At work last month, I dressed down a construction foreman who was being a bully" My boss said she didn't understand this and called me a nice guy... I told her no, I'm a good guy and that I addressed an issue that was long over due to be addressed. I told her I'm always polite and courteous, but not at the risk of not speaking the truth.
I had 2 buddies who swore they would never get the jab at work. I held out they folded at the last minute, and a short time later, it was all dropped .I lost a lot of respect for them. What else would they cow tow too ??
Hearing this was like a punch to the gut, and a kick to the balls for me. I don't have all the "Nice Guy" attributes, but enough that I need to make a serious change. Thanks for making this video John.
You have one great thing going for you. Your humble. That's a character trait that is becoming elusive. Like you I find it hard to have balance. It seems I continue to be too much one way or another. I think I think I could really learn to be a decent man in two lifetimes.
I totally agree an try to live my life accordingly: "The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything"- Albert Einstein
It's easy to be a nice, compliant guy. It's also easy to be a jerk and never learn how to be persuasive to those you disagree with. To be a man of both persuasion and conviction is a lifelong pursuit.
There is a meme going around that talks about the difference between a gentleman and a harmless man. The meme points out that being incapable of harm does NOT make someone gentle. Instead, we have to acknowledge we are capable of violence yet be willing to restrain that violence to be considered a true "gentleman".
Exactly, a mouse is not gentle, because it is incapable of great violence. A grizzly bear however, can be gentle, because it is capable of violence. That is how a man should be, that's the whole point of being a "gentleman".
Nick Freitas talked about that. A nice guy is a weak man. A GOOD man is gentle by choice, capable of great violence when needed, and wise enough to know when that is.
Not always. Maybe a man can't defend and cause violence because he spent a lifetime against violence. Looking at what the New Testament says about violence goes very much against our just war and other narratives. I know that is controversial, but most of us will make the Word say whatever we want to prove our point.
@crystalbuck6525 And that's one of the best explanations of it. "Capable of great violence when needed..." And sometimes it's needed. Reminds me of John's interview with that guy in TX a few years ago, who, when he heard gunfire in a church across the street, grabbed his rifle, headed across that street into the churchyard, encountered that mass shooter leaving and shot him. What was doubly tragic about that whole incident was that there were no armed sheepdogs in that congregation to protect the flock. All the men, no, strike that, biological males(but not actual men)there were a bunch of nice guys. It took an actual real man to put down the evil evildoer.
You're spot on John. I'm a recovering nice guy and recognize many of these traits in myself. You, John Cooper, and Doug Wilson have been helpful in getting me to start becoming a courageous man.
Yeah, I had this exact realization about myself. As a young man raised with two older, liberal sisters- it took me through my military career about half way, until I realized that sometimes you have to be hard in social situations.
absolutley! have tou ever heard congressional debates? they akways refer to each other as 'my friend congressman so- and so' regardless of how much they can't stand each other.
1st husband, not proud of this but spot on. When I left him everyone said “he’s such a nice guy” so often that today it still sets my teeth on edge. Every statement you made is so true, even 25 years later, it helped hearing this
@@briansmith4726 you had to make sure she heard the part about women being "built" to follow men, eh? That is neither kind nor respectful and undermines the rest of the decent points.
It's incredible how scared people are of taking responsibility for their own actions. So many in my life I've stood up and said I was wrong, I messed up, and it's been met with nothing but appreciation for being honest. There might be disappointment with the mistake and the consequences, but being trustworthy and accountable is far more appreciated.
@@nathankleber9150 I agree it’s uncommon to see folks willing to admit their mistakes. We normal folks don’t like to be wrong but will admit our mistakes so we can fix our mistakes. When we are willing to move on and fix our problems we can live good lives. The alternative is to be one of the millions of folks living life with anger and frustration. You spend to much time unhappy in the alternative life choices. Bravo sir perfect observation.
I started at a new plumbing company a few years back, and in my first week, I made a huge rookie mistake and flooded someone's kitchen, costing 10s of thousands to repair. The next day, a buddy asked hey we're you at this job yesterday?" I immediately knew what had happened. So I went to the bosses office and before they said anything I apologized, and explained what happened and said it was completely my fault and was a stupid mistake for someone with my experience to make. He just said, "Thanks, go make it right" it cost the company thousands of dollars for water mitigation and reconstruction. He told me a year or so later that if I had said anything else, he would have fired me. They have been the best people I have ever worked for, and I truly appreciate all they have done for me.
Yes, that's a shame! I believe it's an evil spiritual mess that is taking over. We as believers need to really know The Word of God, follow as best we can and pray to stay on His path. Where God in the Bible says to do something, do it. Where He says not to do something, don't do it! He and His Word is the same " yesterday, today, and forever" !!!
I’m not triggered by this, so much as I am convicted by it. Definitely at least a couple of things here that I identify with. This is a good one. God bless bro.
100% Agree. Tangentially, a lot of guys think they are protectors simply b/c their hobby happens to be firearms / training. A lot of men in this community, myself included at times, have prioritized a fantasized battle that we may never face (such as a home invasion / bugout / etc.) over REAL fights that we ignore every day (fighting chores with our wives, fighting our own sin and selfishness, praying for our families, etc.). I think a lot of guys think they are on the right path because they are monsters on the range when in fact they are passive when it comes to what really counts.
Brother - I'll leave the fantasy fights for the younger men. Way too much snap-crackle-pop when this old Vet body moves! I believe fantasizing a situation is bad, Thinking thought those situations from a TTP perspective, and following through with training is not a bad idea. But for sure - guys. Take out the garbage. Respect and honor your wife and train your child/children in the way that they should go - TRAIN not tell. Lead by example. It's really not an option in a certain perspective. You (Dad's) will lead by example whether you want to or not. It's either good and righteous leadership or crappy dad leadership. Follow the #1 man - Jesus. Be His disciple. Appreciate the comment I can sense your passion in those statements.
A man of virtue and honor is kind. But speaks out about things important to him - including if unkindness is required. He stands up for what he thinks is worth protecting.
sort of like when people are being fake where they smile at you and act all friendly and talk to you with their teeth clenched at the same time & whenever they look away from you theyre scowling then when they look back at you they smile again? Edit: cartoon example: Hazbin Hotel episode 4 when Valentino would look angrily at Angel but is smiling being nice, friendly, & polite to Charlie talking through his teeth. th-cam.com/video/5H2OzIQEez0/w-d-xo.htmlsi=PZpnr9ZfodLdOKWR
I think the word "nice" has been so overused, that it has become meaningless. There is nothing wrong with being agreeable, amicable, polite, respectful, humble, kind, peaceful, thoughtful, etc. Not everyone has to be a leader. There is nothing wrong with serving others. Christ taught us that the greatest among us is the one who will be a servant.
Amen. I will often appear to be a nice guy and conformist. Think of it like a grey man tactic. Be invisible, look non threatening. The whole time you are measuring people and the environment. Someone once told me in a crowd, look past the extroverts, tattoos and loudmouths. Beware the guy in the quiet, smiling guy in the corner, who looks weak and easy. Very often he's the most dangerous one in the room.
@@craighaller4002 I attempt to be the grey man, but I'm 6'2"/225. I've even gone so far as driving a boring old-man car with no distinguishing markings.
Grandad said be strong enough to be gentle. You can't just cultivate strength or exercise tenderness alone. You lose sight of things like your boundaries and might not tell someone the hard truth because it will hurt a lot.
This is one of the major points of the Fountainhead. I would recommend anyone read it to see these character traits dramatized in a beautifully crafted narrative
Holy crap!!! I work with a guy EXACTLY like this. You hit every nail on the head! This guy's left his religion, got left by his wife, his teenage daughters don't listen to him and actively avoid him at times, he believes in a socialist paradise, he runs from conflict, he's turned on people, he's a yes-man, etc. I'm in my car right now, laughing so hard that I can barely breathe! I'm already picking co-workers to send this to!
@@StinkyGringo Is that all you do is go from comment to comment gas lighting? Only thing worse than a nice guy, is a douche who likes to leave keyboard warrior messages all over peoples comments of a video, knowing good and well they wouldnt say it to their face. Run along and comment on the next one. I think id rather be a nice guy than a keyboard warrior.
