Fjord went from a sailor taking orders never thinking He’d do anything important with his life. To a captain of multiple ships, leader of one of the greatest adventuring groups, champion of the wild mother, defector of ukatoa, and a man willing to sacrifice his own morals, maybe even his reputation among his friends for a better shot at victory. Respect.
What are you talking about that was literally useless. They travel carefully themselves and it didnt take 3 hours. He did that because he likes being slightly evil.
It may have not worked but it wasn't useless or evil. His mentality the entire buildup was clear - they have to use absolutely everything at their disposal, even their own lives because it's do or die for not only themselves but potentially the rest of the world. If his thought process resulted in M9 getting the rest off or taking the 2 hp needed to bring someone unconscious it would've been worth it.
Any second bought, any HP lost and any spell slot wasted. Buying time and any advantage with blood. My boy is cold blooded, seeing this gave me shivers when I first saw it.
What people don't seem to realize is that this probably did make a difference. The troop was all rangers, so they probably fought from a distance, which would have forced the Tomb Takers to book it to the entrance in a hurry. Remember that there was very little time between this and them falling down the hole. The speed they were probably forced to move at could have been the deciding factor in whether they noticed the traps or not, thus making it the reason they worked so well
Thus allowing them to kill 2 (?) Tomb Takers right at that entrance after the traps went off. I know Fjord finished 1 off immediatly but i think a second one died too. This call literally made it so they were able to finish them quicker and spare ressources for nonagon
Bruh, people saying it was pointless or stupid, how can you be so sure? ONLY Matt knows if it had an affect, he said before during the hero's feast roll "how many times 1 or 2 points made the difference". What Fjord did could have been the reason why three of them were down and Cree were weak OR could have been pointless. Only Matt knows
When I saw this scene, I had to go back and rewatch it three times not only to catch everyone's individual reaction but also watch Travis' eyes as he hesitates and chooses between his morals and his life
That's not exactly what he chose. He knew if they failed none of them were coming back. He said as much to Bo that nobody was retreating. He was considering if it was worth sacrificing them, and considering he would and has already stated he is willing to sacrifice himself, it's an easy choice to make. It didn't pay off in the way he wanted it to, however it would have caused some damage to Lucians party and could have made them use spells if things with the bombs didn't go well.
Because he played Percy for so long. He understands the hard choices that needed to be made. When everything is on the line, sacrifices will have to be made.
I was so surprised, i didnt think Fjord had it in him, but leaders have to make the hard choices, for the good of all. I was proud of him, also love how Talisen gave the nod too
I never thought of Fjord as the leader... But this definitely was a pretty big moment for him. It was ultimately a pointless choice... It didn't give them any more of a time to rest but still I guess at that point they needed all the time they could get to prepare
Tal was the only one that didn't really react other than nod when Travis gave the order, if you play it back and watch each person's reaction. Tal completely understands why and what Travis/Fjord did
@@greeneyesgirl467 it couldnt give any more time. There was literally just 1 room between the entrance and the trap. All that decision did was let lucien know that the secret entrance was no longer secret and that they should be wary. They're lucky that pointless sacrifice didnt ruin their plan, which was partly reliant on surprise
Absolutely. Percy would have made the same call. Maybe with some better details to draw out the fight as long as possible, but he would have called for the engagement.
It was the Fjord Tough decision. It was also the right one no matter how you look at it, even it didn't have as noticeable of an effect (yet) that Travis wanted. Beyond just more giving the MIX more time, less HP, fewer spell slots, the TTs being less on their guard as they enter the cave... all of that-- ANY of that-- is worth it. And really only Fjord could've made the call. Maybe Caleb or Veth, too-- but they might've wavered. Veth is just so fickle in her decision-making, who knows what she would've done? She also would never want to be in that position. Caleb likely would've shouldered the burden, but he's come so far that his value in people's lives may have him waver. And the blow a decision like that could've been to his progress... Fjord had to be the one. I wonder what Jester will think if/when she finds out because Laura was so vehemently against it.
Watching this again, Taliesin was the only one it seems to have been in the same boat as Travis. This is a heavy choice to make but you got to level the playing field for the two encounters and all of the spells they have used up until now.
Andrew Camacho Totally agree. I’m sure out of game Taliesin is relishing that decision because it was exciting. In a Talks, he missed E56 and said he cheered when Liam gave the Beacon to the Dynasty even though everyone else disagreed. In game, I wonder how Cad will pass judgement on Fjord’s decision. Also, I think Liam looked more shocked than in disagreement.
"TTs being less on their guard"? Absolutely not. If anything, it could have made them MORE on their guard, because they'd know to possibly expect something below. That's why it blows my mind that so many people are praising him for making some kind of amazing chess move... when in reality, he threw away others' lives on a gamble that possibly gave them nothing at all, and potentially could have actually ruined the whole thing. There's nothing genius about that.
I get disagreeing w travis' decision. I also understand the frustration because there are some who get deeply attached to the npcs. But calling the players stupid and basically just hating on them is so weird because this isn't scripted. Travis didn't have the time to meticulously consider every outcome of his decision. It's easy when you're in game to forget shit and act impulsively, especially during highly stressful moments of the game. Good for you if you're a better strategist but idk, some of what ppl are saying is just unnecessary. Like chill out, this is supposed to be fun.
My opinion is that it was not a thought out decision. If you're gonna sacrifice your troops, do it smart - order them to kite TT for a few hours, not just dumbly engage. Engagements last minutes if not seconds. And yes, I thought of that in the moment, not after
@@zozilin like i said, good for you. Not everyone thinks so quickly and rationally under pressure. And hating on someone who doesn't act or think the way you want them to is pointless.
Bro, if that beholder wasted 2 spells, it's more than helpful. Besides, blood hunters use hp to do their abilities. Regardless of how much impact the rangers had, the TT would have necessarily had to use hit points.
Let's also remember that none of the M9 have any real training to draw upon. None of them are former military so none of them can plan out every move in a battle. Couple that with an agonizingly painful tendency to get careless and you have a group that constantly ends up on the losing side of an encounter. Love them to pieces, but gods dammit it would be nice to see them get their shit together once in a while...
@@ORLY21 neither the m9 & the players themselves have that type of training. But idk, im on the camp of it's all just a game w fictional characters & yes it will suck if anything terrible happens to them, but i had fun along the way regardless. So the amt of ppl I've seen who get rude or mean towards the players is just absurd to me.
Hes been saying since they left the tomb takers the first time, this confrontation is it. Either the nein or the TTs are living but not both. Hes even alluded to the fact that if it comes down to saving a member of the nein or killing the TTs, his priority will be the TTs.
@@chand911 I'm not screaming at the cast for being idiots or something, I was just watching the clip like "you don't need it prepared!!! Guys!! Check the PHB!!!" lol
So much nuance behind this choice, I hate it, but i respect it and I see where he's coming from... To the nonexistant imaginary people who gave their lives that day, you will be forever in our hearts, you died heroes and you WILL be remembered. A moment of silence. ... Fuck, i love dnd!
Theres a brilliant short animation from the Rangers perspective, and it makes Fjords choice so much colder. Check it out for yourself if you can find it.
