I think this looks great! No $100,000 Black lotus. No spending thousands for a deck to compete in a tournament. I love deck-building but to be able to afford a competitive deck, that's what makes me happy. Definitely gonna try this one.
Sir Hamalot Well, not so fast. People will buy and sell decks instead of cards. An excellent looking deck would theoretically sell for a higher price than a bad looking deck. It would be a more chaotic second hand market but there would still be a second hand market for people looking to buy good looking decks for tournaments and such.
This game will be great for sealed deck tournaments. I don't have the time or money to go around buying the perfect cards to construct a deck, but I like sealed deck play. Also, I see nothing wrong with mixing and matching cards to make your own deck with your friends. This game seems very youth-friendly. I like the idea.
isnt every tournament basicly asealed deck tournament? outside of experience with your own personal deck giving you an edge. mixing and matching seems fine for friendly play, again aside from getting getting at your own deck for organized play
Craig X Opaque sleeves will be certainly banned for tournament, and people will probably play only vs players with clear sleeves if they want to play like Garfield want it.
I played Magic when it first came out and then quickly tired of the deckbuilding and metagaming (of all CCGs and LCGs). I love Summoner Wars, with its premade factions, but can never find anyone who wants to play it. KeyForge seems like it might be the perfect combination of these two types of games and something that can pull in people who have no interest in games where someone can buy or otherwise create the perfect deck and stomp you every time. NOW, I think I'll be perfectly willing to grab a stack of my decks and bring my son to a game store and challenge anyone to a KeyForge game, knowing that it's not automatic that I get destroyed in two turns. That King of the Hill at my FLGS may have what he thinks is a killer deck, but he's never played MY deck yet, and my deck might just have the cards that can take his deck down. I totally get that traditional CCG players will despise this model, but they've got their games. No one is taking Magic or Destiny away from them. KeyForge seems like it's for everyone ELSE, which I think is an exponentially larger pool of players. Obviously, actual longterm gameplay remaining fun, and potentially discovering broken combos is still a possibility, but for NOW, this game has got my attention.
true ccg metagaming is fun, but you have to get in deep and stay in deep in the game... which means time and money ,, keyforge looks more accessible just as a regular tabletop where you don't have to get consumed by the card choices/changes
Summoner Wars remains my favorite card game, likewise I can't find people to play with often. I've got 12 of the first summoners and all corresponding Reinforcement packs (which is a solid collection IMO, allowing for some optional deckbuilding), but the base game without deckbuilding it is honestly deep enough.
I hate metagaming in MTG but I do like brewing decks out of it's massive card pool. For anyone who hates the metagaming aspect of Magic: The Gathering, I would highly recommend Drafting. It's a Limited format so everyone starts on an even keel - it's not about who has spent $100s on a competitive deck. The Draft itself is an additional layer of gameplay which you can improve at separately from MTG itself. You'll naturally end up with a different deck playing against different decks each time you draft so each set can be drafted loads of times and still feel fresh. Limited gameplay is also very nuts-and-bolts Creature combat and doesn't require knowledge of the metagame. You can even have an idea about what cards your opponent may have in their deck/hand from the drafting portion. Tl;DR Drafting is the best way to play Magic: The Gathering.
If nothing else, i like the idea of them using new technology to create a card game that was impossible in the past. Im sure some math is involved....algorithms and such, but its innovation with those tools that gets me excited. Hopefully they find a way to balance the decks because we all know when the hardcore crowd gets a hold of anything, they will figure out the exact way to rate decks, while eventually deciding on a meta that could break the game if they dont have a method of tuning the relative power of decks to each other. If anyone can do it, its Garfield.....and Odie.
I think the idea for this is amazing. My wife is my primary gaming partner and she despises deck building. I like that I can just buy some packs and leave it as it to play!
This sounds so crazy! I said it before, and I'll say it again, I think this new option for game developers is going to be the next big thing in the industry. I reckon more designers will use the ability to print custom, formula generated game items (probably cards to start with) to create new mechanics which don't rely on an app or a computer or such like. I'm so excited by this idea!
Yeah I suppose there are - some are quite good too. This takes it a step further in that every deck will also be unique despite the lack of deck building, but I get the feeling that the decks won't be super unique overall. Still, very intrigued
That’s my thoughts too! I’ve to give up Agot and L5R because i don’t have time to stay tuned to the meta and strategy so this could be my come back to card games
Procedurally.. generated.. decks though! This is just mind blowing. How does one even come up with a game concept of which the printing technology to accomplish it didn't even exist for 10 years.. Now THAT'S next level game design!
Why is that so complicated? Just built algorithm on your card and card combination, assign value to them assign restrictions and hope for the best :). I doubt the decks are all balanced an even Richard Garfield doubt that, hence the chain mechanic. Which is kinda brilliant and sneaky at the same time. It's like saying hey guys I know the decks won't be balanced but here's some tools you can use to balance them out yourself 😁
I will eat. This. Up. I like hyper-competitive card games like Magic, but I'm ALSO a sucker for things like Summoner Wars, Epic, etc. Basically if it's a card game, you have my interest already, and the concept here is so cool. I'm pretty sure a secondary market will arise where you can buy the decks with the particular factions/cards that you like the most and that's awesome. Plus the game just drips fun, I already love that style of card game with clear MtG inspirations, I will absolutely love this. Hope it gets released in my country.
I don't think they forget, but the quickest and most broad reaching introduction for Garfield is as the inventor of Magic and the TCG. MTG is much known by a larger spectrum of society than Netrunner (which I play).
The biggest reason I never got very into games like magic and other ccgs, is that I hate buying things blindly. I like the game itself, I also really enjoy deckbuilders. For example I really like the legendary encounter series, you get what's in the box, you know what's in the box and you can still build a deck unique to you for how you feel like playing that game. I really haven't a clue how I feel about this one, definitely will have to try and see
I love deck-building--it's one of my favorite game mechanics--whether it's pre-game deck consturction (MtG--which I started playing back in '93) or in-game (Dominion), so when this game first dropped I paid no mind to it. But now, it's grown on me and I have my first 5 decks (starter box and 3 'singles') coming. I'm getting multiples so I can cover friends who want to try it before they buy any. Several people in my game group are resistant to MtG due to it's cost of entry (basically), Keyforge will all-but eliminate that issue. On the side note, my houses of interest are Shadow, Dis, and Logos.
One important thing mentioned elsewhere about the aspect of competitive play. At a tournament the players will scan the QR code of their deck. The win loss ratio of the different decks will be tracked and the people with the decks that are losing most will be given more "chains" at the start of each game. The game will work to balance itself in real time.
