Great discussion, I would also like to see them get rid of class v class modifiers all together. Wizards do less damage to every single class except another wizard. Early in the game you can overcome that to some extent by out gearing your opponents but when you are 740+ gear score and you do 18% less damage to a Striker/Mystic and they do 110% damage at end game thats just not possible. All these classes have thier class specific skills that should provide the protection and balace they need but throwing these class modifiers on top of that is unreasonable.
Good conversation to listen to. Havent meet/spoke to the other casters, but been in guild with Chadsini before and ask his opinions regularly. Went Evas under his tutelage and really enjoyed the class during that time. Also have chimed in on several of Piag's forum posts as he's usually spot on. I appreciate his passion and desire to keep the class from falling into oblivion. They're both 100% accurate on the class. Can barely bring myself to show up to war anymore and have started to invest time into other more "favored" PA classes as a result. PA gives ZERO... I repeat ZERO fucks about the Wizard class, with what appears to be a general animosity towards the Awakened players. Elementalization changes for witch and not wizard was an actual curb stomp to awk wizards. Torrential Cascade was an actual big middle finger after the curb stomp.. Ima give my unrequested opinions: (😃) They really have 3 options to help the class or they may as well remove the spec from the game: 1. Increase the damage so much that the rest of the insanely mobile classes have to run away 2. Increase the mobility where we can disengage fights like all the other classes. 3. Increase the tankiness so we can both SA trade and live long enough to do enough damage to secure a kill. My take on the DR/Evas was to roll hybrid, blue boots/green gloves. Uncapped is non-existent anyway these days and no one RBF's without an event. Running hybrid feels better when grinding(if you can call it that lol). Magic Shield take, a few options: -Increase mana pool(alot) to accommodate for the damage absorption. -Make the shield a static amount of absorption and longer CD. -"Torrential Shit stain" should be the mobile version, no ifs ands or buts about it.. Or just give the old skill back and make it a flow out of the water chain. -PVE I think would fall back into place with massive damage increases we desperately need. -I don't get Combat's take on different spec DR%. They do this now with other classes. If nothing else, put the original varrying DR% in SA by skill. Missed Things: -Pets - Pets should not die. Corsairs doesn't die. Nova's doesn't die. Tamer's doesn't die. Its just another FU from PA for a significant piece of our damage to be tied to pets and they're able to die. MOREOVER, while everyone else stands up from a death in NW to do damage around the stick, Witchards are forced to waste half the Invinc time bringing pet back out. So pets should be treated like buffs that persist through death. -Remove stun from Hellfire, (add SA back to it would be a bonus). The skill is a gap closer or filler damage on a combo. We don't need it messing up our CC caps. They made it to where you can grab out of hellfire, but if you do, you're cc capped, so the only things you can do is downsmash, damage, downsmash, damage, run. Hot Takes: -Grabs should be full SA. Its the worst grab in the game and only SA if it lands. We're a melee class, every other melee grab is protected. This is a no brainer.. The Pet idea is great but they'll never go for that. We can't have an original class be as cool as the new ones.. -Get rid of EarthQuake rebam. Replace with a combination of Magical Shield Red/Orb. Where you can either: 1. Have a -DP debuff that is an aura around you as you move in addition to existing magical shield buffs. 2. Have 50% DR while active.
Just a random shower thought about manashield. what if manashield gave a free-cast of your next ability stacking up to 5times, one charge aquired per 500 or 1000 mana drained during manashield?
I said before to my friends that wiz should have the option like sage does where he can grab close or at a mid range distance, can give us a a flame chain like scorpion from Mortal Combat
11:35 and so on, it's the same thing for succ lahn for years now. If we invest in dmg, we get 1shoted in every single scenario, if we invest in dr/eva our combo deals like 40% max hp to any class, 20% in case of zerker/striker/valk/warrior... Plus the movement skills are only FG/SA no , so we die while trying to back it up... Also half of the skills are bugged, the flights keep your hitbox on the ground so i get hit by flames/grabs while flying... stamina consumption, gaps at the beggining of the skills, 80% unprotected CCs... i feel like PA forgot about lahn succ and a lof of other classes to, and as you said, we got "nerfed" just by the changes and new metas/classes 23:00+ I'm sorry but if u get movement or tankiness in a wizard, having PA + Heals + Iframed TPs, you will be broken as fk. Classes like me (lahn) will have nothing to hunt you down and youi + rangers are our only focus at this point where everyone have massive movility and perma SA...
