Oh cool. Never knew about your late dad riding one but I've heard you say how you love all bikes. I love all of them to, except the old kawasaki zx-7's. Haha they're butt ugly man.
Omar Abdulghani There are a lot of ugly bikes but when you throw a leg over them the looks don't matter. My late dad did more fixing of harleys than he did riding them though. lol However, Harleys seem to be more reliable these days.
After owning my FXSB for 3 years( I have the exact one they are testing) I love it and will probably keep it for as long as I can ride it. It actually performs really well in corners and I live in a great curvy Highway network.
The Gunner is almost half a second slower in the quarter mile than the Breakout. But that is not a lot. The HD is much nicer but thats why its more $. Close comparison shows the HD is a better build and it should be for the extra $. Ride what you like and like what you ride. Enjoy and ride safe!
Take them both for a ride and decide which one you prefer, its the only way to know. I researched for years and test drove and thats why I picked the Night Train. Some riders prefer the Victory and others the HD, now Indian is in the mix also. Night Rider
Victory all the way they are way better balanced and they ride much smoother and you know what victory says ride one and you'll own one!! Such a true statement! Will never own a Harley victory for life!!!
I’m a Victory guy, got myself a Judge, the Gunner’s sister, and very happy with the 106 motor. Way better than the H-D I owned for several months... more agile, smooth and technologically correct (a 21st century bike), you bikers know what I mean.
Wow.....Just for a second at first glance I thought that I had missed the Yamaha Raider was included in the title. At certain angles that Breakout looks so much like a Raider that it would be easy for one to think that the Yamaha Raider was a shameless copy of the Break Out's styling. The only problem with that logic is the Raider actually came out before the Breakout by about 4 years.
Why the Gunner? Why not the Victory Hammer 8-Ball? With it's 250 Rear, I'd think handling would be similar to the Breakout's 240 Rear. That would bring the price difference to $3K.
When I first saw the breakout I could not get that bike out of my head. I ended up buying a brand new 2014 about 3 months ago. It is the Hard Candy paint, which is the metal flake. I put black V&H big radius pipes that make the look coming off the motor really cool. The back seat is not very passenger friendly, I had to buy a detachable back rest for my wife so she would not feel like she is going to slide off and the rear seat itself is hard on her butt if she rides with me too long. That huge rear tire and short fender give the bike a very custom look. I am a big guy, 6' 3", and this bike fits me great. Handling is not as rigid as described, maybe for smaller guys. It sits low and does not have a lot of lean angle so you do have to get accustom to turning at higher speeds and learn the bikes limits. As they mentioned, the Breakout is a looker, I get asked about the bike and complimented on it every time I pull it out and it is mainly from other Harley riders.
If anything, I'd say Victory is more classy than Harley. It's elegant, toned and dignified. Wheras harley is brash, shouty and obscene. Nothing classy about it. It's for people who have nothing else in life to look for.
Nice review of both bikes but I think you are still missing a bike in it. The Yamaha Star Raider. It has both bikes beat in displacement with its 113 ci are cooled v-twin. But love the looks of the breakout but would take the gunner cause of the price
HD for me, but its an opinion. I like all bikes and respect everybody's opinions. But when people talk about HD being overpriced, what does that mean? Overprice according to what the market bears or factory costs? That statement is totally meaningless just as me saying that an Armani suit is overpriced. It is true that Harleys are not for everybody but that does not make them bad choices for the ones that can afford them. I have a Harley and a Honda and both are great, but then again I just love riding on two wheels.
Also, did you notice that the Gunner was dragging the kick stand and lower forward controls around deep corners? You could just hear it scraping the pavement. I'm more of an Harley guy, than anything else, but I am open to whatever is out there. I'm not snobbish about it. See people seem to be making comments, and you can just feel the hate that they have for Harley, and would take any second available to say something negative about them. But what you stated is exactly what most people are thinking, in my opinion. "According to what?"... Is exactly right. There are design flaws with most Victorys that I just cannot get past, and accept. Like the rear fender lines that are completely out of sync with the rear wheel. That is a huge issue to me, personally. A dragging kick-stand.... that would eat at my nerves for as long as I was riding. Things that Harley has worked-out decades ago. Small, but relevant issues like that. Sorry for the length, but you can tell by certain comments, that some people don't even ride HD's. Anyway... take care.
I rode the breakout and it was alright, bit uncomfortable, touches really easy like any harley, but not bad. Though realistically I prefer the aesthetics of the gunner more, and I simply don't think the breakout is worth that price tag, not even close. Combine that with the more power of the gunner and I'd easily choose one over the other. Haven't ridden a gunner yet, though.
If ur a little short throw the cvo handle bars on the harley n they can fix the foot pegs to how u like it. I got one one n the cvo handle bars a far more comfy.
I just happen to see this old comparison. Too bad the Victory line was brought to a halt. They were some dam good bikes that simply needed to fit the finish that the Indians received right from the start. Polaris fucked up bad with a brand that could have so much better.
The Victory Gunner has nice lines and cool riding position. They had better looking (and optioned) Vegas models a few years back and I still have the same styling gripes about them. Victory does not seem to understand how to make good looking handle bars. With the exception of their ape hangers and the drag bars that were offered on the Hammer and the first year of the Judge.. There is little difference in the riding position on all their bikes. All laid-back. They take no risk in ergonomics department and as result most of their bikes lose a few points for personality. Victory has very limited color options outside of their touring models. So their goes a few more points for personality. Their overall fit and finish seems to be limited by price which is OK because currently they do offer a lot of bike for the money compared to most competitors as a result. Victory engines are not only very low maintenance, they perform very well, even above most competitors. Victory engines are also inexpensive to modify compared to most brands and reap great power gains with small modifications while still running relative cool and reliable. This is a big bonus for the hot-rodders. Victory transmissions thus far are less than what their engine deserves. When shifted patiently, deliberately they do the job, but the shifters feels clunky at times and the rest of the drive-train has notable lash. Enough that simple on/off throttle inputs seem abrupt. The throttle cable has considerable slack as well, which only exasperates this issue. There are cheap fixes for the throttle but the lash is more than likely a build tolerance issue that hopefully the factory will eventually learn how fix in future manufacturing. It is hardly enough an issue to be a deal breaker but it's there. Victory suspension is simply superior to nearly all other cruisers. The ride quality and control is better out of the box than many after market alternatives for most other brand cruisers. Victory brakes. Not so much. adequate at best in most cases. They'll stop you fine but don't expect to feel them working all the time. Reliable, not communicative. Why am I not bringing up the Harley? Because you can go anywhere on the internet find a list of their flaws. That doesn't change that they make beautiful motorcycles that perform well regardless of being high maintenance and consequently expensive to own if you don't do your own mechanical work. Victory is gaining popularity and is a great motorcycle line as well. Most of their flaws have cures and from a price and performance perspective it is difficult to find a better bike in this class. Why am I rambling? Probably just bored and lonely with too much free time... Loser.
