Excellent perspectives Titus! Of course I'm the early adopter (and have from time-to-time ended up with an unplayable instrument after either an operating system, or hauptwerk, update misadventure!) - When we look at the Hauptwerk Journey (from pre-2002, to where we are now, and where v4 sits on that spectrum) - there is no question that what v4 is capable of will satisfy a majority of users. Gains become ever more incremental. However, I also recognize that the software developers only source of income are the updates (unlike the sample set producers that can go out and sample a new organ) - so I do see both sides of all of this. The MOST important thing however is to find musical inspiration in the tools at hand, and to MAKE great music (which you do, and I look forward to more!!!!)
Well said, Jerry. I absolutely want to support the developers, and understand this is their source of revenue, and I do want to support them when I find that my money is well spent.
Well said, Jerry! And I must admit: The most changes in the software are only usable for those (as we are) who are using the advanced version of Hauptwerk. That is the biggest issue I would say. So basic users or free users really don't benefit much from the upgrade. But well, if you really want to load bigger organs you have to have the advanced version and then you benefit from all the additions. What would I do without the reverb-module? This made me finally able to use dry sample sets by adding convolution reverb to them. And you can much better use the mixer now. Well and last: You won't be able to use a new sample set under HW 4 because you can't license it anymore with the old blue HW-Dongle. As Milan won't transfer licenses anymore but via the iLok-System. So I think you will have to consider an upgrade at that moment, when you really want a new organ-set... btw: I don't understand, why with HW particularly the users do fear upgrades so much... hmm...
I love your ideas, Titus! 😀 In my opinion the ‚pros‘ with the upgrade (in my case from HW 6 to 7) are minor compared to the hassle and time it would take to download/install/activate it including reloading all the sets. We will probably get forced to upgrade when new samplesets are released, but for the time being I‘m happy with my ‚old version‘ too!
You can tune each pipe in Hauptwerk 4. The issue that I have from time to time is that some of the mixture stops are not in tune on sample sets. I am probably like you in that I don't like much beating unless it is a celeste voice. There are several people who complain to the sample set producers about sample sets being tuned too well. I myself use to help my organ teacher tune a few organs and I also tuned one quite often in the town where I live, so I don't really like buying sample sets that I have to tune. I have a few sample sets where some pipe were out close to 40 cents. I am sure that Charles at Silver Octopus has combined Hauptwerk with real organ pipes. I think he has done a few organs like that in England. Thanks for the great videos!
Hello, Thanks for the video. It is indeed possible to individually tune every note of every stop with Hauptwerk and I believe that capability has been in place since Hauptwerk v2. Simply right click on a stop, select 'Adjust voicing....' then select 'Overall: tuning (cents)' from the drop down menu. I am using Hauptwerk 6 and it is the first adjustment parameter in the list. I don't recall what it was in v4 but it was indeed there. I used that version for several years. Then, each note of that stop can be individually tuned in real time using the appropriate sliders on the bottom half of the screen. You mentioned 'hybrid virtual/pipe' organs. Hauptwerk can indeed output the necessary MIDI signals to control pipework. I have never done that myself but others have.
Thanks for your response. I wondered whether some features existed that I wasn't aware of. I appreciate it. I will have to experiment with these features, and will let you know how I go.
Hear hear. You can tune individual notes already though on HW4 (in the voicing menu), but note that tuning is also affected by the adjustable random detune and wind stability facilities. I've had particular issues with Hereford, which 'out of the box' sounded like a giant harmonium. Took a lot of tweaking of the detune percentages but worth it.
To Pep Organ: Your comment about combining two or more organs is interesting because I had that done for me several years ago with Version IV. I had someone (the one that created the Caen 4 manual extended version) create a wonderful four manual 128 stop organ for me that used stops that I chose from the Caen, Zwolle, St. Maximin, Forcalquier and others. It was an experiment because the outcome was unceratin. I was told by naysayers that it would not work because there would be a problem with different reverbs from different organ stops. This turned out to not be a problem at all. I created and posted a TH-cam demonstaing this organ. I lost this organ during the migration process to Version VII something I didn't expect. I have a second Hauptwerk license and dongle that I can use with my previous computer but the 128 stop organ is gone forever.
I completely agree. Having had v6 for two years, and paying out monthly, I was relieved to find my old v4 installation discs. In v6, I often found the monthly licence would expire, and I'd be without a working organ until I got around to manually renewing it. I've found that even with the Free version of V4 you can load big instruments by adjusting bit rates and various memory options. I'm still looking to purchase an original V4 dongle BTW.
@@peporgan @peporgan These sets were built by amateurs, mostly from demonstration sets. If a set is not encrypted, then you can take stops and combine them at will. However, this is not for the faint-hearted. The design software is necessarily complicated; and it's not that easy to just take a rank from one organ and install it in another, from a tonal perspective.
When changing from Hauptwerk 4 to Hauptwerk 7, the old Hauptwerk4 license is irrevocably deleted. This is not pointed out beforehand, neither on the Hauptwerk website nor in the migration wizard.
That is just what happened to me! Really stinks! I spent 800 on the original and now they are expecting 30 for mitigration and 400 for the upgrade? I feel screwed... Hauptwerk is the one of the most expensive VSTIS and I just bought Hollywood Orchestra all under 400. And now they are saying I cannot roll back! Big mistake!!!
I was just thinking today that I’d like to combine various organs… why be limited to the construction choices of someone else if you can accomplish building “your” perfect organ? The halls would differ, but that can be part of the selection, mitigated other ways, or just accepted as part of a unique and robust set of acoustic colors that combine.
I think that there is a point missing re staying with H4.2.1. Some of the biggest organs like Billerbeck can be supported but the computer needs to be large enough and fast enough to cope, and they must have audio systems that are similarly capable. That can take expertise and maybe a lot of money. I use Windows on a dual octacore Xeon workststion fitted with 128G of fast RAM, but as many have observed, you do have to fiddle with Windows to avoid clicks and other issues - and sometimes you have to fiddle again - eg when Microsoft issues 22H2. You CAN do all this with H4.2.1 and once stable there is little motivation to change the application. I have also made a couple of small organs with only a handful of stops using the free version of 4.2.1 - simplicity is sometimes very desirable.