The Rangers' job was to guard the chernobyl of their world; a dangerous hellhole formed of a nightmarish tragedy. They knew they would likely die up there. It's their job as protectors of the Dynasty, and they performed it well
He made the right decision. I think they would've died regardless, they couldn't have hid. They had nowhere to go and even if they did, the TT would have seen them being that they're the seemingly the most perceptive group of fucks in Wildemount.
The right choice, cree and lucien got away but they may have to deal with whatever else lives down there, with essek on a full rest, cad half tapped and caleb pretty much full the odds are looking real good
@@Ethan-nl2wgThey certainly COULD have, but their success would be highly unlikely, and Fjord knew that. From the way Matt described the area, it didn't seem like there were many areas for them to escape, or hide good enough from the ever-perceptive Tomb Takers. They might be excellent at concealment, but they've never faced a group as cunning as the TT.
It made no sense. There was only 1 room between the entrance and the tunnel so it would never have slowed them dow . All it did was tip off lucien that the secret entrance was no longer secret and to be wary of further traps. They're lucky that Fjord didnt blow the whole thing with that decision
Granted, Dagen has seen the TT before, so he knows. Hell he hid from them when they first caught up with M9 after they got the first crest. So maybe Dagen did stay back and hide? One can hope
@@Pocket18 I have a feeling he’s up there on like a couple of HP left, because unlike the Dynasty Rangers, I don’t think he was the type ready to put down his life on a command.
I’m kinda concerned about this scene... not because I’m second guessing Fjord, but because I’m pretty sure Fjord is gonna second guess himself, and I’m worried for him, about what kind of effects it will have.
I have yet to reach this point (currently going through to catch up), but judging on this clip alone, I can gage that this is not a decision he took lightly. Especially if pertaining to lives of people under your command. I can understand the groups reactions to his choice, but as someone who plays rts games often and is part of the military, his decision was probably the right one. It's not always easy being a leader.
One of the great things about this hard choice is that like many hard choices, its outcome isn’t clear-cut. We may never know if the Rangers’ attack tipped the balance against the Tomb Takers, or if they were instantly slaughtered for nothing. Fjord had to make a best guess with other peoples’ lives, and that makes for great drama.
As a leader you have to make the hard decisions, no matter the cost. You might lose a lot from the people around you but in the end, they don't have to live with the decision and costs after it has been made. I'm proud of Fjord, truly proud because he took in the cost of it all and will have a better understanding of these choices. They are trying to save the world, it's either the few or the many.
Nothing to be proud of. The M9, and Fjord, could have made better decisions up to this point -- or approached the fight differently -- in a way that didn't require a bunch of people to die just to (maybe) buy them time (though it could have just as easily blown their cover, or at least put the TT more on their guard). Praise for making "the hard decision" shouldn't come so easily, when the situation itself was of the M9's own making. Convenient that throwing away those lives also happened to serve to prolong Fjord's own life. I don't think he made that decision for selfish reasons, of course -- I'm just saying that it's all too easy to use the "it's the few or the many" justification when you're the one who gets to choose other people to be "the few". I have zero expectation that Fjord will actually "have to live with" his decision, or reflect on it in any meaningful way. And even if he does... screw that. "Living with" guilt is still living -- which is more than can be said for the people who died on his command.
@@Duskdog717 what would you have done then? I'm curious. What other choices could they have made upto this point? If you're saying that they could have done things differently, what choices do you think they could have made? Edit:this is honest curiosity
@@Duskdog717 I think I agree with you for much of that, but I can’t blame Fjord entirely. Sure it was a gamble that didn’t pay off, but he knew that Jester was tapped and most of the party wasn’t at full strength. But if it did pay off, the benefits woulda been huge. Not saying that he should feel good about the decision, but he was looking for every advantage he could get and that extra bit of time coulda easily sealed the win if it had worked.
@@Duskdog717 And one more thing about it is I think Fjord coulda also known that the long rest wasn’t going to happen. And if the Nien was going to be fighting with the handicap, maybe the Rangers could widdle the Takers down a bit. Obviously not much, but could have got some hits in.
@@Duskdog717 first, the freshly killed monster corpses were going to give them away anyway. Having the rangers fight makes the situation less clear - who actually killed them, was it someone laying in wait deeper in, or the rangers who came back out after deciding not to investigate farther? And if they got to the corpses without encountering anyone, they would know a trap was ahead. This way, they can't be sure. In fact, it's less likely, as the M9 wouldn't be so dumb as to think that a few soldiers could really make a difference. So from Lucian's perspective, it would be more likely that the way was clear. Plus even if all they did was one hit point damage, or cost one spell, that may have meant the difference between life and death. And those are soldiers - they knew the risk. And it's no less than what the M9 are willing to do.
NG is my guess, he doesn’t go out of his way to break laws or follow them. I think he’s trying to do what’s best for people whether that’s right or wrong in the eyes of the law
Realistically, they would never have been able to stall for the 3 hours needed (even a close battle only goes a few in-game minutes at most). But the damage they did may have been the difference between death and survival for any of the TTs that died.
Literally got chills from this moment. Such a great character moment that shows how Fjord is a real leader. They have to make decisions that will directly result in the deaths of others. He knows that it is the right call, even though it is completely in the wrong. I hope this moment goes in the history book as one of the best of campaign 2
That was the moment that Fjord became a real leader, that kind of decision is the right one to make, gain every advantage you can when you can't avoid a confrontation with a superior foe, sometimes it means sending troops in to situations you know will cost them their lives.
Man that's a tough call, letting the rangers fight them may give enough time to rest, but in the end the rangers didn't hold them off long enough and the party's rest was ended anyway, rip rangers, know that you died for nothing
We don't know that, though. Only Matt right now knows what toll if any the fight with the Rangers had on the Tomb Takers. It was the right call. The M9 need every advantage they can get and if a fight with the rangers gets them one then it is the choice he has to make.
I think the gamble was that the TT would stop and reevaluate or take their time some other way. Travis knew the rangers would buy them a few seconds at best in a fight. Its about if they would give Lucien pause
As Matt said after Laura's roll, how many times has it come down to just one or two hit points? We don't know what effect they had, but 3 out of 5 are now dead. Even if all they did was one hit point to put one of the TT over the mark, that's worth it.
Respect the call but personally thought that there were other options oppose to a direct engagement when I saw this live. 1. If the objective is to delay for as long as possible - Order a guerilla attack, fire and run/hide behind cover to force them away from the entrance. 2. If the objective is afflict maximum damage - Order the rangers to let them through and then follow up behind for a pincer attack after the explosion goes off.
@@jakenorwood8597 just because only two options were given doesn't mean that a third cannot be proposed. The DM will ultimately decide what is possible. Who knows, Matt may be pleasently surprised that something outside the box is being suggested and decides to give the go ahead. Never know if you never try.
@@SarJulemThe scenario as presented didn't allow the time for Fjord to conceive and communicate a plan. Besides, if the rangers didn't have the awareness to engage in exactly the way you suggested then what are they even doing there?
This moment further solidifies my belief that Fjord is the best M9 leader when their under pressure, or have to make tough decisions. He has made snap decisions before that have really been needed (Gelidon for example. If they had waited, the dragon would most likely have found them, all bundled up.). No one in the group, excluding perhaps Caleb would have made this decision. Jester, Veth and Cadeuces will probably be very angry or at least worried about this, though I suspect Caleb, Beau and Yasha will at least understand why he had to do this. Can't wait for the rp that comes from it though.
