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This is a head cannon answer as far as I know. But, what if evocation is the oldest school of magic, it can functionally tap into all aspects of magic. But not to any intricate depth. Spells and abilities that just have singular purposes (send, burn, bend, freeze, etc). I know there are spells that dont lend to this theory. But I humor the theory.
Hey guys, You're really great! Also, this is like the second time your videos have only 5 recommended fallowups for me. Is that some algorithm affecting you guys?
Somethig that me and my frind find funny is that when you look at spells that have a wizards's name like Melf's acid arrow often are said wihout the wizard's name, for example as just acid arrow. This, reasonably applied, gives you snowball swarm, tiny hut, and resilient sphere. However, it also means that Mordenkainen's sword can be referred to as Sword. You can cast Sword. This is also why I like to cast Hand (Bigby's hand.)
the way i like to play it out is that the schools of magic in fiction are purely academic, and this is the exact kind of discussion a couple of disgruntled wizards would have
@@MrFForger Magic is everywhere and in everything...unless something specifically pushes that force out. So things with more magic have a greater capacity. Whether it be natural or engineered. Magic is part of the natural rules of the d&d world. Wizadry is the science of d&d. That magic is kinda capable of anything kinda makes the idea you can scientifically understand both magic and the d&d world seem a little overwhelming but then that maybe is how you should feel. Maybe this is how wizards feel.
This has made me homebrew that magic schools are academic constructs and that wizards constantly debate different spells. Might have to make a Jim & Pruitt pair of NPCs for my party to witness it the next time they are in the city.
Another explanation is that each school has an underlying property in the construction its spells. The schools were named early on when not much was known about them ("oh this one has a bunch of spells for mind-controlling people, let's call it enchantment", "this one has a bunch of spells that let us kill people or bring them back, let's call it necromancy", etc.). As such, spells are grouped by cause instead of effect; and the names are just that... names.
Somewhere in 2e Planescape it mentions (albeit for comedic effect) that planar people and creatures are at risk of being unexpectedly conjured by prime material wizards. So in my mind Conjuration is something which summons material and energy from the Outer Planes, while Evocation summons it from the Inner (Elemental) Planes. That would mean Melf's Acid Arrow draws acid from one of the Elemental or Para-Elemental Planes, (most likely Ooze) while Acid Splash summons acid from somewhere in the Outer Planes. Likewise, Wall of Stone would draw from the Plane of Earth while Leomund's Secret Chest would be a real chest stored somewhere in the Outer Planes. Also important to note, I clearly have too much free time.
Leomund's secret chest takes a chest that already exists on the prime material plane that must be crafted to the specifications of the spell and stores it on the Ethereal plane and connects a tiny chest replica to the real chest.
The best in world excuse for why the spell school sorting seems to damn wonky is to look at them like actual schools. Students at MIT have fundamentally different areas of focus than students at Stanford. Each school has it's own focus but they all have similar needs. Sending is evocation and message is transmutation because 5,000 years ago Evokers came up with Sending for their communication needs and Transmuters came up with message. Healing isn't necromancy, even though it should be, because divine casters are students at Brigham Young University and don't care about what is going on in the rest of the educated world. While necromancers are the University of Pennsylvania, off doing god knows what so often that people forget they're also an "Ivy League" school like conjuration, and illusion.
The way I see it, when a spell is first developed, which school the developer of the spell belongs to gets the credit for the spell. Evocation is so broad spectrum because there were so many students blowing shit up and taking credit for it.
This, the inconsistencies in theme of the schools to the spells I think offers a fun exercise in coming up with the history of that spell's creation; Who made it? What was their relationship/class with magic? How did they invent that spell? Why did they invent that spell? When did this happen? I've honestly been tempted to make my own spellbooks for homebrew and having every (or almost every) spell named after its creator, like Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, it adds more depth to the history of the world.
@@Vespuchian I'm picturing the example in the video of Flame Blade being created by a Wizard under the school of Evocation who just thought it would be cool; That's why it's lower level and Concentration, simply an ill-conceived party trick made by an old mystic trying to look like a cool knight with the magic at their disposal.
For those curious: "Why the heck conjuration?" in 3.5 you literally just teleport in chunks of the Plane of Good Feels (Positive Energy Plane, which fuels life, the opposite of the Negative Energy Plane, which fuels undead boogers) to make the boo boo go away. Which, honestly, I have a soft spot for that kinda shenanigans.
Thanks for this. I was hoping for some seriously wonkish discussion of this confusing school of magic, and you delivered. The standard D&D definitions are maddening.
I've said this before on another video on schools of magic, but these are hands down my favorite of Web DM's videos. I have learned so much from you guys. Great work! I'm not sure if you guys have tackled all of the eight schools or not, but I look forward to the next one if any.
in an Apatheist World: Wizard: "prove to me that the gods exist!" Cleric: "that's the only explanation for the schools inconsistencies!" Wizard: "you got me there!"
I like to think of certain spells belonging to certain schools due to where the energy for the spell comes from. This typically determines what types of spells can be seen belonging to their schools, but it also means that nearly identical results can be derived from entirely different sources. This probably is just as mixed up as the descriptions in the PHB, but you can see below roughly how I break it down. Hope it helps. Transmutation, physical energy abjuration, magic energy in yourself conjuration, magical energy from another plane divination, spiritual energy enchantment, emotional energy evocation, magical energy in the environment illusion, mental energy necromancy, life force/energy
Never have I so quickly wanted to revamp a portion of D&D than when I started actually looking at the spell schools and their associated spells. Just attempting to comprehend them requires a plethora of Sanity Checks. #HabitableHemisphere Also, best stinger yet, guys. ;D
The way I've been doing Mordenkainen's sword, all it's spell text as written is the same, but if it hits a target the target must make a Con save, on a fail the target is petrified. A target under the stone skin spell has disadvantage on this save. A petrified or stone target struck by the sword is shattered, destroying it. I love the image of a Wizard slicing through a mountain and causing an avalanche. I also feel like the players don't have enough access to one of the coolest status conditions in the game. It's a 7th level spell, let's have some fun with it here.
The easy out, and one that isn't necessarily wrong, is that the schools are literally, in some sense, schools; we're accepting the fictional premise that all spells were at some point developed by some wizard, who developed it from the perspective of his/her singular school of expertise. Flaming sphere is a ball of otherwise simple fire, developed by an unknown conjurer; flame sword was developed by some unknown Evoker, fire can be energy but it's also a thing that exists. The real, REAL answer is that for the sake of balance, there's a time in every edition of D&D where people sit around and deal out spells for each school, then have arguments for or in favor of where one or another should go THIS time, with tons of edge cases, and eventually they just stop and say 'man, we gotta get this edition published' and the spell schools are sometimes not satisfying for the sake of not stripping 20 other spells away from some other school and going down an infinite rabbit hole. In a practical sense they also help magic users who concentrate on one school to avoid missing out on all heals, or all buff/debuff, or all damage dealing, by sprinkling a few edge case spells into their school.