When you want to purchase a new sample-set, you have a problem with HW4 dus to the new iLok license system which is used to CC Metz and CC Caen. Christoph created a "Merge" file to use these two sets, incl. the free demo set of Dom Bedos, resulting in the "hybrid" Aristide 1 V2 set, emulating the famous CC organ of t. Ouen, Rouen. So merging samples is possible. When HW5 came out, many MD sample-sets were priced with 50% discount. So e.g. the $1000 Kampen Bovenkerk sample-set became $500.
On the other hand, V7 is faster, has better sound, and has convolution reverb built in. And before you say you wouldn't use it, consider this: If you want to load a set for which you don't have the memory, you can load without the accoustic and apply reverb. Even Melbourne Town Hall, which has little accoustic, is reduced from 62Gb to just under 32Gb. The sound is improved, it loads faster, and will fit more easily on the system. The improved editing for the stepper can be a great time-saver as well. And all for less than the cost of playing for a wedding.
(Part 1) Thank you for this; your insights are very good, and one would think this would be obvious to The Powers That Be behind the scenes. Every point you make seems also so obvious to me, and I'd think to TPTB, as well. A couple of customizations I have really thought are severely missing, are the following two: 1) to be able to move or copy a stop from one keyboard to another; or even a duplicate keyboard that could be "added" as there are some amazing sounding instruments but where there is NOT a good reed on one of the manuals - and it would be so helpful to have certain stops that would allow better balance, such as playing French Baroque and the many diologues where you need a cornet and a trompette on separate manuals, against a grand jeux....(Gonnigen organ, for instance, is a very good example; the reeds are great, but I want to have them on the upper manual, as well, not just on the lower - so I can really enjoy Clerambault's "dialogue" for Cornet and Trompette, that is modelled on a French Ouverture, with the slow opening with the Tirades, and going into a fast triple meter imitative - and really have a dialogue, even if those aren't the specific reeds available on the sample set); 2) many of the best organs in person have a real spatial aspect where when one plays chromatically on some of the most prominent stops - the sounding pipes were typically arranged either in a direct, perceptible linear fashion, but especially in the pedals, or reed stops, they would start at center and then alternately go to the next pipe to the right, then the next pipe to the left, gradually going out from Center alternating outwards to the further most Left and Right - this gives a spatial "dance" the the sound that is really important. As the great Wendy Carlos herself discovered, that spatial "orchestration" is essential to keep the ear from getting fatigued, among other things - it also adds a positive element of motion that is in itself, simply, extremely cool. I have rarely (if ever?) noticed that the people who have recorded this maintain this aspect and instead, one gets a melage of sound with the spatial movement aspect greatly minimized or not even present. This seems a terrible mistake. It would be nice to be able to assign a Left-Right balance to any particular note of any particular register. While many are fine as is, this would especially be striking, and much more "realistic" with pedal stops, particularly the reeds, but even some of the flute stops - if one imagines the 16th notes in Bach's Wedge fugue, when those enter into the texture, on a good organ, they dance about spatially - instead of being "flattened" and their distinct spatial positioning subsummed into vagueness. This seems like an very related aspect of being able to tune/detune any pipe one wants - just adds an extra parameter: Pitch, and Spatial Location. I've recorded and produeced over a dozen organ albums on some very European based instruments custom built and designed by the organist Anthony Newman (he was my teacher and colleague and dear friend) - and I believe it was a very versatle organ but based on European design in general, but also, with reeds and mixtures so it was also especially ideal and striking for the French Baroque repertoire, and also the German Baroque, as well as being capable of handling Franck, Reubke, Liszt, and Messaien, along with Vierne, and all the "Romantic Organ Masterworks", but also Clearambault, du Mage, Couperin as well, in addition to all of the rest of the repertoire, without wanting for anything. (This is such a track from one of the albums I engineered and produced, which one can really hear the clarity and spatial motion which is a part of the instrument, which I think was built by Rieger and Sons - Liszt: "Ad nos, ad salutarem undam" th-cam.com/video/TC0mqxoJs_s/w-d-xo.html and Liszt: "Fantasy and Fugue on BACH th-cam.com/video/UxXfXoI8DRc/w-d-xo.html - both of which played by Anthony Newman ) This is something that drives me crazy (and is dissapointing, considering the cost of the sample sets in general), when they are thinking the are doing us a favor but using multiple mics, but ignoring the "sound" from the vantage point of if the console is dead center in front of most of all the main pipework. It's a huge dissapointment; this would be a way to recreate that authenticity, that without which, the effect of the organ is "miniaturized", regrettably. I think like you said, the adherence of "purism" becomes a huge negative - as with this technology these things should all be possible. It's like a recent Kontakt sampleset by The Conservatory Collection, where they have sampled a "King of Sweeden" clavichord - which has a short octave - for 160 Euros (or possibly Pounds!) - and they didn't fill out the bass chromatically. So, forget playing any other repertoire but 16th and early 17th century music - no WTC, no Inventions, no French suites - let alone being able to play Haydn, so much of which was written for a clavichord. This is deeply regrettable, and, yes, maybe I sound like an American when I say that it's frankly quite stupid! Similarly, there is a Hauptwerk Set for a modern copy of the Ruckers 1610 harpsichord, and here, the people who recorded the set (I can't remember, this is all from memory!), on one of the registers, they accidentally switched the "long reverb tails" and the "short reverb tails" so that when one plays a short chord/note - one gets the short reverb tail; and it sounds terrible. Has there been an update? No! Fortunately, Pianoteq came out with an AMAZING replica of the 1610 Ruckers (the instrument Pinnock recorded The Goldbergs, as well as his amazing album of Handel "Chaconne" and several suites from Handel's 1733 set of suites - "The Queen's Harpsichord"), that has given me a "solution"; and I think their version 1.6 of Organteq, is going to hopefully force Milan Digital Audio to move forward and for less - because Pianoteq and Organteq are extremely designed to be customizable - and while the organ is not some wonderful specific famous organ, it is really good - and it cost so much less than the HW program itself, and less than the majority of somewhat overpriced (sometimes very overpriced) samplesets. I hope they keep pushing forward on their development. Also, they are probably going to be much more "Mac" friendly - as this is the result of Modart, which arose from the "Computer Music" "Think Tank" of ICRAM - where they wanted to use Acoustic Modeling, rather than samples and set about to replicate first conventional instruments, but then they started doing some extrarodinary historical instruments as well. An 1806 Graf Pianoforte - a favorite instrument of both Beethvoen and Haydn? It's amazing. (Arbitrary break - but continued immediately above, as "Part 2" - TH-cam thought the comment was too long)
I too much prefer to own outright my software (not just Hauptwerk) rather than a subscription model. This is an issue when updates become more and more frequent as it becomes far less of a financial incentive to buy, in Hauptwerk's case, the perpetual license. It also bothers me that, in spite of owning software outright, license keys are held on the vendor's servers. I assume your Hauptwerk is dongle based and this would be another advantage for you not upgrading.