I find it amazing how they can print the decks all with unique combinations, art, names, etc... a real accomplishment just with that! As for the game, I am definitely interested in trying it. I am not so sure if it will quickly lose its luster, though, because I always loved the deck-building aspect of CCGs; for me, that is half the fun. Anyway, I am definitely interested in this and will keep an open mind until I actually get to try it.
Honestly this is the most excited I’ve been for a game in a long time, I definitely want to pick it up and I for sure hope it catches on! It’s taking the old saying “playing the hand you’re dealt” in a literal sense and I can’t wait to see what random crazy shit life deals me
While I'm not sure about THIS game specifically, I LOVE this deck concept. As long as the card design and algorithm balances things somehow... and one deck is not automatically crap vs another deck, this will be a great great thing for me. I hope to see more games / themes / clones of this in the future!! Edit: Oh! And people will be buying decks off each other for hundreds of dollars just to get a deck with a cool name, cool back art, preferred faction combo, etc. Great after-market potential for sure!
I'm willing to give this game a shot, but I'm not fully sold on the every-deck-is-unique model. But as long as the gameplay is fun and there aren't any major balance issues that shouldn't matter. Might be interesting to bring three decks each and try deck knockout, where if your deck loses it gets knocked out and you have to play one of your remaining decks. First to knock out the rest of the other's decks is the winner. Could add another layer of strategy.
Tom, great explanation, i certainly understood a lot more from this review than the last I saw. Going thru the cards made the game more intelligible... the come in exhausted feature is nice, you have to wait and plan. Also the chains feature seems like a "handicapping" mechanism possibly to even out decks/match-ups.
I for one am intrigued by this. Will pick up starter and 2 more decks once it's out. Probably do a friendly mini tournament amongst my close gaming buds
I am simply in awe of the mind of Mr. Garfield. He just keeps creating games where I immediately think "Huh, this is such a fun and at its core simple idea! Why did nobody come up with it before?"
I think my biggest complaint about the business model of the game is that the packs are *completely* blind. Personally, what I would have done is design packaging that has a small window that's enough to see one of the three factions in the deck. You wouldn't know which of that faction's cards are in the deck, and you wouldn't know what the other two factions are, but you also aren't buying completely blind; if there's a faction that you enjoy playing as more often, you can try to get a deck with that faction as one of your three.
This is pretty much what I was thinking, as a customer I prefer that method. The only downside to this is that popular factions would sell out quickly and others would never sell, they would probably have to raise the price point to make up for this. In some ways it also goes against the spirit of try a combination of factions you might not gravitate towards and get better with it.
Regarding people house ruling that you can build your own deck, one minor issue with that which Tom didn’t highlight in his final thoughts comments is that every deck has unique card backs. So if you mix cards from different decks your face down deck won’t have all the same image. So if you throw in exactly one card from some second deck into your primary deck, for instance, then you would immediately know if that particular card was on top of your draw pile and your opponent would immediately know if it was in your hand or draw pile. Of course that’s not enough to stop people from playing that way casually but it is a factor serious players would probably consider before mixing and matching decks.
I have waited a lifetime for something like this. Finally something that removes the deckbuilding, collectible and metagaming aspects from games like this. Obviously balance issues will be one key issue to its success, but this makes me VERY happy.
As someone who played Magic for a loooong time and fell out of it because of the rising price of cards this game interests me a lot. I hope my FLGS will do tournaments where you pay 12 bucks or whatever, get a deck, and then just slug it out with everyone. I think that will be loads of fun.
Love the concept of this - very curious about balance, but apparently there is a system in place. Will not be tempted to get every card but will just bounce a few decks off each other. A 'casual tournament' with everyone opening up their new decks at round 1 sounds like it would be interesting. A kind of draft without drafting. If people really wants to deck-build with this, I guess they could do this at home with sleeved cards? Will there be a valid 2-vs-2 players format for this?
I think you can construct your deck fairly easily, theorically. You pick 3 factions, 12 cards of each and then sleeve those 36 cards with opaque card sleeves. Risk is that this won t be as synergistic than a bought deck because as you said, decks are not full random. Definetilly worth a try.
I like the idea of this game. We'll see how the implementation shakes out. And you know people are still just going to sleeve cards and deckbuild. But draft or sealed deck is my favorite form of MtG anyway, so I don't have a problem with this.
I'm excited for this. I want to get into games like Star Wars: Destiny or Pokemon, but the cost to build a deck to effectively build a deck dissuades me from trying. Definitely seems worth trying.
It's a very interesting idea, but likely not one for me personally. I worry that like booster packs, I'll open it and be entirely underwhelmed and disappointed with what I got. Still, if I've found friends around that enjoy it, and want me to play, I guess the beauty of the system is I can just buy a deck (if said friends don't supply one) and go for it.
Great first impressions as always. The idea in Magic that half of the cards printed are so bad no-one would ever play them always seemed crazy to me, so a card game that has all cards designed to be actually used is intriguing, So many questions though: how can the decks all be balanced? Will they be balanced moving forward? How will they release the decks? Will decks cycle out? How will this game be supported in the future? But early indications (and the fact its a Garfield game) would suggest they have some grand plans. Definitely looking forward to finding out more.
I'm beyond excited for this game. I can't wait to get my hands on it. I love games like Magic and Netrunner, but I share Mr. Garfield's disdain for "muh meta". So many fun cards and decks that never get played because they're not "meta". I hate being forced to be a meta slave if I want to win. This game is tailor made for me.
I wonder how they would handle translation of the game where every deck is unique. It would've been better as a digital game where you can easily change the language of your cards.
This game has built in friction and I love it! 5 Mars cards in your hand but three Shadows cards on the board that can mess up your opponents day? Play Mars to improve your board state OR face melt your opponents next turn by choosing some sneaky Shadow action this turn. Your choice 😈 This is one of those places "Muahahahahaha" would be appropriate.
That sure is an interesting concept! Might grab a deck somewhere especially if I find something with a dragon in its name :=) Hoping to see a review of Ivion that you had an unboxing video of, it's a great card game too and deserves more attention.
Wow, this looks interesting. Anyone who likes playing deck builders but hates having to build the decks, the meta game, or just doesn't have time will be interested in it. Reminded me a bit of Hearthstone as well (at least the 1 pointers). Definitely interesting.
This game is the reason why I love Smash Up and Sentinels of the Multiverse. Other CCGs always turn into meta hunting expensive cards, and complex planning of decks (which I get it, some enjoy). But Smash Up and Sentinels with their forced decks, means you ARE inevitably getting some crappy cards in your deck whether you want to or not. Then the game becomes about making the most of those crappy cards, and thinking how to best make them work with your other tools, plus you can just dive in and start playing right away.
