Camelot: Musical Hell Review #37

[@LaDracul]

Without this movie, we wouldn't have that lovely "Animaniacs" gag about Sir Richard Harris having two volumes: low and dignified and YELLING HIS BRAINS OUT!

[@MissCaraMint]

LaDracul Or that "What’s your name Tom" joke. At least I think that was Harris.

[@CharlesMoss091]

DRAGON!! DRAGON!! DRAGON!!

[@shaynabarnhard2274]

"Oh sir knight, PLEASE PASS THE KETCHUP!"

[@moviemonster2083]

It started with SCTV's Dave Thomas and his Richard Harris impersonation which was spot on.

[@HeartyArtie]

Where are you getting this 'sir' from? Richard Harris was Irish.

[@timothymclean]

I wonder why it is that people try to tone down the supernatural stuff in Arthurian mythos. I mean, just straight adapting it would put the story in an odd place between realism and fantasy (as you would expect for a time when unseelie were considered to be as big a threat as the Plague), but you _can_ go the other way. A high-fantasy interpretation of King Arthur, perhaps with a Tolkienesque good-old-days-go-with-the-magic deal, could be great.

[@briarpelt2333]

Agreed! The fey stuff may not be the most important part of Arthurian legend, but it's an essential characteristic nevertheless--and for people like me, a huge part of what makes it worthwhile to begin with! I would love to see Arthur and Tolkienesque high fantasy combined.

[@martinar.5722]

Have you read Marion Zimmer Bradley's Mists of Avalon? I think it's the most fantasy-like adaptation I've read with all characters being three-dimensional.

[@PassTheMarmalade1957]

I think people are just too preoccupied with figuring out who the real Arthur was, or if he ever existed. They're always trying to do realistic interpretations, trying to tell the 'real story' of the Arthur legend.

[@davidspring4003]

Especially in this musical, where Merlin was implied to have just had Arthur imagine being transformed into animals, “ages backwards” (whatever that means), Nimue is in the play for all of a minute, and Morgana is off in an invisible castle and implied to not actually exist...at least in the version I saw.

[@timothymclean]

​@@PassTheMarmalade1957 I think the evidence makes that pretty clear: He was some guy in Britain after the fall of Rome, a post-fall-of-Rome Briton who fought Angles and Saxons.
The first written accounts of him (written in the 900's) say that in 516 Arthur won the battle of Badon for the Britons in and carried the cross for three days (probably on his shield?), and that in 536 he and Mordred "fell" in the Strife of Camlann and that there was death in Britain and Ireland. Things not mentioned: Who Arthur was outside of battle, his connection to Mordred (including little details like if they were fighting on the same side or not), whether Arthur and Mordred died or if they were just wounded. There's a lot of room for speculation, but it doesn't sound like Arthur had many great accomplishments outside of battle, and _certainly_ doesn't sound like he introduced mid- to high-medieval concepts to England centuries early.
Oh, and a lot of fan favorite characters (most importantly for most stories, Chretian de Troyes's OC Lancelot) were added well after Geoffery of Monmouth expanded on these two random guys from the distant past. Yes, modern versions of the King Arthur story are basically retelling fanfiction of fanfiction-one layer of fanfiction being "Let's expand on this minor character who sounds cool" and the other being focused on the author's Marty Stu. Most authors adapting the work sand off the worst of the fanficky elements alongside antiquated concepts of what mattered to a story, thank the Opposition.
TL;DR: More "realistic" portrayals of King Arthur still focus on the parts that, according to our oldest historical sources, didn't happen, involving many characters who didn't even exist until some a French poet submitted his interpretation of the legend to the Dark Ages equivalent of Wattpad.

[@LostApotheosis]

Lancelot had more chemistry with that guy he almost killed than he did with Guin.

[@ScorpionFlower95]

Finally someone said it

[@Zggy91]

One thing that always bugs me in adaptations of Arthurian lore is that it almost always leaves out Gawain. The contrast between him and Lancelot always struck me as one of the biggest themes in the stories. Gawain was a competent knight who’s morals raised him to prominence while Lancelot was arrogant but able to back his boasts. Despite this they were close friends, and Gawain dies fighting Lancelot, who he knows he can’t beat, because his honor demands it.

[@jenniferschillig3768]

It's a little odd that this musical, based on The Once And Future King, leaves out Gawain and his brothers (except for Mordred)--who were so important in TOaFK.

[@timothymclean]

Fun fact: Lancelot, the super-awesome knight with an exotic backstory and basically no flaws who totally gets the girl instead of the former protagonist, was basically an OC inserted into the story at a time when the nobility of courtly love trumped the sin of adultery. Another fun fact: Gawain, a knight defined mainly by being even purer than Lancelot (and Percival, the Grail Knight before Gawain came along) is _another_ OC, inserted by an author who thought courtly love was stupid, adultery was bad, and Camelot deserved an even more blandly perfect knight than Lancelot had been.
Yes, the Arthurian mythos is basically a layer cake of fanfiction.

[@lizzychrome7630]

@@timothymclean What about the New Testament? It introduces a new OC who is related to the first book's main character, and shares all of His powers, is loved by everyone but the bad guys, is always right, comes back from the dead, and has a unique name. Is Jesus the first Mary Sue?

