Thanks for watching! It was challenging to find the balance of entertainment and education. I had to cut out a lot of to avoid putting everyone to sleep! Questions? Put them below and I will try my best to answer.
Yes we need an uncut edition! With producer’s comments. Keep this one for the neophytes 😂. This original video will get looked at thousands more times as people well into the future seeking out #steelisreal videos see it
In what direction are you tuning for "compliance?" Surely the geometry of a bike frame will almost always be extremely stiff in the vertical plane, it is essentially a truss. Compared to the deflection in tires, wheels, fork and seatpost, it seems like the vertical deflection of a frame would be quite a miniscule percentage. So are you tuning for side to side flex? Twisting flex? It seems like a bike with a lot of side to side flex would be an inefficient pedaller, and both side flex and twisting flex might lead to vague handling. Maybe it would lead to "lively" handling. I am honestly trying to understand what attributes of frame flex contribute to ride quality for my own curiosity. Never really understood it.
@ the primary flex mode is torsional. When you ride off road, you never hit things square on. The twisting plays a big role in keeping your tires in contact with the ground. This is why you see top downhill racers cutting out braces in their rear triangle, or even using custom steel chainstays.
Explained like a pro! My favorite statement in the video is, "when steel goes past its yield strength it bends, it does not fracture...this means you do not need to overbuild a steel bike to ensure it is safe to ride, instead you can focus on ride quality." Exactly!
As an engineering instructor, I think you did a great presentation of the topic. Makes want to purchase on of your bikes, because you know what's going on in a design.
Almost passed this vid up when I saw the title. After seeing the subject and "steel is real" phrase come up for like 30 years, it's gotten a bit tired for me. But, I hovered over the thumbnail a bit and saw the tech charts pop up, so I decided to watch. Great vid! Really enjoyed the tech bits and forming footage, and was glad it wasn't another "steel has a heart and a soul and a warmth and buttery smoothness" vid. Well done, and I was not aware that True Temper had resumed with Fairing.....cool. Good to see your relationship grow with them.
Italians have Columbus and Dedacciai. British have Reynolds. Americans had True Temper. Japanese have Tange and Kaisei (which used to be Ishiwata). And Tom Ritchey use his own proprietary, triple-butted Ritchey Logic tubing.
I think the main takeaway from this video is Steel allows framebuilders to make bikes that are not going to fail catastrophically and kill someone… they bend before they break - unlike carbon.
@@snorttroll4379 you are missing the point - carbon does not bend - it shatters and you hit the floor so one off builders end up having to overbuild the frame so it does not feel nice to ride. ( large manufacturers will build many frames that they test to destruction to achieve nice ride characteristics with enough strength ). With steel, a small manufacturer can build bikes that feel nice to ride ( because they are only as strong as they need to be ) without the worry of the customer crashing.
Thanks for helping me understand a comment I heard from bike enthusiasts about “flexiness” in their bike frames. It stuck with me all these years and I never understood what they were talking about until today! 😊
this stupid myth has simply taken root in the brains of ignorant people - of course you can build a wing for an Airbus A380 out of aluminum and the wing flexes many meters - millions of times - so what is the point of this silly saying ? from someone who obviously has no idea about the subject but just repeats what others have said at some time ?
@@Śiśna3633this stupid myth has simply taken root in the brains of ignorant people - of course you can build a wing for an Airbus A380 out of aluminum and the wing flexes many meters - millions of times - so what is the point of this silly saying ? from someone who obviously has no idea about the subject but just repeats what others have said at some time ?
@@bertkreft9689 I am asking as a layman. Wing is not one solid piece of aluminium, it's more like a composite, isn't it? So saying that you cannot make a spring out of aluminium is true. Am I right?
Thank and you for that very clear explanation. I have ridden vintage Ti bikes, modern Ti, carbon, aluminum, plain gauge steel and Soma's execution of Tange Prestige. I was never overly impressed with the ride quality of the steel bikes. For some reason my 1973 Raleigh Competition in 531 has this unreal quality that I can only describe as springy and almost floats over chatter. I truly now know why "steel is real". Cheers!