@@monicabower5022 Except that in the 5e rule books, literally the only caster class who cares what school a spell comes from is the wizard, and wizards CAN learn spells from other schools, it's just easier to learn something in their field of expertise...and to muddy those waters even more, that is only applicable to spells they found a spellbook for. So the exact placement of a spell in a particular school doesn't even matter to most casters. Get rid of spell schools altogether and only the wizard would even notice that element was gone.
I actually ran a game in which one of the characters was an Evoker who was debating such things whenever he could. One of the best scenes we roleplayed was when he challenged a master in a certain magical academy in order to gain propriety of a certain magical item. The duel was one of words and they debated about school appropriation of Melf's Acid Arrow, one arguing that it belongs to Evocation and the other to Conjuration. They ended up falling in love through that conversation and sharing said magical item. Fun times were had.
The thing i love about D&D is that if something doesn't work for you you can change anything you want i think the spell system is a perfect playground for doing that
"Evocation spells manipulate magical energy to produce a desired effect." So, by that extremely broad definition, wouldn't that make _all_ spells Evocation?
Love the discussion on all the spell schools that don’t make sense. LOL It would be incredibly interesting to get one of the designers - Mearls or Crawford - to give an honest explanation of their choices... Either there is some crazy genius at work behind the scenes, or the different owners of the spell schools had an auction or something to see who got what.
i really enjoyed this and, as you mentioned, evocation seems to be a subschool of conjuration, for this i personally like the way warcraft deals with this, mages use evocation for their primary elementals (fire and frost) as they learn to use the magic energies that surrounds them, and on the other hand, we have the shamans, shamans use what would be conjuration, they ask for the aid and permission of the elements to use their strenght, wether it be causing an earth shock or a lava surge, evocation uses the magic weave of the planar world whilst conjuration may need some sort of agreement from both parties to work (like letting the elements in this case, be channeled through you)
I always thought of evocation as sort of like a specialized form of conjuration. I think it makes sense that the schools of magic would be derivative and build on / off each other etc. When you cast an evocation spell I always think of it as very briefly "summoning" or, one might say "evoking" the energies of the elemental plane of fire, say. Using the spell as like a brief planar short-circuit, rather than the conjurer who in this metaphor is basically "grounding" the planar energy so it doesn't dissipate away as soon as he summons the thing.
I love Jim's expression as he thinks about Witch Bolt + Lightning Lure. "Yeah, that's a really cool...I actually really like that image." (It is a sweet visual)
While I agree that I wouldn't take Witch Bolt as a wizard, I do think I know a good niche for that spell: Warlocks. The multiple rounds of damage Witch Bolt provides for the cost of only one spell slot works well with the warlock's very limited number of spell slots. Eldritch Blast is nice and all, but you have to roll for each attack, and Witch Bolt provides a way around that. Also, it scales as you cast it with higher-level spell slots, so you're getting a lot of damage in right off the bat before settling into maintaining it. The result is pretty cool.
Nintendo Loyalist that said, there is one place where it is useful: on a blue dragon Sorcerer before they get access to Lightning Bolt. You CAN add the Charisma damage bonus on the subsequent turns after the first, which makes it viable
You are almost always better off not using witch bolt, even as a warlock. The following damage does not scale and the action cost is not worth it. Eldritch Blast, particularly with agonizing blast, is better, even with with a miss chance.
I once designed a kind of gish weapon that had a special effect of allowing spells like witch bolt to be activated as a bonus action that made it really good, but that was me just kind of patching it with an easy cheat.
Q: "Is there a plane of magical force?" A: Yes. Q: "Can you visit there?" A: Uh... That depends on how you're looking to do so. The Plane of Force technically has gates, but they're completely indistinguishable from a Wall of Force. If you manage to Plane Shift into the Plane of Force, you're gonna have a bad time, because the whole thing is a mess of invisible movement. It completely destroyed everything I Plane Shifted in, and spat it out through a gate into the Astral. And before you ask, it's impossible to attune yourself to Force energy. I've tried.
I've always had the same view of the planes and magic as Pruitt. (All the planes are parallel, like layers, and magic permeates vertically.) It makes the most sense to me.
IMO Crown of Stars does not get nearly enough credit for being an amazing spell. Up to 28d12 damage that can crit, and it lasts for an hour. I guess it really depends on the types of games you're running, but if you're going into a dungeon or some sort of gauntlet of enemies, throw this up and blast through your enemies. Doesn't even require concentration.
I’ve barely played Magic: The Gathering and I know next to nothing about it, but I do know that I love the way it categorises magic. The colour-coded system is so much better than D&D’s spell schools IMO. It’s simultaneously nebulous enough to feel magical an mysterious, being organised by theme and feel rather than scientific semantics, while making it perfectly clear which spells should belong in which categories.
About necromancy not having the healing spells, you explained It yourself, evocation generates the energy, necromancy manipulates it, so it can not make it's own
I have this speculation. That all the spells were listed in a spreadsheet and the default was evocation after they wrote the description for it, then they went through & added the appropriate school, on a one by one basis & the weird ones were just the ones they didn't get to before the book had to be printed.
My main is an Evoker, Immolation spells dusted one and almost another White Dragon a few sessions ago. Being able to exclude friendlies when using AoE boom spells is EPIC!
Holy shit-balls, I've been through Xanathar's spells a hundred times: how did I never see sickening radiance!?!? I know what my necromancer is going to be taking now when she gets her 4th level spells. As always, great episode! Much love from the ATX D&D crowd.
Lightning Lure can be really fun if you're playing a lizardfolk wizard. Draw them to you with the spell, and use hungry jaws for a bonus action cronch. I had a lot of fun doing that to, like goblins and kobolds at low levels. *sigh* Now I miss playing my lizard wizard.
Here’s my hypothesis about what’s really going on with d&d magic. PH says that magical effects are created by manipulating the strands of the Weave. The only two real things you can do with strings are loop them and vibrate them. I propose that making a loop out of the Weave creates a magical feedback loop that provides the actual energy used in spells, while vibrating those strings alters the properties of that energy or of other objects. That might seem kind of one-note, but that’s what all the arcane symbols and gestures are for: to add more complex vibrational modes and thus more nuanced effects. Conceptually, this explains the spell schools evocation, transmutation, illusion, enchantment, abjuration (implied with the principle of negation), the animating and cursing parts of necromancy (although the definition of “energy” starts to get annoyingly broad) and the detecting half of divination (required secondary power). To get all of conjuration, the scrying half of divination, and the spirit summoning part of necromancy, we have to add a magical property to these magic strings, for which I would suggest that two ends of a Weave-string are always in the same physical location, even when they’re not (i.e. portals). What does this mean for the spell schools? It’s all arcane gibberish.