That's right, I don't want to trust servers for my perpetual license. It might be more secure on their side for sales/ analytics, but is less reliable on the customer side.
License keys for the Hauptwerk software itself and for individual sample sets are not stored on vendor’s servers. Since v5, Hauptwerk has transitioned to the very commonly used Pace iLok licensing system because the security of the HASP USB keys used since (I believe) v2 was compromised by miscreants meaning it could no longer be relied upon to protect intellectual property. Pace iLok offers the option to store licenses either on their cloud servers or locally on a custom USB dongle. These devices are widely available for purchase. I too like to keep my license keys stored locally so I opted for the USB dongle approach.
@@stevemann9821 Thanks for this useful information. Does that mean that you can run Hauptwerk offline with a USB dongle, and even swap computers offline?
@@peporgan Yes, you can. As long as the licenses are present on the iLok dongle you can run Hauptwerk without an active Internet connection. You can also run Hauptwerk on another computer by just moving the dongle to it.
Well, you can buy a lifetime HW-license. I did that and its fine. And if you upgrade, you only pay an "upgrade-price" that at first is low and increases later. And with the iLok-System: As others pointed out already: Just get an iLock-Dongle (USB-Stick) and transfer all licenses to that and you can go around and use HW on many different Computers if you like, you just have to take your iLok-dongle with you.
Hi Titus. I have just subscribed. Like a few have already said, you can tune every "pipe". I have had Hauptwerk since 2003 and have been very reluctant to upgrade to HW7 but I took the plunge on Easter Day! I would say the sound is cleaner and so far I don't regret it though I've lost my St. Anne's Moseley Swell Nazard and my two 32ft stops. I hope HW7 stays as it is with any necessary bug fixes the only upgrade needed and not a big expense every other year.
This is indeed what is needed. Fantastic forward thinking and not that far fetched. Perhaps Hauptwerk has no competition hence Hauptwerks slow movement. I have an interesting situation, I am buying a viscount legend which is a Hammond clone organ and also acts as a midi controller for hammonds. I am wanting to try using the viscount legend as a midi controller for classical pipe organ music and am looking at haupwerk for this. Thoughts?
You can already combine sample sets with the CODM. You can also adjust the pitch of individual pipes. There are plenty of free organs out there also of very high quality, such as the Friesach sample set. You can certainly use software for a few years, but you said you used IV for more than 10 years already. The improvements, especially in audio quality, since IV have been huge. There are lots of reasons to upgrade to VII. My main concern is that Hauptwerk stay in business long term, and if they come out with a yearly update that is only $99 and this helps their business model work, I will support them.
@@peporgan I believe John is referring to what is known as the Custom Organ Design Module, a feature available that allows you to do exactly what you’re describing in your first point. The only issue is even though it’s a very simplified compared to compiling an actual Organ Definition File, it’s still not the most user friendly and require quite a decent tech savvy and knowledge of xml coding. I’ll attach a link to the manual. As far as controlling pipes, I believe Hauptwerk already has that feature and can be accomplished by configuring the MIDI on the Direct MIDI inputs/outputs panel correctly. Advanced voicing and tuning settings that apply in real time was also a feature that got added in Hauptwerk V. The problem you seem to be having is that even though these features exist, they aren’t heavily advertised or really explained in depth by anyone other than the manual, and there isn’t a user friendly interface to allow for less advanced users to take full advantage of them. www.scribd.com/document/442052161/Hauptwerk-Custom-Organ-Design-Module-User-Guide
Hi, I am using the Free edition of Ver 4, just a query / Can you change the sample set from St Annes to another as I have down loaded some free sets but can't find how to upload / If I have to have a full version of the software can one buy Ver 4 full edition / Only have a small amount of money
Like you, I've kept using Hauptwerk 4. The main reasons are because my Hauptwerk computer can't run iLok without major upgrades (it's a Windows issue) and because I don't think the iLok license terms provide adequate consumer protection. The main risk with keeping Hauptwerk 4 is that the USB dongle might eventually fail, and I'm not aware of any way to replace it.