So excited and I cant wait to buy a bunch of decks and play the crap out of it! Im hoping to get a Dis/Shadow/Logos or Mars deck since those seem to be the control factions and so I want in on that!
I am surprised you made a video of this so fast, of all the new games you showed that you can review this was first on the list. I am wondering if this game left that much impression on you that you felt you needed to do a video on it soon. I am really looking forward to the game I actually like the business model, being able to play against anyone deck for $10 is music to my ears. I dont need to have certain cards or factions to enjoy a game. I sure whatever I get will be good enough.
Def seems like the game I'd play, but not really the game my friends would play. They're magic players, but they mainly play to show off that rare card they got and keep talking about how oh-so expensive it is and all that crap. I just want a game where I can get a deck, play the game, and have a good time. Default deck Final War is so fun like this, since you can have so many people playing at once, and it's balanced.
i reccomend Yomi, it's online, it's fairly balanced all decks are premade, and you buy them separately, plus all characters have their quirks and even on high ranked ladder you can literally find every character at almost equal distributions.
The age old question for any new card game is "how do you compete with Magic?" The answer is "You don't." You have to come up with something new. LCG's were a great attempt at this. I was an avid Warhammer: Conquest player and am neck deep in the new Legend of the Five Rings. But that distribution model has it's own pitfalls. This game is a whole new animal. It's not even trying to compete with other card games, It's doing it's own thing. Which is exactly how you make a new mega hit game that can persist for as long as Magic has. The only thing that could screw this up is Fantasy Flight themselves, who have a bit of a reputation of poor support for competitive games and a tendency to abandon games as soon as they start floundering.
A very interesting concept. I really like the idea of having a deck and being stuck with it, and just working out how to play it the best. However, balance is my biggest concern. I can't see how this could be balanced all that well. I don't like the idea of buying a random deck, and then being stuck with one that is subpar and feeling the need to purchase another one in order to have a chance at winning.
This seems like a game I would like to try! **checks multiple OLGS** Looks like it won't be out until "4th quarter 2018", and Amazon is saying 31 December. We'll see if I remember this game by then....
The thing is all you need to do is play the cards in opaque sleeves and you /could/ mix-and-match them. As a Magic Limited player, I want to see the community (or I guess the developers) come up with Limited formats for KeyForge. I mean I am interested as it is but if I can Draft it and/or make a KeyForge cube, I'll be in big-time. KeyForge Deck Constructed is completely against the ethos of the game and will never take-off but Limited could totally be a thing. It could even be pretty economic seeing as the packs/decks are larger. Of course at the end of games you'll want to put all the drafted cards together and divy up the decks among participants somehow.
In the bottom right, the card still says what deck it's originally from, and it definitely would need to be balanced somehow if there were to be a build your own deck format.
Really intrigued by this. I love deck building, but most of the fun of that for me is ruined by net-decking (when people copy the "best" decks from lists online). I've always been intrigued by the possibility of games that eliminate net-decking and this is certainly a unique approach! I also love that I can play with my friends who don't enjoy the deck building component.
Hugh Summoner Wars fan myself. I also cannot find players so I'm hoping this fills that niche! I'm all in. Already preordered the starter game on coolstuff.
The idea of getting a ready made deck that you learn how to get the most out of is interesting, but I can see some fairly major problems. Some decks are just going to be better than others, and although there's the chains system which seems to offer some form of handicapping it feels pretty clunky, what's to stop competitive players buying multiple decks and finding the best one playing with friends, then turn up at the tournament with a busted deck with no handicap because it hasn't been seen before? Can't imagine there can be that much tactical depth in randomly compiled decks anyway, they can't print cards with effects that are too specific, because in the vast majority of lists they would be worthless. So either every deck is basically a tempo deck or else some decks that hit their synergies will be waaay stronger than others.
I like precons. I absolutely love mtg precon wars even though they're not on the same power level. With your explanation, this seems to be close to mtg in spirit.I would love to play an online version of this (I dont think thats an option but who knows, if the game is successful enough they might have something to appease the online only gamers).
So you can't customize your decks? You have to play with the random deck you buy? So you pretty much have to keep buying a ton of decks that have good cards and fits your play style.
The idea of this is antithetical to my interests, but it seems like the people who are excited by it are very excited. I might be a little more sold on the concept if more cards than you needed for a deck came in the randomized box so that some small amount of fixing could happen between games, but honestly the appeal in CCGs for me comes from the idea of beating someone with the same cards in a different way. This is the first iteration of an idea that might have merit in the future, and sure, I'll probably buy a pack or two, but how many roguelite games have hit Steam in the past few years, and how many in retrospect actually used the power of total randomization to its fullest? I think it'll be a few years yet before we get the Dead Cells equivalent of this concept.
Sounds great to me. This sounds like a card game I could actually play. Don't have the time or desire to chase down the greatest cards and deck combos to be competitive.
I agree completely with all your points in this video. The deck building in Magic and other games like it have yielded winning decks that people can build if they have the money for it and for those who don't have the money decks that are unbeatable. Pay to win. Hopefully this style card game will alleviate the pay to win nature of the CCG industry. Also there are no secondary sales of cards, which the game developers don't get any part of that, CCG's have revolved around, all the money will be going to FFG since the cards will have no resell value.
Just sleeve all the cards, and BAM. Constructed decks, like any other tcg. There are sure to be unofficial fan-made constructed formats by the playerbase.
when magic first came out, the random booster packs was a huge negative. easily half the people I showed the game to loved the idea, until the random booster packs came into the picture. then they where out, as it was just to costly for them, and they could open crap for thier color.
Deokiev well no point being troll fodder over symantics. The jist of what i was trying to say was i dont like chasing rares in packs that dont have content list on the back. Neuroshima hex may not have army "deck building" but you are buying "decks" which u draw blindly from. Its not a miniture game and i doubt you would call it carcasonne advance. My 2c.
As far as this game goes. I think the mechanics is very lacking. There is too little going on. Idk maybe its best magic killer ever and id have to eat my hat for being sceptical.
