Your channel is one of the most consistently good fitness channels on youtube. No bullshit, no click-bait titles, no burying the lead, no gimmicks. Just want to say how much I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and skills on this platform. Your advice and tips with kettlebells have changed my life. I've still got a long way to go in my fitness journey but you've put me on the path. Thanks, man.
The best thing about the nerd math videos is I either get the satisfaction that I am programming correctly or I find out that I'm not, but know have the info I need. Win-win.
So incredibly good! I really wish I had an understanding of your nerd math 30 years ago... But, I've got it on lock now and it's made me a better human being. One million thanks!
Always a help Mark. If goal is just something in the areas of GPP...What should the variables be to progress this over 6- or 12-months? Or even 3 years... Add more volume, (sets and/or reps in the ladder pattern)? increase density (shorter rests)? increase loads? or would you “undulate” ....make each of the 2 or 3 days / wk focus on improving a different effect, ie strength day low volume heavy loaded , endurance day raise volume, power day go fast, shorten rest? So many variables!!
Love it. Great explanation. BTW, that is the first time I have seen anyone doing long division since my degree studies over 20 years ago. Good to see though.
Mark, what are your thoughts on higher rep reverse ladders for 2 hand club as a way to keep the grip from being the failure point? Do you know of any better ways to work around grip limitations until it adapts?
Hey, Mark! Have you ever heard/applied an interval training with Kettlebell? There's a book on something like this written by Kenneth Jay it is basically X amount of snatches 15 seconds on/ 15 seconds off going up to 80 rounds.
Thanks for information! But i do not understand. Do you mean 60-80% from what ? If i can not do 16kg 5x5-4-3-1 ,i should do 20 kg 10x3-2-1 or 6-8 x 3-2-1 ?
This is great. I have weird weights (bought a bunch of CAP stuff from a sporting goods store and it's all in multiples of five freedom units, er, lbs), so the arithmetic isn't as slick, but I have learned how to mostly not kill myself when changing weights. As for the heavier weight being harder with the same overall volume, how far down would you wave the load? I have issues with feeling like I'm taking it "too easy" when I'm really just trying not to die.
You either need a bigger white board or an additional white board. I vote for an additional one, because you can attach them with hinges (to keep it all neat and tidy).
Thanks, I've been wrestling with the issue of changing weights lately and this video clarifies the process. I assume the process is the same for straight sets (not ladders) ?
I just want your app to be released and let it do all this thinking for me. I’ve got so many little pages in my notebook of this stuff and it’s just time I don’t have.
It seems that it's easy to outsource our memory to our phones but not our thinking. On the upside however, using our brains will make them stronger. Stronger physically, emotionally and mentally with each training session 😎
Wauw, I think this was actually an answer to a question I posted, so thank you very much! One thing in the question that was maybe not fully covered or that I didnt ask clearly: If you are at 5 x 5/4/3/2/1 (which I think you stated somewhere is "the goal") with 16kg and are then also doing C&P with a 20kg, (5 x 3/2/1) how do you then progress you Heavy/ light to keep the light volume significantly higher than your heavy total volume? Do you go above 5 x 5/4/3/2/1 with the 16kg or do you decide that the 20KG is now your light and give Kettlebell Kings more of your life savings to get a bigger bell or maybe you just realise you didn't time your light/ heavy progression correctly and just work out while trying to forget all the math? :) Thanks again for all this amazing content!
@@namenloss It was in earlier videos. He talks about preferring EMOMs but in later videos he mentions doing reverse ladders for heavier weights. I don't know the videos off the top of my head but he did some Tetris of programming videos last summer that may touch on it.
Easy way to figure out new total reps at new weight... New total reps = old total reps x old weight / new weight So in the above example... new reps = 150 reps x 16kg / 20 kg = 120 reps. Then just figure out needed sets based on what ladder you're doing
Is this how to calculate for the difference in your Heavy/Light days? And, is this also a formula for starting your next weight in a progressive overload scheme? Thank you for these videos they are great!
Interested in your thoughts on the value of a rev Ladder with the same weight vs a Ladder with descending weights (e.g. E3.5MO3.5M 5 rung rev ladder x 24 Kg vs E5MO5M 1/1x 40, 2/2x 32, 3/3x 28, 4/4x 24, 5/5x 16 Kg). I have been alternating between the two and treat the Ladder as my "Heavy Day" and rev Ladder as my "Light Day".
