Andre Galvao Vs Ryron Gracie beef
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ย. 2024
- When the fight was over, he seemed satisfied with a draw. He can now brag "I fought to a draw with Royce Gracie." For him, a draw with me is a victory. It's sad, but you can't fish a fish who doesn't want to bait. And you can't fight when your opponent doesn't want to fight.
- Royce Gracie ( after UFC 5 vs Shamrock )
Post fight interview, Galvao pretty mad because Ryron never step up the fight and Galvao invite him to compete in one of the IBJJF tournaments, enjoy
This match was about true bjj. No rules, just submissions That’s what the art is all about. No points. Ryron is awesome
I swear when I read these comments it must be the "Cool Thing" to hate the Gracies now. Nowhere in that post fight speech did they come off as arrogant or condescending to Andre Galvao. They both were very respectful and continually said he was one of the best in the world (which he is). If anyone came off like a butthurt sore loser/winner it was Galvao. Not sure what peoples problem with what Ryron and Rener said was other than its like stylish to hate the Gracies now
Kinosis79
You make it sound like they are all like these two clowns.
I can't imagine guys like Ralph, Renzo, Roger etc approve of this bs. Royce was on them for selling belts on the internet not too long ago.
Pretty sure Carlson would be turning in his grave from "keep it playful". That guy was all about aggressive top game and was really pissed that Helio claimed to invent BJJ.
Hmmm so do you train to troll? Why dont you post a video of you grappling? Id like to see that
Because that has nothing to do with this conversation.
Speaking of trolling....do you even know what that is?
It's not someone who disagrees with you dummy.
petersouth1000 Lol "jealous of a man who always gets his guard passed". My money is that if you were going to get your balls cut off if you couldn't pass Ryrons guard, you wouldn't be able to. He's 6'3" and has been training jiu jitsu his entire life. You psuedo jiu jitsu authority, Rener and Ryron have done the jiu jitsu community a great service by spreading the word of all the benefits it can offer that are so much better than other hobbies, sports, or martial arts one could pursue.
Kinosis79 LOLL, what peter said was perfectly valid. Carlson would definitely hate this 'playful' stuff and royce has come out and got on them. Would we really know who Rener and Ryron were if there second name wasnt gracie? While Helio, Carlos and the other brothers fought to make bjj big, along with the second generation, this does not mean we have to respect people just because their second name are gracie.
Who has been training since before than can remember? Ryron. Plus he has two brothers to roll around with all day. Doesn't matter if no longer competes, if anything, it preserves his body from competition punishment and his greatest achievement here is not getting submitted, which shouldn't be that hard for anybody training SINCE BIRTH and not concerned with getting punched or kicked or positionally dominated.
+Abdul Shamah LOL. You have no clue.
And according to your logic, neither does Galvao, who is a world champion and isn't dumb enough to fall for Ryron's obvious trap of spending needless energy against someone who clams up 100% and opens up last 5 minutes to fool people into thinking he's not playing wet blanket. Just because Ortega won recently doesn't prove GA fight philosophy is sound.
+Rick James Its a very different thing to train to win tournaments and teach. Andre spends all his time Adapting and perfecting his tecniques to win tournaments in a given set of rules. When you are a teacher you keep sharp, thats rght, but is different. Who do you think spends more time to win tournments, or teachng in this mind set?
You are underestimating Andre awesome athletic carrier over Gracies bloodline.
What people dont understand is this: a real fighting is not always about defeating your opponent, speacially with jiu-jitsu. Many times, when you are against an opponent that has more offensive power than you, the skill to survive is the most important thing. Then disingage and get out. Or tire him and gain the advantage.
😊
Ryron is such a class act!
Ryron did step up the fight in the last five minutes, Andre refused to grapple. Just stood up and stepped away instead of closing the gap and mixing it up.
How can people think ryron was just trying to survive the match? He was clearly trying to wear him down. You can clearly see ryron pursuing him towards the end and going for the kill, he just wasn't successful
Wearing him down from bottom side control and north south. lol
sSPACEBALLSs
Yeah I also saw how he took Ryron down and passed his guard several times and made him kiss his balls.
If that was a real fight with strikes it would have ended very quickly.
So much for self defense.
I guess the message from now on is don't try to do anything, both guys should just turtle up like Ryron.
oh your one of those people that just love to shit talk about the gracies
i get it now
sSPACEBALLSs
Don't try to change the subject dummy.
petersouth1000
Peter don't be beligerent. You think both practitioners would have been in the same positions if it was a fight? If this was a real fight with strikes you wouldn't know how the fight would have gone there for you can't try to state and facts on what would happen..