[@timothymclean]

@@lizzychrome7630 Well...first off, "Jesus" was a pretty common name until some people decided that naming your kid after him would be blasphemous. More importantly, given the history of the New Testament, I'd consider it to be more like mythology than literature from basically every perspective (except that mythology generally doesn't have a central body enforcing a singular version of all myths). If we accept that Jesus is a Mary Sue, the same applies to other demigods with a similarly narrative-dominating presence.

[@lizzychrome7630]

@@timothymclean I was joking.

[@harrietamidala1691]

After this, I wonder if you are thinking of tackling Quest for Camelot. I'm already imaging the opening: "I'm Diva, your judge, jury, executioner and...*sighs* here we go again. *cue snippet of "Spamlot" song from Monty Python" Oh, I wish. Once again we have another camelot based musical, Quest for Camelot."

[@jenniferschillig3768]

That gets my vote!

[@kaileykrantz]

Love the creativity

[@EYTPS]

She is, next month

[@sarahcole9661]

“But because by forgiving me, I suffer more.”
“Yyyyep. Definitely a Catholic.”
I laughed a little too hard at that one, thank you

[@katwernery6505]

It is also a sin they cut Mordred’s song, “The 7 Deadly Virtues”

[@Stari27]

I was looking for someone to point that out

[@elizabetheowynbelle]

Agreed, "The 7 Deadly Virtues" is one of the most delightfully underrated villain songs ever.

[@troyschulz2318]

Especially because David Hemmings was one of the only actors who could actually, y'know, SING.

[@faeagenda7995]

They. WHAT‽

[@steveliveshere]

Film versions always cut down the number of songs particularly in the second act. Mainly because as a film it comes across as too lengthy, where as in stage plays they are usually trying to find the hit in the second act. The only film version of a stage play that has ever been longer than the play is the original roadshow version of South Pacific. Every other film has cut numbers and is shorter than the play.

[@lillyofthenorth8798]

I never noticed until now, but the way Vanessa Redgrave looks and is dressed in the "May" song reminds me a lot of Florence Welch of Florence + The Machine.

[@MissCaraMint]

Oh god that scene with the boy at the end. Harris did the play so many times that at one showing he said "What's your name Tom?" I never can take that scene seriously ever having herd that story. I always end up smiling.

[@steveliveshere]

That's interesting. Apparently Harris believes it was a stand out scene and was picked in a retrospective he attended.

[@MissCaraMint]

@@steveliveshere My parents at least still quote «what’s your name Tom» to this very day. I mean it IS a magnificent scene leading into that wonderful speach about remembering Camelot.

[@steveliveshere]

@@MissCaraMint yeah I get what you're saying and it is funny 👍

[@lauradietrich9424]

This may be unpopular, but here goes: I think Joshua Logan is one of the most incompetent film directors who ever tricked Hollywood into giving them a career. I have no doubt he was a decent stage director, but it does not translate into film in the slightest: uncomfortably long close-ups of people singing (often directly into the camera), interminably long stretches of medium shots of people either standing stupidly or dancing awkwardly (uh, they're called cuts, Josh, they're your friends), and editing that is either choppy or nonexistent.
I agree that Richard Harris is all wrong for King Arthur, he's much too squirrelly and lacks proper regal bearing and vulnerability. I'm not the biggest Richard Burton fan (God knows he was guilty of phoning it in later on), but at his best he was above reproach, and while he was no singer, I've no doubt his Arthur was superior.
Kudos for pointing out the depressing visuals. Ugh, so much brown! It brought to mind Lewis Black's bit about the dreary, grey winters of Chicago: "After a while, you look at your wrists and think, 'Maybe if I slit 'em, I'll see some color!'"

[@hannahbrennan2131]

Joel Schumacher: Am I a joke to you?

[@kennethwayne6857]

A lot of what you're saying is true, but let's not forget Logan was the only director to get something resembling a real acting performance from Marilyn Monroe. Not even Olivier could manage that.

[@robertlauncher]

Harris is far better onstage, I do blame the direction for almost everything in this film, including Harris’ lost feeling performance

[@steveliveshere]

I disagree in fact I think this is one of his best musical films possibly better than South Pacific that he made because of his instance on actors rather than singers and the close-ups took advantage of this and are cinematic and very involving - it's a film right and this is the style Logan was going for. It modernises the story adding an anti-war view and 60s flower power tinge. These things made it unique and the film made money. But some critics were expecting from producer Jack Warner an embalming of the stage version like My Fair Lady was. But Logan was going for the opposite and he succeeded IMHO.

[@stevenzumbrun6105]

Logan did put out two highly entertaining biographical volumes ("Movie Stars, Real People, and Me") which detail the various hells he went through on his big musical productions (Vanessa Redgrave wanted to sing "Take Me to the Fair" in French to make fun of Lancelot, for example). On "South Pacific", he was told the color filters would be subtle and understated, not drench the screen in yellow and purple--and then the studio wouldn't pay to have the color removed. It was always SOMETHING--and let's also not forget he was responsible for the horrific film of "Paint Your Wagon"!

[@forlandm]

I find Harris's eye make-up quite irritating..

[@gwendolynwestwind9764]

Same! I couldn't turn off the bit of my brain going "why does he have so much eyeshadow??"