I have only tried it with C+P but I imagine it would work well for Squats or other grind type movements as long as you keep the weight(s) near the threshold of possible for each rung.
I love it. But I am so confused now. I started with the “tetris to KB workout” where 1 day was KB, 1 day to DH HC, 1 day SH HC. I would love to use your app, but it’s not happening right now. How do we use this in our perfect math? Thank you! (Big bear lake?)
my left shoulder is arthritic. Swings aren't a problem so I go with a heavier weight than c&p or snatch. It is humbling to c&p or snatch with a 20lb bell but my shoulder is responding. Also hang and do various rehab/prehab work which seems to help. Sometimes after some work with the 20 my shoulder feels good, like I could go more heavy (talk like Mark). So far I'm just working my way slowly up the volume tree. I'm just beginning to consider the TGU again.
@@MarkWildman I am doing my Clean and press with a 20kg and a 16kg weight so I was asking whether I can use this same method to keep my work capacity same with both weights so I can have a light day with the 16kg one and a heavy day with the 20 kg one.
Do reverse ladders always have to end in a single rep? As the ladder get "taller" I have a problem that 1 set takes too long which is why I would prefer to terminate before reaching 1 rep. So, do sets of 8/7/6/5/4 make sense?
I have some sets where I don't do the last rep or the last 2 reps (5/4/3, 4/3/2, etc.) but I never go past 5 reps. I use that as my guide for how heavy the weight is, but that's just me. The 8/7/6/5/4 sets make sense for a reverse ladder, but not for a heavy set. If you can do that, then the weight isn't all that heavy. My issue was towards the end of my set the hand switch was getting dangerous with my grip being worn out, so the single reps became a sacrifice.
I think that's missing the entire point of the reverse ladder program isn't it? If you are pressing a reverse ladder your doing 5 left and five right and then four and three and two and one. You are not resting or putting the bell down at all until you have finished the entire 30 reps. The last one on the left and one on the right should take 10 seconds. Trust that there have been enough people working on the theory for enough time that it works. If there was a better protocol, I'm sure that's what Mark would be teaching us!
@@a.lame.username. Well until my KBK's adjustable bell comes in, hopefully soon, I am sticking to the 24kg bell for my heavy clean and press. The jump to the 28kg might be too much, so I'm adding intermediate sets/reps until then.
@@MarkWildman as someone who once tried to build an app I feel your pain. I do suggest trying to simplify as much as you can now. I could be wrong but nerd math may need to come later..,while simple plans would meet (my) more needs sooner and wider audience. You may know this already. Good luck!
I would go either way; spreadsheet or notebook. I feel a tactile satisfaction of just using a spiral bound notebook and a pencil. But a spreadsheet would make doing the math easier.
@@thenrie98 I’m thinking more that you need a “calculator” to do the conversions between the weights and rep schemes. A spreadsheet is perfect for that because you can lay it all out ahead of time. I don’t think if ever use a spreadsheet as a training journal or for displaying program design.
@@thenrie98 I personally like old school notebook approach. The habit hasn't left me from my school days. But I can certainly understand the satisfaction of writing on your own as opposed to typing on computers all the time.
so if you cant finish with 16kg you go to 20kg ? I thought we were supposed to go lower in weight and higher in volume to match the same volume capacity ! master what is going on ????
I'm confused, too. I was fine doing 3 sets of reverse ladders from 7 (7/7, 6/6, 5/5...x3) with 8kg, so moved on to 10kg, but I'm worried as the numbers go up with the 10kg that it's starting to get 'ugly' and trying to figure out what I should do. There's no way I could lift 12kg.
@@beckymofo so based in what I understood from previous videos now you do 3 sets*56 reps both hands *8 kg =1344 workload. So if you want to move to 10 kg you have to do the same workload which 3 sets *44 reps both hands *10 kg =1320. That means you start with 3 sets of 6/6, 5/5, 4/4, 3/3, 2/2, 1/1. I think you doing 3 sets of 7s reps in reverse ladder is a lot as in his videos he suggests max going to 5,4,3,2,1. Watch his video in clean n press nerd math
Thanks, @@orestisnalmpantis. When I went up to the 10kg I started back at sets of 1 for reverse ladders of 3/3, then of 4/4 the next day, etc. I'm only up to 1 set of 10kg C+P reverse ladders of 6/6 and already it's looking like a struggle, so the idea of 3 sets is out my league yet!
