Thanks for watching! I will try to respond to whatever comments I get as it remains attainable! PLEASE SHOW THIS TO OTHER PERSONA FANS. Shabu and I worked really hard on this video getting information for over a month and I really don't want to see this video flop. Persona has grown to mean a lot to me in the past year and I want to see more Persona content succeed. Check out Shabu's Channel as well! "Shabu, That Music Nerd"
It was great and the motif is in "Smile" of P4 around 16 seconds in and it's also in "Heaven" at around 40 seconds. I wonder if there is a song in P3 with the motif as well. If there is that is some crazy dedication to a motif.
ChironTheCuddley I haven’t found the motif in P3’s game OST yet, but in the P3 Movie, there’s “Pure One Heart” where the motif shows up around 16 seconds in, and also a little bit at the beginning of “More Than One Heart.”
in the 3:20 mark of the full moon full life in persona 3 reload, this motif appears, i think this will forever be an important motif throughout persona
INaizumi Lyn's Engrish is actually kind of sweet, actually. Although, yeah, the previous broken English was a nice charm of the Persona series up till Lyn stole the show with her snazzy jazzy voice.
Music is one of the most fundamental aspects in creating the proper mood and tone for shows, video games, movies, etc. The proper utilization of soundtracks for games can transform a simple game into a work of art. Music is a powerful tool.
id normally wouldnt be interested in such a deep dive into music composition but this video was awesome! very concise and easy to follow along. HIDING KUN DOESNT MISSSSSSSS
Persona 2 Innocent Sin is still the best written game in the series with the best cast. I love every game, even the spinoffs, but thats just the gold standard.
Persona 5 is full of call backs to P2 in terms of characters and certain character dynamics, so I'm not surprised this motif is also taken from it as well.
@@HidinginPublic I'm a huge p2 fan and honestly, I noticed "hey Dance of Death" sounds similar to the P5 motif, but I never put it all together until now. And I'm really into music composition so I'm impressed.
I've been very aware of these coincidences ever since P5 came into existence but it comes from a much deeper level. Just like the mainline Shin Megami Tensei games atlus has been reusing and remixing a lot of their music from the first game to represent a sort of ongoing cohesion between the franchise. And the exact same goes for Persona on which Meguro also was a part of even though he wasnt a major part(we owe him the velvet room theme though). A lot of Persona 1's songs have survived and evolved in one way or another as well as the main theme of the franchise which starts with the 4 iconic notes. Mayas theme has shown up time and time again across all 3 of the newest games in the form of living with determination and I'll face myself. They are both meant to evoke the same feeling of Maya's death and the struggle to live on. And I just wanted to mention, Persona 5's credit theme The Stars And Us is also a remix of the Shin Megami Tensei 1 credits sequence, in fact. All of the persona credit themes are. Atlus has been remixing them for over a decade now and you reallly wont notice this stuff unless you're super into their music. I think its wonderful how they've managed to recontextualize everything. Hell even Last Surprise feels like an inverted Persona 2 battle theme. Take Over has that exact same toning as the P2 Battle theme. Meguro knows what hes doing.
Right! The part "doubts from my mind" is this piece in Heaven! I was playing P4 and P5 in tandem last year and it stuck out like a sore thumb. I was shocked I couldn't find anyone else talking about it.
There's one more thing that links persona 2 to persona 5 and that is the use of red as it principal color This video is amazing, really easy to follow and left me wanting more XD excellent job dude !
one other thing i dont see mentioned is that in-universe, the event where Maya Dies plays is the sole reason the rest of the series was able to happen, making its recurring appearance throughout the series even better
There are a lot of other places it plays in part or in whoke in p5 but we were trying to be as consise as we could. It will definitely be fun to go through and see where else you can hear it!
Putting this here for those who don’t know, but in Beneath the Mask, the “masquerade” being referred to from the story of Red Death by Edgar Allen Poe (hence “Poe’s masquerade”). While I’m not sure how this ties in with P2, I think Arsene fits the description pretty well by design
OxyMoron Arsen is also based of a book. The characters name in the book is Arsen Lupin, he is from book about a thief who steals for sport. The book is called Arsen Lupin: Gentlemen Thief
Lazy Gambit yeah, so I heard. I was referring to how he looks, though; even though it’s (rather obviously) Arsene, he also looks like he could represent Red Death as well
p2 Innocent Sin had a famous poem too, included with a classic oldass german song, “der doppelgaenger“, reflecting and forshadowing the theme and ending to P2 IS. Its also present in the opening of the way more atmospheric persona 2 innocent sin ps1 version. And it comes full circle with the dance of death/maya dies theme, which is her sad theme, not the one u hear in the “hero theme“ nor her regular theme. Also Persona had another motif, a leitmotif within the first 3 games (before Shoji Meguro took over aka Persona 3) that is an piano segment u can cleaely hear in the opening of the persona 1/revelation(s) ps1 version.
As a massive fan of the persona series and its music, especially of Innocent Sin's, this brought a huge smile to my face. I always felt that the Persona 2 duology is severely underrated considering most of the modern trilogy archetypes and mechanics seems to be somewhat inspired by what those games did. Glad to see you're bridging the persona community by doing videos like these, Hiding. Was your outro song building up to this video all along?
Thankyou, I'm glad you feel that way. I can't say it was initially. I always felt a particular emotional connection to Maya's theme after first hearing it in FES a few months ago, and the Atsushi Kittajoh rearranged version felt to me exactly what Tsuchiya says in the interview. Like it was representative of me, kind of pushing back against whatever limitations the world had for me, and staying determined that I could eventually succeed with a creative career. I'm a huge junky for persona music so I found the motif, went to shabu and started digging. For about a month and a half or more, when I edit in my outro, yeah, that's definitely what it signifies.