" having PA + Heals + Iframed TPs, you will be broken as fk " Let me address this in order so as to explain why it's stupid and you don't understand the class 1) Having PA in of itself really isn't all that big of an advantage nowadays because we have classes that already have upwards of 50% Damage reduction running around everywhere, being tankier than even WE are with Magical Shield AND PA popped at the same time. Seriously, I will have both active, something to the tune of 67% Damage reduction (Because they are multiplicative, not additive,) with 10840 health, and still die instantly. PA doesn't matter, or at least it never saves MY life, OR any of the other squishy classes that would supposedly benefit from it. 2) The heals got nerfed into the ground and are becoming increasingly irrelevant. All 3 are unprotected animation locks that require me to stand still. There are no cancels or quick casts for any of them, and all 3 risk getting CC'd by You, as a class who has many tools to immediately close the gap. as well as many others. I would like to further to this point mention that Wizard (on either spec) has **Zero Healing on Hit skills.** Absolutely none of our skills recover HP on hit. None. The heals are now static amounts of healing, which in the context of 11k+ health pools nowadays, literally doesn't matter. The change to from % to # was a pretty huge nerf. 3) Making Iframed TPs as an example of strength almost makes me laugh in the context of the classes that exist nowadays. Now, don't get me wrong - I can understand your view point of not having many s either, and perhaps this could be used as an observation of the game having *too many* movement skills in classes' kits, but I digress - Having Iframe TP is not an advantage, or unique, or even a strength. Classes in the game nowadays have more movement on less cooldowns that travel further distances than Teleport that are all Iframes. Take Hashashin, Ninja, Corsair, Guardian, DK, Tamer, Sorceress, Sage, Woosa, Maegu, and the new Dosa as examples. 6 of those classes have grabs, and the other 5 have skills that ignore Forward Guards and CC behind them. Furthermore, this conversation is in the context of **Awakening Wizard Only**. I would encourage you to read the video title. We are not discussing giving Succession anything, outside of maybe buffing Rabams/Skill enhancements, since Trembling Thunder (Melee) and Mana Arrows (0 Range so basically melee) are both trash skills. When I or anyone else in this video discusses giving Wizard more mobility, we are talking about the Awakening Wizard Kit, because it has none. Awakening Wizard gaining mobility has no bearing on your ability to operate as a Succession Lahn because you can FLY. I understand the bugs about your hitbox being on the ground - That isn't something we can reliably track. Another thing to consider, which I mention within the podcast, is that giving us mobility is NOT the same thing as giving us faster skills. We still have to commit to the same long 4+ second animation of casting Hellfire -> Bolide -> Magma -> Some follow up skill be it Chilling Wave, Barrage of Water or Aqua Jail Explosion. That is all still very slow. Not to mention, we ourselves are still susceptible to slows! You can still slow an Awakening Wizard! We don't have any form of slow cleanse and the way we MIGHT counter-act slows is already a NECESSITY to even play the class to begin with such that it doesn't even actually counter-act slows. (Speed Spell. I'm talking about Speed spell.) I could only DREAM of being able to move as free or fluidly as a Succession Lahn. Hell, I would even take the janky cancel-dependent movement that Warrior has over what we have now. At least then we would be able to take advantage of our grab. (Which would be suicide in large scale so don't mention it in that context) So no, we would not be OP.
@@pigslayer275 TY for your reply, now let me set some points straight: 1) The only class that have 60% dmg reduc. is Succ Nova, Valk awa (40%) and the rest of us only 10%-15%-20%, so having a 10 ppl PA is MASSIVE (you can check Ben Guild, top 1 guild league EU with 300+ victories and 1 defeat saying that the only way to win that easily is perma having PA from mages, so yes, it's massive). The problem is some classes should have never had 60% dmg reduccion, 30-40% at max, no more. Mages don't have the tankiness of a nova/valk, if u want the tankiness of a nova, play a nova, don't make wiz be a pseudo-nova/valk, it's not your role. 2) Mages tend to cast heals when they get CC cap and get up, healing everyone arround them for a good amount of HP. With the increase of DR builds, heals are big even after nerfs. All heals should be unprotected except 100%BSR like corsair (valk heal must be nerfed to be unprotected). Lahn succ recover barely close-to-0 hp per hit, even with both elixires running. We get like 1.5hp back with 3 skills and both elixires (one of the skills unprotected for 2s), how much hp u get back with 1 heal? 1.5k hp recovered with hits when i run around with 8k, 10k with shai buffs... nothing more to say, just garbage. 3)Do u wanna know which assassin do not have d mobility? lahn. So being one of the most squishy classes, glass canon, with 0 to run away or engage is really fun, you should try it and maybe you will be thankfull you have d TPs. Maegu, woosa, wiz, witch, dosa, sorc, ninja, kuno, ranger, hash, guardian, tamer, corsair... almost every assassin/rat class/ranged have d mobility. You don't know how strong it is until you lose it. Imagine if PA next patch change your TPs to SA... mages would rage as hell, as they should. 4) I understand the topic is Awakening Wizard, but i'm just trying to give you a POV from other classes so you can see that you have really strong tools to fight back. Of course every class need some fix or QoL, but some of the things pointed out in this podcast are just crazy. If you give good mobility to ranged classes you just turn them OP. Look at succ ranger, as lahn, they can run away from me even while flying, and they can even burst us down because the flights are SA. If you give more mobility to mages they will just throw CC/DMG until i run out of stamina chasing your TPs and get killed with the safety of "range". Also, lahn succ is another class with long animations (my whole combo without shai buffs is a 6-7s for 5 skills with 28% attack speed from buffs/addon/passive) thats why we desperate look for shai buffs, because ppl get up faster than our 4-5 skill combo with no down smash... We are also susceptible to slows. Our flights and glides now scale with movement speed, a -20% mov. speed shred make us move like when you carry 126% weight, plus no d mobility is a GG useless class (let's not mention we do not have slows either). Put a 5s 20% Slow on a lahn and you LITERALLY counter the whole class right now and die instant while trying to fly away in super slow motion. Oh and you have grab as a mage kekw. In conclusion: It's ok if u need some dmg, or some kind of QoL, but most of the things you said in the video are just above craziness... "Ranged grab, grab on summon, more s, more mobility, more protected skills, protected ccs"... I agree with a rework on mana shield since is garbage, but some things they said in the video is like me wanting to make full the flights, all CCs protected, 25% dmg reduction on lahn, add 2 or 3 down smashes because we have none, the awa grab for succ too, slows, and like 20-25% more pvp dmg... It would be the new drakania awakening... You can't get everything man, just be realistic... The problem is PA made some classes waaay to strong and the "old ones" fell behind so hard... I think the way is not buff every class to be broken as drakania/valk/zerk, etc, PA should tone down a bit the OP classes and check the old ones to be able to fight the new meta, because everything away from mages/shai/zerks/striker/mystic/maegus/woosa/musa/archer/ranger/corsair/valk/tamer is just griefing in pvp.