@@beckymofo don't forget he suggests going to 5 reps reverse ladder. I suggest you go till 5 reps reverse ladder and increasing your sets. I think he has another new video on what to do if you can't progress, check it out
Dumb question that maybe I already asked: shouldn't the total work capacity number for clean&presses doubled? Because it is actually two movement, one lift and one press, so technically speaking the amount of weight moved is twice as much than those of simple cleans or swings, right? Or doubling it is "cheating"?
I have a 10k and 16k bell, I can do 5 sets of 4/3/2/1 ladder. When should I progress to 16 k clean and press ladder? (or should I do a light/heavy day)
I'm not Mark but maybe watch his last video where he specifically talks about when to move on? Since his clean and press program goes to 75/75 reps total aka 5x 5/5 reverse ladder I would say then you switch weights. That's what I did. But I only have the "traditional" increase from a 16kg to a 24kg bell and I had to start at 40% capacity in order to not kill myself.
@@JafferSadiqueOfficial Of course it's hard. That's 60% more weight! So getting to 5x 5/5 reverse ladders with the 10kg bell should be your priority. If you do 5x 4/4 that means you currently do a total of 50 reps per side. With the 5/5 ladder you do a total 75 reps per side so your capacity has to get "only" 50% higher over multiple workouts instead of 60% in a single workout (which it would if your sets and reps stayed the same and you used the 16kg). Do the math. The easiest progression is usually the right one. So for you that's 10kg bell 4x 5/5 reverse ladder. Which gives you a total of 60 reps per side. If you want to be super safe start the first workout with 3x 5/5 for 45 total reps per side aka 90% of your work capacity. That should be enough slack to compensate for the longer sets.
I agree with Jan, work towards the 5 x 5/4/3/2/1 ladder with the 10kg making sure they are strict presses. You can try and see how many clean and presses you can do with the 16kg, if any. You can also use a push press for a heavier weight with the goal of performing the technique with a strict press eventually. I would see if you could do around 3 or 4 reps a side (push press) then try a small reverse ladder of 2/1 for a few sets and build your way up from that. That jump is a bit big. You could always do more than 5 sets with the lower weight seeing as you are limited. Always a thought.
Mark, how do you handle light/heavy days and progression? Would they be on two separate ladders and progress independently? Same question for non reverse ladder workouts. For example, in your nerd math video for swings you displayed doing 10 workouts, progressively adding reps until you get to 10 sets and 20 reps before increasing weight and starting over. However, in a tetris of training video you mentioned having light/heavy days. How does the 10 progressive workouts and light/heavy day mesh together? Would you do 10 light workouts of swings on Mondays, and 10 heavy swing days on Thursdays and then progressively increase each of them independently?
I increase volume on light days and keep progressing. E.g. Swings. Start on 10 sets of 10 OMEM (e.g. 16kg) , add 2 reps each session. Get to 10 sets of 20, go up weight and start at 10x10. On light days I would do 12 sets of 20 with 16 (add 2 sets each session), on heavy days (20 kg) I start at 10 x 10 and add 2 reps each session. It was going well but I'm getting stuck on progessing clean and press, haave decided to do a "deload" week and will start again.
@@josephparkes6412 The problem with the C&P is usually the shoulder during the press, which is a much smaller muscle group than for example the glutes, so it can take much less volume. I am currently in between 5 x 5 reverse ladders with the 16kg, 5 x 3 reverse ladders with the 24kg, and Clean and Jerk singles with the 32kg. So on some days I will focus on technique work, where I go heavy but for few reps and some days I try to increase my total work capacity with the 24kg, some days I do snatch and press with the 16. I think reverse ladders work better than sets of 10 for this, but if the load is light (16kg or 20kg) it might help to stay high with the volume - I don't know, I prefer to be quicker with my workouts (Also: Rest needs to be much higher with Clean and Press than with Swings. I think doing ladders every 3 or even 4 minutes is better than OMEM!)