I feel like I’m listening to a sermon here! I’ve had to stand up for truth, seemingly alone, for years. I believe in being kind but not withholding the truth from others, even if it hurts them. This road has been difficult. I’ve chased women away, friends away, and probably had tons of other people trash talk me behind my back. I still find myself asking, “Am I in any part this guy John is talking about?!” I grew up in the south so I believe in being kind. People have said “You’re too nice.” I also have NO problem with being a dangerous man. I learned some martial arts when I was younger and learned how to handle myself better in a fight. But I’ve never gone looking for one. Another problem I see too often in the south is fake niceness too. Nevertheless, we men all need to look in the mirror and root out that weakness, including myself if I’m getting complacent! Great video! I think people are confused about what niceness vs. true kindness is. I’ve been called all sorts of names, nice being one of them. The real question is, is there an agenda tied to being nice? If you’re being nice to someone in that moment because you believe it’s the right thing to do, you’re being kind.
This is somewhat true. Sometimes one can often appear to be a nice guy and conformist. Be invisible, look non threatening. The whole time measuring people and the environment. Someone once told me in a crowd, look past the extroverts, tattoos and loudmouths. Beware the quiet guy, smiling guy in the corner, who looks weak and easy. Very often he's the most dangerous one in the room if he's cornered and got nothing to lose.
The most dangerous person in the room is the one with the ability and _motivation_ . That skinny young man with glasses who got bullied when he was a kid, that old man with a cane and a wife, the person in a wheelchair.... yeah, they are potentially well armed, able, and motivated.
It's not an extrovert/introvert thing. John has made a few video's about 'the most dangerous guy in the room' that your post could actually be an intro for.
Dalton: If somebody gets in your face and calls you a cocksucker, I want you to be nice. Ask him to walk. Be nice. If he won't walk, walk him. But be nice. If you can't walk him, one of the others will help you, and you'll both be nice. I want you to remember that it's a job. It's nothing personal. Steve: Being called a cocksucker isn't personal? Dalton: No. It's two nouns combined to elicit a prescribed response. Steve: What if somebody calls my mama a whore? Dalton: Is she?
This is what every man needs to hear. I have been wondering why I feel bad about failure to act, because I mis understood what being a “good man” actually is. To sum up this video I would say this is what the phrase “nice guys finish last,” means. Thank you and God bless. Your children are lucky to have you as a father who puts The Father before himself.
Former nice guy here. John youbare hitting the nail on the head. I can tell you from experience that you can change for the better. It is difficult, but it means a lot of self-reflection is needed and drop your friggin ego. Nice guys are toxic. I used to be very toxic and didn't even know it. I still have some issues I am working on, but things are getting better. Do better, and your life will get better
My friend started a men’s group called Rise Undaunted which specifically addresses Nice Guy Syndrome and helps guys become true masculine Men. Excellent and important message.
@@GarrettFemister it’s not an mlm but there is an incentive for recruiting if you want to. I don’t. You don’t have to pay to participate. I don’t either. The founder is LDS, but the group is not affiliated with any church.
Spot on. Seen the side of trying to be nice to someone who really wants to take advantage. Learned to be friendly but aggressive. Been through some battles not as nice until I know people better
My mother raised me to be a kind person. Being “nice” tends to be for shallow gain. Not everyone deserves kindness and that’s what every man needs to learn.
Some solid useful and generally correct insights John! I had to go back and re-listed while taking some notes when a thought occurred to me halfway through point #3. 1) Say Hard Things 2) Lead/Take Risks 3) Take Responsibility 4) Protect 5) Keep the Faith These are equally the failings of toxic women. Solid points all the way through, and I think you're right we all at least occasionally fail to do these things at some level and it's a good list to consider when planning out our paths to self improvement. Work Hard, Pray Hard, Play Hard.
The term "nice guy" may throw some folks off track, Ann Gunther said it well, "I see "nice" as being what "kind" looks like, Kindness comes from love" I would say "kindness" comes from strength as well. And she is correct, "nice is just a shell". You are spot on with this, can't argue a single point you've made.
Man that’s the truth. I believed in tolerance so strongly for a while. And then I figured out it’s just another way, 99% of the time, for someone to say they don’t care without having to admit they don’t care. The 1% of the time it’s sincere, I even more so admire it. But I notice that 1% of the tolerant people who genuinely are tolerant, it’s people who also don’t hesitate to admit to themselves and others when they don’t care. And people notice them for the not caring, and never recognize that they are being tolerant when they are. People love hypocrisy except when other people do it.
@@RickyJr46 bullshit. Having conviction is not an excuse for being intolerant. More often it's an excuse to be a lazy, stubborn asshole who wants to impose their "faith" on other people.
Correct. I used to be like this and had to force my self to change. Now I see my brother going down this path and the people he associates with use him because of it, so he is basically a doormat for everyone. We are trying to get him out of it
The origin of "nice" is "nescio." It's Latin for "I don't know." The idea is that a "nice" guy will flip flop on every issue they're confronted with, have no firm opinion of their own, and will therefore ride the fence in every circumstance to the point where they can't stand up for anything, even the things that matter. Speaks pretty well to what John's saying.
I think you clarified my internal frustration with organized religion, with your remark on “your church is dead if it’s filled with nice guys”. I have felt like I was in the wrong crowd many times based on the way people behaved to the needs of the community vs the role of the church. This isn’t to say that representation is true of all organized religion, but unfortunately, represents many of the churches people attend. God is not for us to follow as sheep and cowards. The right thing to do, may in fact, be something your church won’t support. In those times it’s better to follow god than the church.
I would encourage you to still find a church full of good men to go through life with, rather than rejecting the church. No man is an island. I’m in a church with the opposite of nice guys, and that collective is doing things that are making massive impacts in our city.
I know what you are talking about. I struggle with it too. I'm a Mormon, and I think the nice guy syndrome is plaguing our church. People generally consider Mormons conservative/traditional, but I believe all the nice guys are creating confusion about our message and what we stand for. A lot of people don't really know what Mormons stand for anymore. That used to not be the case. Even though people hated us for our beliefs, at least we made them clear and stood by them. The criticism made us better Mormons. Those days are a memory. But, instead of giving up, I'm one of the holdouts that believes in the Warrior Poet way. I don't play nice guy. Sometimes people gasp at what I say. But, they like my sincerity. I don't think I make a big difference, but I do think I make a small difference with the small circle of influence I have. If nothing else, I hope to pass it along to my sons, and that my daughters will value the Warrior Poet way in men. Half of my kids are teenagers and it seems like they are learning the ways of their old man, and rejecting the nice guy syndrome. I basically associate myself more with my Warrior Poet mentality than I do with my particular "brand of church" at this point. I agree with your statement that it's better to obey God instead of the church. I have done that many times over the past few years, and so far, God has always backed me up. I encourage you to do it where you can.
@@mnt809 My favorite complement I have received in the past five years is being told I am authentic. In that one word, I felt proud and emboldened to continue presenting myself as a man, unafraid. I appreciate your comment and your authenticity to stand for the right things over the crowd. Regardless of what name your faith carries, people need others to represent the strength and compassion of a higher purpose. Stand tall and lend an insightful ear to all that need guidance. Good men, like yourself, will save us from tyrants lurking in our communities.
@@connormcalister5765 You are not wrong. It be of the most common things I hear these days is that men have no friends. Good organizations are a great way to combat that theory. They also provide a place for important messages to be heard. I was told recently, that I am an authentic soul. It’s my favorite complement I have received because it not only empowered me to stand tall in my convictions, but it also gave room for me to be received by the community around me on a true level. I am happy you have found a fellowship that aligns with your authenticity. Stand tall in your community and lend solid guidance to “right and wrong” wherever you see fit. As for me , I will continue without a church until I am drawn in by authentic people. People that understand that compassion is the second biggest strength/burden we must carry in order to secure the role of leaders in our community. I hope you continue to be authentic to yourself and provide that strong outward guidance to your fellowship and community at large. Our world needs it in every way.
My late husband wanted our kids to like him so he left the discipline up to me. The kids loved him but I was being sabotaged. He was also a coward in many other ways. Even though he suffered with cancer for over 5 years, he would not talk about death due to fear. I was left with little information and guidance but I was relieved when he finally died.
