Without the stubway on Sheppard (and the NYC station), you probably still wouldn't need the Relief line yet. Sheppard brought at least 20K riders (for a total of 40K trips along the corridor) to the corridor, North York Centre station brought in another 25K. Most of the rides used at these stations are taken by peak hour commuters. It's why Sheppard gets crush loaded during the peak hours, but is almost ghost-like all other times. So, all in all, at least 32K peak hour commuters (65K daily rides on the Yonge line) were added to the Yonge line with these two projects alone. Distributing those through the 3-hour rush hour window, you're looking at an additional 10K PPH in the peak direction during rush hour. Without those two projects, ridership on the Yonge line would likely have still been low enough to justify not doing anything. The main problem was that when they built Sheppard (and North York Centre), they didn't build the Relief line directly after, meaning that ridership grew exponentially in North York, while capacity stagnated downtown. Now, 17 years later, since capacity is limited at Bloor and St. George, no one wants to use the subway more in North York (because trains are often full at Sheppard), and no one wants to take the subway from Scarborough or East York, because Bloor-Yonge is far too crowded to be viable for use.
I know. I'm just saying it's unfortunate city/transit planners weren't able to upgrade the transit infrastructure as the city grew. Are the platforms along the new Line 1 extension wider?
k smith another thing is some stations are so close to each other and get less traffic like rosedale it's right beside bloor-Yonge just walk 100 metres lol it's same with st George and spadina station
K smith - i know your comment is old but to add, Toronto is the only transit system in North America that did not get provincial support for if i remember right over a decade. All the fares and city taxes went to just keep the thing going while Toronto got taxed hard Provincially and Federally hard. Finally they took notice after too fucking long and things are being done... slowly.
Transit in the GTA is in a perfect storm. It's run badly, it's underfunded, and a lot of the stations are really poorly designed when it comes to dealing with increases in riders. It's also dealing with major problems outside of its control, like the bombardier fiasco. Although the TTC should have taken action against them much sooner than this.
When you look at many subways around the world you realize Toronto Subway is rather small system for its almost 3 million residents and over 5 million in the Greater Toronto area. New lines should of been built years ago but instead the car and highways became priority and subway line plans were cancelled. To bad we are now up there with Los Angeles as the worst traffic commute and the longest daily travel to work in USA and Canada. The relief line should be the first and foremost line built, before other lines are built you need to build the relief line or else new lines will just add more people into the old Younge and University lines that are already near maximum capacity. Main point, new subway lines are needed bad and need to start building NOW!!
Samuel Appiah LRT's can be very good transit systems, but only if they are integrated well with current Subway systems and inner city commuter rails (Like GO trains, Union to Pearson and future smart Track, if that ever gets built). They have some very good LRT's systems in other cities around the world that work fantastic, the main thing is they need to be raised above ground, main level or underground as long as there is no connection to the main road traffic. Underground is best option but also the most expensive to be built, but they can be built very well above ground. To many people in Toronto think LRT means the same thing as Toronto's old Streetcars that slow traffic down and mix with cars and trucks on the road (however I like the Streetcar system for historic and nostalgic feel of the Streetcar system, for that reason I am glad the streetcar system is still very much a part of hundreds of thousands of peoples every day commute) . Hopefully the future Eglington Line will show many what an LRT line can be. It just needs to be built well, in the right nbeighbourhoods and its probably best to not cheap out for the cheapest transit system, or else you often get cheap results.
James 1 Fair points, Lrt's can be a useful especially in low density areas that need more than a bus, but less than a Subway... But I feel we need to prioritize and complete a full Underground Transit system first. , The DRL .Scarborough Subway .Finch Subway After that then yes surface LRT'S seem pretty reasonable in mid-city streets such as .Jane .Don Mills .Sheppard East .Lakeshore But of course, Money will always be a barrier....
Samuel Appiah yup, so very true. And the Downtown Relief line should have been built decades ago, it is the core of the entire system that needs to be built first, and it is such densely built downtown core that it must be a subway and not a LRT.