@@Seiza_InSomnia To be fair, the things in the post aren't all suggested in wholesale. None of us think that everything we suggest should be given all together, these are just lots of individual ideas that would give the class a Niche that it currently lacks Another thing I think you seem to not understand is that, again, we are talking about AWAKENING WIZARD. Which is a MELEE SPEC. NONE of its ranged options are viable tools right now, as we discussed in the staff skill section of the podcast, and none of the changes I personally would suggest would really change that outside of giving us some protected chip damage options. " don't make wiz be a pseudo-nova/valk, it's not your role." That's not what we're asking for, we're asking for either A) The mobility to have the agency to decide when we perform our role of big damage dump -> death or B) the Durability aka tankiness to be able to perform our role of again dump damage and then die. Currently we can't do any damage because if we invest into defense we instantly do 0 damage, and if we invest into offense we die before even the first skill goes off. " Oh and you have grab as a mage kekw. " Yes, the far & away worst grab in the game without comparison. But sure. Make the grab as a point, as if that's actually valid. " almost every assassin/rat class/ranged have d mobility. " Again, we're talking about Awakening wizard, which isn't a ranged class. It's a melee class with large AOEs. We don't call Awakening Sage a ranged class, do we? " POV from other classes so you can see that you have really strong tools to fight back " You're giving me your perspective, not multiple other classes. My perspective is that I DO NOT have ""really strong tools to fight back"" because they all got nerfed or just outright removed. Our slows are gone or significantly nerfed - We lost Ritardando, which was an Unprotected, animation lock 50% All slow, and had it replaced with a dogshit skill that has no interaction with the kit, no protection, no damage, no CC, not even a downsmash. Torrential Cascade is a terrible skill. This compounds the issue with the lack of mobility, because that was one of our FEW ways to be able to counter classes just walking up and Grabbing or CC-ing through FG. Our heals are all unprotected as I mentioned, our mobility actually got NERFED (See Magical Evasion Nerf th-cam.com/video/nmH92n38p_A/w-d-xo.html ), We didn't get the Witch Elementalization Iframe change ( www.naeu.playblackdesert.com/en-US/News/Detail?groupContentNo=7337&countryType=en-US#Witchard), We ALSO didn't get the 20% SA DR that Witch got. We only have 10% SA DR which is actually a nerf from pre-SA DR standardization because our Super armor damage reduction ranged from 10 to 25% depending on the skill. The TINY advantage we had with pre-absolute skills dealing more damage than absolutes and consequently actually relevant damage got nerfed too, so our entire staff kit deals 0 damage now; I can go on and think of more examples. It's just nerf after nerf after nerf, direct or not, so Awakening Wizard is in a terrible spot right now. " You can't get everything man, just be realistic..." I'm gonna write in a separate comment what I actually think should happen to the class on the whole, in case you want a more cohesive understanding of what I specifically am asking for. I don't think I want "Everything," I want to be functional as a class and have a role, instead of continuing to be in Class Identity Limbo like we have for the past 5 years.
Regarding what I actually want for the class, here's what I would list: Baseline: Increase Mana pool from ~1600 to 2000 at level 60. **Staff Skills** Multiple Magic Arrows -Add Forward Guard -Add actual input to the skill of S+RMB so we don't have to use it via hotkey while in staff stance -That's it. Concentrated Magical Arrow -Remove charge animation -Add forward guard before attack (so the attack is still unprotected) -Change to Knockdown in PVP Fireball -Remove Charge Animation -Increase burn DOT to 200 damage every 3 seconds for 12 seconds Fireball Explosion -Remove Fireball Sustaining buff, change input to Shift+LMB always, instead of during Fireball Sustaining Buff -Increase burn DOT to 200 damage every 3 seconds for 12 seconds Meteor -Add Super armor during cast, remove super armor when the actual attack is thrown, so it's only forward guard during actual attack -Increase burn DOT to 300 damage every 3 seconds for 18 seconds -Buff PVP damage by 10-15%, currently this skill hits like a wet noodle Lightning Storm -Allow to be cast independently via Hotkey -Add Forward Guard -Remove Stiffness Residual Lightning -Remove Windup Animation -Increase Casting Speed -Change CC to Knockdown, but remove multiple ticks (currently it's multiple bound ticks, should only be 1 tick) Blizzard -Remove slow, replace with a -AP Debuff (like, -20 AP or something) -Maintain Forward guard during cast Earth's Response -Increase distance traveled -Add Super Armor + Linger -Remove Float -Allow to be used from Awakening via the same A/D+LMB input, swapping to awakening on use Rain of Fire (Magnus skill) -Change from caster-centered to be a ranged skill similar to Prime: Residual Lightning or Prime: Bolide of Destruction -Reminder that this skill does not have a CC or a Debuff, It only does damage; I am not suggesting it gain a Debuff or a CC, Only that it become a ranged damage skill. Speed Spell -Remove entirely, or if you insist on it existing, make it a Prime skill that only Succession can use. -Make all Wizard skills, both Succession and Awakening, 20% Faster by default so that we are not reliant on this skill's uptime in order to play. -Add Super Armor if you're going to keep this skill. Magical Shield -Change behavior from Spending Mana to reduce damage to Reserving 60% of Total Mana to provide it's function +25% Damage Reduction and +30% all resistance. -By "Reserve" mana I mean Cap your Mana to that of 40% of your mana bar, i.e If you have 2000 base mana, this would consume 1200 mana for the duration it is toggled on, leaving you with 800 mana to use. -Add Super Armor to Cast -Change Functionality to be A Toggle, instead of based on duration -Reduce cooldown to 10 