I'm sure he would be thrilled to hear your talk about him like that in the comment section of TH-cam, of all places. Did you ever say anything to him about it? Maybe you're the coward.
I love the call to action and encouragement to do something about it at the end - better yourself, better the community, better the next generation. Keep Fighting the Good Fight
Seriously badazz move... I luv it... Inspiring, insightful, motivating... Good f*kin job... Well articulated, informed, and stated the case clearly and professionally... I look forward to more of your posts...
@@GreatWhite7 even if that was the case in general, the principle conveyed here is still valid. A formidable force for good is only going to come from someone who also possesses a formidable potential for evil. Weak individuals arent capable of much either way.
What a great message! This could easily be turned into a sermon. I would say that a good leader can be kind, but can never be nice and be an effective leader.
I am blessed to be part of a church filled with the exact opposite of “Nice Guy” as you define here, and you will find some of the most kind and gentle husbands, fathers, and protectors you will ever meet.
@@Station737 well, maybe they shouldn't have gone full racist by voting to leave the EU. Would have saved them a lot of trouble and even more money. But hey, you should stick to your "moral" guns and tell people how you really feel, right?
Excellent take. I grew up as a nice guy. Just over 40 years ago, at the young age of 23, I went to Marine Corps boot camp. Life has never been the same since. Nice guys are weak men. Weak men create hard times. Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. Guess where in the cycle we are!
@FreeBirdVince never give up on yourself, on your team, and you'll do well. Quite the adventure you're embarking on, your service will be appreciated, thank you for taking the oath. Hey, don't drink too much off duty, a LOT of problems stem from just that one seemingly little act. I mean yeah drink, get wasted sometimes, just don't make it your go-to. Stay true to yourself, once you find him in the hardest days. Keep your head down in boot camp, do what you're told, do it fast but do it as well as you can.
Amen sir. All points dead-on. I actually have a "Not Nice" tattoo, and for exactly the reasons you describe. I don't share my personal reasons for any of my ink; in this case you've done so vicariously and correctly. Much love, appreciation and respect.
I'm ashamed to say this, but at nearly 30 years old, I've had to learn the hard way, and there is a difference between niceness and kindness. Kindness still contains humility, compassion, love, understanding, patience, and tenderness, but niceness is essentially naivety. If one is nice, they are willing to be naive in order to evade confrontation, but when you are kind, when dealing with confrontation, you take the high road, you keep a cool head, as long as it doesn't get physical, then yeah, take up self defense, but you discuss, not argue. Arguing determines who is right, that is, ego, but discussing determines WHAT is right, that is true knowledge and wisdom. That's what the kind guy does. Also, I've had to learn this, and I have a quote for this as well, just because the word ass is in assertive, that doesn't mean you have to be one, so in short, the kind guy is assertive but at the same time humble and patient about it, he's not a jerk. Also, pardon my language with my quote, but I am just being honest.
100% accurate… and the women whom go for the “nice guy” are narcissistic, they can manipulate the “nice guy” as they both use each other to pursue their own excessive self-interest.
@@WendyOryen It’s important to not conflate polite with nice… To speak honest truth one must be willing to offend, many folks don’t face the truth, truth hurts those whom live a lie or unwilling to face issues they’re not mature enough to deal with… The nice guy wants to be seen as virtuous so will constantly seek to maintain such an appearance for his own sake, withholding truth for his self-interest rather being honest even if the other isn’t receptive to the facts. Even though immature people don’t always want the truth, speaking the truth is what allows for growth to overcome. To withhold truth to be seen as a “nice” guy is often times self serving. This is compounded when a nice guy uses it to manipulate women, often they don’t really care about being polite or virtuous as a decent human, it’s a tactic used to get the unsuspecting women into bed so they can bust a nut… they’ll be nice all day long if they gonna get something out of it. The guy not trying to manipulate for sex by constantly being the nice guy has greater capability of honest truth as they don’t have that ulterior motive, the honest truth actually benefits the other person not themselves or how they can manipulate you by playing the nice guy.
@@WendyOryen People using the nice guy approach can often be doing it as a form of manipulation, giving the impression or appearance of being virtuous or of upstanding character.
John, you’re such a class act man. Way to walk what you preach. You gave some unpopular truths, stood your ground on saying it and why you’re saying it, and then even give a call to action and a pathway for betterment for those who are perhaps “programmed” to be a nice guy. Uncomfortable truth->stand for your beliefs as opposed to chasing being liked->demonstrated actual kindness by trying to help lift up others John is certified not a nice guy (possibly a real jerk, need to meet in person to verify!)
We all should listen to things that are hard to listen to. If all we ever hear is the things we want to hear, we never feel like we have to grow as a person. Thank you for the Hard Listen.
@2:59 Yes. It means that Nice Guys are people pleaser. They tell things that would garner positive attention towards him, and is careful in saying the right things so as not to offend. There's no assertion in language and speech
Most people pleasers had abusive parents. Like narcissistic abuse etc. Thank God we're all here talking about how pathetic people with mental illness are. It's like a dog that has been abused. It doesn't tuck it's tail just because it's choosing to be weak, it does so from horrible experiences you never went through and don't fully understand.
I love this. You are right on point about all of this. My husband is NOT a nice guy (as described in this video). I have 2 sons and we have raised them not to be “nice”
Kindness is a virtue, niceness is usually a tactic. Do your best to love people more than you like them. Like is only interested in reciprocity, love is interested in well being.
Mr. L. Each one of your points is well thoughout sir. Your psychological analysis in my view is spot on. You would make a common sense therapist. Thank you.
Wow. I always thought I was a nice guy. Until this. Yeah. I don’t fit into that category as you describe. Challenge brings adversity. And adversity brings experience and knowledge. Which makes a good leader for others to follow. 100 percent onboard with your perspective on this.
This is in the Bible: Romans 2:1: “You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.” (NIV)
The older I get, the more I value honesty and a genuine demeanor rather than being "nice" and politically correct. I respect people that are loyal to their values and not concerned about being nice and popular. John, thank you for an insightful video
In my experience, as a retired Green Beret….. Nice guys when they get in trouble, they do disastrous things. Meaning, they don’t know how bad things can get for them because they have never been in trouble. So when they fall, they fall hard and don’t know when to stop themselves. Men that have failed before, and been through some tough times can recognize when he should stop, he knows how bad it can get.
So true, there is only a line crossed. That is where the Lion comes out, and all bets are off. I bite my tongue only when applicable, otherwise I have no filter 😊
The saying is “never confuse MY kindness for weakness””. If someone just went around judging kindness as weakness they would be right a lot of the time.
Whoa glad you covered that last past. My wife and I talk about that a lot. About how we have plenty of “nice” guys in the church today. We can look at our current times as a blessing in that because it’s getting harder regarding the attacks against faith. A lot of the chaff is being separated from the wheat.
I'm generally a nice guy, but not that kind of "nice guy", but I know exactly the type you speak of. I place being nice well down the list of importance, and that niceness can evaporate extremely quickly when someone mistakes it for weakness, and tries to take advantage of it. I care very little what most people think of me, and as a result I'm able to admit my flaws and mistakes, and I'm also capable of being extremely blunt when needed. I've no time to entertain bullshit from anyone. On second thought maybe I'm not nice, so much as genuine and potentially friendly.
This hits home. I don't like conflict, but I've always addressed the really important conflict, especially when it comes to the defense of others. But, I desperately want to get more self confident- it's something that I pray for often. I've had moments since I've been married where I DID act when the situation called for it - and I'm thankful that I had the courage to act then. I just want the courage to say the truth in a loving way before it gets to a situation where you HAVE to act. I don't want to turn every opportunity into a hill to die on, but I definitely don't want to self censor either. Please pray for my courage.
I heard something years ago and it always stuck with me. A friend will tell you what you want to here. But a real friend/best friend will tell you what you need to hear. I was taught as a child. You can be nice and still stand on what you believe. Be kind to everyone be respectful to everyone. But never compromise your honor and dignity. Just because someone don't like it. I also agree with difference of a "Nice Guy". Nice guy who wants to be nice because their afraid to offend someone. So they comply to get everyone to like them. And the Nice Guy who is kind and gentle but has the ability for violence. Not to be a bully or over bearing. But to protect those they love and cherish.
