Reminds me of college wind ensemble or percussion ensemble. Conductor says “can we try such n such timpani mallet? I want more articulation.” Player literally just plays differently rather than change mallet because we know that the mallet choice isn’t what they were really after. Conductor praises for it being perfect and to use that one even though we didn’t change mallets at all but how we played. Lol
Well, first off, I gotta say that the pattern that Cody plays beginning at the 7:23 mark made me bust out in a grin as big as his own! That was so much fun that I had to replay it a few times. Thanks, dude! And then I have to say that I always love it when you guys talk about combating GAS with common sense and a knowledge of how to get a wide variety of sounds from drums. As a guy who has been playing the same kit and snare drum for over fifty years, simple economics made me appreciate how versatile a good set of drums can be. Back when I was gigging, I played in a LOT of different rooms with a lot of different acoustic environments. Now, my kit lives in my lovely little music room in the basement, and I can tinker with it in lots of different ways. And my good ol' Super Sensitive snare can do just about anything. (I recently took it apart and fixed a lot of little things, but that's another story.)
If I’m spending money to get new sounds, I’m going to be buying cymbals. Tuning, dampening, head choice and how you play can drastically change your sound on a drum. I’d say you can also get different sounds from a cymbal based on sticks and the way you play, but it’s definitely not going to be as versatile as a drum.
Agree, with one additional caveat: using uncouple mass can dry out and therefore revoice a cymbal without darkening its attack as much, so understanding the difference between uncoupled and coupled mass can allow for revoicing. Also sizzle chains can sub for rivets w/o drilling, and ching rings can do some interesting stuff too as a sort of combination of uncoupled mass and sizzle/jingle. So...accessorize! But yeah cymbals obviously can't be retuned or head swapped like drums...
I cannot tell you how huge and revealing this video is for me and my compulsion for buying stuff that appears shiny at first, but not necessary for the gig. I’m gonna make some changes here. Thanks guys‼️🙏🏻🧖🏻
Steve Jordan was recording in Memphis a few years ago playing 1960s Ludwig with wrap peeling off and some just ok old A zildjians. Sounded phenomenal because he knows how to coax the sound out of whatever it is he’s playing. Then he de-tuned 2 lugs completely and….you guessed it, it sounded phenomenal. Of course it helped that he was Steve Jordan. In the end when the rest of the music was added it didn’t really matter that much what he was playing or even how it was tuned. He knew how to make it all work….
Great video and commentary y'all! How about breaking down what comes next...after you get the recording gig. How to listen, interpret and chart out the tracks or songs you are expected to play and be creative on. Cheers from the PNW!
I don’t record, but I play live, and adapting and tuning, and playing to the room. My tuning for two of the gigs in 2024: small max 20 people room, large outdoor festival with no snare microphone (i’m not kidding), was wildly different. Playing also totally different for those venues. I find that playing, grip, stick height, angle of impact doesn’t get talked about lots, though I think that’s what most of Steve J or Ash Soans success is about.
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Out of the 2000 (a little more now) drum sessions I've done, I lost the gig ONCE because I didn't have a specific snare drum that a producer really wanted. I now have a vintage supra, a black beauty, a bell brass...but I must say that this is more for the joy I get to play those than for the people who hires me ^^ I started out with one single mapex wood snare that I got for cheap and I recorded more than 300 songs with it without having problem or complaints at all. :)
Perfect example of asking for a prescription rather than a desired outcome. It's our job to interpret that and provide a solution that matches their expectations (regardless of their prescription).
It’s also worth remembering that when someone asks you to “go to rim shots” for the quieter passages they probably mean rim clicks. It is not worth playing super loud rim shots just to prove the point that you know better than them…
Yes! This speaks to professionalism and attitude along with the interpretation of feedback, all of which tends to matter far more than the specific model of drum(s) being used.
I've seen the following story in multiple ways from three or four drummers here on TH-cam and reading (Modern Drummer and online forums): Producer: "That snare sound isn't what I'm looking for. Please try you [insert model] snare." Drummer: "You mean the one that sounds like [insert Producer's sound description]." Drummer changes heads and/or tunes it the only snare he/she has with them differently, including using the famous droping the tuning on a lug or two technique. Producer from Control Room after above changes: "That's the sound. Thanks for working with me and using that snare." Paraphrasing, of course, but that's the interaction and actions by the drummer I've heard about or read about.
