I agree with the other comments. The donation proposal / ticket raffle seems almost worse than the dealer selling over MSRP as it's a total shot in the dark. Best idea I've read is Porsche opening a special division that sells the GT cars at MSRP with selection criteria that doesn't involve dollars spent.
That would work but would require Porsche North America to buy in, a local dealer can choose to market how they would like and sell at msrp if they so choose.
Good conversation and I appreciate the intent and mental energy that went into it. I believe that the only way to move the needle on this is for Porsche to sell cars direct to consumer. Perhaps starting with GT line first and have the process managed by Porsche NA HQ or Stuttgart where we trade time (as it will take longer to get these cars) for upfront, MSRP pricing. Dealers can sell mass produced cars and run service.
If you are a newcomer to the brand (me) the odds would be stacked against you. The overs my guy quoted are ridiculous. I don’t want to buy a Macan or a Taycan to establish a relationship or buy raffle tickets to be put in a GT raffle. I’m just a guy looking for my next track car and I would like it to be a GT product. At this point. I’m just waiting for the market to cool
That will work, but you will be buying gray market forever. Unfortunately we are passed the days where you can buy nothing from a dealer then get a GT car out the gate without any incentive for the dealer of repeat business.
@@ignitionontheleft i have a 991 RS and have talked to the 10+ dealers about taking a bath on a trade for a 992 GT3, no bites unless i'm willing pay 50K adm, so basically 90k in value between trade and ADM. It's crazy. I even know a GM in DFW who tells me i have no chance but happy to sell me a "used" car that someone drove for 500 miles before trading on their next GT car. IT's a cycle that has to stop. I'm planning to just drive my current RS 100k miles and say FUCK to Porsche NA and never buy a new car.
@@ignitionontheleft It Is difficult in one comment but if only one rule were needed, I would act like Patek Philippe: if you're granted a timepiece and you flip it, you'll never be granted another one through the official network. Ever.
The lotto system will end up pissing off their top clients that expect to get allocations in exchange for buying a lot of cars or being a celebrity. If you make the system non deterministic it doesn’t make their best clients happy. They will simply go to the next dealer.
You just get your credits back when you trade in the car. You can also negotiate that value. No contract necessary, that’s the deal. They can sell it private party for more but then they have to go buy 5 more Macans to ever get back up to that level with that dealership. It’s perfect.
If you get picked in the lotto and don’t want that particular GT car, let em hold on to it for first dibs on the next car and pull a new name for the current allocation.
@IgnitionOnTheLeft How is this making the system fair or favoring motorsport enthusiasts? Old system: only people with deep pockets can get GT cars by paying huge ADMs New system: only people with long history of Porsche ownership and deep pockets can get GT cars by making large donations rather than ADMs. Now, instead of paying huge ADMs, you would need to buy/sell multiple Macans/Taycan/..etc plus donations to get into the lottery to buy a GT car. GT cars should be exclusive to Porsche fans only, not really motorsport enthusiasts?
Fair point, however with this system you can establish yourself with one dealer so you don't need a long list of purchases- just start purchasing from them this year and have a chance at a GT car.
@@ignitionontheleft Think about it, would you rather pay 50-75K to definitely get a GT4RS or buy/sell one Macan, one Taycan, one Cayenne and donate $15K for a small possibility of a getting a GT4RS at MSRP? I wouldn't do the first one, but I would never want to do the second one. Specifically for GT cars, the system should be geared towards motorsport enthusiasts, for people who will actually track the car, for people who can actually push the limits of that car. If I cannot even push the limits of base Cayman on track, I don't need a GT car to begin with. No one needs a GT car to drive to shopping malls/restaurants. I would need to think a bit more to nail down the system to make this happen, but I don't think any dealer would go for it (even if they like the idea). At the end of the day, it is a just business for them. As long as they are making money, they wouldn't care who buys it, why, how the car is used.