seconds Healing Aura -Add Super Armor -Increase healing from 1400 to 2600 -Increase animation speed by default Healing Lighthouse -Add Super Armor -That's it Sage's Memory -Reduce Cooldown from 3 minutes 30 seconds to 1 minute 30 seconds -Add Super Armor on cast **Awakening Skills** Magical Evasion, Flow: Magical Evasion -Change Cooldown to 2 seconds -Change from Super Armor to Invincible -> Super Armor linger -Upon use from Staff, swap to Sphera Stance -Allow to cancel Bolide of Destruction, Cataclysm, Water Sphere and Torrential Cascade with this skill. Flame Knot (The Grab) -Change to Knockdown on success -That's it Barrage of Water -Split this skill into two skills -The first skill would be the movement section, with its animation and endlag smoothed out, only being a movement skill. Skill details would be: -Costs 200 stamina, 6 second cooldown, Iframe during movement, SA linger for ~0.7 seconds upon ending, input would be W+RMB. -Second skill would just be current Barrage of Water's damage, but separated from the movement, as its own skill. -Remove Split damage from Barrage of Water Flow: Aqua Bomb (Flow off of Water Sphere) -Allow to be cast via RMB after Magma Bomb, Bolide of Destruction (Prioritize Magma Bomb, but cast Aqua Bomb if Magma Bomb is on cooldown), and Torrential Cascade -Remove Air Smash -Remove Split Damage Flame's Calling -Change to auto-cast with Hellfire, and become part of Hellfire as a skill Aqua Jail Explosion -Allow to be cast and then canceled by the above described Movement skill from Barrage of Water, Continuing its damage at the end of that skill's movement path Elementalization -Allow use from Staff if Freeze is locked -Give the change Witch got to Wizard; Change from Super Armor -> Iframe while moving -> unprotected upon landing to Iframe on Cast and while moving -> Super Armor upon landing
@@Seiza_InSomnia Just to pick apart more directly; everything what Pig said was already correct. "You can check Ben Guild, top 1 guild league EU with 300+ victories and 1 defeat saying that the only way to win that easily is perma having PA from mages, so yes, it's massive)." A. being a PA bot is not a class identity B. PA has a 60s re-apply CD. Ben is not kiting its opponents for 60s and only fighting with PA up. "Mages tend to cast heals when they get CC cap and get up, healing everyone arround them for a good amount of HP." Being CC immune implies one of two things. A. your opponents failed to properly follow-up on their initial CCs B. you are running a defensive (read: shai) build that sacrifices all offensive values to ensure recovery from non-targeted damage. "We get like 1.5hp back with 3 skills and both elixires (one of the skills unprotected for 2s), how much hp u get back with 1 heal?" A. we restore 1.5khp / pulse, with our normal healing lighthouse almost *always* being cancelled by the 2nd pulse, as else we will have used up even your assumed-CC-immunity time. At best, we will thus heal ourselves 3khp, usually only 1.5. B. you on the other hand, are able to heal *while damaging an opponent*, thus exerting pressure. As a witchard, all we can do is build up massive pressure and then drop it all to heal, or *attempt* to disengage and heal... read pig's notes regarding mobility here. "Do u wanna know which assassin do not have d mobility? lahn. So being one of the most squishy classes, glass canon, with 0 to run away or engage is really fun" A. Vertical mobility is a form of damage reduction B. Succ lahn has some of the most untrackable and freedom-filled mobility kits in the game. You choose with extreme precision the exact position and timing of your engage. You further have the ability to select between quicker burst combos AND extended riskier combos. Finally, you have an extremely high damage kit, out-trading even classes such as Musa (another class with little to no " mobility", yet considered meta in all capped content). "Of course every class need some fix or QoL, but some of the things pointed out in this podcast are just crazy" A. No, they don't. Some of us hold the opinion that the only way to fix witchards in the modern game, is to delete the modern game. Revert 4 years of power creep, delete many of the newly released classes, delete succession. Only then can our archetype class exist, without being doomed to endless power creep. You seem to approach this perspective later on, but not nearly to the extent of how far we take it... As a reminder, awakening witch scored 3rd *worst* in AoS global rankings. She is not given exceptions for largescale recruitment. She is the worst 1v1 duelist in the game.
I am trying to learn wizard so people in my guild just getting out of seasonal who likes the class can have something other than reroll to witch as an answer.
I always tell people if you enjoy a class just keep playing it. The class CAN work you just have to work harder to do so. If you want to learn more to tell your guild I do have a awkened wizard pvp guide video.
Wizard is a mediocre PvE'er at high end, unless you're at Highlands/Trolls/Dekhia spot. Wizard is a mediocre PvP'er in capped content and more of a full blown support class in uncapped.
Buff awake wiz fr! Thanks for having me blue, it was fun!
Glad to have you and happy you enjoyed the discussion!
Thank you Bluesky900, we talked about it on stream that you would probably do this! always nice to see pl talking about our class. (PS: Jovitt)
Great discussion, I would also like to see them get rid of class v class modifiers all together. Wizards do less damage to every single class except another wizard. Early in the game you can overcome that to some extent by out gearing your opponents but when you are 740+ gear score and you do 18% less damage to a Striker/Mystic and they do 110% damage at end game thats just not possible. All these classes have thier class specific skills that should provide the protection and balace they need but throwing these class modifiers on top of that is unreasonable.
Good conversation to listen to. Havent meet/spoke to the other casters, but been in guild with Chadsini before and ask his opinions regularly. Went Evas under his tutelage and really enjoyed the class during that time.