I do 2 steps forward, 1 step back... For instance, Tuesday is my light day, and Friday is my heavy day. Today I'm doing 5 sets of swings, this Friday I'm doing 7 sets of swings. Next Tuesday I'll do six sets, and next Friday is 8 sets. This continues until I hit my max sets/reps (swings is 25L/25R for 10 sets). Then I increase weight. My clean and press is similar, with different numbers for reps. And I adjust based on listening to my body
My approach (and this isn't the end all, be all) is I try for a clean and press and swing workout twice a week. I alternate which one is heavy and light. The light sets are an EMOM and the heavy sets are a reverse ladder. I always start with the C+P (even if it is light) because that has the most demand. For light I will increase number of sets and for a bit then change the numbers of reps. I know how many reps I can get in a minute, so that becomes the limit. With the heavy workouts, I have a cheat sheet of multiple weights, types of reverse ladders and number of sets. I'm sticking to a weight where I can do 5 sets of 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 with a 1 minute break in between as a strict press, currently 24kg. Then I will increase the weight and do push presses at less sets/reps, etc. I also have a medium EMOM weight for both in case I only have time for one exercise between other training. A lot of other good answers here as well. Good luck.
@@georglehner407 thanks for the info, definitely helped. I should have clarified, I do reverse ladder with C&P, I’m just stuck on 4x5 with 16 kg. I time the sets to be 2.5 minutes long with a 1 minute rest, I’m almost completely gassed after 2 sets hence why I’m stuck. I might try longer rest then.
Here is the pdf. Part of it was for a buddy just getting into it. There are definitely typos but I followed the light weight should match the beginning heavy weight at the end of the 10th week. drive.google.com/file/d/1g3jOXBSoE7mj0lHX-PLJS0Q7XcU6iOAQ/view?usp=drivesdk
![เจ็บที่ยังฮัก - ม่อน วรวิทย์ [ Official Mv ] จอนนี่มิวสิค](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KALIGSRSjFs/mqdefault.jpg)
Your channel is one of the most consistently good fitness channels on youtube. No bullshit, no click-bait titles, no burying the lead, no gimmicks. Just want to say how much I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and skills on this platform. Your advice and tips with kettlebells have changed my life. I've still got a long way to go in my fitness journey but you've put me on the path. Thanks, man.
Glad to help
Just a note... This is not a fitness channel, this is a skills channel. There is a big sign on the front page.
The best thing about the nerd math videos is I either get the satisfaction that I am programming correctly or I find out that I'm not, but know have the info I need. Win-win.
LOVE the Nerd Math stuff!!!
Same! 😍
So incredibly good!
I really wish I had an understanding of your nerd math 30 years ago... But, I've got it on lock now and it's made me a better human being. One million thanks!
Always a help Mark.
If goal is just something in the areas of GPP...What should the variables be to progress this over 6- or 12-months? Or even 3 years...
Add more volume, (sets and/or reps in the ladder pattern)? increase density (shorter rests)? increase loads? or would you “undulate” ....make each of the 2 or 3 days / wk focus on improving a different effect, ie strength day low volume heavy loaded , endurance day raise volume, power day go fast, shorten rest?
So many variables!!
This was exactly my question! (not sure whether you were responding to someone else w/ same question) But thanks! Nailed it. This makes so much sense.
What's your view on deload? Where does it fit in nerd math?
Fantastic explanation of the principles involved!
Love it. Great explanation. BTW, that is the first time I have seen anyone doing long division since my degree studies over 20 years ago. Good to see though.
I was certainly amused when he pulled out the slick mental math for the multiplication and then went to long division for 2400/20. Good stuff though.
Mark, what are your thoughts on higher rep reverse ladders for 2 hand club as a way to keep the grip from being the failure point? Do you know of any better ways to work around grip limitations until it adapts?
Hey, Mark! Have you ever heard/applied an interval training with Kettlebell? There's a book on something like this written by Kenneth Jay it is basically X amount of snatches 15 seconds on/ 15 seconds off going up to 80 rounds.
Thanks for information! But i do not understand. Do you mean 60-80% from what ? If i can not do 16kg 5x5-4-3-1 ,i should do 20 kg 10x3-2-1 or 6-8 x 3-2-1 ?
