I made this kind of system in my van, but by my own way. I didn't use any ready supplies. Now I have 80 litres (21 gallons) of hot water in 20 minutes of driving. 😁
Howdy, Do you maybe have a video of the setup, or parts list and a diagram? Many thanks in advance for your time and assistance, it's much appreciated. C.I.M.
This is how most cruising boats make hot water. Works great and the water will stay hot for a day. Most marine water heaters are stainless and include an internal engine coolant heat exchanger plus a 120V electric heater as well. My boat makes water very hot and it lasts into the next day easy.
That solves the problems of getting the truck stranded losing its engine coolant from those lines getting cut by a rock or something on the road, and solves the problems of those lines freezing during the winter since it is also antifreeze coolant. I didn't see or hear if you shown or talked about the tank freezing when not in use during the winter. But i am sure all you would need to have is a drain valve for the fresh water in the tank at its lowest point, and just drain it when you know you will be storing the truck in the freezing weather.
What a work of art! Never would I be able to design this myself. Simply amazing that your knowledge reservoir is so large. I will absorb this slowly, like a good novel. Looking at the aluminum, high tech systems, birch plywood just gives me the thrills. I savor these videos like a fine wine - smell, sip, taste, swirl, absorb, repeat. What a gift you are to the planet. Looking good with that hair and beard trim. And more relaxed somehow. Glad to see you in the pink of health.
An ideal to install it on or in the roof with a transparent dome cover over it, to allow sunlight to hit it, paint it flat black. This way it gives more energy options and more energy period. During your camp stop you not only have the option to use solar panels and batteries with the 750watt element to heat the water, you have the sunlight hitting it during the sunny days. And at most you will benefit by not having to use so much battery power to keep hot water, and have more energy for other things. You could also install tees on the input and outputs of the reservoir and add another heat transfer loop using a small solar water heating coil(under a transparent flat panel), giving even more energy into the system during sunny days.
I’m always blown away with your professionalism, love for building vans the right way, and, just your total knowledge in general! Thanks for sharing all you do with all of us, George! ❤️👍😎. ~Jim~
Spring clamps are typically better than worm-drive clamps for automotive and similar applications where heating and cooling is taking place, such as on the tank barbs. They will expand and contract keeping a constant water-tight pressure on the tubing, but they must be sized correctly. Worm drive clamps such as in the video can apply too much pressure upon the hose when the tank and hose is heated and over time, this can cause leaks. If you need worm-drive clamps for an application, I suggest the Norma brand because they will hold much tighter than other worm drive clamps. Cheers!
You make some of the most well explained and safest/smartest solutions for Van lifers like me. Thank you for your videos. You are super knowledgeable and it shows in your work. I just purchased my 2022 Promaster 2500 136WB yesterday and I’m coming to you for my conversion needs. Talk to you soon hopefully. 🙏🏽
I think this is brilliant and it solves quite a worry I've been having about the idea of a heat exchanger set-up where the engine coolant is heat-exchanging with the hot water system. The problem with having a "direct" exchanger is that you generate hot water whenever you drive. And don't have an option to stop heating - at least not without complex diverter valves. I think with your system, can you not run the pump via a thermostat in your hot water tank - so when it reaches e.g. 120, your intermediate glycol loop pump switches off?
Great video! Sir George, just wanted to give a heads up. That those worm gear clamps connected to the heat exchanger will eventually leak glyco, especially in the engine bay. Due to the hose experiencing cold/hot temps. It is much better to use spring clamps that can deal with that expanding and contracting of hoses. Hence why all car manufacturers, will never use worm gear clamps in the engine bay
Been looking for hours to find a proper video for explaining the heating system for hot water / floor heating in the van, I thought about using the auto term combo boil and connect ut to the coolant system of the car I see here I should use a exchanger
Hello, my friend Haven't commented in a while. Last year was rough on everybody, I like the new format good information 1 set-up with the lights. More time to build vans. Also so glad you got the new space. I knew how much you wanted it before. Take care talk to you later,😀
Your level of detail and expertise in so many aspects of van building is second to none. I think the water heater resides in the second to none area - however great it is to have a hot shower. When I travel I generally am chasing T-shirt weather and would not want an extra heat sink inside the van, as I typically have the fans running and doors wide open to get rid of accumulated heat just from outside temperature inputs. I am usually successful in ridding all of the heat - when I don't - I don't sleep as well. (& we all know that lack of sleep is the new smoking!!!) I use a more mobile solution to get a hot shower (much less convenient though)
I am always chronically cold, freezing. I never camped in my life because no matter how hot it is outside, I need a heater or heated mattress pad. This system would be a life saver for me
@@natureloversadventures7335 I tried a heated mattress pad for the first time last winter. I do have a furnace/heater in the van but I use the heated mattress pad more often to take the chill off before going to sleep.. (use the furnace in the morning to take the chill off in van) That system works for me. So I would recommend a mattress pad.
Great system, very interesting. Instead of adding and removing insulation around the pipes, it would help to regulate the pump. In summer it should run slower, so the glycol has more time to cool down before it runs into the heater. (Maybe a two level-switch for summer/winter is sufficient.) Btw: I'm using an electric 12V heater and run it only while I'm driving. Same effect, but only 200W and much less water than in your system.
Yes, having 2 separate glycol systems safeguards from a cut line on the 2nd one disabling your vehicle. But if all the effort you put into making that 2nd system was focused instead on protecting those lines it would be much simpler and avoid the problems that glycol reservoir is causing. If the hoses came through the wall separating the passenger side from the engine they'd be well protected. What do you think?
The hoses are not so easily routed to and through that fire wall without blocking or compromising another system under the hood. Best route is straight down and over the steering axle.
Hi George, I use isotherm slim in most of my builds. I have shut offs(electric ball valves) and no heat exchanger or Reservoir. These systems produce too much hot water if left open all the time. If it’s still too hot under my bed after both me and my wife shower, I have recirculating feature in shower valve rv that I can transfer most of the heated hot water to main tank that sits under van
@@mattadams7261 you don’t need pump, the engine water pump is always on when running. It circulates thur engine block and thur heater coil and isotherm if allowed. It works perfectly.I am now installing electric ball valves.