[@elizabetheowynbelle]

5:50-6:04: It sure was nice of them to invite all those candles to the wedding.
I agree that the colorless aesthetic of this movie is just dreadful; Camelot looks less like a royal court and more like a filthy hippie commune. Hell, if you play "Time of the Season" over "The Lusty Month of May" sequence, it could pass for a cut scene from "Woodstock".

[@timothymclean]

That's an insult to hippies. They at least know how to rock tie-dye.

[@harlequinade2709]

I've always found movies from 60s and 70s movies to feel drab in general.

[@maryloohoo8526]

Nothing on this channel has made me happier than your use of Mal telling "TRAP" in the serenity outtakes rather than the maybe more conventional Admiral Akbar clip
...Okay maybe the thing about Moses' radioactive armpits from the Ten Commandments review but that's it!

[@4Mr.Crowley2]

Diva, love the review. I am a medievalist, and I LOATHE the color palette of this film. I nearly squealed in demonic delight when you pointed out how hideously drab the film is -- which makes absolutely no sense historically or especially in terms of a 1960s film musical. To me, Richard Harris spends the entire film trying to out-Shakespearean tragedy Burton, which destroys the film. The main tension for me is that the source material is horribly jumbled together -- and it does not work at all. T.H. White's The Once and Future King, written after WWI, heavily influenced by Twain's Conneticut Yankee, and the source for the jokey jokes, Merlin aging backwards, etc etc, is obviously radically different in tone than Tennyson (I'd love a film musical of the Idylls), Malory, the awesome fourteenth-century Gawain-poet, earlier French sources like Chretien de Troyes or Marie de France, early English sources like Geoffrey of Monmouth, and certainly the earliest medieval Welsh Arthurian sources ( Taliesin). These texts are radically different from each other in tone -- so trying to blend them together haphazardly in a musical (even if "mostly" based on White and Malory -- no, it doesn't work) has always seemed very wrong-headed to me.

[@punkwrestle]

Technically, since the legendary Arther would have been born around 500ad, that would be way before medieval times, and back to when they were using mud castles, so if that is the case isn’t the color palette more suited for the time when historical Arther would have been around?

[@kennethwayne6857]

@@punkwrestle I believe for the musical the time was brought up to the 1100's or possibly later.

[@Mythologos]

@@kennethwayne6857 It's set in the 15th century, Malory is the boy at the end.

[@kennethwayne6857]

@@Mythologos But we know who the British kings were in the 15th century. I think they make liberal use of dramatic license and play fast and loose with time schemes.

[@stevenzumbrun6105]

Logan disliked the original sketches the production designers submitted to him, saying that they looked like every other picture set in medieval times, and he encouraged everyone to come up with their own ideas. They obviously took him at his word....

[@TheaterRaven]

Diva, have you seen "Queens of Avalon"? It's a musical by Heather Dale, a songwriter and singer who's known for her Arthurian material, and it focuses on the relationship between Guinevere and Morgan Le Fay. They spend their summers training on Avalon and grow up as "sisters", but are eventually pitted against each other due to pride, destiny, and the men in their lives. If you enjoy the Arthurian legends, I'm sure you'll like this twist on it. Just a suggestion. Love your videos. Keep up the good work!

[@alisaurus4224]

I love Heather Dale!

[@willlyon7129]

Is it similar to Mist of Avalon?

[@TheaterRaven]

@@willlyon7129 It's similar in that one of the main conflicts is Morgana and Guinevere are taught by the Lady of the Lake to revere nature and themselves and to choose their own paths in life, but such freedom only exists on Avalon and when the girls leave it, they're confronted by and have to live in the patriarchal world which is traditionally presented in the Arthurian legends. Plus, there's the added drama of Morgana and Guinevere growing up together and seeing each other as sisters and trying to maintain that relationship as the quarreling roles fated for them play out.

[@EricMontreal22]

Joshua Logan is an interesting case in general. By all accounts he was a great stage director--and certainly he helmed and often helped shape some of the most important plays and musicals of the golden age (and film that exists of his production of South Pacific in London shows a remarkably fluid and modern feeling staging). But his film work--even when adapting his own stage pieces (Picnic and South Pacific which, flaws and all, may be the best) are invariably extremely heavy handed and overly literal.

[@gageperuti5519]

Fun bit of trivia: John F Kennedy loved the play, especially the last reprise of the title song.

[@j3ssthealien283]

Wait is that why in The Presidents Song from the Animaniacs. It "John Kennedy had Camelot"

[@SkyeID]

Nero and Redgrave married 40 years after they were in this movie together! Well.. I guess it gave them plenty of time to get to know each other enough to be sure that they wanted to be together!

[@jenniferschillig3768]

They did hook up on the set, had a son out of wedlock, broke up, Vanessa was with Timothy Dalton for a while, then they got back together and married.

[@stefanfilipovits21]

I think the rumors of Richard Harris’s really epic drunkenness and belligerence on set goes a looooong way to explaining his performance. If u want a laugh look up the stories & rumors from the time. One of them involved him assaulting a producer.

[@LucyLioness100]

I was going to say the same. His drunk was during this film shoot was legendary & indeed caused no end of headaches for everyone

[@punkwrestle]

To be fair he didn’t get over leaving his cake out in the rain and it took so long to bake it and he’ll never have that recipe again!

