quarter if I am not correct. The full project is estimated to be 11B, not your 20B that you state. The operating cost is also $85M, not over 100M like you state. While we will take a loss, it's not like we don't take a loss on highways, which people also spend up to 60 hours a year stuck in while degrading the health and mental well being of everyone who lives within a mile of it. Skyline is not, was not, and never will be a scam. As someone who uses it, it is disappointing that it was not built earlier as it removes nearly all stress and friction from my commute and is much faster and cheaper than driving (and all of its associated costs). We also need transit oriented development. Endless sprawl has only fueled car dependency on our island and this has led to us having the worst traffic congestion in the country. We need dense development, because we have a severe housing shortage and a limited amount of land to house said people on it. Skyline was not an excuse to rezone land around its stations. In fact, out in the west side a master plan to make Kapolei the "second city" was in the works for decades, which envisioned transforming all of the agricultural land into housing to address our affordability and congestion crisis. Skyline actually improved this (already existing plans), by then changing much of that into denser transit oriented development that would house more people and stimulating local economic activity.
@@georgemann3369 yes, it was originally planned to go to Manoa. “The plan also includes $2.7 billion for mass-transit projects, including $2.5 billion for a fixed-rail system between Kapolei and Manoa.” Star Bulletin 2/19/2006 The original full funding grant agreement with the FTA, 12/19/2012, specified 20.1 miles, 21 stations completed by 1/31/2020 for $5,121,693,163. The FTA approved 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan specified 18.9 miles, 19 stations ending at the imaginary “civic center” completed in 2031 for $9.933 billion. The final 1.2 miles and two stations are estimated to cost $1.367 billion for a total of $11.3 billion to Ala Moana, but no timeline is given since there’s no funding available. In fact, the city center estimate came in over $300 million higher than hart’s $1.3 billion “estimate,” so they’re considering delaying certain items. “Near the top of the list is a proposal to save more than $60 million by delaying installation of seven units of Static Synchronous Compensation Equipment, known as “STATCOMs.” Those are supposed to stabilize the voltage of the electrical supply in West Oahu when the rail line is busy.” civil beat 9/5/2024 The final EIS, table 3-12, estimated that rail will reduce traffic by ~1.7% after 10 years are full time operation, roughly 48k out of 2.8 million cars. That was based on 116,340 daily riders. Now that daily ridership for the truncated route has dropped to 84,005 (hart 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan), that will undoubtedly be lower. “The rail system is now expected to cost the city $94 million to operate in its first year, including $54 million paid to the rail’s operator, Hitachi Rail Honolulu, according to Roger Morton, the city’s Transportation Services director. ” civil beat 5/10/2023 “The result means that Skyline will have generated $617,441 in revenue during its first year of operation.” staradvertiser 6/30/2024 According to hart’s 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan, O&M will exceed $150 million by 2030, even before the truncated route is completed in 2031.
Firstly the line needs to be finished. It needs to have actual destinations people want to go to or else ridership will never be enough to pay for its running costs! Secondly pay for it via a tourist tax/overnight stay fee increase. Thirdly allow towers of unlimited height but with no car parking spaces to be built within 750 yards of all train stations. Within 10 years you have a great daily ridership of hotel guests, office workers and residents all using the rail line to get about. Very few people are going to use the line of you jave to get off the train and catch a bus the final 3 miles!
Alot of pocketing forsure, but i see the project in an optimistic view. When it does open up to Middle Street, it'll definitely help with traffic. Hopefully there are plans to extend west at least up to Ko Olina.
I was stationed in Hawaii for the Navy from 2011 - 2016 and would have to say, they should change their motto to the traffic jam state, so yes I think this is something that is needed. However, the amount of time they are taking to finish this makes me sick, but doesn't surprise me either. I lived close enough to Kamehameha highway to be able to watch them work on this from my balcony and the sheer amount of just sitting around they did was disgusting. I could be over egadurating, but it seemed like they would work maybe 30 minutes in an 8 hour shift? I noticed the workers would sit around and chat for hours on end getting nothing done, now whether this was because of waiting on materials or because they were encouraged by their company to do so, so that they could make more money I couldn't say. Either way, the sheer slow pace that this thing is being built, at the over budgeting shows yet another example of a government project that is struggling.
you aren't exaggerating at all, its been years and they have hardly done anything past the airport but can at least say the section near aloha stadium/pearl is running so its "successful", despite being empty almost every day meanwhile it already has serious issues breaking down and people needing to walk all the way off already
@@fish_activity Those have happened a couple times, due to automated safety systems stopping the trains where the train cannot connect to the third rail system. They are rare occurrences and are not serious issues that shouldn't be used to damper the fact that the network as a whole has a ~99.4% on time rate (with "on time" being considered within 10 seconds of schedule)
I ride the Skyline 4 out of 5 days. I get on at Stadium and ride to West Loch. I think the rail needs to go farther, to Waianae to help relieve some traffic issues and relieve riders coming in from the far west side. heck, why not go over the mountain to Kaneohe/Kailua area or MCBH?
"Consequences" suggests there isn't benefits to Skyline. While construction has been a debacle, the current system already saves me a significant amount of time during my commute, and I almost always beat those I know that still (somehow) choose to brave the H-1 during rush hour.
Hi MegaBuilds, you should consider doing a video about Singapore's Tuas Megaport. It is a massive construction project on reclaimed land and when fully complete will be the world's largest port.
It sounds like you do not/or never lived on Oahu. It is NOT going to happen, for a simple reason, GEOGRAPHY. There "used to be" a railroad that went from Kalihi, to Barbers Point, up the Waianae coast, around Kaena Point, to Haleiwa, to Kahuku. The PROBLEM is part of the coast north of Makaha to Kaena Point is basically along the base of a cliff. Parts of the old RR right of way, and later jeep road, have slid down into the ocean. Construction and maintenance there will be a bitch, since you have to construct inward from both ends and you do not have much/any working area, and cost will be $$$$$$$$. There is a reason that there is NO road around Kaena Point. On the other end at Makapuu Point, it will have to go through residential Hawaii Kai $$$$$$, out the back end, then tunnel $$$$$ through the end of the Koolau. Then you have the problem of going up the windward coast, which is NOT the flat land of leaward Oahu. What is the PROBLEM that your round the island rain is trying to solve? Relieving traffic is/was a major goal of the rail system. But there is VERY LITTLE population or business up the Waianae coast, North Shore, and northern half of the Windward coast. So who would your round the island rail be for, the tourists?
With a big project like this, people just need to give it time to get build out. It's still under construction, and luckily, they seem to be on track to finish the other segments in the near future. Once the downtown and airport segments are finished, it'll be very useful. This is great news and I'd love to visit when it's finished. Keep in mind, the great metro systems around the world were not built in a day. I saw their are proposals to expand to the University and Waikiki and other areas which would be great to see in the future. There's a valid argument that it costs too much when other countries could build for less. Ultimately, it comes down to bureaucracy and poor management which was mentioned in the video. Metro systems in America need to start streamlining design and engineering in-house. A lot of that cost is paying other people to come in a do the work for way more, taking up valuable resources and time. If we had design, engineering teams for these metro systems, the cost for these projects wouldn't be so astronomical, and we could see regular expansions to our metro systems rather than once a decade. That being said, it is difficult to compete against free (go figure). By that, I mean, highways are subsidized by an insane margin that it's no wonder cities opt for building them instead of public transportation. Long term as cities are finding out, they can't keep up with the infrastructure cost of these huge highways that take up valuable space away from urban development. It's not sustainable how we build our infrastructure in the US. It needs to change. Deregulate!
2/19/2006: 28 miles Kapolei to Manoa, $2.5 billion 3/1/2007: 20 miles Kapolei to Ala Moana, $3.6 billion Full funding grant agreement with the FTA: 12/19/2012: Kapolei to Ala Moana, 20 miles, 21 stations, completed by 1/31/2020, $5.12 billion 11/9/2021: Kapolei to Ala Moana, 20 miles, 21 stations, $12.45 billion, completed in 2031 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan: 18.9 miles, 19 stations, $9.933 billion, updated to $10.065 billion
@@ryana9796 It's nice to live in a dream world. But when you wake you're faced with a rail that wont take you anywhere you want to go. I know bus riders who switched to the rail and they say it takes about as long as riding the bus. First they wait for and ride a bus to a rail hub - no park and ride as promised since most were taken from the original plan to provide graft to the criminal here; then you climb the tower and wait for and ride the rail; then you wait for another bus to take you from the middle of nowhere to your destination. And rail supporters still think spending 13-15 billion is a good idea! Remember the lies about the added excise tax ending next year. They're permanent now. Also, anyone who can add numbers will quickly figure out that current revenue wont support the rail at any level of completion. More taxes in the future. For a rail that will not reduce traffic. For more than a decade rail supporters here have been proven wrong about everything and they will continue to be wrong. Meanwhile, homelessness has skyrocketed, our schools are continually rated in the bottom 10 percent in the nation, a ten percent State income tax rate, rail officials under investigation by the FBI. I could go on, but it's just too depressing. I wish I could live in your world of endless optimism.
I wish they would've started in Honolulu instead of Kapolei because I'd definitely use it more. However, the times the rail is open isn't conducive for their ridership (last rides end at 7 PM). Hopefully once they finish the second segment in Kalihi, they'll get more people riding to Pearls and the stadium and they can open later once they get it all the way done, but only time will tell.
The most absolute WORST example of "government malfeasance" would be the trillion-dollar annual cost of the wasteful and inefficient stuperhighway network....
5:13 only the second segment will open in 2025, the third will open 2031 and the fourth is not in the current budget so it is not known if it even will be built
I don't live in Hawaii, but it's definitely worth it. One thing I thought is illogical is why did they start building it from the boondocks to downtown and not the other way around? Why would anyone be surprised that ridership at this point is only 3,000 per day? Did they do this just because it's cheaper to build out in nowhere? They still need to build the rest. I can't imagine New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Vancouver, etc., not building their subway systems from the center outward.
Excellent observation...they (the proponents of the rail) did it strategically to keep the costs down until they were at a point where the project couldn't be canceled. They under reported what the costs were gonna be and they knew when the construction got into the urban areas, the prices were gonna go thru the roof. If they had started logically from Ala Moana to the airport.... it would have been shut down years ago. They knew exactly what they were doing starting the project backwards.
