Could the modern Polish military survive the German invasion of 1939? (part 1 of the series)
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Imagine the modern day Polish military going through time to 1939, and replacing old Polish military. Could the modern poles fight off the German invasion? How would that battle play out? Watch the video to find out. This is the first part in the two part series. The second part, covering the the Soviet invasion as well is here: • Could the modern Polis...
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Panzer II Aus F (Chassis No 28434) (modified work)
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Leopard 2 A4 Dresden (modified work)
Billyhill / CC BY-SA (creativecommons.org/licenses/...)
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Funniest thing would be to see Nazi soldier looking at label on Polish Leopard tank: "Made in Germany"
Best comment of the 20th century
they would never get close enough
@@greggcom unless the nazi soldier was a prisoner of war
Really. I thought german is only license and chassis are made in Greece and other components in other countries.
poland: I use german tanks to destroy german tanks
When Germany invades Poland, but Poland has German Tanks from the future:
*sichtbare Verwirrung*
Excellent comment Sir :D Greetings from Poland
Poland has Russia Tank from the future too
Lol
... and Russian aircraft!
@@namelesscynic1616 they are using german equipment like the leopard 2a5 or Eurofighter
You forgot one important factor - the night. Polish jets would be able to perform night raids deep into Germany and destroy main airfields, army groups, supply lines, kill important commanders. Modern spec ops would be practically immortal at night dealing heavy damage behind the enemy lines. Same with tanks. Most of modern day military offensive against III Reich could take place when it's dark.
Imagine 10 modern fighter bombers hitting Berlin.
Germany, AT NIGHT. Itwould immediately fall back; stopping all offensive operations .
40 high value sites in Berlin would be decimated .
Hitler'so private residences would all be slums
Also, M I S S I L E
@@Fred_the_1996 D R O N E
@@Fred_the_1996
bombe drone send to the funny mustache man
Imagine being in a Panzer 1 and fighting a Leopard 2
that would never happen.
@@sadanbarakovic7318 in this scenario it would thats the whole point of the video
World of tanks be like:
*i can't imagine it if im taken out the second i see it* oh wh-
The Leopard would take them out with machine guns. No reason to even waste a shell.
RIP to that polish factory worker trying to fix a Leopard 2 from the future.
I'd think that a 50mm german cannon would only a scratch.
@@leehongjin6884 True. But I was thinking more just general wear and tear after a few years of combat. Plus, bombs, large caliber artillery, and 8.8 cm German guns would be capable of putting slightly larger dents in polish tanks.
@@potatopants4691 ir they can even get in range when they are getting harassed by polands own artillery divisions
Well we are known from breaking German cars security systems.. Leopard 2 pffff
Operating principles remains the same so they will figure it out
Will be weird, Poland using "old" soviet weapons against a even older, prewar Soviet Union.
In this video they're already using Leopard 2 tanks against the Germans.
Well there's no old vs older in this.
@@trezapoioiuy Not yet.
@@trezapoioiuy The first Leopard tank though.
The future is now, stalin
@@hopfinatorischerkuchenkrieger They got 2A5 from what i remember.
I think this analysis is pretty good, but it misses one very key aspect: The Polish air force could bomb anything in Germany at will. The first target would probably be the place where a man with a funny moustache lived and worked, followed by every headquarters building, communications node, major supply depot etc. that Poland knew existed. Shortly after, the attacks would shift to airfields, and the bulk of the Luftwaffe would be destroyed on the ground.
The German army may continue to follow whatever invasion plan was already worked out, but they wouldn't be able to adapt to new situations. Almost certainly, all of the army-level headquarters would be destroyed, and I imagine division-level headquarters would be wiped out for the most part as well. This would leave the task of coordinating the war to brigade commanders, communicating via couriers. It would be entirely unmanageable; strategic and operational decision-making would essentially cease. Even basic logistical tasks, like feeding the army, may become impossible, as the headquarters that planned the logistics are systematically wiped out.
The real question is not: "Could Poland defend itself?" but "How long would it take Poland to compel unconditional surrender?"
Exactly
another consistently not modeled part is the fact despite all of this is Germany would be stripped of all reconnaissance capability, and have all radio communication (for which they owed a large part of their sucsess in the early war) jammed.
ur overestimating the effectiveness of Aerial bombing. 80 planes isnt near enough to make a real impact even with modern weapons unless they r nukes. Germany got bombed to absolute fuck in the the later parts of the war by bombers in the thousands but their command structure remained intact
@@incognito-px3dz You realize that an F-16 can carry about 4x the bombload what a B-17 on a European mission (17k lbs vs 4.5k lbs) carried and can lift what a B-29 (20k lbs Could on a very short range mission at low altitude.) Over further differences at high altitudes. These are with modern weapons with much greater explosive loads per weight of the bomb, who penetrate further, have a massively lower dud rate, and have Circular Error of Probability (accuracy) measured in feet for smart bombs and tens of feet for dumb bombs vs miles for WWII munitions. And the F-16 has the ability on these missions to have a 100% survival rate ensuring all bombs make it there. An F-16 especially at the distances involved has the ability to prosecute time sensitive targets. Cruise missiles are not even a concept that Nazi leadership is even aware of, nor are glide bombs in 1939.
Every time an F-16 drops a bomb it will have the effect of thousands of WWII bombs to achieve requiring hundreds of sorties back then.
With Modern Electronics and computers Poland has the ability to read 100% of all radio communications in real time with precise positioning. This isn't something the allies could do then. (they also have the ability to jam all comms). The Modern Geospatial Intel discipline wont even be a thing for another 40 years. Poland has the ability to watch all of Germany and map relevant areas in a Day. Watch any areas of interest 24/7 in high resolution, in spectrums beyond visible light and with radar in all weather. Germany doesn't even know that's possible and wont detect those aircraft flying above their radar envelope, or ones that do having modern low RCS's making them undetectable to primitive low power high frequency radars Germany had at this point.
Your conception of modern military capabilities is wildly off from reality, especially from an adversary with no defensive measures, and no concept of the dangers of their actions or positions, and what value it gives to the enemy. That's the difference between ISIS and Germany Here. ISIS knows better then to blabbering on over radio and its important to take measures to conceal IR signatures and confuse Radars, and to not meet for periods long enough to get targeted. This isn't even a concept in Germanys head, much less they are being watched and have aircraft overhead.
Also getting Humint from 1939 Germany should not be hard.
there's something funny about Nazi war machines getting wrecked by Israeli made missiles.
Xd
And the payload? William Joseph Blazkowicz.
Could the modern Italian army successfully invade 1895 Ethiopia
No
No
No
Italian: YES OF COURSE
Also itslian: who am I kidding even if it was berlin va the world we would somehow lose
No
I can feel someone making a mod in hoi4
Thats what I wanted to do lmao
It already exists I'm not joking.
Makes sense
NoGoji Mod name?
It already exist
The Polish army with Soviet equipment in the 50s and 60s could likely thwart the 1939 invasion. The Polish air force would have jets and all kinds of anti-tank capabilities that would make mince meat out of German early war armor.
Thats so unfair. How about modern Germany?
@@mozambique9113 Modern germany could absolutely make mince-meat out of ww2 germany.
@@ummdustry5718 lmao
so basically the poles have all the wunderwaffe except the maus before germany
-1936 start date
- play Poland
- open console
- type in research all
- *Reaches Berlin in 2 weeks*
Or just type in annex all
Close game
🤣🤣🤣
imagine being a german, pulling up to Poland and seeing basically every soldier have a assault rifle
Fritz: HANS wo ist dat schwere Wasser ?
Hans: warte wo ist das Uran?