Hi HR, I am about to do this on my new 2023 promoter 159 Ext. I am trying to figure out where exactly you cut your hose so that you didn't need to add any hose! I am stumped! LOL. Do you have a video of how you did it, I would love to see how so that I can do it! Great video as always, thank you so much for making these videos! Dwayne - Utah
After thinking all day on this it’s as simple as wiring the pump through the thermostat on the tank already provided for the electrical heating element. Problem solved never too hot.
I’m pretty sure it opens and closes the connection without power. A gas water heater has no power to the thermostat. It just opens and closes a circuit. It’s worth looking into.
Great idea! Just watched a video by Silvercymbal regarding coolant hose clamps. Might have to agree with him that ring clamps are not meant for coolant hoses. Need to use spring clamps that apply constant clamping pressure no matter if the hose and nipple are hot or cold. The ring clamp might allow a coolant hose to leak depending on temperature.
What a well thought out system. Even the drawback of the reservoir giving off heat is only an issue a few months out of the year and insulated cover solves that. As someone who is cold far more often than I am hot, that radiant heat would actually be a benefit to me most of the time. Great explanation, George!
Hello George, many thanks for your excellent work. Your brain is always working overdrive!!! Question: where do you tap into your heat exchanger understood? Did you install a Y connector to split the heated coolant to cab heat and exchanger, or to have coolant going in series to exchanger and can heat. I know you are busy, but I hope for the best. TIA.
I don't know how many times I have watched this video to learn. I think I watched all of your episodes. Thank you so much. I wonder why you didn't install the reservoir tank in the engine bay. Was it just simply because of no space?
Excellent system. I'm curious if I could use a cheap 2.5 gallon HWH (Home Depot type) and then always have a 120v HWH available where I have shore power? In other words, heat exchanger plumbed in like yours just in to an existing HWH where it almost never runs? Can you link which heat exchanger you went with? I'm seeing lots of variance in price and I'm sure this is in line with quality.
Seems like more work for more money, parts, failure points and less efficiency. And slight peace of mind. But if done correctly, a hose getting cut doesn’t seem likely
Thanks for sharing tour knowledge. Instead of adding water to air heat exchangers in order to cool the glycol in the summertime, why not just stop the pump? It wouldn't boil the water to water glycol stationary part as the boiling point is way higher...
Hello George. Could you tell what is the size of the holes used for your system? I am in the process of doing hydraulic. Thank you very much for the content.
A counter argument for having a mixing valve at the tap vs. mixing valve at the calorifier is that the pre-mixed at the calorifier water will lose less heat in transit than the mixing at the tap variant,
In terms of physics, you are correct. However, the fact that the water is being sent to the faucet at upwards of 150 to 170°F. I wouldn’t mind losing a little more heat at that point as well!
Hi HR! I have been following your videos for years now and very much appreciate your sharing of your experience, but also your explanation-teaching of your work and process. I am in the process of buying appliances for my Transit van and wanted to ask where you picked up your hot water heating system, specifically the glycol coolant unit and if its just the unit or other parts needed for assembly? I already purchased the isotemp cylinder water heater and hoping to install the passive heating system as well. Thank you for sharing your experience and look forward to hearing from you!
The engineer in me really wants to install this in my next build. The pragmatist doesn’t want to feel like I am running an engine room on my camping trips.
@@HumbleRoad haha. Until your guest forgets that your outdoor shower can be 170 degrees 😬 I’d love to hear more about the pros and cons for someone like me who isn’t full time
Hi George, first of, love your work and the channel. Would you be willing, to please confirm I have the right part numbers for your hot water system, i.e. SKU: G55 Heat Exchanger, SKU:C11-103 2 Gal Exp Tank; SKU:P11-100 12v Pump? I live in the UK, so finding these parts here is a bit of a challenge. I was thinking of buying direct from Rixen; that's if they'll ship abroad. I managed to buy the ISOtherm tank. Thanks in advance
Great job! I notice that you did not address the vent on top of the Rixen expansion tank. What are you planning to do with that in order to manage the potential air/coolant "escapes"? Also, is there a reason you did not put the expansion tank and/or pump in the engine area?
I will vent the reservoir outside the van, but if you keep the coolant level one inch and a half down from the top of the tank, it will not boil over. In a Promaster, there is not room under the hood for the reservoir. Sprinters? yes, I put the tank on the aux battery tray, if it is not occupied.
You are an excellent illustrator! You really fully understand the heat exchanger principles to give such a clear lecture without a script. Really enjoy all your videos. Any reason not using instant tankless hot water system?
really interesting, so not sure if it's been asked already but what happens if you're stopped for more than 2 days and no shore power, in other words, how long would you have to idle your engine build up a decent amount of heat?
I mentioned in the video that this water heater also has a 120VAC heater coil immersed in the tank. Turn on the inverter and turn on the heater. 750W so it takes a little bit of time to heat up, but that's another way to make hot water with this set-up.
Hello George, by any chance you can draw a diagram how you did this? It’s the system of keeping the hot water in that water tank that throws me off. I totally understand the heat exchanging process produced by the engine glycol. It’s how to keep the hot water in the tank to be used later when you wanna take a shower or whatever. Thank you 😊
The water pump (when on) is pushing cold water into the water heater, where it is heated and sent out to the hot manifold for dispersion throughout the van.
This is genius. I am always cold and I need a constant heat during night. I live on the West Coast and nights are cold here even in the middle of summer. Can I have this system installed just to have my small van warm? I have a Ford Transit Connect. I do not care about kitchen or cooking or running water. I only want my tiny van to be warm and I do not want any noise coming from the heater like diesel or gasoline heater. This system would be perfect if I could heat my van with it. Can you do that? I grew up in Ukraine and we had water system to keep our homes warm. The hot water was pumped from a separate building structure into many 9 story residential buildings and it was cheap, we never were cold. Here in the US I do not like the heating systems as they are too noisy and I cannot have them on at night.
Enjoy your ideas and build series. I also have the Isotemp Sure Slim 4.2 G water heater and the rixen Hydronic Kit with the expansion tank minus the electrical heat element.I also have the engine coolant heat exchanger add on. My question to you is what was your reasoning for running your glycol from the extension tank to the pump then direct to the heater exchange in the engine compartment and then to the isotemp?. Also if I put the extension tank in the engine compartment with the heat exchanger where would I place the pump?