There is a good distinction here between being a "nice guy" and being polite, being kind or being meek and humble. Those are not always the same and I think that distinction is important.
I tend to just give people the benefit of the doubt because we as people have our problems too, so I try not to give people a hurt time. Not sure why this behavior of mine falls into this category because it's just me minding my own business, saying less and no more. If you somehow mistake this as weakness, the moment you abuse this courtesy, I will not hesitate to withdraw this treatment.
On a serious note, My mother, the greatest person to ever walk this earth, raised me to be a pacifist. She would get very angry with me if I got in a fight as a kid. She said any problem can be worked out with communication. For the most part, she is correct. I have never been in a fight that was worth the fight not that I have been in that many. That being said, she was very proud of me when I enlisted in the Army. While she did not like me fighting, she liked me defending. She is who taught me the difference.
I see what you are saying, and thank you for your service, BTW (*I am also a US Army veteran) ;but if she was okay with you "defending" (*physically, that is, which occasionally requires violence to do so) then she is not a complete pacifist; complete pacifists believe (*or claim to believe) that literally every single form of violence towards/against another human being, in all situations, is unjustified.
I was raised in a similar fashion. Only my parent's admonition was that I was never to start a fight, but I'd better be ready to end it. So I never got into fights, walked away from several of them. Got labeled a coward, particularly since I wasn't allowed to play football either, took a long time to prove otherwise, elementary and Jr. Hi were not fun times.
In my experience, a nice guy is actually prone to saying sorry because he will commit emotional hijacking as a way of disguising his cowardice. "I'm sorry, I was wrong on this small issue, and because I'm so humble and willing to admit my flaws, it would be cruel to correct me on bigger issues". Nice guys gas light because no one can truly avoid conflict in life, so they choose that path instead of direct conflict.
I had this same conversation yesterday: I have many family members who prioritize the biblical notion of being peacekeepers above standing firm on moral principles and clearly telling others what is right/wrong.
"Throwing down", and "always considerate of others feelings" seems to be a juxtaposition. The individual being "thrown down" upon may feel his feelings have not been held with consideration. Perhaps the "nice guys" have a veneer that is easily removed when necessary. A veneer that covers a not nice guy.
@@getyourgnarlon idk , but these guys I know are like super liberal and always talk about their feelings and you'd pretty much think they are a group of women the way they talk. But they do have some principals that they stand for and will fight for. And I mean I sure as hell wouldn't want to fight them.
@@WiIdbiII Someone in the comments pointed to the difference between being nice and being kind. Kindness is a positive trait based on human compassion, while niceness is most often a cloak of concealment that is used as a tool to gain favor or advancement best exemplified by the politician. At the end of the day I would say it is very important that we all learn to distinguish the difference.
Goodness John this is a whole sermon. The last point about nice guys is something that hits home for me. I see this in my church so much. The people there try to walk a tightrope of being acceptable socially without outright compromising biblical principle, but push come to shove they just collapse. We need so many strong me. Men who dont bend and compromise but who hold fast under pressure. Sadly they seem rare. Im really tempted to send this to my pastor as a challenge.
We certainly do need to use these traits as a guide when selecting which pastor we choose to follow. If our current pastor doesn't have the traits of a true leader, then we need to find ways to grow his character. Sadly many will refuse to grow due to their own insecurities, in which case, we need to move on.
The parallel argument is that gentleness without the capacity for violence/strength is just weakness.
That would imply all women are just weak and have no genuine gentleness.
Agreed
I heard it said, "If you can't be violent you're not peaceful, you're harmless. There's a difference."
@@ianwalker3144Unless of course they get you arrested, and or bankrupted etc.
And it's true, if you don't fight and you don't look like someone fit to fight, they will assume that you don't fight because you are a coward.
At work last month, I dressed down a construction foreman who was being a bully" My boss said she didn't understand this and called me a nice guy... I told her no, I'm a good guy and that I addressed an issue that was long over due to be addressed. I told her I'm always polite and courteous, but not at the risk of not speaking the truth.
I agree, being good and polite, are much different than being nice. The 1st is moral and social. The 2nd is a cover for someone without conviction.
Your first problem is a woman being your boss. Good luck.
I had 2 buddies who swore they would never get the jab at work. I held out they folded at the last minute, and a short time later, it was all dropped .I lost a lot of respect for them. What else would they cow tow too ??
well said, Good Sir.
Yes! Right on!
Hearing this was like a punch to the gut, and a kick to the balls for me. I don't have all the "Nice Guy" attributes, but enough that I need to make a serious change. Thanks for making this video John.
Good job noticing. Get on those changes bro.
GITSUM
You have one great thing going for you. Your humble. That's a character trait that is becoming elusive. Like you I find it hard to have balance. It seems I continue to be too much one way or another. I think I think I could really learn to be a decent man in two lifetimes.
Great job at seeing it, brother! Work hard, and you'll be there sooner than you think!
Knowing is half the battle. Be true to your convictions, and don’t kneel to anyone but Christ. If you can recognize a need for change, You got this!
I totally agree an try to live my life accordingly:
"The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything"- Albert Einstein
I actually think it will be destroyed by both when you really think about it.
John you just mentioned one of my favorite lines. Be dangerously good. Basically I am only a threat if you are. Only dangerous to evil
I can be polite and not agree, be firm and be decisive. Being brutally candid does not mean being rude
Kind and nice are two different things, and you may find that objectively kindness looks less nice in practice.
That doesn't give license to say things in a condescending manner however, which is the default for many "manly men" these days.
Being "brutally candid" CAN be rude.
@@StinkyGringo what you speak of is not a manly man, it is a fool.
@@StinkyGringo well said!
It's easy to be a nice, compliant guy. It's also easy to be a jerk and never learn how to be persuasive to those you disagree with. To be a man of both persuasion and conviction is a lifelong pursuit.
There is a meme going around that talks about the difference between a gentleman and a harmless man. The meme points out that being incapable of harm does NOT make someone gentle. Instead, we have to acknowledge we are capable of violence yet be willing to restrain that violence to be considered a true "gentleman".
Exactly, a mouse is not gentle, because it is incapable of great violence. A grizzly bear however, can be gentle, because it is capable of violence. That is how a man should be, that's the whole point of being a "gentleman".
Nick Freitas talked about that. A nice guy is a weak man. A GOOD man is gentle by choice, capable of great violence when needed, and wise enough to know when that is.
Not always. Maybe a man can't defend and cause violence because he spent a lifetime against violence. Looking at what the New Testament says about violence goes very much against our just war and other narratives. I know that is controversial, but most of us will make the Word say whatever we want to prove our point.
@@crystalbuck6525that's a good one for a poster
@crystalbuck6525 And that's one of the best explanations of it. "Capable of great violence when needed..." And sometimes it's needed.
Reminds me of John's interview with that guy in TX a few years ago, who, when he heard gunfire in a church across the street, grabbed his rifle, headed across that street into the churchyard, encountered that mass shooter leaving and shot him.
What was doubly tragic about that whole incident was that there were no armed sheepdogs in that congregation to protect the flock.
All the men, no, strike that, biological males(but not actual men)there were a bunch of nice guys. It took an actual real man to put down the evil evildoer.
"It is better to be a Warrior in a Garden, than a Gardener in a War" - Miyamoto Musashi
"Fuck your garden bob, SAKI SAKIIII"
- The Last Samurai
@@FkUToob1776lol
You can be both. A good prepper should be.
Last time I checked, the farmers fuck shit up in war
@@justintyme4690 control the food control the army!
"You are not upset with me, but you are blaming me"
A truly fantastic way to articulate the idea of being offended. ❤
You're spot on John. I'm a recovering nice guy and recognize many of these traits in myself. You, John Cooper, and Doug Wilson have been helpful in getting me to start becoming a courageous man.
Joko willink navy seal is very inspirational great leadership abilities
You're not the only one. Many of us are recovering nice guys. Raised up being told to repress the "evil" masculine that we were created and born with.
Yeah, I had this exact realization about myself. As a young man raised with two older, liberal sisters- it took me through my military career about half way, until I realized that sometimes you have to be hard in social situations.
Are those so called nice guys narcissist guys?
@@froglord1559 I think most of us were just people that over valued politeness at the cost of other virtues.