James 1 Agreed The DRL has been way too long coming. As well as the Scarborough subway, the SRT is on the verge of death. And finch needs an underground Transit line too, places like Jane and Finch and Albion Finch, and Humber college are extremely dense. After Building a core full east to west underground transit line, yes, LRT'S would be really useful, Like on .Sheppard East .Don Mills .Lakeshore .Jane etc.....
Here in Edmonton, our LRT (which runs underground through Downtown and the University of Alberta, much like the subway) features only centre platforms, which are much better suited to accommodate large crowds. We also have only five-car-long platforms, which makes the platform seem shorter to people, and entices them to spread out more.
Riiiiight, so its the passengers' fault that almost every inter-change station dumps everyone at ONE end of the platform AND that in the past 5 years, nobody in the city has thought that maybe subway stations designed in the 1950's could need an update or redesign by now....right; the passengers are just lazy....
I think expanding ab underground station is extrenely expensive. In London, I think it was the Northern Line Platform at Bank Station, they did it and it cost over a billion pounds. What Toronto also desperately needs, is more lines i think. @@casual_boredom7195
I would the LRT's speed is about in between a subway and the current bus. Sheppard bus: 17km/h Sheppard LRT: 22-27km/h (depending on stop spacing) Current subways: ~30-32km/h GO is waaay faster though, around 45-50km/h for milk runs, but close to 90km/h for the express section from Clarkson to Union. I think adding stations on the Markham GO line at Finch, Ellesmere and Lawrence, electrifying the route and having high frequency all day all week service would be even better than a subway.
I remember that it would get so bad at Bloor I would just walk to school from their ... difference between walking and taking the subway was an extra 10-15 minutes but it was a lot less stressful then waiting
The station is ill designed to take passengers from the 2 Bloor-Danforth since the latter wasn't built until 12 years after the Yonge line was built. What the Bloor station needs is its platform to be moved half its current distance northward (60 metres to be precise) so that the transfer portal can be used to accommodate all doors on any train. Maybe make Bloor Station a centered platform like its connecting cousin Yonge Station.
Reason for increased ridership: Canadians are paying almost 5 USD for a gallon of regular unleaded, and the GTA is a very big place with lots of traffic.
all this talk of LRT's, streetcars, sheppard subways, none of that, none of it deals with the 1st and foremost transit issue in this city - overcrowding on the yonge line...the only line that takes you to and from downtown...we need a downtown relief line, and we need it yesterday...the downtown relief line was a priority for the ttc until david miller and his cronies came along and decised to put LRT's everywhere...what will those LRT's do?...just bring more people to the overstretched yonge
wait camera 5 is the south end of the southbound, and camera 8 is the north end of the northbound? I'm confused... I thought he meant both cameras are on the same train (aka both northbound or both southbound)
Steven Francis Notice he hovers his hand over both cameras and says this is the northbound platform (1:51). When he says this is the south end of the southbound, I think he meant south end of the northbound. I don't know which station that is though because when I worked in the financial district and took the Yonge-Bloor train southboud to King all doors were always utilized and people still got left behind.
No, no the passengers are jist lazt, thats all, how you have a 450 foot long train yet "not be aware" of 20 available doors on the train, just wanting the first four, there is a platform and more cars for a reason, just move down the platform, if some people can run 26.2 miles in a marathon, the civilians can walk the extra 375 feet
When I used to ride the subway, where I stood on the platform before getting on the train was based on where I knew the escalators were at the destination. If I were going to work at Yonge & King, I would want to be on the south end of the south bound trains. If I were going to Ryerson, then I would choose the northern part of the south bound trains.
@Untainted Afro It took a bit for me to figure it out, but I think I figured it out by watching others subway passengers. I noticed that others seemed to want to line up at particular spots to get on the subway. If I saw them again when I got off the subway, but they were closer to the escalator than me, that’s likely when things ‘clicked’.
It's not so much as the station design (not that it is a great one to begin with), but it is the over-capacity in the whole system. What we need is a downtown relief line but that will never happen. We may also be benefited with another North-South subway line. I would actually interchange at St. George sometimes to avoid Bloor-Yonge, but with people pressing the emergency buttons, all bets are off.