Ryron played towards the rules, it's called strategy. You must be one of those meatballs who goes tanning that use to go to a gym for a few months before you stopped.
Ryron was able to live in what was a dominant position for Andre. Ryron was very efficient in all his defenses and exerted little energy in fending off threats posed by Andre. This is exactly what BJJ is about.
If you don't like the structure of Metamoris then just don't watch the event.
You can take the mouthguard out now Ryron ;-)
@1:32 i thought why the heck is that guy is drinking with his ear!??!?!
No ego in jiu jitsu they said! Yeaaaah. Way to many!
and i know you know.................. you know
Galvao, you tried your best and you couldn't beat Ryron baby?! No matter what, real JJ is not about points!!!! I don't see myself on the street telling the other guy I beat you because I got you more time on holding you. PFSST!!!
G, You could be a real rock star on points, but on the street you are not that good.
whats all the arguing about? People can go back and forth all day about passing,who didnt try to submit, what kind of competition it was, bla bla bla. They are both legends in the bjj world and it was a good fight. Lets leave it at that.
This event was as real as it gets, it shows control is only a part of jiu jitsu. As much as Galvao did you cannot deny the fact that
1. He could not submit Ryron
2. He was gassed at the 15 min mark
It is my belief that Galvao would get submitted if there were no time limit. The Jiu-Jitsu world learned more from Rryon in the is match then Galvao.
Rener always gotta talk when Ryron gets a chance to speak Rener takes over
Ryron is such a great guy. Fucking hell Andre has such massive credentials. He has won so many medals at the highest levels under every legit top BJJ tournament in the world. Ryron is such an cool guy
Ryron's strategy was defend, survive and then attack. By the end you could see Andre was just defending and pulling guard.
andre galvao has never free rolled before? every jiu jitsu practitioner has freerolled in the gym. he just felt dumb that he couldnt do shit to ryron. the excuse made him look even dumber.
In BJJ it is much easier to stall and survive than it is to advance with aggression. For Andre, the only way to win was a submission, but Ryron's goal was to run out the clock. The Helio/Rorion Gracie's are famous for loosing than claiming they won. If you watch their interpretation of Helio Vs. Kimura it is the same bullshit.
It would be interesting to have Galvao train for a few months in pure defense and then "fight" another top middleweight. If you do just want to stall and you are fighting in the gi then it is possible to just establish a lock down and let the clock run.
This was supposed to be entertainment, not an evangelical platform for the "Crazy Gracies". Rener has the kind of "Holy Spirit" look in his eyes that makes me run a mile.
*****
Andre could have just laid there took a nap in bottom side control and claimed victory. lol
I'm very impressed by Ryron, a guy that doesn't really do competitions managed to survive and make attacks against a world class contender. Amazing defense by Ryron, his philosophy is be comfortable in worst case scenarios and it works.
People forget that the Helio side of BJJ is mainly for self defense purposes, while the Barra guys focus more on sport aspect of it.
What did barra have to do with this lmao, and what about helio? Doesn't matter lmao
@@demz6365 Barra is incorrect, but Andre's background is Alliance. Ironically Andre's lineage comes down from Rolls Gracie, who was taught/adopted by Helio (although he was Carlos' illegitimate son).
Point being Andre is too used to rolling for points and got salty that he couldn't score the win in a sub-only environment. Sub-only is what Gracie Academy usually trains for as the school is focused on self-defense and cage fighting first.
@@tjl4688 lol cage fighting??? If this was cage fighting galvao would of been pounding from top position
I love Ryron. Pure class. Humble and great for the sport ! OSS !
Galvao came off as butthurt. He knew the rules before going in. Just deal with it.
+mikesyr Yeah, submission only. Fight to submit your opponent, from beginning to end, not lay around hoping the other guy gets tired.
+Pendejo Yeah but if an attacker commits to breaking someone's defenses and he fails continually, that is worse. Ryron at least defended efficiently and was less tired. Andre wants to always win, ryron wants above all survive. If you ask me, surviving is more important. But that is only an opinion.
Both are good fighters, no doubt.
Alkis05 When you're attacking, and the opponent is on his heels (back), you're automatically surviving.
People made much of Ryron's attacks in the final five minutes, but Galvao got his wind back and still was in position to attack AND survive.
I'm not diminishing Ryron's skill, but if you remember the Metamoris promotion, it was hyped as a whole new type of competition where submissions were the only objective. Frankly, if thats the case, there should be a points system to award submission attempts, and nothing else.
Pendejo no points bro.