Yes when i played eternal punishment (thanks to the game being much more difficult than IS Wich means I have to pay attention to the mechanics of the game) i noticed a lot of game designs that makes me feel like it would be the seeds that will be laid down for persona 3
Yoooo this turned out great! The editing is super dope. Thanks so much for having me on man it was a lot of fun to research :] It was really interesting doing a deeper dive into a lot of tracks from all over the persona series. If anyone has any specific or general questions hit me up :] We kept things pretty concise here and I'd love to talk about some of the musical ideas more in-depth for people that want to hear about them
Maya’s theme is by far my favourite track in the franchise and I love all the different arrangements of it to fit the different moods throughout the game. When listening to Maya’s death I knew there was something familiar about it but had no idea why. Now I know thanks to this video 😂 It was very informative and I appreciate the easy explanations as someone with very little knowledge on music lmao 👌👌
It's my favorite too. Specifically the Atsushi Kitajoh rearranged version connects with me in a way few other songs have been able to. I'm happy it was informative and easy to understand! I want as many people to see this as possible so I would appreciate if you helped me share it if possible. Thanks for taking the time to watch!
Amazing video, it's mind blowing to me how much thought can go into a game's soundtrack. I really think it shows just how passionate some people in the industry are towards what they do. Even after 2 decades of working on the same series, Meguro & Tsuchiya still cared enough to reflect on past compositions like that. Again, great video Hiding.
This is a bit old now and some people have pointed out that this motif is also in P3/ FES and P4 as well, But now it's ALSO in P3 Reload in Full Moon Full Life's full version as well apparently
Holy smokes, I was listening to a Persona mix, and realised that Smile from Persona 4 also has this motiff! That's nuts. And I guess Whims of Fate does too, when it says "So we roll the dice", or at least I hear the semblance XD Now I can't unhear this, fuck
holy shit its scary how somewhat my thoughts aligned to "Persona 1 and 2" was never forgotten but its been there all along without majority of the people knowing. I didn't know Persona 5 would be somehow connected and I would find out bout one of my fave songs (M. Dies) was there as base. I love all of Persona's songs from 1-5 (including spin-offs) I'm glad every Persona game that came after the other had a good reference of the past persona games.
I had notice small references between from Persona 2 and Persona 5, but i through it was just myself. This wow, it puts another perspective into this connection i notice
The motif is also now in the new P3 remake, in the bridge section of Full Moon Full Life (the extended version) you can hear it in the vocals like twice
This means a lot to me as a persona fan, too. Persona 2 means the world to me, and I've enjoyed every game in the series. Thank you for sharing all of this work.
As someone who hyperfixates on the P2 duology on the daily... this actually blew my mind and it's so obvious now that I know what to look for. ...Or is that "hear for"? I would not be surprised if this was intentional given how P5 revived a lot of classic stuff anyway (certain character dynamics, an endgame villain for P5 Vanilla that might as well be Nyarly, the return of old mechanics like Negotiation and the Nuclear element being it's own thing AND seperate from Almighty/Megido - EDIT: Also as someone else mentioned, Royal took the classic references and ran with it like with Biyarky/Byakhee appearing in that Palace in the trailer making me think NYARLY WAS ACTUALLY COMING BACK!!!!). And even if it wasn't an intentional callback, it's still dope as fuck since it turns an originally morbid and sad motif into a really, REALLY hopeful one. LIke full-on unadulterated "THE POWER OF ANIME AND FRIENDSHIP ARE ON MY SIDE TO SMITE YABBA-DABBA-DOO"-level of hopeful. It also kinda gives me similar vibes to how Ideal and the Real (mostly the End Version) has snippets of Memories of You for some reason. Regardless, this video has given me an excuse to once again replay the original trilogy. Haven't actually given EP PSP a go before but the English translation is done so might as well. (now, enough rambling out of me lmao)
I noticed a few years ago that Life Will Change and Wake Up Get Up Get Out There are, like, almost exactly the same song just with different lyrics and I love that
I know almost nothing about Persona 5, but this was still a very interesting video and I'm glad you look positively on it. Due to quarantine, I don't have much friends to contact to tell them to watch this, but I'll try my best to tell people about this video that clearly deserves attention due to the amount of time and effort put into it.
let's not forget that the same jingle is used in both "smile" and "heaven" from Persona 4. Both songs play in emotional moments of the game where characters are pushing through tough situations so it checks out. As well as the main boss theme in p5 AND the "days of sisters"
Also interesting that you can find those similarities between P2 and P5 as the butterfly also gets a little closer to Joker vs how it's just a background item in Persona 3 and 4.
And to add to this: Freedom and Security is also connected to Tokyo Daylight. The melody is very similar to the vocals of Tokyo Daylight, especially near the beginning of the loop. Considering when Freedom and Security plays, and what that part of the game stands for, it's not a surprise at all.
Thanks for making this video. I'm just baffled to know about the relations and if it weren't for you I couldn't have pointed this out. Persona 2 is very very close to my heart, especially the ost and maya as a character. Might sound childish but it's one game which really helped me in what means to "change your way" during my depression phase. And that's why both Maya and her theme is very close to my heart, I always perceived her theme exactly how you describe it and that's why it's a very important to me. thanks for making this video.
Persona 5’s music changed my fuckin life I swear. It’s the only soundtrack that gets me extremely hyped and emotional. There’s not enough words in the English language to explain how perfect it is. The beauty of Persona 5 music is that you never see it coming. I wish I could meet the composers and give them the strongest, manliest, most respectful handshake.