Seeing a lot of people questioning/condemning the choice to have the rangers fight. But you're missing a key point. The fresh kills along the way are a clear sign that someone had been there recently. If the rangers hadn't attacked, the TTs would absolutely know that someone was waiting up ahead. By having the rangers fight, it makes the situation less certain - did these rangers go in exploring then retreat when they met resistance, or is someone else up ahead? And from Lucian's point of view, the M9 having these low-ranking soldiers fight is a signal that they're desperate, stalling for time. Either they aren't here yet, or they're trying to set something up. Best to hurry in then and either beat them to the goal or catch them unprepared. Even if the rangers didn't have any physical impact (which we don't know - as Matt said when Laura rolled low, even 1 or 2 HP can make a difference), the psychological impact may have cost him significantly.
And based on his remarks, Lucien was clearly surprised, which gives weight to your theory. TT didn't know M9 were there, they were obviously hoping that they weren't. Encountering the rangers would be natural if the outpost was alerted, but it's a big old Eiselcross, and even if M9 made it back they could be anywhere. On the whole, I think the ranger encounter would be more likely to put TT at ease than to raise suspicions.
@@marymalmros1926 The corpses had been hauled off and the tracks covered. All the other encounters were in the chamber or further in. The decision only alerted the tomb takers which still were surprised. I'd bet the intuit charges and the symbol were enough to outright kill some of the TT's.
Well since they are willing sacrifice their lives too,to stop lucien. Imo,i won't say it was a tough call,i think it was calculated.they said it in previous episodes,they need all the help they can get to stop this perpetual evil. And throw them into the fight,if that help is Essek and a handful of soldiers,so be it. But yeah in the end thats character growth too.
Certainly a badass moment. I don’t think in the end that it mattered. The nein still didn’t get full sleep. Had they been kept in reserve maybe they could have used them to get reinforcements so that it would have been harder for Lucien to retreat back out.
People are way over analysing the ranger sacrifice it was the right move in terms of RP and tactics, Fjord has repeatedly said that at this point he'll do anything to stop them and tactically even shaving off afew hit points or spell slots could make all the difference between winning and losing.
Too bad that it didn't give them the time to have a full rest but i think Matt didn't want his campaign to end in such an anti-climatic fight ( i mean, they would have dealt with the rest of the ennemies without too much trouble even though some of the M9 were low on spells).
@@Scottx125Productions Saying that the DM doesn't decide anything sounds very off. At the very least the DM decides what scale of randomness is apropriate, and what situation to roll for. E.G.: what die size is apropriate for the number of hours till they arrive. I can't see a game where the DM "doesn't decide anything" (which would also be horribly boring for the DM) Of course I agree that a railroaded Campaign is very frustrating , but I can't say I'd prefer a campaign where everything is random and not based on logical consequences and trying to meet dramatic expectations.
In the heat of the moment, it was the right call. Try to weaken the threat as much as possible, while letting your strongest force strengthen up. It's such a tough call and may haunt him, but it was more than likely the best one. That's 60% of their enemy forces gone because of this action.
Honestly it was frustrating to watch Fjord make this difficult call so swiftly only for it to have zero impact on their rest. Matt literally had the tomb-takers enter shortly after this exchange and nobody got a long rest. I have no idea why Matt even gave Travis the choice, or why he let the tomb-takers’ position be decided by a dice roll, for that matter. It made all their choices up to this point in trying to out-run the group (placing the stolen orb really far away, teleporting, etc) seem inconsequential. I would have expected the tomb-takers’ distance from the ruins to be decided by routes they’d be taking during the players’ journey with maybe a few dice rolls throughout (post-episode) to determine some minor luck-based time delays/reductions along the way; not just one “let’s see how close they are” roll. I can only hope there’s more to the story behind the scenes, but it sure didn’t feel like it.
From the look of it, seemed like Matt made multiple rolls and the tomb takers got lucky. And the gang got to use their time by fighting the monsters and planning for the ambush. And it’s unknown how much damage the rangers did to the tomb takers. They could have made a decent impact which would help their ambush. Tldr we can’t decide for sure if it made a difference or not because we don’t know what happened behind the scenes.
I love Matt but there are times where his decisions are kind of frustrating, he is the DM, his word is final in all matters but there are instances like the counterspells of caleb and trent. This is just speculation but it felt like Matt wouldn't have made caleb's counterspell a success unless it was a nat 20 just because trent got a nat 20 as well. After Liam rolled the nat 20, he had to look up and decide how it would go. Of course this just the feeling i got from him and i don't know whether that was his intent.
@@merlinwindrivver600 well see, we as an audience have to remember one thing. At the end of the day this is there job, to entertain. Matt has built his world for his players and for us, he has to appeal sometimes to us, look at chat. They were saying they wanted to see a fight, then saying they wanted to see some RP, then were fed up when they got the Rp with marshia and ash. In that moment like you said, he could of been inching for a fight not just because of the rolls, but because sometimes the critters want to see a fight more than the RP, but liam came out with his nat 20. Now of course im not saying he's in all knowing guy, he is human just like us, and sometimes he will make some questionable choices, but lets not forget they have to entertain us because thats what they use to keep themselves alive, apart from their voice acting of course.
Life isn't like that. You don't get "rewarded" for making a decision, even if it's a hard one. Sometimes you can make all the right decisions and still lose -- and the fact that Fjord CHOSE to sacrifice people doesn't automatically bestow a prize upon him. It was a gamble. Maybe it would work, maybe it wouldn't -- and that is part of what Fjord should have weighed when making the decision. Would it be worthwhile? Would he be throwing their lives away for nothing at all? Those are the choices you have to live with when you make them, and Matt was absolutely right to stick to whatever the plan/dice/whatever was, and not fudge just to make Fjord's critical decision a "good" one. Otherwise they aren't hard decisions at all. If you're going to have your character make such a choice, you have to be prepared for there to be consequences or for things not to work out.
I love Fjord, but God DAYM, whatta bad call. That was not a choice "for the good of all" He killed those men for no reason. Dagen included. You think those guys could do any damage to the Tomb-takers? Hell nah, Lucien fucking froze those bolts mid-air Kylo Ren style FOR SURE. Man, get outta here, Fjord straight up killed Dagen for 10 minutes of sleep, applause for the confidence, but the way to hell is paved with good intentions. Idk how so many are out here thinking Fjord made the right call, he didn't, that's why he (Travis) was so pissed that Cree and Lucien got away, he realized he killed Dagen and those men in exchange for just a couple minutes of rest.
Actually I think it was the right call. The fresh monster corpses are a dead giveaway that someone came through recently. Had the rangers not engaged, it becomes clear there's someone waiting ahead. By engaging, it makes it less clear. Was it these rangers who went in and came out after meeting resistance, or is someone waiting farther in? Plus from Lucian's point of view, it wouldn't make sense for the M9 to waste these soldiers' lives unless they're desperate. They're probably trying to stall, so best to hurry in and catch them unprepared, or beat them to the goal.