Also have chimed in on several of Piag's forum posts as he's usually spot on. I appreciate his passion and desire to keep the class from falling into oblivion.
They're both 100% accurate on the class.
Can barely bring myself to show up to war anymore and have started to invest time into other more "favored" PA classes as a result.
PA gives ZERO... I repeat ZERO fucks about the Wizard class, with what appears to be a general animosity towards the Awakened players.
Elementalization changes for witch and not wizard was an actual curb stomp to awk wizards.
Torrential Cascade was an actual big middle finger after the curb stomp..
Ima give my unrequested opinions: (😃)
They really have 3 options to help the class or they may as well remove the spec from the game:
1. Increase the damage so much that the rest of the insanely mobile classes have to run away
2. Increase the mobility where we can disengage fights like all the other classes.
3. Increase the tankiness so we can both SA trade and live long enough to do enough damage to secure a kill.
My take on the DR/Evas was to roll hybrid, blue boots/green gloves.
Uncapped is non-existent anyway these days and no one RBF's without an event.
Running hybrid feels better when grinding(if you can call it that lol).
Magic Shield take, a few options:
-Increase mana pool(alot) to accommodate for the damage absorption.
-Make the shield a static amount of absorption and longer CD.
-"Torrential Shit stain" should be the mobile version, no ifs ands or buts about it.. Or just give the old skill back and make it a flow out of the water chain.
-PVE I think would fall back into place with massive damage increases we desperately need.
-I don't get Combat's take on different spec DR%. They do this now with other classes. If nothing else, put the original varrying DR% in SA by skill.
Missed Things:
-Pets - Pets should not die. Corsairs doesn't die. Nova's doesn't die. Tamer's doesn't die. Its just another FU from PA for a significant piece of our damage to be tied to pets and they're able to die.
MOREOVER, while everyone else stands up from a death in NW to do damage around the stick, Witchards are forced to waste half the Invinc time bringing pet back out. So pets should be treated like buffs that persist through death.
-Remove stun from Hellfire, (add SA back to it would be a bonus). The skill is a gap closer or filler damage on a combo. We don't need it messing up our CC caps. They made it to where you can grab out of hellfire, but if you do, you're cc capped, so the only things you can do is downsmash, damage, downsmash, damage, run.
Hot Takes:
-Grabs should be full SA. Its the worst grab in the game and only SA if it lands. We're a melee class, every other melee grab is protected. This is a no brainer..
The Pet idea is great but they'll never go for that. We can't have an original class be as cool as the new ones..
-Get rid of EarthQuake rebam. Replace with a combination of Magical Shield Red/Orb. Where you can either:
1. Have a -DP debuff that is an aura around you as you move in addition to existing magical shield buffs.
2. Have 50% DR while active.
Just a random shower thought about manashield. what if manashield gave a free-cast of your next ability stacking up to 5times, one charge aquired per 500 or 1000 mana drained during manashield?
I said before to my friends that wiz should have the option like sage does where he can grab close or at a mid range distance, can give us a a flame chain like scorpion from Mortal Combat
So.. does Goordian beat wizard now? Or should I still be Sad? 😁
I’ve been saying for a while that flow magical evasion should be 2 seconds if it’s an SA
11:35 and so on, it's the same thing for succ lahn for years now. If we invest in dmg, we get 1shoted in every single scenario, if we invest in dr/eva our combo deals like 40% max hp to any class, 20% in case of zerker/striker/valk/warrior... Plus the movement skills are only FG/SA no , so we die while trying to back it up...
Also half of the skills are bugged, the flights keep your hitbox on the ground so i get hit by flames/grabs while flying... stamina consumption, gaps at the beggining of the skills, 80% unprotected CCs... i feel like PA forgot about lahn succ and a lof of other classes to, and as you said, we got "nerfed" just by the changes and new metas/classes
23:00+ I'm sorry but if u get movement or tankiness in a wizard, having PA + Heals + Iframed TPs, you will be broken as fk. Classes like me (lahn) will have nothing to hunt you down and youi + rangers are our only focus at this point where everyone have massive movility and perma SA...
" having PA + Heals + Iframed TPs, you will be broken as fk "
Let me address this in order so as to explain why it's stupid and you don't understand the class
1) Having PA in of itself really isn't all that big of an advantage nowadays because we have classes that already have upwards of 50% Damage reduction running around everywhere, being tankier than even WE are with Magical Shield AND PA popped at the same time. Seriously, I will have both active, something to the tune of 67% Damage reduction (Because they are multiplicative, not additive,) with 10840 health, and still die instantly. PA doesn't matter, or at least it never saves MY life, OR any of the other squishy classes that would supposedly benefit from it.
2) The heals got nerfed into the ground and are becoming increasingly irrelevant. All 3 are unprotected animation locks that require me to stand still. There are no cancels or quick casts for any of them, and all 3 risk getting CC'd by You, as a class who has many tools to immediately close the gap. as well as many others.
I would like to further to this point mention that Wizard (on either spec) has **Zero Healing on Hit skills.** Absolutely none of our skills recover HP on hit. None.
The heals are now static amounts of healing, which in the context of 11k+ health pools nowadays, literally doesn't matter. The change to from % to # was a pretty huge nerf.
3) Making Iframed TPs as an example of strength almost makes me laugh in the context of the classes that exist nowadays. Now, don't get me wrong - I can understand your view point of not having many s either, and perhaps this could be used as an observation of the game having *too many* movement skills in classes' kits, but I digress -
Having Iframe TP is not an advantage, or unique, or even a strength. Classes in the game nowadays have more movement on less cooldowns that travel further distances than Teleport that are all Iframes. Take Hashashin, Ninja, Corsair, Guardian, DK, Tamer, Sorceress, Sage, Woosa, Maegu, and the new Dosa as examples. 6 of those classes have grabs, and the other 5 have skills that ignore Forward Guards and CC behind them.