Persona 2 is my second favorite persona game and favorite story and characters in any video game. I can't believe I never noticed this video was amazing and shows yet again how important music is to Persona.
I've been playing the p3 remake recently and i was curious because a song kept hearing familiar and i didn't know from where, then i discover this videos, tysm
The -another version- of Futaba's palace theme also contains the first notes of Swear to my Bones. It's great how everything comes back in Shoji Meguro's work. Persona 3's Memories of You is also scathered all over its OST.
A lot of bits and pieces vet used throughout the soindtracks and it's always cool to see which songs share and where they come from, the one in the video was even crazier than I would have thought though. Meguro does a great job, and yeah memories of you has fingerprints all over p3
Just in time for that Persona 5 Royal drop. Ever since my exposure on Persona 5, I’ve been addicted to Persona music from some of the earlier works, especially Persona 3
Rip :( But thanks the creators p2 is so incredible game that you can enjoy it even with some spoilers. I tell you it's the best persona game the story, music, characters and themes, what's there not to love? Except the gameplay is a bit outdated, but it's old game so not really that big of a deal.
Personally, I like Eternal Punishment more. While being almost similar to Innocent Sin and despite being a silent protagonist in the game, you can see how positive Maya is in her choice responses.
Love seeing leitmotifs in anything, but it's especially cool that Persona 5 pulled a somewhat obscure motif from a much older game in the series and turned it into the backbone of its own soundtrack. Also just nitpicking, but huge props for pronouncing Shoji Meguro's name correctly. Usually no English speaker ever gets it right. Immediately afterwards, you mispronounced Kenichi Tsuchiya's name though. You never need to guess how to pronounce Japanese names; it's almost always going to be third to last syllable has the most stress e.g. KEN - i - chi TSU - chi - ya, not ken - I - chi tsu - CHI - ya.
I am musically pretty much illiterate so seeing how the theme connects to the franchise was really nice!, The editing was top too, keep it up Hiding :)
I am back after playing Persona 5 Strikers up to a certain late game boss and their second phase OST. After listening to it for a bit I began recognizing a chord progression straight out Maya's theme. And then I remembered this video and had to dig it out. My dude, you are still right. Maya's theme is where it all points back to!
guys its in interstice of time... i mean, obviously right? parallels between Maya and Aigis... (the song that plays when you explore the Abyss of Time in The Answer)
Random thing but I'm like 99% sure I've heard the motif in Heaven from Persona 4. Its right around the lyrics "removing doubts from my mind." It would make sense because of the certain character in heaven and how hope would definitely correlate with them. I think this motif is bigger than just 5 and 2 which is crazy to think.
Great vid, and amazing editing with this new video. The music in the Persona series are always amazing. Persona 3's OST is my personal favorite from the games.
Dude this video shows the effort that both of you and Shabu put into this video which makes this video AMAZING!. I'll make sure to come by the stream and share the video, Have a amazing day and continue making great videos in your own way.
As a guy who loves both Persona as a game and as a musical project, I have to say that this video blew me away. Both you and Shabu gave me so much more to chew on concerning this game and made me love the music even more. As a musician seeking to expand my musical knowledge, this has been great and having it concern one of my favourite things helps a lot as well. Listening back on the OST, I can hear a lot of variations of the fabled "motif" now. Thanks, guys, great vid! I love the content!
I like this deep dive, and I will like it even more if this does remain a sort of "Franchise motif" across future games as well. I think it's safe to say that was the intent of the composers and directors shared between 2 and 5!
Thanks for making this video. I can't remember if I commented before, but here are my thoughts: It's a great analysis and I have to say I'm amazed as a Persona fan myself and I really am amazed by the music analysis too
i did not know a SINGLE thing about persona to this day but consider me fully invested now what the hell fuckin love musical connections like this and my mind is blown have a Good Day Sir
Not to mention that this motif appears in most of the series as well at several points. I'm glad that everyone including the devs agrees Maya's theme and it's many, many versions is the best persona song and the unofficial franchise theme.
Wow! This is such a good analysis, even for a person like me, who has next to no knowledge about musical composition, it was able to make me understand and learn something new! Great job!
Motifs also have to do greatly with first impressions as they can establish location, character, mood or theme. A motif is the first notes of the ultra instinct awaken theme, if you hear it once you can directly identify it just by the first note alone, another example is the original super mario music of world 1-1 as well as the underground theme. Hearing the motif again reminds you of that first introduction with Mario and the game. A person who works a lot with Motifs is Toby Fox as he is known to implement motifs from some songs to other songs usually by slowing them down greatly or speeding them up. He does this to hint connection of causality in the lore but is not only limited to that effect.
Its not only p5 I am pretty sure it appears in reload too. Full moon full life, and surprisingly heaven, specifically the tune for the lyrics itself. In "revealing doubts from my mind" before the chorus.
Hiding in Public of course, not a problem! I actually have a question about the motif in one of the other songs you mentioned, Butterfly Kiss. I was wondering how the theme of the motif correlated with Tae?
Props to the research and the very well put together video. I rewatch every few months just as a refresher. But also i think it's funny that it's much more likely that the use of the theme was more like: "hey we need an emotional theme that'll get the water works going" "OH gotcha uhhh.... Let's just use Mayas theme! It worked last time"
The Persona games is the first video game where I pay attention to the music. Just watching this video wants me to go back and play all Persona games. It's been months since I beat P5R. And I was fortunate enough to attend the Persona concert at my local convention in Arizona 5 years ago
I remember hearing this leitmotif in a couple P5 songs, but I had no idea it connected to a previous game, especially all the way back to 2. Super cool video dude.