For all we know that fight cost the TT three of their members, sure it didn't stall them for as long as they wanted but if they were going to have to fight before they wanted to anyways it would be best to weaken the enemy as much as they could before then. I think the biggest mistake was not going after Cree immediately but even then looking back I'm not sure Fjord could have gotten to her.
Dude it was definitely the right call. In the heat of the moment he made a decision and hoped for the best. Unfortunately it just didn’t turn out that way. When you’re thinking critically really fast in this type of situation, you don’t have time to think about any unforeseen consequences
This decision makes no sense though. There was only 1 room between the hidden entrance and the tunnel. So it was never going to slow down the tomb takers, just tip them off that the secret entrance was discovered. It risked everything for no gain 🤨
@@matthewwindelspecht2559 i'm not sure it would have done anything. Matt wasnt rolling for their attack so its unlikely it had any impact. What it did do was tip off lucien, thereby risking the loss of surprise, and he didnt give the rest any time to prepare. If anyone was sleeping without armour on (like Matt emphasised that time they got attacked at sea) then they were about to be at severe disadvantage for that critical fight. Alerting lucien and not giving his team time to prepare, that is doubly bad planning. To be honest though, Laura was showing real frustration that she wasnt going to be able to fight without sleep so Travis probably did it in the hopes that Laura wouldnt be upset and could enjoy it more. He gets more good husband points than battle tactics points 😂
I saw you making the same argument under multiple comments and you may have a small point there, but you have to remember that there were 2 dead giants in front of the cave so that wouldve tipped the TT off as well, so maybe with the Rangers around they thought they took care of the giants. Also the rangers couldve shipped away at their HP or made them use spell slots, there was certainly something to gain.
@@roonaldo86 true. Considering their plan was to catch them by surprise, they didnt really do much to cover their tracks 😂 But they had Travis on Talks Machina this week and it was interesting to hear his perspective on this directly. Turns out he immediately regretted his decision but felt pressure in the moment to be decisive, he thought they were further away than they actually were and got it stuck in his head that the team needed sleep to be at full power. He recognised in retrospect it couldnt have happened. Was an interesting discussion.
Man I don’t know. Obviously in hindsight, it seems it was not a good decision because Fjord’s main goal of getting everyone a long rest didn’t pan out. I just don’t understand why you would reveal to the tomb takers their presence. I guess Matt rolled on this, but my logic was they would be cautious and wary entering the tomb resulting in the plan failing. I guess maybe you force them to use some spell slots. I think the point I would make is the outcome would’ve been the same whether or not the rangers engaged. I don’t know how much ground the tomb takers needed to cover to get the rope that led to the cavern, but it didn’t seem like a 3 hours long journey which would’ve been needed to get the long rest. I just feel they died for nothing, and to make it worse Fjord knew that they didn’t stand a snowballs chance in hell.
the thing is with dnd hells, is that theres 9 of them, and one of them is frozen. there is no definitive right or wrong here, as fjord let people know, this was it, they had to go all in. you miss 100 percent of the shot you dont take, and knowing what was at stake, better to try than not.
All this planning and they botched the combat. I usually don't get upset at their decisions especially in combat but not targeting the healer? Really? That is like rule #1 of strategy
I agree, considering the fact that she was bloodied when they got there, taking her out woulda sealed that fight. Considering the only person to fight is Lucien, who is pretty much just a beholder with extra flair.
It was the only choice as a game player. The GM provides resources for the player to achieve success. Travis used imaginary rangers that don't really exist, aren't anybody else's player characters and don't matter at all. Except to buy time for the rest and whatever rolls Matt might make for Lucien to waste spell slots or HP on. Yes it really annoys me when they give money away to NPC characters for no reason as well. Lol.
this decision makes him literally no better than Lucien willing to do whatever they want to meet their goals I knew Fjord was loose with the morals but this is too far and it was the equivalent I'm trying to take on a tank with a slingshot
I wholeheartedly disagree. As you stated, Lucien does what he wants. Fjord did what he believed was NEEDED, not what he wanted. You've also got to consider the respective goals, too. Fjord knows that if Lucien isn't stopped, Exandria is doomed. Making difficult decisions isn't the same as being loose with morals.
![ILLSLICK - KILLSHOT REMIX [FULL VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RIK8RrqIAzE/mqdefault.jpg)
"A general has one job. To tell his men where to die." Marshall Gebhard Leberecht von Blücher 1813
"He was my boyfriend!" - Frau Blucher
@@WulfPriest Got to love a Young Frankenstein reference. Best film ever!
@@WulfPriest *horse whinnies offscreen*
Thank you for this great quote
I heard horses neighing as I finished reading this and I'm giddy to see I'm not alone.
Fjord went from a sailor taking orders never thinking He’d do anything important with his life. To a captain of multiple ships, leader of one of the greatest adventuring groups, champion of the wild mother, defector of ukatoa, and a man willing to sacrifice his own morals, maybe even his reputation among his friends for a better shot at victory. Respect.
Against a monstrosity lets just remember
Very well said
@@hauz287 Whole world and maybe worse is on the line.
What's that phrase? "Any port in a storm."
Now he’s Bjald
"thinking He’d do anything important with his life. "
You have zero evidence of this. Hate fucking internet therapists with this show.
We had No Mercy Percy in campaign 1
No we got Stone Cold Fjord in campaign 2
I can’t wait to see him unleash his wrath upon Lucien
Nah its gotta be Fjord Stone Cold, since its it actual name😂
Nuclear Imogen😂
This scene literally shook me to the core...mans really made a character choice I respect the man he has become
This and the Lava scene. Really shows how strong his conviction is.
This is a great character choice, it shows how far he has come as he was stepping into the leader role
What are you talking about that was literally useless. They travel carefully themselves and it didnt take 3 hours. He did that because he likes being slightly evil.
Confident? Yes? Good decision? NO. He just sent Dagen and those men to their deaths.
It may have not worked but it wasn't useless or evil. His mentality the entire buildup was clear - they have to use absolutely everything at their disposal, even their own lives because it's do or die for not only themselves but potentially the rest of the world. If his thought process resulted in M9 getting the rest off or taking the 2 hp needed to bring someone unconscious it would've been worth it.
Laura has this look on her face like "I'm married to this man."
Absolute chills from just one word by Travis
The last 30 minutes or so of the episode was the most edge-of-my-seat period of the campaign yet.
I've watched this three times. Chills every time.
Any second bought, any HP lost and any spell slot wasted. Buying time and any advantage with blood. My boy is cold blooded, seeing this gave me shivers when I first saw it.
What people don't seem to realize is that this probably did make a difference. The troop was all rangers, so they probably fought from a distance, which would have forced the Tomb Takers to book it to the entrance in a hurry. Remember that there was very little time between this and them falling down the hole. The speed they were probably forced to move at could have been the deciding factor in whether they noticed the traps or not, thus making it the reason they worked so well
Thus allowing them to kill 2 (?) Tomb Takers right at that entrance after the traps went off. I know Fjord finished 1 off immediatly but i think a second one died too. This call literally made it so they were able to finish them quicker and spare ressources for nonagon
@@goodIkarma they took 3 of the 5 out. Only Cree and Lucien survived and Cree was hurt.
It was at this moment when I really knew, Fjord is an actual captain.