@@pendejo6466 "it was hyped as a whole new type of competition where submissions were the only objective. Frankly, if thats the case, there should be a points system to award submission attempts, and nothing else." Dude, you are not making any sense at all. Only submissions means you ONLY care about submissions happening, not about points or weak submission attempts. If you want to reward more active players, which can be a good thing for the sport, then you go back to a rule set with points. But they are different mindsets and sports.
haha wow nice sportsmen ship galvao, he acts like ryron wasn't doing anything but he was using amazing defense the whole time and the reason for this was because of andres aggressiveness,,,,now towards the last 5 min ryron had many more sub attempts then galvao and basically had tired galvao out and all andre did was pull guard, so honestly just two different strategies which is completely fine, and then galvao had to make excuses at the end….which i guess i understand because he is one of the best in the world and he was almost bested by a guy who he was supposed to completely destroy because of course these "new" graces are just all talk right? also ryron hadn't competed in years, weighs less and is much less athletic……and seriously people who are saying "graceis just choose venues were they will have success" …..its submission only how grappling should be, not driven by points so competitors are afraid to go for the kill or use a different strategy…even eddie bravo said that its how it should be after his metamorphis fight….people are really quick to ridicule the gracies but without them non of this would be possible
Uh no dummy Andre pulled guard because he realized passing Ryron's guard wasn't opening anything up and getting yet another takedown and pass would be fruitless.
He pulled guard to go for submission form the bottom as that is faster.
How was Andre almost bested. Ryron was never close to a legitimate submission.
Rener Gracie should ask questions instead of explaining everything by himself.
i know right
He really does love the sound of his own voice
He asked questions. But also Seems like he already knew the answers to his questions on some
Gearz86 after watching many videos with Rener, i usually always feel like hes alot more humble than proud tbh
rener is simply talkative haha
The Gracie "no-points, submission only" philosophy is realistic. Timed matches, in my opinion, are equally irrelevant, although I acknowledge they are practical for the majority of matches. It's senseless to win by points under timed conditions, when the winner could have been submitted if the match had continued. Submission is the winning determining factor in real life situations, and if you want to put your skills (technique and endurance) to the test, submission should also be the determining factor in competition. I would have loved to see the end result of this match had it been allowed to continue with no time and by submission only.
@Jem Dikyol Bullshit. Think of soccer. Who cares if you were dominating the whole match, doing great passes, dribbling, you name it. But you never ever got even close to score a goal. By the end of the match, it's 0-0 and you failed to win. You can be dissapointed with your own performance, but do not blame the ruleset you agreed upon beforehand.
@Jem Dikyol How was it dominant when he couldn't even attempt a proper submission? Ryron literally spends his life teaching people how to defend against strikes while on the bottom.
Ryron literally fought grown men when he was a blue belt:
th-cam.com/video/DFrqz2LAUU4/w-d-xo.html
Ryron was wearing him down and clearly had more energy at the end of the fight, and it can be seen when Ryron started to attack. It's sad how people think all jiu jitsu is is submissions. Jiu Jitsu is position before submission. Jiu Jitsu is wearing your opponent down, defending his attempts at submissions, and then finally finishing the fight when your opponent no longer has the energy to defend himself or herself. If all you do is go full-on attack mode, you're just setting yourself up to get tired, and setting yourself up to get caught.
It's sad how people are so hateful to the Gracies, who are simply practicing jiu jitsu at it's core elements. Andre here and anyone is simply uptight because Galvao could not tap out Ryron. Had the fight gone with no time limit, Ryron's strategy of conserving energy and making Andre tired would have brought him to an eventual victory. That is practical jiu jitsu. It may not be what everyone wants to see in the sport jiu jitsu world (which I am a part of as well) but it's what works. End of story -> Galvao, arguably one of the best sport guys out there, could not submit Ryron. Are you not entertained? I'd be interested to see how Ryron would have faired if he went all out and attacked Andre from the start, because you cannot deny the skill of Ryron. Perhaps we'll never know. You adapt your own game in jiu jitsu. Do what works for you, but don't hate on people because people can't submit them.
OSS!!! but in my opinion if Ryron would have went all out and attacked he most likely would have got submitted very early and if the fight had no time limit do u honestly think Galvao would have used the same strategy of constantly attacking??? I dont think so
+Jeremy Freeman "Jiu Jitsu is position before submission." Andre got that on him...
+Pendejo did he? You're misclassifying "position" - you're thinking "good position" but all you need to do is stabilize your position *wherever you are* to preserve your energy. And this is what RYRON did.
Joey McAllister Wah, HA HA HA...
Um...okay.
Indeed. There are 2 schools of thoughts. One aims to submit and the other aims to defend. If you submit the one who aims to defend, you win. If you don't get submitted by the one who aims to do so, you win.
It's just that simple.