+1400IntruderVS Actually... that was a well-written, insightful commentary. You brought up some issues that I hadn't read about yet. I have been looking to get a new bike (preferably American big-twin), and have had Harley as the main contender. But... Victory has piqued my interest... going to test drive a few today...
+solomyngrundy1968 let me know if you agree after a test ride. I am still shopping but I am currently leaning toward a Gunner or 8 Ball. There pricing is very attractive for the performance.
Pretty much everything that you wrote was spot on. I test drove one today. Very impressive bike. The handlebars on the Vegas 8 ball that I drove needed some adjustments on it, but they were very comfortable otherwise. As you had mentioned, the brakes weren't bad, but could be more aggressive. The riding position was pretty much exactly what I"m looking for. Boring or not, it's comfortable and I can see myself in the seat for very long periods of time. I'm coming from a 97 Honda Magna, and the aggressive riding position is starting to get to me. This is going to be a tough decision. You certainly do get a lot of bang for your buck.
solomyngrundy1968 If you are the type to hod rod your motorcycle it may help to check out www.lloydz.com. The dyno results they get from relatively inexpensive engine up grades are impressive for an American V-twin. They also sell a very easy to install pulley for the throttle cable eliminates that slack. Fair instruction videos help you decide if you how much you can do it yourself. Best of luck to you.
You know , I wish you could include some more informations such as the consumption of each bike and the price as well so that would help us to decide whether we should go for which one !
The Harley is just too badass to compare it to the Victory. If you buy a motorcycle only by looking at the price tag, then I'm sorry but you deserve a Victory. After all, these are "classic" bikes and H-D knows how it should look like.
+Florin Nitulescu It's all in perspective. To me, the Harley screams "Hi boys! I 'm here with my shiny pretty bike!". In my opinion, the Victory looks more badass. And if by "deserve a Victory", you mean a bike that is built for handling, performance and well... ride-ability than I can say I deserve a Victory!
The Breakout is actually about half a second faster in the quarter mile, just fact. The fully chromed Hammer or Vegas is a better comparison and then the price is on par with the Harley. Victory is not better built amd quality is close to the HD. Its like Ferrari and Lambourghini. Ride safe and ride what you like.
You come across as an uncool HD hater. hD doesnt scream look at my shiny bike, thats your biased opinion. Furthermore HD Street Bob is $13,699 while the Gunner is $15499....now what?? You get what you pay for. HD brakes, clutch and tranny are better but to each his own. All these bikes are nice. Respect all riders and their machines because we all love to ride, so ride what you like and like what you ride, just ride man just ride. Ride safe.
+Dragan M And you come across as a pathetic Harley fanboi. You troll these threads constantly, and come back in to comment on months-old comments that you've already commented on. So what about the cost of the two bikes? Two different types of bikes. Big deal. I'll bet anything you've never even rode a Victory before, have you? You spend all your time in these threads defending Harley, and slamming Victory... without ever having ridden one. And before you turn that around on me... I test drove pretty much EVERYTHING that Harley had to offer last year. This was after years of me wanting one, and having the money to buy a brand new one (willing to spend up to $25k on one). Seriously, once you start riding and comparing the two bikes... there is absolutely no comparison. The Victory's simply handle and perform much better. The Vic baggers are considerably more comfortable stock, and the difference in power is remarkable. The 103 HO is fine on the smaller bikes... but once you go to the baggers... wow. I don't think they could out-accelerate even a compact car. In the end, I could not justify buying a Harley (remember, after years of wanting one!) after having driven a Victory. They may not be as "cool", popular, and in some folks opinions nice looking as the Harley... but they certainly ride A HELL of a lot better than the Harleys.
The Breakout has 95.5 ft lbs of torque. At least you guys gave the torque specs rather than the hp (which is a theoretical number derived by multiplying torque times rpm divided by 5252). The Victory looks too much like a Star to me.
I absolutely love the breakout, but Harleys are really not worth what they are asking. Way overpriced if you ask me. For that kind of money I could build my own bike with 100% American parts and be one of a kind.
What are you talking about? You are completely wrong about the pricing. Compare apples to apples,not a vw to a cadillac. Gunner is $15,499 while the Harley street Bob is $13,699. Even the somewhat dressier HD FatBob is $15,499. If you want to make remarks at least do your homework or you look foolish. I hope this info helps you. Ride safe....if you ride.
+Dragan M What the hell are you talking about? He didn't do any type of comparison at all, you moron. He never said anything about Victory's price vs Harley's price. He simply stated his opinion that he thinks Harley's are overpriced. Also... why the frig are you mentioning the HD Bob at all? The video is the Breakout vs the Gunner... which the Breakout is over $4,000 more! You just used the cheapest HD Big-Twin bike because it's the cheapest. For crying out loud... learn to comprehend what you read before you come back with such drivel. Aren't you tired of making yourself look like an idiot yet? Now I ask one thing of you... before you respond... Please read what I have written... and at least ATTEMPT to make a comprehensive, cohesive response... OK? I'm Just trying to help you out here buddy...we all have confidence that you'll start using that great intellect you keep telling everyone you posses... I hope that this info helps YOU.
solomyngrundy1968 go away little boy without a brain. And that is me being kind. Are you really that dumb or are you pretending just to be able to argue? Its all relevent when talking overpricing, YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR, the Gunner is bare bones, same class as the fat bob, not the class of the top of the line FXSB! You say Help me out? With your stupid opinions instead of facts, help yourself and be a man, admit you are wrong. Hahaha using my words lol "I hope this info helps you", you cant even be original, you are such a poser. The Gunner is the cheapest of the Victory line so of course to do a proper comparison you must use the cheapest HD in the same class, it doesnt get any easier than that but you obviously dont understand that, its obvious from your comments. Dont wast anymore of my time, I would rather polish the chrome on my bikes than deal with childish rhetoric.
I will never understand harley ( small H), a big bike 350 pounds and a single front brake disc ,they always bet on a crash to sell a new one and don't give a shit to what happens with the rider.