You don’t need to cool the water from the heat exchanger. That’s why you get the isotherm with a mixing valve. You connect only one hose to the expansion tank otherwise you create a radiator.
@@HumbleRoad there is no harm in running engine cooling water through the isotherm. That’s done on boats. They just have a heat exchanger to cool the coolant with sea water. The coolant with antifreeze just cycles through engine, hot water tank and the heat exchanger that gets cooled by the sea water. They use an impeller pump to cycle the sea water through that. It’s basically the same functionality as in a car just with sea water not air. It is a good thing to separate the engine loop from the van/house loop in case you ever have to work on one system only. On the van side, just tee off a line from the highest point of your antifreeze plumbing to the expansion tank. The tee should open to the top to the line that goes to the tank. Your circulation pump should be in the colder return line. Once you fill your system it will just fill with water and the air will go out. Let the pump run and you will see how the air comes out of the system. The expansion tank must be the highest point in your system. I hope that explains it.
Do you run the pump off the Vehicles engine 12V? If so where did you tap into the wire does it start when ignition starts? I’d imagine you could have this on a rocker switch so on cold mornings you could circulate the gycol in the back on leisure battery and give the engine a warm?
If a customer is drive their van daily that is a fantastic system. If someone is boondocking for a week or two not as much as showers may have to be timed as it will take time for the 750w element in the water heater to get that tank warm. There are 800w DC water heater elements available, that heater may be able to be converted so you lessen the load on your inverter by running it directly off your batteries. I have one concern with the glycol tank, it looks like the tank is aluminum and the fittings are brass, how did you mitigate the Galvanic Corrosion risk between the two dissimilar metals?
Great system, and I am looking forward to install it into my VAN as well. I am a perfectionist like you as well and love that everything is perfectly installed and allocated. Why add the extra tank of glycol though? Wouldn't 2 shut off ball valves where your intake and out-take from the van is be working the same way?
@@HumbleRoad I would have loved to build my van with you as I am sure it would have turned into another masterpiece. I would Love to connect and share some ideas I have applied into my built that haven’t seen done yet.
Always clear and concise explanation of your engineering decisions; thanks! I would like to hear your opinion and experience on using those plate exchangers vs shell & tube. My concern in my application is that the exchanger in the engine bay will experience significant vibrations, and I am concerned about the plate exchanger as they are theoretically much more prone to breakdown in the seal and resulting in liquids mixing compared to the shell & tube type heat exchanger.
I know a few builders using the very same exchanger in their builds without issue. I have three vans out in the wild using this heat exchanger without issues. One van is full time, running every single day!
Just watched the video from Van Land, they installed the same heat-exchange water heater but under the chassis. Maybe it's a good idea to solve the issue of having a high-temperature heat source in the chassis in summer.
While I agree it is a fine, rugged piece of equipment, but the Isotemp is not made for exterior mounting. It is from the marine world, where its intended use is in the bilge or engine room.
@@HumbleRoad Right, just figured out they're using a different brand, the "SureCal 20 liter / 5.28 gal Horizontal Single Coil Calorifier". Having read through the product description, this one seems better for interior use, too.
ha! I just watched that video too before finding this one. I think they're also running the actual radiator water through their system as well, so when those exposed hoses and fittings under the van break, and they will, the van is going to lose all coolant and overheat.
My 40 year old winnebago has a heater in the back that uses the antifreeze from the engine radiator. I just took out the heat exchanger and blower and used the hoses to install a closed loop system around my cold water to heat it up for the shower and washing machine. With all due respect there is no need to use a second reservoir in the back for a second heat exchanger, every time you use a heat exchanger you lose efficiency. Why not just pipe the antifreeze from your radiator to the water tank. Amd skip the extra exchanger and glycol reservoir. Just a thought.
He deliberately did not type a chassis anti-freeze back to my system for a most important reason. If anything were to happen to those lines, the vehicle is in operable with my set up. If anything happens to the lines only the water heater is in operable. And I did want to step back on the efficiency of the system. A pro master runs normally at 215° with the heat exchangers in place. I am still making 170° water which is rather hi it’s Spaulding so anything I can do to step it down I’ll do.
I deliberately did not pipe the chassis anti-freeze back to my system for a most important reason. If anything were to happen to those lines, the vehicle is in operable, with my set up, If anything happens to the lines only the water heater is in operable. And I did want to step back on the efficiency of the system. A pro master runs normally at 215° with the heat exchangers in place. I am still making 170° water which is rather hot
If the heat exchanger is still in your engine bay, how you have it, but you're pumping your water through it to heat it directly, then if anything happens to the lines under the chassis you will only lose the water and not a load of glycol. Correct me if I'm wrong and thanks for taking the time to make the video.
Super clean setup, great work. I have a similar setup in my van and love it. One question: Do you ever have the overheat protection get triggered? I keep finding myself having to access my water heater to reset the overheat protection pin every time I turn the heating element on and the water is hot.
@@HumbleRoad Thanks for the quick reply. I wasn't sure if those cooled it down enough since the Promaster's coolant gets so hot, but it looks like with your heat exchanger and the in-line heat sinks it does which is great to hear. I really like your closed loop system as you have completely isolated systems. Great work, love seeing how well you've thought this through.
I am surprised this type of system does not set a engine code P0128. The engine's operating temperature not reaching a specified temperature within a given time.
From my understanding, there are 3 pumps. One for the glycol, One for the hotwater to exchange with the glycol and another to refill the hot water tank after use. Just to be sure I understood, how many pump are needed in this solution?
Is more to the point of keeping the engine system separate is providing proper temp for the engine to operate optimally? Does it drop the engine temp a bit. ICEs need heat to combust
I've got two of these vans out in the wild, one full time for over a year now. No issues. If the chassis coolant was run all the way back to the water heater, then yes, I see what you are thinking.
Beautiful job!! Curious if there would actually be any battery net loss if you ran the electric water heater while driving with your multi chargers going?