[@robertlauncher]

This was actually the first episode I watched.
"Oh, boy, I love the soundtrack of this Arthurian based "Camelot", the musical must be great!"
*Watches the HBO stage airing on YT.* "It's okay, but maybe a film adaptation could trim the fat of the story. I'll look up a review to see... why's it on a show called Musical Hell?" *Watches.* "OH, GOD WHAT DID THEY DO TO GUINEVERE'S SONGS?"

[@ilikecurry2345]

Gamer Rob My first was the 1998 Rudolph.

[@robertlauncher]

Catherine Lipscomb Sad part? I accidentally rented that as a kid once.

[@ilikecurry2345]

Gamer Rob Well, it's OK at best.

[@MissCaraMint]

I was Chamelot on stage. I bought some of the songs iTunes thinking they were from the film (I just assumed seeing Richard Burton on the creddits that it was the film version because of how prominent a film actor he was). I was in for a rude awakening from my blissfull ignorance with this revew.

[@IAmTheUnison]

Hmm, I think I'll stick with 1981's "Excalibur". By far, a much more enchanting telling of Arthurian legend...or at least I like to think so.

[@robertlauncher]

As for stage Harris, he's still a bit awkward, but he's better than he was on film.

[@amiefortman7220]

+Gamer Rob Oh, I think he's miles better on stage than he was on film. I think it's just his acting style.

[@MissCaraMint]

Amie Fortman "What’s your name Tom?"

[@LucyLioness100]

His rowdy antics didn’t do him many favors either nor did his perpetual drinking

[@elizabethfields2658]

King Arthur reminded me of Hamlet. He was emo, brooding, had an in general off-setting was of interacting.

[@misfittoys5873]

"Resurrection is the ultimate aphrodisiac" truer words have never been spoken

[@alisaurus4224]

Rise again, eh wot

[@winters_revolt]

Apparently, from what I researched, when Richard Harris played the character on stage he was a lot better, I went ahead and listened to him sing "I Wonder What The King Is Doing Tonight" on both the movie soundtrack and the 1983 London Cast Recording, and he does sound better on the latter, and apparently there is an HBO recording of the 1981 revival where he played the character that is available.

[@user-mx2ky5ui8e]

I’ve seen that one! Harris is significantly better in the revival. Still a bit melodramatic, though. The scene where he yells “VENGEANCE!!” has been bouncing around my brain ever since I watched it; dude could knock down a telephone pole with that scream.

[@janeyrevanescence12]

I think this adaptation meant to be a deconstruction of the myth of Camelot, due to the assassination of the person who is most associated with Camelot; JFK. The optimism associated during JFK's tenure had been replaced with feelings of pessimism and cynicism thanks to events happening at the time. Now if the original musical had been written in the style of, say, Sweeney Todd, (where the humor is directly tied to the dark nature of the story), I think this movie would've worked a little better. Then again, that's my two cents.

[@jenniferschillig3768]

Mmm...I don't think it's so much that but being true to the themes of T.H. White's The Once And Future King, which this is an adapation of.

[@steveliveshere]

I actually think that's the films strength! LOL. I guess life would be pretty boring if we all had the same opinion.

[@robertofenloch9595]

While the movie may have been really disappointing, at least it didn't just completely change the entire stage show (looking at you, Cabaret), cutting out three of my favorite songs notwithstanding: Fie on Goodness, Seven Deadly Virtues, and Before I Gaze At You Again. I'm also convinced Lerner & Loewe were fans of the pre-rap stylings for Broadway shows. Richard Harris AND Richard Burton both talk-singed throughout their songs (Burton actually did it less than Harris if I remember) as well as Rex Harrison in My Fair Lady (both versions), and I think Paint Your Wagon did it too.
I don't understand all the negative press for the original stage version. It has some of the best songs outside of a Rodgers & Hammerstein show up to that point.
And I don't know if you legitimately don't understand what Arthur was trying to say to Merlin at the end of the movie, but it's "Make me a hawk."

[@stevenzumbrun6105]

Burton was told he could Rex Harrison his songs in the stage version, and he said no--that he was from Wales and his countrymen would slaughter him if he didn't at least try to sing all he could.

[@FabricFool]

I saw this in theatres when it first came out, and was disappointed beyond belief. Julie Andrews is/was the stud of Broadway musicals, and got shafted no less than twice out of making the movie versions of roles she made hers. And I don’t think I’d get too much argument that she could (and did) seamlessly straddle the worlds of stage and screen (apologies for all the sibilants there). Vanessa Redgrave is lovely and talented, but she was not the vocalist this project needed. Then again, I’m repeating you here, and that’s not what I came to do.
I wanted to mention the correlation of Lerner/Lowe Camelot and Kennedy’s Camelot. The US was so excited to have our own version of the Arthurian idealism exposited in the show; ultimately, we lost our Camelot too, through treason of another kind. I always think of this when Arthur sings, “...that once there was a spot/For one brief shining moment that was known as Camelot.” And I always tear up and weep for the US we could have been had Kennedy been allowed to stay among us. Though I was too young to remember clearly, I know my parents were devastated, and we spoke of it in hushed terms for decades.
I’m not expressing myself very well here; I hope I’ve made some kind of sense.