Bruh, people saying it was pointless or stupid, how can you be so sure? ONLY Matt knows if it had an affect, he said before during the hero's feast roll "how many times 1 or 2 points made the difference". What Fjord did could have been the reason why three of them were down and Cree were weak OR could have been pointless. Only Matt knows
he said in the episode that he rolled for the time it would take for the tomb takers to get there, i think. there was probably a chance
When I saw this scene, I had to go back and rewatch it three times not only to catch everyone's individual reaction but also watch Travis' eyes as he hesitates and chooses between his morals and his life
That's not exactly what he chose. He knew if they failed none of them were coming back. He said as much to Bo that nobody was retreating. He was considering if it was worth sacrificing them, and considering he would and has already stated he is willing to sacrifice himself, it's an easy choice to make. It didn't pay off in the way he wanted it to, however it would have caused some damage to Lucians party and could have made them use spells if things with the bombs didn't go well.
Taliesin smirked and nodded when he said yes, interesting.
Because he played Percy for so long. He understands the hard choices that needed to be made. When everything is on the line, sacrifices will have to be made.
I was so surprised, i didnt think Fjord had it in him, but leaders have to make the hard choices, for the good of all.
I was proud of him, also love how Talisen gave the nod too
I never thought of Fjord as the leader... But this definitely was a pretty big moment for him. It was ultimately a pointless choice... It didn't give them any more of a time to rest but still I guess at that point they needed all the time they could get to prepare
I saw that too! Percy had to make many of those tough choices in C1 - so of anyone, I think Taliesin understands.
Tal was the only one that didn't really react other than nod when Travis gave the order, if you play it back and watch each person's reaction. Tal completely understands why and what Travis/Fjord did
@@greeneyesgirl467 it couldnt give any more time. There was literally just 1 room between the entrance and the trap. All that decision did was let lucien know that the secret entrance was no longer secret and that they should be wary. They're lucky that pointless sacrifice didnt ruin their plan, which was partly reliant on surprise
As an eldritch being, Taliesin knows the cost of countless lives.
The only one expecting that answer? Taliesin. Maybe it's the Percy in his brain, but he understands. Laura's and Sam's expressions are priceless.
Absolutely. Percy would have made the same call. Maybe with some better details to draw out the fight as long as possible, but he would have called for the engagement.
Someone please animate the fight between the Tomb Takers and the Rangers
You mean the massacre
That antimagic field is murder. It makes the takers worth double their numbers right there.
Lucien just looks at them and they explode
Shortest animation in history 😂
@@billcasey9672 true, but the rangers don’t use magic, so that major ability won’t help with the fight.
It was the Fjord Tough decision. It was also the right one no matter how you look at it, even it didn't have as noticeable of an effect (yet) that Travis wanted. Beyond just more giving the MIX more time, less HP, fewer spell slots, the TTs being less on their guard as they enter the cave... all of that-- ANY of that-- is worth it.
And really only Fjord could've made the call. Maybe Caleb or Veth, too-- but they might've wavered. Veth is just so fickle in her decision-making, who knows what she would've done? She also would never want to be in that position. Caleb likely would've shouldered the burden, but he's come so far that his value in people's lives may have him waver. And the blow a decision like that could've been to his progress... Fjord had to be the one. I wonder what Jester will think if/when she finds out because Laura was so vehemently against it.
Watching this again, Taliesin was the only one it seems to have been in the same boat as Travis. This is a heavy choice to make but you got to level the playing field for the two encounters and all of the spells they have used up until now.
As a chess man, I see the move for what it is in strategic terms: sacrificed pawns for three key pieces. As a viewer, I hope Dagon is ok.
Andrew Camacho Totally agree. I’m sure out of game Taliesin is relishing that decision because it was exciting. In a Talks, he missed E56 and said he cheered when Liam gave the Beacon to the Dynasty even though everyone else disagreed. In game, I wonder how Cad will pass judgement on Fjord’s decision. Also, I think Liam looked more shocked than in disagreement.
@@andrewcamacho5258 i think Talesin was having an internal struggle Cad was saying no, but Percy was saying yes.
"TTs being less on their guard"? Absolutely not. If anything, it could have made them MORE on their guard, because they'd know to possibly expect something below. That's why it blows my mind that so many people are praising him for making some kind of amazing chess move... when in reality, he threw away others' lives on a gamble that possibly gave them nothing at all, and potentially could have actually ruined the whole thing. There's nothing genius about that.
I get disagreeing w travis' decision. I also understand the frustration because there are some who get deeply attached to the npcs. But calling the players stupid and basically just hating on them is so weird because this isn't scripted. Travis didn't have the time to meticulously consider every outcome of his decision. It's easy when you're in game to forget shit and act impulsively, especially during highly stressful moments of the game.
Good for you if you're a better strategist but idk, some of what ppl are saying is just unnecessary. Like chill out, this is supposed to be fun.
My opinion is that it was not a thought out decision. If you're gonna sacrifice your troops, do it smart - order them to kite TT for a few hours, not just dumbly engage. Engagements last minutes if not seconds. And yes, I thought of that in the moment, not after
@@zozilin like i said, good for you. Not everyone thinks so quickly and rationally under pressure. And hating on someone who doesn't act or think the way you want them to is pointless.
Bro, if that beholder wasted 2 spells, it's more than helpful.
Besides, blood hunters use hp to do their abilities. Regardless of how much impact the rangers had, the TT would have necessarily had to use hit points.
Let's also remember that none of the M9 have any real training to draw upon. None of them are former military so none of them can plan out every move in a battle. Couple that with an agonizingly painful tendency to get careless and you have a group that constantly ends up on the losing side of an encounter. Love them to pieces, but gods dammit it would be nice to see them get their shit together once in a while...
@@ORLY21 neither the m9 & the players themselves have that type of training. But idk, im on the camp of it's all just a game w fictional characters & yes it will suck if anything terrible happens to them, but i had fun along the way regardless. So the amt of ppl I've seen who get rude or mean towards the players is just absurd to me.
Hes been saying since they left the tomb takers the first time, this confrontation is it. Either the nein or the TTs are living but not both. Hes even alluded to the fact that if it comes down to saving a member of the nein or killing the TTs, his priority will be the TTs.
I think everyone forgot that Alarm is a ritual spell
Meaning Caleb doesn't need to have it prepared
Who gives a shit? Its a show. Chill.
@@chand911 I'm not screaming at the cast for being idiots or something, I was just watching the clip like "you don't need it prepared!!! Guys!! Check the PHB!!!" lol
They couldn’t set it cuz they only thought of it after setting the charges and they couldn’t get close to them. Basically it would take to much time
@@sherpas7892 yeah
Some people make the hard decisions and they live with it, and there are other who will judge you whichever choice you make.
So much nuance behind this choice, I hate it, but i respect it and I see where he's coming from...
To the nonexistant imaginary people who gave their lives that day, you will be forever in our hearts, you died heroes and you WILL be remembered.
A moment of silence.
...
Fuck, i love dnd!
Theres a brilliant short animation from the Rangers perspective, and it makes Fjords choice so much colder. Check it out for yourself if you can find it.