Okay I agree! But are cymbals a bit different, since its harder to change the sound of a cymbal? is it obvious to non drummers when a cymbals is cheap? Will people who are paying me care if I use cheap planet Z cymbals? This won't stop me from going for it, but is likely that I'll be judged?
Ironic, because I've found that often the guy doing the recording isn't interested in the actual sound of the drum, they want to kill it and build the sound they like with effects and other tricks. Which I hate.
This kind of theme i heared for several time now from you.....don't buy new gear,what you allready have is fine for everything..... Well...i would say,this one side of the coin....less needs and demands creativity...ok... that's true ......but ,as we all know....a funky new snare drum,a cool set of hi hats,a new bass drum pedal,an other head for the bass drum,good powerhoops for the snare....and so on....this all can be verry inspiiring too,can liift you into new higts,can bring a side to shine much brighter....that's the other side of the coin and is worth beeing said to.....but....it's all about the balance between the too.....too much of a good thing is bad....
That's not quite what we're saying though- the focus here was on the common idea the you need certain gear to be a session drummer and that it's the gear that gets the gig. The discussion of gear for the sake of inspiration is something we've addressed in other videos but not so much in this one. There's an unhealthy representation (in our collective opinion) out there of the gear-centric approach and we've sought to balance that out and minimize gear as the barrier through several videos, this one included. As for the statement that "too much of a good thing is bad," if the "good thing" being referenced in this video is the concept of a strong understanding of the capabilities of the instruments you own in order to get the greatest functionality out of them, we don't think there's such a thing as "too much".
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Reminds me of college wind ensemble or percussion ensemble. Conductor says “can we try such n such timpani mallet? I want more articulation.” Player literally just plays differently rather than change mallet because we know that the mallet choice isn’t what they were really after. Conductor praises for it being perfect and to use that one even though we didn’t change mallets at all but how we played. Lol
Well, first off, I gotta say that the pattern that Cody plays beginning at the 7:23 mark made me bust out in a grin as big as his own! That was so much fun that I had to replay it a few times. Thanks, dude! And then I have to say that I always love it when you guys talk about combating GAS with common sense and a knowledge of how to get a wide variety of sounds from drums. As a guy who has been playing the same kit and snare drum for over fifty years, simple economics made me appreciate how versatile a good set of drums can be. Back when I was gigging, I played in a LOT of different rooms with a lot of different acoustic environments. Now, my kit lives in my lovely little music room in the basement, and I can tinker with it in lots of different ways. And my good ol' Super Sensitive snare can do just about anything. (I recently took it apart and fixed a lot of little things, but that's another story.)
Now we’re talking ! That’s a video I really needed to see to comfort me in my way of playing, thanks a lot for that !
If I’m spending money to get new sounds, I’m going to be buying cymbals. Tuning, dampening, head choice and how you play can drastically change your sound on a drum. I’d say you can also get different sounds from a cymbal based on sticks and the way you play, but it’s definitely not going to be as versatile as a drum.
Pretty crazy how cymbals will change the sound of an entire band
Agree, with one additional caveat: using uncouple mass can dry out and therefore revoice a cymbal without darkening its attack as much, so understanding the difference between uncoupled and coupled mass can allow for revoicing. Also sizzle chains can sub for rivets w/o drilling, and ching rings can do some interesting stuff too as a sort of combination of uncoupled mass and sizzle/jingle.
So...accessorize! But yeah cymbals obviously can't be retuned or head swapped like drums...
I cannot tell you how huge and revealing this video is for me and my compulsion for buying stuff that appears shiny at first, but not necessary for the gig. I’m gonna make some changes here.
Thanks guys‼️🙏🏻🧖🏻
This is an excellecent video. Thanks for putting out such great content!
Very interesting topic right there. Thanks for sharing.
Steve Jordan was recording in Memphis a few years ago playing 1960s Ludwig with wrap peeling off and some just ok old A zildjians. Sounded phenomenal because he knows how to coax the sound out of whatever it is he’s playing. Then he de-tuned 2 lugs completely and….you guessed it, it sounded phenomenal.
Of course it helped that he was Steve Jordan. In the end when the rest of the music was added it didn’t really matter that much what he was playing or even how it was tuned. He knew how to make it all work….
I'm pretty sure being Steve Jordan trumps most gear related issues 🤣
Haaa, Lauten microphones. I love those.
Great video and commentary y'all! How about breaking down what comes next...after you get the recording gig.
How to listen, interpret and chart out the tracks or songs you are expected to play and be creative on.