350? It's twice that... Not all Harleys have 1 disk up front. For example the fat bob is like 4k cheaper and has dual massive front disks...I'd take that any day over this, but it's more of a bobber style, so not really a direct competitor.
MrSlowestD16 (Thank you for the reply) but my only concern was about safety features,do they provide them or no? ,do they care? my believe that life is such precious than a the look and is a news announcement "killing in a crash involving a nice sweet ride" exist?...my other believe is yes ! At harley factory.
zermomia Yeah, I agree with you that life is precious, they should definitely opt for the ABS, then. In general, MOST cruisers have single disks, so there's nothing out of the ordinary about this Harley. There are definite exceptions, but the majority have 1 disk. Even the gunner in this comparison has only 1 disk. The fat bobs are nice b/c of their dual disk setup - it bites hard. I don't think any manufacturer specifically cares about peoples' safety - they care about money, so they care about your safety because of that, but I wouldn't say Harley cares any less or more than the next big company.
I love the reviews, but why the Gunner here when the Hammer 8-Ball is better choice for the comparrison, and more over where are all the reviews for the Hammer 8 -Ball; which if I had the choice would pick over the Gunner without question?
with the money you save buying the victory you can pay for a better paintjob than the harley like 4 maybe 500 dollars depending on where you go it will varey
many aspects come into play when choosing the right motorcycle. however ill say deprecation on Victorys is something to take into account... they all depreciate but the Victorys are horrendous....but Victory has done a great job imitating a genuine Harley Davidson motorcycle. its most important to be out in the wind on 2 wheels no matter the brand ! Ride on my brothers and sisters!
If U into spending money on maintenance.. get a Harley.. with over 62 gaskets compared to victory 8 ..that's some thing.. not to mention oil cooled and air
Hi we here at motorcycle.com despise Harley cause we ride sport bikes, we're just giving you all a fair warning that we will take whatever shot we can at them so don't be to upset.
If Harley was the only bike out there then I would ride it and probably be happy. But for what you pay for what you get, I think its a bad product. These guys rode both bikes and compared them extensively and found that the gunner was better. They don't take shots at harley just because. Lots of the guys there own or have owned harleys. A fair amount like the looks of harleys, just not the ride or the value.
Oh come now, who are we kidding here, only a Harley has looks, rides, feels, has fit and finish like a Harley. These two both secretly prefer the Harley. Nothing has attitude, presence, and owns the roads like a Harley...unless ya can't afford one, then yes, settle for a Victory, or anything else for that matter. Harley bashers, stop deluding yourselves.
I don't get how Harley bikes sell yet ? They weigh a ton you can't go around corners at all and my god there slow. I rode my friends new breakout I'm not impressed. His brother has a Yamaha roadstar and the Yamaha kills the breakout off the start and top end, and the Yamaha costed WAY LESS . And don't get me started on Harley aftermarket parts my friend dropped 2200 on rims, 600.00 for exhaust 400.00 for a air cleaner and his harley jacket cost 700.00 wtf.......
+MotorPsycho what about the new Indians? Those are beautiful bikes. This comparison is of two very different bikes. The Harley is much more show. Victory is much more go.
Can ride for days as long as you stop often to tighten your nuts and bolts... Can ride for days as long as you don't hit traffic and overheat. Can ride for days as long as you can handle their ergonomically unpleasing setups. Truth be told though, no one rides a harley for their reliability. It sucks.
+Seth D I have am and still doing it. Truth be told haven't had one problem one discomfort and it's got plenty of pick up for public roads. So, as an owner and constant rider from,summer well into Christmas you are wrong in all counts
If it works for you then great. Most of my buddies bikes that are harleys must just be abnormal then as they always have to tinker with this or that. Or worse, they can't ride on the weekend cause its in the shop. In your world, your harley can ride for days. In my world, my buddies harleys cannot.
Maybe, but when it is broken or not running well then you have to do something. Told them to get something more reliable but they just keep dishing money into them. Each to their own I guess.
apple to oranges comparison.. 2 diff. kinds of bikes and diff price ranges. Not a good match up. Id take the Harley though >_> . o yea I already have one. :)
The victory was dragging the kickstand around the corners,, great way to wreck your bike,, plus ABS breaks,, alot more engineering was put into the harley thats why it is more money,,you get what you pay for... You guys also need to learn how to ride if you think its a work out to ride a fat tire bike..you only compare the snowmobile to Harley cause you know its the best and you guys are trying to save a sinking ship,, as to why Victory dealerships are closing nationwide ,, and they had to buy the Indian name cause they know america is full and aware of the poor quality motorcycles they make...
you get what you pay for? that was used as a example with harley .. now that's funny... so those cvo $40+k touring bike.. you get what you pay for there ? less HP, Less Torque, increased maintenance... (multiple fluids for 1 engine). and dragging a kick stand causing a wreck ? I guess you haven't ridden us129 the dragon
+Chris Free I don't know if you are making this shit up or just a hater. The gunner is....... well inferior. If you don't like HD so be it. Just face the facts the HD is better. Better engineered, better quality, better reliability.
The Harley is losing ground to better and better bikes like the Victory. You get what you pay for and in this case it's the middle aged bloke with a pony tail driving a Porsche who run Harley's marketing dept.
Then should called it the victory gutter, because that's where it belongs. I can't imagine how sick Harley is with them coming out with a new design and then a competitor trying to copy it. It just shows that victories original models aren't selling that well. So now they have to start copying Harleys like all the other companies do.
+Angel D You do realize that Harley copies other manufacturers, too... right? No automotive manufacturer designs anything in a vacuum now. There's just too much competition.
Everyone copies something. I chose a Harley Davidson Night Train and moded it slightly. No issues to date with the Harley, and its in its 7th year. To each his own. The Gunner is a bare bones bike and of course it should be cheaper and IT IS a less sophisticated machine than the Harley. Ride what you like and like what you ride is my personal motto. Ride safe.
You do know that Harley copied the Vtwin design right? Harley has always been following the innovators. They have been using 100 year old technology and never improving their product so people just THINK that they came up with it.
I don't know why you can't have a grown up conversation with someone without having to sink to the level of name calling and bieber insults. You are not contributing to this post. Go away troll
I've said it before, the victory is an ok motorcycle decent transportation, but the Harley has a soul.. the victory is just more or less comparable to a metric bike. the breakout is just a badass bike.
Harley is overpriced scrap metal. Victory has a classic look to it and comfort and performance as well. Not much to hate in it unless you envy the fact that Victory riders will be always on the road while harleys will be in the shop.