So...what your saying is that most politicians are NICE GUYS. 😂👍
I knew Zach was a warriorpoet subscriber
absolutley! have tou ever heard congressional debates? they akways refer to each other as 'my friend congressman so- and so' regardless of how much they can't stand each other.
Bing bong Bing bong
I was just thinking Democrats. Occasionally a Republican here and there.😅
no...theyre far worse. theyre the wolves kn sheeps clothing. they are an entirely different entity. many of them are genuine psychopaths.
1st husband, not proud of this but spot on. When I left him everyone said “he’s such a nice guy” so often that today it still sets my teeth on edge. Every statement you made is so true, even 25 years later, it helped hearing this
You hit the bullseye with that first one. Immediately made me think of John 12:43 - For they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.
Amen.
Uh. no
I listened to this video on my way to work. Immediately, after work I went home and had my daughter listen to it. Thank you for that.
@@briansmith4726 you had to make sure she heard the part about women being "built" to follow men, eh? That is neither kind nor respectful and undermines the rest of the decent points.
It's incredible how scared people are of taking responsibility for their own actions. So many in my life I've stood up and said I was wrong, I messed up, and it's been met with nothing but appreciation for being honest. There might be disappointment with the mistake and the consequences, but being trustworthy and accountable is far more appreciated.
Are those so called nice guys narcissist guys?
@@nathankleber9150 I agree it’s uncommon to see folks willing to admit their mistakes. We normal folks don’t like to be wrong but will admit our mistakes so we can fix our mistakes. When we are willing to move on and fix our problems we can live good lives. The alternative is to be one of the millions of folks living life with anger and frustration. You spend to much time unhappy in the alternative life choices. Bravo sir perfect observation.
I started at a new plumbing company a few years back, and in my first week, I made a huge rookie mistake and flooded someone's kitchen, costing 10s of thousands to repair. The next day, a buddy asked hey we're you at this job yesterday?" I immediately knew what had happened. So I went to the bosses office and before they said anything I apologized, and explained what happened and said it was completely my fault and was a stupid mistake for someone with my experience to make. He just said, "Thanks, go make it right" it cost the company thousands of dollars for water mitigation and reconstruction. He told me a year or so later that if I had said anything else, he would have fired me. They have been the best people I have ever worked for, and I truly appreciate all they have done for me.
Truth. This is a problem with many "Evangelicals," who bow their knee to political correctness.
Yes, that's a shame! I believe it's an evil spiritual mess that is taking over. We as believers need to really know The Word of God, follow as best we can and pray to stay on His path.
Where God in the Bible says to do something, do it. Where He says not to do something, don't do it! He and His Word is the same " yesterday, today, and forever" !!!
Truth
The one commandment that CANNOT be broken is the 11th: Thou shalt be NICE!
No surprise there. They are Oxymoronic, at their "root".
They try to make Jesus a big sandal wearing hippie and effeminate. It comes from the hippie movement and is idolatry.
I’m not triggered by this, so much as I am convicted by it.
Definitely at least a couple of things here that I identify with.
This is a good one. God bless bro.
100% Agree.
Tangentially, a lot of guys think they are protectors simply b/c their hobby happens to be firearms / training. A lot of men in this community, myself included at times, have prioritized a fantasized battle that we may never face (such as a home invasion / bugout / etc.) over REAL fights that we ignore every day (fighting chores with our wives, fighting our own sin and selfishness, praying for our families, etc.). I think a lot of guys think they are on the right path because they are monsters on the range when in fact they are passive when it comes to what really counts.
Respect
Brother - I'll leave the fantasy fights for the younger men. Way too much snap-crackle-pop when this old Vet body moves! I believe fantasizing a situation is bad, Thinking thought those situations from a TTP perspective, and following through with training is not a bad idea. But for sure - guys. Take out the garbage. Respect and honor your wife and train your child/children in the way that they should go - TRAIN not tell. Lead by example. It's really not an option in a certain perspective. You (Dad's) will lead by example whether you want to or not. It's either good and righteous leadership or crappy dad leadership. Follow the #1 man - Jesus. Be His disciple.
Appreciate the comment I can sense your passion in those statements.
A man of virtue and honor is kind. But speaks out about things important to him - including if unkindness is required. He stands up for what he thinks is worth protecting.
@@chopperking1967 you just described being woke, but isn't that a mortal sin in these parts?
I see “nice” as being what “kind” looks like. Kindness comes from love. Nice is just the shell.
That's good!
sort of like when people are being fake where they smile at you and act all friendly and talk to you with their teeth clenched at the same time & whenever they look away from you theyre scowling then when they look back at you they smile again? Edit: cartoon example: Hazbin Hotel episode 4 when Valentino would look angrily at Angel but is smiling being nice, friendly, & polite to Charlie talking through his teeth. th-cam.com/video/5H2OzIQEez0/w-d-xo.htmlsi=PZpnr9ZfodLdOKWR
i view kindness as an action... i view niceness as simply a sentiment...
Precisely!
I think the word "nice" has been so overused, that it has become meaningless. There is nothing wrong with being agreeable, amicable, polite, respectful, humble, kind, peaceful, thoughtful, etc. Not everyone has to be a leader. There is nothing wrong with serving others. Christ taught us that the greatest among us is the one who will be a servant.
Don't mistake my kindness for weakness. That's my method of my mayhem retired US Navy veteran. Great show, never miss them
This may be the first time a retired Marine gives a Sailor an atta-boy. Please make my day even better and tell me you are enlisted rank.
Copy that. Kindness is strength! Showing kindness can often be born out of ones own experience of hardship etc.
Amen. I will often appear to be a nice guy and conformist. Think of it like a grey man tactic. Be invisible, look non threatening. The whole time you are measuring people and the environment. Someone once told me in a crowd, look past the extroverts, tattoos and loudmouths. Beware the guy in the quiet, smiling guy in the corner, who looks weak and easy. Very often he's the most dangerous one in the room.
@@craighaller4002 In my experience they often also have tits, and split tails.
@@craighaller4002 I attempt to be the grey man, but I'm 6'2"/225. I've even gone so far as driving a boring old-man car with no distinguishing markings.
Grandad said be strong enough to be gentle. You can't just cultivate strength or exercise tenderness alone. You lose sight of things like your boundaries and might not tell someone the hard truth because it will hurt a lot.
This is one of the major points of the Fountainhead. I would recommend anyone read it to see these character traits dramatized in a beautifully crafted narrative
Holy crap!!! I work with a guy EXACTLY like this. You hit every nail on the head! This guy's left his religion, got left by his wife, his teenage daughters don't listen to him and actively avoid him at times, he believes in a socialist paradise, he runs from conflict, he's turned on people, he's a yes-man, etc. I'm in my car right now, laughing so hard that I can barely breathe! I'm already picking co-workers to send this to!
My son has me listening to your books and listening to your podcast now
Sounds like you raised a good kid… congrats
Smart boy
Your son may make a man out of you yet! 😂
@@code_red7744 he is an ex-Marine and I’m so proud of him
@@StinkyGringo Is that all you do is go from comment to comment gas lighting? Only thing worse than a nice guy, is a douche who likes to leave keyboard warrior messages all over peoples comments of a video, knowing good and well they wouldnt say it to their face. Run along and comment on the next one. I think id rather be a nice guy than a keyboard warrior.
Thanks, John. We need more men with a microphone saying this.
I feel like I’m listening to a sermon here! I’ve had to stand up for truth, seemingly alone, for years. I believe in being kind but not withholding the truth from others, even if it hurts them. This road has been difficult. I’ve chased women away, friends away, and probably had tons of other people trash talk me behind my back.
I still find myself asking, “Am I in any part this guy John is talking about?!” I grew up in the south so I believe in being kind. People have said “You’re too nice.” I also have NO problem with being a dangerous man. I learned some martial arts when I was younger and learned how to handle myself better in a fight. But I’ve never gone looking for one.
Another problem I see too often in the south is fake niceness too.
Nevertheless, we men all need to look in the mirror and root out that weakness, including myself if I’m getting complacent!
Great video! I think people are confused about what niceness vs. true kindness is. I’ve been called all sorts of names, nice being one of them. The real question is, is there an agenda tied to being nice? If you’re being nice to someone in that moment because you believe it’s the right thing to do, you’re being kind.