Helio Gracie fought a ton of draws in his career. If Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is about self-defense, you can't knock a draw; it means survival.
Andre, bro you shouldn't need a certain set of rules to win in jiu-jitsu, if your game is good then you can beat anyone no matter the rule set but you didn't, maybe all that point jiu-jitsu is ruining the submission game for you huh?
Exactly. Hey I could beat Ryron too if we played by my rules. Ryron hog tied and me in full mount. What a loser.
I believe that in a no time match Andrê would win.
It seems like there are many schools that have turned to focus on points - which could lead to doing something that could get people hurt on the street. GJJ was able to survive against one of the most elite warriors around. I hope many instructors take note of this and consider an approach that saves lives over winning points. Respect for both warriors.
that makes no sense. As much as I hate points, they exist for a reason. Mount and Knee on belly in a real fight are very bad news for the bottom guy,
@@MrNictaxlord but nobody is counting poinst for anyone in a street fight..Jujitsu first and foremost is a fighting system for self defense...competition and its rules came in the latter run...I makes perfect sense that the rules were submission only letting it be point base is an advantage to a competitor style fighter. No rules but submission for both great athletes reflects on their style of jujitsu and technique used to incapacitate one other in solid jujitsu raw fighting.
@@krynico8451 I agree. Nobody is counting points in a street fight. But also, nobody is stoping you from betting the shit out of someone from mount or knee on belly.
Side control, advantages, guard passing, all of that you can forget if you want, but there’s a reason why mount and back take give you the most points.
In a real fight anyone mounts you, you’re pretty fucked.
As much as I hate points (and I really do. I’ve only won championships by submission and lost by points) some positions are really indicative of dominance in a real fight.
@@MrNictaxlord You absolutely correct and knee on belly is actually one of my favorite positions when I roll...It was a great fight but honestly the only person who lost here in my opinion (but really didn't lose) is Andre G because of his pride and arrogance. He doesn't like to lose due to his competitor nature.. Even in this post interview he made excuses and seemed to upset while Gracie was all smiles and ok with the outcome... Not every fighter is a respectful as these brothers.. It's this type of arrogance that got him smacked by Gordan Ryan last year....These two are both great fighters but jujitsu(from its origin) is a self defense before anything..You can mount ..escape..knee on belly in competition or street fight but if you fight someone skilled in grappling chance are they may be able to escape which why submission was the better decision to end the fight. Much respect to you and your wins.. .OSS
@@krynico8451 I agree with you about Andre…. Not my favorite for several reasons.
Pretty sure he’s going to get crushed by Gordon on September!
Oss my brother.
galvao tried his best to even attempt one submission and get frustated, in the last 5 minutes of the fight, he is just surviving because he got exhausted, then after the fight he is whining like a loser, what a cry baby :)
Andre galvao will grow from this fight and maybe remember what bjj is all about. The competitive aspect of it is great to develop yourself as an athlete but it shouldn't be your goal in bjj.
Ryron epitomized BJJ in this match the way his ancestors prioritized it, it’s not about getting points because of positions, it’s about survival. Super impressive how calm he was in virtually every position vs one of the best sport BJJ fighters in world. He most certainly proved this point.
If he wanted to make his ancestors happy he should have entered a vale-tudo match with Andre. Instead he entered a submission only match, didnt try to win and then declared a moral victory. Shamefull.
@@Jackthestripper 100% also ancestors its his grand dad and even he did not invent jiu jitsu come on man stop the bullshit
Ryron Gracie has been a great representative to the Gracie family. He has a passion for the sport that makes him and others great. He is one of the legends of our time.
"I hope next year it will be 30 mins" LOL
Galvao feels totally beaten. Ryron wins
+Gyubriel Wins what?
Semper Fi I never read a poll where 70% of people thought Galvao would certainly tap Ryron. Your assuming Ryron himself had the gas tank to go another 10 minutes and Galvao would get a second wind.
i love that Ryron was wearing the G academy and rickson patches
You are right, I just noticed that. It might even be a Kron Gracie gi.
Even though the match ended in a draw. The winner is the one showing the most class and is the least gassed. Kudos to both for taking on the challenge to further the art of BJJ.
Facts
It was a draw but the winner is clear after watching the interviews.
Andre is still kicking ass today
At the end of the match it was 50-50. Personally I felt that if the match had gone 15 more minutes, Ryron would have submitted him.
Lol
Ryron plans no time limits... if that match had no time limit he would have one... I’ve never seen someone so chill underneath world class pressure
@@brotendo The juice has a way of prolonging one's career.
Galvao was butthurt and Rener Gracie performed a Gracie worship monologue instead of doing an interview with his brither.