@@gokhansayilarHow would they determine that? How many people can push a GT car to near its limit that isn't named Lietz or Estre? Who needs a GT car at all? I certainly am not going to let someone else tell me I can or cannot buy a product that is being sold. That's what these are. They are products meant to be sold. And at that rate they should only sell panameras and cup cars. Who needs an SUV that isnt going off road? Who needs towing capacity? Who needs a car on the road that goes above 70 mph? At the end of the day these are road cars, ironically they are built for exactly that.
My idea is flood the market. Make as many GT cars as there is demand. Then there is little incentive to resell and dealerships start competing on price which drives the market to a fair level. Literally the simplest way to get rid of this bs. If someone can say “why buy used when I can get a new for less” the game is over.
The goal is to get the dealers not to participate in the markup at point of sale via an adm, goal would be to cater to a larger group of people selling them cars along the way and have a method to offer GT cars when available to that group - not a small group of selective VIP's.
Kudos to thinking of a solution but honestly it's not on buyers to solve, it's on Porsche. At the end of the day I'm there to buy a car I want. I'm not there to be their friend. I'm not there for the culture of their dealership. It's a business, treat it as such and stop gaslighting customers into believing it's anything bigger than what it really is: a transaction.
Sorry, but this is a bit of an absurd solution that changes nothing as those with the deepest pockets that will pay $$$ over MSRP will still end up with cars. The only logical, and best, solution is to have an actual waiting list that is limited to local buyers for each dealer. The list should be open for a set period of time that Porsche will agree to manufacturer 100% of orders for. Until Porsche agrees to build a car for every GT order, nothing will change unfortunately - nothing else will work.
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I agree with the other comments. The donation proposal / ticket raffle seems almost worse than the dealer selling over MSRP as it's a total shot in the dark. Best idea I've read is Porsche opening a special division that sells the GT cars at MSRP with selection criteria that doesn't involve dollars spent.
That would work but would require Porsche North America to buy in, a local dealer can choose to market how they would like and sell at msrp if they so choose.
Or just let Porsche sell their gt cars online only as a loophole to the dealer system like what new car companies do
Good conversation and I appreciate the intent and mental energy that went into it. I believe that the only way to move the needle on this is for Porsche to sell cars direct to consumer. Perhaps starting with GT line first and have the process managed by Porsche NA HQ or Stuttgart where we trade time (as it will take longer to get these cars) for upfront, MSRP pricing. Dealers can sell mass produced cars and run service.
That would work.
If you are a newcomer to the brand (me) the odds would be stacked against you. The overs my guy quoted are ridiculous. I don’t want to buy a Macan or a Taycan to establish a relationship or buy raffle tickets to be put in a GT raffle. I’m just a guy looking for my next track car and I would like it to be a GT product. At this point. I’m just waiting for the market to cool
Same here
That will work, but you will be buying gray market forever. Unfortunately we are passed the days where you can buy nothing from a dealer then get a GT car out the gate without any incentive for the dealer of repeat business.
@@ignitionontheleft i have a 991 RS and have talked to the 10+ dealers about taking a bath on a trade for a 992 GT3, no bites unless i'm willing pay 50K adm, so basically 90k in value between trade and ADM. It's crazy. I even know a GM in DFW who tells me i have no chance but happy to sell me a "used" car that someone drove for 500 miles before trading on their next GT car. IT's a cycle that has to stop.
I'm planning to just drive my current RS 100k miles and say FUCK to Porsche NA and never buy a new car.
Also, TH-camrs ruined the market since many of them have no issues getting the very first car. Not you but you know what i mean.
Some of them do you're right
A great way to ensure that GT cars go to the richest guys. Epic fail.
What would you suggest?
@@ignitionontheleft It Is difficult in one comment but if only one rule were needed, I would act like Patek Philippe: if you're granted a timepiece and you flip it, you'll never be granted another one through the official network. Ever.
The lotto system will end up pissing off their top clients that expect to get allocations in exchange for buying a lot of cars or being a celebrity. If you make the system non deterministic it doesn’t make their best clients happy. They will simply go to the next dealer.
Maybe...