Murica: haha japan go boom
Fritz: Hans! WARUM HABEN DIE AMERIKANER UNSER URAN?
Hans: ähmmm naja ein U-Boot...
Americans: haha japan go boooommm
Fritz: ohhh nein...
@@yuurichito1439 I'm not german but i understood and that was funny i mean yeah quite funny
I am pretty sure in that time germans thought they were lighter version if machine guns or a big and powerful sub machine guns
It's like facing aliens army
That would already be true in couple more years. Poland had impressive firearm designs at the time. Actually, Germans got very surprised when rebels in Poland suddenly got thousands of improved STENs - better and more complex - manufactured literally in the woods.
i think its would be interesting to see both the soviet and german designers who are able to capture an intact modern poland equipment and be like "WE DESIGNED THIS?!"
Haha, hilarious
"IS THIS SOME SORT OF SECRET PROJECT OR SOMETHING?!!!! "
Or they find Mercedes-Benz and BMW cars and think WTF?
Imagine then ask to Hitler
"My Fürher are you pretendig to send humanitarian and military help to Poland after we kill then all?"
"HANZ, WHAT IS ZIS"
In fact, from what I've researched, potential Poland of 1942 would be ready to put up a fight at some point rendering Wehrmacht to a stalemate. At the time, Poland had pretty impressive military programme. Poland actually developed and started issuing semi-automatic rifles even before US had M1 Garand. Polish perspective tank designs were superior to German Pz.I-II and overall development in the area was faster than in Germany. They, however, lacked next-gen development in air combat.
Images depicting Polish army at the time as incapable and stupid with attacking tanks on horses with swords is a German propaganda - Poland could put some fight, but without armor there's little they could do. In fact, horse cavalry units were quite successful against tanks - because they could rapidly deploy artillery over the battlefield.
With industrial base you cannot call impressive, in 3 more years, being in preparation for war, Poland could organize some superior fight at significant directions.
However, they lacked one very valuable resource: time.
I also think that Poland had a big tactical-political disadvantage. The strategy was based on Allies actually starting a military operations against Nazi Germany in September 1939. Poland was supposed to defend until Allies come to help. That’s why a great opportunity of counterattack by Kutrzeba Army was missed. Russian invasion has also dramatically changed the situation. There are examples of Germans taking very heavy losses when Polish Army was well supplied and prepared for a longer defence, like Westerplatte.
@@tomaszdabkowski499 I would also add that Poland did several strategic mistakes, one of them is solving their absolutely second-priority problems with Czechia for small pieces of land. At the time, CZ had really impressive military tech and production capacity, but in the end Germany just eliminated both one by one. Second mistake is treatment of population in Western Belarus as second sort with blockage for any national movement, unequal land rights and etc. This eventually led the latter to welcoming bolsheviks. Of course this was a mistake for them to welcome Russian occupation (though instead of Polish), but the fact is.
It is not as optimistic as you think. Poland had no money. Germany spent 20 times more on army.
Poland pressured by Britain and France has mobilized lass then a half of 1 million army and for the same reason only a quarter was fully equipped in September 1939.
Terror bombings were also an important part of Germany’s strategy. Refugees from the bombed cities blocking the roads were paralyzing logistics. The first Luftwaffe’s target was sleeping city of Wieluń. It had no military defense at all.
if the luftwaffe had lost 200 planes on the first day of the war I assure you they would have thought twice before going in the second day
At night the rest would be cleaned on the ground, so there would be no next day for the luftwaffe LOL He forgot that modern armies have nightvison and ww2s flashlights LOL
Against modern SAM and MANPAD the WW2 luftwaffe would be useless and really cease to exist after a week of fighting.
I pretty much agree with this, although theres a few points to be made.
1) hitler would get airstriked on day 1.
2) the morale of the german army would be shattered in week 1, possibly to the point of mutiny.
The french would of been much more emboldened to push into germany further than they did at the start of ww2. You would have the german rushing to defend the west and allow the polish to swing forces to the east while the british navy would just sail around a decimate the german navy and their northern cities
@@pilot1721 Based on what? Nobody said that France will make different decisions.
@@johnkop4 the fact that the german army was being fucked.They also could think that poland would win and takr more then the allies wanted
Interesting thoughts to consider.
1.) the modern Polish military forces would likely know to target key personnel, and have a decent idea as to where to find them. this would be an effective, not to mention crushing, use of their advanced strike & reconnaissance aircraft. Should they do the same to the Soviet Union, well...
2.) With their centralized dictatorships disrupted, and with key leadership neutralized, moral could not only be devastated, but both nations would quite likely be thrown into complete civil war within a matter of weeks.
However...
3.) The Soviet Union would retaliate, and, though it would likely result in similar Soviet losses as those observed by history, the result would unfortunately remain constant... the Red Army would overwhelm the modern Polish forces and crush them beneath the weight of attrition.
Nice thought problem though, lots more to unravel here.
@@johnkop4 I agree. Changing the scenario on a whim is not appropriate. It can be changed, naturally enough, but not on the whim of a few individuals who had nothing to do with posting the video in the first place. If they want to do that they should suggest it, or make their own video.
Oh, you want to fight cold war weaponry with WW2 weaponry? Just play War Thunder.
that one struck too close to heart
Creamy Cake Germany 6.7 in a nutshell
@@ddontworyboutit7855 more like any 6.7
Só epic fight a r3 with a pZ.iv
Ever tried killing a t29 American heavy tank with a soviet t34-85? Well now you can try and get fucked!
Being defensive would be a stupid thing to do... just get the bombers and other planes headed right for Berlin as their range today is extreme and can fly beyond the sound barrier across 100's of miles in legit minutes. Hitler would be bombed so hard and so quickly he'll not have enough time to even start the war with Poland.
That would bring the wrath of everyone on Poland tho and would not be a good move for it's future.
But bombing Berlin after they declare war would be perfect, it'd be a major hit on the morale of the country, might kill a good amount of the leadership and could cause anti-war riots.
Doesn't seem likely that Stalin would even attempt the SU attack after having seen how a 1.5 million strong German army was obliterated in just one week...
A rational thought, so not a high chance of it playing out that way. I'll give it about 20% he doesn't invade Poland.
More likely he would think the poles would be be weakened by the fight as well and see an opportunity to finish off Germany and expand Soviet protection zone. As was the intent in the invasion of 1919.
Even if Stalin invaded Poland he would delay it by weeks to let the Nazis suffer
The main reason he won't invade in this scenario is because with Germany and Italy dead the Allies can gang up on the Soviets
Stalin decides to no do anything in Europe but instead attack Japanese-Manchuria and 'liberate' Korea
@@christiandauz3742 I can see that as a possibility. Except
1. Stalin had a world class ego to go with his paranoia. His ego was probably pretty close to Gen MacArthur /Winston Churchill. Same reason the Soviets fought Poland in 1919 is why he would in 1939. Bigger wall between western governments and ability to help spread communism in Europe.
2. He would want the technology /equipment Poland used to defeat Germany so easily. He would also see Germany was not as strong as it was appearing. He also thought his military with its new tanks was better than Germany and Polish 1939 equipment.
3. Fear that the other nations of Europe would get that technology and equipment from Poland as they had a shared defense treaty with each other.
4. No denying that Russia/Soviets have long time had desire for Korea as well as other parts south of their border. Something they could have done when they wiped the floor with Japan in 1939. Instead they barely took anything from Japan.