+amjan Yea, I did kind of get that from Andre, and Ryron/Rener.. They do have a bit of an ego about what they've made or helped make/transform, but they also have a point. Spread info, teach people..
+Chaoutzu ego? Wtf Ryron is such a great guy. Fucking hell Andre has such massive credentials. He has won so many medals at the highest levels under every legit top BJJ tournament in the world. Ryron is such an cool guy
Can you blame him Andre tried to attack how his family do things
I feel that there is a place for both competition BJJ and Survival/Self defense BJJ.
***** I don't understand the reply.
***** True.
And this style of fighting works really no where except a competition where points are not calculated and the guy is not allowed to hit you.
petersouth1000 Not completely true. If Andre Galvao gets in a street fight don't you think he is also going to throw punches. You add that to his submissions and you have a serious problem on your hands. He is not punching because the rules don't allow it.
bluechip17
I agree, that's what I meant
Laying on the bottom does not work with strikes.
I think it is impressive that a world champion could not tap Ryron. Ryron even gave Galvao the mount and he couldn't finish. I think it says a lot to the effectiveness of street jiu jitsu. I'm very impressed with Ryron, and sport jiu jitsu can having you chasing points and worrying about time.
Defending is not the he hardest thing in the world to do if that is ALL you are doing. Next time you are on the mat (if you train)...pick the best guy on the mat and focus on only defending, don't worry about positioning, simply let him attack and you only defend. Sumbissions come from openings or opportunities presented during scrambles, positional battles etc. If you aren't doing anything but laying there defending, keeping everything tight, its going to be hard to get caught.
If anything, this match proved that very thing! Had Ryron actually fought for position/submission it would have looked much different. This was two philosophies clashing and was rather pointless (no pun intended).
I think it's pathetic that a guy that's been training since birth gets his ass handed to him, and then makes lame duck excuses as to why he was on his back defending the entire time. Don't make it sound like Ryron was the underdog in this fight. He wasn't. Ryron didn't give Galvao anything, Galvao took it.
Galvao isn't really the world champ just because of his skills, he is good because he had pretty good skills with tons of steroids.
Street Jiu Jitsu? Lol... since when they fight it on the streets? Lol...
the only thing here is, Galvão destroyed Ryron not just because of 10000s of points but because Ryron allowed his opponent to be in every single threatening position, if punches and elbows were allowed Ryrons’s self-Defense game wouldn’t work at all against Galvão...
@@victorcostalima2966 Lol yeah because he was proving a point that survival is more effective. If it were a real fight, he wouldn't have given up positions. Dumb ass.
A pure defensive masterclass and ultimate exhibition of top class bjj in the face of one of the most dangerous finishers out there,maybe mentally it was different but he never seemed worried or troubled just phenomenal control and calmness when faced with extreme pressure,galvao was pushing as much as he dare for a finish but couldn't find anything!
If you watch the gracie breakdown of Royce and Bravo they are constantly criticising Bravo for using these techniques that wouldnt work on the street etc yet they say nothing when Ryron is on his back the whole fight in side control etc double standard much
You sound like you don't know what you're talking about.
@therainman777 Silva vs Sonnen is the perfect example of how well the guard actually works.
Ryron has spent his whole life being comfortable in those positions. He was taught by Helio himself since he could walk.
He knows every position and knew pretty much every move Andre can make.
The "soft art" was demonstrated more effectively in Ryhon's strategy. He was absorbing Andre's energy and patiently waiting for his opponent to make a mistake once he realized deep into the match that he could not submit him and was tiring out. Andre has been competing at the highest level for a considerable time prior to this fight. Ryron has dedicated his life to exclusively teaching for the past ten years and still his strategy and skill level was holding up and frustrating a world class fighter. The Metamoris is a different kind of competition. It is in keeping with what Grand Master Helio would probably have envisioned.
Are you on drugs? did you watch the same match I did?
Absolutely. To come off a 10-year competitive hiatus and hold your own against a world-class competitor is astounding. I guess you weren't on the same drug as MrSupertwo when you watched the fight. Ryon didn't trouble himself with positioning, rather he focused only on submission awareness. Meaning, he was aware when he was being bated for a sub and stopped it at every turn. Moreso, yes, he reacted at perfect moments and swept Andre several times. Guys, sweeping top-level competitors like Andre is no small feet. Men rarely sweep him in the tourny's. He showed his aggression towards the end and almost caught Andre a couple times. Ryron was never in any real danger of losing. So with all facts considered, Ryron was the better JJ fighter. Everyone keeps saying, "but yeah if this was different... if that was different... " Well, if anything were different both Andre and Ryron whould have adapted their strategies so you cant assume what would have changed had the rules been different because you can't guess how they would have strategized for that particular set of rules.