This type of reality is why i keep tunning in to your videos. Truth is a hard pill to swallow for some folks.
This is somewhat true. Sometimes one can often appear to be a nice guy and conformist. Be invisible, look non threatening. The whole time measuring people and the environment. Someone once told me in a crowd, look past the extroverts, tattoos and loudmouths. Beware the quiet guy, smiling guy in the corner, who looks weak and easy. Very often he's the most dangerous one in the room if he's cornered and got nothing to lose.
The most dangerous person in the room is the one with the ability and _motivation_ . That skinny young man with glasses who got bullied when he was a kid, that old man with a cane and a wife, the person in a wheelchair.... yeah, they are potentially well armed, able, and motivated.
That's totally NOT the guy John is talking about here. You missed the point, brother.
It's not an extrovert/introvert thing. John has made a few video's about 'the most dangerous guy in the room' that your post could actually be an intro for.
In my opinion, in the current system we live there is no other way for most of us to live than to pretend that we are weaker then we truly are.
@@cristianandrei5462 is that why all the giga-Chads strut around loudly pretending they're stronger than they actually are?
Be nice. Be nice until it is time to not be nice.
Nice Roadhouse quote!
Dalton: If somebody gets in your face and calls you a cocksucker, I want you to be nice. Ask him to walk. Be nice. If he won't walk, walk him. But be nice. If you can't walk him, one of the others will help you, and you'll both be nice. I want you to remember that it's a job. It's nothing personal.
Steve: Being called a cocksucker isn't personal?
Dalton: No. It's two nouns combined to elicit a prescribed response.
Steve: What if somebody calls my mama a whore?
Dalton: Is she?
Never be nice, be respectful unless someone gives you a reason not to be.
@@Vincent_BoogalooI like being humble. It's the quiet man that people should look out for.
Hehe Swaze gets a pass
This is what every man needs to hear.
I have been wondering why I feel bad about failure to act, because I mis understood what being a “good man” actually is.
To sum up this video I would say this is what the phrase “nice guys finish last,” means. Thank you and God bless. Your children are lucky to have you as a father who puts The Father before himself.
You can be a "good guy" and nice....just dont be a "nice guy"... Agree with you 100% John. Establish boundaries...is a good place to start the change
Former nice guy here. John youbare hitting the nail on the head. I can tell you from experience that you can change for the better. It is difficult, but it means a lot of self-reflection is needed and drop your friggin ego. Nice guys are toxic. I used to be very toxic and didn't even know it. I still have some issues I am working on, but things are getting better. Do better, and your life will get better
I'm trying to be a better and stronger person every day. Watching your channel is part of that journey. Thank you.
This hurt. I am too soft. I have some work to do. Thank you John.
As wife and mother of 4 boys, this is refreshing!
My friend started a men’s group called Rise Undaunted which specifically addresses Nice Guy Syndrome and helps guys become true masculine Men. Excellent and important message.
That’s sounds like a worthwhile group to join. Is it part of an actual study plan? I’d love to lead something like this!
I went to the website. It seems to be essentially MLM, and potentially under the LDS umbrella… tell me if I’m wrong.
@@GarrettFemister it’s not an mlm but there is an incentive for recruiting if you want to. I don’t. You don’t have to pay to participate. I don’t either.
The founder is LDS, but the group is not affiliated with any church.
Spot on. Seen the side of trying to be nice to someone who really wants to take advantage. Learned to be friendly but aggressive. Been through some battles not as nice until I know people better
My mother raised me to be a kind person. Being “nice” tends to be for shallow gain. Not everyone deserves kindness and that’s what every man needs to learn.
Some solid useful and generally correct insights John! I had to go back and re-listed while taking some notes when a thought occurred to me halfway through point #3.
1) Say Hard Things
2) Lead/Take Risks
3) Take Responsibility
4) Protect
5) Keep the Faith
These are equally the failings of toxic women.
Solid points all the way through, and I think you're right we all at least occasionally fail to do these things at some level and it's a good list to consider when planning out our paths to self improvement. Work Hard, Pray Hard, Play Hard.
The term "nice guy" may throw some folks off track, Ann Gunther said it well, "I see "nice" as being what "kind" looks like, Kindness comes from love" I would say "kindness" comes from strength as well. And she is correct, "nice is just a shell". You are spot on with this, can't argue a single point you've made.
"Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions."
- G.K. Chesterton
"Tolerance is the final virtue of a morally depraved society"
Man that’s the truth. I believed in tolerance so strongly for a while. And then I figured out it’s just another way, 99% of the time, for someone to say they don’t care without having to admit they don’t care.
The 1% of the time it’s sincere, I even more so admire it. But I notice that 1% of the tolerant people who genuinely are tolerant, it’s people who also don’t hesitate to admit to themselves and others when they don’t care. And people notice them for the not caring, and never recognize that they are being tolerant when they are. People love hypocrisy except when other people do it.
I’m quite intolerant. Sorry for hogging up all of the conviction 😂
Yep. Though he had theological issues, Chesterton had excellent insights.
@@RickyJr46 bullshit. Having conviction is not an excuse for being intolerant. More often it's an excuse to be a lazy, stubborn asshole who wants to impose their "faith" on other people.
Correct. I used to be like this and had to force my self to change. Now I see my brother going down this path and the people he associates with use him because of it, so he is basically a doormat for everyone. We are trying to get him out of it
The origin of "nice" is "nescio." It's Latin for "I don't know." The idea is that a "nice" guy will flip flop on every issue they're confronted with, have no firm opinion of their own, and will therefore ride the fence in every circumstance to the point where they can't stand up for anything, even the things that matter. Speaks pretty well to what John's saying.
Revelation 3: 16
So, because you are lukewarm-neither hot nor cold-I am about to spit you out of my mouth.
I think you clarified my internal frustration with organized religion, with your remark on “your church is dead if it’s filled with nice guys”. I have felt like I was in the wrong crowd many times based on the way people behaved to the needs of the community vs the role of the church. This isn’t to say that representation is true of all organized religion, but unfortunately, represents many of the churches people attend. God is not for us to follow as sheep and cowards. The right thing to do, may in fact, be something your church won’t support. In those times it’s better to follow god than the church.
I would encourage you to still find a church full of good men to go through life with, rather than rejecting the church. No man is an island. I’m in a church with the opposite of nice guys, and that collective is doing things that are making massive impacts in our city.
I know what you are talking about. I struggle with it too. I'm a Mormon, and I think the nice guy syndrome is plaguing our church. People generally consider Mormons conservative/traditional, but I believe all the nice guys are creating confusion about our message and what we stand for. A lot of people don't really know what Mormons stand for anymore. That used to not be the case. Even though people hated us for our beliefs, at least we made them clear and stood by them. The criticism made us better Mormons. Those days are a memory. But, instead of giving up, I'm one of the holdouts that believes in the Warrior Poet way. I don't play nice guy. Sometimes people gasp at what I say. But, they like my sincerity. I don't think I make a big difference, but I do think I make a small difference with the small circle of influence I have. If nothing else, I hope to pass it along to my sons, and that my daughters will value the Warrior Poet way in men. Half of my kids are teenagers and it seems like they are learning the ways of their old man, and rejecting the nice guy syndrome. I basically associate myself more with my Warrior Poet mentality than I do with my particular "brand of church" at this point. I agree with your statement that it's better to obey God instead of the church. I have done that many times over the past few years, and so far, God has always backed me up. I encourage you to do it where you can.
@@mnt809
My favorite complement I have received in the past five years is being told I am authentic. In that one word, I felt proud and emboldened to continue presenting myself as a man, unafraid. I appreciate your comment and your authenticity to stand for the right things over the crowd. Regardless of what name your faith carries, people need others to represent the strength and compassion of a higher purpose. Stand tall and lend an insightful ear to all that need guidance. Good men, like yourself, will save us from tyrants lurking in our communities.
@@connormcalister5765
You are not wrong. It be of the most common things I hear these days is that men have no friends. Good organizations are a great way to combat that theory. They also provide a place for important messages to be heard.
I was told recently, that I am an authentic soul. It’s my favorite complement I have received because it not only empowered me to stand tall in my convictions, but it also gave room for me to be received by the community around me on a true level. I am happy you have found a fellowship that aligns with your authenticity. Stand tall in your community and lend solid guidance to “right and wrong” wherever you see fit.