A good tube is nice but it wont make up for bad design. Design and quality manufacturing is more important than the materials used. Good video keep it up!
@@davidmarsden7103 thanks! I filmed and voiced over a segment on “damping” properties of steel (it has none) but it didn’t make the final edit. Another myth of steel
Really wish more people could explain this as well as you did. Some people think of its not carbon its not worth riding. My Hummingbird is my favorite bike.
That was nothing short of fascinating, well presented and obviously factual. As a bike mechanic focusing on steel bike builds i have struggled to explain why steel is a great material for bike frames. This helps a lot. Yield strength, elastic and plastic deformation will be my new key words to help describe why steel framers are awsome. thankyou.
One of the best bike geek videos I've ever watched! Really enjoyed how you decoded and conceptualized many of the terms we all throw around when talking bikes. I ride steel, aluminum and titanium frames and have tried to understand why they ride differently without leaning into generalizations. This is the knowledge I've been looking for!
Great video. I'm still riding a 1994 Diamond Back Axis ,nickel plated XT version, here in the UK. TRUE TEMPER TT LITE tubing, set up as a fully rigid single speed. Love it. Better now I'm a bit heavier and pre loading the frame a bit more in my mid 50's.
Ay my dude! I'm riding a 1990 Diamondback Apex, down under in New Zealand. Good old Deore DX spec. Actually blew me away how nice it is to ride over rough stuff with no suspension to speak of. Not to mention it feels like it could take anything I'm liable to throw at it, short of throwing it off a cliff. Which I never would cos I love it!
I rode around a Diamondback Topanga with a black and white splatter paint job. Those 90's diamondbacks were killer! The True Temper Axis must be really nice.
Wow! As a former engineer and everlasting bike nerd, this was fantastic to watch! I did not know how in depth Neuhaus was with their design, and really appreciate the attention to detail! Also super well communicated video!
This is one of the best explainations of stress-strain curves, I and youngs modulus. I'm going to share with my ME and materials friends at work, where do a lot with Aluminium and Ti.
That was a really great video. I started riding mtb 35 years ago and steel was the only option available. Aluminum came but it always felt that marketing pushed it over steel without real debate. Thanks for the clarification. My first real mtb was a Sunn with Columbus steel frame. I loved it.
great video Daniel! definitely my favorite that's been made about this subject. I really liked how you presented your point from an engineering perspective first, and then followed that up with how it impacts riding and fabrication. the constantly changing scenery, with the interview and bench testing stiffness, was also really interesting and informative.
This was fantastic. I’m a student studying mechanical engineering and have fabricated a couple steel frames in the past 2 years and I definitely want to start making more frequently. This video tickled my brain perfectly as it answered questions that I didn’t quite know how to ask. Thanks! Would love to hear more about the process behind getting the tubes shaped from blanks into the simple pieces of art with all their curves and butts lol
Hi Isaac, as a mechanical engineering student myself I'd love to ask you a couple of questions about your frame fabrication. First of all, probably the most obvious, where did you learn how to do it, both theoretically (geometries, I guess) and practically (the cutting and soldering part)? The second one is: what kind of tools do you use and what would be their price? The third one is about the tubing supplier and the final price of the frame build. I hope to hear you soon, Claudio from Italy
Awesome video; thanks for sharing this information. I'm a big fan of Neuhaus, and I've been slowly learning frame building, so this type of information is enormously useful.
Bravo! That was awesome bike nerd science! I learned a ton of detail and understanding of what I had a vague knowledge of before….and so clearly explained, outstanding 10/10 video! And thanks for sharing Fairlight tubing, yay for another US manufacturer of velo spec tubing I wasn’t aware of! I already have more bikes than I have fingers…but this video convinced me I need to start saving/ sell/ make room for a Neuhaus, to support your outstanding work! Thank you Daniel, please keep making these type of bike science nerd videos and awesome bikes!
I studied materials engineering and I've learnt pretty interesting things about bike design considering the materials manufacturers have to work with thanks to this video. Steel is real indeed, real simple, cost effective, and by processing techniques like bending and heat treatment you can alter many aspects of the bike frame.