This is great. I have weird weights (bought a bunch of CAP stuff from a sporting goods store and it's all in multiples of five freedom units, er, lbs), so the arithmetic isn't as slick, but I have learned how to mostly not kill myself when changing weights. As for the heavier weight being harder with the same overall volume, how far down would you wave the load? I have issues with feeling like I'm taking it "too easy" when I'm really just trying not to die.
You either need a bigger white board or an additional white board. I vote for an additional one, because you can attach them with hinges (to keep it all neat and tidy).
Coach, how do you like the whoop strap and does it get hit when you do cleans?
Thanks, I've been wrestling with the issue of changing weights lately and this video clarifies the process. I assume the process is the same for straight sets (not ladders) ?
Thanks for this bro. Much appreciated.
Mark, what are your thoughts on how step loading works with volume/density cycles when moving up in weight? Do/Can they work together?
I just want your app to be released and let it do all this thinking for me. I’ve got so many little pages in my notebook of this stuff and it’s just time I don’t have.
It’s gonna take awhile to get any app to do this
It seems that it's easy to outsource our memory to our phones but not our thinking. On the upside however, using our brains will make them stronger.
Stronger physically, emotionally and mentally with each training session 😎
Very well explained. Thanks
Wauw, I think this was actually an answer to a question I posted, so thank you very much!
One thing in the question that was maybe not fully covered or that I didnt ask clearly:
If you are at 5 x 5/4/3/2/1 (which I think you stated somewhere is "the goal") with 16kg and are then also doing C&P with a 20kg, (5 x 3/2/1) how do you then progress you Heavy/ light to keep the light volume significantly higher than your heavy total volume? Do you go above 5 x 5/4/3/2/1 with the 16kg or do you decide that the 20KG is now your light and give Kettlebell Kings more of your life savings to get a bigger bell or maybe you just realise you didn't time your light/ heavy progression correctly and just work out while trying to forget all the math? :)
Thanks again for all this amazing content!
I think he suggests doing an EMOM for the light portion. And that goal is to get many reps in on one side per minute.
@@cucciafr68 Oh, that might be the case. Haven't seen that anywhere, but easy to miss with so many comments.
@@namenloss It was in earlier videos. He talks about preferring EMOMs but in later videos he mentions doing reverse ladders for heavier weights. I don't know the videos off the top of my head but he did some Tetris of programming videos last summer that may touch on it.
Love Nerd Math!
Easy way to figure out new total reps at new weight...
New total reps = old total reps x old weight / new weight
So in the above example...
new reps = 150 reps x 16kg / 20 kg = 120 reps.
Then just figure out needed sets based on what ladder you're doing
Is this how to calculate for the difference in your Heavy/Light days? And, is this also a formula for starting your next weight in a progressive overload scheme? Thank you for these videos they are great!
Hey Mark, do you do the 5/5, 4/4, 3/3, 2/2, 1/1 one after the other and that equals one set.
Regards: Dom
He did a video on reverse ladders
Yes that is one set!
@@nadiadozova6515 Thanks for the info, it's greatly appreciated
Interested in your thoughts on the value of a rev Ladder with the same weight vs a Ladder with descending weights (e.g. E3.5MO3.5M 5 rung rev ladder x 24 Kg vs E5MO5M 1/1x 40, 2/2x 32, 3/3x 28, 4/4x 24, 5/5x 16 Kg). I have been alternating between the two and treat the Ladder as my "Heavy Day" and rev Ladder as my "Light Day".
This is very interesting. Do you use only the C+P for this format or also any other movement like squat, etc.?
I have only tried it with C+P but I imagine it would work well for Squats or other grind type movements as long as you keep the weight(s) near the threshold of possible for each rung.
Love the theory/nerd math stuff. What about adding reps to a set amount of sets - say 5 sets of 5, then 6,7,etc reps
He is talking classic strength training protocols. More reps is a different protocol and therefore I would assume, different mathematics.
Hey Mark. What is the most efficient way to fix spine kyphosis?