For my money I would go Victory. For the cool factor Victory. For the power I would again go victory. Sorry Harley Victory has the win in my book. However Harley still wins cause Harley is still in business and Indian killed off Victory.
estas dos motos no son comparables, han cojido una de las harleys mas caras y la comparan con una de las victorys mas baratas…. no tienen sentido. Y aun así la Big Gun no desentona nada...
More and more this guys sound like a commercial victory and indian, for starters how u compare a 13k bike with a 20k bike? Doesnt victory make a 20k or closer to the 20k price tag on the hd? Of course they do. Heck if they wer in the same league and it was a 5k difference or so even i would get the vic over the hd and am an hd rider, awful comparison if they keep.sounding like commercials for the vic and indian company i will have to unsuscribe..
Those two bikes are direct competitors. They're similar in style, target market, equipment, etc. The Harley is just overpriced. And this video couldn't have been further from a "commercial". They both said how the Harley was as good as the Victory in a lot of ways, looked better, etc. You seem to be viewing this with a lot of bias and can't handle the fact that someone would chose anything other than the Harley.
Zanpa sorry but i disagree, that victory is a direct competitor.with a street bob, with a blacked out.look and flat.paint it looks totally off in this comparison meaning price.and looks, i love hd but i also love any bike and know that hd are not perfect by far and whenever i see this comparos i take the fact that its an hd out of the equation because quite frankly if i didnt it would be a waste of time u cant compete against brands but u can compete on looks performance etc, reason i say its a commercial.for victory is cuz ive seen alot.of videos lately wer this magazine of the back wants to handle over the trophy to the scout or any other bike from the brp family.
If it we're engine size they go by then victory would win hands down so why compared them? I always look for a balance between money and what u get so yes if Harley was 2 or maybe 3k more OK whatever u pay for the name but 5 6k? This would of been a better comparison against the street Bob it has a 103 and it starts at the same price the Vic does its also blacked out or flat colors its a cruiser, I mean am I the only one that see's this? Look up harley davdison street Bob and tell me if that not the bike they we're trying to copy which is fine but wouldn't that be a better comparison? But I believe they didn't go that route Cuz it wouldn't be a comparison at all being almost the same price and having the HD brand most of us would go for the HD right? Like I said I love HD I own a 2014 street glide but I love all motorcycles I own a 07 Kawi and ride with Kawi or Honda riders Dont matter.
James N sorry but this conversation is over, first because if u cant see the similiraties on the gunner and the street bob well i cant help u with that, second cuz either u dont know what liquid cooled means or ur confused but the gunner is not.liquid cooled actually none.of.the victory line up is, they are oil cooled which is what they state... yes harleys are still air cooled u got.that right. Bottom line is that if u had 13k to spend i reall doubt u would.spend them on the victory over the hd unless u just hate hd or want to make a point. Victory are great bikes they have been my secondary bikes here and there but it feels like a jap copy of an engine and looks of a copied hd. Which it has to be that way hd has been around for a long time if they didnt want to copy they would.make some crazy crossover like the nx series bikes which i still.like and aplaud honda gor doing and not copying anymore they cannot beat hd at their own game now can victory nor any other brand now indian entering the game can be interesting but even then i think its a lil to late. Anyhow totally of topic my point was the comparison between this two bikes is totally off to much of a proce.diference and the person looking for the breakout would.be looking at the vic if u know hd riders its nos so much the brand why they wouldnt look at the vic its the feel.of that softail which personally indont care for.
Just me or does that Victory look way better? I'm a pilot and the Gunner has "hanger bike" written all over - love it!
HD Breakout looks the sickest.
Lol what's up man! Wouldn't expect to see you here...
Omar Abdulghani I love all bikes! My late dad rode a Harley!
Oh cool. Never knew about your late dad riding one but I've heard you say how you love all bikes. I love all of them to, except the old kawasaki zx-7's. Haha they're butt ugly man.
Omar Abdulghani There are a lot of ugly bikes but when you throw a leg over them the looks don't matter. My late dad did more fixing of harleys than he did riding them though. lol However, Harleys seem to be more reliable these days.
I see what you're saying but man I can't stand how some look. Lol but as long as it rides how you like then it doesn't really matter!
Look out Harley...Here comes Victory and they are killing it! More power more torque less money and a high quality build.
After owning my FXSB for 3 years( I have the exact one they are testing) I love it and will probably keep it for as long as I can ride it. It actually performs really well in corners and I live in a great curvy Highway network.
I had a chance to demo the Breakout this past August and love it!
victory looks nicer.
i am not even a biker.
I agree the victory looks alot better and I usually love the way Harleys look.
The victory rides better and faster for over $5000 less!
The Gunner is almost half a second slower in the quarter mile than the Breakout. But that is not a lot. The HD is much nicer but thats why its more $. Close comparison shows the HD is a better build and it should be for the extra $. Ride what you like and like what you ride. Enjoy and ride safe!
+Dragan M Yeah i read the full review.Basically the Harley is for looks the gunner is for Riding.
Take them both for a ride and decide which one you prefer, its the only way to know. I researched for years and test drove and thats why I picked the Night Train. Some riders prefer the Victory and others the HD, now Indian is in the mix also. Night Rider
Dragan M
Who makes the night train?
Harley Davidson made the Night Teain, 2009 was the last year they made it. It's the bike on the left in my profile pic. Night Rider
Exactly !! Harley is "look at me!" . I'm a low key guy so I'm going Gunner ... ASAP !
Victory all the way they are way better balanced and they ride much smoother and you know what victory says ride one and you'll own one!! Such a true statement! Will never own a Harley victory for life!!!
I’m a Victory guy, got myself a Judge, the Gunner’s sister, and very happy with the 106 motor. Way better than the H-D I owned for several months... more agile, smooth and technologically correct (a 21st century bike), you bikers know what I mean.
Wow.....Just for a second at first glance I thought that I had missed the Yamaha Raider was included in the title. At certain angles that Breakout looks so much like a Raider that it would be easy for one to think that the Yamaha Raider was a shameless copy of the Break Out's styling. The only problem with that logic is the Raider actually came out before the Breakout by about 4 years.
Harley doesn't say "I'm cool," it says "I'm stupid." H-D has always carried that stigma.
Why the Gunner? Why not the Victory Hammer 8-Ball? With it's 250 Rear, I'd think handling would be similar to the Breakout's 240 Rear. That would bring the price difference to $3K.