Oops, Composites are complex. Fibers by themselves are stiffer. When fibers are placed into epoxy and the total system is tested in the longitudinal direction, Uni directional Carbon Epoxy laminates will have stiffnesses similar to titanium. In a woven format the carbon epoxy laminate actually has a stiffness of 1/4 that of steel, however, woven carbon laminates are 1/5 the weight and therefore can be slightly stiffer in equal weight situations when loaded in the longitudinal direction. By equal area however, Carbon fiber is more compliant and absorbs vibrations and impacts The real highlight is Strength, where a Uni Directional Carbon epoxy laminate is roughly 10X the strength of steel. Therefore, a lighter weight object can be produced.
It would be interesting to manufacture a Fiberglass and or Kevlar Commuter bicycle where the bicycle is half the weight of steel, roughly the same strength of steel but absorbs impacts to create a smoother ride on the way to work without needing suspension.
@@CRITESBIKER for sure, I think composites are amazing and have huge potential. I Would love to make Carbon fiber bikes, but for the scale you need to be at, you need to prioritize money over innovation. It costs $60k to do a run of Carbon molds.
I was looking at an old Raleigh racer made from steel, with the gear shift on the crossbars on Marketplace the other day in excellent condition, originally from the 80's. Perfect working order and only going for €200.
You missed one of steel and irons greatest advantages: durability. Carbon is naturally brittle, and over time impacts cause microscopic tears and breaks which slowly weaken the material until it breaks. A soft to medium hardness steel is malleable, and impacts will not cause the metal to have any breaks within it. While poorly heat treated super hard metals and carbon will eventually suffer brittle fracture, malleable steel alloys will bend instead of break, and more importantly, will not slowly have fractures throughout the material until it fails. Good quality steel and engineering can make something nearly indestructable, while carbon fibre will eventually fail under impact. Carbon is strong, but outside of its sheer strength it is very delicate and vulnerable.
Bespoke,custom selected frame building has really advanced. When you think about how long frame building craftsmanship has been around and what advancements have been implemented over time it’s hard to deny that steel has a much richer history of development and design than any other frame material. As for any comparison to an assembly line mass production frame building bicycle design. It should be noted that those factory frames are designed for the masses and cannot be manufactured for everyone’s preferences so will inevitably be produced to be strong enough to avoid any warranty issues of a fat kid jumping off his roof. I truly enjoy this content and look forward to hearing about how you “tune” your frame tubing selection based on a riders weight and needs.
Thanks for your comittment to sharing your knowledge! As I study up on frame building, your tutorials, info, and interviews are very informative and easy to understand. Maybe consider teaching some day?
Thanks! This is my form of teaching now. TH-cam videos made me realize that mixing entertainment and education is extremely powerful teaching tool. Nowadays all the information is out there in the world. There are thousands of free text books. But if people don't have the inspiration or motivation to learn, it won't matter. I am starting to realizing the power of the entertainment component of video media!
@@tongotongo3143 Fancy forms? Sure, if we conveniently ignore the need for moulds, the required knowledge about layups (vs. being able to just buy ready-made tubing and a metric shitton of small parts to go with it or, need be, just hammer something into shape ... in a world where said tubing and parts have been used for literal centuries and people just know their stuff) ...
It's interesting the "Tube Stiffness" part of the video starting @6:47 shows that tube material, e.g., steel vs Ti, doesn't matter nearly as much as tubes' length & diameter. Unlike proportional material elasticity differences, tubes' length and diameter had cubic (power 3) and quartic (power 4) influences. Apparently aluminum frames have reputation for being stiff really only due to tubes' large diameters.
Oh Boy..... this video is real !!! I couldn't have explained it better. I keep trying to educated customers and people in general with a podcast but I think you have simplified it at the best level. Congrats and thanks for that. I may tay the time to duplicate some content in French. Would you mind if I do so? Thanks. JP from 2-11Cycles in France.
My current carbon frame is the most comfortable yet stiff where needed I have ever ridden. It's by far not the latest but it's really good! Yet I never feel 100% safe on it, always having to go out of your way to make sure your frame doesn't get damaged, that's where I like steel more, you can just "abuse" it without any worry. Still not sure if I go for titanium or steel bike as next frame. Guess I need a test ride on titanium first.