Single arm heavy club
How much do you guys like to rest in between each work set in an RL? I don't imagine that, at higher reps, this would fit into an EMOM.
it doesn't. 1 min
You're the man Mark
I love it. But I am so confused now. I started with the “tetris to KB workout” where 1 day was KB, 1 day to DH HC, 1 day SH HC.
I would love to use your app, but it’s not happening right now. How do we use this in our perfect math?
Thank you!
(Big bear lake?)
Not sure if you mentioned it or not, but what is the rest between sets?
Agreed. Would like an opinion here as well.
I watch these and then question myself as to how to apply for greatest gain or results. Application if the nerd math.
The final number of sets is for the total # of sets? "10 sets = 5 left side, 5 right side"?
have advice on kettlebells work outs when you have arthritis
I don't have arthritis, but that's a good topic.
Would love to hear about this. My dad has arthritic shoulders from being so static as a truck driver.
my left shoulder is arthritic. Swings aren't a problem so I go with a heavier weight than c&p or snatch. It is humbling to c&p or snatch with a 20lb bell but my shoulder is responding. Also hang and do various rehab/prehab work which seems to help. Sometimes after some work with the 20 my shoulder feels good, like I could go more heavy (talk like Mark). So far I'm just working my way slowly up the volume tree. I'm just beginning to consider the TGU again.
Question. couldn't we apply this same concept find out our work capacity for density and volume cycles for our light and heavy days?
Unclear on what you mean. Please elaborate
@@MarkWildman I am doing my Clean and press with a 20kg and a 16kg weight so I was asking whether I can use this same method to keep my work capacity same with both weights so I can have a light day with the 16kg one and a heavy day with the 20 kg one.
Do reverse ladders always have to end in a single rep? As the ladder get "taller" I have a problem that 1 set takes too long which is why I would prefer to terminate before reaching 1 rep. So, do sets of 8/7/6/5/4 make sense?
I have some sets where I don't do the last rep or the last 2 reps (5/4/3, 4/3/2, etc.) but I never go past 5 reps. I use that as my guide for how heavy the weight is, but that's just me. The 8/7/6/5/4 sets make sense for a reverse ladder, but not for a heavy set. If you can do that, then the weight isn't all that heavy. My issue was towards the end of my set the hand switch was getting dangerous with my grip being worn out, so the single reps became a sacrifice.
I think that's missing the entire point of the reverse ladder program isn't it?
If you are pressing a reverse ladder your doing 5 left and five right and then four and three and two and one. You are not resting or putting the bell down at all until you have finished the entire 30 reps. The last one on the left and one on the right should take 10 seconds.
Trust that there have been enough people working on the theory for enough time that it works. If there was a better protocol, I'm sure that's what Mark would be teaching us!
@@a.lame.username. Well until my KBK's adjustable bell comes in, hopefully soon, I am sticking to the 24kg bell for my heavy clean and press. The jump to the 28kg might be too much, so I'm adding intermediate sets/reps until then.
Hey, what's that watch you're wearing on your right arm?
Garmin instinct
@@MarkWildman Thanks
The goal of the app to crunch all these numbers & give us a workout schedule, right?
that is the goal if the app company ever does any of the features they said they would
@@MarkWildman Ouch. Is there a deadline on the horizon? Seems like you've been in limbo for some time.
@@MarkWildman as someone who once tried to build an app I feel your pain. I do suggest trying to simplify as much as you can now. I could be wrong but nerd math may need to come later..,while simple plans would meet (my) more needs sooner and wider audience. You may know this already. Good luck!
I should make a separate notebook for all this info for personal reference. Nice work mark.
Actually you should be able to put this all in spreadsheets. It is just "nerd math" and that is something spreadsheets are good for.
I would go either way; spreadsheet or notebook. I feel a tactile satisfaction of just using a spiral bound notebook and a pencil. But a spreadsheet would make doing the math easier.
@@thenrie98 I’m thinking more that you need a “calculator” to do the conversions between the weights and rep schemes. A spreadsheet is perfect for that because you can lay it all out ahead of time.
I don’t think if ever use a spreadsheet as a training journal or for displaying program design.
@@thenrie98 I personally like old school notebook approach. The habit hasn't left me from my school days. But I can certainly understand the satisfaction of writing on your own as opposed to typing on computers all the time.
so if you cant finish with 16kg you go to 20kg ? I thought we were supposed to go lower in weight and higher in volume to match the same volume capacity ! master what is going on ????