Its ok people with bikes don't understand distance that well, they also do not understand that people cant show up at work drenched in sweat if they work in a office or pretty much any other Job. I also doubt he rides his bike in snow any more then 5 cm.
Thing about LRT is that they are going to have frequent stops, its going to serve as the bus and subway... with a stop every few blocks along with traffic lights.. it will be the same as a bus express lane during rush hour. Speed wise its garbage, its a good bus replacement where possible to save on fuel but to act as a subway line is no where near close. I am not against LRT's they are great, as long as they have a dedicated line, like the subway when it goes outside aka YorkDale station.
Also -- they can "herd" the riders, and better facilitate traffic flow using the TTC light-duty employees, which is probably what they're trying to do at this point.
They're the same people (watch the bald hipster in camera 8), they just skipped part of the boarding process to save time in the video and get to the point.
I bet the crush hours there come about mostly because of the pratts' short-sighted commitment of Torontonians into bearing trains being broader than the platforms they themselves pull into. Overly cramped station facilities, built along some kind of village-esque format, is one of many reasons why living in Ontario becomes distasteful and even repulsive .. blech.
TTC's subway is the worlds worst subway system that doesn't gamble with lives. It only get's worse if there is a chance you will die like on a Sao Paulo or Mumbai train.
I remember it being packed when I was commuting to Ryerson between 2000 and 2005. I can only imagine how bad it is now with so much more development within the downtown core. Then again, I can't, cuz I moved to Calgary and take the C-Train on the West LRT. F*ck Toronto. Hot women though...
As for GO ya i know what you mean, too bad the Fliping province or some billion air dude buys GO and adds a high speed light rail electric line.... Smaller faster trains, more trains on the track :).
The DRL shouldn't really be a discussion, because currently, the Yonge line is chocking with riders while city council sits on their ass.
Anyone else find the music really catchy :) I love the wee tone, the door chime with the announcement tune thingy!
i found it quite annoying
emmakiwi oh yeah it feels like a dubstep dance music with the subway chime.
Yes
Emma I never get sick of the old chimes they bring me back a lot
0:24
That supervisor is from trinidad and tobago... that accent!!!
And no one can understand him lmao. Literally useless job
I love how he says the customer is unaware. No brother, its not being unaware, it's just being plain stupid.
i think it's about time we needed the platform edge doors
Honestly I think the Relief Line from Downtown to Danforth is what should have been built 15-20 years ago and not that "Stubway" on Sheppard Ave.
Without the stubway on Sheppard (and the NYC station), you probably still wouldn't need the Relief line yet. Sheppard brought at least 20K riders (for a total of 40K trips along the corridor) to the corridor, North York Centre station brought in another 25K. Most of the rides used at these stations are taken by peak hour commuters. It's why Sheppard gets crush loaded during the peak hours, but is almost ghost-like all other times. So, all in all, at least 32K peak hour commuters (65K daily rides on the Yonge line) were added to the Yonge line with these two projects alone. Distributing those through the 3-hour rush hour window, you're looking at an additional 10K PPH in the peak direction during rush hour. Without those two projects, ridership on the Yonge line would likely have still been low enough to justify not doing anything.
The main problem was that when they built Sheppard (and North York Centre), they didn't build the Relief line directly after, meaning that ridership grew exponentially in North York, while capacity stagnated downtown. Now, 17 years later, since capacity is limited at Bloor and St. George, no one wants to use the subway more in North York (because trains are often full at Sheppard), and no one wants to take the subway from Scarborough or East York, because Bloor-Yonge is far too crowded to be viable for use.
the platforms in the TTC subways seem so undersized for the amount of traffic they get. i would be afraid of being shoved onto the tracks
k smith well Ellington to union was built in 1954 when Toronto population was reaching 890 000 population
k smith now in 2016 it's 2.85 million
I know. I'm just saying it's unfortunate city/transit planners weren't able to upgrade the transit infrastructure as the city grew. Are the platforms along the new Line 1 extension wider?
k smith another thing is some stations are so close to each other and get less traffic like rosedale it's right beside bloor-Yonge just walk 100 metres lol it's same with st George and spadina station
K smith - i know your comment is old but to add, Toronto is the only transit system in North America that did not get provincial support for if i remember right over a decade.
