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Honda Africa Twin vs KTM 1090 Adventure R
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ส.ค. 2024
- This comparison is one I think many are making when shopping for a bike of this kind. It is the Honda Africa Twin vs the KTM 1090. I was lucky enough to have the opportunity to ride both before making my buying decision. I am also lucky enough that I have a friend who has one and brought it out for this video.
In this video I'll explain some of the similarities and the differences between these two. Hopefully this comparison will be helpful for those who are maybe on the fence in terms of which one to buy.
Even though I personally went with the KTM 1090 I think we all owe a debt of gratitude to Honda for introducing the Africa Twin. This was at a time when all the manufacturers seemed to continue down the path of bigger and heavier motorcycles. Since Honda took an alternate path it seems all other manufacturers have now responded.
The KTM 1090 I don't think would exist in its current state if it wasn't for the Africa Twin and other manufacturers are responding as well. So thank you Honda for bring out the Africa Twin and thank you KTM for responding so well to it with the KTM 1090 Adventure R.
Hopefully you'll enjoy this ADV motorcycle comparison video Africa Twin vs KTM 1090 Adventure R. I've ridden the KTM more miles than I have the Honda since it is my bike so please keep that in mind as you watch.
I do think this is a fair review though between the honda vs ktm I like both motorcycles.
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Nice to hear a KTM owner give a honest review of both scooter without bias one way or the other. I have a AT DCT and it is great. You mentioned one thing that is a plus for me having come from the age of motorcycling where you did sit into the bike, I like that feel type cockpit. Great video.
Thanks, I will always provide my honest opinion regardless of which bike I currently own. Much of motorcycle purchasing decisions come down to individual preferences about items. So I try to focus on just direct comparisons and making clear what my "opinions" or "personal recommendations" are in case the reasons for those match the person considering the bike.
Some of the over looked features on the AT is in the frame design. I just bought the 2018 Adventure Sports and I am amazed how well this big bike has done in the foothills of Bakersfield with my very limited experience on it (only 140 miles on the odometer and I do have a bit off-road experience with my last bike being a KTM XC-W 300 and a couple KOM races with it ... I will say the AT is much more like a dirt bike than the KTM Adventurer . The frame on the Africa is the dead giveaway 🍻😎
This was a great video, and even though I don't ride off-road, your delivery and dedication to detail and lack of bias is an absolute pleasure to watch.
Thank you for the positive feedback and thank you for watching
Superb video and well comented. Nice to see people like you that can explain things of the two bikes side by side with such transparency and sincerity. Thank you very much and lot of success in your channel.
Thanks for the feedback and for watching!
Slower ,cheaper less maintenance = Honda .Ktm faster, more maintenance ,more suspension ,More money.I am getting old and just want to get there while enjoying the scenery .I would buy the Honda .
dude this is motorcycles - it needed for emotions! If you want chipper and less money what about hondaph.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/BLACK-450x420px.png ?
KTM 1090r is a bit cheaper where I live.
I rarely watch entire reviews, but I did watch yours from beginning to end. Nice clear and detailed review. One thing that is often neglected during reviews is the cost of ownership (maintenance schedule including cost and frequency of valve check, oil change, etc) maybe something to consider for the next review. It can make a big difference more so for those riding 20-30000miles/year. Keep up the good work, you've gained a new subscriber :)
Speedytrip thank you for watching and thank you for the kind words. I'm glad you've decided to subscribe and I hope you enjoy the future videos.
Thank you for taking the time and effort to make this video. I has provided me with things to consider. Great shop too.
Thanks for the compliment on the shop and thanks for watching
Hey!!! Great video!!! Finally some serious rider talking about motorcycles, I am choosing between an Africa or a 1090r so I find this very usefull! Keep the good work!!
Thank you for the compliment and thank you for watch. The decision between those two is a difficult one. If you’re not in a rush to buy hang tight. The next video is actually going to be a 2k mile update on the KTM so may be some additional information to consider.
Great review! Appreciate the unbiased and insightful information
Thank you for watching and I’m glad the unbiased opinion is appreciated. I love my KTM but I can also recognize other great motorcycles from other manufacturers too.
These latest bikes from KTM are magic. They are just so much better than anything else on the market and priced very well. The Africa Twin is a good bike but its like driving a box. It's just not fun. The KTM's are a total blast. They also have good kit where it's needed. Built by folks who know how to ride and know what is important.