Mordenkainens can attack twice on the round its cast. Once when you cast it as an action, and again as a bonus action. Still not great for 7th level but it has a couple of benefits.
Second part of the video was really good ! The first part was multiple castings of Beating on a dead horse (Beating is an evocation spell btw, not a conjuration)
If your not stuck running Adventure League as a DM try lowering the level of those spells that you feel are to weak are useless for there original level, after all you are the DM. I also like the idea of changing spells that require both concentration and allow a saving throw every round to read no extra saves every round if the caster continues concentrating for the duration or you may make a save every round if the caster stops concentrating and just lets the spell run for its full duration. Keep in mind as the DM you have to allow these spells to run for there full duration now.
I generally think that effects like flaming sphere and flame blade, which do almost the same thing, but are different schools, has to do with how the spell accomplishes that task. Long ago some druidic nerd was like "i can draw magical energy from the nature spirits and contort it into a blade of fire in my hand", and some wizard was like "yeah or you could just conjure a little flame up from the plane that's MADE OF IT."
I love these Magic School videos! Which school will you be covering next? My guess would be conjuration, if only because y'all talked so much about it in this episode.
22:30 Just FYI, if you're a melee Sorcerer with a 3 level dip in Hexblade Warlock, you can absolutely wreck shit by Twinning Lightning Lure and then Quickening Green-Flame Blade or Booming Blade while having a Shadow Blade conjured.
I don't know where I read this but I loved his description of Evocation. "Evocation is the most flashing, most spectacular, most effect heavy and most boring school of magic. Don't get me wrong, I love it but it is a school made for simply blasting stuff. It is a blunt instrument of destruction without finesse. Then again when 90% of the Problems are nails, I guess the Hammer is the king of the tools." After that my next D&D Charakter I created was a Fire Genasi city guard who is kinda the loose, trigger happy, cannon. (Evocation wizard with spellsniper)
I think when it comes to similar spells using different schools, i think of it as one magic school trying to copy that spell, sometimes resulting in a more/less powerful version or a slightly different effect. As for game logic i think its so every school individually is more flexible and allows better use of wizards who specify on a specific school
I always see schools as having a purpose at their center. Evocation- the school that destroys Transmutation-the school the turns things into other things Divination-spells that gain you information Necromancy-spells that deal with life and death Abjuration- the school that blocks and protects Enchantment- the school that alters what people think and believe Illusion- the school that changes what people see and sense Conjuration- the school that makes things that you use It’s not perfect, but it works better than most.
Guys, I TOTALLY agree with your frustration. Here’s how I see the schools: Evocation: draws magical energy to produce an instantaneous magical effect. Conjuration: draws magical energy to summon a substance, creature, or lasting elemental energy from elsewhere Necromancy: summons and controls the energies of life and death. Enchantment: magical energies that affect behaviour or that alters how an object behaves. Illusion: magic that affects or alters the senses in an effort to control or deceive them. Transformation: changes one energy, object, or creature into another. Abjuration: blocks or defends against and attack, energy or creature Divination: magical information gathering. The spells as they are labeled fails to match these descriptions, but that’s just my opinion.
Fireball, if my math is correct, occupies 34 ten foot cubes. That means hallways become tubes of fire, and tight confines fill with flame. And you’re right, Witch Bolt is the worst. A spell that locks the CASTER in place but is only 30’ in range? As in... one move away? Caster casts, fighter walks up and takes his lunch money. Ugh.
I had a evil boss cleric cast Guiding Bolt on the cocky ranger in the back. They were level 4, and the guiding bolt got a crit and did 39 damage. Almost killing the ranger in 1 hit.
Blood-Lord I fucking love bringing my players to the brink of death (or even killing them sometimes lol) just to scare the shit outta them. A personal favorite spell to shock them with is Inflict Wounds. They never expect the 3rd lvl inflict wounds that crit to do 50 dmg :P
I have a funny crit story, I casted inflict wounds on a succubus and crited and when I almost rolled max damage instantly killing it I said," Begone thot!" That got a laugh out of the table.
I like to believe that the channel energy feature for pathfinder clerics is just them opening a pinprick sized portal to the positive or negative energy plane for a split second, and as they become more experienced the hole gets bigger and bigger
i personally like evocation containing all non-resurrecting healing spells since it explains those spells in a very straight forward way, that they are simply summoning positive energy and working it the right way to do healing.
I've saved party members by striking them with lightning lure (very situational I know) pulling them out of witches hut in CoS, and from a fall later on. I also used it to pull the druids into the standing stones at the hill.
With Mordenkainen's Sword, you have the possibility of dealing an extra 3d10 on the same turn you cast spell (3d10 action, 3d10 bonus action). So up to 6d10 on the initial turn. Makes it a somewhat better spell when you realize this.
The way I would justify some acid being evocaton and others being conjuration is that some summon a physical acidic liquid, and others are a blast of magical energy that corrodes things similarly to acid. It isn't actually summoning a vitriolic sphere of acid, it is creating a sphere of magical energy that corrodes substances similarly to acid.
If I have interpreted the text in Mordenkainen’s Sword correctly, you get two attacks on your first round; one with the casting and one other with your bonus. There after you use a bonus action to use the sword, but it is a concentration spell. I’m not sure if this contradicts the observations presented, but I felt it did
I’ve played a war cleric the last few campaigns and I’ve always described guiding bolt as the clerical laser cannon, doing as much damage as possible. Softening up the enemy and then letting the guys in front finish them off.
''Decent'' damage? 4d6 for a first level spell is absolutely incredible. The only first level spell that compares to that damage output is Chromatic orb,and that requires you to have a 50gp diamond,which many people might not have when first starting out.
36:45 Don't really want to be "that guy" but you can't pick and choose who takes effect from sickening radiance, which makes it more balanced. Don't get me wrong. Still an amazing spell. But nowhere does it say you can designate who takes damage within the AOE.
@@ianmoone8640 you activated my trap card which reduces all of my enemies Hit Points to 0 and it can't be negated and they also fail 3 death saving throws and there body is destroyed and they can't be resurrected by any means
The way I see it is that evocation is like straw you "suck" magic through, nothing big can get through intact but you can get energy through it. Conjuration on the other hand is like a door/portal you open, where thing can get through intact. The challenge with evocation is to shape the magic on the other side of the "straw" whilst the challenge with conjuration is to keep the things you don't like out of your portal.
17:47 If you look on page 303 in phb you can see positive plane abow the astral plane in the picture, negative plane on the bottom. they simply stopped being a inner plane.
The way I see it, evocation is the Projection of energy to create desired effects. Each school has an opposite that is either projecting or absorbing energy. Abjuration is the opposite since it's all about negating or absorbing energy.