All the fares and city taxes went to just keep the thing going while Toronto got taxed hard Provincially and Federally hard.
Finally they took notice after too fucking long and things are being done... slowly.
its like playing sim city, observing bot citizens from screens
Edmonton's LRT system is like this too. A lot of the station designs have had entrances and exits at the same place across the system.
So that explains those empty trains that sometimes pass by and don't stop... Interesting
LordOfFreedom Lol
Transit in the GTA is in a perfect storm. It's run badly, it's underfunded, and a lot of the stations are really poorly designed when it comes to dealing with increases in riders. It's also dealing with major problems outside of its control, like the bombardier fiasco. Although the TTC should have taken action against them much sooner than this.
When you look at many subways around the world you realize Toronto Subway is rather small system for its almost 3 million residents and over 5 million in the Greater Toronto area. New lines should of been built years ago but instead the car and highways became priority and subway line plans were cancelled. To bad we are now up there with Los Angeles as the worst traffic commute and the longest daily travel to work in USA and Canada. The relief line should be the first and foremost line built, before other lines are built you need to build the relief line or else new lines will just add more people into the old Younge and University lines that are already near maximum capacity. Main point, new subway lines are needed bad and need to start building NOW!!
+James 1 I agree! unfortunetly some people are more interested in building frinkin on surface LRT'S than Underground LRT'S an Subway's!
Sad....
Samuel Appiah LRT's can be very good transit systems, but only if they are integrated well with current Subway systems and inner city commuter rails (Like GO trains, Union to Pearson and future smart Track, if that ever gets built). They have some very good LRT's systems in other cities around the world that work fantastic, the main thing is they need to be raised above ground, main level or underground as long as there is no connection to the main road traffic. Underground is best option but also the most expensive to be built, but they can be built very well above ground. To many people in Toronto think LRT means the same thing as Toronto's old Streetcars that slow traffic down and mix with cars and trucks on the road (however I like the Streetcar system for historic and nostalgic feel of the Streetcar system, for that reason I am glad the streetcar system is still very much a part of hundreds of thousands of peoples every day commute) . Hopefully the future Eglington Line will show many what an LRT line can be. It just needs to be built well, in the right nbeighbourhoods and its probably best to not cheap out for the cheapest transit system, or else you often get cheap results.
James 1 Fair points, Lrt's can be a useful especially in low density areas that need more than a bus, but less than a Subway...
But I feel we need to prioritize and complete a full Underground Transit system first.
, The DRL
.Scarborough Subway
.Finch Subway
After that then yes surface LRT'S seem pretty reasonable in mid-city streets such as
.Jane
.Don Mills
.Sheppard East
.Lakeshore
But of course, Money will always be a barrier....
Samuel Appiah yup, so very true. And the Downtown Relief line should have been built decades ago, it is the core of the entire system that needs to be built first, and it is such densely built downtown core that it must be a subway and not a LRT.
James 1 Agreed The DRL has been way too long coming.
As well as the Scarborough subway, the SRT is on the verge of death.
And finch needs an underground Transit line too, places like Jane and Finch and Albion Finch, and Humber college are extremely dense.
After Building a core full east to west underground transit line,
yes, LRT'S would be really useful,
Like on
.Sheppard East
.Don Mills
.Lakeshore
.Jane
etc.....
Here in Edmonton, our LRT (which runs underground through Downtown and the University of Alberta, much like the subway) features only centre platforms, which are much better suited to accommodate large crowds. We also have only five-car-long platforms, which makes the platform seem shorter to people, and entices them to spread out more.
Riiiiight, so its the passengers' fault that almost every inter-change station dumps everyone at ONE end of the platform AND that in the past 5 years, nobody in the city has thought that maybe subway stations designed in the 1950's could need an update or redesign by now....right; the passengers are just lazy....
alongfortheride84 the TTC has already extended the bloor platform
@@EPIK_yt I think he means major major modernization of the entire system.