To those considering upgrading to VII, perhaps the following might be helpful. I was happy with Version 4.2.1 for years but decided to upgrade based on improved audio claims ( i.e. sounding more like a pipe organ). The audio is slightly better, but hardly worth the expense and issues associated with upgrading. Hauptwerk owners may not be capable of upgrading by themselves and will require help from a professional. Your present computer may not be upgradable to handle Version VII, which was my case. It required purchasing a new computer ,which this case was a PC, a new sound card and two new touch sensitive monitors for a total of $4500. Your Version IV dongle will be wiped clean. Any remorse about Version VII ( i.e. reinstalling Version IV) is not possible. Once you go forward, you can't go back. Keep in mind that many sample sets may not migrate. I lost several custom made sample sets, which was not made clear to me when I decided to upgrade. There are many new features on Version VII, such as reverb profiles, that may not worth the effort. Also, if you select a reverb profile, all sample sets on your Hauptwerk are affected. Version IV did eveything that you could want ( i.e. note by note adjustment of volume, brightness and tuning). The reason I upgraded was because my equipment was old ( 2008) and I thought the audio improvement would be a plus. Upgrading was expensive but at least the equipment is new. My biggest complaint about Hauptwerk has always been the lack of help. It's a brilliant software that requires computer knowledge to install. Getting help is next to impossible. Even my local Mac computer guy stayed away from installing Hauptwerk VII, too complicated, he said. My comments are my opinions only. How much better is Version VII's audio ? It is subjective. It's a bit better. But Version IV is pretty damn good, too. New members to Hauptwerk have no choice but to go with VII. Had I to do it over again, knowing what I know now, I would have saved the $4500.
I agree that annual updates start to seem like nothing but pure greed on the part of the developer, especially when there aren't seriously different features added. Keep up your great work on whatever edition you run!
if Haupwerk claim that the whole organ is tuned when sampled then it is wrong to sell a sample set which is not completely in tune. Whether they go back and tune and then re record the pipes which are out of tune or digitally tune the recorded sound is immaterial for the final user. Is this not a quality assurance issue? I own a large digital organ which has a full midi capacity and all the temperaments used for tuning an organ. It would be unacceptable to me to have any note out of tune. It should be the same for any Haupwerk sample set and that is a quality assurance issue which should be addressed before the product goes on the market. A pipe organ can be tuned but if you cannot tune a pre recorded sound in a sample set it means you are stuck with it. When you buy a new car you expect everything to work. I see this as no different
I upgraded, cuz why not? I support Hauptwerk development to make sure it stays in business. If you stay current, the cost isn't exorbitant. You're choice, but if customers don't buy, don't be surprised to see fewer features, higher costs, etc. I do the same with my other music software.
I can fully understand minor application developers not jumping at the prospect of having to port their software to Apple's ever changing system architecture.
I think the ever-changing is overstated. The last architecture change since Apple Silicon in 2020 was the Intel transition in 2006. So it's not that bad. Sure, a few other things change over time, but not massively so. Correct me if I'm wrong?
(Part 2) (TH-cam was unhappy the comment was too long - Read "Part 1" just below, first!!!!) So, I hope this helps motivate Hauptwerk that there is something on their heels, where the programers and designers are clearly much more "consumer friendly" than it seems, that many of the HW programmers are. I got my first copy of Hauptwerk for free, when I was struggling to find an organist job, and wrote to Martin Dyde, and he sent me a comp copy....sadly, those days are long gone in Hauptwerkland; but hopefully the pressure of Organteq - and enough people like you (and me), harranging (politely, but firmly) both the HW people (I am avoiding using names, here), and the sample set designers, will "motivate them" to return to what it was originally envisaged by Martin Dyde - to be "player friendly" - and not a Capitalist nightmare. Again, I'd welcome to hear from you; and I hope you like the Newman recording - the entire album is mindblowing; we had immense fun recording two volumes of "Romantic Organ Masterworks", and like Newman did with Bach on his 1968 Columba debut album of JS Bach on the Pedal Harpsichord and Organ, challenged the "unquestioningly uninformed" tradition of organ playing, which still persists to this day. I uploaded a digital transfer and included some additional tracks from several of the following organ and pedal harpsichord albums, which includes the Great a-minor prelude and fugue - where you can hear the spatial aspect, as described above, as with his playing, he wanted them to closely mic the organ - so one can really hear the movement. th-cam.com/video/k3__pImCmvw/w-d-xo.html - I annottated the details and historical sources in the comments. While I did not make this transfer, and it's a bit more noisy, his 3rd album which the Great a minor Prelude and Fugue I took from for my "custom" transfer (the extended play version of the JS Bach on the Pedal Harpsichord and Organ Album), here is the link to the album that has the Wedge, and the Toccata and Fugue in F, where one can also really hear the spatial aspect that is almost nowhere to be found in most of the HW sets - as if it has been homognized out - grrr; bad producers/engineers! - Whereas Columbia got it right (and forever influenced my recording/engineering/producing style) with their much more closely recorded album by Newman, playing these amazing works (and some gorgeous chorale preludes) - th-cam.com/video/q7Z_sstLCNc/w-d-xo.html - "Anthony Newman - First Recording on the Noack Organ at Trinity Lutheran Church" Anyhow, Thank you for your posting - as I have Hauptwerk 4, and I was considering their extended black friday sale for upgrades - $299 for an Upgrade to HW 7 perpetual - and I looked at the "new features", and I really have paused...for $199 I'd do it; but at $299, they just seem very greedy;. If they would allow a purchase of HW 6 for $199, I'd probably would have purchased it, as it would take care of the problem that the Gonnigen Organ (HW 1 or 2 originally) had an upgrade, which I got, but it requires HW 5 or higher...which I was going to get but then hit a financial obstacle, and almost bought an upgrade during the hieight of the pandemic, but didn't, also, because of lost finances from covid making it hard to get new students, or organ jobs! And now, if I ever want to finally use it, I have to do the upgrade which seems very financially opportunistic. But you're right; there are reasons why you, and I did not go for the current "upgrade offer" - Anyway, that's my 10 cents, in about 2000 words or more! All best, Scott
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Excellent perspectives Titus! Of course I'm the early adopter (and have from time-to-time ended up with an unplayable instrument after either an operating system, or hauptwerk, update misadventure!) - When we look at the Hauptwerk Journey (from pre-2002, to where we are now, and where v4 sits on that spectrum) - there is no question that what v4 is capable of will satisfy a majority of users. Gains become ever more incremental. However, I also recognize that the software developers only source of income are the updates (unlike the sample set producers that can go out and sample a new organ) - so I do see both sides of all of this. The MOST important thing however is to find musical inspiration in the tools at hand, and to MAKE great music (which you do, and I look forward to more!!!!)