As for me , I will continue without a church until I am drawn in by authentic people. People that understand that compassion is the second biggest strength/burden we must carry in order to secure the role of leaders in our community. I hope you continue to be authentic to yourself and provide that strong outward guidance to your fellowship and community at large. Our world needs it in every way.
You clearly have not read the Bible. We’re gods sheep. We are followers of god. From there we can lead others to following god.
My late husband wanted our kids to like him so he left the discipline up to me. The kids loved him but I was being sabotaged. He was also a coward in many other ways. Even though he suffered with cancer for over 5 years, he would not talk about death due to fear. I was left with little information and guidance but I was relieved when he finally died.
I'm sure he would be thrilled to hear your talk about him like that in the comment section of TH-cam, of all places. Did you ever say anything to him about it? Maybe you're the coward.
I love the call to action and encouragement to do something about it at the end - better yourself, better the community, better the next generation. Keep Fighting the Good Fight
@@danasmith9942 Except don't better women, right? They need to walk six steps behind with their feet bound. /s
Thanks John. I have been guilty of being a “nice guy” but thanks to people like you I am trying to improve myself.
Seriously badazz move...
I luv it...
Inspiring, insightful, motivating...
Good f*kin job...
Well articulated, informed, and stated the case clearly and professionally...
I look forward to more of your posts...
"You should be an absolute monster, and then learn how to have it under complete self control"
~Jordan Peterson
Most people don't though. They are almost all either weak or condescending as hell. Balance is very difficult and most fail at it.
Life requires work. I sometimes struggle with my anger. Are you completely balanced?
jp is a clown
@@GreatWhite7 even if that was the case in general, the principle conveyed here is still valid. A formidable force for good is only going to come from someone who also possesses a formidable potential for evil. Weak individuals arent capable of much either way.
Truth.
What a great message! This could easily be turned into a sermon. I would say that a good leader can be kind, but can never be nice and be an effective leader.
"blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth"
-Jesus Christ
That's actual biblical truth. Not this.
I am blessed to be part of a church filled with the exact opposite of “Nice Guy” as you define here, and you will find some of the most kind and gentle husbands, fathers, and protectors you will ever meet.
Everything you said is true I have seen it so many times in my 76 years.
A favorite patch I keep on my kit..." Dont mistake my kindness for weakness".
Love it!
Another way to say this is “weak passivity”
@@Benaiah2279 We call them "Cucks".
Everyone's an outlaw till it's time to do outlaw $hit- Bryan Martin
We in the UK have just elected a nice guy. He has changed his position on nearly everything when faced with any push back.
My heart hurts for what has happened to your country.
@@Station737 well, maybe they shouldn't have gone full racist by voting to leave the EU. Would have saved them a lot of trouble and even more money. But hey, you should stick to your "moral" guns and tell people how you really feel, right?
Excellent take. I grew up as a nice guy. Just over 40 years ago, at the young age of 23, I went to Marine Corps boot camp. Life has never been the same since. Nice guys are weak men.
Weak men create hard times.
Hard times create strong men.
Strong men create good times.
Good times create weak men.
Guess where in the cycle we are!
I'm 23 years old now. Enlisted in the Army and intend to become a Ranger. Respect to you sir.
@FreeBirdVince never give up on yourself, on your team, and you'll do well.
Quite the adventure you're embarking on, your service will be appreciated, thank you for taking the oath.
Hey, don't drink too much off duty, a LOT of problems stem from just that one seemingly little act. I mean yeah drink, get wasted sometimes, just don't make it your go-to.
Stay true to yourself, once you find him in the hardest days.
Keep your head down in boot camp, do what you're told, do it fast but do it as well as you can.
@@Mr_Contract________x thank you. I will keep this all in mind. 🙏
Amen sir. All points dead-on. I actually have a "Not Nice" tattoo, and for exactly the reasons you describe. I don't share my personal reasons for any of my ink; in this case you've done so vicariously and correctly. Much love, appreciation and respect.
I'm ashamed to say this, but at nearly 30 years old, I've had to learn the hard way, and there is a difference between niceness and kindness. Kindness still contains humility, compassion, love, understanding, patience, and tenderness, but niceness is essentially naivety. If one is nice, they are willing to be naive in order to evade confrontation, but when you are kind, when dealing with confrontation, you take the high road, you keep a cool head, as long as it doesn't get physical, then yeah, take up self defense, but you discuss, not argue. Arguing determines who is right, that is, ego, but discussing determines WHAT is right, that is true knowledge and wisdom. That's what the kind guy does. Also, I've had to learn this, and I have a quote for this as well, just because the word ass is in assertive, that doesn't mean you have to be one, so in short, the kind guy is assertive but at the same time humble and patient about it, he's not a jerk. Also, pardon my language with my quote, but I am just being honest.
100% accurate… and the women whom go for the “nice guy” are narcissistic, they can manipulate the “nice guy” as they both use each other to pursue their own excessive self-interest.
How does a nice guy have self-interest?
@@WendyOryen It’s important to not conflate polite with nice…
To speak honest truth one must be willing to offend, many folks don’t face the truth, truth hurts those whom live a lie or unwilling to face issues they’re not mature enough to deal with…
The nice guy wants to be seen as virtuous so will constantly seek to maintain such an appearance for his own sake, withholding truth for his self-interest rather being honest even if the other isn’t receptive to the facts. Even though immature people don’t always want the truth, speaking the truth is what allows for growth to overcome. To withhold truth to be seen as a “nice” guy is often times self serving.
This is compounded when a nice guy uses it to manipulate women, often they don’t really care about being polite or virtuous as a decent human, it’s a tactic used to get the unsuspecting women into bed so they can bust a nut… they’ll be nice all day long if they gonna get something out of it. The guy not trying to manipulate for sex by constantly being the nice guy has greater capability of honest truth as they don’t have that ulterior motive, the honest truth actually benefits the other person not themselves or how they can manipulate you by playing the nice guy.
@@WendyOryen People using the nice guy approach can often be doing it as a form of manipulation, giving the impression or appearance of being virtuous or of upstanding character.
Yep! A warrior poet is not a nice guy! You are right on!
Don’t be afraid to tell anyone NO and walk away.
I read The Warrior Poet Way...great book with lots of manly advice. Unfortunately, I know many nice guys. Your video is spot on...
I moved from Denver to central TX. Damn what a change. I'm a woman but learning to be Nicer
Very convicting, thanks for not being the "nice guy" and saying the hard truth.
John, you’re such a class act man. Way to walk what you preach. You gave some unpopular truths, stood your ground on saying it and why you’re saying it, and then even give a call to action and a pathway for betterment for those who are perhaps “programmed” to be a nice guy.
Uncomfortable truth->stand for your beliefs as opposed to chasing being liked->demonstrated actual kindness by trying to help lift up others
John is certified not a nice guy (possibly a real jerk, need to meet in person to verify!)
We all should listen to things that are hard to listen to. If all we ever hear is the things we want to hear, we never feel like we have to grow as a person. Thank you for the Hard Listen.
"Dangerous good guys and Dangerous bad guys". Love it!
@2:59 Yes. It means that Nice Guys are people pleaser. They tell things that would garner positive attention towards him, and is careful in saying the right things so as not to offend. There's no assertion in language and speech
Most people pleasers had abusive parents. Like narcissistic abuse etc. Thank God we're all here talking about how pathetic people with mental illness are. It's like a dog that has been abused. It doesn't tuck it's tail just because it's choosing to be weak, it does so from horrible experiences you never went through and don't fully understand.
I love this. You are right on point about all of this. My husband is NOT a nice guy (as described in this video). I have 2 sons and we have raised them not to be “nice”
Quite literally describing “The Try Guys” and Rhett and Link lol
Ever seen that video where The Try Guys get their testosterone levels checked?
Those beta's make me sick
Damn, what wrong did rhett and link do
@@BigZ971well for one thing they denounced their faith did they not?
@@matthewr209 I have no clue. That's why I'm asking you
Kindness is a virtue, niceness is usually a tactic.
Do your best to love people more than you like them. Like is only interested in reciprocity, love is interested in well being.