Maybe I got it from another game or older edition but I always thought the difference between Evocation and Conjuration was Evocation created energy from nothing and Conjuration summoned energy from elsewhere. So an Evoker would create a fireball from nothing but a Conjurer would call energy from the Plane of Fire for the same effect.
Lightning lure seems pretty good on an eldritch knight fighter. When you get war magic at lv 7 you can cantrip then make a weapon attack as a bonus action. Nice to peel off an enemy that snuck up on your party squishys.
I think one big difference between conjeration and evocation is: Evocation siphons off the energy- and the energy discharges and stays in the enviernment. Conjeration creates or summons something that eventually returns back to whence it came. (Not saying that all the spells fallow this but this is what I think it should be)
There’s an evocation spell in my game called “Arcane Overcharge”. This spell is a 3rd level spell that lets a willing character make an attack roll in casting and if they hit they take the normal damage plus 15 force damage when upcast it gives them advantage on the roll
For the Flaming sphere and flame blade questions. I imagine it is the same as a lighter and a match. They both produce flame but are vastly different in how they do it
I found one situation in which witch bolt was useful. A level 17 character tempest cleric dipped with sorcerer with 18s for wis/cha and channel divinity. A level 9 witchbolt is 9d12 for automatic 108 lightning dmg on hit.
The adjustment to Witch bolt that I have used, is that the Witch bolt is broken if the caster ends their turn outside of 30ft of the enemy or outside of line of sight. That is when the damage to the target takes effect.
What am I misunderstanding about Mordenkainen's Sword? It sounds like you can make attacks with it on subsequent turns using a bonus action (like Spiritual Weapon). It still seems strictly worse than Spiritual Weapon, but I don't understand the comparisons to Shadow Blade. The latter, as far as I can tell, is a weapon attack, not a spell attack; and has a normal range of 20 if you want to attack from range, requiring your bonus action on subsequent turns to throw it again. I would note that Spiritual Weapon is an additional 1d8 for every TWO slot levels above 2nd, so it'd only be 3d8 + your spellcasting ability modifier as a 6th/7th level spell. Still, casting time of a bonus action plus no concentration.
if you think about it, lightning lure puts more emphasis on "magnet" in "electromagnetic" than most other spells. it'd be cool to play a magnetic knight EK.
As a GM Delayed fire ball is perfect mid rest attack spell. its night time and there's a fire... center your ball of flame behind the fire from night watch... They have 10 minutes to realize whats going on and deal with it... no tents; no gear; no supplies; and the forest is on fire around you what does the party do even if they survive? I would use that tactic on a group that always does the round 3 or less and usually 1 slaughter fest of enemy encounters... the smart villains answer or in a similar vein Tsunami the camp. Its not about the damage of the spells but rather the thematic element of disruption they provide that i like so much. soaked having to find where all your crap was washed away to extra exhausted or in risk of losing things all those factors and if fall or winter the risk of freezing to death at night is also possible.
Sometimes you are calling forth the substance, sometimes you are using energy to split the molecules of the air into the acid. One is evocation or transmutation, the other is conjuration. So acid effects can have any one of the 3 as the primary school.
Its pretty much... which energy plane are you tapping to activate the spell? You could make a necromatic variant "fireball" doing necrotic damage instead of fire damage. Tap the negative energy plane and it draws life force out of the sphere, instead of tapping the fire plane and letting a little bit out.
if you want a bunch of fireballs, it is costly but the effect is epic. Use Glyph of Warding with Fireball. It will explode if triggered or dispelled! for even more craziness, cast it on several pages, let someone elses unseen servant carry it or mage hand it. find the location for your "Nuclear Option" triggered by either magic or opening the book. Then grab a calculator!
With regards to how the positive and negative plans of energy are in 5e. The PHB describes those planes as domes that encompass all the other planes in a SUPER DETAILED (not really) sidebar on page 300.
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This is a head cannon answer as far as I know. But, what if evocation is the oldest school of magic, it can functionally tap into all aspects of magic. But not to any intricate depth. Spells and abilities that just have singular purposes (send, burn, bend, freeze, etc). I know there are spells that dont lend to this theory. But I humor the theory.
Hey guys, You're really great! Also, this is like the second time your videos have only 5 recommended fallowups for me. Is that some algorithm affecting you guys?
So where's that Baldur's Gate longplay gentlemen? :^)
I did enjoy 2e take on necromancy, it was the manipulation of positive and negative energy. Good video guys
Somethig that me and my frind find funny is that when you look at spells that have a wizards's name like Melf's acid arrow often are said wihout the wizard's name, for example as just acid arrow. This, reasonably applied, gives you snowball swarm, tiny hut, and resilient sphere. However, it also means that Mordenkainen's sword can be referred to as Sword. You can cast Sword. This is also why I like to cast Hand (Bigby's hand.)
the way i like to play it out is that the schools of magic in fiction are purely academic, and this is the exact kind of discussion a couple of disgruntled wizards would have
Agreed
Lesbosmer are you telling me Pruitt and Davis AREN’T disgruntled wizards?
@@Karak971 Jim Davis definitely is; however, Pruitt is a monk/fighter.
@@pasp9866 Please explain how something can be less or more magical 'cause the way I see it, something is magical or it's not.
@@MrFForger Magic is everywhere and in everything...unless something specifically pushes that force out. So things with more magic have a greater capacity. Whether it be natural or engineered. Magic is part of the natural rules of the d&d world. Wizadry is the science of d&d. That magic is kinda capable of anything kinda makes the idea you can scientifically understand both magic and the d&d world seem a little overwhelming but then that maybe is how you should feel. Maybe this is how wizards feel.
“I didn’t say ‘I ask how big the room is’, I said ‘I cast fireball’”
UrbanBen killed my whole party doing that the second time I ever played .
Well done! (Or just a medium roast?) :P
If you didn’t you’d be called fried chicken
5e ruined fireball by not having it guaranteed to fill the full volume, taking whatever shape is available if the sphere doesn't fit.
@@fhuber7507 the spell description says that is goes around corners...
The wizard, a chem major:"Why can't I summon a base?"
the bard, who just got off his phone: "yeah, I'd like to summon a bass."
I cast Summon Bigger Fish.
The Druid: “DID ANYONE SAY BASS?”
Engineering major: summon? Why not just build a base?
Culinary arts major: if you’re going to build you’ll need food so I cast fried chicken
@@mls160 would the engineer be playing an artificer?
I like how half of every spell-school video is about how loose the spell classification is.
This has made me homebrew that magic schools are academic constructs and that wizards constantly debate different spells. Might have to make a Jim & Pruitt pair of NPCs for my party to witness it the next time they are in the city.