[@jenniferschillig3768]

It's a bit of a toss-up between Julie and Vanessa. Julie had an exquisite singing voice, but she played it too ladylike and delicate (as was her wont) for Guinevere, who's supposed to be hot-blooded and earthy. Vanessa's singing voice was nowhere near as lovely as Julie's, but she brought out those qualities in Guinevere much better than Julie did.

[@LaydiNite]

I... honestly really love this movie. To be fair, I've never seen Camelot onstage, but I do have a great deal of affection for it. The acting didn't bother me, but I've found I have a lot more tolerance for certain types of melodrama than most.

[@SEELE-ONE]

3:20 How many Muppets did they kill to make that thing!?

[@PeachBoba1523]

Me: *Hears the final song
Also me: *Remembers the ending of Jackie
Also also me:*cries 😭

[@TheForeverfree1]

This was a movie with well liked actors for that time a great story, scenery and music. People seniors now enjoyed it.

[@willcunningham4724]

I will never forgive them for massacring The Lusty Month of May...the Julie Andrews version is on my list of favorite showtunes of all time :(

[@LucyLioness100]

Dame Julie is a treasure & she’ll be the eternal stage Guinevere

[@Grethrey123]

Before I Gaze At You as well. One of the loveliest songs for a soprano I’ve ever heard…although admittedly I’m not sure how Redgrave would have fared with it listening to her other vocal attempts in this movie so, perhaps…cutting this song is a Saving Grace?

[@graciegalahad9258]

Diva, you can make as many Monty Python references as you want. I love both the movie and the musical (Spamalot), so bring it on!

[@anna_in_aotearoa3166]

I swear Arthur (Harris) is wearing twice as much eyeliner as Guinevere (Redgrave) in this movie! No shade on guys in makeup but it definitely makes one wonder how much inspiration the production was taking from prior medieval spoofs!

[@stevehinnenkamp5625]

Who is the voice behind this incisive, critical evaluation?
She is brilliant! Unlike others blessed with an ultra sense of humor.
Right on target. Thank you for saying the truth in a way only you can.

[@rasaan2011]

Absolutely love your singing, your content, well informed opinions, style & humor!!! The only thing I hate is that I just recently found your ch, but I have been thoroughly enjoying the binge watching!!!😸❤😸

[@scarylion1roar]

Graham Chapman openly talked about his alcoholism and being drunk during the filming of Holy Grail, and his decision to become sober while filming the Bridge of Death scene. Richard Harris was super drunk during the filming of Camelot.

[@maniacaldude]

I've never seen this movie before, but when it comes to adaptations of Arthurian legend (that aren't the comedic ones like Monty Python and the Holy Grail and Disney's The Sword In The Stone), I personally prefer the 1981 film Excalibur. Great dream-like atmosphere, great acting (especially from Nicol Williamson as Merlin), epic music, and extremely violent battles. It might not be for everyone, but I certainly love it.

[@punkwrestle]

Except of course it’s historically bad, the Arthur legend takes place around 500ad, all the plate mail they use is just silly, no one around that time would have even had plate mail like that.

[@markelijio6012]

Warner Bros. - Seven Arts' highest grossing musical picture of the 1967-1968 year and winner of 3 Oscars, including Alfred Newman/Ken Darby's
adaptation score in 1968.

[@annaolson4828]

Does anyone else hear Redgrave's rendition of "The Lusty Month of May" and think of Madeline Kahn in Blazing Saddles? Or is that just me?

[@janbrady4290]

That's just you.

[@johnpickford4222]

“It’s twu, it’s twu”

[@fanofmusicals]

My freshman year in college, I was doing a paper on Lerner​ and Loewe and I used Marni Nixon's book as one of my sources. One tidbit I came across​ was that at one point, Burton would star in the film, with Elizabeth Taylor (and Nixon dubbing for Liz). That would have been interesting.

[@DrGregoryHouseIT]

You know, I heard the end song in 'Jackie' and thought 'Why didn't they make a movie out of this musical?' Then I find out they did, and it's THIS. Holy mackerel this is bad!

[@j.g.2543]

they cut seven deadly virtues. that would have been a perfect sin.

[@sesfilmsllc]

Arthur’s played by the og Dumbledore.

[@ScorpionFlower95]

It's funny, I've watched the video a couple of times and when she said the actor's name, it flew completely over my head. But today, while watching the video again, she said the name and I was like "wait a minute!"

[@amiefortman7220]

It's kind of a shame that they cut out Mordred's two songs, but A) this movie is long enough as is, and B) I doubt David Hemmings would have done as well as Roddy McDowall (who made the speak-singing thing work for him a lot better than Harris and Redgrave did).

[@jenniferschillig3768]

Actually, David was the only really trained singer in the cast--and they cut his character's only song.

[@brianfuller5868]

Diva, I agree with you on every point. I enjoyed the stage production but...this would and should have been better.

[@barbthornell4786]

Unmitigated sap, egregious overacting, often painful vocalizations...and yet this movie/soundtrack still makes me weep for the lost innocence of the human condition.

[@jenniferschillig3768]

Many stage versions after the movie have taken the tack the movie does--starting it with the final battle and playing the rest as a flashback. That does a little bit to mitigate the flaw you mentioned--the fact that the first act seems mostly comic while the second gets into deeper and deeper tragedy. (However, it doesn't address the problem of the main villain never showing up or even being mentioned until two-thirds of the way through.)
What I'd like to see is a big-screen non-musical adaptation of The Once And Future King. They could probably do it as a trilogy, combining The Queen of Air and Darkness with The Ill-Made Knight, since not all that much HAPPENS in The Queen of Air and Darkness.