Great video! I'm so glad more people remember P2 (and it's amazing music!!). Just a quick note, however, at 12:08 , you called the group the 'Masquerade', when it should've been the 'Masked Circle'. Maybe it was called that in the original fan translation (if it was, I wouldn't know)? Otherwise, an amazing analysis!!!!
It's referred to as both, I think the ps1 and psp versions have slightly different english translations. But yeah that waa more of a throwaway near the end, Thank you! I'm glad you took the time to watch it
Oh damn wonder what he found that correlates throughout the entire franchises music- "Found the biggest secret in Persona 5s music" M8.... At least you redeemed it with persona 2
The motif actually appears in the ending of p3 and p4s songs as well, but it's a bit too different from the motif wholesale. We didn't want the video to get bogged down or look less tight so we went with the strongest matches only
![Good and Evil in the Persona 5 Soundtrack [Patron Request]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/aWxni7NiQ6M/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for watching! I will try to respond to whatever comments I get as it remains attainable!
PLEASE SHOW THIS TO OTHER PERSONA FANS. Shabu and I worked really hard on this video getting information for over a month and I really don't want to see this video flop.
Persona has grown to mean a lot to me in the past year and I want to see more Persona content succeed.
Check out Shabu's Channel as well! "Shabu, That Music Nerd"
Don’t worry it turned out to be a good vid
I really appreciate this video
It was great and the motif is in "Smile" of P4 around 16 seconds in and it's also in "Heaven" at around 40 seconds. I wonder if there is a song in P3 with the motif as well. If there is that is some crazy dedication to a motif.
ChironTheCuddley I haven’t found the motif in P3’s game OST yet, but in the P3 Movie, there’s “Pure One Heart” where the motif shows up around 16 seconds in, and also a little bit at the beginning of “More Than One Heart.”
@@arkaene At least it showed up in the movie's soundtrack.
Persona and SMT made me realize just how important music is
Oh yeah music really big part of those games
It's amazing how well of a job they have done and continue to do.
@@HidinginPublic hell yeah the mood throughout the match well with scenes
Any SMT games that have strong musical motifs that you would recommend? There are so many SMT games!
@@tonnmiister As long as there's Shoji Meguro all of them are masterpieces
in the 3:20 mark of the full moon full life in persona 3 reload, this motif appears, i think this will forever be an important motif throughout persona
also used in kimi no kioku/memories of you - a lot
and now it's in Metaphor
It’s probably the Japanese ladies singing broken English that gives it the charm
It's good stuff
@@HidinginPublic its amazing stuff
INaizumi Lyn's Engrish is actually kind of sweet, actually.
Although, yeah, the previous broken English was a nice charm of the Persona series up till Lyn stole the show with her snazzy jazzy voice.
it's that GOODSHIT
Japlish music is the best
Music is one of the most fundamental aspects in creating the proper mood and tone for shows, video games, movies, etc. The proper utilization of soundtracks for games can transform a simple game into a work of art. Music is a powerful tool.
The Work Shoji Meguro and Kenichi Tsuchiya did here can't be overstated
snaaaaake eaaaaterrrr
why are you in every comment section ever?
9th count of seeing you on Random TH-cam Videos.
@@junyoKR I have a feeling this account is just several people watching as many videos as they can.
I see Maya on the thumbnail , I click
She's very integral you will see
WHOOPASS TIME!
God, Maya is such an underrated character. P2 as a whole needs more respect.
@@Anna_Leviant facts
Best girl Maya
id normally wouldnt be interested in such a deep dive into music composition but this video was awesome! very concise and easy to follow along. HIDING KUN DOESNT MISSSSSSSS
"Do anyone want me?"
Thank you Tippity! I'm glad you see things that way--
YOOOOOOOOO BRO TIPPITY IS A HIDING FAN LETS GOOOO
Fancy seeing you here Anthony
YO WHATS GOOD TIPPITY
The motif lives on in Metaphor by the way :P
and everyone says that Atlus forgot the Persona 2
When It was right under their nose all along
There are some Easter eggs of persona 2 characters as well
Persona 2 Innocent Sin is still the best written game in the series with the best cast.
I love every game, even the spinoffs, but thats just the gold standard.
@@snakeslife-uroborodjinn790 yeah
Persona 5 is full of call backs to P2 in terms of characters and certain character dynamics, so I'm not surprised this motif is also taken from it as well.
I mean it makes sense, but I was super surprised.
@@HidinginPublic I'm a huge p2 fan and honestly, I noticed "hey Dance of Death" sounds similar to the P5 motif, but I never put it all together until now. And I'm really into music composition so I'm impressed.
They also use the same color: red
I thought it was callbacked more to Persona 1 than any other Persona game really
@@ulty1472 Albeit not originally.
I've been very aware of these coincidences ever since P5 came into existence but it comes from a much deeper level. Just like the mainline Shin Megami Tensei games atlus has been reusing and remixing a lot of their music from the first game to represent a sort of ongoing cohesion between the franchise. And the exact same goes for Persona on which Meguro also was a part of even though he wasnt a major part(we owe him the velvet room theme though). A lot of Persona 1's songs have survived and evolved in one way or another as well as the main theme of the franchise which starts with the 4 iconic notes. Mayas theme has shown up time and time again across all 3 of the newest games in the form of living with determination and I'll face myself. They are both meant to evoke the same feeling of Maya's death and the struggle to live on.
And I just wanted to mention, Persona 5's credit theme The Stars And Us is also a remix of the Shin Megami Tensei 1 credits sequence, in fact. All of the persona credit themes are.