I love how when people mention Richard Garfield, they say creator of Magic and Android etc. Dude created SW TCG, one of the best TCG game of all time, WoTC crashed it, then IDC took the game, and still today are making cards better then WoTC ever did. Thank you, mr. Garfield for creating such a beautiful and underrated game. For those who are insterested in the game, head over to this link, the game is free to play, you just print your cards and that's it. There are 20+ expansions, so you don't need WoTC cards. swtcgidc.wordpress.com/
Whaaaaat there is negativity on the INET? Shocker :). Dont get why people always have to be upset about something new? Dont like the concept? Well move along, there are 100000000 of other games or play magic ;). I love the fact that i dont have to deckbuild, because most people dont deckbuild anyway if you think about it. They look it up what the best deck is and use it, so whats the diffrents?
uhmmm way to see only what you want to see man, you know that his statement about most people not building decks and just copying the from the internet is massively true. Also Zendikar proved mirror matches not to be as "skill testing" as pros make them to be, you get goblin guide or stoneforge mystic before your opponent does? congratulations! you win the game in a glorified coin flip! .
My question would be the depth of the experience of gameplay and uniqueness per deck. If you bought 12 decks, would each game play and style be totally different or eventually there will be some set way to play that would be optimized based on the houses you got? Also with the ability to play online they can then gather the data and build expansions or cards to balance the game further. Looks very interesting.
It seems as if each faction has it's own style, so only the decks with the same 3 factions would play similarly, which I imagine can be diminished if new sets introduce new factions, thus increasing the amount of combinations of factions in the game. Even then though, it seems like there is even good variety between cards in a faction, especially for a game that's only on it's base set. I dare say that the decks will be quite unique for quite a while, though who knows, maybe I'll be completely wrong.
I can't wait to have this UCG format applied to other franchises like Star Wars, Arkham Horror, Android, Game of Thrones and everything FFG got! Why not, huh?
I want to know what Jason thinks about this game. As a game collector, if he likes this game as much as e.g. SW Destiny, will he buy as much decks as possible? Or 32 unique combinations? He can't have all content.
The main issue with games like this is that pros will figure out the top 5 decks, empirically speaking. It is impossible for smart gamers to not figure out optimal strategies. Once that happens, then we will see if the core gameplay is fun to keep.people hooked.
There will really be 2 options long term A. The Best players are the best because they found the God Deck and didn't sell it Or B. The best players are the best because they play well, so they will intentionally start with a lower power deck so that the opponents have chains starting the match, ruining the opponents draw potential for a long time.
The marketing concept behind a collectible non-deckbuilder feels very awkward. It makes me think that expanding the game will be difficult since it will lead to a ton of bloat and diminishes any real value for rarity of cards since the entire deck has to be sold or traded as a whole.
Easy.. old decks just become obsolete, because new nådecks can be better. Then there can be a set where there only Are very few good decks and that set sell badly, so the next set has ro be better to compensate so that it will sell well... that automativåcally leads to powercreep where every new set of keyforge has ro be an average more powerfull than the previous, or it does not sell. If you have a strong old deck, it can be ok for some sets, but eventually it will get outgunned. Interesting consept!
I find this game very interesting. But I wonder what happens if for example a single card out of a unique deck gets broken? Will there ever be the chance to get it replaced or is the whole deck lost then? Playing unsleeved might be a bad idea...
the deck comes with an Identity card that has the name of the Archon and a decklist, they'll probably allow a proxy or using the same card from a different archon as long as it is in your Archon's decklist.
J W - No offense, but you are wrong, at least with my own experiences. I have bought 11 total so far. Going to give 4 to my son and I will hog the rest. I love the idea of working with a deck to get to know it, playing it and using its strengths and trying to work around its weakness. For $8 a deck, why not?
After playing this game for an evening, my prediction is: the concept of casual unique decks will stand, the gameplay is not good enough, some new game will come in the future that uses this same concept with a different gameplay and that game will win it all. But not this game. I speak as a seasoned MtG, YuGiOh!, Force of Will player whose favourite VS card game is Ashes (just to give some background).
Ah, right you are. Though I wonder if the order will matter for the deck-building algorithm. Is it possible that they could generate 2 decks with the same 36 cards, with the only difference that the houses are arranged in a different order on the card backs?
![[UNCUT]"ตุลามรณะ"ย้อนฟังคำทำนาย หมอดูทุกสาย ดวงเมืองร้อน (หมอปลาย ฟองสนาน อ.โอเล่)I คนดังนั่งเคลียร์](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/lE5az5VvT9M/mqdefault.jpg)
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 82 วันนี้!! คู่เอก | ยอดไอคิว vs อับดัลลาห์](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hSsyTl_9bqs/mqdefault.jpg)
I think this looks great!
No $100,000 Black lotus.
No spending thousands for a deck to compete in a tournament.
I love deck-building but to be able to afford a competitive deck, that's what makes me happy.
Definitely gonna try this one.
Sir Hamalot Well, not so fast. People will buy and sell decks instead of cards. An excellent looking deck would theoretically sell for a higher price than a bad looking deck. It would be a more chaotic second hand market but there would still be a second hand market for people looking to buy good looking decks for tournaments and such.
This game will be great for sealed deck tournaments. I don't have the time or money to go around buying the perfect cards to construct a deck, but I like sealed deck play. Also, I see nothing wrong with mixing and matching cards to make your own deck with your friends. This game seems very youth-friendly. I like the idea.
sealed deck tournaments... makes sense
I was thinking the same thing. As someone who plays mtg almost exclusively in limited formats this is quite appealing.
isnt every tournament basicly asealed deck tournament? outside of experience with your own personal deck giving you an edge.
mixing and matching seems fine for friendly play, again aside from getting getting at your own deck for organized play
Craig X Opaque sleeves will be certainly banned for tournament, and people will probably play only vs players with clear sleeves if they want to play like Garfield want it.
@Craig X unique deck name is written both at the front n back of the cards right?
I played Magic when it first came out and then quickly tired of the deckbuilding and metagaming (of all CCGs and LCGs). I love Summoner Wars, with its premade factions, but can never find anyone who wants to play it. KeyForge seems like it might be the perfect combination of these two types of games and something that can pull in people who have no interest in games where someone can buy or otherwise create the perfect deck and stomp you every time. NOW, I think I'll be perfectly willing to grab a stack of my decks and bring my son to a game store and challenge anyone to a KeyForge game, knowing that it's not automatic that I get destroyed in two turns. That King of the Hill at my FLGS may have what he thinks is a killer deck, but he's never played MY deck yet, and my deck might just have the cards that can take his deck down. I totally get that traditional CCG players will despise this model, but they've got their games. No one is taking Magic or Destiny away from them. KeyForge seems like it's for everyone ELSE, which I think is an exponentially larger pool of players. Obviously, actual longterm gameplay remaining fun, and potentially discovering broken combos is still a possibility, but for NOW, this game has got my attention.