Completely disagree (about the driving a box statement). I have owned 7 bikes now since 2015 - and I have never had so much fun on a bike before as I do now on my 2018 Africa Twin Adventure Sport. And I have owned everything from a DR-Z400S (also a very fun bike) all the way up to a 200 hp Suzuki Hayabusa - and everything in between.
Have you even tried the new AT's? Never heard anyone imply that they're boring - unless they haven't tried it themselves. I was one of them; before I actually rode it.
Yes I have a few times. I'll say this, bikes are fun full stop. I find it very hard to judge unless I can ride them side by side. Fortunately, some riding buddies had them. I was able to ride one and then jump on the other. I so wanted to like the AT because of the original. It was freaking sweet. This new one, however, lacks something and I can't put my finger on it. When I jump on the KTM, it is totally different. It just feels right, it sounds right, it moves right and that engine is soooooo fun. Plus, the KTM's have all the right parts in all the right places (just like a good lady).
that at will be driveing for ever and your junk ktm will be in the shop forever
yes dude africa is boring motorcycle on comparison with ktm ))
@@grego10r obviously you've never owned a KTM, bought my wife a 2010 honda crv, after a couple of years we realized it was burning oil, Honda stance is that it's ok for their cars to burn up to 1qt of oil every thousand miles,they wouldn't do anything about it! Great company!
just watched a ---a couple of videos and subscribed--- excellent for a first-time buyer explanations best wishes
Thanks and thanks for watching glad it was helpful.
I traded my 1190 for an Africa Twin. The KTM heat issue was too much. They both have 9.8” of ground clearance. the Africa Twin actually has more travel in the front and the same in the back.
Are you crazy???
my KTM 1050 Adventure has reliability issues
@@panagiotisferentinos9811 must be
Thanks for the video. It is a very good and comprehensive comparison. Excellent work.
You’re welcome thanks for watching
great video keep them going!
Just FYI the 2018 AT has new suspension, more travel .etc and your clutch hand doesn't get tired on the DCT.
Yes and I’m confident that next year KTM, BMW and others will respond. To me this is the best part. Competion amongst manufacturers means we as consumers win! They will continue to push each other forward with ongoing improvements.
I just had my first go on a DCT still not the 2018 but I was surprised and how good it is. Video coming soon on that.
There is one thing that a lot of reviewers don't consider- most of adventure bike owners don't ride even gravel. I work in Honda center and at end of 2017. we made Africa Twin day for new owners (2016-2017 sales) and 70% hadn't ridden gravel even once, only tarmac. So things like off-road tires and knobby foot pegs are just things you don't need for everyday use. Of course it looks more aggressive and good for sales, but do you really need them if your tires wear down after 3000km?
If you are looking straight for off-road bike I would recommend KTM, but if you are novice in off-road or looking more comfortable bike on-road and everyday use- choose Africa with DCT.
That´s a really good review. Thank you!
You’re welcome thank you for watching
Great vid. Very thorough. BTW, I'm always interested in the rear luggage racks on these bikes. My KLR came with a decent OEM luggage rack, which I upgraded with a large aftermarket plate so I can easily strap on waterproof, soft duffel bags. The KLR rack also has downward-facing posts underneath it, so I can use a quick on-quick off bungee luggage solution like Wolfman's Wolf Tail Bag around town or for day-trips. I wonder about the OEM racks on the AT and 1090 in comparison.
Thanks for the compliment. Honestly I don’t use top racks so I’m probably not the best person to comment on this aspect since I prefer to use side cases vs top racks. However I can say the top rack on the KTM is JUNK. It is one of the parts they switched to help bring down costs. So it is a composite and mine has already broken. Now it was due to towing another bike, but not happy with it at all. In fact I have the metal one from the 1290 on order to replace it. I didn’t pay that much attention to this aspect of the Africa Twin so I can’t comment on that one. The tiger 800 oem one is also plastic but seemed to hold up pretty well for what I used it for. Hopefully this was at least somewhat helpful, and maybe other can chime in who use the top rack more.
Great comparator video. I'm presently evaluating options to upgrade from a 2013 KLR. My focus is primarily street riding, but I like the riding position of the Adventure bikes.
CLOWhite, first thanks for watching. Now onto your question about bikes. I’d recommend checking out the Triumph Tiger series. If you’re doing mostly street riding I think this is the best route to go. I have some other videos on the 800 version and overall they are just a great bike and I think a great value for what you get. I only went from the Tiger 800 to the KTM because I’m the opposite I prefer more of the off-road stuff. But for street use I would’ve kept the Tiger. Also the Tiger is still very good off-road if you want to do that, just the KTM is more focused on that. Africa Twin is similar more off-road focused.