Steel is real, but not all steel is real. Hence the difference between ride quality of the Neuhaus and Honzo. Glad you explained the reason behind butting and how tube diameter affects stiffness.
"Steel is real and rust is real", Hambini justify that statement few years ago - Peak Torque said that the stiffness that you can get in a titanium bike frame is insignificant (i.e. magic carpet ride) like to those steel frames. Because what matters in a bike specially in Mountain Bikes is the acceleration, the time that it takes to make the object from rest - move and move - rest. In summary: F = ma or a = m/F.
Learned lots of bike nerd stuff and I feel like I should prioritize durable things. People don't have money to give away. Bike should be durable, simple and reliable for the mass
another opportunity to request a piece on how frames and forks are designed and tested to be compliant with applicable requirements (i.e. CFR Part 1512.) I assume for the most part these regulations are not applicable for bikes falling under the category of "one-of-a-kind" bicycle. At the same time I'm curious why we don't see more bikes fitted with chain guards and derailleur guards as these requirements would seem to apply to a lot of production bicycles.
I will believe in the unique ride quality of X material or tubing when I see it pass a blind test with statistical significance. The only such test I have ever seen was from a magazine in the eighties where the very experience editor of the magazine was unable to tell different types of tubing apart. Not a definitive test by any means, but it does suggest that placebo may be at play. If there was a measurable difference, we would have seen blind tests by now rather than audiophile-quality subjective assessments.
On my steel bike all the components wear out sooner or later,but frame never failed.What I like about steel is absorption of vibrations compared to aluminium,the downside is it's tougher uphill.
Thanks for watching! It was challenging to find the balance of entertainment and education. I had to cut out a lot of to avoid putting everyone to sleep! Questions? Put them below and I will try my best to answer.
Hmm, even if the length doubled I'd be into it.
Yes we need an uncut edition! With producer’s comments. Keep this one for the neophytes 😂. This original video will get looked at thousands more times as people well into the future seeking out #steelisreal videos see it
In what direction are you tuning for "compliance?" Surely the geometry of a bike frame will almost always be extremely stiff in the vertical plane, it is essentially a truss. Compared to the deflection in tires, wheels, fork and seatpost, it seems like the vertical deflection of a frame would be quite a miniscule percentage. So are you tuning for side to side flex? Twisting flex? It seems like a bike with a lot of side to side flex would be an inefficient pedaller, and both side flex and twisting flex might lead to vague handling. Maybe it would lead to "lively" handling. I am honestly trying to understand what attributes of frame flex contribute to ride quality for my own curiosity. Never really understood it.
@ the primary flex mode is torsional. When you ride off road, you never hit things square on. The twisting plays a big role in keeping your tires in contact with the ground. This is why you see top downhill racers cutting out braces in their rear triangle, or even using custom steel chainstays.
Explained like a pro! My favorite statement in the video is, "when steel goes past its yield strength it bends, it does not fracture...this means you do not need to overbuild a steel bike to ensure it is safe to ride, instead you can focus on ride quality." Exactly!
As an engineering instructor, I think you did a great presentation of the topic. Makes want to purchase on of your bikes, because you know what's going on in a design.
When he said ultimate strength, the tube was still plastic deformation area, it didnt snap.
@@nielsgiesen789yeah I noticed that too. Buckling is not tensile failure. Good video otherwise though.
Almost passed this vid up when I saw the title. After seeing the subject and "steel is real" phrase come up for like 30 years, it's gotten a bit tired for me. But, I hovered over the thumbnail a bit and saw the tech charts pop up, so I decided to watch. Great vid! Really enjoyed the tech bits and forming footage, and was glad it wasn't another "steel has a heart and a soul and a warmth and buttery smoothness" vid. Well done, and I was not aware that True Temper had resumed with Fairing.....cool. Good to see your relationship grow with them.
Great vid!
Italians have Columbus and Dedacciai. British have Reynolds. Americans had True Temper. Japanese have Tange and Kaisei (which used to be Ishiwata). And Tom Ritchey use his own proprietary, triple-butted Ritchey Logic tubing.