@@Matt-mt2vi
1. Romania stays on the Allied side this time around meaning that had Stalin invaded Poland he would be going to war with Romania and later Finland
2. The Modern Poles can threaten Stalin with telling his dirty secrets to people he doesn't want to know about it
3. Zhukov would say no to Stalin's face and convince him to escalate the border conflict with Japan into a full-blown war. Zhukov is one of the very few men that can say no to Stalin and can persuade him
4. With Germany and Italy dead the Allies can strike Stalin if he is stupid enough to invade Poland. The UK and France would be too much for the Soviets and he knows it
5. Japan would attack the Allies much earlier as to get their colonies as they are stuck in their foght against China. America embargos Japan much earlier ensuring Pear Harbor happens in 1939
6. It only takes one Polish missile to destroy the Reichstag, killing Hitler and his cronies. Civil war paralyzes Germany while the Nazi's popularity sinks within a day
7. Polish special forces liberate Concentration camps and send footage for the world to see. Ex-prisoners now form guerilla groups to weaken the Nazis
Nazi Germany falls within a week with Fascist Italy joining them a few days later. Japan dies months later ending WW2
Best way for Stalin to get the tech is the same way he got the Atomic Bomb, his spies copy the designs
The Cold War starts in 1940 with the Communist side much weaker. Decolonization happens much earlier and much more safer
Wouldn't suprise me in such a situation if Polish intellegence simply gets the location of Stalin and the ussr inner circle. Using such info, they'd just perform a decapitation airstrike on all critical party members if the ussr was crazy enough to invade.
Dolphins are returning to Italy
Meanwhile in Poland:
germans*
Meanwhile,in 2020, seeing that polish armed forces are from 1939
Germany: Oh yeah, it's all coming together
Merkel: Prepare for trouble.
Putin: And make it double.
This needs updated. The Polish Armed Forces has expanded massively.
True
With todays Polish Army this will be pretty much simmilar to current invasion against Ukraine, but with much less casualities on Polish side.
None of the bought equipment has arrived yet.
"what if poland finally unchecked Ironman Mode and started using the console"
Hoi4 console commands be like:
Yeah good hoi4 meme.
lmao
Don't forget the annex cheat cuz it could come handy
Never forget “manpower 5000000” and “add_latest_equipment 99999999999”
Modern Paraguayan army vs 1860's Triple Alliance.
Paraguay army is a joke, even for south american standards, but I guess assault rifles would still make a difference.
I think the 1860 army would be better that todays army. Actually the 19 century Paraguay had more men that todays army. The only thing today army had that would make a difference May be the actual guns and artillery. But still, i dont think they could do anything.
@@tanostrelok2323 Assault Rifles may still not win the war but it can definitely turn the tide of the desisive Battle of Tuyuti which was an all out Assault on the allied forces by the out numbered Paraguayans. If the assault rifles live up to their name, an honorable cease fire could be negotiated.
Do the triple alliance have any advantages outside of manpower in this scenario? I really don’t think they would have anything to counter a Sherman, never mind any aircraft.
And one more thing. The modern Polish army with knowledge about the WWII war would not wait for the 1.09 but instead would launch a pre-emptive strike on German land and air forces and leaders.
Even delaying until attack day, the Polish army could knock down German air bases and staging areas so that the equipment would never reach the border.
germans and soviets reverse engineering polish weapons be like: wait wait wait, made in Germany? made in Russia? MADE IN THE USA?? what the fu-
Nazi Germans would be like "what kinda non-aryan sorcery is this?!"
The modern Polish army in 1939. That sounds like the easiest way to get the "30 minutes of Hel" achievement in Hearts of Iron IV.
More like :30 minutes 9f heave'
30 minutes of vengeance.
The Irony here is that in this video polish mbt is in fact a German leopard
There are making pl01 tho so that can change
@@droopy1343 I would love to see the PL01 come to life.
Ironic
The soviet union and germany would crush them
@@droopy1343 Pl-01 Concept doesn't exist. It was just a dummy built on CV-90. There are no plans to start mass production. They will probably buy more Leopards and transform old T-72 into drones.
80 years of military technology is like if the 1939 US military fought the US Civil War Confederate army. Tanks, planes, and semiautomatic rifles didn’t even exist yet and the best naval ships were the first ironclads. If 1939 Germany fought 2020 Poland all of the Luftwaffe, Heer, and Kriegsmarine vehicles would be destroyed within the first few weeks and every German leader would have been killed by long range strike aircraft.
yes thats why this video sounds dumb
@@crystallaxx3440 Yea, this video genuinely suggested that a supersonic jet, going over mach 2 could get could get shot down by a Messerschmitt. and let's not forget that the rechtstag could be demolished within hours, killing the German leaders.
I would assume a 80 year technological advantage would win the war
Yeah XD
In Part two the Germans engineer zombies to overrun the Poles because everyone knows that no modern military can beat slowmoving, unarmed automatons.
Lmmfao. That's true. And no one ever seems to know to shoot them in the head. Despite all the movies that tell you to shoot them in their damn heads! 🤣😂
Perhaps Britain and France would actually help this time.
Just kidding
Help Germany that is.
Perhaps France and Britain would have time to prepare an offensive past the Siegfried line against the Germans, something they never did before the war started. 80% of the German army was in Poland during the early stages of the war, and giving Britain/France a few months to plan an offensive could've meant a large-scale successful offensive into Germany's west.
The air war is like when you bring your bf 109 in a top tier ground realistic battle in war thunder
True XD
And the 109 is either the flegels bf 109 a or the bf 109 b1 early
Binkov's Battlegrounds:
"Could the modern Polish military survive the German invasion of 1939?"
Polish military in 2022:
[laughs in slowly becoming Europe’s newest military superpower]
Shh, we need few more years
@@Killerek022 Just don't get any ideas if ya know what I mean lol jk
But srsly tho
@@getmeoutofsanfrancisco9917 moscov is a part of poland borders since 1610, we are simply taking it back. Jokes aside the only thing i think we could take back is Kaliningrad stolen by drunk Stalin. Aside from that we just want to be stronghold impossible to raid again
@@Killerek022 just as long as you remember kaliningrad = konigsberg!!!
Poland needs 6 more years to get all the stuff they bought, and a lot of that equipment is replacing all the stuff given to Ukraine.
The nazis wouldn't stand a chance!
The Luftwaffe would be pretty much disabled after a day or two! Due to modern fire computers, even gun based AA can shred WW2 planes in absolutely no time.
Modern fighter jets don't even need missiles to deal with those planes! Due to vastly higher service ceiling, speed and radar they can pick engagements as they wish and kill dozens of planes per sortie with guns/ gun pods.
Nighttime commando insertions via heli would take care of supply bases and command infrastructure (or they simply fly to Berlin and wipe the high command).
What is left would be picked apart with hit and run tactics.
Imo the war would be over in 2 weeks max!
I agree, especially with flying to Berlin and wiping out the high command quickly and effectively.
runs out of fuel. lmao.
If it was JUST Germany, than yes. But you're forgetting the Red Army to the east...
Imagine the irony of a german invasion of Poland being defeated by polish Leopards.
Lol
The looks of utter shock and confusion on the faces of troops if they managed to capture and inspect one. To see "Rheinmetall" on the data plates on Polish tanks lol
@@tn_bluestem KMW is the producer of Leopard tank. Rheinmetall provides gun and ammuntion
basically
German soldier: heinrich what does that say?
Other german soldier: it says made in germany
the entire army: *what is reality*
Without even watching- yes, easily. It wouldn’t even be close. Does anyone really believe they wouldn’t be able to, and easily?
I know, the modern planes could just, well, fly over the enemy planes and level most major german cities, because there was no AA in that time that could handle that. Not to mention modern tanks, they would literally roll over the germans. Also with much more advanced guns and training for infantry, the germans would get their asses handed to them
The Luftwaffe wasn't suicidal yet. I think they would refuse to fly after the first day.