Well said, Jerry. I absolutely want to support the developers, and understand this is their source of revenue, and I do want to support them when I find that my money is well spent.
Well said, Jerry! And I must admit: The most changes in the software are only usable for those (as we are) who are using the advanced version of Hauptwerk. That is the biggest issue I would say. So basic users or free users really don't benefit much from the upgrade. But well, if you really want to load bigger organs you have to have the advanced version and then you benefit from all the additions. What would I do without the reverb-module? This made me finally able to use dry sample sets by adding convolution reverb to them. And you can much better use the mixer now. Well and last: You won't be able to use a new sample set under HW 4 because you can't license it anymore with the old blue HW-Dongle. As Milan won't transfer licenses anymore but via the iLok-System. So I think you will have to consider an upgrade at that moment, when you really want a new organ-set... btw: I don't understand, why with HW particularly the users do fear upgrades so much... hmm...
I love your ideas, Titus! 😀 In my opinion the ‚pros‘ with the upgrade (in my case from HW 6 to 7) are minor compared to the hassle and time it would take to download/install/activate it including reloading all the sets. We will probably get forced to upgrade when new samplesets are released, but for the time being I‘m happy with my ‚old version‘ too!
You can tune each pipe in Hauptwerk 4. The issue that I have from time to time is that some of the mixture stops are not in tune on sample sets. I am probably like you in that I don't like much beating unless it is a celeste voice. There are several people who complain to the sample set producers about sample sets being tuned too well. I myself use to help my organ teacher tune a few organs and I also tuned one quite often in the town where I live, so I don't really like buying sample sets that I have to tune. I have a few sample sets where some pipe were out close to 40 cents. I am sure that Charles at Silver Octopus has combined Hauptwerk with real organ pipes. I think he has done a few organs like that in England. Thanks for the great videos!
Hello, Thanks for the video. It is indeed possible to individually tune every note of every stop with Hauptwerk and I believe that capability has been in place since Hauptwerk v2. Simply right click on a stop, select 'Adjust voicing....' then select 'Overall: tuning (cents)' from the drop down menu. I am using Hauptwerk 6 and it is the first adjustment parameter in the list. I don't recall what it was in v4 but it was indeed there. I used that version for several years. Then, each note of that stop can be individually tuned in real time using the appropriate sliders on the bottom half of the screen. You mentioned 'hybrid virtual/pipe' organs. Hauptwerk can indeed output the necessary MIDI signals to control pipework. I have never done that myself but others have.
Thanks for your response. I wondered whether some features existed that I wasn't aware of. I appreciate it. I will have to experiment with these features, and will let you know how I go.
Yep, can confirm. Am on v4, have done this to fix several sets.
Hear hear. You can tune individual notes already though on HW4 (in the voicing menu), but note that tuning is also affected by the adjustable random detune and wind stability facilities. I've had particular issues with Hereford, which 'out of the box' sounded like a giant harmonium. Took a lot of tweaking of the detune percentages but worth it.
To Pep Organ:
Your comment about combining two or more organs is interesting because I had that done for me several years ago with Version IV. I had someone (the one that created the Caen 4 manual extended version) create a wonderful four manual 128 stop organ for me that used stops that I chose from the Caen, Zwolle, St. Maximin, Forcalquier and others. It was an experiment because the outcome was unceratin. I was told by naysayers that it would not work because there would be a problem with different reverbs from different organ stops. This turned out to not be a problem at all. I created and posted a TH-cam demonstaing this organ. I lost this organ during the migration process to Version VII something I didn't expect.
I have a second Hauptwerk license and dongle that I can use with my previous computer but the 128 stop organ is gone forever.
I completely agree. Having had v6 for two years, and paying out monthly, I was relieved to find my old v4 installation discs. In v6, I often found the monthly licence would expire, and I'd be without a working organ until I got around to manually renewing it.
I've found that even with the Free version of V4 you can load big instruments by adjusting bit rates and various memory options.
I'm still looking to purchase an original V4 dongle BTW.
Combined sets are already available. There is the Large Dutch organ compromised outof several other samplesets check it out.
I know, I was referring to customisable sets, not pre-made.
@@peporgan @peporgan These sets were built by amateurs, mostly from demonstration sets. If a set is not encrypted, then you can take stops and combine them at will. However, this is not for the faint-hearted. The design software is necessarily complicated; and it's not that easy to just take a rank from one organ and install it in another, from a tonal perspective.
When changing from Hauptwerk 4 to Hauptwerk 7, the old Hauptwerk4 license is irrevocably deleted. This is not pointed out beforehand, neither on the Hauptwerk website nor in the migration wizard.
That is just what happened to me! Really stinks! I spent 800 on the original and now they are expecting 30 for mitigration and 400 for the upgrade? I feel screwed... Hauptwerk is the one of the most expensive VSTIS and I just bought Hollywood Orchestra all under 400. And now they are saying I cannot roll back! Big mistake!!!
Thank you very much for this video! I'm using HW4 too, and for me works perfectly too.. It's all what I need and have all what need😌🙏
That's great! Just enjoy the music and the great software.
I was just thinking today that I’d like to combine various organs… why be limited to the construction choices of someone else if you can accomplish building “your” perfect organ? The halls would differ, but that can be part of the selection, mitigated other ways, or just accepted as part of a unique and robust set of acoustic colors that combine.
It is being done by various builders of virtual organs. Here in Australia we have a few composite Hauptwerk organs in churches.
I think that there is a point missing re staying with H4.2.1. Some of the biggest organs like Billerbeck can be supported but the computer needs to be large enough and fast enough to cope, and they must have audio systems that are similarly capable. That can take expertise and maybe a lot of money. I use Windows on a dual octacore Xeon workststion fitted with 128G of fast RAM, but as many have observed, you do have to fiddle with Windows to avoid clicks and other issues - and sometimes you have to fiddle again - eg when Microsoft issues 22H2. You CAN do all this with H4.2.1 and once stable there is little motivation to change the application. I have also made a couple of small organs with only a handful of stops using the free version of 4.2.1 - simplicity is sometimes very desirable.