There's no space to store and or service the trains if they build from town. The storage yard is out in Kapolei. So if they did build from Honolulu to Kapolei, the system wouldn't be running until it's finished. Just my observations.
Rail sucks I ran for office as anti rail because we need since the 1960s that it would not be sustainable or logical we mass transit for a place with less than 900k population and the linear limitations was always asinine by pure common sense. The 15 billion it will cost means that we could have given each family $40k to by their own cars the. .5 percent Get tax killing us too
A big part of the reason they started it six miles west of the rail yard/operations center in Pearl City is so they could build as much as possible as fast as possible in order to make it more difficult to stop. Our former mayor Carlisle admitted that in no uncertain terms. “Mayor Carlisle, now a lame duck, says he will ‘do everything [he] can to get rail far enough along so that it cannot possibly be stopped’” the transport politic 8/18/2012 At a minimum of $525 million per mile or more, the scamline is probably the world’s most expensive project of its type on a per capita basis. Remember we have ~1 million inhabitants paying for the majority of this 18.9 mile, 19 station, $10 billion project. If they complete the final 1.2 miles and two stations to Ala Moana (20.1 miles total) as originally contracted with the FTA, hart’s 6/3/2022 “recovery plan” claims the cost will be $11.3 billion, or $565 million per mile. Operations and maintenance (O&M)expense is what will kill us though. In their first year of operations, O&M was ~$94 million against revenues of $617k. By 2030, O&M is projected to exceed $150 million, even before the shortened route to the imaginary “civic center” is completed. The difference between the fare box collections and O&M is paid out of Honolulu’s general fund, 80% of which comes from our property taxes. Do you see where this is going? “It was a short answer to a loaded question: How much will rail operations and maintenance cost Oahu property owners in taxes? The response (from deputy director of the city Department of Budget and Fiscal Services Gary Kurokawa) was that broadly speaking and ‘using today’s numbers,’ property taxpayers can expect to see a 9 percent increase in rates to subsidize annual operational costs for the 20-mile rail system when it comes online in late 2021.” Star Advertiser 1/26/2016
If you have traveled in Europe by car the first thing you notice is that there is almost no parking in the large cities. We went to Paris (it used to be the most beautiful city in the world IMO). Had a rental car we picked up in Marseille. We opted to stay in hotel in a suburb 20 miles out of the city. Good thing. There is no parking in Paris that I could see. We took the train into the city center and used buses or walked thereafter. Did the same in Rome and London. US all major cities have huge parking garages everywhere. These parking garages are what kill rail transportation. Cities need to change zoning to end 1 apartment or so many sq ft of office space have to have 2 parking spaces requirements. Making parking expensive and hard to find and people will look for alternatives.
FyI the area which the rail is built on doesn't include "steep cliffs" nor "volcanoes" rather very level land. Additionally the cost is rising exponentially with no end in sight as they built the easy part first and are getting to the hardest part now.
You know some of the issues. First, when the contractor for the rail was chosen, Hitachi said they would bring the project in on time and on budget. They chose number 25, whose parent company was just then indicted for graft. Also, the city never precured right of way in the city core of Kakaako, which was an industrial area. Instead, they approved building plans of luxury towers and raising the cost of a sq ft from $550 to $800, making it more expensive to buy a right of way. Panos Povaderous was an engineering professor at the University of Hawaii. Everything he said has come true. He gave up on Honolulu after decades of trying to improve infrastructure but getting heavy push back from politicians.
Using steel in concrete construction is the normal procedure, making sure the steel inside the concrete doesn't rust is a problem, ask the folks in Miami where that apartment building fell down or the folks over in Italy who had a big bridge failure. Cracking is the first sign of problems. Reagan is often blamed for cutting money from the budget but the real cost cutter was Carter, he looked at the spending on the DC metro and nearly tore his hair out. Yea, that was out of control. These cost numbers are pretty wicked but this is Hawaii, remember that EVERYTHING had to be brought in from the mainland and getting coordination between both sides becomes awfully expensive. There are no railway experts on Hawaii, at one time they had some but that was in the past. Having government agencies build something makes it cost more, often a lot more. Too often government bureaucrats are put in charge of something that they known little or nothing about, this usually doesn't work out well. Way back when, the private companies that built the bulk of the existing NYC transit system did so rather quickly and it's been in service for over 100 years now so I guess it was pretty good, it's taken over 40 years to build the very limited Second Ave. subway in Manhattan promised to residents in the 1950s being built by a government agency.
It depends on the expertice, capacities, and liberties given to the transit agency. There's a reason that Europe (with extensive govermental control over public transit), and even Latin America are able to construct and provide extensive transit: giving more power over to the transit agency
I look at this rail everyday on my way to work and back. I don’t have official rider numbers but by a visual head count, NOBODY rides it. Mufi got the backing of the unions to get that vote. Kiewit Construction screwed up the first leg big time. And HART was absolutely corrupt. You did a good job covering this. Oh and it’s Ka Ka A Ko. lol.
I ride it regularly, but yes it is very limited right now, lot of people on it during commute hours I’ve noticed though. Next year supposed to go to the airport and Kalihi transit center, which will definitely make it more useful.
100,000 people a month isn't "nobody". I'm not "nobody". You're supposed to take a bus to skyline, that's how it works. Skyline goes to many population centers, and saying that they aren't "anywhere good" does a massive disservice to those living there.
@@Wisdom808 For now. They are supposed to all be Transit Oriented Developments infilled at each stop much like Vancouver are they not? And limited hours don't help... Who though 7 PM was a good cut off time? Honestly...
our generation's grandchildren will benefit from this rail sure, but for now its going to be a pain in the ass for many more years before its even efficiently up and running enough to make any of that money back
Devolving traffic? Do you want to elaborate? Also, why blame rail projects for "sucking you dry" while the white elephant that is H-1 gets a free pass?
The thing about building expensive public transit is that while it's easy to be horrified by the costs when it's being planned and built, once it exists nobody ever regrets building it. You quickly forget about the money, start using it all the time and become appreciative that it exists. You often find people opposed to future tram/train/subway lines, but you rarely hear people in cities that have those things say they wish they'd never been built.
11 billion is _quite_ alot to try and make a return on investment for, it wont be completed for another 10 years and the costs are likely to keep rising. It’s also not open 24/7 which limits some revenue. Hawaii is already one of the most expensive states and people are feeling the tax burdens
Building a train system makes sense in a growing city but Honolulu has a shrinking population. Locals are being forced to move away due to high taxes and out of control cost of living. The average home costs a million bucks and there are no jobs. Only kind of jobs in Honolulu are waiting tables and cleaning hotel rooms. These are minimum wages jobs. The taxes and rents are out of control. People can't afford to live here. Building this stupid rail line will only make it more expensive to live here. So who is going to ride this rail? Who is going to pay for this rail? The answer is nobody. It is an albatross that bankrupt the city and doom its population to perpetual poverty. I also doubt it will ever be finished.
@lancew71 lol. China has reliable world class mass transit systems that have been in operation for decades. The quality in China is many times better than what is being built in Hawaii. Not even comparable
Build it with cheap materials not structurally safe, with slave labor, and no safety checks. Then forget maintenance and have the whole thing collapse the economy
Why not tax the billionaires who are buying all the land, and the tourists who's numbers are always increasing. But first let's start with Billionaires like The Meta CEO who is buying enough land to make his own private country, unacceptable meanwhile he is doing nothing for the community so take his money god sake
@@Trashman702 to preserve our land, yes foreign billionaires that only visit here a few times a year should be taxed a premium to have property here. Non locals / kanaka should also be on leases not ownership
I think this will make them more money in the long run. We didn't really even mention that tourism is a huge part of the economy. Having good transit makes it a city destination people can see more of. And that mean people will be visiting more locations and more taxes spent at businesses like hotels and restaurants. Less money spent resurfacing roads for Ubers and rental cars. Also good for carbon footprint.
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What do you think? Is building the Skyline worth it? Thanks a lot for watching 💛
Please cover Riyadh metro, it's first metro in Saudi with six lines and costing 22.5 billion dollars. It will launch this month. Would love to see a video about it's delays, the project success or failure and the 7th line to Qiddiya that was announced.
Please Hindi Dubbed 😍
8:42 - What up with that? First verse in a rap song?
The Little Andaman project is not a sustainable initiative compared to the second project located in Vizhinjam in Kerala. The Vizhinjam project is strategically positioned near an international trade route, making it a better choice for trade purposes. While the Little Andaman project raises significant environmental concerns, the Vizhinjam project does not face such issues.
With the ongoing economic boom in India, the Vikas Bharat initiative appears more viable and economically promising. The Vizhinjam project, with its proximity to Thiruvananthapuram, promotes regional development and benefits nearby cities. This government-backed initiative strengthens the economy by facilitating mother ship connections, making it a key player in enhancing India's trade capabilities.
Moreover, the Vizhinjam project is expected to transform the region into a shipping hub for India. The first phase of this project is set to be completed by 2024, with further developments planned to attract more investment into the region. Economically, it is a more viable and sustainable option compared to the time-consuming and resource-intensive Little Andaman project.
If the gov spent 50 years to talk, plan, and budget, just tunnel bore it and get it done by the time finish talking.
I almost lost it when he said Kaka’ako. Great video, dude. Really taught me a lot about how long these plans have been around.
Back in the 1970s, the early plan was to start in Hawaii Kai. Cuz Kalanianaole was only 4 lanes (2 lanes each way), and commute traffic was a bitch. Especially if you lived in Hawaii Kai.
There was also a big discussion about putting a parallel freeway off-shore on the reef. Can you imagine the environmental impact ruckus of that. Not to mention if it was even possible.
12:20start watching if you wanna hear him say that... brah you made me sit thru all that common knowledge *for us its common*.
kaka ko had me laughing
So, you like to make fun of people's accent? This reminds me of when I was trying to learn English.
Btw, go teach the locals how to speak proper English.
@@SV-kr9futhey're not making fun or mocking him in any way. its always amusing to hear.
you, on the other hand, are just being a bigot.
I worked on that rail, The general contractor was STG when I left, out of my 35 years of working in construction! STG was by far the worst company I’ve ever worked for!!! Poor planning poor communication lack of accountability!!!
Lowest bid right?
NAN INC gonna be worse.
You didnt work on it you played on it. Lol😂 hope youre well bro.