Another explanation is that each school has an underlying property in the construction its spells. The schools were named early on when not much was known about them ("oh this one has a bunch of spells for mind-controlling people, let's call it enchantment", "this one has a bunch of spells that let us kill people or bring them back, let's call it necromancy", etc.). As such, spells are grouped by cause instead of effect; and the names are just that... names.
@@SamFinklestein "Dim Javis" and "Phonathan Juitt" should be recurring NPCs in every D&D game.
@@Xocists Why not both?
@@SamFinklestein Wizard subclasses would become very murky indeed.
If magic would be real these guys would still be having the same discussion
I can’t wait to have enough experience with DnD to talk about and understand it like you guys. Thanks for all your help.
You will get there
And did you get there?
@@rikgales123 lmao fuckin no
Somewhere in 2e Planescape it mentions (albeit for comedic effect) that planar people and creatures are at risk of being unexpectedly conjured by prime material wizards. So in my mind Conjuration is something which summons material and energy from the Outer Planes, while Evocation summons it from the Inner (Elemental) Planes. That would mean Melf's Acid Arrow draws acid from one of the Elemental or Para-Elemental Planes, (most likely Ooze) while Acid Splash summons acid from somewhere in the Outer Planes. Likewise, Wall of Stone would draw from the Plane of Earth while Leomund's Secret Chest would be a real chest stored somewhere in the Outer Planes. Also important to note, I clearly have too much free time.
Leomund's secret chest takes a chest that already exists on the prime material plane that must be crafted to the specifications of the spell and stores it on the Ethereal plane and connects a tiny chest replica to the real chest.
@@BordrKing Yup. Probably should have re-read that first, haha.
That's a fun way to think of it.
The best in world excuse for why the spell school sorting seems to damn wonky is to look at them like actual schools. Students at MIT have fundamentally different areas of focus than students at Stanford. Each school has it's own focus but they all have similar needs. Sending is evocation and message is transmutation because 5,000 years ago Evokers came up with Sending for their communication needs and Transmuters came up with message.
Healing isn't necromancy, even though it should be, because divine casters are students at Brigham Young University and don't care about what is going on in the rest of the educated world. While necromancers are the University of Pennsylvania, off doing god knows what so often that people forget they're also an "Ivy League" school like conjuration, and illusion.
I like that that explanation
Stealing this
The way I see it, when a spell is first developed, which school the developer of the spell belongs to gets the credit for the spell. Evocation is so broad spectrum because there were so many students blowing shit up and taking credit for it.
This, the inconsistencies in theme of the schools to the spells I think offers a fun exercise in coming up with the history of that spell's creation; Who made it? What was their relationship/class with magic? How did they invent that spell? Why did they invent that spell? When did this happen? I've honestly been tempted to make my own spellbooks for homebrew and having every (or almost every) spell named after its creator, like Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, it adds more depth to the history of the world.
@@Vespuchian I'm picturing the example in the video of Flame Blade being created by a Wizard under the school of Evocation who just thought it would be cool; That's why it's lower level and Concentration, simply an ill-conceived party trick made by an old mystic trying to look like a cool knight with the magic at their disposal.
I agree so hard with this!
This is now canonical in my universe. Thank you for that.
For those curious: "Why the heck conjuration?" in 3.5 you literally just teleport in chunks of the Plane of Good Feels (Positive Energy Plane, which fuels life, the opposite of the Negative Energy Plane, which fuels undead boogers) to make the boo boo go away.
Which, honestly, I have a soft spot for that kinda shenanigans.
Sapphire Crook flaming sphere is a droplet if the plane of fire
Thanks for this. I was hoping for some seriously wonkish discussion of this confusing school of magic, and you delivered. The standard D&D definitions are maddening.
I've said this before on another video on schools of magic, but these are hands down my favorite of Web DM's videos. I have learned so much from you guys. Great work! I'm not sure if you guys have tackled all of the eight schools or not, but I look forward to the next one if any.
We haven't done them all yet! Gonna make up a Playlist soon!
Fire is addition heat
Lighting is the movement of electrons
Cold is loss of heat
Acid is the motion of hydrogen (ie, it pulls compounds apart)
So then it's all transmutation
@@gerardoleal4590 In 3rd edition Burning Hands was actually Transmutation.
@@gerardoleal4590 "always has been"
@@gerardoleal4590 evocation Is energy manipulation. All atoms in universe connected due to energy. All transmutation should be evocation
I see Web DM, I watch Web DM, I explosive rune.
in an Apatheist World:
Wizard: "prove to me that the gods exist!"
Cleric: "that's the only explanation for the schools inconsistencies!"
Wizard: "you got me there!"
Leomund's Habitable Hemisphere. Genius.
I like to think of certain spells belonging to certain schools due to where the energy for the spell comes from. This typically determines what types of spells can be seen belonging to their schools, but it also means that nearly identical results can be derived from entirely different sources. This probably is just as mixed up as the descriptions in the PHB, but you can see below roughly how I break it down. Hope it helps.
Transmutation, physical energy
abjuration, magic energy in yourself
conjuration, magical energy from another plane
divination, spiritual energy
enchantment, emotional energy
evocation, magical energy in the environment
illusion, mental energy
necromancy, life force/energy
Never have I so quickly wanted to revamp a portion of D&D than when I started actually looking at the spell schools and their associated spells. Just attempting to comprehend them requires a plethora of Sanity Checks.
#HabitableHemisphere
Also, best stinger yet, guys. ;D
The way I've been doing Mordenkainen's sword, all it's spell text as written is the same, but if it hits a target the target must make a Con save, on a fail the target is petrified. A target under the stone skin spell has disadvantage on this save. A petrified or stone target struck by the sword is shattered, destroying it.
I love the image of a Wizard slicing through a mountain and causing an avalanche. I also feel like the players don't have enough access to one of the coolest status conditions in the game. It's a 7th level spell, let's have some fun with it here.
Series summarised: Complaining about mislabelled spells.
yes! and we need more of it!
Yeah and it’s sucks. Talk about the spells more.
@@jgr7487 Why? Like, even just on the face of it, isn't that kinda self-evidently tedious?
The easy out, and one that isn't necessarily wrong, is that the schools are literally, in some sense, schools; we're accepting the fictional premise that all spells were at some point developed by some wizard, who developed it from the perspective of his/her singular school of expertise. Flaming sphere is a ball of otherwise simple fire, developed by an unknown conjurer; flame sword was developed by some unknown Evoker, fire can be energy but it's also a thing that exists. The real, REAL answer is that for the sake of balance, there's a time in every edition of D&D where people sit around and deal out spells for each school, then have arguments for or in favor of where one or another should go THIS time, with tons of edge cases, and eventually they just stop and say 'man, we gotta get this edition published' and the spell schools are sometimes not satisfying for the sake of not stripping 20 other spells away from some other school and going down an infinite rabbit hole. In a practical sense they also help magic users who concentrate on one school to avoid missing out on all heals, or all buff/debuff, or all damage dealing, by sprinkling a few edge case spells into their school.