When you want to purchase a new sample-set, you have a problem with HW4 dus to the new iLok license system which is used to CC Metz and CC Caen. Christoph created a "Merge" file to use these two sets, incl. the free demo set of Dom Bedos, resulting in the "hybrid" Aristide 1 V2 set, emulating the famous CC organ of t. Ouen, Rouen. So merging samples is possible.
When HW5 came out, many MD sample-sets were priced with 50% discount. So e.g. the $1000 Kampen Bovenkerk sample-set became $500.
On the other hand, V7 is faster, has better sound, and has convolution reverb built in. And before you say you wouldn't use it, consider this: If you want to load a set for which you don't have the memory, you can load without the accoustic and apply reverb. Even Melbourne Town Hall, which has little accoustic, is reduced from 62Gb to just under 32Gb. The sound is improved, it loads faster, and will fit more easily on the system.
The improved editing for the stepper can be a great time-saver as well.
And all for less than the cost of playing for a wedding.
(Part 1)
Thank you for this; your insights are very good, and one would think this would be obvious to The Powers That Be behind the scenes. Every point you make seems also so obvious to me, and I'd think to TPTB, as well. A couple of customizations I have really thought are severely missing, are the following two:
1) to be able to move or copy a stop from one keyboard to another; or even a duplicate keyboard that could be "added" as there are some amazing sounding instruments but where there is NOT a good reed on one of the manuals - and it would be so helpful to have certain stops that would allow better balance, such as playing French Baroque and the many diologues where you need a cornet and a trompette on separate manuals, against a grand jeux....(Gonnigen organ, for instance, is a very good example; the reeds are great, but I want to have them on the upper manual, as well, not just on the lower - so I can really enjoy Clerambault's "dialogue" for Cornet and Trompette, that is modelled on a French Ouverture, with the slow opening with the Tirades, and going into a fast triple meter imitative - and really have a dialogue, even if those aren't the specific reeds available on the sample set);
2) many of the best organs in person have a real spatial aspect where when one plays chromatically on some of the most prominent stops - the sounding pipes were typically arranged either in a direct, perceptible linear fashion, but especially in the pedals, or reed stops, they would start at center and then alternately go to the next pipe to the right, then the next pipe to the left, gradually going out from Center alternating outwards to the further most Left and Right - this gives a spatial "dance" the the sound that is really important.
As the great Wendy Carlos herself discovered, that spatial "orchestration" is essential to keep the ear from getting fatigued, among other things - it also adds a positive element of motion that is in itself, simply, extremely cool.
I have rarely (if ever?) noticed that the people who have recorded this maintain this aspect and instead, one gets a melage of sound with the spatial movement aspect greatly minimized or not even present.
This seems a terrible mistake. It would be nice to be able to assign a Left-Right balance to any particular note of any particular register. While many are fine as is, this would especially be striking, and much more "realistic" with pedal stops, particularly the reeds, but even some of the flute stops - if one imagines the 16th notes in Bach's Wedge fugue, when those enter into the texture, on a good organ, they dance about spatially - instead of being "flattened" and their distinct spatial positioning subsummed into vagueness.
This seems like an very related aspect of being able to tune/detune any pipe one wants - just adds an extra parameter: Pitch, and Spatial Location. I've recorded and produeced over a dozen organ albums on some very European based instruments custom built and designed by the organist Anthony Newman (he was my teacher and colleague and dear friend) - and I believe it was a very versatle organ but based on European design in general, but also, with reeds and mixtures so it was also especially ideal and striking for the French Baroque repertoire, and also the German Baroque, as well as being capable of handling Franck, Reubke, Liszt, and Messaien, along with Vierne, and all the "Romantic Organ Masterworks", but also Clearambault, du Mage, Couperin as well, in addition to all of the rest of the repertoire, without wanting for anything. (This is such a track from one of the albums I engineered and produced, which one can really hear the clarity and spatial motion which is a part of the instrument, which I think was built by Rieger and Sons -
Liszt: "Ad nos, ad salutarem undam" th-cam.com/video/TC0mqxoJs_s/w-d-xo.html and Liszt: "Fantasy and Fugue on BACH th-cam.com/video/UxXfXoI8DRc/w-d-xo.html - both of which played by Anthony Newman )
This is something that drives me crazy (and is dissapointing, considering the cost of the sample sets in general), when they are thinking the are doing us a favor but using multiple mics, but ignoring the "sound" from the vantage point of if the console is dead center in front of most of all the main pipework. It's a huge dissapointment; this would be a way to recreate that authenticity, that without which, the effect of the organ is "miniaturized", regrettably.
I think like you said, the adherence of "purism" becomes a huge negative - as with this technology these things should all be possible. It's like a recent Kontakt sampleset by The Conservatory Collection, where they have sampled a "King of Sweeden" clavichord - which has a short octave - for 160 Euros (or possibly Pounds!) - and they didn't fill out the bass chromatically. So, forget playing any other repertoire but 16th and early 17th century music - no WTC, no Inventions, no French suites - let alone being able to play Haydn, so much of which was written for a clavichord. This is deeply regrettable, and, yes, maybe I sound like an American when I say that it's frankly quite stupid!
Similarly, there is a Hauptwerk Set for a modern copy of the Ruckers 1610 harpsichord, and here, the people who recorded the set (I can't remember, this is all from memory!), on one of the registers, they accidentally switched the "long reverb tails" and the "short reverb tails" so that when one plays a short chord/note - one gets the short reverb tail; and it sounds terrible. Has there been an update? No!