Wait till you see how tutor perini is. They will make stg look like Childs play.
True dat cuz!
7pm closing time is nuts.
Silly that they didn't want to activate the Pearl Harbor and AIRPORT Stations sooner since it's track is done - those are Stations that people would use. Delaying it's opening for completion of 2 more stations is Stupid.
The Dillingham Track fiasco with relocating all Street Utility lines shows Poor planning and awareness on Rail Officials. King Street/Downtown/Ala Moana track will be similar.
They'll extend it to at least 10:30pm when phase 2 opens.
@@hillyseattlenarrowstreets6087 Pearl Harbour and the Airport station are just as important as the Lagoon Drive and Kalihi Transit Center stations, and the latter two are arguably even more important for commuters that actually use TheBus and Skyline right now, as they will be the stations to have express bus service into town.
Right? I work night shifts in sand island and live ewa beach, I’d honestly consider the rail if it ran later
@bradleya98 no one cares about it being used at night because traffic decreases on the H1 after 7
The idea of pausing construction of the system before getting to the denser part of town where it's needed most would change this from super costly but worthwhile to simply a tragic waste of money.
The problem is that if you have it start in town none of the problems it's supposed to solve are addressed. The bus is already fast in town. People that don't ride public transit would feel better I guess lol.
@@meijiishin5650it makes less sense to start in the middle of nowhere, making it useful to no one at all until the final stage of the process is complete.
Had they started in Ala Moana area and moved towards airport and stadium first, it would have been useful for at least SOME things. Right now you can ride it from no where to no where and it will be like that until like 2045 when they finally finish (if they ever do). Just in time for them to close sections down for repairs and section replacement.
First cost overruns showed that starting at Kapolei was to lock in the full build b/c "Hey, it's useless until we finish it all, right?". The Big Players saw this as the greatest chance at improved property values, construction contracts and graft that they'd ever have in their lifetimes and they're milking it. Waipahu- Ala Moana's better than Kapolei - Downtown b/c buses clog streets more in town, and clogged streets are what rail's supposed to fix.
@@ChancyCthis is what ive been saying this whole time. If it started from Alamoana to the airport it could have moved a significant portion of tourist traffic off the road and just more it from Ala moana to Waikiki. This makes shorter bus trips and taxis needed in that route and decreases local traffic.
Then once it goes out to pearl city it can start to meaningfully take local commuter traffic off the road. Then if it went all the way to Ko Olina it could take even more tourist traffic off the road and if they made a corresponding park and ride it could take some portion of the traffic off the road from Waianae.
@@gemanscombe4985 yea that’s a lot of words to say that they chose to be financially stupid to get what they wanted. (Something you can only really do with government programs and someone else’s money)
Great video, love that you're giving this project the attention it deserves, being the first automated metro system in the US. However at 5:12, there seems to be a slight error, as the 2nd segment is actually the only one opening in 2025, while the 3rd segment is planned for 2031 and the 4th segment still has a date yet to be decided.
you seem quite well informed! I planned the earlier schedule, the operations revenue was supposed to be 2025 until Alo Moana Center. 3 years were wasted when then CEO tried to procure bids using PPP delivery method
You hit the main problem slightly at the 11:45 mark. All you need to do is ask, "why would they start at the section that is least useful and move into the more populous area? Wouldn't the smart move be to start where it does the most good and grow out?" The answer is obviously yes. The reason they did it backwards is to drastically underestimate costs and create massive sunk costs making the project financially unstoppable.
If they had build a couple miles downtown, going from Ala Moana to the airport, swinging through downtown FIRST, then the rail could have been useful early on, and slowly built out as the funds became available. Since they started in the middle of nowhere, they have spent a decade and billions of dollars for something that has literally NO ONE riding it. Their estimates haven't just been wrong, they have been off by orders of magnitude.
This is all to create a project that, as your last quote says "we can't stop now"
I live in Hawaii and every time I see a rail car go by completely empty I get more and more annoyed. Such mismanagement that if it was a private company and not the government, it would have gone bankrupt a decade ago and half the management would have been indicted on money laundering charges. But since this is the government, we just pay more taxes for no gain.
The problem with building from the populated areas first is that they needed a rail yard and operations center. There’s no suitable land in the populated areas for a rail yard and operations/maintenance center.
@ That answer sounds nice, but the main rail yard now is by leeward college. Meaning they started like 10 miles west of their planned rail yard and spend a decade building towards it.
Had they built the rail yard in the exact same position but came at it from the east, it would have been able to open up nearly the same time, but be useful.
It’s all a mess. I have had a number of conversations with people who love the idea, and in the end everyone always ends up agreeing, even if under their breath, “yea it’s been mismanaged badly.”
@ okay, that’s a fair point.
The rail is being built to connect the new hotels in the west side as well as the new 50billion stadium that'll be the new down town in the next 50 years they told people it was for the Islanders but in reality they built them for the visitors 🤷
Don't get mad at the carts being empty 50 years before they are to actually start being used 🥴
@@ChancyC Haole boy talkin about hawaii like he got all the ideas now lol.
It wasn't just budget pressure. Rail had a history of being killed at the final hour. This is the third time the project has been greenlit. Obviously they were going to build out as much as they could.
Not to mention, nobody has a problem with bus in town. I'd bet $100 you've never rode bus more than 5 times, so idk why you're so mad about this project like you would have ever used it.
Overall the Slyline still can be a good project, however having the first section opened be so close to but not even connecting to the airport, and having many of the completed stations located on highways requiring an additional bus ride to get to destinations riders would actually want to travel to really makes it seem like a "train to nowhere" which makes it look quite bad in the moment.
I live in Kapolei and work in Pearl City. Since the traffic is so bad I have to leave 1 hour to travel 7 miles down H1 heading east towards Honolulu in the morning. The only riders I know use it are people who used the bus before. They never had cars to begin with.
The Kapolei station was initially suppose to go all the way to the Ka Makana mall but the rail abruptly stops because they were hitting water with the pilings.
It’s been very disruptive during the construction of the first phase. I see and travel along side it everyday I work.
At that time remember where the Kapolei station is located, they were allowed to build w/o a fully executed sale price agreed to. They built a** backwards to be able to use the sunk cost fallacy saying we've come this far, we can't stop now. Comedian Tumua even jokes about them not running past Kapolei into Nanakuli and Waianae due to perceptions of the people.
@@frikitiki They built backwards because firstly there's literally nowhere anywhere near town large enough to hold a railyard. Their current one was basically gifted to them and if not for that, the railyard would've been located in Kapolei. It only would've made sense to build out from the railyard itself for a phased opening like was planned. Secondly, It's significantly more convenient to build a station first, and the communities afterwards so the people that move in have an operational system from the get-go. If Hoopili was built before Skyline, they'd have to go through the same issues and inconvenience that people in Dillingham are experiencing right now.
I've been on Oahu for several years now, live in Waikiki and work downtown, have no car and ride da'bus everyday.... It works great for me... Honolulu, like many cities HAD a rail transport system, but tore up the tracks and slapped Hawaii's only highway right thru Honolulu (Ho-No-LuLu not Ha-Na-LuLu) and divided the city into two, destroying entire neighborhoods and creating constant noise, traffic congestion and ramp chaos... Absolutely TERRIBLE Urban Planning... NO MASTER PLAN leads to Bad City Life.
@@AHLUser They didn't do this. The rail transport was from the 1920's. Stop sensationalizing.
@@georgemann3369spot on about why they couldn’t start from the populated areas first
Before the last mayor of Honolulu left office, he opted to not renew the ceo of HARTs contract. He worked on multiple well known transit projects. The former mayor then brought in his own friend as the replacement … her experience is trash management. Whole project stinks of corruption & red tape.
City and County is full of favoritism/nepotism, so much incompetence in the management positions. Honolulu is doomed!
@@meegssan5716 That's why we refer to it as the "Sitting and Counting" of Honolulu. LOL!
I’m pissed none of these people are not investigated and put in jail. The public can’t do shit about this problem.
@@sushi0085 well, you know the old saying.... it's not who you know, it's who *I* know.... LOL!!
@@slimkhalifa766 funnily enough the trash management lady saved the rail project more money than the actual rail guy though lol. Mauka shift was Lori's idea.
Great video! Glad to see our rail system getting more attention. If only this had been done in the 90s
Wait are you Frank Fasi's grandson? Small world.
As a local in O'ahu, this is a very well detailed and researched video. As also a government employee for the City and County of Honolulu, I would say in the long run once the rail is completed and hopefully extended to its original plan from Kapolei Hale to University of Hawai'i at Mānoa it will be truly beneficial and utilized much more. Right now due to the limited stops it's not being utilized but once completed you will be seeing a lot more locals and students using this transit!
Mahalo nui loa!
This isn't well researched at all. The TH-camr incorrectly states twice in the video that Honolulu Rail Transit will end at Ala Moana Shopping Center.
The Ala Moana segment was cancelled in 2022, after Mayor Rick Blangiardi proposed trimming it, and the Federal Transit Authority (FTA) approved the change.
But even if it did reach Ala Moana a hundred years from now, it is IMPOSSIBLE to extend it to the University of Hawai‘i at Mānoa. This is because of a 45-story high rise condominium being built at 1631 Kapi‘olani Boulevard - as well as a new 36-story building closer to the Convention Center - physically block any extension.
The Honolulu Department of Planning and Permitting (DPP) - who approved these towers - apparently knew very early on that a UH Mānoa segment was just “fake news” designed to attract support for the train. 🚆💰☠️
we rode it... it quickly gets you from nowhere anyone is to nowhere anyone wants to go. good job.
So Kapolei, Waipahu, Pearl City, and Aiea is "nowhere anyone is"?
@@georgemann3369yep
Why do Americans have such a hard time to understand that walking in general or between public transits is a viable option 😭
@@georgemann3369 Correct.
u can use it and take a bus lol cuts down travel time by alot depending on your needs.
I live in Vancouver, and this looks a lot like our Skytrain system. Elevated rail, light rail, commuter system automated trains, its got everything our skytrain system has.
which is better Seattle or Vancouver?
@@pranshukrishna5105obv Vancouver cause we have great rapid busses the sea bus amazing regional busses, 3 trains and excellent times
And we got the SkyTrain back in 1986 😅
Here on Oahu, it’s now called The Skyline.