I'm confused, too. I was fine doing 3 sets of reverse ladders from 7 (7/7, 6/6, 5/5...x3) with 8kg, so moved on to 10kg, but I'm worried as the numbers go up with the 10kg that it's starting to get 'ugly' and trying to figure out what I should do. There's no way I could lift 12kg.
@@beckymofo so based in what I understood from previous videos now you do 3 sets*56 reps both hands *8 kg =1344 workload. So if you want to move to 10 kg you have to do the same workload which 3 sets *44 reps both hands *10 kg =1320. That means you start with 3 sets of 6/6, 5/5, 4/4, 3/3, 2/2, 1/1. I think you doing 3 sets of 7s reps in reverse ladder is a lot as in his videos he suggests max going to 5,4,3,2,1. Watch his video in clean n press nerd math
Thanks, @@orestisnalmpantis. When I went up to the 10kg I started back at sets of 1 for reverse ladders of 3/3, then of 4/4 the next day, etc.
I'm only up to 1 set of 10kg C+P reverse ladders of 6/6 and already it's looking like a struggle, so the idea of 3 sets is out my league yet!
@@beckymofo don't forget he suggests going to 5 reps reverse ladder. I suggest you go till 5 reps reverse ladder and increasing your sets. I think he has another new video on what to do if you can't progress, check it out
Thanks @@orestisnalmpantis
Saw a comment about the app in another video. That it’s, “In the hands of the developers.” Don’t know how long ago it was written. Is there an ETA?
They say 4 weeks but they say a lot of things
@@MarkWildman Thanks. Getting it where you and all of us, who have watched darn near all 212 nerd math videos, need it to be will be worth it.
Dumb question that maybe I already asked: shouldn't the total work capacity number for clean&presses doubled?
Because it is actually two movement, one lift and one press, so technically speaking the amount of weight moved is twice as much than those of simple cleans or swings, right?
Or doubling it is "cheating"?
it is defined specific to the movement
I have a 10k and 16k bell, I can do 5 sets of 4/3/2/1 ladder. When should I progress to 16 k clean and press ladder? (or should I do a light/heavy day)
I'm not Mark but maybe watch his last video where he specifically talks about when to move on?
Since his clean and press program goes to 75/75 reps total aka 5x 5/5 reverse ladder I would say then you switch weights. That's what I did. But I only have the "traditional" increase from a 16kg to a 24kg bell and I had to start at 40% capacity in order to not kill myself.
@@ryusuikarate Yea I agree but 10 to 16 K is pretty hard for me
@@JafferSadiqueOfficial Of course it's hard. That's 60% more weight!
So getting to 5x 5/5 reverse ladders with the 10kg bell should be your priority. If you do 5x 4/4 that means you currently do a total of 50 reps per side. With the 5/5 ladder you do a total 75 reps per side so your capacity has to get "only" 50% higher over multiple workouts instead of 60% in a single workout (which it would if your sets and reps stayed the same and you used the 16kg).
Do the math. The easiest progression is usually the right one. So for you that's 10kg bell 4x 5/5 reverse ladder. Which gives you a total of 60 reps per side. If you want to be super safe start the first workout with 3x 5/5 for 45 total reps per side aka 90% of your work capacity. That should be enough slack to compensate for the longer sets.
I agree with Jan, work towards the 5 x 5/4/3/2/1 ladder with the 10kg making sure they are strict presses. You can try and see how many clean and presses you can do with the 16kg, if any. You can also use a push press for a heavier weight with the goal of performing the technique with a strict press eventually. I would see if you could do around 3 or 4 reps a side (push press) then try a small reverse ladder of 2/1 for a few sets and build your way up from that.
That jump is a bit big. You could always do more than 5 sets with the lower weight seeing as you are limited. Always a thought.
I gonna need frank and Jan to start making vids or doing office hours for me
I'm a simple man: I see "nerd math", I click, watch the video, close the laptop, and pick up a kettlebell.
What more could we ask for?
Me too!