So if you're boondocking for several days this seems like a very expensive system that's useless unless you want to waste fuel running the engine. The same thing can be accomplished with an electric hot water heater and letting the alternator provide electricity for heat. This way you only have the cost of one system that will work under all conditions.
You missed a very important part of the story, John. The water heater also has a 120V 750W heating element inside. I used your exact words when I said if you're boondocking for two week, simply turn on the inverter and make hot water. The Vagabonds have this system and with over one year of use, have never turned on the electric portion. Their driving habits provide plenty of hot water every day.
@@FlexDRG I agree but it adds a huge expense and the opportunity for more things to break when you already have the alternator. To each his own but I believe it's money poorly spent.
Most of the energy (60%-80%) in the petrol you burn goes as waste heat - So it should use less fuel to heat your water like this than to use your alternator.
I am guessing you use the same coolant that the chassis uses? If the heat exchanger were to fail inside it would contaminate the chassis coolant otherwise.
An astute observation. But no, in all three vans done so far, I used a pet safe glycol as per the client's request. But moving forward, I will introduce your theory. I like it.
George, I just appreciate you so much! So timely, you are! I've been fruitlessly researching this very system you demonstrate so beautifully here. Thanks so much for that! I'm thinking there must be a reason you didn't install the glycol reservoir under the van? I'd like to understand if you care to elaborate.
Firstly, love your work - great build quality and attention to detail with excellent functionality. For the glycol system, what would be the outcome if glycol was to leak, for any reason, from the heat exchanger within the water tank?. As a sweet tasting but toxic substance, could such an event pose a serious health risk, to a person that was routinely consuming water with other sweeteners (cordials) masking the taste? Loss of glycol in the header tank would, at some stage, alert a person to the issue of a leak and rate of dilution would vary dependant on the severity of any potential failure within the exchanger -, could it be a risk worthy of consideration for discussion with the manufacturer and precautionary advice to owners?
The heat exchangers in the water heaters are double walled. The particular brand I use has a near perfect track record. Also the color of the glycol would alert you to the problem almost immediately.
I don't know of anybody that drinks from their hot water supply source. We have a separate cold supply and a water filtration system, for just the small drinking water tap !
@@MultiOutdoorman Some people may use the hot water because they have run out of the main supply and just take advantage of what's left, or use hot water to get a head start on further heating water for cooking. Regardless of the frequency of the risk, it's more about the severity of the potential outcome and the need for robust design and end user awareness.
Hey George, Thanks so much for Another Very Nice Video! I plan to do mostly winter traveling to avoid the crowds plus I like winter better than summer. Have you considered preheating the engine (H-12 option for a Sprinter), but instead of spending $1200 for a factory install, just incorporate it into your plumbing system using the Espar Hydronic S3 D5E? I plan to use two motorized valves in my glycol lines for turning it on and off. Plus, I want one system without the separating heat exchanger just to MAKE IT SIMPLE. I have driven over a million miles and I have never had a heater hose to blow and I bet you could say the same thing, so What is the BIG DEAL ? I know no one recommends this! With all the safety warning electronics build into the Sprinter I am sure I would know if a line blew, and I would just FIX IT!
I installed an Espar Hydronic system in my first van build. Did not like the idea of firing up a diesel furnace all Summer long every time I needed hot water. Since you will be mostly in colder climates, that will not be an issue.
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I made this kind of system in my van, but by my own way. I didn't use any ready supplies. Now I have 80 litres (21 gallons) of hot water in 20 minutes of driving. 😁
can you share on how you did that
Howdy,
Do you maybe have a video of the setup, or parts list and a diagram? Many thanks in advance for your time and assistance, it's much appreciated.
C.I.M.
Hi Filip, can you share how you did it? A partslist would help as well.
PLEASE, a parts list especially the billet intercooler. TIA
Now THIS was a beautiful, clean build and an amazingly clear and simple overview. THANK YOU
Thank you!
Free hot water, and as a by-product, extra cooling for the van engine.
Buying a used van with the system like this in it this helps so much! Thank you thank you
This is how most cruising boats make hot water. Works great and the water will stay hot for a day. Most marine water heaters are stainless and include an internal engine coolant heat exchanger plus a 120V electric heater as well. My boat makes water very hot and it lasts into the next day easy.
Good Morning George
Always Enjoy Your Humble Road Videos !!
Thanks !!👍
George, that Garage is a work of art.
That solves the problems of getting the truck stranded losing its engine coolant from those lines getting cut by a rock or something on the road, and solves the problems of those lines freezing during the winter since it is also antifreeze coolant.
I didn't see or hear if you shown or talked about the tank freezing when not in use during the winter. But i am sure all you would need to have is a drain valve for the fresh water in the tank at its lowest point, and just drain it when you know you will be storing the truck in the freezing weather.
I haven’t installed a low point drain since van #01. Run the tank dry and blow the lines.
What a work of art! Never would I be able to design this myself. Simply amazing that your knowledge reservoir is so large.
I will absorb this slowly, like a good novel. Looking at the aluminum, high tech systems, birch plywood just gives me the thrills. I savor these videos like a fine wine - smell, sip, taste, swirl, absorb, repeat. What a gift you are to the planet.
Looking good with that hair and beard trim. And more relaxed somehow. Glad to see you in the pink of health.
Love your videos.....trust the humble man . Someday I would like to send a can for conversion from UK.
Please do!
Fantastic and thank you for the information share.
Peace and love from Liverpool England ✌🏼❤️
Every time I think I’ve got a good idea you have already done it. You got me again.
Thank you so very much for sharing George. Awesome 👍❤️
An ideal to install it on or in the roof with a transparent dome cover over it, to allow sunlight to hit it, paint it flat black. This way it gives more energy options and more energy period. During your camp stop you not only have the option to use solar panels and batteries with the 750watt element to heat the water, you have the sunlight hitting it during the sunny days. And at most you will benefit by not having to use so much battery power to keep hot water, and have more energy for other things.
You could also install tees on the input and outputs of the reservoir and add another heat transfer loop using a small solar water heating coil(under a transparent flat panel), giving even more energy into the system during sunny days.
Be aware of the weight you will have up there. Not to alter the center of gravity too much
Great idea for winter heating. I have a floor heater in my bus and after parking it puts off radiant heat for hours... Nice.