Could they do it if they were suicidal? It seems like a stretch to me. They would all die. One modern aircraft can destroy many planes. I don't know how many but if it's fully loaded with ammo and is to attack what is basically sitting ducks for it, it would kill many many planes...
@@Chris-cs7nv F16s have 500 rounds for the gun, that is at worst 20 German planes down in a matter of couple of minutes (even couple of 20mm rounds from that M61 Vulcan would down any plane from WWII era). It's equivalent of heavy machine gun against charging enemy wielding swords. Using AA missiles as Binkov suggests is such an overkill. What Poles would probably do is replace AA missiles with a bigger 20mm rounds storage for the guns.
@@perakojot6524 exactly. They could load more ammo... But ok I guess they still wouldn't kill as many planes as I thought. How about reloading? Does the Polish air Force not have enough ammo? Would the ammo not be time shifted as the aircraft were? Would the Polish air Force at the time not be able to produce a lot of ammo?
Sorry, I somehow read 20 fighters not 50. I don't know what you mean at worst. Do you mean 50 or more or 50 at most? 50 are a lot of aircraft. It would mean that just 10 modern aircraft could down 500 old fighters without reloading. I think the Germans would try to hide them before they destroyed by the enemy.
@@Chris-cs7nv the Poles could just fly into Germany and drop cluster weapons and destroy the German airfields to stop their planes taking off. You don't have to take out the airforce if you take out their airfields. Also, take out Germany's Electricity Grid and water supply.
@@almac9203 that's correct as long as they don't have many many air bases. (Or maybe even if there are... no reason to give them time) Taking out electricity also helps.
I agree
everybody gangsta till 1939 poland pulls out 2020 tech
😂😂😂 poor Poland middle of the bullies
West 🇩🇪
East 🇷🇺
Imagine that A-bomb is 1945 techmology.
Ironic that in this scenario modern German Leopard Tanks would be used by the Poles to fight the Germans
Kinda same with the russian planes
Add 250 Abrams SEPv3 main battle tanks that Poland just bought, and 38 F35 fighter jets
Some points:
0) Current Polish army numbers are slightly off: in 2018 there were 144.000 soldiers in the army. Official reserves are 1,7 million.
1) All planes could use cannons when they will run out of missiles. With boom and zoom tactics, it's turkey shoot.
2) Polish planes doesn't have to attack enemy planes in the air - they could just destroy them on the ground with precision guided bombs and missiles
3) Special forces of today will slaughter much larger enemy, especially during nighttime
4) Tanks will likely be nearly immune to infantry trying to stop them, making up for Polish infantry numbers
5) If you take psychology into account, seeing such devastating losses will likely stop the opponent from going on. Soldiers will probably refuse to fight.
6) Electronic jammers and modern recon with cooperation with precision strikes from the air could immobilize whole armies.
7) Polish planes and helicopters wouldn't be flying at all after their first few sorties, because they wouldn't run on 1930's avgas.
8) The Polish army has about 60.000 active personnel, not 144.000.
9) There won't be any recon or precision strikes after the first two or three days, because of 7.
10) Leopard 2 tanks need atleast 60% diesel in their fuel mix, so the Polish army wouldn't be able to use them a lot after their fuel tanks are empty. Only the T-72s would stay in the fight.
11) Same is to say for all other vehicles using diesel fuel. After the reserves are emptied, there wouldn't be any supply of diesel fuel.
@@matzeh1985 About the fuel - valid points, but if we take modern ammo into consideration (as is pointed in the movie), then we should also take modern fuel into equation. Besides, prewar Poland had oil supplies only smaller than Soviet Union and Romania.
As for army size: 61.000 infantry, 18.700 air arm, 7000 marine arm, 3100 special forces, 30.000 teritiorial guard. The rest are national reserves, cadets and gendarmerie.
@@mattbite the Army is only the land force.
A military normally consists of three branches: Army, Airforce and Navy.
The Polish Army only has about 60.000 personnel.
Plus, the scenario is, that the modern Polish Military travels back in time INCLUDING their infrastructure and while militaries store massive amounts of ammunition, they don't do the same for fuels.
Therefore, the hypothetical time travelling military wouldn't have ammo shortages, but fuel shortages.
@@matzeh1985 7) military have way more fuel storage than just for a few sorties, also jet fuel is kerosene based. Kerosene was widely produced and used at that time .
8) Polish army consists not only of 60,000 strong land forces (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Armed_Forces), if counting all branches they actually have nearly 200k active personnel
9) your point 7 is full nonsense.
10)Even if Leopard 2 would require at least 60% diesel, diesel engines and diesel fuel were around from 1890's. You can even make diesel from cooking oil.
11) same, diesel fuel was available in 1930's
12) stop being full of shit and talking nonsense.
@@mattbite He is talking nonsense, jet fuel is kerosene based, which was available at the time, same is for diesel fuel, it was known from 1890's.
"rewrite ww2 history with call of war"
Laughs in hoi4
Console commands
Bootleg hoi4
they don’t need modern weapons they just need few thousand winged hussars. respect from Mongolia
This man gets it. 👏🏼
You forgot to mention that the whole army would own the night. Which is a massive tactical advantage. And wouldn't you know the other sides tactics too???
yeah they could just snipe the german army during the night, germans couldnt counter that.
Hmm... Weapons from 70 Years of the future? You even could ask:
Can the german Army of WW II beat Napoleon? :D
Hahaha
Well the difference is bigger between Napoleon and ww2
Yes a better question is if one modern division could fight the whole invasion?
Nah, Poland couldn't have fended off an German invasion, even with a modern army.
But it's a different story when the Winged Hussars Arrive.
Put winged hussars on Leopard tanks and we're set.
just give explosive lances to the hussars so they can charge tanks, ez
And appoint Wojtek field marshal.
One assumption is unrealistic. Poland would never give up Gdansk (Danzig), so the ground forces wouldn't position themselves so far from the border.
For the rest of the starting conditions, it would be illogical to fight defensive war with smaller but superior force. Instead, you would want to remove enemy's capability of waging war by strikes on main airfields and strategic industry. Could very well destroy Reichstag for psychological effect while you're at it. You don't need precision strike munitions to do that in early WWII environment, iron bombs dropped with precision of modern avionics would suffice. If that wouldn't suffice, ground forces could attack enemy command centers which should be identifiable using sigint, with artillery and armored forces capable of taking out near ones, and air assault force taking our more remote ones. Basically, it should be strategy directed against command structure, effectively collapsing it and at the same time putting threat on Hitler and his staff themselves.
As for the direct combat capabilities, we are not talking about late WWII equipment. It's 1936 iteration of armor, guns and aircraft. Tank and AT guns of that period would have hard time of doing more than superficial damage to modern armor. Modern infantry with armoured vehicles would have advantage of range, mobility, visibility, especially at night, and troops protection. Aircraft of early WWII era would be easily destroyed by autocannon fire from beyond their defensive range and in a pinch even close pass with supersonic speed would tear up their airframes. The only problem would be sheer size of German army. Polish forces would run out of ammunition or be overrun if fighting stationary defensive war.
An undersized shield or a nigh unstoppable spear. With how some Polls acted after the fall of Poland, I wouldn’t be surprised if they went on the offense.
I feel like one thing missed here, is that Poland could also perform some targeted air strikes in Berlin etc, or use special forces to attack high value targets. But yeah, the ground war would be incredibly one sided - modern tanks out-class early WW2 tanks to such an extent that it would be little more than a turkey shoot
A key component to Germany's march across Europe was the Luftwaffe. As crazy as it sounds, a small number (relative term that could still mean a hundred or more) of modern fighters would tear apart the Germain air force...and then harass the land force quite well.