Atlus has been remixing them for over a decade now and you reallly wont notice this stuff unless you're super into their music. I think its wonderful how they've managed to recontextualize everything. Hell even Last Surprise feels like an inverted Persona 2 battle theme. Take Over has that exact same toning as the P2 Battle theme.
Meguro knows what hes doing.
This song is actually also in Persona 3 Spring of Birth with More than One Heart. It’s also in Heaven from Persona 4.
Right! The part "doubts from my mind" is this piece in Heaven! I was playing P4 and P5 in tandem last year and it stuck out like a sore thumb. I was shocked I couldn't find anyone else talking about it.
it is in FES as well, in The Answer
It's very cool they are also used as a transitional motif
It’s also in Persona 3 Reload’s intro, Full Moon Full Life! (and in Persona 4’s Smile)
There's one more thing that links persona 2 to persona 5 and that is the use of red as it principal color
This video is amazing, really easy to follow and left me wanting more XD excellent job dude !
I've noticed that p5 has quite a few callbacks/similarities with p2, especially in royal.
@@lob674 Especially in character designs.
one other thing i dont see mentioned is that in-universe, the event where Maya Dies plays is the sole reason the rest of the series was able to happen, making its recurring appearance throughout the series even better
Innocent sin the only non canon mainline persona game
Was listening to the soundtrack, and found out that this motif also plays during blooming villain, its near the end of the loop!
There are a lot of other places it plays in part or in whoke in p5 but we were trying to be as consise as we could. It will definitely be fun to go through and see where else you can hear it!
which is also why "Regret" contains it, since it's just a "sad" version of "Blooming Villain"
Also kinda in whims of fate! “so we roll the dice”
Putting this here for those who don’t know, but in Beneath the Mask, the “masquerade” being referred to from the story of Red Death by Edgar Allen Poe (hence “Poe’s masquerade”). While I’m not sure how this ties in with P2, I think Arsene fits the description pretty well by design
OxyMoron Arsen is also based of a book. The characters name in the book is Arsen Lupin, he is from book about a thief who steals for sport. The book is called Arsen Lupin: Gentlemen Thief
Lazy Gambit yeah, so I heard. I was referring to how he looks, though; even though it’s (rather obviously) Arsene, he also looks like he could represent Red Death as well
The story of Red Death is actually the basis for the Velvet Room itself; it's the room before the final room in the story.
ßãgl maybe, but we don’t have the madlad Red Death himself yet
p2 Innocent Sin had a famous poem too, included with a classic oldass german song, “der doppelgaenger“, reflecting and forshadowing the theme and ending to P2 IS. Its also present in the opening of the way more atmospheric persona 2 innocent sin ps1 version. And it comes full circle with the dance of death/maya dies theme, which is her sad theme, not the one u hear in the “hero theme“ nor her regular theme. Also Persona had another motif, a leitmotif within the first 3 games (before Shoji Meguro took over aka Persona 3) that is an piano segment u can cleaely hear in the opening of the persona 1/revelation(s) ps1 version.
Great video, I knew Maya's Theme was a legendary track but I never realized how important the track was to the series as a whole
And then Royal doubled down on the P1/P2 references with the new story arc.
Can't wait to see! I'm playing it on stream now!
As a massive fan of the persona series and its music, especially of Innocent Sin's, this brought a huge smile to my face. I always felt that the Persona 2 duology is severely underrated considering most of the modern trilogy archetypes and mechanics seems to be somewhat inspired by what those games did. Glad to see you're bridging the persona community by doing videos like these, Hiding. Was your outro song building up to this video all along?
Thankyou, I'm glad you feel that way. I can't say it was initially. I always felt a particular emotional connection to Maya's theme after first hearing it in FES a few months ago, and the Atsushi Kittajoh rearranged version felt to me exactly what Tsuchiya says in the interview. Like it was representative of me, kind of pushing back against whatever limitations the world had for me, and staying determined that I could eventually succeed with a creative career. I'm a huge junky for persona music so I found the motif, went to shabu and started digging. For about a month and a half or more, when I edit in my outro, yeah, that's definitely what it signifies.
P2 itself cribs much from P1, but otherwise, I see it too.
Yes when i played eternal punishment (thanks to the game being much more difficult than IS Wich means I have to pay attention to the mechanics of the game) i noticed a lot of game designs that makes me feel like it would be the seeds that will be laid down for persona 3
The thing I like about Persona's Music
is that you'll never see it coming
Discoveries around every corner
@@alex-sh5ed im just gonna call you a baby baby baby baby baby
YEAAAAAHHHHH
for not getting a joke
Boo
Wanna know how I know you've never touched a Persona game? You still make this overused 'joke' you found on the internet unironically.
@@alex-sh5ed you can see music if you have synaesthesia
Isn't that the plot of Persona at its most basic?
People standing up to oblivion.
Yeah, and to Tsuchiya the song that has always represented that is Maya's theme
That’s essentially the theme of MOST Shin Megami Tensei games!
Yoooo this turned out great! The editing is super dope. Thanks so much for having me on man it was a lot of fun to research :] It was really interesting doing a deeper dive into a lot of tracks from all over the persona series.
If anyone has any specific or general questions hit me up :] We kept things pretty concise here and I'd love to talk about some of the musical ideas more in-depth for people that want to hear about them
Thanks for working with me again man. You're a great friend.