I’m always blown away with your professionalism, love for building vans the right way, and, just your total knowledge in general! Thanks for sharing all you do with all of us, George! ❤️👍😎. ~Jim~
Spring clamps are typically better than worm-drive clamps for automotive and similar applications where heating and cooling is taking place, such as on the tank barbs. They will expand and contract keeping a constant water-tight pressure on the tubing, but they must be sized correctly. Worm drive clamps such as in the video can apply too much pressure upon the hose when the tank and hose is heated and over time, this can cause leaks. If you need worm-drive clamps for an application, I suggest the Norma brand because they will hold much tighter than other worm drive clamps. Cheers!
What a great series you have. Thank you.
You're very welcome!
Thanks for the excellent information. Please provide the product description.
Learned more info for my system in my 98 Xplorer. Thanks for posting George!
My 98 Xplorer heats the water heater from the motor. I also added a 110v heat rod to heat off the generator, shore power or solar.
@@yvairguy Interesting!
Beautifully designed and explained
You make some of the most well explained and safest/smartest solutions for Van lifers like me. Thank you for your videos. You are super knowledgeable and it shows in your work.
I just purchased my 2022 Promaster 2500 136WB yesterday and I’m coming to you for my conversion needs. Talk to you soon hopefully. 🙏🏽
I wish you the best with your build! 👍
Can you post a link to the brand / model heat exchanger you use??? Looks like it'd fit perfect in the Transit.
Nice work Loue! I hope I spelled that right.
I think this is brilliant and it solves quite a worry I've been having about the idea of a heat exchanger set-up where the engine coolant is heat-exchanging with the hot water system. The problem with having a "direct" exchanger is that you generate hot water whenever you drive. And don't have an option to stop heating - at least not without complex diverter valves. I think with your system, can you not run the pump via a thermostat in your hot water tank - so when it reaches e.g. 120, your intermediate glycol loop pump switches off?
Correct
If the returning glycol is too hot, couldn't you just setup a thermostatic switch to the pump? and stop the glycol looping.
I like that, have a e-valve solenoid switch on the dash for summer days when you dont need hot water or really just dont want a hot van
who wants a hot shower anyway when it is 30°C outside anyway. I like your idea a lot.
Hi following your videos is a treat with your humor.
My question what is the specificaction of the heat exchanger.
Great video! Sir George, just wanted to give a heads up. That those worm gear clamps connected to the heat exchanger will eventually leak glyco, especially in the engine bay. Due to the hose experiencing cold/hot temps. It is much better to use spring clamps that can deal with that expanding and contracting of hoses. Hence why all car manufacturers, will never use worm gear clamps in the engine bay
Noted. Thank you!
I have just recently learned of these water heaters and I think they are a great idea, I will be incorporating one into my build.
Been looking for hours to find a proper video for explaining the heating system for hot water / floor heating in the van, I thought about using the auto term combo boil and connect ut to the coolant system of the car I see here I should use a exchanger
Thanks for the detailed explanation!
❤️ your systems and options, GEORGE…amazing‼️
Hello, my friend Haven't commented in a while. Last year was rough on everybody, I like the new format good information 1 set-up with the lights. More time to build vans. Also so glad you got the new space. I knew how much you wanted it before. Take care talk to you later,😀
Your level of detail and expertise in so many aspects of van building is second to none.
I think the water heater resides in the second to none area - however great it is to have a hot shower. When I travel I generally am chasing T-shirt weather and would not want an extra heat sink inside the van, as I typically have the fans running and doors wide open to get rid of accumulated heat just from outside temperature inputs. I am usually successful in ridding all of the heat - when I don't - I don't sleep as well. (& we all know that lack of sleep is the new smoking!!!)
I use a more mobile solution to get a hot shower (much less convenient though)
I am always chronically cold, freezing. I never camped in my life because no matter how hot it is outside, I need a heater or heated mattress pad. This system would be a life saver for me
@@natureloversadventures7335 I tried a heated mattress pad for the first time last winter. I do have a furnace/heater in the van but I use the heated mattress pad more often to take the chill off before going to sleep.. (use the furnace in the morning to take the chill off in van)
That system works for me.
So I would recommend a mattress pad.
Great system, very interesting.
Instead of adding and removing insulation around the pipes, it would help to regulate the pump. In summer it should run slower, so the glycol has more time to cool down before it runs into the heater. (Maybe a two level-switch for summer/winter is sufficient.)
Btw: I'm using an electric 12V heater and run it only while I'm driving. Same effect, but only 200W and much less water than in your system.
Thanks for the tips!
Yes, having 2 separate glycol systems safeguards from a cut line on the 2nd one disabling your vehicle. But if all the effort you put into making that 2nd system was focused instead on protecting those lines it would be much simpler and avoid the problems that glycol reservoir is causing. If the hoses came through the wall separating the passenger side from the engine they'd be well protected. What do you think?
The hoses are not so easily routed to and through that fire wall without blocking or compromising another system under the hood. Best route is straight down and over the steering axle.
Hi George, I use isotherm slim in most of my builds. I have shut offs(electric ball valves) and no heat exchanger or Reservoir. These systems produce too much hot water if left open all the time. If it’s still too hot under my bed after both me and my wife shower, I have recirculating feature in shower valve rv that I can transfer most of the heated hot water to main tank that sits under van
Paul, do you have a pump on the your Isotherm to circulate the coolant from the engine or not?
@@mattadams7261 you don’t need pump, the engine water pump is always on when running. It circulates thur engine block and thur heater coil and isotherm if allowed. It works perfectly.I am now installing electric ball valves.
Wow having you do the build then a video on how it works
You sir are a rockstar and an inspiration.
Spring clamps would be better than worm clamps for systems and connections that change temperature.
I don't trust spring clamps. But that's just me.
Hi HR, I am about to do this on my new 2023 promoter 159 Ext. I am trying to figure out where exactly you cut your hose so that you didn't need to add any hose! I am stumped! LOL. Do you have a video of how you did it, I would love to see how so that I can do it! Great video as always, thank you so much for making these videos! Dwayne - Utah
I have a Promaster coming in for the first of the year.