[@MusicalHell]

Jennifer Schillig Yes, there is a version of the script out there that roughly follows the movie. I believe Harris used it when he performed Arthur on stage.

[@jenniferschillig3768]

I think that version's on TH-cam now. When we read The Once And Future King in high school, our teacher showed us that version of Camelot, not this movie. The thing is...Richard Harris was in his fifties by then, which was fine for the more mature Arthur of the second act but not so much for the boyish king in his twenties. (It also ditches the Morgan Le Fay scene for the Arthur-and-Mordred "you wish me to be your son?" scene--a good call dramatically.)

[@nolanmcbride5653]

I'm fairly certain the original version does use have the story start and end right before Arthur's final battle. The version I saw did at least, and it also had the invisible wall bit.

[@EricMontreal22]

Lerner endlessly adapted his script--including (like the movie but reflected in revivals) removing a lot of the magical elements in the original production.

[@alexisgrey3633]

Lol @ 'Les Miserables if every character was played by Russell Crowe!'

[@WobblesandBean]

Is it just me, or is there something...off...in the way Guinevere's mouth moves? During the may song, her mouth looks like a rubber band, it's deeply unsettling. It's like someone put orajel on her teeth and she's doing her damndest to curl her lips away from them.

[@pseudonymous9153]

Lol when Arthur falls out of the tree at 4:35 you can CLEARLY see the mattress "snow" bounce right back

[@nathanielcraig3588]

You know, I don't think people give Richard Harris enough credit for this film, he's always been very... Oh my goodness! I left the cake outside! And it would be raining too. Sorry, we'll have to discuss this later.

[@alexlella8771]

The worst song of all time... according to Dave Barry readers for what that's worth.

[@collegealgebravideos9540]

Excellent analysis. One thing you could have mentioned is that the severe shortening of Mordred's part removed the cleverest song in the musical: The Seven Deadly Virtues

[@DeepEye1994]

Is this Linkara's favorite movie?

[@KidSnivy69]

According to his Holy Terror review (at the very least the musical)

[@davidspring4003]

It's his favorite musical, and he uses clips from the movie when referencing it, but that's likely because the movie is easier to access than footage of the stage production.

[@megcormier]

4:53 Why does she sound disappointed/angry about him not taking advantage of her? Wasn't she just cowering in fear anticipating that very thing? Shouldn't she be, idk, relieved?!?! Or were they running out of time/money and that was just the best take? Or was it just bad direction like what seems to be happening to Richard Harris?

[@MusicalHell]

Guinevere has an extremely skewed notion of romance at this point in the play.

[@megcormier]

@@MusicalHell Oh ok. This is my first time seeing any version of the play in any format. So I was like, "WTF?"

[@jenniferschillig3768]

@@MusicalHell Exactly. That's what "The Simple Joys of Maidenhood" is all about--this seventeen-year-old girl thinks of war and violence as romantic, since the only experience she's probably had of them is in the minstrels' songs and tales she's heard in her father's palace. It's very different when she tries to make these fantasies come true, and it ends up getting one of her favorite knights killed (fortunately, to be brought back to life by Lancelot). And it's even more different--and even more tragic--when she gets EXACTLY what she longed for in her first song by the end of the show.

[@jenniferschillig3768]

I'd like to see you tackle the animated Quest for Camelot.

[@ingonyama70]

I still adore "C'est Moi" for its ham, but I agree, it's been done far better.

[@jackbutler6606]

The most baffling thing about this is that a statue dedicated to Harris in his birthplace of Limerick is based on the movie look specifically.... Like they couldn't gone with any other role? The Bull McCabe? Peachum from Mack the Knife?

[@mowesrik]

I have one thing to say about this film. Without Julie Andrews and Richard Burton it was doomed. They're geniuses and had amazing chemistry. Without it the musical simply isn't what it was designed to be. I mean they wrote Guinevere especially for Julie, it's obvious that a mediocre singer will never fill that role.

[@Hewylewis]

What are your thoughts on the Into The Woods movie? I thought the first half was great, but immediately began to drag when the Giantess came down.

[@MusicalHell]

I talk about that right here! th-cam.com/video/SL3oFs6eMbg/w-d-xo.html

[@Hewylewis]

Musical Hell Ah, okay.

[@ScorpionFlower95]

My thoughts exactly

[@corelei]

I think he said "make me a hawk" hahaha

[@torimott6354]

My musical playlist has you to thank for adding so many great titles (music man, evil dead, the broadway cast of camelot ect) I never knew of before, THANK YOU!

[@Tomwebsterart]

Extended hobbit trilogy? How cruel! But then again, Demon.

[@AmazingThor]

Burton, Andrews, and Goulet are three of the biggest personalities (and voices) to ever grace the stage. Trying to replace any of them was doomed to failure. You can feel the vacuum left by their absence.