You just get your credits back when you trade in the car. You can also negotiate that value. No contract necessary, that’s the deal. They can sell it private party for more but then they have to go buy 5 more Macans to ever get back up to that level with that dealership. It’s perfect.
If you get picked in the lotto and don’t want that particular GT car, let em hold on to it for first dibs on the next car and pull a new name for the current allocation.
I like that
This was your Jerry Maguire moment.
I grew up mormon, haven't seem Jerry Maguire :)
@IgnitionOnTheLeft How is this making the system fair or favoring motorsport enthusiasts?
Old system: only people with deep pockets can get GT cars by paying huge ADMs
New system: only people with long history of Porsche ownership and deep pockets can get GT cars by making large donations rather than ADMs.
Now, instead of paying huge ADMs, you would need to buy/sell multiple Macans/Taycan/..etc plus donations to get into the lottery to buy a GT car. GT cars should be exclusive to Porsche fans only, not really motorsport enthusiasts?
Fair point, however with this system you can establish yourself with one dealer so you don't need a long list of purchases- just start purchasing from them this year and have a chance at a GT car.
@@ignitionontheleft Think about it, would you rather pay 50-75K to definitely get a GT4RS or buy/sell one Macan, one Taycan, one Cayenne and donate $15K for a small possibility of a getting a GT4RS at MSRP? I wouldn't do the first one, but I would never want to do the second one.
Specifically for GT cars, the system should be geared towards motorsport enthusiasts, for people who will actually track the car, for people who can actually push the limits of that car. If I cannot even push the limits of base Cayman on track, I don't need a GT car to begin with. No one needs a GT car to drive to shopping malls/restaurants. I would need to think a bit more to nail down the system to make this happen, but I don't think any dealer would go for it (even if they like the idea). At the end of the day, it is a just business for them. As long as they are making money, they wouldn't care who buys it, why, how the car is used.
@@gokhansayilarHow would they determine that? How many people can push a GT car to near its limit that isn't named Lietz or Estre? Who needs a GT car at all? I certainly am not going to let someone else tell me I can or cannot buy a product that is being sold. That's what these are. They are products meant to be sold. And at that rate they should only sell panameras and cup cars. Who needs an SUV that isnt going off road? Who needs towing capacity? Who needs a car on the road that goes above 70 mph? At the end of the day these are road cars, ironically they are built for exactly that.
My idea is flood the market. Make as many GT cars as there is demand. Then there is little incentive to resell and dealerships start competing on price which drives the market to a fair level. Literally the simplest way to get rid of this bs. If someone can say “why buy used when I can get a new for less” the game is over.
Horrible system. It’s unfair. Millionaires will donate $50-100k and that will eliminate any donors $5k or less
Capped at 5k per car you buy
Cool...but what's the incentive for the dealership? Why give a GT to Joe schmoe, when they could give it to their VIP who buys multiple cars
The goal is to get the dealers not to participate in the markup at point of sale via an adm, goal would be to cater to a larger group of people selling them cars along the way and have a method to offer GT cars when available to that group - not a small group of selective VIP's.
@@ignitionontheleft again, why would the dealers want to do that? It would be less beneficial to them
What dealership loved the idea? I’d start doing business with them.
If they want - i can share, they know who it is. :)
Cute story, but flawed in so many ways…
Kudos to thinking of a solution but honestly it's not on buyers to solve, it's on Porsche. At the end of the day I'm there to buy a car I want. I'm not there to be their friend. I'm not there for the culture of their dealership. It's a business, treat it as such and stop gaslighting customers into believing it's anything bigger than what it really is: a transaction.
I think Ferrari does that
Sorry, but this is a bit of an absurd solution that changes nothing as those with the deepest pockets that will pay $$$ over MSRP will still end up with cars. The only logical, and best, solution is to have an actual waiting list that is limited to local buyers for each dealer. The list should be open for a set period of time that Porsche will agree to manufacturer 100% of orders for. Until Porsche agrees to build a car for every GT order, nothing will change unfortunately - nothing else will work.
I like absurd. :)