Mr. L. Each one of your points is well thoughout sir. Your psychological analysis in my view is spot on. You would make a common sense therapist. Thank you.
Being kind is not the same as being nice. Kindness is to niceness as meekness is to weakness.
Wow. I always thought I was a nice guy. Until this. Yeah. I don’t fit into that category as you describe. Challenge brings adversity. And adversity brings experience and knowledge. Which makes a good leader for others to follow. 100 percent onboard with your perspective on this.
I am not a guy, but watch and support the cause. Yep, kindness is a Fruit of the Spirit, niceness is not. Is the word nice even in the bible?
This is in the Bible:
Romans 2:1: “You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.” (NIV)
@@StinkyGringo Sounds like St. Paul was speaking to a bunch of scum-sucking democraps.
Sin is sin. You sin every day.
@@StinkyGringo get me that verse in the KJV or ESV and then we'll talk.
using the N.on I.nspired V.ersion is just peek coward behavior.
The older I get, the more I value honesty and a genuine demeanor rather than being "nice" and politically correct. I respect people that are loyal to their values and not concerned about being nice and popular. John, thank you for an insightful video
In my experience, as a retired Green Beret….. Nice guys when they get in trouble, they do disastrous things. Meaning, they don’t know how bad things can get for them because they have never been in trouble. So when they fall, they fall hard and don’t know when to stop themselves. Men that have failed before, and been through some tough times can recognize when he should stop, he knows how bad it can get.
Never confuse kindness for weakness.
So true, there is only a line crossed. That is where the Lion comes out, and all bets are off. I bite my tongue only when applicable, otherwise I have no filter 😊
The saying is “never confuse MY kindness for weakness””. If someone just went around judging kindness as weakness they would be right a lot of the time.
The reverse is also true: never confuse weakness for kindness.
@@boyscout6566 That’s an interesting perspective. Seems like it could be useful in a totally different way
Quoting Al Capone...
Whoa glad you covered that last past. My wife and I talk about that a lot. About how we have plenty of “nice” guys in the church today. We can look at our current times as a blessing in that because it’s getting harder regarding the attacks against faith. A lot of the chaff is being separated from the wheat.
I'm generally a nice guy, but not that kind of "nice guy", but I know exactly the type you speak of.
I place being nice well down the list of importance, and that niceness can evaporate extremely quickly when someone mistakes it for weakness, and tries to take advantage of it.
I care very little what most people think of me, and as a result I'm able to admit my flaws and mistakes, and I'm also capable of being extremely blunt when needed.
I've no time to entertain bullshit from anyone.
On second thought maybe I'm not nice, so much as genuine and potentially friendly.
In my experience most of the "nice" folks don't like when people are actually genuine and masculine.
But plenty of time to brag about it in the TH-cam comments? What a strong, modest, REAL man you are!
This hits home. I don't like conflict, but I've always addressed the really important conflict, especially when it comes to the defense of others. But, I desperately want to get more self confident- it's something that I pray for often. I've had moments since I've been married where I DID act when the situation called for it - and I'm thankful that I had the courage to act then. I just want the courage to say the truth in a loving way before it gets to a situation where you HAVE to act. I don't want to turn every opportunity into a hill to die on, but I definitely don't want to self censor either. Please pray for my courage.
I heard something years ago and it always stuck with me. A friend will tell you what you want to here. But a real friend/best friend will tell you what you need to hear. I was taught as a child. You can be nice and still stand on what you believe. Be kind to everyone be respectful to everyone. But never compromise your honor and dignity. Just because someone don't like it. I also agree with difference of a "Nice Guy". Nice guy who wants to be nice because their afraid to offend someone. So they comply to get everyone to like them. And the Nice Guy who is kind and gentle but has the ability for violence. Not to be a bully or over bearing. But to protect those they love and cherish.
Always, always, give a second glance to Mr Happy Glad Hands.
Honestly, not everyone is cut out to be a leader.
There is a good distinction here between being a "nice guy" and being polite, being kind or being meek and humble. Those are not always the same and I think that distinction is important.
I tend to just give people the benefit of the doubt because we as people have our problems too, so I try not to give people a hurt time. Not sure why this behavior of mine falls into this category because it's just me minding my own business, saying less and no more. If you somehow mistake this as weakness, the moment you abuse this courtesy, I will not hesitate to withdraw this treatment.
well spoken, dealing with crap at work and this sums it up.
Thank you for being honest and straightforward on this subject more people need to hear this, God bless America!
On a serious note, My mother, the greatest person to ever walk this earth, raised me to be a pacifist. She would get very angry with me if I got in a fight as a kid. She said any problem can be worked out with communication. For the most part, she is correct. I have never been in a fight that was worth the fight not that I have been in that many. That being said, she was very proud of me when I enlisted in the Army. While she did not like me fighting, she liked me defending. She is who taught me the difference.
Well said.
You don't always have to fight to stand your ground. But, you should stand your ground. Which sometimes leads to defending what you stand for!
There’s absolutely nothing wrong with being in a fight if you’re defending yourself and your beliefs. Or just be a punching bag, your choice.
I see what you are saying, and thank you for your service, BTW (*I am also a US Army veteran) ;but if she was okay with you "defending" (*physically, that is, which occasionally requires violence to do so) then she is not a complete pacifist; complete pacifists believe (*or claim to believe) that literally every single form of violence towards/against another human being, in all situations, is unjustified.
I was raised in a similar fashion. Only my parent's admonition was that I was never to start a fight, but I'd better be ready to end it. So I never got into fights, walked away from several of them. Got labeled a coward, particularly since I wasn't allowed to play football either, took a long time to prove otherwise, elementary and Jr. Hi were not fun times.
Finally! I am so glad to hear someone other than myself admit that the “nice guy” is a self-centered coward. Thank you for your voice
That isnt something my mind usually goes to. But it really makes sense. I agree with this statement!
Example of a 'nice guy' in politics: a RINO.
In my experience, a nice guy is actually prone to saying sorry because he will commit emotional hijacking as a way of disguising his cowardice. "I'm sorry, I was wrong on this small issue, and because I'm so humble and willing to admit my flaws, it would be cruel to correct me on bigger issues".
Nice guys gas light because no one can truly avoid conflict in life, so they choose that path instead of direct conflict.
Great read here. I’ve seen this
John, you hit the nail on the head with each point you made.
I had this same conversation yesterday: I have many family members who prioritize the biblical notion of being peacekeepers above standing firm on moral principles and clearly telling others what is right/wrong.
Be nice until it's time to not be nice- Patrick Swayze
Gotta disagree. I know some nice guys who will throw down at moments notice , but they are always considerate of others feelings.
"Throwing down", and "always considerate of others feelings" seems to be a juxtaposition. The individual being "thrown down" upon may feel his feelings have not been held with consideration. Perhaps the "nice guys" have a veneer that is easily removed when necessary. A veneer that covers a not nice guy.
@@getyourgnarlon idk , but these guys I know are like super liberal and always talk about their feelings and you'd pretty much think they are a group of women the way they talk. But they do have some principals that they stand for and will fight for. And I mean I sure as hell wouldn't want to fight them.
@@WiIdbiII Someone in the comments pointed to the difference between being nice and being kind. Kindness is a positive trait based on human compassion, while niceness is most often a cloak of concealment that is used as a tool to gain favor or advancement best exemplified by the politician. At the end of the day I would say it is very important that we all learn to distinguish the difference.
Goodness John this is a whole sermon.
The last point about nice guys is something that hits home for me. I see this in my church so much. The people there try to walk a tightrope of being acceptable socially without outright compromising biblical principle, but push come to shove they just collapse.
We need so many strong me. Men who dont bend and compromise but who hold fast under pressure. Sadly they seem rare. Im really tempted to send this to my pastor as a challenge.
We certainly do need to use these traits as a guide when selecting which pastor we choose to follow. If our current pastor doesn't have the traits of a true leader, then we need to find ways to grow his character. Sadly many will refuse to grow due to their own insecurities, in which case, we need to move on.
It is powerful to be kind and charismatic with others, while never revealing your hand.
Silent speaks. Volume. As a warrior society they don't fight because they can they fight for those who can't fight for themselves
My life turned around when I stopped being nice
So you're an asshole?😂