They don't call him Fjord Stone for nothing
Gives me chills everytime
The Rangers' job was to guard the chernobyl of their world; a dangerous hellhole formed of a nightmarish tragedy. They knew they would likely die up there. It's their job as protectors of the Dynasty, and they performed it well
I love that Taliesin just nods :D
While watching I really thought sacrificing the rangers would of granted them the rest time. Seems the decision didn't really matter.
Something, maybe > Nothing, for sure.
I have a feeling Dagon said fuck that and didn't fight the Tomb Takers. He's not stupid and is aware what they are capable of.
Sometimes you gotta make a choice. He made it and to me it seemed like the right thing to do. How does everyone feel about what happened?
He made the right decision. I think they would've died regardless, they couldn't have hid. They had nowhere to go and even if they did, the TT would have seen them being that they're the seemingly the most perceptive group of fucks in Wildemount.
The right choice, cree and lucien got away but they may have to deal with whatever else lives down there, with essek on a full rest, cad half tapped and caleb pretty much full the odds are looking real good
@@blackbox8697 why wouldn’t they be able to hide? if Essek ordered them to go and hide then definitely could have
@@Ethan-nl2wgThey certainly COULD have, but their success would be highly unlikely, and Fjord knew that. From the way Matt described the area, it didn't seem like there were many areas for them to escape, or hide good enough from the ever-perceptive Tomb Takers. They might be excellent at concealment, but they've never faced a group as cunning as the TT.
It made no sense. There was only 1 room between the entrance and the tunnel so it would never have slowed them dow . All it did was tip off lucien that the secret entrance was no longer secret and to be wary of further traps. They're lucky that Fjord didnt blow the whole thing with that decision
They may have killed Dagen
My question now is... was wheelcair guy in the fray? :O
yeap. he would have been
Daegan would have left
@@kizxankan6513 why would he have left? if they attack and he is with them he could be in the crossfire or worse
he doesn't get paid enough
he doesn't get paid enough
Rip dagen
Bro I didn’t even think about that
I don't think anyone else thought about that either
Me and you buddy, the one two that was thinking about Dag
Granted, Dagen has seen the TT before, so he knows. Hell he hid from them when they first caught up with M9 after they got the first crest. So maybe Dagen did stay back and hide? One can hope
@@Pocket18 I have a feeling he’s up there on like a couple of HP left, because unlike the Dynasty Rangers, I don’t think he was the type ready to put down his life on a command.
Fjord made the choice so no one elss had to. Amazing scene
I’m kinda concerned about this scene... not because I’m second guessing Fjord, but because I’m pretty sure Fjord is gonna second guess himself, and I’m worried for him, about what kind of effects it will have.
I have yet to reach this point (currently going through to catch up), but judging on this clip alone, I can gage that this is not a decision he took lightly. Especially if pertaining to lives of people under your command. I can understand the groups reactions to his choice, but as someone who plays rts games often and is part of the military, his decision was probably the right one. It's not always easy being a leader.
When this happened, I nodded and though of what Thanos said "The hardest choices require the strongest wills". The hard call, but the right call.
I really really reallly (multiple times) hope that Dagen is still alive after this
I hope so. But hey its Dagen and thats above his paygrade so he might have escape.
And that's why he's the CEO
One of the great things about this hard choice is that like many hard choices, its outcome isn’t clear-cut. We may never know if the Rangers’ attack tipped the balance against the Tomb Takers, or if they were instantly slaughtered for nothing. Fjord had to make a best guess with other peoples’ lives, and that makes for great drama.
As a leader you have to make the hard decisions, no matter the cost. You might lose a lot from the people around you but in the end, they don't have to live with the decision and costs after it has been made. I'm proud of Fjord, truly proud because he took in the cost of it all and will have a better understanding of these choices. They are trying to save the world, it's either the few or the many.
Nothing to be proud of. The M9, and Fjord, could have made better decisions up to this point -- or approached the fight differently -- in a way that didn't require a bunch of people to die just to (maybe) buy them time (though it could have just as easily blown their cover, or at least put the TT more on their guard). Praise for making "the hard decision" shouldn't come so easily, when the situation itself was of the M9's own making. Convenient that throwing away those lives also happened to serve to prolong Fjord's own life. I don't think he made that decision for selfish reasons, of course -- I'm just saying that it's all too easy to use the "it's the few or the many" justification when you're the one who gets to choose other people to be "the few". I have zero expectation that Fjord will actually "have to live with" his decision, or reflect on it in any meaningful way. And even if he does... screw that. "Living with" guilt is still living -- which is more than can be said for the people who died on his command.
@@Duskdog717 what would you have done then? I'm curious. What other choices could they have made upto this point? If you're saying that they could have done things differently, what choices do you think they could have made?
Edit:this is honest curiosity
@@Duskdog717 I think I agree with you for much of that, but I can’t blame Fjord entirely. Sure it was a gamble that didn’t pay off, but he knew that Jester was tapped and most of the party wasn’t at full strength. But if it did pay off, the benefits woulda been huge.
Not saying that he should feel good about the decision, but he was looking for every advantage he could get and that extra bit of time coulda easily sealed the win if it had worked.
@@Duskdog717 And one more thing about it is I think Fjord coulda also known that the long rest wasn’t going to happen. And if the Nien was going to be fighting with the handicap, maybe the Rangers could widdle the Takers down a bit. Obviously not much, but could have got some hits in.
@@Duskdog717 first, the freshly killed monster corpses were going to give them away anyway. Having the rangers fight makes the situation less clear - who actually killed them, was it someone laying in wait deeper in, or the rangers who came back out after deciding not to investigate farther? And if they got to the corpses without encountering anyone, they would know a trap was ahead. This way, they can't be sure. In fact, it's less likely, as the M9 wouldn't be so dumb as to think that a few soldiers could really make a difference. So from Lucian's perspective, it would be more likely that the way was clear.
Plus even if all they did was one hit point damage, or cost one spell, that may have meant the difference between life and death. And those are soldiers - they knew the risk. And it's no less than what the M9 are willing to do.
Everyones so surprised like this ain't the same man who tried to kill Santa xD
Get me a Fjord 316 shirt because he is Stone Cold.
Thats the Fjord i like the cold bloded sea serpent. The only question i have is, what is his aliment?
I’d say definitely neutral. It’s a toss up between chaos and lawful tho. But if I had to guess I’d say chaotic neutral.
Fjord is canonically lawful good
@@tobizerker4153 Not after this
NG is my guess, he doesn’t go out of his way to break laws or follow them. I think he’s trying to do what’s best for people whether that’s right or wrong in the eyes of the law
I dont think the CR guys really use the alignment system, it's way too straight forward for such a morally gray campaign
Ashley, Sam, and Marisha with those looks lol
Hoooooly shit I felt this in my chest
In all reality, right call. Sacrifice those men and women, so they can rest.
Realistically, they would never have been able to stall for the 3 hours needed (even a close battle only goes a few in-game minutes at most). But the damage they did may have been the difference between death and survival for any of the TTs that died.
Literally got chills from this moment. Such a great character moment that shows how Fjord is a real leader. They have to make decisions that will directly result in the deaths of others. He knows that it is the right call, even though it is completely in the wrong. I hope this moment goes in the history book as one of the best of campaign 2
That was the moment that Fjord became a real leader, that kind of decision is the right one to make, gain every advantage you can when you can't avoid a confrontation with a superior foe, sometimes it means sending troops in to situations you know will cost them their lives.