Cory Vore he swept him once with a trap and roll from mount. Andre took him down and passed his guard at will. Mounted and took his back. U wanna say it’s submission only and passing his guard doesn’t mean anything then don’t pretend like Ryron’s sweep meant anything.
@@pjbuma13 Andre got reversed by THE most basic lesson of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu, and STILL couldn't sub Ryron after taking his back.
@@tjl4688 whats your point? Ryron got 1 sweep but Andre had several takedowns guard passes and back takes. Neither got a submission.
you can tell andre was not salty at all ... he was the salt itself 🧂
Fancy meeting you here my friend
This is why I love practicing Jiu Jitsu. Absolute killers like Andre CAN be countered and shut down effectively. I feel like I am progressing when the Brown belt killer in my school chokes me out only twice in five minutes instead of six times. I know that sounds pathetic, but the adjustments mean something: I can't beat him but I can anticipate his offense. Surviving his weight and pressure and superior skill set and aggression counts to me. It is the equivalent of effectively slipping someone's overhand right. I also know that when I am dominant over less skilled opponents their ability to neutralize my best offense makes me go back to the drawing board to adopt a different approach or improve my tactics.
Andre is a fantastic bjj guy. But he shouldn't cry about not have a point system. That's not what bjj was designed for.
Renee should be the announcer again
Self defense? He immediately got taken down and galvao passed his guard, if he was allowed to strike he would have been under a rain of knuckles
These guys really look at jiu jitsu as like the gospels of jesus, to them it's like a soul saviour and they need to spread it to the masses to save their souls
Galvao made himself look like a turd.
Ryron feels like a winner because he didn't get tapped
That’s why he DID win.
Ryron is getting praised due to his surname anyone else would've been slaughtered for performing this way but GRACIE is a powerful name
It's pretty obvious that Galvao expected to do better than this against Ryron and it's pretty obvious that this is pretty much what Ryron expected.
The Gracies are known for making their own rules, it's bs. For instance Rolyer vs Eddie Bravo, Eddie couldn't grab Roylers shorts but Rolyer could grab eddies gi pants. Bullshit
Late entrant here on my comment lol...but let's keep in mind that's Eddie's side of the story...
The rule actually was "either competitor could grab the other's gi pants."
Eddie (whom I love) had the option of competing without pants just like Royler. He turned it down (which is fine).
But, if Eddie gets to use his gi pants against Royler (namely, to soak up sweat and provide more friction), then Royler gets to use Eddie's gi pants against Eddie.
So no, not "bullshit". Fair.
Helio Gracie most definitely did not invent the guard, I'm not sure where the guard originated but I am sure that Judoka such as Tsunetane Oda who did invent the triangle-choke, used the guard, the lockdown(ashi kennuki), and many guard passes(toreando) and sweeps that are still displayed by high level grapplers of today. Many people consider these and other moves to have origins in BJJ but they all have been in Judo for a long time.
"you know"
I think you're correct. I think Ryron timed his shift from defense to offense badly. I think you're missing some things though. By playing defense and getting a handle on your opponent's strategy it makes it even less likely that you'll be caught in it later on. After all, you've already seen it. This has been expounded upon in every treatise on strategy from Sun Tzu to Musashi to those of the modern day. Go read.
Cry Andre Galvao. Despicable atitude.
its irritating when they keep saying "our grandfather said this our grandfather said that" the fact is their grandfather never done that..never done what ryron did.. you can watch helio's fight against kimura here on youtube.. he gave it his best and got his arm broken for it but he never once just laid on his back and let kimura get side control he fought as best he could and kimura was the best in the world at the time.. helio earned kimura's respect after their bout.. i think their grandfather would be disappointed if he had watched this fight.
You are 100% incorrect. That strategy is the exact strategy Helio used on ALL opponents- period. It's the survival mindset in action. So the fact that you are unfamiliar with this strategy doesn't negate that it IS Gracie Jiu Jitsu.
I think andre can beat ryron. Ryron needs to face galvao in galvaos court
Delmar Simpson is like to see them in a no time limit submission only match. Just to prove that Ryron’s strategy was flawed at best. No way he can hide forever and Andre would conserve his energy when needed knowing he had as long as he needed to finish the fight.
"if he fought me on my rules" - is a statement that doesn't really carry any weight because he's saying he would win if the rules were more restricted. It would be like a fighter getting beat in MMA then saying "if he fought me in BJJ he would lose"
Ryron actually looked incredibly. Talk about energy preservation
"we can't prevent the future" - Andre Galvao
I wonder how figured that out?