Furthermore, this conversation is in the context of **Awakening Wizard Only**. I would encourage you to read the video title. We are not discussing giving Succession anything, outside of maybe buffing Rabams/Skill enhancements, since Trembling Thunder (Melee) and Mana Arrows (0 Range so basically melee) are both trash skills.
When I or anyone else in this video discusses giving Wizard more mobility, we are talking about the Awakening Wizard Kit, because it has none. Awakening Wizard gaining mobility has no bearing on your ability to operate as a Succession Lahn because you can FLY. I understand the bugs about your hitbox being on the ground - That isn't something we can reliably track.
Another thing to consider, which I mention within the podcast, is that giving us mobility is NOT the same thing as giving us faster skills. We still have to commit to the same long 4+ second animation of casting Hellfire -> Bolide -> Magma -> Some follow up skill be it Chilling Wave, Barrage of Water or Aqua Jail Explosion. That is all still very slow.
Not to mention, we ourselves are still susceptible to slows! You can still slow an Awakening Wizard! We don't have any form of slow cleanse and the way we MIGHT counter-act slows is already a NECESSITY to even play the class to begin with such that it doesn't even actually counter-act slows. (Speed Spell. I'm talking about Speed spell.)
I could only DREAM of being able to move as free or fluidly as a Succession Lahn. Hell, I would even take the janky cancel-dependent movement that Warrior has over what we have now. At least then we would be able to take advantage of our grab. (Which would be suicide in large scale so don't mention it in that context)
So no, we would not be OP.
@@pigslayer275 TY for your reply, now let me set some points straight:
1) The only class that have 60% dmg reduc. is Succ Nova, Valk awa (40%) and the rest of us only 10%-15%-20%, so having a 10 ppl PA is MASSIVE (you can check Ben Guild, top 1 guild league EU with 300+ victories and 1 defeat saying that the only way to win that easily is perma having PA from mages, so yes, it's massive). The problem is some classes should have never had 60% dmg reduccion, 30-40% at max, no more. Mages don't have the tankiness of a nova/valk, if u want the tankiness of a nova, play a nova, don't make wiz be a pseudo-nova/valk, it's not your role.
2) Mages tend to cast heals when they get CC cap and get up, healing everyone arround them for a good amount of HP. With the increase of DR builds, heals are big even after nerfs. All heals should be unprotected except 100%BSR like corsair (valk heal must be nerfed to be unprotected). Lahn succ recover barely close-to-0 hp per hit, even with both elixires running. We get like 1.5hp back with 3 skills and both elixires (one of the skills unprotected for 2s), how much hp u get back with 1 heal? 1.5k hp recovered with hits when i run around with 8k, 10k with shai buffs... nothing more to say, just garbage.
3)Do u wanna know which assassin do not have d mobility? lahn. So being one of the most squishy classes, glass canon, with 0 to run away or engage is really fun, you should try it and maybe you will be thankfull you have d TPs. Maegu, woosa, wiz, witch, dosa, sorc, ninja, kuno, ranger, hash, guardian, tamer, corsair... almost every assassin/rat class/ranged have d mobility. You don't know how strong it is until you lose it. Imagine if PA next patch change your TPs to SA... mages would rage as hell, as they should.
4) I understand the topic is Awakening Wizard, but i'm just trying to give you a POV from other classes so you can see that you have really strong tools to fight back. Of course every class need some fix or QoL, but some of the things pointed out in this podcast are just crazy. If you give good mobility to ranged classes you just turn them OP. Look at succ ranger, as lahn, they can run away from me even while flying, and they can even burst us down because the flights are SA. If you give more mobility to mages they will just throw CC/DMG until i run out of stamina chasing your TPs and get killed with the safety of "range". Also, lahn succ is another class with long animations (my whole combo without shai buffs is a 6-7s for 5 skills with 28% attack speed from buffs/addon/passive) thats why we desperate look for shai buffs, because ppl get up faster than our 4-5 skill combo with no down smash... We are also susceptible to slows. Our flights and glides now scale with movement speed, a -20% mov. speed shred make us move like when you carry 126% weight, plus no d mobility is a GG useless class (let's not mention we do not have slows either). Put a 5s 20% Slow on a lahn and you LITERALLY counter the whole class right now and die instant while trying to fly away in super slow motion.
Oh and you have grab as a mage kekw.
In conclusion: It's ok if u need some dmg, or some kind of QoL, but most of the things you said in the video are just above craziness... "Ranged grab, grab on summon, more s, more mobility, more protected skills, protected ccs"... I agree with a rework on mana shield since is garbage, but some things they said in the video is like me wanting to make full the flights, all CCs protected, 25% dmg reduction on lahn, add 2 or 3 down smashes because we have none, the awa grab for succ too, slows, and like 20-25% more pvp dmg... It would be the new drakania awakening... You can't get everything man, just be realistic... The problem is PA made some classes waaay to strong and the "old ones" fell behind so hard... I think the way is not buff every class to be broken as drakania/valk/zerk, etc, PA should tone down a bit the OP classes and check the old ones to be able to fight the new meta, because everything away from mages/shai/zerks/striker/mystic/maegus/woosa/musa/archer/ranger/corsair/valk/tamer is just griefing in pvp.