Except that the one in Vancouver actually connects the downtown with the airport; Oahu’s train thus far has been pretty useless as it stands in the middle of several little suburbs
How can such a relatively simple civic project can cause such discord?
Corruption, Incompetence, Ancient Tribal Burial Ground!? King Kamehameha is shaking his head…
We who living here are shaking our heads "No-No", while the big Property Developers are nodding their heads "YES-YES"...!!
Ok so what are the people going to do?
Stop the project completely?
That will never happen! At some point it will finish…
VERY much need to extend this to Nanakuli via the Ko Olina Resorts!! The H1 is a nightmare to the west here! Also need to go East to the University area!!
Agree, it should at least go to Ko Olina, and eventually Waiani in the leeward direction.
They could easily build the rail at grade on the old sugar cane rail road tracks. It would save a ton if money. I don't know what they were thinking. The rail could've easily went all the way to nanakuli and the resorts out there also. There's so much space, it should also have a small extension that actually goes all the way to Kapolei.
@@aaronkamakaze2967 bold of you to assume that CnC is capable of common sense! Haha
@@aaronkamakaze2967 A lot of those tracks are owned by the railway society, the city doesn't have the right-of-way to do it in some areas. Would be nice though.
original plan was to uh
loved this video! I think you've done a great job explaining the rail issue on our island. I'm hoping somehow in the future we can get an extension to UH and further west, and that when the new stadium is built the rail will be prioritized instead of personal transport by car. I've taken the rail a fair amount of times already and I really like how safe and clean it feels, especially given the automated platform doors.
Corruption and idiocy are major reasons. Doesn't take much thought to see that when a project's price tag increases ten fold from when it started there are some serious questions about those in control.
Can't remember if it was for everywhere or just USA... I saw an article or maybe video that showed that all or nearly all rail projects go over budget... At this time, Hart had the contract & approval, but didn't start work yet, iirc. But they were trying to convince the public, that they wouldn't blow up the budget.
Do you have an example of this corruption or is that just how you feel?
For all the troubles that rail transport suffers, especially passenger rail, the automotive industry and energy corporations can be directly blamed, as sell as the airline industry in certain cases.
The cracks in the columns comes from what they did to them; they were designed and built properly but then after the fact they decided "Oh hey, let's take a few inches off to carve in a design along DBZ way." Which, as you could imagine caused structural problems.
Ayo a video on Hawaii ?! Let's goooo !
Personally this thing doesn't come anywhere remotely near where I live so it serves next to zero purpose for me .
I still think it's for the best in the long run (the way the project went about could've been VASTLY more thought out and better executed) . Once the rails get expanded and more places get a station for access is when I'll consider using it .
The fact it will have any effect on decreasing traffic is enough to be a benefit to you
@@AL-lh2ht Oahu has a population of a little less than one million. That means that for ever single adult and child on Oahu they have a tax burden of over 11K just to build the Skyline. That ignores the fact that the Skyline will never generate a profit so it will need to be subsidized each year.
Then there is the fact that this only serves a fairly small part of the population of the island as it goes along less than 20 miles of the island and will only have 19 stops. This isn't a fairly robust system like the Metro in NYC, Sound / King transit in Seattle or JR in Japan. All of those I have used and are excellent. I cannot see Skyline approaching anything even remotely as effective as those systems.
Remember that 11B is for a shortened version that was approved by tax payers. That provides stations that lack basic amenities like toilets open to the public.
@@Komainu959No transportation generates a profit.
Where do you live? There's bus connections to almost any neighbourhood along its route and during commuter hours buses that come as frequently as the trains do.
@@Komainu959 And why does Skyline have to generate a profit in order for it to be useful? Freeways are 100% subsidised, yet we don't question them. It also does, in fact, serve a sizable amount of the population, and it is not a standalone system and never was intended to be. Oahu has a robust and expansive bus system that will get you from every neighbourhood along its alignment to the nearest station, and from my experience it is more than sufficient for general commuting needs. The "shortened" version in question is only two stops less, and while admittedly this cuts off service to the largest transit hub on the island, most commuters would likely only go as far as the central business district to begin with, and there is more than adequate bus service from there.
This is why I hate so much bureaucracy. The USA is the worst offender of bureaucracy for infrastructure projects. We are so behind the rest of the world in terms of high speed rail.
Yet when it comes to throwing bad money after worse when building and maintaining stuperhighways, there appears to be an endless budget for some reason....
We love Skyline and ride it almost every day! It's a wonderful and much needed addition to our state infrastructure.
Good call choosing an elevated rail transit. Cities with at grade rail systems experience more delays for many reasons.
Also the floodiing
It's only a good call if it gets riders. The problem is it could be replaced with a bus line with how few riders it is getting, and they keep trimming stations off the end (which was all the important stops like the university of Hawaii and Ala Moana Shopping Center, which has the facilities and space to be the main bus hub of the city). Even if it goes to Civic center, Civic center doesn't have the space to be the main bus hub like Ala Moana is, and you've already lost the ten thousand potential bus riders from the university. No one would have gone elevated rail for this route back when it was $5.2 billion. Now that the cost has doubled and expected ridership is swirling the toilet the only thing keeping this project going is "it is too late to stop" and the Federal government is paying for the last piece since $600 million in federal funding is reserved for the final stage. But even that might be at risk given how far out of compliance the project has gone and the incoming Trump administration might be aggressive in cutting costs even if it gets the Federal and state government into a lawsuit.
I wish LA figured this out
@@jofujinoif you build it they will come
@accordiongordon But they aren't building all of it. In fact they aren't even building the most important stops. This is like building a baseball diamond with only enough money to make the infield, and then counting on crowds to show up.
We are a small island. Projects like this will cost 10x more than other places. Plus may be a lot of corruption and folks creating challenges for the project.
Size is NOT a factor. Look at the rails systems in Singapore and Hong Kong. Singapore is half the size of Oahu. 6 lines and adding 2 more. More than 140 stations. Clean, safe, efficient, fast and frequent. Trains run every 6 minutes. 2 to 4 minute during peak periods.
Singapore and Hong Kong do not have to worry about DEI. The hire the most qualified candidates.
@@daviejz6698 You are forgetting about density and population. The current population of Oahu doesn't support the cost of the rail. It is a money pit that the tax payers are going to pay forever.
@@jl-io3vw Yet you remain totally silent on the trillion-dollar waste that stuperhighways represent....
@@CraigFThompson Straw man argument.. So wasting resources for Stuper Rail projects in Hawaii is justifiable b/c of other stuper highways in other states? Ask yourself, who was going to ride the rail first? Answer, hardly anyone
Welcome to 1980s technology. Vancouver has had a driverless LRT system since 1986 in the form of the SkyTrain. Probably the most successful LRT in all of North America
It's not light rail, its light METRO it's still considered heavy rail ALM automated light metro
Can’t it be considered light metro? I mean is it high floor like NYC subway?
@@nopunts9947 it is light metro don't know they are calling let 🫲🤨🫱
@@Railenroute oh thank god you got the acronym corrected for us all.
@@bmolitor615 ☝️🤓 it's not just an acronym it's whole different system
This can be compared to a fairly long nine-mile expansion of the light rail SAN DIEGO TROLLEY system that was recently completed in my hometown of San Diego, connecting Old Town with an extension that largely was built elevated for seven of the nine miles up through parts of La Jolla and through the sprawling campus of University of California San Diego in La Jolla…unlike the Hawaii Skyline, however, the process went smoothly here (as it was an extension of an extensive and well run transit system that had been extended several times in its forty year history and now stretches more than twenty five miles north from the US Mexico border up to the UCSD campus and 15 miles east into El Cajon)..It was finished three months EARLY as well as almost $100 million UNDER its $4 billion budget
And running mostly on track that already existed; very little work had to be done in the first place.
in many ways it reminds me of the mess that is Rome's Line C. Costs have ballooned astronomically, archaeological remains have stumped the project (leading to the loss of one station and the dramatic redesigning of several others), the construction was subdivided in segments (instead of doing the whole thing in one go) and they started with the least useful bit.
It's a good future proof project but it needs to run 24/7/365 and have Transit Oriented Developments built at each station site for it to really get use like Vancouver or Hong Kong...
Is 24/7 a thing? Doesn't Japan have set times to do inspections and maintenance
absolutely right. No money is spent on TOD. I worked with Japanese funded project in Manila, they thoughtfully planned TOD. In Honolulu, we dont plan for TOD
I appreciate the shade it casts when I'm driving westward during rush hour.
Excellent video! I've lived on Oahu twice in my life, and yes, it's getting increasingly *congested* , and a rail system has always been needed.
it will never alleviate anywhere close to 1% of traffic. waste of tax payer money, surrounded by corruption.
@@jimotto1134 Which is exactly what the stuperhighways have always been since the first cupful of concrete was placed for their initial construction; the "Hitler strips" have never earned so much as one red cent in tolls or special motorist taxes, but have guzzled more than a trillion dollars annually in general tax funds....
A pretty good summary of the HART system but you left out the fact the system was to serve the University of Hawaii, Manoa but it was short-stopped at Ala Moana . UHM is the number one commuter destination , not downtown.
Also you left out the fact that SIDA (State Independent Taxi Association) tied up the project in lawsuits to prevent the rail from serving the airport. And thereby cutting into their lucrative. Waikiki to HNL business.
I was there when convicted felon and city counsel woman, Rene Mansho cast the killer vote to prevent funding the project 30 years ago. The vote was to impose a ½ of 1% tax increase for 10 years to fund the project . No doubt the project would have been already completed by now at considerable savings if not for her.
The project does not terminate at Kapolei but in a deserted sugar cane field. What were they thinking?
I suspect lack of service to Waikiki has something to do with those pesky taxi drivers.
And as of now it’s still not even going to Ala Moana, but stopping at Civic Center.
The worst planning and filled with criticism in general, research and more research should have been done to prevent delays for more then 15 years and still not finished since 2009 and public input by tax payers should have voted or given a right of choice. The Public in general had no choice it was forced by government . People knows it 😊will be more then 40 years to build completely, let alone Aloha Stadium is another issue other's dont realize it take an eternity for Hawaii project to build anything on Small little island.
Similar situation in Las Vegas with the LV Monorail. It was supposed to go to McCarren Airport, but it didn't go to the airport cause of the Taxi Lobby there.
don’t forget that John DeSoto, John Henry Felix, Steve Holmes and Arnold Morgado also voted no.