***** Hammer 8-Ball is still ugly as sin.
When I first saw the breakout I could not get that bike out of my head. I ended up buying a brand new 2014 about 3 months ago. It is the Hard Candy paint, which is the metal flake. I put black V&H big radius pipes that make the look coming off the motor really cool. The back seat is not very passenger friendly, I had to buy a detachable back rest for my wife so she would not feel like she is going to slide off and the rear seat itself is hard on her butt if she rides with me too long. That huge rear tire and short fender give the bike a very custom look. I am a big guy, 6' 3", and this bike fits me great. Handling is not as rigid as described, maybe for smaller guys. It sits low and does not have a lot of lean angle so you do have to get accustom to turning at higher speeds and learn the bikes limits. As they mentioned, the Breakout is a looker, I get asked about the bike and complimented on it every time I pull it out and it is mainly from other Harley riders.
Gr8 choice, enjoy and ride safe.
The video was informative and unbiased somewhat. Good job guys!
I have a Softail Breakout , I absolutely love it. I do really like the Gunner too , it's very nice 👍
If anything, I'd say Victory is more classy than Harley. It's elegant, toned and dignified.
Wheras harley is brash, shouty and obscene. Nothing classy about it.
It's for people who have nothing else in life to look for.
That's just stupid.
The Harley is Prettier but that's no surprise , I still prefer Function Over Form .. Victory Wins ..
Both monsters, love it...and they get upset if you call it a boat and not a ship!
Nice review of both bikes but I think you are still missing a bike in it. The Yamaha Star Raider. It has both bikes beat in displacement with its 113 ci are cooled v-twin. But love the looks of the breakout but would take the gunner cause of the price
People pay more for Hardleys & always say the can sell for More. Well when You Pay More Id hope that'd be True
More time cleaning the HD, less time riding, give me the dark victory any day,
Great video. Can you do one with the Breakout vs the Victory Hammer? The Hammer has a larger rear tire.
HD for me, but its an opinion. I like all bikes and respect everybody's opinions. But when people talk about HD being overpriced, what does that mean? Overprice according to what the market bears or factory costs? That statement is totally meaningless just as me saying that an Armani suit is overpriced. It is true that Harleys are not for everybody but that does not make them bad choices for the ones that can afford them. I have a Harley and a Honda and both are great, but then again I just love riding on two wheels.
My definition of overpriced: Cost overly exorbitant to the value offered.
Also, did you notice that the Gunner was dragging the kick stand and lower forward controls around deep corners? You could just hear it scraping the pavement. I'm more of an Harley guy, than anything else, but I am open to whatever is out there. I'm not snobbish about it. See people seem to be making comments, and you can just feel the hate that they have for Harley, and would take any second available to say something negative about them. But what you stated is exactly what most people are thinking, in my opinion. "According to what?"... Is exactly right. There are design flaws with most Victorys that I just cannot get past, and accept. Like the rear fender lines that are completely out of sync with the rear wheel. That is a huge issue to me, personally. A dragging kick-stand.... that would eat at my nerves for as long as I was riding. Things that Harley has worked-out decades ago. Small, but relevant issues like that. Sorry for the length, but you can tell by certain comments, that some people don't even ride HD's. Anyway... take care.
Polaris really shit on their Victory Customers.
I rode the breakout and it was alright, bit uncomfortable, touches really easy like any harley, but not bad.
Though realistically I prefer the aesthetics of the gunner more, and I simply don't think the breakout is worth that price tag, not even close. Combine that with the more power of the gunner and I'd easily choose one over the other. Haven't ridden a gunner yet, though.
Excellent review!
And when your voltage regulator blows on the Harley right after the 2 yr warranty, they'll milk you for $1,400 for parts and labor.
BeaglePower G Multi billion dollar company for a reason !
Lot easier to upgrade cosmetics than inferior drive train. Choice is simple. Go for the more reliable one with the most power.
If ur a little short throw the cvo handle bars on the harley n they can fix the foot pegs to how u like it. I got one one n the cvo handle bars a far more comfy.
Really good review, thanks
I just happen to see this old comparison. Too bad the Victory line was brought to a halt. They were some dam good bikes that simply needed to fit the finish that the Indians received right from the start. Polaris fucked up bad with a brand that could have so much better.
'you mind doing 1080p for all your videos please?
The Victory Gunner has nice lines and cool riding position. They had better looking (and optioned) Vegas models a few years back and I still have the same styling gripes about them.
Victory does not seem to understand how to make good looking handle bars. With the exception of their ape hangers and the drag bars that were offered on the Hammer and the first year of the Judge..
There is little difference in the riding position on all their bikes. All laid-back. They take no risk in ergonomics department and as result most of their bikes lose a few points for personality.
Victory has very limited color options outside of their touring models. So their goes a few more points for personality.
Their overall fit and finish seems to be limited by price which is OK because currently they do offer a lot of bike for the money compared to most competitors as a result.
Victory engines are not only very low maintenance, they perform very well, even above most competitors. Victory engines are also inexpensive to modify compared to most brands and reap great power gains with small modifications while still running relative cool and reliable. This is a big bonus for the hot-rodders.
Victory transmissions thus far are less than what their engine deserves. When shifted patiently, deliberately they do the job, but the shifters feels clunky at times and the rest of the drive-train has notable lash. Enough that simple on/off throttle inputs seem abrupt. The throttle cable has considerable slack as well, which only exasperates this issue. There are cheap fixes for the throttle but the lash is more than likely a build tolerance issue that hopefully the factory will eventually learn how fix in future manufacturing. It is hardly enough an issue to be a deal breaker but it's there.
Victory suspension is simply superior to nearly all other cruisers. The ride quality and control is better out of the box than many after market alternatives for most other brand cruisers.
Victory brakes. Not so much. adequate at best in most cases. They'll stop you fine but don't expect to feel them working all the time. Reliable, not communicative.
Why am I not bringing up the Harley?
Because you can go anywhere on the internet find a list of their flaws. That doesn't change that they make beautiful motorcycles that perform well regardless of being high maintenance and consequently expensive to own if you don't do your own mechanical work.
Victory is gaining popularity and is a great motorcycle line as well. Most of their flaws have cures and from a price and performance perspective it is difficult to find a better bike in this class.
Why am I rambling?
Probably just bored and lonely with too much free time...
Loser.
+1400IntruderVS Actually... that was a well-written, insightful commentary. You brought up some issues that I hadn't read about yet. I have been looking to get a new bike (preferably American big-twin), and have had Harley as the main contender. But... Victory has piqued my interest... going to test drive a few today...