I think expanding ab underground station is extrenely expensive. In London, I think it was the Northern Line Platform at Bank Station, they did it and it cost over a billion pounds. What Toronto also desperately needs, is more lines i think. @@casual_boredom7195
That was a pretty awesome beat.
I would the LRT's speed is about in between a subway and the current bus.
Sheppard bus: 17km/h
Sheppard LRT: 22-27km/h (depending on stop spacing)
Current subways: ~30-32km/h
GO is waaay faster though, around 45-50km/h for milk runs, but close to 90km/h for the express section from Clarkson to Union. I think adding stations on the Markham GO line at Finch, Ellesmere and Lawrence, electrifying the route and having high frequency all day all week service would be even better than a subway.
No wonder I never understand anything that is announced in TTC....
what is going to happen to traffic on the 401 is something I don't want to even think about.
0:24 *The TTC rap*
0:03 wait wait there are still H4 trains in 2012?
I think that’s a h5
@@Notjackpausnerh5
I remember that it would get so bad at Bloor I would just walk to school from their ... difference between walking and taking the subway was an extra 10-15 minutes but it was a lot less stressful then waiting
In a year or two, you'll have the same situation at Yonge-Sheppard with all the condos in process of building right now.
ACH PSH!!!! Don't tell them! If people opened theirs eyes I'd have to wait twice as long in supermarkets.
The station is ill designed to take passengers from the 2 Bloor-Danforth since the latter wasn't built until 12 years after the Yonge line was built. What the Bloor station needs is its platform to be moved half its current distance northward (60 metres to be precise) so that the transfer portal can be used to accommodate all doors on any train. Maybe make Bloor Station a centered platform like its connecting cousin Yonge Station.
Supervisor sounds Trinidadian...
rodman1993 He probably is (I wrote this comment while reading it in his Accent)
Reason for increased ridership: Canadians are paying almost 5 USD for a gallon of regular unleaded, and the GTA is a very big place with lots of traffic.
I thought the broadcast was recorded
Try riding the subway anywhere in Asia.
Homestay Mac Especially Beijing, Tokyo, Shanghai, etc.
all this talk of LRT's, streetcars, sheppard subways, none of that, none of it deals with the 1st and foremost transit issue in this city - overcrowding on the yonge line...the only line that takes you to and from downtown...we need a downtown relief line, and we need it yesterday...the downtown relief line was a priority for the ttc until david miller and his cronies came along and decised to put LRT's everywhere...what will those LRT's do?...just bring more people to the overstretched yonge
wait camera 5 is the south end of the southbound, and camera 8 is the north end of the northbound? I'm confused... I thought he meant both cameras are on the same train (aka both northbound or both southbound)
He just wasnt articulating correctly
Steven Francis Notice he hovers his hand over both cameras and says this is the northbound platform (1:51). When he says this is the south end of the southbound, I think he meant south end of the northbound. I don't know which station that is though because when I worked in the financial district and took the Yonge-Bloor train southboud to King all doors were always utilized and people still got left behind.
True I feel like that's Dundas station because I've seen things like this happen before
No, no the passengers are jist lazt, thats all, how you have a 450 foot long train yet "not be aware" of 20 available doors on the train, just wanting the first four, there is a platform and more cars for a reason, just move down the platform, if some people can run 26.2 miles in a marathon, the civilians can walk the extra 375 feet
Those same people refuse to walk for 30 seconds or less to get to the grocery store and wait for a free parking spot to open up.
why does the news warning music keep playing
It's the song
When I used to ride the subway, where I stood on the platform before getting on the train was based on where I knew the escalators were at the destination. If I were going to work at Yonge & King, I would want to be on the south end of the south bound trains. If I were going to Ryerson, then I would choose the northern part of the south bound trains.
@Untainted Afro It took a bit for me to figure it out, but I think I figured it out by watching others subway passengers. I noticed that others seemed to want to line up at particular spots to get on the subway. If I saw them again when I got off the subway, but they were closer to the escalator than me, that’s likely when things ‘clicked’.
its all based on the station you are exiting on, obviouly the front of the train seem to be closer to the stairs of the station ur exiting on.