Use the undertrack areas, as well. Gardens, skateboard parks, tennis courts, hoops, et cetera could use this large windfall creatively.
Totally agree.
The undertrack area is already busy streets
@@cjgairi9398This person doesn't live here😅
Most of the video was correct but I have one correction. At 12:07, that 19,000 number is the estimate for phase 2. Not phase 1. Phase 1 was for around 10k riders. The number has climbed to around 4k in recent months but it's still pretty off the mark.
I didn't know this existed when I visited. It would be a massive improvement to connect the airport to Waikiki
That would be logical, but hawaii is run by corrupt politicians and the rail won't have a stop at the airport.
There are no plans to go to Waikiki at present. The planned route to UH Manoa disappeared in 2007., iso I don’t expect that it will go there either.
Construction started long before 2011. I live in Waipahu, the rail bridge over the H-1 at Waipahu and the line west to Kapolei was already under construction by 2007.
It's Great That Hawaii Have A Train Service so Traffic Can Ease Congestion on Freeways Amazing Videos
Ahahahahahahaha!!!
sure but this train wont even get you to downtown, also 3/4's of the island cant even access it without driving far
You should look at the final environmental impact statement, table 3-12. It projected that after 10 years of full time operation of the full 20 mile Kapolei to Ala Moana route, the rail will reduce daily car trips by ~48k, but it also projected that total daily car trips would be ~2.8 million, giving you a total improvement of… drum roll please, 1.7%. Woohoo!
Also note that was with daily ridership of 116k. Now that the route has been shortened to just east of downtown, 1.2 miles short of Ala Moana, the ridership estimate has dropped to 84k, more than 27% less, so the 1.7% improvement is undoubtedly overstated.
Great deal for $525 to $565 million per mile and $94 million in operating costs in 2024, increasing to over $150 million per year in 2030, even before the shortened route to the imaginary “civic center” is completed.
@@ren96706so swap out car lanes for dedicated bus/tram lanes to get to the station and also final leg of the trip ?
@@gsn794 Still much cheaper than an equivalent-capacity stuperhighway....
Having just returned from Honolulu today, I was wondering what the heck was up with this thing. This video explains things perfectly! From my perspective and what I saw, I think the main issue is it simply just doesn’t run anywhere worth riding. You still need a car or bus to drive to the stops. So you certainly aren’t going to have many tourists taking this thing in its current state. You can also make the argument that the above ground system is a bit of an eyesore and disrupts some previous beautiful landscapes. Clearly lot of issues behind the scenes that need to be fixed- government incompetence and poor planning at the frontline of these problems. Great video!
You hit the nail on the head with "doesn't run anywhere worth riding".
I live in oahu as well and yeah so far it's not being used but I mean Me and my friends use it all the time, but I wish it went to Milllani and then all the way to town.
When the next phase opens they're gonna make at least one all-day express to central from the pearl highlands station
The issue with the rail is it just doesn't go to a lot of places where people actually want to go. If it can be expanded into the city, with off shoots to places like Salt Lake and UH it would really help with traffic
Its planned to go in the city, said city has the wst traffic in the US.
Salt Lake councilman voted against the rail, so the rail bypassed Salt Lake. Need to vote-in wiser councilman.
big fan as always
Hainan in China. Exists. 600km ring high speed rail on a tropical island with same conditions. Ironically often called as "Hawaii of China". Same elevated design. Same huricanes, mountains and complicated soil. Not mentioning, that it's connected to the mainland rail system with ferry. Yes. Trains are entering the ferry, crossing the sea, and reentering the rail system.
The ferry trains are not that uncommon. That's how Sicily is connected to mainland Italy. There also is a train between Stockholm and Berlin, that takes the ferry across the Baltic sea. There even used to be a ferry train on the lake Constance between Austria, Germany and Switzerland. But that's in the past.
The key ingredients are China's weak property rights, small chances to fight the government and overall much cheaper construction costs. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if some corners may have been cut, since it's, sadly, still a common occurrence in China.
Of course, the US is on the other end of the spectrum, together with the UK and Canada, for building extremely slow and extremely expensive, being basically a joke at this point.
Any democratic country has better examples than China. There's France, Spain, Japan and Korea.
The key ingredients are China's weak property rights, small chances to fight the government and overall much cheaper construction costs. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if some corners may have been cut, since it's, sadly, still a common occurrence in China.
Of course, the US is on the other end of the spectrum, together with the UK and Canada, for building extremely slow and extremely expensive, being basically a joke at this point.
Any democratic country has better examples than China. There's France, Spain, Japan and Korea.
@@martinbruhn5274 i was about to mention Sicily. Done that crossing many many times, i am looking forward to the bridge though, cause it normally takes over an hour between disconnecting the cars, fitting them piece by piece in the ferry and then putting them back together on the other side, and if you're doing this trip in the summer, the whole time you have no electricity and so no AC. The bridge would cut all that down to a few minutes, especially on HSR.
@@martinbruhn5274 They are. Train system of Europe are good too indeed. I added it to highlight infrastructure of railway system of tropical island of China, of almost same Latitude and weather conditions, compared to Hawaii.
I wanted to take the train to my hotel in a few weeks but the airport station isn’t even open yet. Ridership will be huge once everything is open.
This "hi tech" solution has been running in Copenhagen since 2004
Same in London. For decades 😂
Vancouver as well since 1985
Yup. Hi tech for America... Which is like 80's pop being current in Russia now... ;-)
Lille, France since 1983!
Singapore since 1987
Good job on pronunciation of Hawaiian place names.
Only one short-coming: "Kaka'ako" has two a's in a row, with *both pronounced* , as in "Kaka-ako".
This rail is a huge headache due to many different diverse factors, but i am impressed that they were able to accomplish what they did. I really hope that this reduces my traffic.
I've been following this since the very beginning (from afar) and still scratch my head as to why they didn't start from the city centre.
Aloha Stadium to Ala Moana Center... instead, it became a vanity project.
It has to be completed for everyone's interests, but good luck convincing Congress to fund future rail projects.
Mate, as soon as they started explanaing where construction began, within 30 seconds I thought to myself. "Well they started at the wrong end of the track" 🤦♂️
Something so glaringly obvious!
How can that be overlooked?
Start at the city, establish an instant clientele after stage one where the population is greatest, then use those profits to pour back into stage 2 and only build as the demand increases from the city towards the outskirts.
This is how every city has been built since the beginning of time, they have done this entire project backwards 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🚝
No coincidence that the train itself doesn't distinguish from front or back, because it even looks like it could be driving backwards.
Also it doesn't have a pilot in the actual train, when it appears that the entire project doesn't have a pilot.
The train mimicks the project.
Backwards. and driverless.
Painful to watch.
poor locals. ❤️🩹🚝🤦♂️👑
I get that the outer population wants to get into the city, but essentially they are trying to build a bridge 32km long.
That is what I call a bridge too far. 🚟🌁🏝
They started far outside of the city's centre because it would've been too costly finding a place to put a railyard anywhere near Honolulu proper. The stations were built in "the middle of open fields" because those areas are currently under heavy development and it would be significantly easier to build the station first and have the rest of the communities built around it.
Yes, there are many things that could've been done better, but as someone who uses it (in all of its limited fashion) regularly to commute now, I only hold support for this project and push for its completion, at all costs.
They (the proponents of the rail) did it strategically to keep the costs down until they were at a point where the project couldn't be canceled. They under reported what the costs were gonna be and they knew when the construction got into the urban areas, the prices were gonna go thru the roof. If they had started logically from Ala Moana to the airport.... it would have been shut down years ago. They knew exactly what they were doing starting the project backwards.
@@smizu1442 If they started in Ala Moana, we wouldn't HAVE any sort of system because there's literally no room to put a railyard anywhere near town. Their current baseyard next to LCC was practically gifted to them, and if not for that, the contingent baseyard would've been in Kapolei, exactly where they started building it.
It was my understanding that the initial plan was to run the rail between UH Manoa and UH West Oahu so that students could easily transit between campuses if they had classes at both campuses.
8 freeway lanes only being able to move 40,000 people per day is just pathetic. The Shinjuku Station in Tokyo moves 3,000,000+ through it per day. Cars are just too expensive and space inefficient to make any sense as the only mode of transit unless you like being broke and in traffic all the time.
Car and oil industry corrupted the US' urban planning I can imagine. The US used to have trams/trolleys everywhere
I remember being very young and seeing places before the rail was built. I remember a lot of caution signs and stuff, and being scared that something happened because I didn't understand what was up. I basically grew up with it, I saw it getting longer and longer as I grew. I never rode it before, I always wondered what it'd be like, but the cracking and unstable roads always scared me off.
0:35 My father served as the press secretary for Mayor Fasi and led this ambitious project. His name is Jack Teehan, and you can find information about him. The project progressed to a final vote, where it was decided by a single individual, Ben Cayetano, a name well-known in Hawaii. At that time, he was the head of Hawaii's Department of Transportation and rejected the project, asserting that the existing bus system was adequate.
@@PeterTeehan We could have quadrupled bus transportation and made all the fares free for a small fraction of this disgusting, backward disaster. Corruption, theft, bribery, etc. Cayetano knew what a fiasco this would be. In time, though, with enough lies, incompetence, and graft this unmitigated disaster was foisted upon residents. If I had a relative even remotely connected to this disaster the last thing I would do is admit my association.
@@TheTroyallen23 Most of the funding from the original was going to be federally funded. Not entirely sure what this idiotic plan is. I left home in 1995. We go back every couple of years or so. Always reminds me why I left. Aloha Nui Loa.
@@TheTroyallen23 Furthermore, the idea is to minimize traffic - more busses would just make matters worse.
@@PeterTeehan The HOV line could have been made exclusively for buses and emergency vehicles. As this has turned out, almost nobody will ride it. The county says they have only 3,000 riding the rail now using the 65 percent that is finished. I know for sure this is a lie because my house is in visible space of the line. My son sat on our porch one day, all day, because he wanted to count riders. He says that most runs have 0 or 1 person riding. The most riders he say was 5 or 6. I realize that people can get on and off at different points, but the county numbers just don't add up. . I don't think anyone really believes anything they say with a culture of lies and deceipt.