Maya’s theme is by far my favourite track in the franchise and I love all the different arrangements of it to fit the different moods throughout the game. When listening to Maya’s death I knew there was something familiar about it but had no idea why. Now I know thanks to this video 😂 It was very informative and I appreciate the easy explanations as someone with very little knowledge on music lmao 👌👌
It's my favorite too. Specifically the Atsushi Kitajoh rearranged version connects with me in a way few other songs have been able to. I'm happy it was informative and easy to understand! I want as many people to see this as possible so I would appreciate if you helped me share it if possible. Thanks for taking the time to watch!
I need your profile picture
How can the Persona 5 soundtrack exclusively get better the more you listen to it and learn about it? My god what a masterpiece of an OST
They did a great job
Masterpiece is an understatement, it’s heavenly
I can't believe I am dead and became part of the Persona soundtrack.
Surprises around every corner. Your theme bops btw, hope it's ok if I continue using it as my outro
there is another persona 2 fan
i thought they were just a legend..
Just a rumor...
I've been waiting for this!
Akihiko Goat man
Amazing video, it's mind blowing to me how much thought can go into a game's soundtrack. I really think it shows just how passionate some people in the industry are towards what they do. Even after 2 decades of working on the same series, Meguro & Tsuchiya still cared enough to reflect on past compositions like that. Again, great video Hiding.
It really is mindblowing, I'm glad you agree and see my point. I appreciate it a lot. They did amazing work here
This is a bit old now and some people have pointed out that this motif is also in P3/ FES and P4 as well, But now it's ALSO in P3 Reload in Full Moon Full Life's full version as well apparently
Holy smokes, I was listening to a Persona mix, and realised that Smile from Persona 4 also has this motiff! That's nuts. And I guess Whims of Fate does too, when it says "So we roll the dice", or at least I hear the semblance XD
Now I can't unhear this, fuck
Yup, in Smile its at right about 0:15 if I'm hearing it right.
Okay so hear me out
P5 arena where the phantom thieves fight P2 Joker’s masquerade
I hear you
I want that...
Damnit with your promising rumour!
SHAWKLAN 27 I wish it was even a rumor to begin with lol
Imagine we finally get to learn who Junko's persona was
holy shit its scary how somewhat my thoughts aligned to "Persona 1 and 2" was never forgotten but its been there all along without majority of the people knowing. I didn't know Persona 5 would be somehow connected and I would find out bout one of my fave songs (M. Dies) was there as base.
I love all of Persona's songs from 1-5 (including spin-offs) I'm glad every Persona game that came after the other had a good reference of the past persona games.
Meanwhile SMT 3 Nocturne's OST: ONE MORE GOD REJECTED!!!! I AM THE WORM INSIDE YOU!!!!!
W o r m
*God inside you
*Bug
I had notice small references between from Persona 2 and Persona 5, but i through it was just myself. This wow, it puts another perspective into this connection i notice
The motif is also now in the new P3 remake, in the bridge section of Full Moon Full Life (the extended version) you can hear it in the vocals like twice
This means a lot to me as a persona fan, too.
Persona 2 means the world to me, and I've enjoyed every game in the series.
Thank you for sharing all of this work.
As someone who hyperfixates on the P2 duology on the daily... this actually blew my mind and it's so obvious now that I know what to look for. ...Or is that "hear for"? I would not be surprised if this was intentional given how P5 revived a lot of classic stuff anyway (certain character dynamics, an endgame villain for P5 Vanilla that might as well be Nyarly, the return of old mechanics like Negotiation and the Nuclear element being it's own thing AND seperate from Almighty/Megido - EDIT: Also as someone else mentioned, Royal took the classic references and ran with it like with Biyarky/Byakhee appearing in that Palace in the trailer making me think NYARLY WAS ACTUALLY COMING BACK!!!!).
And even if it wasn't an intentional callback, it's still dope as fuck since it turns an originally morbid and sad motif into a really, REALLY hopeful one. LIke full-on unadulterated "THE POWER OF ANIME AND FRIENDSHIP ARE ON MY SIDE TO SMITE YABBA-DABBA-DOO"-level of hopeful. It also kinda gives me similar vibes to how Ideal and the Real (mostly the End Version) has snippets of Memories of You for some reason.
Regardless, this video has given me an excuse to once again replay the original trilogy. Haven't actually given EP PSP a go before but the English translation is done so might as well. (now, enough rambling out of me lmao)
I noticed a few years ago that Life Will Change and Wake Up Get Up Get Out There are, like, almost exactly the same song just with different lyrics and I love that
It's something Atlus is great at
so basically alpharad's outro is the motif for persona, his favorite JRPG? neato
Pretty gamer
I know almost nothing about Persona 5, but this was still a very interesting video and I'm glad you look positively on it. Due to quarantine, I don't have much friends to contact to tell them to watch this, but I'll try my best to tell people about this video that clearly deserves attention due to the amount of time and effort put into it.
let's not forget that the same jingle is used in both "smile" and "heaven" from Persona 4. Both songs play in emotional moments of the game where characters are pushing through tough situations so it checks out.
As well as the main boss theme in p5 AND the "days of sisters"
Also interesting that you can find those similarities between P2 and P5 as the butterfly also gets a little closer to Joker vs how it's just a background item in Persona 3 and 4.
I just noticed it in the p3r intro and raced back to this vid. Sadly im a little late
*burn my dread intensifies*
of course
Did someone say bread?
burn my bread is all i know of
You joke but Yusuke would be all over music theory if he was given the opportunity to study it as a form of art
One must imagine a game before p3 😢
Another good use of motifs is how tokyo daylight and shido's palace themes are similar, driving the point that Shido's Palace is his vision of Tokyo
That is a good connection. Persona 5s ost has a ton of cool motifs, meguro does a great job
And to add to this:
Freedom and Security is also connected to Tokyo Daylight. The melody is very similar to the vocals of Tokyo Daylight, especially near the beginning of the loop.