I like how this vid doesn't have a single down vote
Stone cold fjord
Is Dagon dead now?
Man that's a tough call, letting the rangers fight them may give enough time to rest, but in the end the rangers didn't hold them off long enough and the party's rest was ended anyway, rip rangers, know that you died for nothing
We don't know that, though. Only Matt right now knows what toll if any the fight with the Rangers had on the Tomb Takers. It was the right call. The M9 need every advantage they can get and if a fight with the rangers gets them one then it is the choice he has to make.
I think the gamble was that the TT would stop and reevaluate or take their time some other way. Travis knew the rangers would buy them a few seconds at best in a fight. Its about if they would give Lucien pause
As Matt said after Laura's roll, how many times has it come down to just one or two hit points? We don't know what effect they had, but 3 out of 5 are now dead. Even if all they did was one hit point to put one of the TT over the mark, that's worth it.
I think fjord made the right call knowing the info he did at the time, I'm just not sure if it amounted to much
Respect the call but personally thought that there were other options oppose to a direct engagement when I saw this live.
1. If the objective is to delay for as long as possible - Order a guerilla attack, fire and run/hide behind cover to force them away from the entrance.
2. If the objective is afflict maximum damage - Order the rangers to let them through and then follow up behind for a pincer attack after the explosion goes off.
The thing is that that’s not what Matt asked. So if the question is are they too engage, the answer is yes.
@@jakenorwood8597 just because only two options were given doesn't mean that a third cannot be proposed.
The DM will ultimately decide what is possible. Who knows, Matt may be pleasently surprised that something outside the box is being suggested and decides to give the go ahead. Never know if you never try.
@@SarJulemThe scenario as presented didn't allow the time for Fjord to conceive and communicate a plan.
Besides, if the rangers didn't have the awareness to engage in exactly the way you suggested then what are they even doing there?
This moment further solidifies my belief that Fjord is the best M9 leader when their under pressure, or have to make tough decisions. He has made snap decisions before that have really been needed (Gelidon for example. If they had waited, the dragon would most likely have found them, all bundled up.). No one in the group, excluding perhaps Caleb would have made this decision. Jester, Veth and Cadeuces will probably be very angry or at least worried about this, though I suspect Caleb, Beau and Yasha will at least understand why he had to do this. Can't wait for the rp that comes from it though.
Seeing a lot of people questioning/condemning the choice to have the rangers fight. But you're missing a key point.
The fresh kills along the way are a clear sign that someone had been there recently. If the rangers hadn't attacked, the TTs would absolutely know that someone was waiting up ahead. By having the rangers fight, it makes the situation less certain - did these rangers go in exploring then retreat when they met resistance, or is someone else up ahead? And from Lucian's point of view, the M9 having these low-ranking soldiers fight is a signal that they're desperate, stalling for time. Either they aren't here yet, or they're trying to set something up. Best to hurry in then and either beat them to the goal or catch them unprepared. Even if the rangers didn't have any physical impact (which we don't know - as Matt said when Laura rolled low, even 1 or 2 HP can make a difference), the psychological impact may have cost him significantly.
And based on his remarks, Lucien was clearly surprised, which gives weight to your theory. TT didn't know M9 were there, they were obviously hoping that they weren't. Encountering the rangers would be natural if the outpost was alerted, but it's a big old Eiselcross, and even if M9 made it back they could be anywhere. On the whole, I think the ranger encounter would be more likely to put TT at ease than to raise suspicions.
@@marymalmros1926 The corpses had been hauled off and the tracks covered. All the other encounters were in the chamber or further in. The decision only alerted the tomb takers which still were surprised. I'd bet the intuit charges and the symbol were enough to outright kill some of the TT's.
@@codyjungers not sure what your point is, but clearly if the TT were "alerted" in some form it didn't make any difference.
Well since they are willing sacrifice their lives too,to stop lucien. Imo,i won't say it was a tough call,i think it was calculated.they said it in previous episodes,they need all the help they can get to stop this perpetual evil. And throw them into the fight,if that help is Essek and a handful of soldiers,so be it. But yeah in the end thats character growth too.
Certainly a badass moment. I don’t think in the end that it mattered. The nein still didn’t get full sleep. Had they been kept in reserve maybe they could have used them to get reinforcements so that it would have been harder for Lucien to retreat back out.
Rip Daggen.
People are way over analysing the ranger sacrifice it was the right move in terms of RP and tactics, Fjord has repeatedly said that at this point he'll do anything to stop them and tactically even shaving off afew hit points or spell slots could make all the difference between winning and losing.
Too bad that it didn't give them the time to have a full rest but i think Matt didn't want his campaign to end in such an anti-climatic fight ( i mean, they would have dealt with the rest of the ennemies without too much trouble even though some of the M9 were low on spells).
Matt doesn't decide anything. He rolls the dice and they dictate the flow of the campaign. There's nothing worse than railroading a campaign.
@@Scottx125Productions Saying that the DM doesn't decide anything sounds very off. At the very least the DM decides what scale of randomness is apropriate, and what situation to roll for. E.G.: what die size is apropriate for the number of hours till they arrive. I can't see a game where the DM "doesn't decide anything" (which would also be horribly boring for the DM)
Of course I agree that a railroaded Campaign is very frustrating , but I can't say I'd prefer a campaign where everything is random and not based on logical consequences and trying to meet dramatic expectations.
Travis honestly deserves inspiration for that.
Sam really needs to put a sock in it sometimes.
i love that Fjord did this
In the heat of the moment, it was the right call. Try to weaken the threat as much as possible, while letting your strongest force strengthen up. It's such a tough call and may haunt him, but it was more than likely the best one. That's 60% of their enemy forces gone because of this action.
Respect Fjord, respect.
Honestly it was frustrating to watch Fjord make this difficult call so swiftly only for it to have zero impact on their rest. Matt literally had the tomb-takers enter shortly after this exchange and nobody got a long rest. I have no idea why Matt even gave Travis the choice, or why he let the tomb-takers’ position be decided by a dice roll, for that matter. It made all their choices up to this point in trying to out-run the group (placing the stolen orb really far away, teleporting, etc) seem inconsequential. I would have expected the tomb-takers’ distance from the ruins to be decided by routes they’d be taking during the players’ journey with maybe a few dice rolls throughout (post-episode) to determine some minor luck-based time delays/reductions along the way; not just one “let’s see how close they are” roll.
I can only hope there’s more to the story behind the scenes, but it sure didn’t feel like it.
From the look of it, seemed like Matt made multiple rolls and the tomb takers got lucky. And the gang got to use their time by fighting the monsters and planning for the ambush. And it’s unknown how much damage the rangers did to the tomb takers. They could have made a decent impact which would help their ambush.
Tldr we can’t decide for sure if it made a difference or not because we don’t know what happened behind the scenes.
I love Matt but there are times where his decisions are kind of frustrating, he is the DM, his word is final in all matters but there are instances like the counterspells of caleb and trent. This is just speculation but it felt like Matt wouldn't have made caleb's counterspell a success unless it was a nat 20 just because trent got a nat 20 as well. After Liam rolled the nat 20, he had to look up and decide how it would go. Of course this just the feeling i got from him and i don't know whether that was his intent.