@@TheTroyallen23 No matter what you do with a bus, it'll ALWAYS be just another AUTOMOBILE out there....
BUSES SELL PRIVATE CARS.
Appreciate the efforts in annunciation 🙌
The mistake was starting in the area least busy first. While more expensive initially, starting in the city then going west would already have a population center that could use the service more often than what it is now.
They did this because it was the first part they were allowed to start construction.
They did this because they needed a place to build a railyard, and the areas they started are being developed, so those communities could be built around the Skyline stations instead of the other way around.
too many objections by the public when it was planned to start at the city center
As someone who has lived on Oahu their whole life, I couldn't help myself but laugh anytime he mentioned the traffic getting worse, and H1 being an absolute nightmare 😂 because facts
I think it'll be worth it in the long run. Right now though... not really doing anything.
The biggest challenge with certain locations of Oahu is everything of note is in Honolulu increasing ease of access to Honolulu from areas like Waikiki would easily make my life better
The state should build a bridge from Hickam to ewa and fix the punaho exit. The bridge would fix afternoon traffic giving alternate routes to go westbound. It would also help morning traffic allowing commuters to get to work faster. Fixing the punaho exit would get rid of a majority of morning traffic allowing traffic to flow to past without stopping. Even when the rail is complete it won’t work because of poor planning. Parking is limited, stops are poorly planned out and there won’t be enough coverage to meet peoples schedules. We’re billions of dollars invested in this thing and on top of that it’s not finished. Please help spread the word about the bridge and punaho exit if you truly care about the traffic issue.
@@RK-my3lq don't they add alternative transit like buses, trams, biking, etc. for last the leg/last mile of the trip. If the various schools have the highest traffic dedicated shuttle services and perhaps dedicated bus/tram lanes during peak hours from the closest station might be the play
@ We do have that. In the morning we have a zipper lane allowing only buses, motorcycles and multi passenger cars in. And theres still traffic in that lane. Dedicating it to only buses wouldn’t do much either because once they reach the end of the zipper they will just have to sit in traffic.
@@RK-my3lq is that for in city roads/streets or only on the highway/freeway?
@@Cryosxify it’s only on the highway. The way our roads are mapped out it would be impossible to implement an only bus lane in the city.
@RK-my3lq could just be temporary for rush hour between the closest station and the high traffic destinations
Ultimately the whole thing needs to reach the University of Hawai'i at Manoa in order to cut down on traffic. Commuter students will use it and won't have to worry about parking, as well as faculty and staff. Even the federal government commented as much in one of the earlier proposals on the project.
There are countries like china , having more than 10,000 km of metro but also some countries struggling to build 30 km metro😂
Can you think of a reason why ?
look at the quality of the chinese metro system, look at videos about the issues of the chinese metro. it isn’t sustainable for china.
You surly are looking at the wrong videos 😂😂@@denizgab2167
Surely you're watching the wrong content@@denizgab2167
@@stankythecat6735red tape, bureaucratic bloat, inferior system, democrats.
Awesome video and what a project
$366,000,000 per kilometer of built rail.
Absolute insanity.
What's it made from? Gold and diamonds?
Corruption🗿🍷
Haha, at $366 million per kilometer, this railway better be made out of gold, diamonds, and a little bit of magic! ✨ I mean, at that price, the tracks should come with built-in Wi-Fi, air conditioning, and maybe even a personal butler for each passenger, right? 😅
buddy has no idea where hawaii is on the map
Now that you mention it, I just realized that the HART Skyline is more expensive than the Jakarta-Bandung HSR that was completed last year.
For context, it went over budget up to US$7,3 Billion for a 142 km HSR and that is around US$50 Million per km.
Hawaii got ripped off, time to do a federal investigation
I use to live in Pearl City, this was going to be an improvement over the 1-2hr drives I made to work. When I left in '09, the station across from Sam's was getting started, so I was looking forward to it being done when I came back. Well here we are, 15 years later, still not done, still having issues. I closed my business due to all the regulations, unions, etc., and moved elsewhere. I have my own heartburn, but this does not surprise me one bit.
The cost is way out of line. In round numbers, $11,000 million/20 miles = $550 million/mile. The Oakland Airport BART Connector is a driverless elevated railway that cost $500 million for 3.2 miles = $156 million/mile. I bet there are a lot of Hawaii construction folks with new Tesla's in their three car garage.
As far as transportation costs are concerned, there should be more attention paid to all the excessive governmental oversubsidization dumped on stuperhighways and air travel....
They lied to the population from the start. They said there would be all these local jobs but locals didn't have the industrial knowledge so many mainland contractors were brought in. They started a tax they said would sunset after 20 years for the construction and the operating costs would be covered by fares. They they said they needed the tax permanently to cover the operations expense. You used the term at grade and elevated but they kept saying it would be light rail meaning at grade. I went to meetings where they kept saying light rail and I didn't open my mouth. At the end of the meeting I asked the rail "expert" and he said yeah, he should have been calling in heavy rail. We were told a larger plan going into Waikiki and UH was going to be $4B and then they cut those two lines and you mention the costs overrun. In order to get the plan, they started in the really easy area for land to come into the city center thereby using the sunk cost fallacy to keep up with the building. They also lied to get one of the city council people to vote for it. It was supposed to run into a heavy residential area called Salt Lake near the airport to bring workers into Waikiki. Once Ron Menor gave his approval for the plan and it was signed by the Mayor, the route through Salt Lake was removed. The terminus now Ala Moana center with expected 24K/day passengers. The next most populous stop was downtown with 11K/day so more than double. Since they removed the routes into Waikiki and UH, they would need busses every 8 minutes in the AM and every 4 minutes in the afternoon to get people to/from UH and Waikiki to Ala Moana. I could go on with other items but I'll leave with this last item. Panos who ran for many is a UH Civil Engineering professor who is sought after world wide for projects dealing with rail. The construction and bus union did EVERYTHING in their power to make sure he didn't get in because he pointed out how bad of a plan it was.
Light rail just means that the trains themselves are theoretically capable of running at grade, although many transit lines will run them on elevated or underground tracks. But yeah it makes no sense to do extra construction and serve fewer people.
You should make a video about the Newcastle Australia and all the big construction projects that are happening there e.g. the airport and the new container port
So many inaccuracies in this video, but let's start with the basics:
1) The rail line is not going to Ala Moana (which would still leave it missing the last mile to get to Waikiki). While that was the original plan, that has now been abandoned. Even the part past Middle Street is now off the table due to funding and land ownership issues. Among other things, 40-story buildings have been built on the original proposed path for the rail (their construction actually enabled by the hypothetical rail line). The part of the rail that was built is the easy part, over agricultural land. It has now reached the city, where land ownership is entangled under several centuries of history going back to the Kingdom days.
2) HART's own estimates are now that rail will not remove even 5% of the current traffic from city streets.
3) When the plebiscite was taken for the rail, it just said "Should there be a rail line?". At that time projected cost was about $3B, of which the feds would pay half. It was also implied that the rail line would reach the University of Hawaii, a major contributor to traffic. The rail is now coming in at a finished cost closer to $20B, with no increase in the federal contribution. That leaves Hawaii on the hook for the bill.
4) Honolulu is actually quite a small city, similar in size to Toledo, Ohio. We lack the tax base of, say, California, to be able to pay for projects of this magnitude. The greater than $100M/yr operating budget will be taken at a loss.
In reality, the rail system is the largest land scam in Hawaii in the last 100 years. It's purpose is actually to rezone tracts of land around the rail stations as transit-oriented development. As a result, relatively worthless, generally industrial land suddenly became worth billions per acre. This has given rise to a frenzy of construction of 40-story (the tallest in the state) ultraluxury condo projects. These reach costs of millions of dollars per unit, far beyond local affordability, and are mostly sold to foreign investors. A handful of people got very, very rich from this rail system, and the locals just got extra taxes.
I remember the councilman of salt lake didn't approve of the project so they made a rail line that passed through salt lake. The rail was approved and salt lake was cut out of the line for the airport. This entire project was a money laundering operation headed by Mufi.
So many inaccuracies in your fact check.
Skyline was never planned to go to Waikiki or UH Manoa, that was only explored as a further option once we got to Ala Moana.
The part past middle street will be completed and is still on the table. The last sections of land needed for the stations are currently undergoing eminent domain.
There are no buildings that obstruct the construction of Skyline, with one hypothetical building (it's been an empty lot for the past decade) being in the way of any future planned route.
The "worthless" industrial land you are talking about is in Kakaako, and yes while it is being developed into ultraluxury housing for foreign investors, it was never meant to be a transit oriented development. In fact the developers (Howard Hughes) have been in court with HART trying to demand more money out of them for the land that they acquired through eminent domain. The "Ward Village" development would have happened whether or not Skyline was being built, because it was started before Skyline was a serious topic.
While their own estimates state that Skyline won't remove any more than 5% of traffic, that is still a lot of cars nonetheless. Anyone would be foolish *to* drive knowing the time and money they could've saved by taking Skyline and TheBus instead of being stuck in traffic congestion. As someone who almost regularly uses it, commuting using it and TheBus is in most cases significantly faster than driving during peak rush hour. And even if so, what would the reality be if the hadn't built it? We don't have the space for more freeway lanes, and ultimately more freeway lanes would induce more traffic to begin with, since most housing growth is happening out in the west side.
The Skyline project was estimated to be ~4B dollars, with the feds contributing slightly less than a quarter if I am not correct. The full project is estimated to be 11B, not your 20B that you state.
The operating cost is also $85M, not over 100M like you state. While we will take a loss, it's not like we don't take a loss on highways, which people also spend up to 60 hours a year stuck in while degrading the health and mental well being of everyone who lives within a mile of it.
Skyline is not, was not, and never will be a scam. As someone who uses it, it is disappointing that it was not built earlier as it removes nearly all stress and friction from my commute and is much faster and cheaper than driving (and all of its associated costs). We also need transit oriented development. Endless sprawl has only fueled car dependency on our island and this has led to us having the worst traffic congestion in the country. We need dense development, because we have a severe housing shortage and a limited amount of land to house said people on it.
Skyline was not an excuse to rezone land around its stations. In fact, out in the west side a master plan to make Kapolei the "second city" was in the works for decades, which envisioned transforming all of the agricultural land into housing to address our affordability and congestion crisis. Skyline actually improved this (already existing plans), by then changing much of that into denser transit oriented development that would house more people and stimulating local economic activity.