Well played.
true ccg metagaming is fun, but you have to get in deep and stay in deep in the game... which means time and money ,, keyforge looks more accessible just as a regular tabletop where you don't have to get consumed by the card choices/changes
Summoner Wars remains my favorite card game, likewise I can't find people to play with often. I've got 12 of the first summoners and all corresponding Reinforcement packs (which is a solid collection IMO, allowing for some optional deckbuilding), but the base game without deckbuilding it is honestly deep enough.
I have everything for summoner wars save the alternative summoner arts(i have one) and the dices.
I hate metagaming in MTG but I do like brewing decks out of it's massive card pool.
For anyone who hates the metagaming aspect of Magic: The Gathering, I would highly recommend Drafting. It's a Limited format so everyone starts on an even keel - it's not about who has spent $100s on a competitive deck. The Draft itself is an additional layer of gameplay which you can improve at separately from MTG itself. You'll naturally end up with a different deck playing against different decks each time you draft so each set can be drafted loads of times and still feel fresh. Limited gameplay is also very nuts-and-bolts Creature combat and doesn't require knowledge of the metagame. You can even have an idea about what cards your opponent may have in their deck/hand from the drafting portion.
Tl;DR Drafting is the best way to play Magic: The Gathering.
If nothing else, i like the idea of them using new technology to create a card game that was impossible in the past. Im sure some math is involved....algorithms and such, but its innovation with those tools that gets me excited. Hopefully they find a way to balance the decks because we all know when the hardcore crowd gets a hold of anything, they will figure out the exact way to rate decks, while eventually deciding on a meta that could break the game if they dont have a method of tuning the relative power of decks to each other.
If anyone can do it, its Garfield.....and Odie.
I think the idea for this is amazing. My wife is my primary gaming partner and she despises deck building. I like that I can just buy some packs and leave it as it to play!
def. innovative, and success or not, likely to spawn other such "unique" tabletop experiences.
This sounds so crazy! I said it before, and I'll say it again, I think this new option for game developers is going to be the next big thing in the industry. I reckon more designers will use the ability to print custom, formula generated game items (probably cards to start with) to create new mechanics which don't rely on an app or a computer or such like. I'm so excited by this idea!
I love the idea of deck construction, but find that I don't have the time for it. So in some ways, I'm excited about the concept here.
Yeah I suppose there are - some are quite good too. This takes it a step further in that every deck will also be unique despite the lack of deck building, but I get the feeling that the decks won't be super unique overall. Still, very intrigued
That’s my thoughts too! I’ve to give up Agot and L5R because i don’t have time to stay tuned to the meta and strategy so this could be my come back to card games
Played my first hand of this at my FLGS today... LOVED IT!
Can't wait for it to hit the market!
I haven't been this excited for a physical game since the (re)launch of Legend Of The Five Rings last year!
Procedurally.. generated.. decks though! This is just mind blowing. How does one even come up with a game concept of which the printing technology to accomplish it didn't even exist for 10 years.. Now THAT'S next level game design!
Most likely the've hired a mathematician, another mathematician, a statistician and a mathematician XD
Why is that so complicated? Just built algorithm on your card and card combination, assign value to them assign restrictions and hope for the best :). I doubt the decks are all balanced an even Richard Garfield doubt that, hence the chain mechanic. Which is kinda brilliant and sneaky at the same time. It's like saying hey guys I know the decks won't be balanced but here's some tools you can use to balance them out yourself 😁
Thanks for the fast video on this. I was really interested in this and after watching this I'm really pumped!
I will eat. This. Up. I like hyper-competitive card games like Magic, but I'm ALSO a sucker for things like Summoner Wars, Epic, etc. Basically if it's a card game, you have my interest already, and the concept here is so cool. I'm pretty sure a secondary market will arise where you can buy the decks with the particular factions/cards that you like the most and that's awesome. Plus the game just drips fun, I already love that style of card game with clear MtG inspirations, I will absolutely love this. Hope it gets released in my country.
Everyone singing Garfields praises forgets to mention Netrunner. Garfield himself says thats his best game.
RIP Netrunner
Netrunner is best game. Maybe this will beat it.
I don't think they forget, but the quickest and most broad reaching introduction for Garfield is as the inventor of Magic and the TCG. MTG is much known by a larger spectrum of society than Netrunner (which I play).
Netrunner❤️❤️❤️!!!
Cyber Poker.
It may be coming back. FFG did post a teaser on their twitter.
After watching many videos for this game, I am definitely going to pick up a few decks
The biggest reason I never got very into games like magic and other ccgs, is that I hate buying things blindly. I like the game itself, I also really enjoy deckbuilders. For example I really like the legendary encounter series, you get what's in the box, you know what's in the box and you can still build a deck unique to you for how you feel like playing that game. I really haven't a clue how I feel about this one, definitely will have to try and see
I'm very interested in this game, and you satisfied and piqued my curiosity. Thanks for the coverage!
I love deck-building--it's one of my favorite game mechanics--whether it's pre-game deck consturction (MtG--which I started playing back in '93) or in-game (Dominion), so when this game first dropped I paid no mind to it. But now, it's grown on me and I have my first 5 decks (starter box and 3 'singles') coming. I'm getting multiples so I can cover friends who want to try it before they buy any. Several people in my game group are resistant to MtG due to it's cost of entry (basically), Keyforge will all-but eliminate that issue.
On the side note, my houses of interest are Shadow, Dis, and Logos.
I'm very excited about the idea. I think it's a great concept to have prebuilt decks, plus I love the sci-fi/ fantasy combination theme.
I LOVE this concept, and everything about it! I WANT IT NOW!!!
This sounds really intriguing. Thanks for explaining your first impressions so clearly Tom.
One important thing mentioned elsewhere about the aspect of competitive play. At a tournament the players will scan the QR code of their deck. The win loss ratio of the different decks will be tracked and the people with the decks that are losing most will be given more "chains" at the start of each game. The game will work to balance itself in real time.
I find it amazing how they can print the decks all with unique combinations, art, names, etc... a real accomplishment just with that! As for the game, I am definitely interested in trying it. I am not so sure if it will quickly lose its luster, though, because I always loved the deck-building aspect of CCGs; for me, that is half the fun. Anyway, I am definitely interested in this and will keep an open mind until I actually get to try it.
Honestly this is the most excited I’ve been for a game in a long time, I definitely want to pick it up and I for sure hope it catches on! It’s taking the old saying “playing the hand you’re dealt” in a literal sense and I can’t wait to see what random crazy shit life deals me
While I'm not sure about THIS game specifically, I LOVE this deck concept. As long as the card design and algorithm balances things somehow... and one deck is not automatically crap vs another deck, this will be a great great thing for me. I hope to see more games / themes / clones of this in the future!! Edit: Oh! And people will be buying decks off each other for hundreds of dollars just to get a deck with a cool name, cool back art, preferred faction combo, etc. Great after-market potential for sure!