After thinking all day on this it’s as simple as wiring the pump through the thermostat on the tank already provided for the electrical heating element. Problem solved never too hot.
Except then you have to leave the tank “on” all the time, making hot water through the inverter .
I’m pretty sure it opens and closes the connection without power. A gas water heater has no power to the thermostat. It just opens and closes a circuit. It’s worth looking into.
ahh, an aux system to heat when you are not driving. I was always wondering about that!
Great idea! Just watched a video by Silvercymbal regarding coolant hose clamps. Might have to agree with him that ring clamps are not meant for coolant hoses. Need to use spring clamps that apply constant clamping pressure no matter if the hose and nipple are hot or cold. The ring clamp might allow a coolant hose to leak depending on temperature.
What a well thought out system. Even the drawback of the reservoir giving off heat is only an issue a few months out of the year and insulated cover solves that. As someone who is cold far more often than I am hot, that radiant heat would actually be a benefit to me most of the time. Great explanation, George!
New Jersey Italian genius.
Hello George, many thanks for your excellent work. Your brain is always working overdrive!!!
Question: where do you tap into your heat exchanger understood? Did you install a Y connector to split the heated coolant to cab heat and exchanger, or to have coolant going in series to exchanger and can heat.
I know you are busy, but I hope for the best. TIA.
I don't know how many times I have watched this video to learn. I think I watched all of your episodes. Thank you so much. I wonder why you didn't install the reservoir tank in the engine bay. Was it just simply because of no space?
Correct, no space in the engine bay.
Excellent system. I'm curious if I could use a cheap 2.5 gallon HWH (Home Depot type) and then always have a 120v HWH available where I have shore power? In other words, heat exchanger plumbed in like yours just in to an existing HWH where it almost never runs? Can you link which heat exchanger you went with? I'm seeing lots of variance in price and I'm sure this is in line with quality.
Seems like more work for more money, parts, failure points and less efficiency. And slight peace of mind. But if done correctly, a hose getting cut doesn’t seem likely
Thanks for sharing tour knowledge.
Instead of adding water to air heat exchangers in order to cool the glycol in the summertime, why not just stop the pump?
It wouldn't boil the water to water glycol stationary part as the boiling point is way higher...
* your knowledge
Hello George. Could you tell what is the size of the holes used for your system? I am in the process of doing hydraulic. Thank you very much for the content.
A counter argument for having a mixing valve at the tap vs. mixing valve at the calorifier is that the pre-mixed at the calorifier water will lose less heat in transit than the mixing at the tap variant,
In terms of physics, you are correct. However, the fact that the water is being sent to the faucet at upwards of 150 to 170°F. I wouldn’t mind losing a little more heat at that point as well!
Hi HR! I have been following your videos for years now and very much appreciate your sharing of your experience, but also your explanation-teaching of your work and process. I am in the process of buying appliances for my Transit van and wanted to ask where you picked up your hot water heating system, specifically the glycol coolant unit and if its just the unit or other parts needed for assembly? I already purchased the isotemp cylinder water heater and hoping to install the passive heating system as well. Thank you for sharing your experience and look forward to hearing from you!
Thank you Brett, for supporting my channel. .
The engineer in me really wants to install this in my next build. The pragmatist doesn’t want to feel like I am running an engine room on my camping trips.
Once installed, the only thing left to do is smile 😊
@@HumbleRoad haha. Until your guest forgets that your outdoor shower can be 170 degrees 😬 I’d love to hear more about the pros and cons for someone like me who isn’t full time
Mind blowing ☀️ great idea
How about a parts list for that tank, pump, exchanger, etc?
I have the same heater but i like your isolated system idea.
Yes, PLEASE, a parts list especially the billet intercooler. TIA
@@gme5802 I would love a list of items with links to stores. I am going crazy trying to find these parts and the right sizes for my van. Pleeeease?
Hi George, first of, love your work and the channel. Would you be willing, to please confirm I have the right part numbers for your hot water system, i.e. SKU: G55 Heat Exchanger, SKU:C11-103 2 Gal Exp Tank; SKU:P11-100 12v Pump? I live in the UK, so finding these parts here is a bit of a challenge. I was thinking of buying direct from Rixen; that's if they'll ship abroad. I managed to buy the ISOtherm tank. Thanks in advance
Great job! I notice that you did not address the vent on top of the Rixen expansion tank. What are you planning to do with that in order to manage the potential air/coolant "escapes"?
Also, is there a reason you did not put the expansion tank and/or pump in the engine area?
I will vent the reservoir outside the van, but if you keep the coolant level one inch and a half down from the top of the tank, it will not boil over. In a Promaster, there is not room under the hood for the reservoir. Sprinters? yes, I put the tank on the aux battery tray, if it is not occupied.
Does the pomp switch on automatically when starting the Van? Amazing video! Thanks
Yes
I love your content!! I am trying to find the heat exchanger you are using in this video. What brand is it and where can I buy It?
If the water stays hot for up to two days could you add a cabin heat radiator to the system and use the retained heat to heat the van overnight?
Yes this could work but I don’t think you would get too much energy out of it.
You are an excellent illustrator! You really fully understand the heat exchanger principles to give such a clear lecture without a script. Really enjoy all your videos.
Any reason not using instant tankless hot water system?
Tankless requires power every time. this system requires zero power.
really interesting, so not sure if it's been asked already but what happens if you're stopped for more than 2 days and no shore power, in other words, how long would you have to idle your engine build up a decent amount of heat?
I mentioned in the video that this water heater also has a 120VAC heater coil immersed in the tank. Turn on the inverter and turn on the heater. 750W so it takes a little bit of time to heat up, but that's another way to make hot water with this set-up.
Hello George, by any chance you can draw a diagram how you did this? It’s the system of keeping the hot water in that water tank that throws me off. I totally understand the heat exchanging process produced by the engine glycol. It’s how to keep the hot water in the tank to be used later when you wanna take a shower or whatever. Thank you 😊
The water pump (when on) is pushing cold water into the water heater, where it is heated and sent out to the hot manifold for dispersion throughout the van.