@@monicabower5022 Except that in the 5e rule books, literally the only caster class who cares what school a spell comes from is the wizard, and wizards CAN learn spells from other schools, it's just easier to learn something in their field of expertise...and to muddy those waters even more, that is only applicable to spells they found a spellbook for. So the exact placement of a spell in a particular school doesn't even matter to most casters. Get rid of spell schools altogether and only the wizard would even notice that element was gone.
I actually ran a game in which one of the characters was an Evoker who was debating such things whenever he could. One of the best scenes we roleplayed was when he challenged a master in a certain magical academy in order to gain propriety of a certain magical item. The duel was one of words and they debated about school appropriation of Melf's Acid Arrow, one arguing that it belongs to Evocation and the other to Conjuration. They ended up falling in love through that conversation and sharing said magical item. Fun times were had.
The thing i love about D&D is that if something doesn't work for you you can change anything you want i think the spell system is a perfect playground for doing that
5e : "Everything is evocation for no good reason."
Aaaahhh,new episode of WebDM. Just what I needed to start my day at work. Love listening to you guys while I go about my day.
Glad to make the work day a little better!
I need a Web DM Intro compilation in my life.
Acid Damage: When the mage drops the base!
boo...
Woo!
"Evocation spells manipulate magical energy to produce a desired effect." So, by that extremely broad definition, wouldn't that make _all_ spells Evocation?
Love the discussion on all the spell schools that don’t make sense. LOL It would be incredibly interesting to get one of the designers - Mearls or Crawford - to give an honest explanation of their choices... Either there is some crazy genius at work behind the scenes, or the different owners of the spell schools had an auction or something to see who got what.
i really enjoyed this and, as you mentioned, evocation seems to be a subschool of conjuration, for this i personally like the way warcraft deals with this, mages use evocation for their primary elementals (fire and frost) as they learn to use the magic energies that surrounds them, and on the other hand, we have the shamans, shamans use what would be conjuration, they ask for the aid and permission of the elements to use their strenght, wether it be causing an earth shock or a lava surge, evocation uses the magic weave of the planar world whilst conjuration may need some sort of agreement from both parties to work (like letting the elements in this case, be channeled through you)
I always thought of evocation as sort of like a specialized form of conjuration. I think it makes sense that the schools of magic would be derivative and build on / off each other etc. When you cast an evocation spell I always think of it as very briefly "summoning" or, one might say "evoking" the energies of the elemental plane of fire, say. Using the spell as like a brief planar short-circuit, rather than the conjurer who in this metaphor is basically "grounding" the planar energy so it doesn't dissipate away as soon as he summons the thing.
That thumbnail is seriously one of the coolest things ever
I love Jim's expression as he thinks about Witch Bolt + Lightning Lure. "Yeah, that's a really cool...I actually really like that image." (It is a sweet visual)
While I agree that I wouldn't take Witch Bolt as a wizard, I do think I know a good niche for that spell: Warlocks. The multiple rounds of damage Witch Bolt provides for the cost of only one spell slot works well with the warlock's very limited number of spell slots. Eldritch Blast is nice and all, but you have to roll for each attack, and Witch Bolt provides a way around that. Also, it scales as you cast it with higher-level spell slots, so you're getting a lot of damage in right off the bat before settling into maintaining it. The result is pretty cool.
Nintendo Loyalist that’s true, except the problem is the damage on subsequent turns is 1d12 not matter how high of a level you initially cast it at.
Nintendo Loyalist that said, there is one place where it is useful: on a blue dragon Sorcerer before they get access to Lightning Bolt. You CAN add the Charisma damage bonus on the subsequent turns after the first, which makes it viable
You are almost always better off not using witch bolt, even as a warlock. The following damage does not scale and the action cost is not worth it. Eldritch Blast, particularly with agonizing blast, is better, even with with a miss chance.
I homebrew it to make subsequent attacks scale up with spell level like the original attack does, to make it a lot better, but not overpowered.
I once designed a kind of gish weapon that had a special effect of allowing spells like witch bolt to be activated as a bonus action that made it really good, but that was me just kind of patching it with an easy cheat.
Q: "Is there a plane of magical force?"
A: Yes.
Q: "Can you visit there?"
A: Uh... That depends on how you're looking to do so. The Plane of Force technically has gates, but they're completely indistinguishable from a Wall of Force. If you manage to Plane Shift into the Plane of Force, you're gonna have a bad time, because the whole thing is a mess of invisible movement. It completely destroyed everything I Plane Shifted in, and spat it out through a gate into the Astral. And before you ask, it's impossible to attune yourself to Force energy. I've tried.
I've always had the same view of the planes and magic as Pruitt. (All the planes are parallel, like layers, and magic permeates vertically.) It makes the most sense to me.
IMO Crown of Stars does not get nearly enough credit for being an amazing spell. Up to 28d12 damage that can crit, and it lasts for an hour. I guess it really depends on the types of games you're running, but if you're going into a dungeon or some sort of gauntlet of enemies, throw this up and blast through your enemies. Doesn't even require concentration.
phoenixking62 they could also all miss, doing no damage. Plus, each mote takes an action to throw.
I’ve barely played Magic: The Gathering and I know next to nothing about it, but I do know that I love the way it categorises magic. The colour-coded system is so much better than D&D’s spell schools IMO. It’s simultaneously nebulous enough to feel magical an mysterious, being organised by theme and feel rather than scientific semantics, while making it perfectly clear which spells should belong in which categories.
About necromancy not having the healing spells, you explained It yourself, evocation generates the energy, necromancy manipulates it, so it can not make it's own
Always happy to see when you've uploaded. Cheers boys!
Cheers!
That thumbnail alone sold me on this vid!
I have this speculation. That all the spells were listed in a spreadsheet and the default was evocation after they wrote the description for it, then they went through & added the appropriate school, on a one by one basis & the weird ones were just the ones they didn't get to before the book had to be printed.
I love the new banners with the spell when you discuss a spell!
YAY! Spell school series!
My main is an Evoker, Immolation spells dusted one and almost another White Dragon a few sessions ago. Being able to exclude friendlies when using AoE boom spells is EPIC!
Holy shit-balls, I've been through Xanathar's spells a hundred times: how did I never see sickening radiance!?!? I know what my necromancer is going to be taking now when she gets her 4th level spells.
As always, great episode! Much love from the ATX D&D crowd.
Perfect timing-running a session Saturday to feature the EvoWiz in my group! Thx bois!
Leomund's Tiny Hut. Also known as Leomund's Impervious Bunker
Lightning Lure can be really fun if you're playing a lizardfolk wizard. Draw them to you with the spell, and use hungry jaws for a bonus action cronch. I had a lot of fun doing that to, like goblins and kobolds at low levels.