Even if the germans know, how would Hitler react to the fact that the Polish magically got futuristic weapons to defend against the "aryan" race? Like, what would happen to the biblical based thinking when faced with the thought that the Polish have been magically granted, as if by God, unfathomable weapons at that time, just in time for the German invasion?
He would probably think the devil or some force of evil gave it to them to destroy Germany
Come on , Hitler wasn't at all Christian biblical based thinking more pagan.
The US as an entire armored division in storage somewhere in Poland, they used to be stored in Germany for operation Forger. So Poland would have Access to M1A2 tanks, Bradly fighting vehicles, Striker armored vehicles, and Oskosh heavy combat vehicles with their Leperord tanks.
Do they still do ? Yet we only heard about the few thousand troops sent over because of possible Russian invasion ..
@@frankmontez6853 operation Forger was created to speed up reimbursements to the front line in case the USSR came through East Germany. It was getting too expensive to house entire armored divisions in Germany. It would take too long to bring an armored division with all it gear into the fight. The compromise was to create a warehouse for the equipment battle ready to be stored in and fly the troops in. Being battle ready in 24 hours, instead of a week. My sources said that this Warehouse of equipment is now in Poland.
Older Sam's would hit regardless they had a low accuracy because of tactics used by JET planes. Jet being the key word in the sentence. You fly an f22 like an idiot and those old Sam's will get you 100% of the time
Nice english dummy
@@aceapache4914 you got the point.
@@josephgallo5170 Heh, yes, I was making a joke, though it could have been worded differently
What these games overlook is that Poland would take the fight directly to Berlin and to the German fuel stores. All those German tanks are just scrap iron without fuel. There would be no such thing as "safely behind the lines" for Germany and every asset would be vulnerable.
Poland using some german equipment:
*Ah yes*
German equipment of the future
And in the next ep using soviet cold War era weapon against soviet
German Commander : "What the f*ck is that tank? my Panzers I/II cannot match it!"
Polish Commander : "It's the Panzer X"
German Commander : "WHAT?!"
What about Poland using Battle tech mecha?
Next video: who would win? Varus and his Roman legion or or Anakin Skywalker and his 501 clone legion?
No no it would be Anakin Vs Sand
The question would be : would they still be betrayed by France and the UK?
Hmm yes the floor is made from floor
Its simple YES
What do you call timetravelling very tall people?
Poles from the future.
Not touching that one with a 10 meter Pole.
@@LiezAllLiez some poles are taller than others
@@akigreus9424 You know, a driver starting from the 1st place in a race is said to hold "Pole position". Wonder why...
@@LiezAllLiez What does a planet shaped like a donut have?
Polelack
@@akigreus9424 Theres only two Poles in the world: the north one, and the south one.
This is absurd on so many levels. If they just transferred modern army to 1939 they would run of supplies way too fast, but together with bases and stockpiles? That will be so one sized.
Things that video ignores
1) F-16 and Mig-29s wouldn't really need their air to air missiles. They have deadly cannons and that cannons would destroy every enemy bomber long before they reach Polish airbases. And their cannons still outrange machineguns of the era giving them full safety. They would easily shoot down dozens of enemy aircrafts per sortie. Also, modern airbases have well-protected hangars, taking them down is not an easy task even if by some miracle some Germans would get to airbases
2) In the video, Poland does nothing with its airforce offensively, IRL, there would be no major bridge left in all of Eastern Germany in a day or two. The same goes for train depots and railway stations.
3) German tanks are absolutely irrelevant, they are no much harder to destroy than civilian cars. Modern APCs easily destroy even PZ IVd. You can assemble 50 KTO Rosomaks and send them to destroy a tank division of 1939 and they will easily succeed (30mm automatic chain gun is no joke) Poland has hundreds of them. +hundreds of BMP1s. In the same time, Polish infantry can easily destroy enemy tanks with number of weapons - anti-tank missiles (overkill), rpgs (another overkill, BTW you can teach a civilian how to aim and shoot that thing in days and stockpiles are full of them), automatic grenade launchers, even machineguns with AP bullets.
4) Polish artillery, the most deadly weapon of modern army, is doing nothing in the video except counterbattery fire. Lol. Nope. In reality, it would be like that - UAV spots a German division on the march, division of RM-70s (or even good old BM-21) does a strike and a few minutes later there is no combat-ready German division anymore.
5) The funniest part for me was the navy. Video says that once Polish subs run out of torpedoes they become useless. Once Polish subs run out of torpedoes Germany has no surface ships left. We are talking about 1 torpedo - 1 kill. OK, pocket battleships would probably need 2-3.
6) Infantry equipment isn't even touched. Assault rifles alone are a large advantage. But there are more - far superior machineguns, super deadly snipers pairs, automatic grenade launchers, RPGs that aren't only an anti-tank weapon. + "minor" things like thermal vision, combat armor, modern hand grenades, etc.
Yes, its funny. It's a thought experiment; done for fun, and nothing else. That's the point of "what if" scenarios. It gives something interesting to discuss.
I’m surprised there hasn’t been a movie about a modern army defeating another one in WW2 ( there’s been anime and manga tho but those are obviously Japan centric and biased)
bo mg I’m not, sounds terrible lol.
What anime?
@@feedthechickens8359 there was one anime where the old mythical armies and dragons fought modern JSDF
@@feedthechickens8359 There's Gate, I think it has a spin-off (not sure), there's Zipang and Yojo Senki (probably)
@@ckr3167 Maybe as very nationalistic propaganda...?
Interesting how the video makes no mention of Polish hardware that is mothballed from the Cold War (Binkov makes extensive mention of those in the Austria v Hungary episode). Even T-55s and rpg kill teams would be absolutely devastating for 1939 Wehrmacht. Also no mention of the possibility of targeted air strikes. The Poles know exactly when and where German (and Soviet) high command is located and could decapitate them without much danger to their aircraft.
There is one flaw... Polish airforces could bomb axis factory's and strategic locations with deadly precision, crippling the axis this way.
Grounding the German Air Force would be quite easy, specially with precision bombing to fuel storage areas and fuel processing facilities, after breaking the initial momentum using the superior armor and speec of modern tanks to create huge encirclements would be easy for modern day polish army.
A German NCO radios back to HQ that he is encountering heavy resistance from "Space Poles who sold their souls for power," and requests for a contingent of priests to be sent in for support.
Lol😂
It would've been like fighting a highly advanced alien military for the 1939 Germans.
@Andrew Bailiie so now imagine an army thats 100 years in advance what it will be capable of...in case of an alien invasion it would be even worse, fighting a civilization that has space travel technology be totally futile.
1:55 Poland didn't manage to mobilize the army, because it succumbed to strong requests from England and France to cancel the mobilization, started already in August, as this could irritate Germany, which after a moment of warm gossip could be persuaded not to start a war, of course.
The idea was to not give them justification for a war which is the reason dor thr false flag radio attack
German engineers : NEIN NEIN NEIN THIS IS UNFAIR
Quite engineer : silence*
Creates *NUKE*
Also Germans: Itz our tank in ze future ze Leopard 1
This is a poor title. A better title would be 'how rapidly would the modern Polish military crush both the German and Soviet armies'.
What Binkov basically saying is quantity is corrosive and will eventually overcome the modern army without tech bases to upkeep the munition and maintenance
@@gantulgaganhuyag717 Ww2 aircraft is too slow, less deadly, more prone to detection, more costly. So what in your dumbass head makes you believe quantity could win in this case? There would have to be 10x the gear from germany to win. It would take 2x as much soldiers lmaooo.