@@Seiza_InSomnia
To be fair, the things in the post aren't all suggested in wholesale. None of us think that everything we suggest should be given all together, these are just lots of individual ideas that would give the class a Niche that it currently lacks
Another thing I think you seem to not understand is that, again, we are talking about AWAKENING WIZARD. Which is a MELEE SPEC. NONE of its ranged options are viable tools right now, as we discussed in the staff skill section of the podcast, and none of the changes I personally would suggest would really change that outside of giving us some protected chip damage options.
" don't make wiz be a pseudo-nova/valk, it's not your role."
That's not what we're asking for, we're asking for either A) The mobility to have the agency to decide when we perform our role of big damage dump -> death
or B) the Durability aka tankiness to be able to perform our role of again dump damage and then die.
Currently we can't do any damage because if we invest into defense we instantly do 0 damage, and if we invest into offense we die before even the first skill goes off.
" Oh and you have grab as a mage kekw. "
Yes, the far & away worst grab in the game without comparison. But sure. Make the grab as a point, as if that's actually valid.
" almost every assassin/rat class/ranged have d mobility. "
Again, we're talking about Awakening wizard, which isn't a ranged class. It's a melee class with large AOEs. We don't call Awakening Sage a ranged class, do we?
" POV from other classes so you can see that you have really strong tools to fight back "
You're giving me your perspective, not multiple other classes. My perspective is that I DO NOT have ""really strong tools to fight back"" because they all got nerfed or just outright removed.
Our slows are gone or significantly nerfed - We lost Ritardando, which was an Unprotected, animation lock 50% All slow, and had it replaced with a dogshit skill that has no interaction with the kit, no protection, no damage, no CC, not even a downsmash. Torrential Cascade is a terrible skill.
This compounds the issue with the lack of mobility, because that was one of our FEW ways to be able to counter classes just walking up and Grabbing or CC-ing through FG.
Our heals are all unprotected as I mentioned, our mobility actually got NERFED (See Magical Evasion Nerf th-cam.com/video/nmH92n38p_A/w-d-xo.html ),
We didn't get the Witch Elementalization Iframe change ( www.naeu.playblackdesert.com/en-US/News/Detail?groupContentNo=7337&countryType=en-US#Witchard),
We ALSO didn't get the 20% SA DR that Witch got. We only have 10% SA DR which is actually a nerf from pre-SA DR standardization because our Super armor damage reduction ranged from 10 to 25% depending on the skill.
The TINY advantage we had with pre-absolute skills dealing more damage than absolutes and consequently actually relevant damage got nerfed too, so our entire staff kit deals 0 damage now; I can go on and think of more examples.
It's just nerf after nerf after nerf, direct or not, so Awakening Wizard is in a terrible spot right now.
" You can't get everything man, just be realistic..."
I'm gonna write in a separate comment what I actually think should happen to the class on the whole, in case you want a more cohesive understanding of what I specifically am asking for. I don't think I want "Everything," I want to be functional as a class and have a role, instead of continuing to be in Class Identity Limbo like we have for the past 5 years.
Regarding what I actually want for the class, here's what I would list:
Baseline: Increase Mana pool from ~1600 to 2000 at level 60.
**Staff Skills**
Multiple Magic Arrows
-Add Forward Guard
-Add actual input to the skill of S+RMB so we don't have to use it via hotkey while in staff stance
-That's it.
Concentrated Magical Arrow
-Remove charge animation
-Add forward guard before attack (so the attack is still unprotected)
-Change to Knockdown in PVP
Fireball
-Remove Charge Animation
-Increase burn DOT to 200 damage every 3 seconds for 12 seconds
Fireball Explosion
-Remove Fireball Sustaining buff, change input to Shift+LMB always, instead of during Fireball Sustaining Buff
-Increase burn DOT to 200 damage every 3 seconds for 12 seconds
Meteor
-Add Super armor during cast, remove super armor when the actual attack is thrown, so it's only forward guard during actual attack
-Increase burn DOT to 300 damage every 3 seconds for 18 seconds
-Buff PVP damage by 10-15%, currently this skill hits like a wet noodle
Lightning Storm
-Allow to be cast independently via Hotkey
-Add Forward Guard
-Remove Stiffness
Residual Lightning
-Remove Windup Animation
-Increase Casting Speed
-Change CC to Knockdown, but remove multiple ticks (currently it's multiple bound ticks, should only be 1 tick)
Blizzard
-Remove slow, replace with a -AP Debuff (like, -20 AP or something)
-Maintain Forward guard during cast
Earth's Response
-Increase distance traveled
-Add Super Armor + Linger
-Remove Float
-Allow to be used from Awakening via the same A/D+LMB input, swapping to awakening on use
Rain of Fire (Magnus skill)
-Change from caster-centered to be a ranged skill similar to Prime: Residual Lightning or Prime: Bolide of Destruction
-Reminder that this skill does not have a CC or a Debuff, It only does damage; I am not suggesting it gain a Debuff or a CC, Only that it become a ranged damage skill.
Speed Spell
-Remove entirely, or if you insist on it existing, make it a Prime skill that only Succession can use.
-Make all Wizard skills, both Succession and Awakening, 20% Faster by default so that we are not reliant on this skill's uptime in order to play.
-Add Super Armor if you're going to keep this skill.
Magical Shield
-Change behavior from Spending Mana to reduce damage to Reserving 60% of Total Mana to provide it's function +25% Damage Reduction and +30% all resistance.
-By "Reserve" mana I mean Cap your Mana to that of 40% of your mana bar, i.e If you have 2000 base mana, this would consume 1200 mana for the duration it is toggled on, leaving you with 800 mana to use.