*sigh* Now I miss playing my lizard wizard.
4:10 By definition, Necromancy is literally Death Divination; basically asking ghosts for answers that only the dead would know.
Here’s my hypothesis about what’s really going on with d&d magic.
PH says that magical effects are created by manipulating the strands of the Weave. The only two real things you can do with strings are loop them and vibrate them.
I propose that making a loop out of the Weave creates a magical feedback loop that provides the actual energy used in spells, while vibrating those strings alters the properties of that energy or of other objects. That might seem kind of one-note, but that’s what all the arcane symbols and gestures are for: to add more complex vibrational modes and thus more nuanced effects.
Conceptually, this explains the spell schools evocation, transmutation, illusion, enchantment, abjuration (implied with the principle of negation), the animating and cursing parts of necromancy (although the definition of “energy” starts to get annoyingly broad) and the detecting half of divination (required secondary power). To get all of conjuration, the scrying half of divination, and the spirit summoning part of necromancy, we have to add a magical property to these magic strings, for which I would suggest that two ends of a Weave-string are always in the same physical location, even when they’re not (i.e. portals).
What does this mean for the spell schools?
It’s all arcane gibberish.
Btw spiritual weapon only increases damage every 2 levels. It’s a 3d8+spell mod at 6th level
And Mordenkainen's is a bonus action to attack on subsequent turns.
I was just looking that up too. Conquest Paladin over here
Mordenkainens can attack twice on the round its cast. Once when you cast it as an action, and again as a bonus action. Still not great for 7th level but it has a couple of benefits.
Who ever is putting up the spell detail your the best man.
We wouldn't be Web DM without our producer Travis!!!
@@WebDM Thanks Travis!
Pruitt must’ve multiclassed into rogue cause that post opening fade away was AMAZING
Second part of the video was really good ! The first part was multiple castings of Beating on a dead horse (Beating is an evocation spell btw, not a conjuration)
If your not stuck running Adventure League as a DM try lowering the level of those spells that you feel are to weak are useless for there original level, after all you are the DM. I also like the idea of changing spells that require both concentration and allow a saving throw every round to read no extra saves every round if the caster continues concentrating for the duration or you may make a save every round if the caster stops concentrating and just lets the spell run for its full duration. Keep in mind as the DM you have to allow these spells to run for there full duration now.
I generally think that effects like flaming sphere and flame blade, which do almost the same thing, but are different schools, has to do with how the spell accomplishes that task. Long ago some druidic nerd was like "i can draw magical energy from the nature spirits and contort it into a blade of fire in my hand", and some wizard was like "yeah or you could just conjure a little flame up from the plane that's MADE OF IT."
I love these Magic School videos! Which school will you be covering next? My guess would be conjuration, if only because y'all talked so much about it in this episode.
22:30 Just FYI, if you're a melee Sorcerer with a 3 level dip in Hexblade Warlock, you can absolutely wreck shit by Twinning Lightning Lure and then Quickening Green-Flame Blade or Booming Blade while having a Shadow Blade conjured.
You guys have such awesome contenr! I've got to remember to like each and every one of them!
I invested in a new stock that rises by 0.1% every time either Davis or Pruitt repeats something the other has said and now I own one third of Apple
I don't know where I read this but I loved his description of Evocation.
"Evocation is the most flashing, most spectacular, most effect heavy and most boring school of magic. Don't get me wrong, I love it but it is a school made for simply blasting stuff. It is a blunt instrument of destruction without finesse. Then again when 90% of the Problems are nails, I guess the Hammer is the king of the tools."
After that my next D&D Charakter I created was a Fire Genasi city guard who is kinda the loose, trigger happy, cannon. (Evocation wizard with spellsniper)
Awesome Video! Would love to see these kind of videos generalised for like Arcane and Divine magic etc
I think when it comes to similar spells using different schools, i think of it as one magic school trying to copy that spell, sometimes resulting in a more/less powerful version or a slightly different effect.
As for game logic i think its so every school individually is more flexible and allows better use of wizards who specify on a specific school
I love how Jim always looks confused where he is, like he was just walking in a bookstore and this table just appeared
I always see schools as having a purpose at their center.
Evocation- the school that destroys
Transmutation-the school the turns things into other things
Divination-spells that gain you information
Necromancy-spells that deal with life and death
Abjuration- the school that blocks and protects
Enchantment- the school that alters what people think and believe
Illusion- the school that changes what people see and sense
Conjuration- the school that makes things that you use
It’s not perfect, but it works better than most.
Guys, I TOTALLY agree with your frustration.
Here’s how I see the schools:
Evocation: draws magical energy to produce an instantaneous magical effect.
Conjuration: draws magical energy to summon a substance, creature, or lasting elemental energy from elsewhere
Necromancy: summons and controls the energies of life and death.
Enchantment: magical energies that affect behaviour or that alters how an object behaves.
Illusion: magic that affects or alters the senses in an effort to control or deceive them.
Transformation: changes one energy, object, or creature into another.
Abjuration: blocks or defends against and attack, energy or creature
Divination: magical information gathering.
The spells as they are labeled fails to match these descriptions, but that’s just my opinion.
Fireball, if my math is correct, occupies 34 ten foot cubes. That means hallways become tubes of fire, and tight confines fill with flame.
And you’re right, Witch Bolt is the worst. A spell that locks the CASTER in place but is only 30’ in range? As in... one move away? Caster casts, fighter walks up and takes his lunch money. Ugh.
I've been waiting for this my whole life
I had a evil boss cleric cast Guiding Bolt on the cocky ranger in the back. They were level 4, and the guiding bolt got a crit and did 39 damage. Almost killing the ranger in 1 hit.
Blood-Lord I fucking love bringing my players to the brink of death (or even killing them sometimes lol) just to scare the shit outta them. A personal favorite spell to shock them with is Inflict Wounds. They never expect the 3rd lvl inflict wounds that crit to do 50 dmg :P
I have a funny crit story, I casted inflict wounds on a succubus and crited and when I almost rolled max damage instantly killing it I said," Begone thot!" That got a laugh out of the table.
@@mylesdrake2949 This is why I play D&D.
I like to believe that the channel energy feature for pathfinder clerics is just them opening a pinprick sized portal to the positive or negative energy plane for a split second, and as they become more experienced the hole gets bigger and bigger
i personally like evocation containing all non-resurrecting healing spells since it explains those spells in a very straight forward way, that they are simply summoning positive energy and working it the right way to do healing.
I've saved party members by striking them with lightning lure (very situational I know) pulling them out of witches hut in CoS, and from a fall later on. I also used it to pull the druids into the standing stones at the hill.