@@mokushmasmo6009 its almost impossible to shoot down propeller plane to be shot down by IR homing missiles and modern planes carry too few rounds to shoot down many planes. Try getting behind a propeller plane in a jet is actually extremely dangerous business. Air to ground missiles are many times expensive than the propeller plane themselves and number of missiles in inventory is just not enough to shoot down thousands of small propeller fighters so it appears your dumbass head needs some thinking to do
@@gantulgaganhuyag717 If we consider that the BWP1 is also tanks in 1939, Poland has more tanks than Germany. In addition, the ammunition in the combat vehicles is also sufficient to defeat Germany several times. It can be added that each division has its own technical units
Binkov is wrong
@@gantulgaganhuyag717 th-cam.com/video/AP-JzplC8e8/w-d-xo.html or
th-cam.com/video/Lj4-pwDDBlc/w-d-xo.html enough to shoot down a 1939 plane. Poland also has over 3,000 rakied manpads
Talking about all the added firepower of modern Tanks, fighter, and artillery, I feel you left out an important factor. A modern infantry squad/platoon/company has vastly more firepower with modern assault rifles than their comparable 1939 counterpart. Although there are less of them, and the platoons are smaller, the sheer volume of firepower a modern infantry unit can lay down is terrifying. A platoon of German infantry with bolt action rifles engaging even a squad of modern Poles would find themselves suppressed, and then overwhelmed quite quickly. Just my opinion, but from my time in the Army, I was always impressed watching infantry units engaging the enemy.
It wont matter in the long run, germans would simply over run them. Just like the russians over ran the germans towards the end of the war. Equipment doesnt mean anything if you cant put down massive logistics lines and man power. America is the largest army in the world, and still used close to a million men in afganistan and iraq.
@@singular9 yeah beacuse Afghanistan and Iraq where guerilla wars. Thats more akin to the tet offensive or Korea
@@finnISHY Logistics matters even more in open conflict though; without logistics you just have starving PoWs waiting to happen. Also, it matters even more in this case because the Modern Polish army doesn't have the capacity to replace a lot of their equipment, so if a tank gets it's tracks damaged, a fighter has some wear or tear in it's engine or a rifle gets worn down by constant use, then that is a permanent loss of a tactical asset. Add to that fuel and amunition shortages and it doesn't look good.
There's a reason why Patton called the semi-automatic M1 Hat and "the best battle implement ever devised." The Americans oven had a significant tactical advantage over their enemies.
We also shouldn't forget that modern infantry is incredibly well trained. You are not taking two equal combatants and giving one better equipment; the Poles will outclass the Germans in every regard.
The value of numbers should not be overlooked, but neither should the expertise of a professional. Combine a modern professional with better logistics, comms, Intel, armor, and weapons; the German infantry would need to get real creative real quick to stand any kind of chance at even inflicting significant casualties.
It would increase fuel usage a lot, but I imagine a close supersonic pass would do some nasty stuff to an early WW2 plane. Probably not anything as dramatic as structural failure of a wing (although the shockwave would stress it more), but things like shattering canopies would still cause issues and keep the aircraft on the ground longer getting repaired.
Tbh I think it would completely possible to knock a ww2 plane out of the air.
Since the planes were analogue they wouldn’t be able to correct and would likely harm their sensors too.
In fact, the pilots would bs the most important part of the equation- they wouldn’t be trained for this.
Although if we’re looking at a prolonged war, it might not be effective to do supersonic passes.
They’d simply be flying at such a low altitude that it’d harm the polish jets.
Ultimately, I doubt that the polish jets would even dogfight the Luftwaffe
Imagine your Hans in your Panzer II and you see a goddamn MBT and a jet plane in Poland, nobody would know what they are but they'd know one thing, that is very scary
Welcome to war thunder
There's no way the Soviets will attack Poland knowing how badly Nazi Germany got mauled in this scenario. Fact is Stalin waited over two weeks after the German invasion both to see how well Poland would do *and* to see whether France and Great Britain would get involved in the war. When it became clear that A) France and Great Britain did very little and B) That Poland was going to fall , Stalin simply seized his own "buffer zone" against Nazi Germany in Poland. With Poland decimating the entire Wehrmacht with minimal casualties of their own I don't see Stalin deciding to enter a war where he risks being made a complete fool (several times more than the 1939-1940 Winter War against Finland).
If anything Stalin was a bit too cautious in WWII and tried to avoid wars as long as he could unless he was absolutely "certain" he could win them (see Finland or Poland over two weeks into the German invasion in 1939). He could have taken all of Romania in 1940 and seized the oil fields in Ploesti but only took a part of Bessarabia. Without the Romanian oil Nazi Germany would have been doomed. He could have told his armed forced in 1941 to dig in and be prepared for war when intelligence reports coming in about German formations close to the border but believed it was but a provocation. His plan of a war against Nazi German was for 1943 when his entire army would have been re-equipped, re-trained and a whole new generation of officers would have finished their education.
Quite simply. There is absolutely no way Stalin decides it's a good idea to invade Poland seeing how badly Nazi Germany is getting mauled. In fact his entire war strategy at the beginning of the war was to let France and Britain fight Nazi Germany until exhaustion like in WWI and then swoop in all over Europe and decimate what is left. A Poland equipped with super-weapons? Stalin doesn't enter the war.
We don't really know why Stalin waited. On September 16th the battle of Khlalkin Gol ended in Mongolia. Earlier, the Molotov Ribbentrop pact allowed Stalin to reinforce that front with what Zhukov needed to win that fight.
So there's a good argument to be made that Stalin merely waited to end one war, before moving on to another one.
Also Bessarabia was given under threat of force, so there was a reason the oil fields remained out of Stalin's reach. Probably a war in Romania would have involved more of Europe, or maybe Stalin didn't consider that. But you're right he was very cautious.
He kinda covers that in the stipulations of the video. Germany and the Soviets will be playing their parts no matter what, even though irl I'm sure as soon as the Germans would start to see signs of the time travel bullshit they wouldn't invade.
A general in the modern Polish military would have considered to launch their own blitzkrieg and take Berlin instead, with Polish numbers that small, sometimes a good offense is a good defense. They have to do their own blitzkrieg and pull a page from the Americans with shock and awe.
oh hell yeah, a modern force of any decent size going against WW2 era armies would be a repeat of 73 easting in desert storm.
@@EmperorDionx Untill you can't get resupplies for all of the guns ammo, parts, fuel, or anything that breaks.
@@KioneWinterHowl all infrastructure exists its just extremely difficult to make it in this time. So some replenishment can happen
@@Its_shiki_time4876 The rate in which shit used to be produced compared to what it is now is nothing.
The rate at which they lose equipment would be their downfall. Like let me ask why the Germans lost in WW2.
during the gulf war, a single company of M1A1 tanks took out an entire regiment of Republican Guard tanks due to their ability to shoot while moving, and the advanced armor capabilities. One of the tanks was damaged in the field, so the Army attempted to destroy it in place, however, they were unable to sufficiently damage it, so they had it towed back to the rear, repaired and put back into service. You can read about this company in Armored Cav, by Tom Clancy.
I have to imagine that the current tanks deployed by Poland are better than the A1 Abrams tanks, at least in the electronics and ballistics capabilities. It would at least be on par, for sure.
Nah, their probably not better than the M1A1, but it does really matter. T-72 are so much better than WWII tanks and they were torn to bits.
@@seraphwithatank6535 Interesting. I thought that they were built from the same General Dynamics chassis that most of NATO shared, and I was making the assumption that they would have been upgraded past the A1 by now. I would hope they at least upgraded the fire support data system. The one the A1 had when I served is severely outdated by today's standards, compared to what we are using now. I was shocked to find out that the Corps is still using the PLGR to get positioning. We are always the last to get the cool stuff.