I think the main takeaway from this video is Steel allows framebuilders to make bikes that are not going to fail catastrophically and kill someone… they bend before they break - unlike carbon.
👏👏👍👍
what if your bike bends on you, how much does it bend?
@@snorttroll4379 you are missing the point - carbon does not bend - it shatters and you hit the floor so one off builders end up having to overbuild the frame so it does not feel nice to ride. ( large manufacturers will build many frames that they test to destruction to achieve nice ride characteristics with enough strength ).
With steel, a small manufacturer can build bikes that feel nice to ride ( because they are only as strong as they need to be ) without the worry of the customer crashing.
Thanks for helping me understand a comment I heard from bike enthusiasts about “flexiness” in their bike frames. It stuck with me all these years and I never understood what they were talking about until today! 😊
I missed aluminium in the explanation. Excellent video, thanks!
You cannot make a spring out of aluminum.
this stupid myth has simply taken root in the brains of ignorant people - of course you can build a wing for an Airbus A380 out of aluminum and the wing flexes many meters - millions of times - so what is the point of this silly saying ? from someone who obviously has no idea about the subject but just repeats what others have said at some time ?
Aluminium hardens and becomes brittle and cracks
@@Śiśna3633this stupid myth has simply taken root in the brains of ignorant people - of course you can build a wing for an Airbus A380 out of aluminum and the wing flexes many meters - millions of times - so what is the point of this silly saying ? from someone who obviously has no idea about the subject but just repeats what others have said at some time ?
@@bertkreft9689 I am asking as a layman. Wing is not one solid piece of aluminium, it's more like a composite, isn't it? So saying that you cannot make a spring out of aluminium is true. Am I right?
Thank and you for that very clear explanation. I have ridden vintage Ti bikes, modern Ti, carbon, aluminum, plain gauge steel and Soma's execution of Tange Prestige. I was never overly impressed with the ride quality of the steel bikes. For some reason my 1973 Raleigh Competition in 531 has this unreal quality that I can only describe as springy and almost floats over chatter. I truly now know why "steel is real". Cheers!
A good tube is nice but it wont make up for bad design. Design and quality manufacturing is more important than the materials used. Good video keep it up!
Best vid so far!!
This video has so much information that every pause is worth a capture. Thanks for this knowledge!
Excellent presentation
Great video. Top marks for de-mystifying these terms so often thrown-about, confused, conflated & misapplied.
@@davidmarsden7103 thanks! I filmed and voiced over a segment on “damping” properties of steel (it has none) but it didn’t make the final edit. Another myth of steel
Excellent overview of what stiffness is! Thanks for putting in the work, so that we can just point people to a clear explanation
Thanks! Now, I consider this video peer-reviewed!
Really wish more people could explain this as well as you did. Some people think of its not carbon its not worth riding. My Hummingbird is my favorite bike.
@@JasonScottCarter thanks! That means a lot! Regardless of material, I just want to design and build bikes that make people happy
The visualization graph was a great touch for understanding where the specific processes like forming occur. Nice work as always!
Another banger. Love seeing these applied engineering vids that are so simple to follow
I love that I didn't have to stress or strain to learn about steels mechanical properties!
That was nothing short of fascinating, well presented and obviously factual. As a bike mechanic focusing on steel bike builds i have struggled to explain why steel is a great material for bike frames. This helps a lot. Yield strength, elastic and plastic deformation will be my new key words to help describe why steel framers are awsome. thankyou.
One of the best bike geek videos I've ever watched! Really enjoyed how you decoded and conceptualized many of the terms we all throw around when talking bikes. I ride steel, aluminum and titanium frames and have tried to understand why they ride differently without leaning into generalizations. This is the knowledge I've been looking for!
👍These engineering and manufacturing heavy videos are what I love most about your channel.
Great video. I'm still riding a 1994 Diamond Back Axis ,nickel plated XT version, here in the UK. TRUE TEMPER TT LITE tubing, set up as a fully rigid single speed. Love it. Better now I'm a bit heavier and pre loading the frame a bit more in my mid 50's.