This is genius. I am always cold and I need a constant heat during night. I live on the West Coast and nights are cold here even in the middle of summer. Can I have this system installed just to have my small van warm? I have a Ford Transit Connect. I do not care about kitchen or cooking or running water. I only want my tiny van to be warm and I do not want any noise coming from the heater like diesel or gasoline heater. This system would be perfect if I could heat my van with it. Can you do that? I grew up in Ukraine and we had water system to keep our homes warm. The hot water was pumped from a separate building structure into many 9 story residential buildings and it was cheap, we never were cold. Here in the US I do not like the heating systems as they are too noisy and I cannot have them on at night.
Enjoy your ideas and build series. I also have the Isotemp Sure Slim 4.2 G water heater and the rixen Hydronic Kit with the expansion tank minus the electrical heat element.I also have the engine coolant heat exchanger add on. My question to you is what was your reasoning for running your glycol from the extension tank to the pump then direct to the heater exchange in the engine compartment and then to the isotemp?. Also if I put the extension tank in the engine compartment with the heat exchanger where would I place the pump?
The reservoir should be the highest component in the system
How does someone sign up with you to build out their van? I love you and your work!!!
email: georgemauro@humbleroad.tv
You don’t need to cool the water from the heat exchanger. That’s why you get the isotherm with a mixing valve. You connect only one hose to the expansion tank otherwise you create a radiator.
please explain further. thank you.
@@HumbleRoad there is no harm in running engine cooling water through the isotherm. That’s done on boats. They just have a heat exchanger to cool the coolant with sea water. The coolant with antifreeze just cycles through engine, hot water tank and the heat exchanger that gets cooled by the sea water. They use an impeller pump to cycle the sea water through that. It’s basically the same functionality as in a car just with sea water not air.
It is a good thing to separate the engine loop from the van/house loop in case you ever have to work on one system only.
On the van side, just tee off a line from the highest point of your antifreeze plumbing to the expansion tank. The tee should open to the top to the line that goes to the tank. Your circulation pump should be in the colder return line. Once you fill your system it will just fill with water and the air will go out.
Let the pump run and you will see how the air comes out of the system.
The expansion tank must be the highest point in your system. I hope that explains it.
Awesome setup...however those marine systems are VERY expensive...
Do you run the pump off the Vehicles engine 12V? If so where did you tap into the wire does it start when ignition starts?
I’d imagine you could have this on a rocker switch so on cold mornings you could circulate the gycol in the back on leisure battery and give the engine a warm?
Very interesting video good job
If a customer is drive their van daily that is a fantastic system. If someone is boondocking for a week or two not as much as showers may have to be timed as it will take time for the 750w element in the water heater to get that tank warm. There are 800w DC water heater elements available, that heater may be able to be converted so you lessen the load on your inverter by running it directly off your batteries. I have one concern with the glycol tank, it looks like the tank is aluminum and the fittings are brass, how did you mitigate the Galvanic Corrosion risk between the two dissimilar metals?
i thought the tank was stainless steel ?
@@MultiOutdoorman The cylindrical water heater is stainless, but the rectangular reservoir tank I believe is TIG welded aluminum.
Good morning!
Morning!
This is amazing! Where can I find the water heater and reservoir to purchase?
Rixen
Great system, and I am looking forward to install it into my VAN as well. I am a perfectionist like you as well and love that everything is perfectly installed and allocated. Why add the extra tank of glycol though? Wouldn't 2 shut off ball valves where your intake and out-take from the van is be working the same way?
Ball valves are fine, except the engine coolant is at risk making the journey to the water heater and back
@@HumbleRoad I would have loved to build my van with you as I am sure it would have turned into another masterpiece. I would
Love to connect and share some ideas I have applied into my built that haven’t seen done yet.
@@HumbleRoad also why do you prefer this system to the isoterm itself with all built in already?
Always clear and concise explanation of your engineering decisions; thanks! I would like to hear your opinion and experience on using those plate exchangers vs shell & tube. My concern in my application is that the exchanger in the engine bay will experience significant vibrations, and I am concerned about the plate exchanger as they are theoretically much more prone to breakdown in the seal and resulting in liquids mixing compared to the shell & tube type heat exchanger.
I know a few builders using the very same exchanger in their builds without issue. I have three vans out in the wild using this heat exchanger without issues. One van is full time, running every single day!
I believe that this plate heat exchanger is fully brazed meaning there are no seals on the plate pack, it seems very robust to me.
Just watched the video from Van Land, they installed the same heat-exchange water heater but under the chassis. Maybe it's a good idea to solve the issue of having a high-temperature heat source in the chassis in summer.
While I agree it is a fine, rugged piece of equipment, but the Isotemp is not made for exterior mounting. It is from the marine world, where its intended use is in the bilge or engine room.
@@HumbleRoad Right, just figured out they're using a different brand, the "SureCal 20 liter / 5.28 gal Horizontal Single Coil Calorifier". Having read through the product description, this one seems better for interior use, too.
ha! I just watched that video too before finding this one. I think they're also running the actual radiator water through their system as well, so when those exposed hoses and fittings under the van break, and they will, the van is going to lose all coolant and overheat.
My 40 year old winnebago has a heater in the back that uses the antifreeze from the engine radiator. I just took out the heat exchanger and blower and used the hoses to install a closed loop system around my cold water to heat it up for the shower and washing machine.
With all due respect there is no need to use a second reservoir in the back for a second heat exchanger, every time you use a heat exchanger you lose efficiency. Why not just pipe the antifreeze from your radiator to the water tank. Amd skip the extra exchanger and glycol reservoir. Just a thought.
He deliberately did not type a chassis anti-freeze back to my system for a most important reason. If anything were to happen to those lines, the vehicle is in operable with my set up. If anything happens to the lines only the water heater is in operable. And I did want to step back on the efficiency of the system. A pro master runs normally at 215° with the heat exchangers in place. I am still making 170° water which is rather hi it’s Spaulding so anything I can do to step it down I’ll do.
I deliberately did not pipe the chassis anti-freeze back to my system for a most important reason. If anything were to happen to those lines, the vehicle is in operable, with my set up, If anything happens to the lines only the water heater is in operable. And I did want to step back on the efficiency of the system. A pro master runs normally at 215° with the heat exchangers in place. I am still making 170° water which is rather hot
If the heat exchanger is still in your engine bay, how you have it, but you're pumping your water through it to heat it directly, then if anything happens to the lines under the chassis you will only lose the water and not a load of glycol. Correct me if I'm wrong and thanks for taking the time to make the video.