@@seraphwithatank6535 The Leopard 2A5s entered service from 1995. The M1A1, on the other hand, was installed until 1992, so I would not exaggerate with this advantage. The older version of the Leopard 2A4 is upgraded to the Leopard 2PL standard. T 72 in Poland are practically stored in case of war. The only T 72 used are the modernization of the PT 91. Poland bought 250 tanks of the 3rd generation ABRAMS M1A2 SEPv3 and I am happy about that :)
meanwhile back in 2020
Polish army commander: alright time for tra- why do you have bolt action rifles and tankettes
where are the MBT's and assault rifles
1939 polish army: the what?
I would Love to See modern Bundeswehr vs 1939 Wehrmacht
Me too
Modern one completely smacks, absolute mismatch. Modern Germany vs Soviet forces of the 80's would be better match.
@@Necrodzentelmenel1 The germans would lose. The soviet union had 10x more forces than germany today. The soviets could just do a mass attack. And the 80s equipment arent that big of a difference than modern to 1940s equipment.
@@arvidbratt5156
Now, the question is would mass attack work.
@@Necrodzentelmenel1 maybe, the only true way to find out is to test.
According to Wikipedia:
"Active personnel: 140 000 (111 000 prof + 29 000 WOT) (2020) (ranked 42nd)
Reserve personnel: 75,400 Border Guards and Police Prevention forces"
According to FirePower index:
Active Personnel: 118,000 (0,3%)
Reserve Personel: 75,400 (0,2%)
So you are wayyyy off there
Also Poland has "1,010 tanks 3,110 IFV/APC 250 helicopters". It really seems like you try to belittle the size of Polish army
Yeah, it seems like he underrepresent the size of Polish army on every step, from air-force through navy to land forces. It's funny because the numbers for Polish army are easy available. Maybe it's because he seems to be Russian
Firepower index range Japan higer than France.
One can reach ans werk havoc the other but the inverse is untrue.
@@jeremypintsize7606 Japan has almost duble the population, and fit for service. Japan has almost 20% higher military budget and has 40% larger economy. What is more Japan has more overall aircraft, attack jets, twice as much attack helicopters, twice as much tanks, duble the Self-Propelled Artillery, and a huge upper hand in overall artillery. Both france and Japan have 4 carries, but Japan has 40 Destroyers to only 11 french ones, Japan also enjoys overall navy supremacy over France. Only aspect of military where France is superior to Japan is nuclear weapons. I don't see why you are surprised by Japan surpassing France.
I'd be using my superior striking range to prioritize hitting German command and logistical infrastructures. They would be almost completely incapable of defending against any counter attacks done by the air or artillery or maybe even infantry.
And then with their organizational structure and supply lines in shambles that numbers advantage could actually start working against them since any supplies they do still have at that point would be used up that much quicker.
Wouldnt be easier and more efficient destroying their main airfields before the germans launched their invasion?
Polish army of today would of course slaughter the Germans of 1939 very easily, even a polish army of the 1950’s and 60’s would do that. Military technology is quickly outdated.
Surely, the Poles would use their air superiority to bomb strategic targets in inner Germany and force the Germans to halt and retreat.
I think you are underestimating the combat value of post-soviet equipment against the pre-war tech.
American P51s, arguably the fastest propreller planes of WW2 had considerable difficulty gunning down Me262s. Now you have german propeller aircraft, at this point considerably slower, against fourth gen jets. There is virtually no way a german airplane would be able to target such a vehicle in a close up gunfight. Poles would be untouchable in their high speed gun passes. Unless the situation was dire, the jet pilots would be instructed to use their missiles on bomber targets only, as ww2 fighters would pose minimal risk, both to ground and aerial targets. This way the stocks of missiles would last much longer
Mi24 Hinds aren’t bad at all. In fact there are examples that got hit with dozens of 50 cal bullets and still flown. Their bad reputation came from the fact that Soviets lost them by the dozens to the US-supplied Stinger missiles, a state of the art tech at the time. Dedicated AA vehicles were not that plentiful at the time, concept of SPAAG didn’t exist yet, so as long as these Hinds didn’t encounter static defenses they would be more or less untouchable.
And regarding armor, the most numerous German tank, Pzkpfw II, had at the time 14mm of straight armor. Given that 50 BMG RAUFOSS ammo can penetrate 11mm but sloped armor and Poland has adopted the WKW Tor anti materiel rifle, there is a high chance that it would penetrate and teams with such rifles would be able to disable many types of german vehicles, Pzkpfw I definitely.
Stingers are deadly even today.
The poles could just fly to Berlin and drone strike / bomb the german command. War over gg.
@@neonicecube908 They cannot destroy ourigth berlin a huge conventional bomb is equivalent of 11 metric tons of TNT Little boy is the equivalent of 15 000 metric tons of TNT.
One of French M51 SLBM is an equivalent of about 100 000 tons of TNT a French Airborne nuclear warhead (TNA) could be an equivalent of 300 000 metric tons of TNT.
Conventional bombs are pretty weak compared to Nuclear ones.
You have missed one aspect of proximity fuses in this scenario. Flyers of that time were trained to fly in tight formation, one missile exploding amongst them will probably down or at least damage multiple targets.
Poland really typed "research all" and "ale" in their console
I think you forgot to mention infantry weaponry focusing too much on vehicles, every soldier running around with equivalent of machinegun against army mostly using bolt actions, even Americans with garands had serious firepower
Also i forgot to mention that when germans were testing mkb42 in field, test units fully equipped with those assault rifles were very effective, and that was even before russians took the idea and crafted great weapon out of it(like british inventing mk1 and french perfecting it with ft17) now imagine modern assault rifles in hands of entire army
@@wojszach4443 that would totally devastated the german army. If you were using an bolt action rifle, it would took something like 5-7 person squad to pin down an section. But with an modern assault rife. You just need one and the other can just run from cover to cover, and that was not to mention the radio communication between each member in squad, compare to the old time which took hour for news to reach
there's a series of novels by Marcin Ciszewski exploring exactly this topic - a Polish NATO batallion travels back in time to the 1st September 1939 and fights the Germans. Unfortunately ammo runs out fast and they only manage to prolong the defensive until late November, then need to disband and hide. But they get back again in 1944 to fight in the Warsaw Uprising, using stuff like ZSU-4-23 Shylka to lay cover fire in the streets of Warsaw "painting the facades red with blood" of massacred German troops with 23mm cannon bursts.
I’m confused but okay lmao
in other novel from the series, happening during the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising in 1943, they use a 25mm GAU-12 scavenged from a defunct Mi-24 (NATO forces had the ex-Soviet choppers refitted with modern guns) and put on a truck to quickly assault a unit of German soldiers in an alley, laying devastating fire from the 5-barrel gatling cannon. But I wonder - is the author even aware that a single or even a duo of men could not operate such a powerful weapon from a truck? And the mass cannonade from this gun would not only kill the personnel, it would also damage all the buildings hit along, and I would not expect dilapidated ghetto houses to not cave-in immediately...
Anyway, an interesting read nonetheless.
The novels are really bad because they suffer a common problem in ATL stories, despite time travel no other factor changes and world doesn't react to the time travel at all.
@@davidlokanski2771 it does in Ciszewski's novels, when eventually the Nazis intercept a second time machine Americans clumpsily sent with a rescue mission to 1939, and use their intelligence officers to find out about the previous time-travelers and the world they came from. They prepare a bold attack to the future, with Otto Skorzenny leading a whole panzer division to take over a former Soviet military base with nuclear arsenal in modern Poland - because the Soviets back in 1944 also discovered the time machine and prepared a decades-long plan to take over the first time machine in modern times by using their Soviet-era underground arsenals in satellite countries to gather and stockpile a batallion in wait for the first time-machine to show up.