@@georgemann3369 yes, it was originally planned to go to Manoa.
“The plan also includes $2.7 billion for mass-transit projects, including $2.5 billion for a fixed-rail system between Kapolei and Manoa.” Star Bulletin 2/19/2006
The original full funding grant agreement with the FTA, 12/19/2012, specified 20.1 miles, 21 stations completed by 1/31/2020 for $5,121,693,163. The FTA approved 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan specified 18.9 miles, 19 stations ending at the imaginary “civic center” completed in 2031 for $9.933 billion. The final 1.2 miles and two stations are estimated to cost $1.367 billion for a total of $11.3 billion to Ala Moana, but no timeline is given since there’s no funding available. In fact, the city center estimate came in over $300 million higher than hart’s $1.3 billion “estimate,” so they’re considering delaying certain items.
“Near the top of the list is a proposal to save more than $60 million by delaying installation of seven units of Static Synchronous Compensation Equipment, known as “STATCOMs.” Those are supposed to stabilize the voltage of the electrical supply in West Oahu when the rail line is busy.” civil beat 9/5/2024
The final EIS, table 3-12, estimated that rail will reduce traffic by ~1.7% after 10 years are full time operation, roughly 48k out of 2.8 million cars. That was based on 116,340 daily riders. Now that daily ridership for the truncated route has dropped to 84,005 (hart 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan), that will undoubtedly be lower.
“The rail system is now expected to cost the city $94 million to operate in its first year, including $54 million paid to the rail’s operator, Hitachi Rail Honolulu, according to Roger Morton, the city’s Transportation Services director. ” civil beat 5/10/2023
“The result means that Skyline will have generated $617,441 in revenue during its first year of operation.” staradvertiser 6/30/2024
According to hart’s 6/3/2022 “recovery” plan, O&M will exceed $150 million by 2030, even before the truncated route is completed in 2031.
@@georgemann3369this guy notjustbikes
@@Cryosxify Do you have any refutations to my fact check?
I love the shade 😂😂😂😂
Firstly the line needs to be finished. It needs to have actual destinations people want to go to or else ridership will never be enough to pay for its running costs! Secondly pay for it via a tourist tax/overnight stay fee increase. Thirdly allow towers of unlimited height but with no car parking spaces to be built within 750 yards of all train stations. Within 10 years you have a great daily ridership of hotel guests, office workers and residents all using the rail line to get about. Very few people are going to use the line of you jave to get off the train and catch a bus the final 3 miles!
However, WHEN has any stuperhighway ever earned enough of its own efforts to cover its own costs?!
NEVER!!
Alot of pocketing forsure, but i see the project in an optimistic view. When it does open up to Middle Street, it'll definitely help with traffic. Hopefully there are plans to extend west at least up to Ko Olina.
I was stationed in Hawaii for the Navy from 2011 - 2016 and would have to say, they should change their motto to the traffic jam state, so yes I think this is something that is needed. However, the amount of time they are taking to finish this makes me sick, but doesn't surprise me either. I lived close enough to Kamehameha highway to be able to watch them work on this from my balcony and the sheer amount of just sitting around they did was disgusting. I could be over egadurating, but it seemed like they would work maybe 30 minutes in an 8 hour shift? I noticed the workers would sit around and chat for hours on end getting nothing done, now whether this was because of waiting on materials or because they were encouraged by their company to do so, so that they could make more money I couldn't say. Either way, the sheer slow pace that this thing is being built, at the over budgeting shows yet another example of a government project that is struggling.
you aren't exaggerating at all, its been years and they have hardly done anything past the airport but can at least say the section near aloha stadium/pearl is running so its "successful", despite being empty almost every day
meanwhile it already has serious issues breaking down and people needing to walk all the way off already
@@fish_activity Those have happened a couple times, due to automated safety systems stopping the trains where the train cannot connect to the third rail system. They are rare occurrences and are not serious issues that shouldn't be used to damper the fact that the network as a whole has a ~99.4% on time rate (with "on time" being considered within 10 seconds of schedule)
I was in the US ARMY 🇺🇲🪖 [Schofield Barracks, HI.] from 92-95 .
I Concur
I ride the Skyline 4 out of 5 days. I get on at Stadium and ride to West Loch. I think the rail needs to go farther, to Waianae to help relieve some traffic issues and relieve riders coming in from the far west side. heck, why not go over the mountain to Kaneohe/Kailua area or MCBH?
Thanks for reporting on this debacle.
I pray that all works out as I am in Hawaii and will financially feel the consequences of what occurs.
"Consequences" suggests there isn't benefits to Skyline. While construction has been a debacle, the current system already saves me a significant amount of time during my commute, and I almost always beat those I know that still (somehow) choose to brave the H-1 during rush hour.
The first rail station is always from the airport to downtown, and then from downtown to where people go that has density
Elevated rail is the smartest move. Foot traffic is the life blood of retail, so getting tourists around easier, is ideal.
The line does not go into Waikiki.
Hi MegaBuilds, you should consider doing a video about Singapore's Tuas Megaport. It is a massive construction project on reclaimed land and when fully complete will be the world's largest port.
It should continue as a circle around the entire island
at $550 million per mile? Food luck with that.
It SHOULD, yes, but only way that would happen is if you cut out the unions and had China build it; Good luck with both of those.
It sounds like you do not/or never lived on Oahu.
It is NOT going to happen, for a simple reason, GEOGRAPHY.
There "used to be" a railroad that went from Kalihi, to Barbers Point, up the Waianae coast, around Kaena Point, to Haleiwa, to Kahuku. The PROBLEM is part of the coast north of Makaha to Kaena Point is basically along the base of a cliff. Parts of the old RR right of way, and later jeep road, have slid down into the ocean. Construction and maintenance there will be a bitch, since you have to construct inward from both ends and you do not have much/any working area, and cost will be $$$$$$$$. There is a reason that there is NO road around Kaena Point.
On the other end at Makapuu Point, it will have to go through residential Hawaii Kai $$$$$$, out the back end, then tunnel $$$$$ through the end of the Koolau.
Then you have the problem of going up the windward coast, which is NOT the flat land of leaward Oahu.
What is the PROBLEM that your round the island rain is trying to solve?
Relieving traffic is/was a major goal of the rail system.
But there is VERY LITTLE population or business up the Waianae coast, North Shore, and northern half of the Windward coast.
So who would your round the island rail be for, the tourists?
@garyn7067 tourists . . . . Which keep Oahu from being uninhabitable.
I was surprised that you used a picture of Santiago's Metro L5 to showcase the elevated option. Thank you for that!
With a big project like this, people just need to give it time to get build out. It's still under construction, and luckily, they seem to be on track to finish the other segments in the near future. Once the downtown and airport segments are finished, it'll be very useful. This is great news and I'd love to visit when it's finished. Keep in mind, the great metro systems around the world were not built in a day. I saw their are proposals to expand to the University and Waikiki and other areas which would be great to see in the future.
There's a valid argument that it costs too much when other countries could build for less. Ultimately, it comes down to bureaucracy and poor management which was mentioned in the video. Metro systems in America need to start streamlining design and engineering in-house. A lot of that cost is paying other people to come in a do the work for way more, taking up valuable resources and time. If we had design, engineering teams for these metro systems, the cost for these projects wouldn't be so astronomical, and we could see regular expansions to our metro systems rather than once a decade.
That being said, it is difficult to compete against free (go figure). By that, I mean, highways are subsidized by an insane margin that it's no wonder cities opt for building them instead of public transportation. Long term as cities are finding out, they can't keep up with the infrastructure cost of these huge highways that take up valuable space away from urban development. It's not sustainable how we build our infrastructure in the US. It needs to change. Deregulate!
2/19/2006: 28 miles Kapolei to Manoa, $2.5 billion
3/1/2007: 20 miles Kapolei to Ala Moana, $3.6 billion
Full funding grant agreement with the FTA: 12/19/2012: Kapolei to Ala Moana, 20 miles, 21 stations, completed by 1/31/2020, $5.12 billion
11/9/2021: Kapolei to Ala Moana, 20 miles, 21 stations, $12.45 billion, completed in 2031
6/3/2022 “recovery” plan: 18.9 miles, 19 stations, $9.933 billion, updated to $10.065 billion
@@ryana9796 It's nice to live in a dream world. But when you wake you're faced with a rail that wont take you anywhere you want to go. I know bus riders who switched to the rail and they say it takes about as long as riding the bus. First they wait for and ride a bus to a rail hub - no park and ride as promised since most were taken from the original plan to provide graft to the criminal here; then you climb the tower and wait for and ride the rail; then you wait for another bus to take you from the middle of nowhere to your destination. And rail supporters still think spending 13-15 billion is a good idea! Remember the lies about the added excise tax ending next year. They're permanent now. Also, anyone who can add numbers will quickly figure out that current revenue wont support the rail at any level of completion. More taxes in the future. For a rail that will not reduce traffic. For more than a decade rail supporters here have been proven wrong about everything and they will continue to be wrong. Meanwhile, homelessness has skyrocketed, our schools are continually rated in the bottom 10 percent in the nation, a ten percent State income tax rate, rail officials under investigation by the FBI. I could go on, but it's just too depressing. I wish I could live in your world of endless optimism.
they need to build high density housing around phase 1
They did state took prime farm land and build termite infested houses
I wish they would've started in Honolulu instead of Kapolei because I'd definitely use it more. However, the times the rail is open isn't conducive for their ridership (last rides end at 7 PM). Hopefully once they finish the second segment in Kalihi, they'll get more people riding to Pearls and the stadium and they can open later once they get it all the way done, but only time will tell.
This is easily one the greatest examples of government malfeasance ever perpetrated on the citizenry.
Wait until you find put about Cali "High Speed Rail"......
The most absolute WORST example of "government malfeasance" would be the trillion-dollar annual cost of the wasteful and inefficient stuperhighway network....
5:13 only the second segment will open in 2025, the third will open 2031 and the fourth is not in the current budget so it is not known if it even will be built
I don't live in Hawaii, but it's definitely worth it. One thing I thought is illogical is why did they start building it from the boondocks to downtown and not the other way around? Why would anyone be surprised that ridership at this point is only 3,000 per day? Did they do this just because it's cheaper to build out in nowhere? They still need to build the rest. I can't imagine New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Vancouver, etc., not building their subway systems from the center outward.