Great comparison, thank you. Cross shopping these bikes as I type. You didn’t mention the engine heat issue. Any thoughts there? My Tiger 800xc throws off some noticeable heat.... how would you compare the KTM to your Tiger in that regard?
The KTM definitely runs hotter than the other two. Primarily because it is the only V-Twin of the bunch so the rear cylinder is tucked behind the front cylinder or at least that is what I suspect the cause to be. But definitely far warmer than the other two and you will notice it.
LOL @ that Honda peg. Did they make a mistake and switch it out with the Grom peg?
What's your opinion on linkage suspension vs PDS on adventure bikes?
I am seriously considering an 2019 Africa Twin and upgrading to ohlins suspension.
Very good video. KTM optimizes their motorcycles to get all the performance possible at the expense of higher maintenance and potentially less reliability.
This is what i believe too. Only time will tell about reliability but you definitely have to stay on top of maintenance with the KTM. It does however provide a level of excitement greater than the AF. Like most things it is a trade off and everyone has to decide for themselves what suites their riding style.
@@kdemotorsportsI've followed the maintenance schedule on my KTM 1050 Adventure religiously and I've had many problems with it. oil leaks hydraulic clutch fluid leaks, front disc brakes warping etc
@@motosap7145what year is your ktm 1050 ? Is it used ?
You just made my choice easy! KTM it is
I’ve been extremely pleased with mine. Definitely post back and let me know how you like it.
I will thanks. It was a useful comparison. I did think about the Africa. Gonna try test rides on both
my KTM 1050 Adventure has reliability issues get the Honda
amazing video! Very Nice! I bought this one yesterday!(Africa twin adventure sports) Have a good day!!
We are friend!!!
What's the out-the-door price difference between the KTM 1090 and the Honda Africa Twin?
OTD is hard to say because that’s all negotiable but Honda MSRP $13,499 and KTM MSRP $14,899 both 2018. However initial price isn’t the only consideration. Everything on the KTM will be more expensive. Maintenance and service is definitely higher. For example 600 mile service from the dealer on my KTM was $600. So keep that in mind when shopping. Personally I feel the KTM is worth it because of the confidence I feel on the bike. It is more expensive though no 2 ways about it.
Great video, but work on the headroom. Don't be scared to get in a bit tighter, maybe invest in a wide angle lens that way we can get in a bit more without losing bike shots.
Philip, thanks for the feedback. It is challenging filming alone especially with 2 bikes where I’m moving between them. I know what you’re saying and it is something I’ve been trying to accomplish but again challenging when alone and trying to make the time investment manageable. After all these are videos I try and do in my spare time. But again your feedback is greatly appreciated and thanks for watching. This video in particular I had an audio malfunction, so it is always something. :)
Philip not every video is a motion picture. Save your production advice for independent films not TH-cam motorcycle videos.
No worries I love Motorcycle videos like this and I want every one to succeed in making them! Good luck I'll be watching :)
@dirtbike adventure
But I do appreciate being able to see the whole bike, as well it makes it more visually interesting for people watching (the avg youtube viewer takes 10 seconds to lose interest). Sorry if my comment offended you, these videos have quality content and I want him to keep doing them. I think a bump in stats would encourage to make more.
Guys I’d love hear from you about ktm 1190 adventure r vs Honda twin adventure sport I’m in break mind between booth I’m not tallest rider 5’84 or thanks so much
I can’t weigh in on the 1190 because I haven’t ridden one. I don’t think they’re too different from the 1090 though so most of what I used to compare the 1090 I would expect to apply to the 1190 as well. But hopefully someone who owns or has ridden the 1190 can offer more insight. Thanks for watching.
The KTM will be more fun and ride better getting there but the Honda will make it there and back. My buy would be the Honda....KTMs just are not reliable enough for actual overlanding IMO.
Donsfast I think you're being unfair to KTM, they make soom of the toughest bike out there which is why they win the Paris Dakar race nearly every year recently. Sometimes its hard to change peoples perception of brands as in the US about 15 years ago they got a bad rap. A lot to do with poor dealerships and maintenence.
I can only speak from personal experience, they break down more often than the Japanese big 4, etc. Infact my nephews. KTM 125 is down right now again, sure is nice when it runs but it is less often.