I'm willing to give this game a shot, but I'm not fully sold on the every-deck-is-unique model. But as long as the gameplay is fun and there aren't any major balance issues that shouldn't matter. Might be interesting to bring three decks each and try deck knockout, where if your deck loses it gets knocked out and you have to play one of your remaining decks. First to knock out the rest of the other's decks is the winner. Could add another layer of strategy.
Tom, great explanation, i certainly understood a lot more from this review than the last I saw. Going thru the cards made the game more intelligible... the come in exhausted feature is nice, you have to wait and plan. Also the chains feature seems like a "handicapping" mechanism possibly to even out decks/match-ups.
I for one am intrigued by this. Will pick up starter and 2 more decks once it's out. Probably do a friendly mini tournament amongst my close gaming buds
Gosh this looks SO cool!
It's a great concept. If you want a deck building game, good news, there's several available.
I am down to do some Keyforgin'!
I am simply in awe of the mind of Mr. Garfield.
He just keeps creating games where I immediately think "Huh, this is such a fun and at its core simple idea! Why did nobody come up with it before?"
I think my biggest complaint about the business model of the game is that the packs are *completely* blind. Personally, what I would have done is design packaging that has a small window that's enough to see one of the three factions in the deck. You wouldn't know which of that faction's cards are in the deck, and you wouldn't know what the other two factions are, but you also aren't buying completely blind; if there's a faction that you enjoy playing as more often, you can try to get a deck with that faction as one of your three.
This is pretty much what I was thinking, as a customer I prefer that method. The only downside to this is that popular factions would sell out quickly and others would never sell, they would probably have to raise the price point to make up for this. In some ways it also goes against the spirit of try a combination of factions you might not gravitate towards and get better with it.
Packs are completely blind in every CCG. No different here. I will say it again, I really like this concept.
Loved the prelaunch event and I’ve enjoyed playing. It’s a cracking game.
Regarding people house ruling that you can build your own deck, one minor issue with that which Tom didn’t highlight in his final thoughts comments is that every deck has unique card backs. So if you mix cards from different decks your face down deck won’t have all the same image. So if you throw in exactly one card from some second deck into your primary deck, for instance, then you would immediately know if that particular card was on top of your draw pile and your opponent would immediately know if it was in your hand or draw pile.
Of course that’s not enough to stop people from playing that way casually but it is a factor serious players would probably consider before mixing and matching decks.
I have waited a lifetime for something like this. Finally something that removes the deckbuilding, collectible and metagaming aspects from games like this. Obviously balance issues will be one key issue to its success, but this makes me VERY happy.
As someone who played Magic for a loooong time and fell out of it because of the rising price of cards this game interests me a lot. I hope my FLGS will do tournaments where you pay 12 bucks or whatever, get a deck, and then just slug it out with everyone. I think that will be loads of fun.
I am extremely interested in this game. I love limited formats and this sounds like it could be right up my alley!
Love the concept of this - very curious about balance, but apparently there is a system in place. Will not be tempted to get every card but will just bounce a few decks off each other. A 'casual tournament' with everyone opening up their new decks at round 1 sounds like it would be interesting. A kind of draft without drafting. If people really wants to deck-build with this, I guess they could do this at home with sleeved cards? Will there be a valid 2-vs-2 players format for this?
I think you can construct your deck fairly easily, theorically. You pick 3 factions, 12 cards of each and then sleeve those 36 cards with opaque card sleeves. Risk is that this won t be as synergistic than a bought deck because as you said, decks are not full random. Definetilly worth a try.
I like the mechanics of this game! great mix of options!
I like the idea of this game. We'll see how the implementation shakes out. And you know people are still just going to sleeve cards and deckbuild. But draft or sealed deck is my favorite form of MtG anyway, so I don't have a problem with this.
I'm excited for this. I want to get into games like Star Wars: Destiny or Pokemon, but the cost to build a deck to effectively build a deck dissuades me from trying. Definitely seems worth trying.
It's a very interesting idea, but likely not one for me personally. I worry that like booster packs, I'll open it and be entirely underwhelmed and disappointed with what I got. Still, if I've found friends around that enjoy it, and want me to play, I guess the beauty of the system is I can just buy a deck (if said friends don't supply one) and go for it.
Great first impressions as always. The idea in Magic that half of the cards printed are so bad no-one would ever play them always seemed crazy to me, so a card game that has all cards designed to be actually used is intriguing, So many questions though: how can the decks all be balanced? Will they be balanced moving forward? How will they release the decks? Will decks cycle out? How will this game be supported in the future? But early indications (and the fact its a Garfield game) would suggest they have some grand plans. Definitely looking forward to finding out more.
Keyforge feels like it was made just for me. Gonna be amazing.
I'm beyond excited for this game. I can't wait to get my hands on it. I love games like Magic and Netrunner, but I share Mr. Garfield's disdain for "muh meta". So many fun cards and decks that never get played because they're not "meta". I hate being forced to be a meta slave if I want to win. This game is tailor made for me.
I wonder how they would handle translation of the game where every deck is unique.
It would've been better as a digital game where you can easily change the language of your cards.
This game has built in friction and I love it! 5 Mars cards in your hand but three Shadows cards on the board that can mess up your opponents day? Play Mars to improve your board state OR face melt your opponents next turn by choosing some sneaky Shadow action this turn. Your choice 😈 This is one of those places "Muahahahahaha" would be appropriate.
I love the concept of this game, it's going to drive "collectors" bonkers because you simply can't have everything. I'm looking forward to it a bunch.
That sure is an interesting concept! Might grab a deck somewhere especially if I find something with a dragon in its name :=)
Hoping to see a review of Ivion that you had an unboxing video of, it's a great card game too and deserves more attention.
Wow, this looks interesting. Anyone who likes playing deck builders but hates having to build the decks, the meta game, or just doesn't have time will be interested in it. Reminded me a bit of Hearthstone as well (at least the 1 pointers). Definitely interesting.
This game is the reason why I love Smash Up and Sentinels of the Multiverse. Other CCGs always turn into meta hunting expensive cards, and complex planning of decks (which I get it, some enjoy). But Smash Up and Sentinels with their forced decks, means you ARE inevitably getting some crappy cards in your deck whether you want to or not. Then the game becomes about making the most of those crappy cards, and thinking how to best make them work with your other tools, plus you can just dive in and start playing right away.