Cheers from the PNW!
Awesome video
I don’t record, but I play live, and adapting and tuning, and playing to the room. My tuning for two of the gigs in 2024: small max 20 people room, large outdoor festival with no snare microphone (i’m not kidding), was wildly different. Playing also totally different for those venues. I find that playing, grip, stick height, angle of impact doesn’t get talked about lots, though I think that’s what most of Steve J or Ash Soans success is about.
Out of the 2000 (a little more now) drum sessions I've done, I lost the gig ONCE because I didn't have a specific snare drum that a producer really wanted. I now have a vintage supra, a black beauty, a bell brass...but I must say that this is more for the joy I get to play those than for the people who hires me ^^
I started out with one single mapex wood snare that I got for cheap and I recorded more than 300 songs with it without having problem or complaints at all. :)
And there ya have it! It sure would be interesting to know how everything went down with that one session.
One time a producer wanted me to use vic firth magnums.
Perfect example of asking for a prescription rather than a desired outcome. It's our job to interpret that and provide a solution that matches their expectations (regardless of their prescription).
😂
What tuning was used at the 5:50 marker? I can't imagine it. Halp. 😢
We've addressed lower snare tunings in previous videos and have an in-depth section on this within a new resource we'll be releasing shortly.
Great
Is that an INDe drum microphone clip for the snare drum?
Found it, it's a Lauten audio mic clip. How cool is that???
The new Rim Mounts from Lauten are pretty excellent! We've had great experiences with them so far.
@@SoundsLikeADrum Lauten Audio Snare mic and mic mount review time please. Mayby a vs video with SM57 and other snare mics
Was that one beat closer by NiN? Thw snare sure sounded like it :)
That was definitely the inspiration there.
man, what are those hi hats! they sound phenomenal
some 15" zildjian prototypes, according to the description
Yep, that's correct. All gear listed in the description.
It’s also worth remembering that when someone asks you to “go to rim shots” for the quieter passages they probably mean rim clicks. It is not worth playing super loud rim shots just to prove the point that you know better than them…
Yes! This speaks to professionalism and attitude along with the interpretation of feedback, all of which tends to matter far more than the specific model of drum(s) being used.
I've seen the following story in multiple ways from three or four drummers here on TH-cam and reading (Modern Drummer and online forums):
Producer: "That snare sound isn't what I'm looking for. Please try you [insert model] snare."
Drummer: "You mean the one that sounds like [insert Producer's sound description]." Drummer changes heads and/or tunes it the only snare he/she has with them differently, including using the famous droping the tuning on a lug or two technique.
Producer from Control Room after above changes: "That's the sound. Thanks for working with me and using that snare."
Paraphrasing, of course, but that's the interaction and actions by the drummer I've heard about or read about.
What is that hi hat clutch?
looks like a remo spring loaded clutch
@thefallingpi341 ok, thanks, i looked it up, and it's just a quick release system. Got it 👍
Okay I agree! But are cymbals a bit different, since its harder to change the sound of a cymbal? is it obvious to non drummers when a cymbals is cheap? Will people who are paying me care if I use cheap planet Z cymbals? This won't stop me from going for it, but is likely that I'll be judged?
Ironic, because I've found that often the guy doing the recording isn't interested in the actual sound of the drum, they want to kill it and build the sound they like with effects and other tricks. Which I hate.
This kind of theme i heared for several time now from you.....don't buy new gear,what you allready have is fine for everything.....
Well...i would say,this one side of the coin....less needs and demands creativity...ok... that's true ......but ,as we all know....a funky new snare drum,a cool set of hi hats,a new bass drum pedal,an other head for the bass drum,good powerhoops for the snare....and so on....this all can be verry inspiiring too,can liift you into new higts,can bring a side to shine much brighter....that's the other side of the coin and is worth beeing said to.....but....it's all about the balance between the too.....too much of a good thing is bad....
That's not quite what we're saying though- the focus here was on the common idea the you need certain gear to be a session drummer and that it's the gear that gets the gig. The discussion of gear for the sake of inspiration is something we've addressed in other videos but not so much in this one. There's an unhealthy representation (in our collective opinion) out there of the gear-centric approach and we've sought to balance that out and minimize gear as the barrier through several videos, this one included. As for the statement that "too much of a good thing is bad," if the "good thing" being referenced in this video is the concept of a strong understanding of the capabilities of the instruments you own in order to get the greatest functionality out of them, we don't think there's such a thing as "too much".