@@danielthompson803 KTM makes great rally bikes for exceptional riders but their consumer bikes are not the most reliable my KTM 1050 Adventure has had many issues
@@motosap7145 I must admit that they do have some quality issues at times but they are worth it.
Link for cruise control?
www.mccruise.com
What height would you have to be to get both feet on the ground with the Africa Twin, i used to have a BMW GS 1200 and could get 1 foot down and toes on the other. Tx
It is more inseam than height. Depends on whether the GS you tried was an adventure or not. The non-adventure is about 30mm taller than the AF (low seat setting) and the GSA is about 32.2mm higher according to specs. So if anything you should be able to reach the ground even more comfortably on the AF with the seat in its low position.
Also depend how much luggage you have, how heavy you are and how soft you have the damping
I have a Africa twin I have a 32 inch inseam without shoes. Unloaded bike with low seat in the low position I can just about flat foot both feet. My heels are less than 1/2 inch off the ground.
Don't know what hes talking about. I had a CBR 1000 RR and had a Triumph daytona both cable clutch, and the resistance was way less than my Monster 1200 with a hydra-clutch.
The difference between the two on a street bike is far different in my opinion than off-road usage. I have since purchased a 790 adventure R and it is a cable too. Is it the end of the world? No. Do I wish it had a hydraulic clutch? Yes. It’s all personal preference though so everyone should try both and make a decision as to what works well for them.
no mention of AT adventure Sports at all?
I haven’t had a chance to ride that one. If the opportunity arises I’ll definitely post a video. Thanks for watching.
Ty
excellent review! and yes, africa twin footpegs is a joke, as well as alu cast mount which breaks easily. BTW they fixed that a bit with new model for 2018, as well as honda put ride by wire throttle, which personally I am not fond off. Anyway I agree, ktm 1090 is here a better value all around motorcycle for sure.
I haven't tried the AT with cable throttle, but my previous bike (2017 Z1000SX) had cable throttle, and I honestly don't notice any difference between the 2018 AT AS and the Z1000SX with regards to throttle feel etc. Feels the same, which surprised me. Plus, you get more rider modes, 7 stage traction control, adjustable engine braking / engine power (why they added the last one I do not know, as 95 bhp is controllable pretty much anywhere).
I actually think you get better feel without it. But it does facilitate electronic cruise control which for me was a big deal since my tiger 800 had it. But like I said in the other comment I think what it does more than anything is offer the mfg the opportunity to really fine tune the power delivery.
ground clearance both bikes has the same 250 mm.
Also.... if it weren’t for the 1190 there likely wouldn’t be an Africa twin😉
Maybe google "Africa twin"....there's more history there than just the last three years....and it's quit interesting also...🧐
Rod Watson yeah we all know about the history. Doesn’t mean Honda had any intentions on updating it until he market competition forced them to. The XR650L was an amazing bike 20 years ago. Yay go Honda 👍
I meant to imply that Honda has been in the AT business for a fair while....I was not trying to imply that I was a fan of how Honda has plied that business strategy over the last twenty something years. Honda has made some amazing motorcycles over the last half century....only to abandon them post haste.....leaving fans scratching their heads.
Rod Watson I agree. I should’ve initially stated the “modern AT” with regards to the KTM
I would like the AT much more if it had a better suspension. The current suspension is terrible. Plus, the forks are complete dog shit with wear/stiction issues. Soft suspension needing a spring/revalve, OK, I could live with that, but the wear/stiction issue is completely unacceptable. I don't know what Honda has in store for the AT, but it needs a completely new set of forks that are much higher quality.
That was restricted to the early models. It's been solved since.
0 to 60 mph they are neck and neck dirt or road .ktm has faster roll-on speed after 70
I think honda were thinking about A2 restriction when they went for 93hp
Bmw get 90hp out of a 800cc in the f800r @8000rpm. Honda goes 1000cc and gains 3hp. Could have been 105hp. Even the ktm790 is 105hp
That bike has a compression ratio of 10:1, that's why the "low" power. However, if you are really going for ADV riding in far locations or countries (South America, Africa, Asia), that compression ratio fits perfectly for the gasoline octanes you can find there.
They were thinking that the less horsepower an engine produces, the less heat it produces (I rode mine in heavy congested traffic and on an extremely hot day yesterday - temps stayed in the middle all the way - never had a bike not get hot in that kind of situation before) and less wear. It's not a weekend bike where you have to take apart the engine afterwards - it's built to last. And the bike is intended for offroad use - more than 100 hp is useless off the pavement.