So excited and I cant wait to buy a bunch of decks and play the crap out of it! Im hoping to get a Dis/Shadow/Logos or Mars deck since those seem to be the control factions and so I want in on that!
I am surprised you made a video of this so fast, of all the new games you showed that you can review this was first on the list. I am wondering if this game left that much impression on you that you felt you needed to do a video on it soon. I am really looking forward to the game I actually like the business model, being able to play against anyone deck for $10 is music to my ears. I dont need to have certain cards or factions to enjoy a game. I sure whatever I get will be good enough.
the $10 entry is definitely attractive in this world of $100 games
Wow this game sounds amazing, the unique decks!!!! Cannot wait for december. Why was this gen-con pre-release so early!
Def seems like the game I'd play, but not really the game my friends would play. They're magic players, but they mainly play to show off that rare card they got and keep talking about how oh-so expensive it is and all that crap. I just want a game where I can get a deck, play the game, and have a good time. Default deck Final War is so fun like this, since you can have so many people playing at once, and it's balanced.
You seem to have lame friends if that is the reason they play.
i reccomend Yomi, it's online, it's fairly balanced all decks are premade, and you buy them separately, plus all characters have their quirks and even on high ranked ladder you can literally find every character at almost equal distributions.
The age old question for any new card game is "how do you compete with Magic?" The answer is "You don't." You have to come up with something new. LCG's were a great attempt at this. I was an avid Warhammer: Conquest player and am neck deep in the new Legend of the Five Rings. But that distribution model has it's own pitfalls.
This game is a whole new animal. It's not even trying to compete with other card games, It's doing it's own thing. Which is exactly how you make a new mega hit game that can persist for as long as Magic has. The only thing that could screw this up is Fantasy Flight themselves, who have a bit of a reputation of poor support for competitive games and a tendency to abandon games as soon as they start floundering.
A very interesting concept. I really like the idea of having a deck and being stuck with it, and just working out how to play it the best. However, balance is my biggest concern. I can't see how this could be balanced all that well. I don't like the idea of buying a random deck, and then being stuck with one that is subpar and feeling the need to purchase another one in order to have a chance at winning.
This seems like a game I would like to try!
**checks multiple OLGS**
Looks like it won't be out until "4th quarter 2018", and Amazon is saying 31 December. We'll see if I remember this game by then....
It's like someone turned Smash Up into a real competitive game.
The thing is all you need to do is play the cards in opaque sleeves and you /could/ mix-and-match them. As a Magic Limited player, I want to see the community (or I guess the developers) come up with Limited formats for KeyForge. I mean I am interested as it is but if I can Draft it and/or make a KeyForge cube, I'll be in big-time.
KeyForge Deck Constructed is completely against the ethos of the game and will never take-off but Limited could totally be a thing. It could even be pretty economic seeing as the packs/decks are larger. Of course at the end of games you'll want to put all the drafted cards together and divy up the decks among participants somehow.
In the bottom right, the card still says what deck it's originally from, and it definitely would need to be balanced somehow if there were to be a build your own deck format.
Really intrigued by this. I love deck building, but most of the fun of that for me is ruined by net-decking (when people copy the "best" decks from lists online). I've always been intrigued by the possibility of games that eliminate net-decking and this is certainly a unique approach! I also love that I can play with my friends who don't enjoy the deck building component.
Hugh Summoner Wars fan myself. I also cannot find players so I'm hoping this fills that niche! I'm all in. Already preordered the starter game on coolstuff.
The idea of getting a ready made deck that you learn how to get the most out of is interesting, but I can see some fairly major problems.
Some decks are just going to be better than others, and although there's the chains system which seems to offer some form of handicapping it feels pretty clunky, what's to stop competitive players buying multiple decks and finding the best one playing with friends, then turn up at the tournament with a busted deck with no handicap because it hasn't been seen before?
Can't imagine there can be that much tactical depth in randomly compiled decks anyway, they can't print cards with effects that are too specific, because in the vast majority of lists they would be worthless.
So either every deck is basically a tempo deck or else some decks that hit their synergies will be waaay stronger than others.
I like precons. I absolutely love mtg precon wars even though they're not on the same power level. With your explanation, this seems to be close to mtg in spirit.I would love to play an online version of this (I dont think thats an option but who knows, if the game is successful enough they might have something to appease the online only gamers).
So you can't customize your decks? You have to play with the random deck you buy? So you pretty much have to keep buying a ton of decks that have good cards and fits your play style.
You change your play style. "Don't try to change the Crucible to fit your needs. Let it change you."
The idea of this is antithetical to my interests, but it seems like the people who are excited by it are very excited. I might be a little more sold on the concept if more cards than you needed for a deck came in the randomized box so that some small amount of fixing could happen between games, but honestly the appeal in CCGs for me comes from the idea of beating someone with the same cards in a different way.
This is the first iteration of an idea that might have merit in the future, and sure, I'll probably buy a pack or two, but how many roguelite games have hit Steam in the past few years, and how many in retrospect actually used the power of total randomization to its fullest? I think it'll be a few years yet before we get the Dead Cells equivalent of this concept.
Sounds great to me. This sounds like a card game I could actually play. Don't have the time or desire to chase down the greatest cards and deck combos to be competitive.
I’m excited for this.
I agree completely with all your points in this video. The deck building in Magic and other games like it have yielded winning decks that people can build if they have the money for it and for those who don't have the money decks that are unbeatable. Pay to win. Hopefully this style card game will alleviate the pay to win nature of the CCG industry. Also there are no secondary sales of cards, which the game developers don't get any part of that, CCG's have revolved around, all the money will be going to FFG since the cards will have no resell value.
Just sleeve all the cards, and BAM.
Constructed decks, like any other tcg. There are sure to be unofficial fan-made constructed formats by the playerbase.
You can't sleeve it there is name of deck on front as well.
The sleeves prevent marking the cards facedown in your deck, the front doesn't matter really if you are agreeing to play that way
Yeah you are right but it can be seen on front which will ruin then experience even further, in any case playing constructed is stupid.
when magic first came out, the random booster packs was a huge negative. easily half the people I showed the game to loved the idea, until the random booster packs came into the picture. then they where out, as it was just to costly for them, and they could open crap for thier color.
Wait, did you just call Neuroshima Hex an LCG?
You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means.
Do anyone actually mix up factions in Neuroshima Hex? I thought most people played just what came with one preconfigured faction?