[@troyschulz2318]

Part of the reason the movie doesn't work is that the casting of Harris, Redgrave, Nero, and Hemmings felt really at odds with the tone the movie was shooting for. I part of why the movie's so poorly regarded is because it's this big, sweeping, very old-school Hollywood epic starring actors best known for kitchen sink drama and arthouse movies, while Logan's direction is as formalist as you can get. It's an internal contradiction the movie never resolves.

[@EYTPS]

At least Richard looks like he's having the time of his life with his role

[@winters_revolt]

You know, I actually like Richard Harris singing voice, this is one of the voices where I actually don't get why people say his singing is bad, I honestly think his voice fits the role, but his acting is a bit too hammy for me in the movie.

[@janmikhailgaid4562]

To hear more of Richard Harris' singing, try "MacArthur Park".

[@punkwrestle]

Jan Mikhail Gaid He just said he didn’t like hammy!

[@robertwilloughby8050]

Yes, lets agree that Richard Harris' voice is 1) technically pretty fair. 2) And astonishingly hammy at times too. Scarily, the same two points can stand for his acting too.......;-)

[@winters_revolt]

@@robertwilloughby8050 Yeah... I know he was a great actor, but he does seem like he has too much fun hamming it up.

[@LucyLioness100]

He’s not a great singer, but at least he was better than Pierce Brosnan in “Mamma Mia”. That hurts more than Richard’s talk-singing

[@janeyrevanescence12]

"Goody-Two Hooves..." Cue spit take!

[@seani8698]

Vanessa Redgrave is absolutely lost in this movie

[@genevaharris2107]

I completely agree with most of what you said about this musical. I don’t like the singing, especially Richard Harris, who doesn’t seem to be singing on pitch. Yet, somehow he was able to sing it on stage, but I don’t think he played the role well, nor did he sing it well.During his monologues, he doesn’t seem to have a voice.

[@tinymxnticore]

That last sentencing was colder than the innermost circle, Diva 🥶

[@LittleJoeTheMoonlightCat]

Yea Speaking of Speak Singing, That's a Sin for CATS 2019, Speak Singing in CATS is Meant for the Beginning with Numbers like "The Naming of Cats" and "The Invitation to The Jellicle Ball" AKA "Explanation". But for The Most part Speak Singing in CATS IS A TABOO. And Don't say it Diva. "But Moonbeam I thought you liked CATS?" Don't get Me wrong CATS will ALWAYS be my favorite musical of all time, with NEWSIES as a Close second. But Even I got to call the Sins where I see Them, and Alan Menken Can write Music, He Jump Started the Disney Animation Renaissance Films with "The Little Mermaid", and Ariel's Sister Alana is Named after Alan Menken. Well Lancelot's Song does Translate to It's Me, so it is an I am song.

[@willlyon7129]

Let's all say it that Excalibur is the definitive and a much better King Arthur movie ever made.

[@DreamDancer82]

"Camelot! Camelot! Camelot! Camelot!"
For some reason, that's got something stuck in my head, from and old Bugs Bunny cartoon.....
"Leopold! Leopold! Leopold! Leopold!"

[@mothafuckinfoofighter8543]

Richard Harris sounds like a melodramatic Jack Donaghy.

[@EYTPS]

Wait, David Hemmings and Venessa Redgrave were also in one of my favorite movies, Blowup

[@sirjedisentinel]

My biggest issue with this movie is the cutting of the Merlin plotline. Yeah, it's short & doesn't really contribute to the narrative, but (aside from what you mentioned) "Follow Me" is my favorite part of the show (and I'm not a fan of how the movie utilizes it)

[@travisgrant5608]

Saw this movie as a kid and was fascinated by it. I was mesmerized! 👍🤗💞

[@jenniferschillig3768]

For all its flaws, I do still like this film version of Camelot--maybe it's because the soundtrack album is how I was introduced to the score.
But there's one thing that puzzles me a bit--nearly all suggestions of magic or fantasy that were in the original stage script have been cut out of the movie version. As I said below, the removal of the Morgan Le Fay scene is good riddance to bad rubbish--the Mordred/Arthur confrontation is more dramatically appropriate and fits better into the story than this scene with this witch that comes out of nowhere.
However, in the stage version, Merlin taught Arthur by turning him into animals (as in the original book). In this movie, Arthur takes great pains to say Merlin "made me believe I had been changed into animals", maybe by hypnosis or something. So Merlin seems to be less a wizard and more an eccentric old man with a few tricks up his sleeve. (And only seen in flashback, instead of in the forest with Arthur in the beginning.) Pellinore, instead of searching for the fantastical Questing Beast, has simply "misplaced his kingdom" and is wandering around looking for it. There's no mention of Nimue (that I remember) or what happened to Merlin so that he's no longer around--"Follow Me" is given entirely different lyrics and a different context. (Not that it isn't quite lovely in this version.) Not even the script's passing mention of Archimedes the talking owl. Pretty much the only mentions of magic that I can think of in the script are Merlin's aging backwards. I wonder why they did it that way?

[@valmarsiglia]

If you want to see a good sendup of Richard Harris, SCTV's Dave Thomas is the best, imho. There's a parody movie called The Man Who Would Be King of the Popes, with Thomas as Richard Harris from Camelot, Joe Flaherty as Peter O'Toole from Becket and The Lion in Winter, and John Candy as Richard Burton from Becket. All of them spot-on impressions.