I think poor Andre should see some videos of Gracie challenge with Ryron. The rules are the reason Andre didn't get his skull bashed in. Galvao's line goes back to Rolls, so any kind of "beef" is here is stupid. Ryron just doesn't talk smack after fights, and he's not trying to prove anything. Just having fun bro.
I was with these two young Gracie ‘s early on at the Gracie academy Torrance, California, when they were blue belts, and they’ve always been great leaders and following their grandfather’s traditions . Hélio Gracie was the greatest Teacher/ fighter/ & professor to ever live >>>
in my opinion.
self defense? deve ser muito bom para a self defense ficar sendo amassado com o rosto exposto
Self defense 1 para 1. Vai treinar bjj antes de falar o que não sabe.
And pulling guard at the end all the time was stalling to wait for the clock to end.
Metamoris Pro: Ryron Gracie vs. Andre Galvao (Gracie Breakdown)
Galvão didn't show respect. Ugly scene. Ryron, great job! Galvão clearly wouldn't last a 30 minute fight. Just appalling his final reaction.
He keeps claiming that he did a great job cos he didn’t tap to Andre. Add some punches in that, he would’ve been knocked out in less than a minute, so much for self defence and street Jiu Jitsu. Is that what he would do in a street fight? Chill and let the attacker mount him? Side control him? And take him down and just disengage? Hahahaha it’s clear who won, this was a marketing strategy 👎🏼
Check out the fight breakdown. Ryron wanted to chill 15 minutes, the charge. Exactly what you saw. And who cares about position...JJ shows you how to submit from any position. Thats the point of Metamoris. PURE JJ.
Good old "DON'T BRING YOUR EGO TO THE MAT"-Submission by Ryron
At the end of the day, Ryron didn't get submitted!
Lazaro Carreiro he got dominated instead
Corey Collins how so?? Submission only! No points what so ever.
It frees you up to defend the submission and not just the points. The best in the world can still pass and attain dominant positions and get submissions, so it's not stalling to force a draw. There have been plenty of matches I've viewed where not a single submission is attempted, but a person still is called winner based on how many advancements they make. Ryron openly says that he would've lost on points if those were the rules, but the objective was just not to get tapped by a world class guy
Ask Renzo who is better jiujitsu guy between these two . I think the answer Renzo would give would also make all the Gracie jiujitsu boys mad. LOL
Galvao wins this match in any other ruleset by a landslide.
I think the urgency of points better prepares for self defense. No points submission only is ok, but it wouldn't make sense if strikes were involved. Galvao got side control and mounted ryron at one point. No way should you ever lounge in that position if you're under in a street fight. You'd get your skull crushed. I think Sakuraba proved that gracie jiu jitsu is overrated for mma, thus real self defense. If ryron wanted to prove the effectiveness of jiu jitsu in modern times, he should have gone up against a high level ufc fighter. Now if ryron managed to fight that off, id understand their position. But really, this match just proves ryron is good at jiu-jitsu against other jiu-jitsu. Not as self defense.
Galvao is a sore "loser" and has a big ego. He knows that he could not submit Ryron after 20 minutes and was nowhere close to doing so, so her pretends that the rules were the reason. BS. Got watch his match with Leandro Lo, he moves at an even slower pace. What he is really trying to say is that he would have won on points. What his body language and speech betray is thatas a more conditioned, multiple times Wolrd Champion, he could not submit a non-competitor. Recent behavior has shown how unclassy Galvao really is. We need Gordon Ryan to slap him around again.
Everyone here saying that ryron's bjj was perfect because it showcased self defense aspect of bjj, are crazy if this was a real fight andre would have smacked the shit outta him from all those dominant positions.
People are so dumb to compare the 2, causing problems for BJJ, this sport/Martial Art should not be a place or whatever for hatred, we are all learning and best way to learn is together, but eish you people, i fully respect the Gracies and the Competition fighters and whatever, I feel that we can learn from both, it's just ignorant how most of you act. But i guess we are all entitled to our own opinion...
And if it were basketball maybe you would have won as well. It’s sad to see a world class Bjj champion and role model disrespect the art by saying “well if the rules were different I would have so won!” You didn’t win. Period. No excuses.
Good match... different strategies. Galvao won on points but Ryron worked his game well at the end.
What points?
Joey McAllister, if this was scored like a regular BJJ match and not been submission only Galvao would have won on points...
In the eyes of defense sure ryron did great. But in the eyes of a practitioner tournament rules, ibjjf rules we all know ryron just stalled and just stayed dormant. Galvao trains for the kill rener trains only defense
Pause at 1:33 . Galvao had just challenged Gracie to his rule set. Shaved head guy looks like he’s about to go full Conor McGregor and chuck that Pepsi can. then at 1:34 I realized oh nvm that’s the arm of the dude behind him lmao
Common its a fight, you learn from the video from whatever you remember after. You just dont let your opponent pass your guard. at the end is self defense, so if somebody passes your guard you get punch. Is not what they preach?