Great set up. Does the pump run constantly or what triggers the pump to circulate?
Engine on/pump on. Engine off/pump off.
Super clean setup, great work. I have a similar setup in my van and love it. One question:
Do you ever have the overheat protection get triggered?
I keep finding myself having to access my water heater to reset the overheat protection pin every time I turn the heating element on and the water is hot.
No, I installed in line heat sinks on the return line to the water tank and that lowers the temp
@@HumbleRoad Thanks for the quick reply. I wasn't sure if those cooled it down enough since the Promaster's coolant gets so hot, but it looks like with your heat exchanger and the in-line heat sinks it does which is great to hear. I really like your closed loop system as you have completely isolated systems.
Great work, love seeing how well you've thought this through.
Good information.👍💕😊
I am surprised this type of system does not set a engine code P0128. The engine's operating temperature not reaching a specified temperature within a given time.
From my understanding, there are 3 pumps. One for the glycol, One for the hotwater to exchange with the glycol and another to refill the hot water tank after use.
Just to be sure I understood, how many pump are needed in this solution?
One pump
why take pipe insulation off in summer? hope to understand!!
Is more to the point of keeping the engine system separate is providing proper temp for the engine to operate optimally?
Does it drop the engine temp a bit. ICEs need heat to combust
I've got two of these vans out in the wild, one full time for over a year now. No issues. If the chassis coolant was run all the way back to the water heater, then yes, I see what you are thinking.
Beautiful job!!
Curious if there would actually be any battery net loss if you ran the electric water heater while driving with your multi chargers going?
So if you're boondocking for several days this seems like a very expensive system that's useless unless you want to waste fuel running the engine. The same thing can be accomplished with an electric hot water heater and letting the alternator provide electricity for heat. This way you only have the cost of one system that will work under all conditions.
You missed a very important part of the story, John. The water heater also has a 120V 750W heating element inside. I used your exact words when I said if you're boondocking for two week, simply turn on the inverter and make hot water. The Vagabonds have this system and with over one year of use, have never turned on the electric portion. Their driving habits provide plenty of hot water every day.
Using the engine heat that needs dissapating anyway you don't impact fuel economy as much as running an electric heater of an engine alternator.
@Chris yes I do. And every bit of power you draw from them adds load to the engine, worsening the MPG.
@@FlexDRG I agree but it adds a huge expense and the opportunity for more things to break when you already have the alternator. To each his own but I believe
it's money poorly spent.
Most of the energy (60%-80%) in the petrol you burn goes as waste heat - So it should use less fuel to heat your water like this than to use your alternator.
I am guessing you use the same coolant that the chassis uses? If the heat exchanger were to fail inside it would contaminate the chassis coolant otherwise.
An astute observation. But no, in all three vans done so far, I used a pet safe glycol as per the client's request. But moving forward, I will introduce your theory. I like it.
Will it freeze if the van is parked for a long time ie. 3 days? Will there be hot water if your parked at a campground for 3 days?
One question. Why a secondary system? Why not just send the water you use up to the heat exchanger?
Are you still using glycol loop systems in your current vans or have you switched to a different system? THX!
Yes! But I am about to install the new AquaHot D
George, I just appreciate you so much! So timely, you are! I've been fruitlessly researching this very system you demonstrate so beautifully here. Thanks so much for that! I'm thinking there must be a reason you didn't install the glycol reservoir under the van? I'd like to understand if you care to elaborate.
As I explained in the video, the reservoir must be positioned at the highest point in the system. Otherwise, it will overflow!
On second thought, you did say that the tank needs to be higher than the rest of the system. Duh.
Resevoir needs to gravity feed the pump to work properly so low resevoir isnt ideal. Look at the location of your resevoirs in your car.
Firstly, love your work - great build quality and attention to detail with excellent functionality. For the glycol system, what would be the outcome if glycol was to leak, for any reason, from the heat exchanger within the water tank?. As a sweet tasting but toxic substance, could such an event pose a serious health risk, to a person that was routinely consuming water with other sweeteners (cordials) masking the taste? Loss of glycol in the header tank would, at some stage, alert a person to the issue of a leak and rate of dilution would vary dependant on the severity of any potential failure within the exchanger -, could it be a risk worthy of consideration for discussion with the manufacturer and precautionary advice to owners?
The heat exchangers in the water heaters are double walled. The particular brand I use has a near perfect track record. Also the color of the glycol would alert you to the problem almost immediately.
@@HumbleRoad Thanks, the double walled exchange tubes is reassuring.
I don't know of anybody that drinks from their hot water supply source. We have a separate cold supply and a water filtration system, for just the small drinking water tap !
@@MultiOutdoorman Some people may use the hot water because they have run out of the main supply and just take advantage of what's left, or use hot water to get a head start on further heating water for cooking. Regardless of the frequency of the risk, it's more about the severity of the potential outcome and the need for robust design and end user awareness.
Hey George, Thanks so much for Another Very Nice Video!
I plan to do mostly winter traveling to avoid the crowds plus I like winter better than summer.
Have you considered preheating the engine (H-12 option for a Sprinter), but instead of spending $1200 for a factory install, just incorporate it into your plumbing system using the Espar Hydronic S3 D5E? I plan to use two motorized valves in my glycol lines for turning it on and off.
Plus, I want one system without the separating heat exchanger just to MAKE IT SIMPLE. I have driven over a million miles and I have never had a heater hose to blow and I bet you could say the same thing, so What is the BIG DEAL ? I know no one recommends this! With all the safety warning electronics build into the Sprinter I am sure I would know if a line blew, and I would just FIX IT!
I installed an Espar Hydronic system in my first van build. Did not like the idea of firing up a diesel furnace all Summer long every time I needed hot water. Since you will be mostly in colder climates, that will not be an issue.
Genius!
Lots of different size Heat Exchangers.....what brand /size do you find works the best and what brand/size pump do you use?
Who makes the heater? Model? Link? Thanks!
Brilliant ...
very very nice