[@GazingForth]

Spot on. I'm putting on the musical (We open tonight!), and while it's an obnoxiously long show, BOY the movie is bad, and just a way to show off what you can do with film that you can't do on the stage. Also, Richard Harris is awful. Just awful.

[@MusicalHell]

GazingForth Break a leg!

[@thema1998]

Firstly, I picked a good time to rewatch this episode. It's still May after all! Secondly, I have to re-add "Camelot" to the list of movies that I completely forgot about. 🤓➡️😅

[@stefanfilipovits21]

Question from someone who’s waaaay more familiar w/ the film side of things than the stage side: what does pre-chorus line days mean? Just genuinely curious.

[@MusicalHell]

A Chorus Line was one of the first super long-running musicals on Broadway--the original production lasted a then-unheard of 15 years. It's basically the forerunner to the likes of Phantom, Lion King, Wicked, etc. today.

[@stefanfilipovits21]

Musical Hell oh got it! Thanks. Love ur stuff btw, literally been watching since the beginning. Ur great at what u do and the reviews are hilarious and interesting. Even to someone like me who isn’t as familiar with the histories and intricacies of music and musicals. The musical hell review of Jekyll & Hyde was the only good thing that came from that show.

[@thatoneguy9399]

I really think “how to handle a woman” is a saving grace because it’s a beautiful performance from Harris

[@rogue7723]

@Musical Hell. If you're in the mood for a good version of "The Lusty Month Of May" (that's not Julie Andrews, because who could top that), I reccommend Sierra Bogguss. Big fan of your vids, btw :)

[@LucyLioness100]

Sierra is an amazing talent! She’s one of my favorite Broadway actresses

[@Grethrey123]

I’m convinced Sierra Boggess is this generation’s Julie Andrews. A gorgeous soprano voice with seemingly no limits at all, charming to a fault as a person, hilarious, self-depreciating and determined to not say a bad word about anyone or anything.

[@WolfGratz]

In all fairness Harris was the least worst aspect although Hemmings wasn't too bad (I still prefer McDowell). Redgrave on the other hand was a disgrace both vocally and in terms of fatally undermining her characterisation including most of simple Joys of Maidenhood lest Guinevere come across as a thoughtless idiot unaware of the consequences of violence. Well that happens to be the whole point Ms Redgrave. Nero phones in his performance. Not a happy experience

[@LucyLioness100]

Considering I’ve even performed one of Guinevere’s solos, it’s daunting but it still saddens me that Vanessa is so lifeless with her singing (maybe it was the direction Idk).
Maybe we can consider it lucky that the year after this is probably what might’ve kept Roddy McDowall away from this unless it was the usual “put big names in roles” philosophy of the times

[@kimberlynorris338]

I'm not sure if anyone else has heard, but we're getting a concert performance of Camelot this spring with Lin-Manuel Miranda as Arthur and Ethan Slater (aka Spongebob Squarepants) as Mordred. Those two alone are guaranteed to make it spectacular.

[@jesusrox4u]

I think Arthur was trying to say “Make me a hawk. Let me fly away from here.” But it can be harder to tell since Harris’s enunciation doesn’t make that clear. Though what it sounds like he’s saying is unintentionally funny and likely not what the movie was going for which makes it funnier. 😂

[@natureissooamazing]

We condemn Joshua Logan & the screenwriters to listen to an extended version of the hobbit had me laughing so hard!😂 Great video!⚔✨

[@charischannah]

I can remember trying to watch this as a teen and just not getting past the first few scenes because there was no energy, and everything was so drab.

[@CameronProductions20]

"On second thought let us not go to Camelot it is a boring place."

[@harrietamidala1691]

Speaking of Monty Python, would you want to do a Top 5 Monty Python Songs?

[@Whightknight16]

On second thought let’s not go to Camelot, ‘tis a silly place

[@jackmonaghan8477]

Not only did Merlin conveniently forget to mention the whole "banging your wife" part in his foretelling, he also missed out the part where Arthur has it off with his sister and has a child (depending on which version of the tale you read).

[@martind349]

The "cheerful reds, blues, and blacks" of old England as an author whose name I can't recall described them must have been something to see. Designers seem to need to smudge period work like Sanford and Son's kitchen.

[@taiya001]

So essentially a kingdom got ruined due to dumba-es cheating. Nice going queeny and lancethestupid.

[@johnvinals7423]

20:02-20:19 The Collector and Bill Cipher bribe their uncle Discord with a bunch of candy and convince him to keep Queen Daenerys in the forest overnight by building an invisible wall around her.

[@Christineovison]

I was lucky enough to see Richard Harris on Broadway and he was sooo much better. And a nice man, too.

[@justqueennothighqueen38]

I was surprised that you thought this movie was bad enough to do an episode for it. I don't love it (but only because of the dower ending), but my mother loves it and I gave her the DVD for Mother's Day, just in time for her to watch it in the lusty month of May. I do wish it included the song "Before I Gaze at You Again."
You should have mentioned the movie "Letters to Juliet," since it's reflects the real-life romance between Vanessa Redgrave and Franco Nero. It's also an interesting contrast in pacing, which reflects how pacing has changed in general since the 1960s.

[@josevelez5598]

I want to know the name of the theme song for Musical Hell. Beautiful melody.

[@MarvPontkalleg]

It's "Dans Macabre" by Saint-Seans