But if you're not going to go offroad, or don't care about reliability, then I see no reason not to pick up a European / Italian ADV bike.
Victor Jaramillo spot on!
Honda knows what they doing and why.
Regardless what bike you like better. It is another option in ADV market and that's only good for us.
This debate what motorcycle is better and why is never ending in any segment.
R
No ktm.. No party..
With modern electronics the Honda could easily make 115 HP in a "sport" mode and be de-tuned to 100 in off road mode. The bikes are underpowered for serious highway two-up use.
This video is made out of bullshit! So many lies in here.
1) You say that AT doesn't have as much suspension travel as KTM does. THAT IS YOUR BULLSHIT №1 because Africa Twin has actually even bigger suspension travel than the 1090 R. It's 230/220 mm front/rear for Honda vs. 220/220 for KTM. And Africa Twin also got the taller Adventure Sports version with a 252/240 мм of suspensions travel.
2) You say that AT doesn't have as much ground clearance as KTM does. THAT IS YOUR BULLSHIT №2 because actually this bikes has identical ground clearance of 250 mm. AT Adventure Sports has 270 mm by the way.
3) You say that AT has a 89 hp. THAT IS YOUR BULLSHIT №3 because Africa Twin has actually 95 hp. AND you forgot to mention the very important aspect of the engines of this bikes: compression ratios. Honda has very low (by modern standards) compression ratio of 10:1 which makes it's motor understressed and very tolerant to low quality petrol (which is extremely important for serious adventure bikes). While KTM, on the other hand, has very high compression ratio of 13:1, making it's engine quite stressed. And it'll probable puke it's own guts out if you pour a bad fuel in it. That's a very bad for an adventure bike - machine that intended to be ridden in a distant areas and third world countries where low quality fuels are quite common.
4) You said that AT has a cable clutch, and "there's no way around it", THAT IS YOUR BULLSHIT №4 because when buying the Africa Twin rider can choose the DCT version - and than he woudn't need to pull the clutch at all, nor shifting gears with pedal. KTM doesn't have that option.
5) You say that AT has the cable throttle, but it's only true to 2016-2017 models. 2018+ Africa Twins has a throttle by wire.
You also forgot to mention that on the Honda seat height is adjustable, unlike KTM. And you mentioned the difference in stock tires on these bikes, but you forgot to mention that they also have different types oh wheels: AT have a wheels with a tube tires, and KTM has tubeless.
Honda 230 mm - KTM 220 -how can the KTM have more travel.
This is correct and although I said travel in the video, really what I was trying to describe was the difference in characteristics of the suspension. It is hard to get from just looking at the spec sheets. The KTM does have larger diameter forks and the PDS to help with bottoming, but overall the "feel" is just better on the KTM and the way it reacts to large dips, potholes and other variations in the pavement or dirt is far better on the KTM. This can be addressed on the Honda through aftermarket upgrades but the KTM does definitely perform better overall when it comes to suspension both small and larger variations. Thanks for adding the specs though I'm sure others are interested and again my apologies for a statement that didn't accurately describe the characteristics.
Totally agree with what you described, makes total sense (I thought you meant that but still wrote the comment hehe) I already knew that the KTM is far superior in the suspension department, everybody complains that the Honda does not offer a two up solution as stock and that it hops on offroad bumps, not having the proper rebound at high speed. Met a guy and he said the first thing he did was to change the shock because the bike was not liking it at all with his wife and luggage.
I honestly see no real reason for someone like me who likes off-roading and even attempting to jump the pigs ( My 600 Transalp cant dont that, but I do kinda force the limits hehe) to buy the Africa Twin, it simply does not do the job like the KTM does it, and call me crazy people but I really dont think it justifies the price Honda is asking for compared to the KTM.
KTM has the Crashbars, Hidraulic clutch, 4 more litres of fuel,Better suspension, more power, why would I pay Honda 13000 euros when i can get the KTM at 14000 with all those extras, I would have to go way over 14000 to make the Honda like the KTM.
In my opinion the 1090R is the best adventure bike out there and for me at least, there's no discussion otherwise.
Both bikes have warranty , bot bike have problems, but I would take the 1090R hands down.
You goof you did not even know the HP of the AT...
Knowing and remembering exactly at the moment you need to say it in the video are two different things. There is a lot you have to think of while trying to do this. But yes I knew it was a miss so that's why I added the exact number in post-production. :)