Considering when Freedom and Security plays, and what that part of the game stands for, it's not a surprise at all.
insane hearing this in metaphor refantazio
Thanks for making this video. I'm just baffled to know about the relations and if it weren't for you I couldn't have pointed this out.
Persona 2 is very very close to my heart, especially the ost and maya as a character. Might sound childish but it's one game which really helped me in what means to "change your way" during my depression phase. And that's why both Maya and her theme is very close to my heart, I always perceived her theme exactly how you describe it and that's why it's a very important to me.
thanks for making this video.
This video lodged itself into my psyche so deep that nearly 3 years later I still sought it out to share with people
Persona 5’s music changed my fuckin life I swear. It’s the only soundtrack that gets me extremely hyped and emotional. There’s not enough words in the English language to explain how perfect it is.
The beauty of Persona 5 music is that you never see it coming. I wish I could meet the composers and give them the strongest, manliest, most respectful handshake.
Persona 2 is my second favorite persona game and favorite story and characters in any video game. I can't believe I never noticed this video was amazing and shows yet again how important music is to Persona.
Thank you, i'm glad you enjoyed the connections here
funny since one of the names for joker is akira kurusu and jun's surname is kurosu, with both of them being the jokers...
forgot to say jokers japanese va's name is jun fukuyama
@@neognosticismjun and joker connections keep on growing 😭😭😭
P5's Moon Confidant is Mashima, P2 Innocent Sin party member Eikichi's family name is Mashina.
I didn’t know you had another channel. I thought hiding in private was your only content. Good stuff
I've been playing the p3 remake recently and i was curious because a song kept hearing familiar and i didn't know from where, then i discover this videos, tysm
Jokers cult is the masked circle not the mascarade
so basically: play Persona 2
...got it!
Maybe!
The -another version- of Futaba's palace theme also contains the first notes of Swear to my Bones. It's great how everything comes back in Shoji Meguro's work. Persona 3's Memories of You is also scathered all over its OST.
A lot of bits and pieces vet used throughout the soindtracks and it's always cool to see which songs share and where they come from, the one in the video was even crazier than I would have thought though. Meguro does a great job, and yeah memories of you has fingerprints all over p3
So in a way, p5 is the spiritual sequel to p2 directly keeping in with theme to defy fate.
Just in time for that Persona 5 Royal drop. Ever since my exposure on Persona 5, I’ve been addicted to Persona music from some of the earlier works, especially Persona 3
Persona 3's OST is my most go to one tbh. so many bangers
Ah yes, the song that spoiled Persona 2 Innocent Sin for me.
lol yeah I wish they would have been a bit more subtle with the titling lmao
Rip :( But thanks the creators p2 is so incredible game that you can enjoy it even with some spoilers. I tell you it's the best persona game the story, music, characters and themes, what's there not to love? Except the gameplay is a bit outdated, but it's old game so not really that big of a deal.
Personally, I like Eternal Punishment more. While being almost similar to Innocent Sin and despite being a silent protagonist in the game, you can see how positive Maya is in her choice responses.
still a damn good game though
R.C. Beringuela but werent the dungeons in P2 EP more frustrating or feeling a bit stretched out? the Air raid shelter for example
Hey, I found a correlation!
The music's REALLY good in all the games! That has to be thread right!?
Fantastic why hadn't this occured to me. You're right.
@@HidinginPublic See! I'm a genius!
I feel dumb that I never realized that the motif was from Maya Dies because it’s from my favorite game but I’m so excited to think of it like that
Love seeing leitmotifs in anything, but it's especially cool that Persona 5 pulled a somewhat obscure motif from a much older game in the series and turned it into the backbone of its own soundtrack.
Also just nitpicking, but huge props for pronouncing Shoji Meguro's name correctly. Usually no English speaker ever gets it right. Immediately afterwards, you mispronounced Kenichi Tsuchiya's name though. You never need to guess how to pronounce Japanese names; it's almost always going to be third to last syllable has the most stress e.g. KEN - i - chi TSU - chi - ya, not ken - I - chi tsu - CHI - ya.
I am musically pretty much illiterate so seeing how the theme connects to the franchise was really nice!, The editing was top too, keep it up Hiding :)
Thank you so much! I'm glad it was interesting!
This is one of the best videos I have watched recently, thank you. This revelation is amazing
Thqnk you! The kind words are very appreciated
I am back after playing Persona 5 Strikers up to a certain late game boss and their second phase OST.
After listening to it for a bit I began recognizing a chord progression straight out Maya's theme. And then I remembered this video and had to dig it out.
My dude, you are still right. Maya's theme is where it all points back to!
Persona 5 and 2 both have a red colour scheme
The music of this game always makes me wanna dance or kick ass lmao
It's baller
Oh the motif is in persona 4 too! See: Heaven and SMILE
Yes! Also in nevermore, and an inversion in p3's kimi no kioku
Until now I'd thought P5 broke series the trend of final boss themes using part of the game's leitmotif, good to realise it hadn't
A huge thank you to both Hiding and Shabu. This was an amazing video and I look forward to what you both will do. Thank you.
Thank you! I'm glad you took the time to watch it, and that you enjoyed as much as you did
guys its in interstice of time... i mean, obviously right?
parallels between Maya and Aigis...