-Add Super Armor to Cast
-Change Functionality to be A Toggle, instead of based on duration
-Reduce cooldown to 10 seconds
Healing Aura
-Add Super Armor
-Increase healing from 1400 to 2600
-Increase animation speed by default
Healing Lighthouse
-Add Super Armor
-That's it
Sage's Memory
-Reduce Cooldown from 3 minutes 30 seconds to 1 minute 30 seconds
-Add Super Armor on cast
**Awakening Skills**
Magical Evasion, Flow: Magical Evasion
-Change Cooldown to 2 seconds
-Change from Super Armor to Invincible -> Super Armor linger
-Upon use from Staff, swap to Sphera Stance
-Allow to cancel Bolide of Destruction, Cataclysm, Water Sphere and Torrential Cascade with this skill.
Flame Knot (The Grab)
-Change to Knockdown on success
-That's it
Barrage of Water
-Split this skill into two skills
-The first skill would be the movement section, with its animation and endlag smoothed out, only being a movement skill. Skill details would be:
-Costs 200 stamina, 6 second cooldown, Iframe during movement, SA linger for ~0.7 seconds upon ending, input would be W+RMB.
-Second skill would just be current Barrage of Water's damage, but separated from the movement, as its own skill.
-Remove Split damage from Barrage of Water
Flow: Aqua Bomb (Flow off of Water Sphere)
-Allow to be cast via RMB after Magma Bomb, Bolide of Destruction (Prioritize Magma Bomb, but cast Aqua Bomb if Magma Bomb is on cooldown), and Torrential Cascade
-Remove Air Smash
-Remove Split Damage
Flame's Calling
-Change to auto-cast with Hellfire, and become part of Hellfire as a skill
Aqua Jail Explosion
-Allow to be cast and then canceled by the above described Movement skill from Barrage of Water, Continuing its damage at the end of that skill's movement path
Elementalization
-Allow use from Staff if Freeze is locked
-Give the change Witch got to Wizard; Change from
Super Armor -> Iframe while moving -> unprotected upon landing
to
Iframe on Cast and while moving -> Super Armor upon landing
@@Seiza_InSomnia Just to pick apart more directly; everything what Pig said was already correct.
"You can check Ben Guild, top 1 guild league EU with 300+ victories and 1 defeat saying that the only way to win that easily is perma having PA from mages, so yes, it's massive)."
A. being a PA bot is not a class identity
B. PA has a 60s re-apply CD. Ben is not kiting its opponents for 60s and only fighting with PA up.
"Mages tend to cast heals when they get CC cap and get up, healing everyone arround them for a good amount of HP."
Being CC immune implies one of two things.
A. your opponents failed to properly follow-up on their initial CCs
B. you are running a defensive (read: shai) build that sacrifices all offensive values to ensure recovery from non-targeted damage.
"We get like 1.5hp back with 3 skills and both elixires (one of the skills unprotected for 2s), how much hp u get back with 1 heal?"
A. we restore 1.5khp / pulse, with our normal healing lighthouse almost *always* being cancelled by the 2nd pulse, as else we will have used up even your assumed-CC-immunity time. At best, we will thus heal ourselves 3khp, usually only 1.5.
B. you on the other hand, are able to heal *while damaging an opponent*, thus exerting pressure. As a witchard, all we can do is build up massive pressure and then drop it all to heal, or *attempt* to disengage and heal... read pig's notes regarding mobility here.
"Do u wanna know which assassin do not have d mobility? lahn. So being one of the most squishy classes, glass canon, with 0 to run away or engage is really fun"
A. Vertical mobility is a form of damage reduction
B. Succ lahn has some of the most untrackable and freedom-filled mobility kits in the game. You choose with extreme precision the exact position and timing of your engage. You further have the ability to select between quicker burst combos AND extended riskier combos. Finally, you have an extremely high damage kit, out-trading even classes such as Musa (another class with little to no " mobility", yet considered meta in all capped content).
"Of course every class need some fix or QoL, but some of the things pointed out in this podcast are just crazy"
A. No, they don't. Some of us hold the opinion that the only way to fix witchards in the modern game, is to delete the modern game. Revert 4 years of power creep, delete many of the newly released classes, delete succession. Only then can our archetype class exist, without being doomed to endless power creep. You seem to approach this perspective later on, but not nearly to the extent of how far we take it...
As a reminder, awakening witch scored 3rd *worst* in AoS global rankings. She is not given exceptions for largescale recruitment. She is the worst 1v1 duelist in the game.
I am trying to learn wizard so people in my guild just getting out of seasonal who likes the class can have something other than reroll to witch as an answer.
as someone who's played wiz for 7 years I will tell you reroll to witch it's better lol
I always tell people if you enjoy a class just keep playing it. The class CAN work you just have to work harder to do so. If you want to learn more to tell your guild I do have a awkened wizard pvp guide video.
Wizard is a mediocre PvE'er at high end, unless you're at Highlands/Trolls/Dekhia spot.
Wizard is a mediocre PvP'er in capped content and more of a full blown support class in uncapped.
At this point Pa said let’s make wizard shais brother
I also miss how summoning a pet used to work
Awakene d and such wizard both need damage upgrades. A scholar that’s full tank can kill us in 1 combo
Does shift Q hv anyway instantly cast? The animation looks so stupid and no dmg
buff awake wiz pls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Also how they changed ritardando into this new dumbass skill which is unprotected and has a long ass cast time. like wtf are they even thinking bro
I am malding buff awakening wizard
Also RIP water bubble I can’t be Kisame anymore
Yah rip the only skill that let us able to combat the moibility creep that we are left out of.
it's not about wizard, it's just other classes is being over tuned.
in game sounds coming through the podcast was kind of annoying :s