Ay my dude! I'm riding a 1990 Diamondback Apex, down under in New Zealand. Good old Deore DX spec. Actually blew me away how nice it is to ride over rough stuff with no suspension to speak of. Not to mention it feels like it could take anything I'm liable to throw at it, short of throwing it off a cliff. Which I never would cos I love it!
I rode around a Diamondback Topanga with a black and white splatter paint job. Those 90's diamondbacks were killer! The True Temper Axis must be really nice.
Big yes from the UK 🇬🇧🇬🇧
Im Riding a Peugeot Perthus Pro Reynolds 753r Rim Brakes & DownTube Shifters in 2024 its almost 40 years old.💪💪
Wow! As a former engineer and everlasting bike nerd, this was fantastic to watch! I did not know how in depth Neuhaus was with their design, and really appreciate the attention to detail! Also super well communicated video!
Engineers must have attention to detail, its our core philosophy!
Bring on the deep dive nerdy stuff! I'd be interested in more detail and a longer video. Love your videos!
@@benb9876 thanks! That’s the plan! Slowly building my skills to make the videos equally as entertaining and educational!
That was super interesting, more please!
This is one of the best explainations of stress-strain curves, I and youngs modulus. I'm going to share with my ME and materials friends at work, where do a lot with Aluminium and Ti.
Love the format of the video! Very informative. Can't wait for more content! 😎
That was a really great video. I started riding mtb 35 years ago and steel was the only option available. Aluminum came but it always felt that marketing pushed it over steel without real debate. Thanks for the clarification. My first real mtb was a Sunn with Columbus steel frame. I loved it.
great idea to feature fairing. your ode to steel is well appreciated
great video Daniel! definitely my favorite that's been made about this subject. I really liked how you presented your point from an engineering perspective first, and then followed that up with how it impacts riding and fabrication. the constantly changing scenery, with the interview and bench testing stiffness, was also really interesting and informative.
@@querk3810 thanks! When designing and building bikes, I think it’s important to have both, the technical and the art!
One of the best videos I have seen in a long time. I have both Carbon & Steel road bikes. Both are good !
Agreed! Steel can be real and carbon can be cool!
This was fantastic. I’m a student studying mechanical engineering and have fabricated a couple steel frames in the past 2 years and I definitely want to start making more frequently. This video tickled my brain perfectly as it answered questions that I didn’t quite know how to ask. Thanks! Would love to hear more about the process behind getting the tubes shaped from blanks into the simple pieces of art with all their curves and butts lol
Hi Isaac, as a mechanical engineering student myself I'd love to ask you a couple of questions about your frame fabrication.
First of all, probably the most obvious, where did you learn how to do it, both theoretically (geometries, I guess) and practically (the cutting and soldering part)?
The second one is: what kind of tools do you use and what would be their price?
The third one is about the tubing supplier and the final price of the frame build.
I hope to hear you soon,
Claudio from Italy
Rowley Farmhouse represent! Cheers, Nick!
Awesome video; thanks for sharing this information. I'm a big fan of Neuhaus, and I've been slowly learning frame building, so this type of information is enormously useful.
Bravo! That was awesome bike nerd science! I learned a ton of detail and understanding of what I had a vague knowledge of before….and so clearly explained, outstanding 10/10 video! And thanks for sharing Fairlight tubing, yay for another US manufacturer of velo spec tubing I wasn’t aware of!
I already have more bikes than I have fingers…but this video convinced me I need to start saving/ sell/ make room for a Neuhaus, to support your outstanding work!
Thank you Daniel, please keep making these type of bike science nerd videos and awesome bikes!
This is absolutely brilliant! Cheers
The science major in me really appreciated this video. Great job man
Very enjoyable to watch, learned a bunch!
Super good video! I love to learn more about Frame Building
This was cool AF! Thanks for putting this out
As somebody who's in the market for a new metal bike, this was super informative! It however, didn't make my decision any easier lol.
I studied materials engineering and I've learnt pretty interesting things about bike design considering the materials manufacturers have to work with thanks to this video. Steel is real indeed, real simple, cost effective, and by processing techniques like bending and heat treatment you can alter many aspects of the bike frame.