(the song that plays when you explore the Abyss of Time in The Answer)
Random thing but I'm like 99% sure I've heard the motif in Heaven from Persona 4. Its right around the lyrics "removing doubts from my mind." It would make sense because of the certain character in heaven and how hope would definitely correlate with them. I think this motif is bigger than just 5 and 2 which is crazy to think.
God I love Maya so much
Wow this is a great analysis! I've been playing Persona 4 lately and it's quickly becoming one of my favorite games/series
Thank you! The persona series have quickly become my favorites as well
Great vid, and amazing editing with this new video. The music in the Persona series are always amazing. Persona 3's OST is my personal favorite from the games.
Thank you Reiza! I know you're a pretty big persona fan so I really hope this connected with you!
so unbelievably glad you talked about Persona 2 Innocent Sin
It was necessary to the video's existence :)
Please help ne share this if you can! A lot went into it as you can probably tell
@@HidinginPublic yeah I've been sharing it
Dude this video shows the effort that both of you and Shabu put into this video which makes this video AMAZING!. I'll make sure to come by the stream and share the video, Have a amazing day and continue making great videos in your own way.
Thank you! I'll try to do the best I can! Thanks for always stopping by and supporting me
As a guy who loves both Persona as a game and as a musical project, I have to say that this video blew me away. Both you and Shabu gave me so much more to chew on concerning this game and made me love the music even more. As a musician seeking to expand my musical knowledge, this has been great and having it concern one of my favourite things helps a lot as well. Listening back on the OST, I can hear a lot of variations of the fabled "motif" now. Thanks, guys, great vid! I love the content!
I like this deep dive, and I will like it even more if this does remain a sort of "Franchise motif" across future games as well. I think it's safe to say that was the intent of the composers and directors shared between 2 and 5!
Thank you! I'm glad I made a compelling argument! They did a great job
Thanks for making this video. I can't remember if I commented before, but here are my thoughts: It's a great analysis and I have to say I'm amazed as a Persona fan myself and I really am amazed by the music analysis too
i did not know a SINGLE thing about persona to this day but consider me fully invested now what the hell
fuckin love musical connections like this and my mind is blown have a Good Day Sir
Not to mention that this motif appears in most of the series as well at several points. I'm glad that everyone including the devs agrees Maya's theme and it's many, many versions is the best persona song and the unofficial franchise theme.
Wow! This is such a good analysis, even for a person like me, who has next to no knowledge about musical composition, it was able to make me understand and learn something new! Great job!
I'm glad! I'm also only a beginner when it comes to basic music theory knowledge but Shabu really helped me out
Motifs also have to do greatly with first impressions as they can establish location, character, mood or theme. A motif is the first notes of the ultra instinct awaken theme, if you hear it once you can directly identify it just by the first note alone, another example is the original super mario music of world 1-1 as well as the underground theme. Hearing the motif again reminds you of that first introduction with Mario and the game.
A person who works a lot with Motifs is Toby Fox as he is known to implement motifs from some songs to other songs usually by slowing them down greatly or speeding them up. He does this to hint connection of causality in the lore but is not only limited to that effect.
Its not only p5 I am pretty sure it appears in reload too. Full moon full life, and surprisingly heaven, specifically the tune for the lyrics itself. In "revealing doubts from my mind" before the chorus.
That little motif always stuck out to me, but I never thought it would get THAT deep. Great video and great work! I thoroughly enjoyed that
Thank you, i'm glad! Haopy you watched and maybe found it as interedting as I did/do
Hiding in Public of course, not a problem! I actually have a question about the motif in one of the other songs you mentioned, Butterfly Kiss. I was wondering how the theme of the motif correlated with Tae?
Persona 4's Smile ost also has the motif
P4's Heaven has it as well
Props to the research and the very well put together video.
I rewatch every few months just as a refresher.
But also i think it's funny that it's much more likely that the use of the theme was more like:
"hey we need an emotional theme that'll get the water works going"
"OH gotcha uhhh.... Let's just use Mayas theme! It worked last time"
This video was amazing holy shit, nice job Hiding.
Thanks so much snaps!!
i got into persona from hearing swear to my bones randomly on the end card of a video somewhere and god its so gOod
It is! Super emotional too.
Alpharads outro
Yes, Alpharad's outro
This was fantastically put, I noticed the motif in the separate p5 tracks too, but I never thought of Maya's theme. Great video!
Thanks! Glad it presented something new!
The Persona games is the first video game where I pay attention to the music. Just watching this video wants me to go back and play all Persona games. It's been months since I beat P5R. And I was fortunate enough to attend the Persona concert at my local convention in Arizona 5 years ago
The emotion involved in hearing the connection of this motif that I felt but didn’t know about is immense
I remember hearing this leitmotif in a couple P5 songs, but I had no idea it connected to a previous game, especially all the way back to 2. Super cool video dude.
The healing spring music from Nocturne is just relaxing.
Would have never made this connections. Great video Hiding!
Thank you!
Great video! I'm so glad more people remember P2 (and it's amazing music!!). Just a quick note, however, at 12:08 , you called the group the 'Masquerade', when it should've been the 'Masked Circle'. Maybe it was called that in the original fan translation (if it was, I wouldn't know)? Otherwise, an amazing analysis!!!!
It's referred to as both, I think the ps1 and psp versions have slightly different english translations. But yeah that waa more of a throwaway near the end, Thank you! I'm glad you took the time to watch it
Oh damn wonder what he found that correlates throughout the entire franchises music-
"Found the biggest secret in Persona 5s music"
M8....
At least you redeemed it with persona 2
The motif actually appears in the ending of p3 and p4s songs as well, but it's a bit too different from the motif wholesale. We didn't want the video to get bogged down or look less tight so we went with the strongest matches only