Lol that stinger got me, usually its some upbeat joke, this time you both just look super melancholy and then it ends haha
With Mordenkainen's Sword, you have the possibility of dealing an extra 3d10 on the same turn you cast spell (3d10 action, 3d10 bonus action). So up
to 6d10 on the initial turn. Makes it a somewhat better spell when you realize this.
The way I would justify some acid being evocaton and others being conjuration is that some summon a physical acidic liquid, and others are a blast of magical energy that corrodes things similarly to acid. It isn't actually summoning a vitriolic sphere of acid, it is creating a sphere of magical energy that corrodes substances similarly to acid.
41 mins? Oh boy time to make a tea and enjoy!
If I have interpreted the text in Mordenkainen’s Sword correctly, you get two attacks on your first round; one with the casting and one other with your bonus. There after you use a bonus action to use the sword, but it is a concentration spell. I’m not sure if this contradicts the observations presented, but I felt it did
I’ve played a war cleric the last few campaigns and I’ve always described guiding bolt as the clerical laser cannon, doing as much damage as possible. Softening up the enemy and then letting the guys in front finish them off.
"I cast Melf's Basic Arrow!". My alchemist transmuter wizard killed the seriousness of the table with that line, thanks guys.
''Decent'' damage? 4d6 for a first level spell is absolutely incredible. The only first level spell that compares to that damage output is Chromatic orb,and that requires you to have a 50gp diamond,which many people might not have when first starting out.
36:45 Don't really want to be "that guy" but you can't pick and choose who takes effect from sickening radiance, which makes it more balanced. Don't get me wrong. Still an amazing spell. But nowhere does it say you can designate who takes damage within the AOE.
I think evocation wizards can.
Evocation wizards can sculpt their spells. I think sorcerers can do this with some metamagic too.
I cast Fireball!
I cast counterspell!
@@MauroDraco I counter your counter spell
Lunar Star I counter your counterspell that's countering his counterspell.
@@ianmoone8640 My barbarian turns up and kills you all.
@@ianmoone8640 you activated my trap card which reduces all of my enemies Hit Points to 0 and it can't be negated and they also fail 3 death saving throws and there body is destroyed and they can't be resurrected by any means
The way I see it is that evocation is like straw you "suck" magic through, nothing big can get through intact but you can get energy through it. Conjuration on the other hand is like a door/portal you open, where thing can get through intact. The challenge with evocation is to shape the magic on the other side of the "straw" whilst the challenge with conjuration is to keep the things you don't like out of your portal.
I love conjuration magic, would love to see that next. Like the video so far guys, thanks again.
17:47 If you look on page 303 in phb you can see positive plane abow the astral plane in the picture, negative plane on the bottom. they simply stopped being a inner plane.
The way I see it, evocation is the Projection of energy to create desired effects. Each school has an opposite that is either projecting or absorbing energy.
Abjuration is the opposite since it's all about negating or absorbing energy.
Maybe I got it from another game or older edition but I always thought the difference between Evocation and Conjuration was Evocation created energy from nothing and Conjuration summoned energy from elsewhere. So an Evoker would create a fireball from nothing but a Conjurer would call energy from the Plane of Fire for the same effect.
Lightning lure seems pretty good on an eldritch knight fighter. When you get war magic at lv 7 you can cantrip then make a weapon attack as a bonus action. Nice to peel off an enemy that snuck up on your party squishys.
I think one big difference between conjeration and evocation is:
Evocation siphons off the energy- and the energy discharges and stays in the enviernment.
Conjeration creates or summons something that eventually returns back to whence it came. (Not saying that all the spells fallow this but this is what I think it should be)
There’s an evocation spell in my game called “Arcane Overcharge”. This spell is a 3rd level spell that lets a willing character make an attack roll in casting and if they hit they take the normal damage plus 15 force damage when upcast it gives them advantage on the roll
For the Flaming sphere and flame blade questions. I imagine it is the same as a lighter and a match. They both produce flame but are vastly different in how they do it
I found one situation in which witch bolt was useful. A level 17 character tempest cleric dipped with sorcerer with 18s for wis/cha and channel divinity. A level 9 witchbolt is 9d12 for automatic 108 lightning dmg on hit.
The adjustment to Witch bolt that I have used, is that the Witch bolt is broken if the caster ends their turn outside of 30ft of the enemy or outside of line of sight. That is when the damage to the target takes effect.
Its a long one boys we are in for a good ride!
What am I misunderstanding about Mordenkainen's Sword? It sounds like you can make attacks with it on subsequent turns using a bonus action (like Spiritual Weapon). It still seems strictly worse than Spiritual Weapon, but I don't understand the comparisons to Shadow Blade. The latter, as far as I can tell, is a weapon attack, not a spell attack; and has a normal range of 20 if you want to attack from range, requiring your bonus action on subsequent turns to throw it again.
I would note that Spiritual Weapon is an additional 1d8 for every TWO slot levels above 2nd, so it'd only be 3d8 + your spellcasting ability modifier as a 6th/7th level spell. Still, casting time of a bonus action plus no concentration.
you are correct i feel like they didn't read the spells correctly.
if you think about it, lightning lure puts more emphasis on "magnet" in "electromagnetic" than most other spells. it'd be cool to play a magnetic knight EK.
As a GM Delayed fire ball is perfect mid rest attack spell.
its night time and there's a fire... center your ball of flame behind the fire from night watch... They have 10 minutes to realize whats going on and deal with it...
no tents; no gear; no supplies; and the forest is on fire around you what does the party do even if they survive?
I would use that tactic on a group that always does the round 3 or less and usually 1 slaughter fest of enemy encounters... the smart villains answer or in a similar vein Tsunami the camp.
Its not about the damage of the spells but rather the thematic element of disruption they provide that i like so much.
soaked having to find where all your crap was washed away to extra exhausted or in risk of losing things all those factors and if fall or winter the risk of freezing to death at night is also possible.
Sometimes you are calling forth the substance, sometimes you are using energy to split the molecules of the air into the acid.
One is evocation or transmutation, the other is conjuration.
So acid effects can have any one of the 3 as the primary school.
Its pretty much... which energy plane are you tapping to activate the spell?
You could make a necromatic variant "fireball" doing necrotic damage instead of fire damage. Tap the negative energy plane and it draws life force out of the sphere, instead of tapping the fire plane and letting a little bit out.
if you want a bunch of fireballs, it is costly but the effect is epic. Use Glyph of Warding with Fireball. It will explode if triggered or dispelled! for even more craziness, cast it on several pages, let someone elses unseen servant carry it or mage hand it. find the location for your "Nuclear Option" triggered by either magic or opening the book. Then grab a calculator!
With regards to how the positive and negative plans of energy are in 5e. The PHB describes those planes as domes that encompass all the other planes in a SUPER DETAILED (not really) sidebar on page 300.