Oops, Composites are complex. Fibers by themselves are stiffer. When fibers are placed into epoxy and the total system is tested in the longitudinal direction, Uni directional Carbon Epoxy laminates will have stiffnesses similar to titanium. In a woven format the carbon epoxy laminate actually has a stiffness of 1/4 that of steel, however, woven carbon laminates are 1/5 the weight and therefore can be slightly stiffer in equal weight situations when loaded in the longitudinal direction. By equal area however, Carbon fiber is more compliant and absorbs vibrations and impacts The real highlight is Strength, where a Uni Directional Carbon epoxy laminate is roughly 10X the strength of steel. Therefore, a lighter weight object can be produced.
It would be interesting to manufacture a Fiberglass and or Kevlar Commuter bicycle where the bicycle is half the weight of steel, roughly the same strength of steel but absorbs impacts to create a smoother ride on the way to work without needing suspension.
@@CRITESBIKER for sure, I think composites are amazing and have huge potential. I Would love to make Carbon fiber bikes, but for the scale you need to be at, you need to prioritize money over innovation. It costs $60k to do a run of Carbon molds.
But carbon fibre arm-bars in construction industry cost less than steel arm-bars.
Good stuff. Those raw tubes look beautiful.
Really cool stuff. I've always wondered what butting looked like.
Thank you. Here in the UK I kept expecting you to mention Young's modulus.
Another great vid, I really appreciate how you present the info . Thanks for sharing
Thank you for such an informative video. I learnt so much, why steel is real.
Thanks for the video! Love my Ritchey Road Logic Rim
One of the last, best rim road bikes!
Dude this was great, super well explained
Really appreciated this, thank you
wow thank you for this video, I would like to watch it again to help it stay in my mind better.
A really great video. This is what TH-cam was built for.
Great explanation, thank you!
I was looking at an old Raleigh racer made from steel, with the gear shift on the crossbars on Marketplace the other day in excellent condition, originally from the 80's. Perfect working order and only going for €200.
3:51 ceramic bike, when?
Excellent video!
thanks so much for this really good video!
Good TH-cam recommendation. Subscribed.
This was awesome, thank you.
You missed one of steel and irons greatest advantages: durability. Carbon is naturally brittle, and over time impacts cause microscopic tears and breaks which slowly weaken the material until it breaks. A soft to medium hardness steel is malleable, and impacts will not cause the metal to have any breaks within it. While poorly heat treated super hard metals and carbon will eventually suffer brittle fracture, malleable steel alloys will bend instead of break, and more importantly, will not slowly have fractures throughout the material until it fails. Good quality steel and engineering can make something nearly indestructable, while carbon fibre will eventually fail under impact. Carbon is strong, but outside of its sheer strength it is very delicate and vulnerable.
Very cool and captivating video ✌️
such a well done video.
Great video with great, easy to digest explanations. Some day I hope to go custom on the next bike and will definitely consider steel!
I love engineering and this video is fantastic. Liked and subscribed. I also love steel framed bikes.
very cool, would love one on why and why not to use TI in bikes
Bespoke,custom selected frame building has really advanced. When you think about how long frame building craftsmanship has been around and what advancements have been implemented over time it’s hard to deny that steel has a much richer history of development and design than any other frame material. As for any comparison to an assembly line mass production frame building bicycle design. It should be noted that those factory frames are designed for the masses and cannot be manufactured for everyone’s preferences so will inevitably be produced to be strong enough to avoid any warranty issues of a fat kid jumping off his roof.
I truly enjoy this content and look forward to hearing about how you “tune” your frame tubing selection based on a riders weight and needs.
I learned so much! Thank you 🙏🏽
Valuable information.
This is one of the best videos on TH-cam
Omg after the ad @ 5:30 I was literally pouring a cup of french pressed coffee hahaha😂
Thanks for your comittment to sharing your knowledge! As I study up on frame building, your tutorials, info, and interviews are very informative and easy to understand. Maybe consider teaching some day?
Thanks! This is my form of teaching now. TH-cam videos made me realize that mixing entertainment and education is extremely powerful teaching tool. Nowadays all the information is out there in the world. There are thousands of free text books. But if people don't have the inspiration or motivation to learn, it won't matter. I am starting to realizing the power of the entertainment component of video media!