Deokiev well no point being troll fodder over symantics. The jist of what i was trying to say was i dont like chasing rares in packs that dont have content list on the back. Neuroshima hex may not have army "deck building" but you are buying "decks" which u draw blindly from. Its not a miniture game and i doubt you would call it carcasonne advance. My 2c.
As far as this game goes. I think the mechanics is very lacking. There is too little going on. Idk maybe its best magic killer ever and id have to eat my hat for being sceptical.
Heard about this game yesterday, watched a couple of vids today.. bought two packs.
I love how when people mention Richard Garfield, they say creator of Magic and Android etc. Dude created SW TCG, one of the best TCG game of all time, WoTC crashed it, then IDC took the game, and still today are making cards better then WoTC ever did. Thank you, mr. Garfield for creating such a beautiful and underrated game. For those who are insterested in the game, head over to this link, the game is free to play, you just print your cards and that's it. There are 20+ expansions, so you don't need WoTC cards. swtcgidc.wordpress.com/
so your own skill and experience will win the game and not the meta, sounds cool and if your bored with your deck its cheap to change gear, not bad.
Whaaaaat there is negativity on the INET? Shocker :). Dont get why people always have to be upset about something new? Dont like the concept? Well move along, there are 100000000 of other games or play magic ;). I love the fact that i dont have to deckbuild, because most people dont deckbuild anyway if you think about it. They look it up what the best deck is and use it, so whats the diffrents?
uhmmm way to see only what you want to see man, you know that his statement about most people not building decks and just copying the from the internet is massively true. Also Zendikar proved mirror matches not to be as "skill testing" as pros make them to be, you get goblin guide or stoneforge mystic before your opponent does? congratulations! you win the game in a glorified coin flip! .
Ya, that's what ultimately spoiled magic and all the others. That's why I'm excited for this one.
My question would be the depth of the experience of gameplay and uniqueness per deck. If you bought 12 decks, would each game play and style be totally different or eventually there will be some set way to play that would be optimized based on the houses you got? Also with the ability to play online they can then gather the data and build expansions or cards to balance the game further. Looks very interesting.
It seems as if each faction has it's own style, so only the decks with the same 3 factions would play similarly, which I imagine can be diminished if new sets introduce new factions, thus increasing the amount of combinations of factions in the game.
Even then though, it seems like there is even good variety between cards in a faction, especially for a game that's only on it's base set. I dare say that the decks will be quite unique for quite a while, though who knows, maybe I'll be completely wrong.
I can't wait to have this UCG format applied to other franchises like Star Wars, Arkham Horror, Android, Game of Thrones and everything FFG got! Why not, huh?
Great idea😎
Can't wait.
Wow, I'm convinced! Where can I buy?
I can't wait for this. I can't stand deck building, so this is right up my alley
I think the game has alot of potential. Also notice how the game has rules that would work as a digital game. Mobile adaptation maybe?
i think it is really great and a really great idea. I like that you can buy the shit out of it and it would be the same outcome like just buying one
Looks fun but I want it on steam and smartphones because it's kinda hard to find people to play with irl.
Lets see how the premise to eliminate netdecking works out.
I want to know what Jason thinks about this game. As a game collector, if he likes this game as much as e.g. SW Destiny, will he buy as much decks as possible? Or 32 unique combinations? He can't have all content.
haha, you can't have it all ... the ultimate lesson
It was a really bad experience for me at gencon. My opponent did not had a chance to response to my game :(
I feel like it will be impossible to make it fair for competitive play, but for casual play it seems fun!
Cool concept
The main issue with games like this is that pros will figure out the top 5 decks, empirically speaking. It is impossible for smart gamers to not figure out optimal strategies. Once that happens, then we will see if the core gameplay is fun to keep.people hooked.
There will really be 2 options long term
A. The Best players are the best because they found the God Deck and didn't sell it
Or B. The best players are the best because they play well, so they will intentionally start with a lower power deck so that the opponents have chains starting the match, ruining the opponents draw potential for a long time.
The marketing concept behind a collectible non-deckbuilder feels very awkward. It makes me think that expanding the game will be difficult since it will lead to a ton of bloat and diminishes any real value for rarity of cards since the entire deck has to be sold or traded as a whole.
Easy.. old decks just become obsolete, because new nådecks can be better. Then there can be a set where there only Are very few good decks and that set sell badly, so the next set has ro be better to compensate so that it will sell well... that automativåcally leads to powercreep where every new set of keyforge has ro be an average more powerfull than the previous, or it does not sell. If you have a strong old deck, it can be ok for some sets, but eventually it will get outgunned.
Interesting consept!
I think the point is that the cards shouldn’t have value besides the gameplay and that all decks are automatically balanced.
Interested to see where this goes but seems like trading on "chase" for a different "chase"
Yep, buy entire $10 decks chasing that one card, your 30 other decks sit unused
I find this game very interesting. But I wonder what happens if for example a single card out of a unique deck gets broken? Will there ever be the chance to get it replaced or is the whole deck lost then? Playing unsleeved might be a bad idea...
the deck comes with an Identity card that has the name of the Archon and a decklist, they'll probably allow a proxy or using the same card from a different archon as long as it is in your Archon's decklist.
“If I’m a player I’m going to buy 5 or 6 decks...”
No, most people are going to buy the box that comes with two or whatever and that’ll be that.
Maybe! We'll see.
J W - No offense, but you are wrong, at least with my own experiences. I have bought 11 total so far. Going to give 4 to my son and I will hog the rest. I love the idea of working with a deck to get to know it, playing it and using its strengths and trying to work around its weakness. For $8 a deck, why not?
NO MUST BUY CARDS
I have a simple statement for this one: If you are so much into deck building then this game is not for you.
Looking forward for Keyforge.
If there are 7 factions, and each deck uses 3 of them at random, that should be 7*6*5 or 210 combinations, which seems like way more than 35.
Not, that's permutations. A, B, and C is the same thing as C, B, and A.
Would be amazing if it comes to PC or Android, is it planned?
After playing this game for an evening, my prediction is: the concept of casual unique decks will stand, the gameplay is not good enough, some new game will come in the future that uses this same concept with a different gameplay and that game will win it all.
But not this game.
I speak as a seasoned MtG, YuGiOh!, Force of Will player whose favourite VS card game is Ashes (just to give some background).
Choosing 3 out of 7 possible houses gives 210 possible combinations (not 35). Happy hunting!
No, it's 210 permutations. A, B, and C is the same thing as B, C, and A, etc. Thus 35.
Ah, right you are. Though I wonder if the order will matter for the deck-building algorithm. Is it possible that they could generate 2 decks with the same 36 cards, with the only difference that the houses are arranged in a different order on the card backs?