If it were based on points then sure, it would be bad to let your opponent pass your guard. And if you were in a fight it can also be bad, but this was not a match with points and it wasn't a fight.
No. You can't guarantee you guard will never be passed, so you must ALSO learn to fight and defend from being passed, too. The trap and roll that Ryron did when Andre mounted him is LITERALLY the first lesson of Gracie Jiu-Jitsu. It is the very, very, very first thing people are taught when they walk into the school.
If someone passes your guard, they MIGHT start punching you, but we learn plenty of defenses and escapes against punches. We learn how to re-establish our guard, take the back, or sweep, etc.
30 minutes? or just get murked by Josh B, the black underweared crusader, the new Gracie killer, the, dare I say, bjj killer?
Always hate listening to him complain. Still immature during that time. True BJJ prevailed that day.
LOL.. Galvao hardly ever created space and when he did Rryon retrieved a safer position. It's also pointless to inject strikes while at the same time you claim Ryron was "helpless" then why didn't Galvao submit him?? Answer-Defense. If Galvao wanted to strike he would have to create space and Rryon would capitalize on the space created. Since we're doing the "if" thing though, IF there was more time or NO TIME limit Galvao would have been submitted. He was gassed and running the last 5 min
How is just laying in bottom mount and side control where the other guy is free to strike you good for self defense?
jiujitsu is about conserving energy and attacking only when the opportunity arises (hence the "gentle" part in "jiu"jitsu). however, this can be a problem in tournaments. if both people just sit there and conserve their energy, then we'll get to see nothing. props to andre for playing offensively, but ryron didn't do anything wrong either imo. it was smart to defend when you're pushed so hard by andre and only retaliate when possible.
Being on the floor for 20 minutes defending is self defense... The first thing they teach you in a real self defense scenario is to Never go to the floor.
And that defense must happen from the guard, not side mount. lol
Funny cause 90% of fights go to the ground. If you took gracie self defense classes, you'd be able to compensate for that ^_^
That's definitely not true. The first thing they teach you is the trap and roll escape from the mount because sometimes you are FORCED to the ground. You guys are painfully clueless.
"But the objective was just not to get tapped by a world class guy." The objective is to submit your opponent and aggressively look for better positioning.
position seeking don't mean anything in sub-only, except as a means to try a submission.
@@tjl4688 in many tournament style matches, position and aggression is awarded if no sub is accomplished. Yes ebi and other tournaments have a different way to end things but they are not the gold standard.
Its a novel idea this no point ruleset but its kind of a different mindset ... It means BJJ is the real winner on the day
Lol at least pay respect to the Gracie for bringing Jiu-Jitsu to Brazil it was their family showed Brazil the beautiful art of jiu-jitsu they may not be the best now that everyone trains but still at least respect them for bringing Jiu Jitsu to the world
Are you sure they “BRING JJ to Brazil” ? ? ?
Hopefully next year you can knuckle up with him and bang that shit out!!!
Ken shamrock didn't let royce mount, do not compare the two they are completely different.
30mins yes andre was knacker after 20mins Ryron was class real class
Ryron did EXCELLENT for a player that never completes.
Galvao got tired...Ryron was not......Galvao would have eventually got tapped.....Jui Jitsu is about patience.....You throw that out of window when you put time limits and points into a competiton....Everyone just remember: The primary objective is to submit your oponent, not to get a top position....NO DISRSPECT TO GALVAO....I just believe PERSONALLY that points is cheap......Master Helio would NOT compete in a tournament with a 20 min. time limit and points......I'm sure of it
I agreed! But, it wasn't this event no rules no striking, but BJJ? No points!! None submit the other, so a DRAW! Probably in 10 minutes more something different happen, but Galvao is pretty good at it as well. My point is he did not give any credit to the strategy of Ryron, because he was on his own backyard? BJJ is his backyard and that's what he did; actually both of them. Sorry, but still a draw with a BS speech.
It seems a point is trying to be made about self defense BJJ vs. sport BJJ. If this is really the argument then this is the wrong test. Ryron vs Galvao in a MMA match or a steet fight would better answer the question. BJJ (the most effective martial art in my opinion) is only a part of "Self Defense". So to all those awesome BJJ players Sport or Self Defense, like Royce said, a Black belt only covers two inches of your ass, you have to cover the rest".
submission only is the only form that matters. losing on points or winning on points will never mean shit.