Fortunately, Pianoteq came out with an AMAZING replica of the 1610 Ruckers (the instrument Pinnock recorded The Goldbergs, as well as his amazing album of Handel "Chaconne" and several suites from Handel's 1733 set of suites - "The Queen's Harpsichord"), that has given me a "solution"; and I think their version 1.6 of Organteq, is going to hopefully force Milan Digital Audio to move forward and for less - because Pianoteq and Organteq are extremely designed to be customizable - and while the organ is not some wonderful specific famous organ, it is really good - and it cost so much less than the HW program itself, and less than the majority of somewhat overpriced (sometimes very overpriced) samplesets. I hope they keep pushing forward on their development. Also, they are probably going to be much more "Mac" friendly - as this is the result of Modart, which arose from the "Computer Music" "Think Tank" of ICRAM - where they wanted to use Acoustic Modeling, rather than samples and set about to replicate first conventional instruments, but then they started doing some extrarodinary historical instruments as well. An 1806 Graf Pianoforte - a favorite instrument of both Beethvoen and Haydn? It's amazing.
(Arbitrary break - but continued immediately above, as "Part 2" -
TH-cam thought the comment was too long)
I too much prefer to own outright my software (not just Hauptwerk) rather than a subscription model. This is an issue when updates become more and more frequent as it becomes far less of a financial incentive to buy, in Hauptwerk's case, the perpetual license. It also bothers me that, in spite of owning software outright, license keys are held on the vendor's servers. I assume your Hauptwerk is dongle based and this would be another advantage for you not upgrading.
That's right, I don't want to trust servers for my perpetual license. It might be more secure on their side for sales/ analytics, but is less reliable on the customer side.
License keys for the Hauptwerk software itself and for individual sample sets are not stored on vendor’s servers. Since v5, Hauptwerk has transitioned to the very commonly used Pace iLok licensing system because the security of the HASP USB keys used since (I believe) v2 was compromised by miscreants meaning it could no longer be relied upon to protect intellectual property. Pace iLok offers the option to store licenses either on their cloud servers or locally on a custom USB dongle. These devices are widely available for purchase. I too like to keep my license keys stored locally so I opted for the USB dongle approach.
@@stevemann9821 Thanks for this useful information. Does that mean that you can run Hauptwerk offline with a USB dongle, and even swap computers offline?
@@peporgan Yes, you can. As long as the licenses are present on the iLok dongle you can run Hauptwerk without an active Internet connection. You can also run Hauptwerk on another computer by just moving the dongle to it.
Well, you can buy a lifetime HW-license. I did that and its fine. And if you upgrade, you only pay an "upgrade-price" that at first is low and increases later. And with the iLok-System: As others pointed out already: Just get an iLock-Dongle (USB-Stick) and transfer all licenses to that and you can go around and use HW on many different Computers if you like, you just have to take your iLok-dongle with you.
Hi Titus. I have just subscribed. Like a few have already said, you can tune every "pipe". I have had Hauptwerk since 2003 and have been very reluctant to upgrade to HW7 but I took the plunge on Easter Day! I would say the sound is cleaner and so far I don't regret it though I've lost my St. Anne's Moseley Swell Nazard and my two 32ft stops. I hope HW7 stays as it is with any necessary bug fixes the only upgrade needed and not a big expense every other year.
Thank you! I’ll have to consider it.
How about #8 available now?
This is indeed what is needed. Fantastic forward thinking and not that far fetched. Perhaps Hauptwerk has no competition hence Hauptwerks slow movement.
I have an interesting situation, I am buying a viscount legend which is a Hammond clone organ and also acts as a midi controller for hammonds. I am wanting to try using the viscount legend as a midi controller for classical pipe organ music and am looking at haupwerk for this. Thoughts?
You can already combine sample sets with the CODM. You can also adjust the pitch of individual pipes. There are plenty of free organs out there also of very high quality, such as the Friesach sample set. You can certainly use software for a few years, but you said you used IV for more than 10 years already. The improvements, especially in audio quality, since IV have been huge. There are lots of reasons to upgrade to VII. My main concern is that Hauptwerk stay in business long term, and if they come out with a yearly update that is only $99 and this helps their business model work, I will support them.
Can you explain what CODM is? Thanks for your help!
@@peporgan I believe John is referring to what is known as the Custom Organ Design Module, a feature available that allows you to do exactly what you’re describing in your first point. The only issue is even though it’s a very simplified compared to compiling an actual Organ Definition File, it’s still not the most user friendly and require quite a decent tech savvy and knowledge of xml coding. I’ll attach a link to the manual. As far as controlling pipes, I believe Hauptwerk already has that feature and can be accomplished by configuring the MIDI on the Direct MIDI inputs/outputs panel correctly. Advanced voicing and tuning settings that apply in real time was also a feature that got added in Hauptwerk V. The problem you seem to be having is that even though these features exist, they aren’t heavily advertised or really explained in depth by anyone other than the manual, and there isn’t a user friendly interface to allow for less advanced users to take full advantage of them. www.scribd.com/document/442052161/Hauptwerk-Custom-Organ-Design-Module-User-Guide
I think the setup you now have is quite adequate for what you do. Why complicate things?
Hi, I am using the Free edition of Ver 4, just a query / Can you change the sample set from St Annes to another as I have down loaded some free sets but can't find how to upload / If I have to have a full version of the software can one buy Ver 4 full edition / Only have a small amount of money
Like you, I've kept using Hauptwerk 4. The main reasons are because my Hauptwerk computer can't run iLok without major upgrades (it's a Windows issue) and because I don't think the iLok license terms provide adequate consumer protection. The main risk with keeping Hauptwerk 4 is that the USB dongle might eventually fail, and I'm not aware of any way to replace it.
This is true.
There is no way to replace it. If you're dongle breaks or fails you are forced to but Version VII.
To those considering upgrading to VII, perhaps the following might be helpful. I was happy with Version 4.2.1 for years but decided to upgrade based on improved audio claims ( i.e. sounding more like a pipe organ). The audio is slightly better, but hardly worth the expense and issues associated with upgrading.
Hauptwerk owners may not be capable of upgrading by themselves and will require help from a professional. Your present computer may not be upgradable to handle Version VII, which was my case. It required purchasing a new computer ,which this case was a PC, a new sound card and two new touch sensitive monitors for a total of $4500. Your Version IV dongle will be wiped clean.
Any remorse about Version VII ( i.e. reinstalling Version IV) is not possible.