Nice intro into some mechanics basics, but it really all boils down to ease of manufacture. Steel easy to cut, shape and join.
Carbon fiber is even easier, that’s why they can make various fancy forms out of carbon fibre.
@@tongotongo3143
Fancy forms? Sure, if we conveniently ignore the need for moulds, the required knowledge about layups (vs. being able to just buy ready-made tubing and a metric shitton of small parts to go with it or, need be, just hammer something into shape ... in a world where said tubing and parts have been used for literal centuries and people just know their stuff) ...
really good video. thanks
Beautifully explained :) ❤
It's interesting the "Tube Stiffness" part of the video starting @6:47 shows that tube material, e.g., steel vs Ti, doesn't matter nearly as much as tubes' length & diameter. Unlike proportional material elasticity differences, tubes' length and diameter had cubic (power 3) and quartic (power 4) influences. Apparently aluminum frames have reputation for being stiff really only due to tubes' large diameters.
yes... YES... this is what I need in my life. i need me some paper thin tubes for that sublime wobbliness.
Oh Boy..... this video is real !!! I couldn't have explained it better. I keep trying to educated customers and people in general with a podcast but I think you have simplified it at the best level. Congrats and thanks for that. I may tay the time to duplicate some content in French. Would you mind if I do so? Thanks. JP from 2-11Cycles in France.
@@211cycles sure, no problem, just make sure you cite the source materials!
My current carbon frame is the most comfortable yet stiff where needed I have ever ridden. It's by far not the latest but it's really good!
Yet I never feel 100% safe on it, always having to go out of your way to make sure your frame doesn't get damaged, that's where I like steel more, you can just "abuse" it without any worry.
Still not sure if I go for titanium or steel bike as next frame. Guess I need a test ride on titanium first.
I'm absolutely not the target audience for this but this is a super cool video/super well put-together!
Steel is real, but not all steel is real. Hence the difference between ride quality of the Neuhaus and Honzo. Glad you explained the reason behind butting and how tube diameter affects stiffness.
"Steel is real and rust is real", Hambini justify that statement few years ago - Peak Torque said that the stiffness that you can get in a titanium bike frame is insignificant (i.e. magic carpet ride) like to those steel frames. Because what matters in a bike specially in Mountain Bikes is the acceleration, the time that it takes to make the object from rest - move and move - rest. In summary: F = ma or a = m/F.
Love it! Thank you. Cleared up some things in my clouded mind. Love my steel bike. Surly Krampus
So cool I make handmade bicycles in Australia and this was an amazing video.
Fantastic presentation! Makes me want to dust off my old Specialized Rock Hopper.
What a video! So interesting
My steel & Ti bikes are still my favorites...
Rode my steel bike yesterday and it was really fun.
Been a huge fan of steel bikes for almost 50 years now
Why wasn’t aluminum mentioned?
@@AliasHSW no time haha. I think aluminum bikes are really cool too. The new alloy Specialized Crux has some really smart design ideas.
Learned lots of bike nerd stuff and I feel like I should prioritize durable things. People don't have money to give away. Bike should be durable, simple and reliable for the mass
man this takes me back to my undergrad engineering days.
genuinely good vid
another opportunity to request a piece on how frames and forks are designed and tested to be compliant with applicable requirements (i.e. CFR Part 1512.) I assume for the most part these regulations are not applicable for bikes falling under the category of "one-of-a-kind" bicycle. At the same time I'm curious why we don't see more bikes fitted with chain guards and derailleur guards as these requirements would seem to apply to a lot of production bicycles.
I will believe in the unique ride quality of X material or tubing when I see it pass a blind test with statistical significance. The only such test I have ever seen was from a magazine in the eighties where the very experience editor of the magazine was unable to tell different types of tubing apart. Not a definitive test by any means, but it does suggest that placebo may be at play. If there was a measurable difference, we would have seen blind tests by now rather than audiophile-quality subjective assessments.
On my steel bike all the components wear out sooner or later,but frame never failed.What I like about steel is absorption of vibrations compared to aluminium,the downside is it's tougher uphill.
Dude great explanations, I want to buy another steel bike now😂