Exactly! Where I stand before getting on the train is the strategic plan to get past as much foot traffic as possible when getting off the train.
Lol. Fooking Trini 😂😂😂
Try biking from Finch/Yonge to Dundas/Yonge.
nice beat
The TTC needs to visit the Tube in London. The TFL has transformed crowd control into an art form.
Why not just add a inner middle platform to have passengers exit that way and have it flow in one direction
It's not so much as the station design (not that it is a great one to begin with), but it is the over-capacity in the whole system. What we need is a downtown relief line but that will never happen. We may also be benefited with another North-South subway line. I would actually interchange at St. George sometimes to avoid Bloor-Yonge, but with people pressing the emergency buttons, all bets are off.
+CipherFiveZero The Stubway should not ove been bulit I think that relif line from Danforth and downtown.
I remember that monitor's bleets...no surprise the scale of its intelligence matching therein the scope of its art of persuasion......
If they needed more trains and used all of their T1 Subways and Toronto Rockets, couldn't they keep a bit of H6's.
This why I ride my bike to work rain, snow or sunshine. How do people cram themselves in like that everyday?
stcywll They get used to it. Just like you got used to riding your bike in the snow and sometimes slush
Its ok people with bikes don't understand distance that well, they also do not understand that people cant show up at work drenched in sweat if they work in a office or pretty much any other Job. I also doubt he rides his bike in snow any more then 5 cm.
we could have had that relief line back in the 50s or 60s or something dont remember but they didnt do it now look what has happen sighh
Il make an mp3 of the beat
TTC IF A JOKE! who ever constructed had no vision
Do you have a vision of what I will reply next?
NO! vision and extra sensory perception are two different things (clown)
What?
7 ra your grammar is a joke.
some world class city, subways close at a certain time. world class = 24/7 subway
Thing about LRT is that they are going to have frequent stops, its going to serve as the bus and subway... with a stop every few blocks along with traffic lights.. it will be the same as a bus express lane during rush hour. Speed wise its garbage, its a good bus replacement where possible to save on fuel but to act as a subway line is no where near close.
I am not against LRT's they are great, as long as they have a dedicated line, like the subway when it goes outside aka YorkDale station.
Also -- they can "herd" the riders, and better facilitate traffic flow using the TTC light-duty employees, which is probably what they're trying to do at this point.
Overcrowding always happen, even in 2020 with population 6,100,068.
The subway makes already makes a profit. Its the buses that lose money.
2:30 How Can Everybody Look Different In 5 Seconds?
They're the same people (watch the bald hipster in camera 8), they just skipped part of the boarding process to save time in the video and get to the point.
Eeeeeeeeeeyyyyyy Dwike mon!!
All those monitors, and no sign of that tall black homeless guy that begs for change
Obviously you haven't lived in Toronto long enough.
I bet the crush hours there come about mostly because of the pratts' short-sighted commitment of Torontonians into bearing trains being broader than the platforms they themselves pull into. Overly cramped station facilities, built along some kind of village-esque format, is one of many reasons why living in Ontario becomes distasteful and even repulsive .. blech.
TTC's subway is the worlds worst subway system that doesn't gamble with lives. It only get's worse if there is a chance you will die like on a Sao Paulo or Mumbai train.
I remember it being packed when I was commuting to Ryerson between 2000 and 2005. I can only imagine how bad it is now with so much more development within the downtown core. Then again, I can't, cuz I moved to Calgary and take the C-Train on the West LRT. F*ck Toronto. Hot women though...
Cattle being corralled. I need a car -_-
enjoy your don valley parking lot, free citizen
Jesus Christ! How can you people even understand the heck the announcer is saying. It's all garbled up.
Actually none of the transit systems in the world make profit.
As for GO ya i know what you mean, too bad the Fliping province or some billion air dude buys GO and adds a high speed light rail electric line.... Smaller faster trains, more trains on the track :).
I had to mute this at 00:18!! that music is extremely painful to listen to especially if you're a frequent commuter.
TTC is so 🔥 awesome
Bring back the interlining TTC!!!
Please rename this as SHEEPLE.