+solomyngrundy1968 let me know if you agree after a test ride.
I am still shopping but I am currently leaning toward a Gunner or 8 Ball.
There pricing is very attractive for the performance.
Pretty much everything that you wrote was spot on. I test drove one today. Very impressive bike. The handlebars on the Vegas 8 ball that I drove needed some adjustments on it, but they were very comfortable otherwise. As you had mentioned, the brakes weren't bad, but could be more aggressive.
The riding position was pretty much exactly what I"m looking for. Boring or not, it's comfortable and I can see myself in the seat for very long periods of time. I'm coming from a 97 Honda Magna, and the aggressive riding position is starting to get to me.
This is going to be a tough decision. You certainly do get a lot of bang for your buck.
solomyngrundy1968 If you are the type to hod rod your motorcycle it may help to check out www.lloydz.com.
The dyno results they get from relatively inexpensive engine up grades are impressive for an American V-twin.
They also sell a very easy to install pulley for the throttle cable eliminates that slack.
Fair instruction videos help you decide if you how much you can do it yourself.
Best of luck to you.
Sad that Victory is dead.The bikes are great,i dont think there is a bad looking Victory bike. Hope I will own one some day.
LOL at both bikes dragging metal in no more than 20 something degrees of lean. This type of bike is good for two things:
1. Posing
2. Boat anchor.
You know , I wish you could include some more informations such as the consumption of each bike and the price as well so that would help us to decide whether we should go for which one !
On my Breakout I get around 42 to 45 mpg with stage 1.
Both of those look nice
The Harley is just too badass to compare it to the Victory. If you buy a motorcycle only by looking at the price tag, then I'm sorry but you deserve a Victory. After all, these are "classic" bikes and H-D knows how it should look like.
Price aside, I still prefer the Victory in all aspects except lack of abs.
+Florin Nitulescu It's all in perspective. To me, the Harley screams "Hi boys! I 'm here with my shiny pretty bike!". In my opinion, the Victory looks more badass.
And if by "deserve a Victory", you mean a bike that is built for handling, performance and well... ride-ability than I can say I deserve a Victory!
The Breakout is actually about half a second faster in the quarter mile, just fact. The fully chromed Hammer or Vegas is a better comparison and then the price is on par with the Harley. Victory is not better built amd quality is close to the HD. Its like Ferrari and Lambourghini. Ride safe and ride what you like.
You come across as an uncool HD hater. hD doesnt scream look at my shiny bike, thats your biased opinion. Furthermore HD Street Bob is $13,699 while the Gunner is $15499....now what?? You get what you pay for. HD brakes, clutch and tranny are better but to each his own. All these bikes are nice. Respect all riders and their machines because we all love to ride, so ride what you like and like what you ride, just ride man just ride. Ride safe.
+Dragan M And you come across as a pathetic Harley fanboi. You troll these threads constantly, and come back in to comment on months-old comments that you've already commented on.
So what about the cost of the two bikes? Two different types of bikes. Big deal.
I'll bet anything you've never even rode a Victory before, have you? You spend all your time in these threads defending Harley, and slamming Victory... without ever having ridden one.
And before you turn that around on me... I test drove pretty much EVERYTHING that Harley had to offer last year. This was after years of me wanting one, and having the money to buy a brand new one (willing to spend up to $25k on one).
Seriously, once you start riding and comparing the two bikes... there is absolutely no comparison. The Victory's simply handle and perform much better. The Vic baggers are considerably more comfortable stock, and the difference in power is remarkable. The 103 HO is fine on the smaller bikes... but once you go to the baggers... wow. I don't think they could out-accelerate even a compact car.
In the end, I could not justify buying a Harley (remember, after years of wanting one!) after having driven a Victory. They may not be as "cool", popular, and in some folks opinions nice looking as the Harley... but they certainly ride A HELL of a lot better than the Harleys.
$6k less and 20 more horsepower? Victory all day. No chrome to polish... Wipe it down and ride like hell.
was the gunner dragging around the corners
Was that the kick stand rubbing on the road I heard on the Victory and the case on the Breakout?
That's an awful moment, cuz the turn isn't that tight..
Not shit
No, it's the footpegs.
Yepp it's the pegs, my 2013Judge does the same thing (same bike almost exactly except for the forward set pegs, pulled back bars & solo seat)
Well i think u need to compare victory hammer 8 ball with brakeout. More similar.
The Breakout has 95.5 ft lbs of torque. At least you guys gave the torque specs rather than the hp (which is a theoretical number derived by multiplying torque times rpm divided by 5252). The Victory looks too much like a Star to me.
Where's the Triumph Thunderbird Storm guys? Should have been included in this test.
I absolutely love the breakout, but Harleys are really not worth what they are asking. Way overpriced if you ask me. For that kind of money I could build my own bike with 100% American parts and be one of a kind.
What are you talking about? You are completely wrong about the pricing. Compare apples to apples,not a vw to a cadillac. Gunner is $15,499 while the Harley street Bob is $13,699. Even the somewhat dressier HD FatBob is $15,499. If you want to make remarks at least do your homework or you look foolish. I hope this info helps you. Ride safe....if you ride.
+Dragan M What the hell are you talking about? He didn't do any type of comparison at all, you moron. He never said anything about Victory's price vs Harley's price. He simply stated his opinion that he thinks Harley's are overpriced.
Also... why the frig are you mentioning the HD Bob at all? The video is the Breakout vs the Gunner... which the Breakout is over $4,000 more! You just used the cheapest HD Big-Twin bike because it's the cheapest.
For crying out loud... learn to comprehend what you read before you come back with such drivel. Aren't you tired of making yourself look like an idiot yet?
Now I ask one thing of you... before you respond... Please read what I have written... and at least ATTEMPT to make a comprehensive, cohesive response... OK?
I'm Just trying to help you out here buddy...we all have confidence that you'll start using that great intellect you keep telling everyone you posses...
I hope that this info helps YOU.
solomyngrundy1968 go away little boy without a brain. And that is me being kind. Are you really that dumb or are you pretending just to be able to argue? Its all relevent when talking overpricing, YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR, the Gunner is bare bones, same class as the fat bob, not the class of the top of the line FXSB! You say Help me out? With your stupid opinions instead of facts, help yourself and be a man, admit you are wrong. Hahaha using my words lol "I hope this info helps you", you cant even be original, you are such a poser. The Gunner is the cheapest of the Victory line so of course to do a proper comparison you must use the cheapest HD in the same class, it doesnt get any easier than that but you obviously dont understand that, its obvious from your comments. Dont wast anymore of my time, I would rather polish the chrome on my bikes than deal with childish rhetoric.