Quite a drama
Fun scenario, but a huge waste of precision tactical weapons on the part of the Poles. With modern aircraft and weapons available to them at that time, they could have easily made their own lightning fast strikes to decapitate the German leadership in Berlin. And then turned around and done the same to the Russians, though the logistics would have been a little more demanding on that front due to the distances involved. There is nothing like cutting off the head to sow confusion in the body. Focus on very quickly removing command and control of the enemy armies, from top to bottom, and the invading armies would have been all but useless.
Imagine Poland in the future looking at this and saying "Maybe we should try this..."
I think what this kind of analysis lacks is the psychological aspect of war. what would the casualty rate be if a 1939 army fought against a XXI century one? 50 to 1? 100 to 1? imagine the first Gulf War but much worse. they'd had no idea what hit them!
yeah the old school army has a lot more depth in terms of numbers, but they don't know it. what they do know is that their offensives are getting stopped on their tracks with catastrophic losses and that every report indicates that the enemy seems infinitely superior in weaponry. that'll quickly make them reconsider if they want to continue fighitng or not.
He literally said at the beginning of the video that he ignores the psychological effect.
@@Max-hb9yu much of war is psychological warfare to be honest. Without morale army would take more casualties. And if morale are great you can do some shit that people thought was impossible. Take the battle of Monte Casino or the defense of Westerplatte. If a Pole hears someone say "that is literally a suicide its impossible" he will say "hold my beer and gimme a minute".
Wouldn't the simple fact that the modern Poles would know Germany's strategy in detail already be enough to end this in Polish favor? They would also know the USSR was about to attack. All surprise advantage of the invaders would we gone. Couldn't Poland also attack German air bases as well? Flak cannons would be a very minor threat to a modern jet fighter.
The Polish airforce will quickly run out of modern weapons forcing them to just use their auto canons and older gravity bombs. The polish army would have to eventually switch over to more primitive weapons too.
@@TheMrPeteChannel I think they would, if they played it right, be able to break German moral before that happened.
They could even do better thing. Polish knew places of attack. Mine, artillery cover, planes job, tank attack. Easy win, fast and germans are in problem, suprised.Flank their main Force. Hold in siege. Wait for run out of supplies. Germans done. Soviet seeing how Poland did with Germans hold on attack. Then huge offensive on Berlin. War over. Then see The plan of Ribbentrop-molotov. Accuse soviet of will to start war. Kill their economy. Ale hold it There. Then when Polish economy back in game accuse allies of betray and lies and tell them to go to hell. Also important thing. Never let germany rebuild army. Make A puppet State. Their economy never big Again. Economy bad= no army. Poland is Free. Milions of Poles Don t die. All are happy. You woke up in A beautiful land with Fields, and lazy moving trees and grass. Poland prevail. Warsaw never destroyed....
And Then you woke up in A grey post-communist blocks of flat, see sad faces, and medias accusing Poland of Death camps and collaboraction of goverment with Germans. Sad reallity. Back to dream. Boże miej Ich w opiece.
@@TheMrPeteChannel , Just using auto canons, flying ceiling, flying speed, maneuvery and modern air tactics would be devastating for WW2 air force. Actually just superior tactics was devastating already in WW2 with equal hardware.
Of course that any modern army would beat the crap out of a WWII army in any war theatre
providing that the modern army would be well supplied.
Ah you see well akshually modern army would lose to the romans, because the modern army has only a limited number of bullets akshually
@@filipbitala2624 well akshually theyd have enough bullets
Just 1 modern tank could take out everything the germans had. Tanks with gyroscopic stablizing, reactive and plated armour, fire and forget, multiple targeting and ranging. The only problem the Poles would have is running out of amunition.
@TH-cam Monitor maybe only one tank is a bit much I'll admit but you only have to looks at 'desert storm' to see that it would be a massacre with the Polish maybe not taking a single casualty. Check out the Canadian/UN forces verses the Croatians in the Medak pocket. A little convoluted but the point can still be made that a smaller force with superior firepower will win.
I don't know where you got the numbers, but Poland has an active personel army of 118 000 and a reserve of 75 400
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Land_Forces
You're including their Navy, their current day paramilitary units(whom serve across the world and not in Poland), and the elite units of their police force(who should be counted as mobilized civilians and not combatants)
@@aweofficial3366 No im not. Polish standing, professional Army is 140 k strong (111 000 prof + 29 000 WOT). Polish Police forces and paramilitary is included into the 75 400 reserve.
@@janherburodo8070 ref?
I have an idea about a future video - "What if all the former Soviet republics invade Russia"
They die
I mean, russia was a soviet republic, so...
Considering that the modern military has radar, a surprise attack would be a non-starter. The Poles wouldn't waist time with AA missiles, a short gun burst would dispatch the German aircraft. Also the Poles have some good Anti Aircraft gun systems today. So the Air war would be eliminated within hours for Germany. The Poles would have a much better intelligence picture within several hours, so sneak attacks would be again a non-starter. Next the German armor at the beginning of WWII would be an easy target for infantry. As for the lightning war tactics of Germany would be negated as Poles have mobility over the Germans. As for the infantry, the Germans would easily be outperformed. Remember that the Germans would be armed basically with bolt action rifles with Iron Sights, while the Poles would be armed with semi-automatic rifles with many having advanced optics. So the Poles would have the advantage of longer ranges and massively improved accuracy. No matter how superior the numbers the Germans would hold, it would be a bloodbath for the Germans.
Just a few months ago a Russian rocket landed on Polish ground and no one from the military noticed it. It was discovered by a random guy gathering mushrooms.
@@Jutrzenyeah because it landed in the middle of nowhere
@@emillildballe4543 IF someone in the Polish army could operate a radar it could land in a black hole and they'd know about it. But they can't.
Why don't you talk about the impact of the poles having superior automatic firearms compared to the Germans being stuck with mostly bolt action rifles, I would imagine that this would render even quickly trained green recruits more effective per man than German regulars of the time through fire superiority.
How about doing:
“How would have been the African front if the modern Italian army was transported there”
In other words, if there is an alien invasion from an advanced civilization that is just a few hundred years ahead of us, we're screwed.
If they are so advanced and then they would be smarter meaning they would cooperate since cooperation>war
@@nationalist5422 what?
I just don't seek war
meeting aliens that aren't desperate or want to destroy us for their purposes is more realistic than any movie type aliens
In fact it's possible they already know of us and are scared since most of us are savages: we plunder, burn, destroy and wreck each others homes for what? Skin colour, wealth and pride...
@@chillaxo9863 what if they are just men and want to fight
@@joydeepmitra4114 then they are no better than us
@g45 rmr Suggest reading the worldwar series By Harry Turtledove in it an advanced alien force lands in 1942
it would be very different answer now given they have 160k active personnel 200k reserve and 25k deployed personnel plus 261 aircraft and 46 navy vessels
The Soviets wouldn't have attacked though. The only reason they did was because the Germans were winning. With a much more advanced Poland, slowly recovering in numbers, and a germany completely militarily humiliated, the Soviets may decide not to try their luck.
But germany had million more manpower after a while piland would need to surender because if thex still fight ooland will be destroyed
@@gamerdrache2.02 Their tech would allow them to just bomb Berlin and other major cities forcing them to surrender.
@@Protectorio099 you know in rl everythink was bombed and they did not surrender so why then
@@gamerdrache2.02 Thats true but then they could destroy all their supply lines starving the armies allowing the. to easily invade.
@@gamerdrache2.02 Manpower isn’t going to dictate every war, and there’s certainly many times numerically superior opponents lost a war