Once you go forward, you can't go back. Keep in mind that many sample sets may not migrate. I lost several custom made sample sets, which was not made clear to me when I decided to upgrade.
There are many new features on Version VII, such as reverb profiles, that may not worth the effort. Also, if you select a reverb profile, all sample sets on your Hauptwerk are affected. Version IV did eveything that you could want ( i.e. note by note adjustment of volume, brightness and tuning).
The reason I upgraded was because my equipment was old ( 2008) and I thought the audio improvement would be a plus. Upgrading was expensive but at least the equipment is new. My biggest complaint about Hauptwerk has always been the lack of help. It's a brilliant software that requires computer knowledge to install. Getting help is next to impossible. Even my local Mac computer guy stayed away from installing Hauptwerk VII, too complicated, he said.
My comments are my opinions only. How much better is Version VII's audio ? It is subjective. It's a bit better. But Version IV is pretty damn good, too. New members to Hauptwerk have no choice but to go with VII. Had I to do it over again, knowing what I know now, I would have saved the $4500.
Aren't you gonna do an update video on why you won't upgrade to Hauptwerk VIII, now that it's out? 🤭😁
I agree that annual updates start to seem like nothing but pure greed on the part of the developer, especially when there aren't seriously different features added. Keep up your great work on whatever edition you run!
Bro, brilliant analysis. Seriously, you should start your own software company and go for it. You would be very successful...
if Haupwerk claim that the whole organ is tuned when sampled then it is wrong to sell a sample set which is not completely in tune. Whether they go back and tune and then re record the pipes which are out of tune or digitally tune the recorded sound is immaterial for the final user. Is this not a quality assurance issue? I own a large digital organ which has a full midi capacity and all the temperaments used for tuning an organ. It would be unacceptable to me to have any note out of tune. It should be the same for any Haupwerk sample set and that is a quality assurance issue which should be addressed before the product goes on the market. A pipe organ can be tuned but if you cannot tune a pre recorded sound in a sample set it means you are stuck with it.
When you buy a new car you expect everything to work. I see this as no different
Interesting view...thank you
I upgraded, cuz why not?
I support Hauptwerk development to make sure it stays in business. If you stay current, the cost isn't exorbitant. You're choice, but if customers don't buy, don't be surprised to see fewer features, higher costs, etc.
I do the same with my other music software.
And that's fair enough. Good for you! But some do not have the luxury of paying such continuous costs.
@@peporgan then don't be surprised when costs rise, or products are no longer created or updated
@@zoomzoom3950 I suppose that all products are a constant negotiation between what buyers are willing to pay and what sellers are willing to offer.
I can fully understand minor application developers not jumping at the prospect of having to port their software to Apple's ever changing system architecture.
I think the ever-changing is overstated. The last architecture change since Apple Silicon in 2020 was the Intel transition in 2006. So it's not that bad. Sure, a few other things change over time, but not massively so. Correct me if I'm wrong?
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(TH-cam was unhappy the comment was too long - Read "Part 1" just below, first!!!!)
So, I hope this helps motivate Hauptwerk that there is something on their heels, where the programers and designers are clearly much more "consumer friendly" than it seems, that many of the HW programmers are. I got my first copy of Hauptwerk for free, when I was struggling to find an organist job, and wrote to Martin Dyde, and he sent me a comp copy....sadly, those days are long gone in Hauptwerkland; but hopefully the pressure of Organteq - and enough people like you (and me), harranging (politely, but firmly) both the HW people (I am avoiding using names, here), and the sample set designers, will "motivate them" to return to what it was originally envisaged by Martin Dyde - to be "player friendly" - and not a Capitalist nightmare.
Again, I'd welcome to hear from you; and I hope you like the Newman recording - the entire album is mindblowing; we had immense fun recording two volumes of "Romantic Organ Masterworks", and like Newman did with Bach on his 1968 Columba debut album of JS Bach on the Pedal Harpsichord and Organ, challenged the "unquestioningly uninformed" tradition of organ playing, which still persists to this day. I uploaded a digital transfer and included some additional tracks from several of the following organ and pedal harpsichord albums, which includes the Great a-minor prelude and fugue - where you can hear the spatial aspect, as described above, as with his playing, he wanted them to closely mic the organ - so one can really hear the movement.
th-cam.com/video/k3__pImCmvw/w-d-xo.html - I annottated the details and historical sources in the comments.
While I did not make this transfer, and it's a bit more noisy, his 3rd album which the Great a minor Prelude and Fugue I took from for my "custom" transfer (the extended play version of the JS Bach on the Pedal Harpsichord and Organ Album), here is the link to the album that has the Wedge, and the Toccata and Fugue in F, where one can also really hear the spatial aspect that is almost nowhere to be found in most of the HW sets - as if it has been homognized out - grrr; bad producers/engineers! - Whereas Columbia got it right (and forever influenced my recording/engineering/producing style) with their much more closely recorded album by Newman, playing these amazing works (and some gorgeous chorale preludes) - th-cam.com/video/q7Z_sstLCNc/w-d-xo.html - "Anthony Newman - First Recording on the Noack Organ at Trinity Lutheran Church"
Anyhow, Thank you for your posting - as I have Hauptwerk 4, and I was considering their extended black friday sale for upgrades - $299 for an Upgrade to HW 7 perpetual - and I looked at the "new features", and I really have paused...for $199 I'd do it; but at $299, they just seem very greedy;. If they would allow a purchase of HW 6 for $199, I'd probably would have purchased it, as it would take care of the problem that the Gonnigen Organ (HW 1 or 2 originally) had an upgrade, which I got, but it requires HW 5 or higher...which I was going to get but then hit a financial obstacle, and almost bought an upgrade during the hieight of the pandemic, but didn't, also, because of lost finances from covid making it hard to get new students, or organ jobs! And now, if I ever want to finally use it, I have to do the upgrade which seems very financially opportunistic.
But you're right; there are reasons why you, and I did not go for the current "upgrade offer" - Anyway, that's my 10 cents, in about 2000 words or more!
All best, Scott