Hey, do you see any oars on that grey thing called the Iowa? It's a ship! and yes, ships have guns.
I will never understand harley ( small H), a big bike 350 pounds and a single front brake disc ,they always bet on a crash to sell a new one and don't give a shit to what happens with the rider.
350? It's twice that...
Not all Harleys have 1 disk up front. For example the fat bob is like 4k cheaper and has dual massive front disks...I'd take that any day over this, but it's more of a bobber style, so not really a direct competitor.
MrSlowestD16 (Thank you for the reply) but my only concern was about safety features,do they provide them or no? ,do they care? my believe that life is such precious than a the look and is a news announcement "killing in a crash involving a nice sweet ride" exist?...my other believe is yes ! At harley factory.
zermomia the corrector say sorry he means ,belief.
zermomia Yeah, I agree with you that life is precious, they should definitely opt for the ABS, then.
In general, MOST cruisers have single disks, so there's nothing out of the ordinary about this Harley. There are definite exceptions, but the majority have 1 disk. Even the gunner in this comparison has only 1 disk. The fat bobs are nice b/c of their dual disk setup - it bites hard.
I don't think any manufacturer specifically cares about peoples' safety - they care about money, so they care about your safety because of that, but I wouldn't say Harley cares any less or more than the next big company.
To properly ride a Harley you really MUST use both brakes MOST of the time.
I love the reviews, but why the Gunner here when the Hammer 8-Ball is better choice for the comparrison, and more over where are all the reviews for the Hammer 8 -Ball; which if I had the choice would pick over the Gunner without question?
Should have compared to the vegas
with the money you save buying the victory you can pay for a better paintjob than the harley like 4 maybe 500 dollars depending on where you go it will varey
I like the paint job but ya, $5000 would go a long way to something.
I think the matte dark look of the victory looks awesome, and that Harley looks hideous
They are 16" guns. They have rifling in the barrels.
16" guns with rifling range approx. 25 miles
many aspects come into play when choosing the right motorcycle. however ill say deprecation on Victorys is something to take into account... they all depreciate but the Victorys are horrendous....but Victory has done a great job imitating a genuine Harley Davidson motorcycle. its most important to be out in the wind on 2 wheels no matter the brand ! Ride on my brothers and sisters!
Well said! Riding whatever you have and enjoying is the name of the game. Ride safe.
Harley looks great
If U into spending money on maintenance.. get a Harley.. with over 62 gaskets compared to victory 8 ..that's some thing.. not to mention oil cooled and air
Hi we here at motorcycle.com despise Harley cause we ride sport bikes, we're just giving you all a fair warning that we will take whatever shot we can at them so don't be to upset.
or harley just makes a crappy product.
+Seth D if that's what you think then okay.
If Harley was the only bike out there then I would ride it and probably be happy. But for what you pay for what you get, I think its a bad product. These guys rode both bikes and compared them extensively and found that the gunner was better. They don't take shots at harley just because. Lots of the guys there own or have owned harleys. A fair amount like the looks of harleys, just not the ride or the value.
+Seth D like I said if that's what you think
Fuck it, I need the exercise.
Triumph Thunderbird Storm is nicer then them both. More power too! Just doesn't sound as good as the Harley or the Victory.
fivefootsixtriumph 270 degree crank though ... ?!
Why is the gunner compared to the Breakout? No comparison other than Horse Power/torque. Gunner is probably more like the Street Bob or Fat Boy.
Damn drag queen bikes... I've made that mistake once, dragging hard parts in every turn gets old quick.
I guess that make sense. Pay More For LESS? :-? hehehehe
How a new revue Harley has 110 now
Wish they didn't both suck at clearance, too.
Lmao, the Harley does not look better.
When I grow up I want to be John Burns.
they sure scrape pavement too soon
Oh come now, who are we kidding here, only a Harley has looks, rides, feels, has fit and finish like a Harley. These two both secretly prefer the Harley. Nothing has attitude, presence, and owns the roads like a Harley...unless ya can't afford one, then yes, settle for a Victory, or anything else for that matter. Harley bashers, stop deluding yourselves.
TakMan1690 Harley Boy Or unless you're dumb enough to pay for a brand and buy an average blinged up motorcycle ...
I don't get how Harley bikes sell yet ? They weigh a ton you can't go around corners at all and my god there slow. I rode my friends new breakout I'm not impressed. His brother has a Yamaha roadstar and the Yamaha kills the breakout off the start and top end, and the Yamaha costed WAY LESS . And don't get me started on Harley aftermarket parts my friend dropped 2200 on rims, 600.00 for exhaust 400.00 for a air cleaner and his harley jacket cost 700.00 wtf.......
The Breakout looks exactly like the Star Raider... Harley copied a Japanese design??
Breakout by far, recently bought one..., Always Harley for me.
I'll ride a Harley before I ride a victory.
Mans bike for men and teenage kids rides what they can afford
+MotorPsycho what about the new Indians? Those are beautiful bikes.
This comparison is of two very different bikes. The Harley is much more show. Victory is much more go.
+Taylor St. Pierre agreed!
Surely a fatboy or fatbob would be a better comparison to the victory.
Victory all the way...Its a bike you can go anywhere.. If it ain't broke don't fix it...
Man that Gunner is sexy!!!!
harley holds resale and can ride for days
Can ride for days as long as you stop often to tighten your nuts and bolts...
Can ride for days as long as you don't hit traffic and overheat.
Can ride for days as long as you can handle their ergonomically unpleasing setups.
Truth be told though, no one rides a harley for their reliability. It sucks.
+Seth D I have am and still doing it. Truth be told haven't had one problem one discomfort and it's got plenty of pick up for public roads. So, as an owner and constant rider from,summer well into Christmas you are wrong in all counts
If it works for you then great. Most of my buddies bikes that are harleys must just be abnormal then as they always have to tinker with this or that. Or worse, they can't ride on the weekend cause its in the shop. In your world, your harley can ride for days. In my world, my buddies harleys cannot.
+Seth D maybe they should stop tinkering..
Maybe, but when it is broken or not running well then you have to do something. Told them to get something more reliable but they just keep dishing money into them. Each to their own I guess.