@@merlinwindrivver600 well see, we as an audience have to remember one thing. At the end of the day this is there job, to entertain. Matt has built his world for his players and for us, he has to appeal sometimes to us, look at chat. They were saying they wanted to see a fight, then saying they wanted to see some RP, then were fed up when they got the Rp with marshia and ash. In that moment like you said, he could of been inching for a fight not just because of the rolls, but because sometimes the critters want to see a fight more than the RP, but liam came out with his nat 20. Now of course im not saying he's in all knowing guy, he is human just like us, and sometimes he will make some questionable choices, but lets not forget they have to entertain us because thats what they use to keep themselves alive, apart from their voice acting of course.
Life isn't like that. You don't get "rewarded" for making a decision, even if it's a hard one. Sometimes you can make all the right decisions and still lose -- and the fact that Fjord CHOSE to sacrifice people doesn't automatically bestow a prize upon him. It was a gamble. Maybe it would work, maybe it wouldn't -- and that is part of what Fjord should have weighed when making the decision. Would it be worthwhile? Would he be throwing their lives away for nothing at all? Those are the choices you have to live with when you make them, and Matt was absolutely right to stick to whatever the plan/dice/whatever was, and not fudge just to make Fjord's critical decision a "good" one. Otherwise they aren't hard decisions at all. If you're going to have your character make such a choice, you have to be prepared for there to be consequences or for things not to work out.
@@fidelmartinez3802 true, like you said at the end of the day, this show is still the thing that entertains me the most more than anything
I love Fjord, but God DAYM, whatta bad call. That was not a choice "for the good of all" He killed those men for no reason. Dagen included. You think those guys could do any damage to the Tomb-takers? Hell nah, Lucien fucking froze those bolts mid-air Kylo Ren style FOR SURE. Man, get outta here, Fjord straight up killed Dagen for 10 minutes of sleep, applause for the confidence, but the way to hell is paved with good intentions. Idk how so many are out here thinking Fjord made the right call, he didn't, that's why he (Travis) was so pissed that Cree and Lucien got away, he realized he killed Dagen and those men in exchange for just a couple minutes of rest.
Actually I think it was the right call. The fresh monster corpses are a dead giveaway that someone came through recently. Had the rangers not engaged, it becomes clear there's someone waiting ahead. By engaging, it makes it less clear. Was it these rangers who went in and came out after meeting resistance, or is someone waiting farther in? Plus from Lucian's point of view, it wouldn't make sense for the M9 to waste these soldiers' lives unless they're desperate. They're probably trying to stall, so best to hurry in and catch them unprepared, or beat them to the goal.
For all we know that fight cost the TT three of their members, sure it didn't stall them for as long as they wanted but if they were going to have to fight before they wanted to anyways it would be best to weaken the enemy as much as they could before then. I think the biggest mistake was not going after Cree immediately but even then looking back I'm not sure Fjord could have gotten to her.
Dude it was definitely the right call. In the heat of the moment he made a decision and hoped for the best. Unfortunately it just didn’t turn out that way. When you’re thinking critically really fast in this type of situation, you don’t have time to think about any unforeseen consequences
@@theemperorschampion7573 and as fjord said, theres no running from this, it was now or never
Best line in the episode is one word from Fjord. Got to love it.
This decision makes no sense though. There was only 1 room between the hidden entrance and the tunnel. So it was never going to slow down the tomb takers, just tip them off that the secret entrance was discovered. It risked everything for no gain 🤨
@@matthewwindelspecht2559 i'm not sure it would have done anything. Matt wasnt rolling for their attack so its unlikely it had any impact.
What it did do was tip off lucien, thereby risking the loss of surprise, and he didnt give the rest any time to prepare. If anyone was sleeping without armour on (like Matt emphasised that time they got attacked at sea) then they were about to be at severe disadvantage for that critical fight. Alerting lucien and not giving his team time to prepare, that is doubly bad planning.
To be honest though, Laura was showing real frustration that she wasnt going to be able to fight without sleep so Travis probably did it in the hopes that Laura wouldnt be upset and could enjoy it more. He gets more good husband points than battle tactics points 😂
I saw you making the same argument under multiple comments and you may have a small point there, but you have to remember that there were 2 dead giants in front of the cave so that wouldve tipped the TT off as well, so maybe with the Rangers around they thought they took care of the giants. Also the rangers couldve shipped away at their HP or made them use spell slots, there was certainly something to gain.
@@roonaldo86 true. Considering their plan was to catch them by surprise, they didnt really do much to cover their tracks 😂
But they had Travis on Talks Machina this week and it was interesting to hear his perspective on this directly. Turns out he immediately regretted his decision but felt pressure in the moment to be decisive, he thought they were further away than they actually were and got it stuck in his head that the team needed sleep to be at full power. He recognised in retrospect it couldnt have happened. Was an interesting discussion.
Man I don’t know. Obviously in hindsight, it seems it was not a good decision because Fjord’s main goal of getting everyone a long rest didn’t pan out. I just don’t understand why you would reveal to the tomb takers their presence. I guess Matt rolled on this, but my logic was they would be cautious and wary entering the tomb resulting in the plan failing. I guess maybe you force them to use some spell slots. I think the point I would make is the outcome would’ve been the same whether or not the rangers engaged. I don’t know how much ground the tomb takers needed to cover to get the rope that led to the cavern, but it didn’t seem like a 3 hours long journey which would’ve been needed to get the long rest. I just feel they died for nothing, and to make it worse Fjord knew that they didn’t stand a snowballs chance in hell.
the thing is with dnd hells, is that theres 9 of them, and one of them is frozen.
there is no definitive right or wrong here, as fjord let people know, this was it, they had to go all in. you miss 100 percent of the shot you dont take, and knowing what was at stake, better to try than not.
All this planning and they botched the combat. I usually don't get upset at their decisions especially in combat but not targeting the healer? Really? That is like rule #1 of strategy
I agree, considering the fact that she was bloodied when they got there, taking her out woulda sealed that fight. Considering the only person to fight is Lucien, who is pretty much just a beholder with extra flair.
Cree was in the antimagic cone
They didn't botch anything. They got not even half of a round before Cree's turn.
@@marymalmros1926 The 2 people who had their turns could've downed her in 1 round...
@@TheLucidArtist Not until after Fjord's turn
It was the only choice as a game player. The GM provides resources for the player to achieve success. Travis used imaginary rangers that don't really exist, aren't anybody else's player characters and don't matter at all. Except to buy time for the rest and whatever rolls Matt might make for Lucien to waste spell slots or HP on.
Yes it really annoys me when they give money away to NPC characters for no reason as well. Lol.
this decision makes him literally no better than Lucien willing to do whatever they want to meet their goals I knew Fjord was loose with the morals but this is too far and it was the equivalent I'm trying to take on a tank with a slingshot
I wholeheartedly disagree.
As you stated, Lucien does what he wants. Fjord did what he believed was NEEDED, not what he wanted.
You've also got to consider the respective goals, too. Fjord knows that if Lucien isn't stopped, Exandria is doomed.
Making difficult decisions isn't the same as being loose with morals.