Excellent observation...they (the proponents of the rail) did it strategically to keep the costs down until they were at a point where the project couldn't be canceled. They under reported what the costs were gonna be and they knew when the construction got into the urban areas, the prices were gonna go thru the roof. If they had started logically from Ala Moana to the airport.... it would have been shut down years ago. They knew exactly what they were doing starting the project backwards.
There's no space to store and or service the trains if they build from town. The storage yard is out in Kapolei. So if they did build from Honolulu to Kapolei, the system wouldn't be running until it's finished. Just my observations.
Rail sucks I ran for office as anti rail because we need since the 1960s that it would not be sustainable or logical we mass transit for a place with less than 900k population and the linear limitations was always asinine by pure common sense. The 15 billion it will cost means that we could have given each family $40k to by their own cars the. .5 percent Get tax killing us too
@@kaioh6 The storage yard/operations center is in Pearl City on 43 acres next to LCC, six miles east of Kapolei. Google is your friend.
A big part of the reason they started it six miles west of the rail yard/operations center in Pearl City is so they could build as much as possible as fast as possible in order to make it more difficult to stop. Our former mayor Carlisle admitted that in no uncertain terms.
“Mayor Carlisle, now a lame duck, says he will ‘do everything [he] can to get rail far enough along so that it cannot possibly be stopped’” the transport politic 8/18/2012
At a minimum of $525 million per mile or more, the scamline is probably the world’s most expensive project of its type on a per capita basis. Remember we have ~1 million inhabitants paying for the majority of this 18.9 mile, 19 station, $10 billion project. If they complete the final 1.2 miles and two stations to Ala Moana (20.1 miles total) as originally contracted with the FTA, hart’s 6/3/2022 “recovery plan” claims the cost will be $11.3 billion, or $565 million per mile.
Operations and maintenance (O&M)expense is what will kill us though. In their first year of operations, O&M was ~$94 million against revenues of $617k. By 2030, O&M is projected to exceed $150 million, even before the shortened route to the imaginary “civic center” is completed. The difference between the fare box collections and O&M is paid out of Honolulu’s general fund, 80% of which comes from our property taxes. Do you see where this is going?
“It was a short answer to a loaded question: How much will rail operations and maintenance cost Oahu property owners in taxes?
The response (from deputy director of the city Department of Budget and Fiscal Services Gary Kurokawa) was that broadly speaking and ‘using today’s numbers,’ property taxpayers can expect to see a 9 percent increase in rates to subsidize annual operational costs for the 20-mile rail system when it comes online in late 2021.” Star Advertiser 1/26/2016
If you have traveled in Europe by car the first thing you notice is that there is almost no parking in the large cities. We went to Paris (it used to be the most beautiful city in the world IMO). Had a rental car we picked up in Marseille. We opted to stay in hotel in a suburb 20 miles out of the city. Good thing. There is no parking in Paris that I could see. We took the train into the city center and used buses or walked thereafter. Did the same in Rome and London. US all major cities have huge parking garages everywhere. These parking garages are what kill rail transportation. Cities need to change zoning to end 1 apartment or so many sq ft of office space have to have 2 parking spaces requirements. Making parking expensive and hard to find and people will look for alternatives.
Big fan
FyI the area which the rail is built on doesn't include "steep cliffs" nor "volcanoes" rather very level land. Additionally the cost is rising exponentially with no end in sight as they built the easy part first and are getting to the hardest part now.
Yeah, building these kinds of projects is super important. It’s embarrassing how bad we are at completing them.
Not "we"...
It's the corrupt politicians and the corrupt contractors...
it’s definitely “we”. We elect them.
its a politician problem but its also a regulation problem. Insane amount of regulations make it impossible to build anything in less than 10-20 years
@@amifunnymynameisbob We also see a lot of private citizens put up obstructive lawsuits. These cost tons in time and money.
You know some of the issues. First, when the contractor for the rail was chosen, Hitachi said they would bring the project in on time and on budget. They chose number 25, whose parent company was just then indicted for graft. Also, the city never precured right of way in the city core of Kakaako, which was an industrial area. Instead, they approved building plans of luxury towers and raising the cost of a sq ft from $550 to $800, making it more expensive to buy a right of way. Panos Povaderous was an engineering professor at the University of Hawaii. Everything he said has come true. He gave up on Honolulu after decades of trying to improve infrastructure but getting heavy push back from politicians.
Using steel in concrete construction is the normal procedure, making sure the steel inside the concrete doesn't rust is a problem, ask the folks in Miami where that apartment building fell down or the folks over in Italy who had a big bridge failure. Cracking is the first sign of problems. Reagan is often blamed for cutting money from the budget but the real cost cutter was Carter, he looked at the spending on the DC metro and nearly tore his hair out. Yea, that was out of control. These cost numbers are pretty wicked but this is Hawaii, remember that EVERYTHING had to be brought in from the mainland and getting coordination between both sides becomes awfully expensive. There are no railway experts on Hawaii, at one time they had some but that was in the past. Having government agencies build something makes it cost more, often a lot more. Too often government bureaucrats are put in charge of something that they known little or nothing about, this usually doesn't work out well. Way back when, the private companies that built the bulk of the existing NYC transit system did so rather quickly and it's been in service for over 100 years now so I guess it was pretty good, it's taken over 40 years to build the very limited Second Ave. subway in Manhattan promised to residents in the 1950s being built by a government agency.
It depends on the expertice, capacities, and liberties given to the transit agency. There's a reason that Europe (with extensive govermental control over public transit), and even Latin America are able to construct and provide extensive transit: giving more power over to the transit agency
I look at this rail everyday on my way to work and back. I don’t have official rider numbers but by a visual head count, NOBODY rides it. Mufi got the backing of the unions to get that vote. Kiewit Construction screwed up the first leg big time. And HART was absolutely corrupt. You did a good job covering this. Oh and it’s Ka Ka A Ko. lol.
Nobody rides the rail. The rail doesn’t go anywhere good. You would have to take the rail then take the bus to where you need to go.
I ride it regularly, but yes it is very limited right now, lot of people on it during commute hours I’ve noticed though. Next year supposed to go to the airport and Kalihi transit center, which will definitely make it more useful.
100,000 people a month isn't "nobody". I'm not "nobody". You're supposed to take a bus to skyline, that's how it works. Skyline goes to many population centers, and saying that they aren't "anywhere good" does a massive disservice to those living there.
A small price to pay for (hopefully) safe and reliable transportation
Ok 😂
We don’t need the rail in Hawaii. It is in the wrong location and stops many miles from anywhere. Utterly useless. It is always empty.
@@Wisdom808 For now. They are supposed to all be Transit Oriented Developments infilled at each stop much like Vancouver are they not? And limited hours don't help... Who though 7 PM was a good cut off time? Honestly...
Only it’s not a “small price”
our generation's grandchildren will benefit from this rail sure, but for now its going to be a pain in the ass for many more years before its even efficiently up and running enough to make any of that money back
Thank you for giving this the attention is needed. This project is sucking us dry and devolving our traffic even further. All for fking what?
Devolving traffic? Do you want to elaborate?
Also, why blame rail projects for "sucking you dry" while the white elephant that is H-1 gets a free pass?
The thing about building expensive public transit is that while it's easy to be horrified by the costs when it's being planned and built, once it exists nobody ever regrets building it. You quickly forget about the money, start using it all the time and become appreciative that it exists. You often find people opposed to future tram/train/subway lines, but you rarely hear people in cities that have those things say they wish they'd never been built.
11 billion is _quite_ alot to try and make a return on investment for, it wont be completed for another 10 years and the costs are likely to keep rising. It’s also not open 24/7 which limits some revenue. Hawaii is already one of the most expensive states and people are feeling the tax burdens
Building on lava... very expensive
Building a train system makes sense in a growing city but Honolulu has a shrinking population. Locals are being forced to move away due to high taxes and out of control cost of living. The average home costs a million bucks and there are no jobs. Only kind of jobs in Honolulu are waiting tables and cleaning hotel rooms. These are minimum wages jobs. The taxes and rents are out of control. People can't afford to live here. Building this stupid rail line will only make it more expensive to live here. So who is going to ride this rail? Who is going to pay for this rail? The answer is nobody. It is an albatross that bankrupt the city and doom its population to perpetual poverty. I also doubt it will ever be finished.
I live in Oahu and I have seen this train many times before. And we want to ride it, but our aunt said it’s gonna be very expensive.
Chinese would finish this in 2 years. Make Hawaii look like a joke.
Yep, actually probably go around the whole island in that time, but would also probably fall apart in 2 months.
@lancew71 lol. China has reliable world class mass transit systems that have been in operation for decades. The quality in China is many times better than what is being built in Hawaii. Not even comparable
China would build it like their empty cities.
Build it with cheap materials not structurally safe, with slave labor, and no safety checks. Then forget maintenance and have the whole thing collapse the economy
8:41 you have an editing issue you should check were you repeat the same word if you would like to check it out
Why not tax the billionaires who are buying all the land, and the tourists who's numbers are always increasing.
But first let's start with Billionaires like The Meta CEO who is buying enough land to make his own private country, unacceptable meanwhile he is doing nothing for the community so take his money god sake
they should’ve taxed Mr oracle CEO who bought a whole island 🤦♂️
Take his money that he earned and spent it the way he wants to? You’re foolish.
More like we should tax the 2nd vacation home millionaire folks, cause they drove up the cost of housing.
@ so you want to tax a person for being successful
@@Trashman702 to preserve our land, yes foreign billionaires that only visit here a few times a year should be taxed a premium to have property here. Non locals / kanaka should also be on leases not ownership
honestly we need this and a pm zipperlane going west like we have during am
Dubai has already doing driverless trains since 2009. And all 75 kilometres are driverless making it in the world records
Not anymore. Singapore is way ahead.
2009 that’s when they started building the high-speed rail system in California. Democrats stole all that money but I hear it’s really fast
Japan has been doing driverless trains since 1982.
I think this will make them more money in the long run. We didn't really even mention that tourism is a huge part of the economy. Having good transit makes it a city destination people can see more of. And that mean people will be visiting more locations and more taxes spent at businesses like hotels and restaurants. Less money spent resurfacing roads for Ubers and rental cars. Also good for carbon footprint.