HD what else
Are they Cannons or Guns
Seth D Naval Guns..which is weird because navy ships used to have cannon on board .. ?!
apple to oranges comparison.. 2 diff. kinds of bikes and diff price ranges. Not a good match up. Id take the Harley though >_> . o yea I already have one. :)
Breakout
The victory was dragging the kickstand around the corners,, great way to wreck your bike,, plus ABS breaks,, alot more engineering was put into the harley thats why it is more money,,you get what you pay for... You guys also need to learn how to ride if you think its a work out to ride a fat tire bike..you only compare the snowmobile to Harley cause you know its the best and you guys are trying to save a sinking ship,, as to why Victory dealerships are closing nationwide ,, and they had to buy the Indian name cause they know america is full and aware of the poor quality motorcycles they make...
Did you just use Harley and engineering in the same sentence?
you get what you pay for? that was used as a example with harley .. now that's funny... so those cvo $40+k touring bike.. you get what you pay for there ? less HP, Less Torque, increased maintenance... (multiple fluids for 1 engine). and dragging a kick stand causing a wreck ? I guess you haven't ridden us129 the dragon
+Chris Free I don't know if you are making this shit up or just a hater. The gunner is....... well inferior. If you don't like HD so be it. Just face the facts the HD is better. Better engineered, better quality, better reliability.
The Harley is losing ground to better and better bikes like the Victory. You get what you pay for and in this case it's the middle aged bloke with a pony tail driving a Porsche who run Harley's marketing dept.
Harley, and no dual front discs!!!
Then should called it the victory gutter, because that's where it belongs. I can't imagine how sick Harley is with them coming out with a new design and then a competitor trying to copy it. It just shows that victories original models aren't selling that well. So now they have to start copying Harleys like all the other companies do.
+Angel D You do realize that Harley copies other manufacturers, too... right? No automotive manufacturer designs anything in a vacuum now. There's just too much competition.
Everyone copies something. I chose a Harley Davidson Night Train and moded it slightly. No issues to date with the Harley, and its in its 7th year. To each his own. The Gunner is a bare bones bike and of course it should be cheaper and IT IS a less sophisticated machine than the Harley. Ride what you like and like what you ride is my personal motto. Ride safe.
You do know that Harley copied the Vtwin design right? Harley has always been following the innovators. They have been using 100 year old technology and never improving their product so people just THINK that they came up with it.
Seth D wow and you learned all that in just 14 years? Youre a genius! Ok poser! Go listen to your Bieber songs now.
I don't know why you can't have a grown up conversation with someone
without having to sink to the level of name calling and bieber insults.
You are not contributing to this post. Go away troll
I've said it before, the victory is an ok motorcycle decent transportation, but the Harley has a soul.. the victory is just more or less comparable to a metric bike. the breakout is just a badass bike.
victory draggs too soon
Harley looks way better. The victory looks like shit
Harley is overpriced scrap metal. Victory has a classic look to it and comfort and performance as well. Not much to hate in it unless you envy the fact that Victory riders will be always on the road while harleys will be in the shop.
Deux belles motos,mais je préfère Harley!
For my money I would go Victory. For the cool factor Victory. For the power I would again go victory. Sorry Harley Victory has the win in my book. However Harley still wins cause Harley is still in business and Indian killed off Victory.
Victory is dead :(
estas dos motos no son comparables, han cojido una de las harleys mas caras y la comparan con una de las victorys mas baratas…. no tienen sentido. Y aun así la Big Gun no desentona nada...
Yep and I threw up
The victory loses its value fast and is a cookie cutter bike
+brianreynolds188 No offense, but that HD looks just like every other hog on the road ever. The Victory is classy and throw back.
More and more this guys sound like a commercial victory and indian, for starters how u compare a 13k bike with a 20k bike? Doesnt victory make a 20k or closer to the 20k price tag on the hd? Of course they do. Heck if they wer in the same league and it was a 5k difference or so even i would get the vic over the hd and am an hd rider, awful comparison if they keep.sounding like commercials for the vic and indian company i will have to unsuscribe..
Those two bikes are direct competitors. They're similar in style, target market, equipment, etc. The Harley is just overpriced.
And this video couldn't have been further from a "commercial". They both said how the Harley was as good as the Victory in a lot of ways, looked better, etc. You seem to be viewing this with a lot of bias and can't handle the fact that someone would chose anything other than the Harley.
Zanpa sorry but i disagree, that victory is a direct competitor.with a street bob, with a blacked out.look and flat.paint it looks totally off in this comparison meaning price.and looks, i love hd but i also love any bike and know that hd are not perfect by far and whenever i see this comparos i take the fact that its an hd out of the equation because quite frankly if i didnt it would be a waste of time u cant compete against brands but u can compete on looks performance etc, reason i say its a commercial.for victory is cuz ive seen alot.of videos lately wer this magazine of the back wants to handle over the trophy to the scout or any other bike from the brp family.
You hit the nail on the head.
If it we're engine size they go by then victory would win hands down so why compared them? I always look for a balance between money and what u get so yes if Harley was 2 or maybe 3k more OK whatever u pay for the name but 5 6k? This would of been a better comparison against the street Bob it has a 103 and it starts at the same price the Vic does its also blacked out or flat colors its a cruiser, I mean am I the only one that see's this? Look up harley davdison street Bob and tell me if that not the bike they we're trying to copy which is fine but wouldn't that be a better comparison? But I believe they didn't go that route Cuz it wouldn't be a comparison at all being almost the same price and having the HD brand most of us would go for the HD right? Like I said I love HD I own a 2014 street glide but I love all motorcycles I own a 07 Kawi and ride with Kawi or Honda riders Dont matter.
James N sorry but this conversation is over, first because if u cant see the similiraties on the gunner and the street bob well i cant help u with that, second cuz either u dont know what liquid cooled means or ur confused but the gunner is not.liquid cooled actually none.of.the victory line up is, they are oil cooled which is what they state... yes harleys are still air cooled u got.that right. Bottom line is that if u had 13k to spend i reall doubt u would.spend them on the victory over the hd unless u just hate hd or want to make a point. Victory are great bikes they have been my secondary bikes here and there but it feels like a jap copy of an engine and looks of a copied hd. Which it has to be that way hd has been around for a long time if they didnt want to copy they would.make some crazy crossover like the nx series bikes which i still.like and aplaud honda gor doing and not copying anymore they cannot beat hd at their own game now can victory nor any other brand now indian entering the game can be interesting but even then i think its a lil to late. Anyhow totally of topic my point was the comparison between this two bikes is totally off to much of a proce.diference and the person looking for the breakout would.be looking at the vic if u know hd riders its nos so much the brand why they wouldnt look at the vic its the feel.of that softail which personally indont care for.