Mark, how do you handle light/heavy days and progression? Would they be on two separate ladders and progress independently? Same question for non reverse ladder workouts. For example, in your nerd math video for swings you displayed doing 10 workouts, progressively adding reps until you get to 10 sets and 20 reps before increasing weight and starting over. However, in a tetris of training video you mentioned having light/heavy days. How does the 10 progressive workouts and light/heavy day mesh together? Would you do 10 light workouts of swings on Mondays, and 10 heavy swing days on Thursdays and then progressively increase each of them independently?
I increase volume on light days and keep progressing. E.g. Swings. Start on 10 sets of 10 OMEM (e.g. 16kg) , add 2 reps each session. Get to 10 sets of 20, go up weight and start at 10x10. On light days I would do 12 sets of 20 with 16 (add 2 sets each session), on heavy days (20 kg) I start at 10 x 10 and add 2 reps each session.
It was going well but I'm getting stuck on progessing clean and press, haave decided to do a "deload" week and will start again.
@@josephparkes6412 The problem with the C&P is usually the shoulder during the press, which is a much smaller muscle group than for example the glutes, so it can take much less volume. I am currently in between 5 x 5 reverse ladders with the 16kg, 5 x 3 reverse ladders with the 24kg, and Clean and Jerk singles with the 32kg. So on some days I will focus on technique work, where I go heavy but for few reps and some days I try to increase my total work capacity with the 24kg, some days I do snatch and press with the 16. I think reverse ladders work better than sets of 10 for this, but if the load is light (16kg or 20kg) it might help to stay high with the volume - I don't know, I prefer to be quicker with my workouts (Also: Rest needs to be much higher with Clean and Press than with Swings. I think doing ladders every 3 or even 4 minutes is better than OMEM!)
I do 2 steps forward, 1 step back...
For instance, Tuesday is my light day, and Friday is my heavy day.
Today I'm doing 5 sets of swings, this Friday I'm doing 7 sets of swings.
Next Tuesday I'll do six sets, and next Friday is 8 sets. This continues until I hit my max sets/reps (swings is 25L/25R for 10 sets).
Then I increase weight.
My clean and press is similar, with different numbers for reps. And I adjust based on listening to my body
My approach (and this isn't the end all, be all) is I try for a clean and press and swing workout twice a week. I alternate which one is heavy and light. The light sets are an EMOM and the heavy sets are a reverse ladder. I always start with the C+P (even if it is light) because that has the most demand. For light I will increase number of sets and for a bit then change the numbers of reps. I know how many reps I can get in a minute, so that becomes the limit. With the heavy workouts, I have a cheat sheet of multiple weights, types of reverse ladders and number of sets. I'm sticking to a weight where I can do 5 sets of 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 with a 1 minute break in between as a strict press, currently 24kg. Then I will increase the weight and do push presses at less sets/reps, etc. I also have a medium EMOM weight for both in case I only have time for one exercise between other training. A lot of other good answers here as well. Good luck.
@@georglehner407 thanks for the info, definitely helped. I should have clarified, I do reverse ladder with C&P, I’m just stuck on 4x5 with 16 kg. I time the sets to be 2.5 minutes long with a 1 minute rest, I’m almost completely gassed after 2 sets hence why I’m stuck. I might try longer rest then.
If someone could do a spreadsheet for the Clean and Press reverse ladders it would be awesome. My math sucks :(
I have one
I have one as well, but it isn't exactly a program, just a list of Work Capacity for different weights, sets and reps.
@@cucciafr68 I have a similar one but I made it into a program
@@dylanvelasquez9869 I have been meaning to. I am in the process of programming the light C+P and swing progressions as well so maybe that will help.
Here is the pdf.
Part of it was for a buddy just getting into it. There are definitely typos but I followed the light weight should match the beginning heavy weight at the end of the 10th week.
drive.google.com/file/d/1g3jOXBSoE7mj0lHX-PLJS0Q7XcU6iOAQ/view?usp=drivesdk
I'm thinking this is perfect for an Excel spreadsheet.
Gold.
I see you mention reverse ladders and then a week later my coach mentions them 🤔🤔🤔
0:45 don't quite get it. 60% of five is three -- ok. But why is "40% of five is four"? Do you mean 80%?
Yes, he meant to say 80%.
Cool, a bit of an ah-ha! moment
Winner of the No-Prize!
aka FIRST.