Greetings from Perth, Western Australia again... Well I'll be buggered !!! In the 50 + years of wrenching and riding Harleys from FlatHeads, Knuckles, Pans & Shovels & my latest ride, the '85 Evo Bobber, I have never torqued down a set of heads... It has always been ''Three grunts & two smacks of the ring spanner with a rubber mallet'' type of tensioning... I reckon I ''jagged it'' all these years 'cos I could never figure out how to use the tension wrench in those awkward spots... Now I know !!! Thank you kind sir for your excellent tuition... Invaluable...
I just did this for my shovelhead and so far everything seems ok. Iv learned alot about shovelheads watching these videos you do. You always do a great job.
To be honest I did not know much about HD until I became the Manager of all the Police Bikes in Atlanta. I had two full time Harley Mechanics and I learned a metric ton of information from both of them. It's fun to watch your videos on the older bikes. Be Safe.
Thank You. I've known some guys that managed the bikes for different police departments. They seemed to love it. I probably know one or two guys you know in your area. Take care.
Remember, AMF bought out a failing company with worn out tooling and made a pretty good go of it. They did awful things like alternators and disc brakes. The electronics promptly failed in every industry. It took a while for everyone to get it right. I've had my 77 AMF Shovelhead since it was new. Just sayin'. Thanks for watching.
Hi MIKE, Too cold outside to do much in the SHOP this morning - so I'm furthering my SHOVEL-HEAD Education ... Thank you for the "HINT" on drilling the "OILER" Holes out to ease the fitment & installation I'm glad to see those " STD " Heads finally finding their "HOME" ! Thanks AGAIN COOP .......................................................
Mike, you stirred up old fun memories of 1983 when I did the top end on my 71 FLH. No garage and hotter that a Jalapeno's backside. I pulled it inside of the TV room through the sliding doors and proceeded to button things up. Was loads of fun and a learning experience. Loving your work...
Thank you for another interesting & educational video. Your tips and tricks are fantastic and am sure are saving many people unexpected grief. Am sure you have made your fair share of custom made tools. For the initial tightening of the head bolts a shortened up cheap ratcheting box end works well. Take care and keep the rubber side down.
First, I was attending a lecture by an expert who has not grown tired of his subject. And then treated to an amazing display of patience and coolness. (I would need to be sedated)
I was tough to put the manifold on temporarily to line the heads in place until the heads are torqued the first 20 pounds. If the motor is out of the bike I do everything I can while it is in the engine stand. I have only rebuild six motors three flathead two panhead and one shovlehead so you have a 100 time my experience. It is great to be able to watch how you do it since no one explains things better than you.(This was my late wife's youtube account I'm a guy)
Hey Mike. Another great video. I never miss a single episode you post. You do a great job and I wish someday we could meet. I also restore a lot of vintage motorcycles although mostly of the British persuasion. I would like to point out something about the use of the torque wrench. You are correct that as long as you keep the attachment at 90 degrees, you are in fact maintaining the same torque value. However, when you have the torque wrench at any other angle (including straight ahead) you have changed the torque and must adjust the torque setting of the wrench to compensate for that. There is a formula for it: (Torque Wrench Length X Torque Desired) Divided by: (Torque Wrench Length + Extension Length). Anytime you change the length of the torque wrench you need to use that formula. That's why 90 degrees is perfect because it does not change the length of the total torque wrench. So assuming your attachment is about 2 inches long and your wrench is about 1 foot long - when you point it straight ahead, your setting of 20 ft/lbs that you want to achieve should actually be set to about 17 ft/lbs on the torque wrench to achieve the 20 you want at the bolt. Just thought you would be interested.
Mike. Great video. I use the same setup with every thing you use on my own jobs. One note, for every one else watching, is that even though the 90 degree setting with the "dog bone" may not be 100% accurate, the difference is negligible, the important thing is that all the bolts are torqued to the same value. I wish there were a way to include pictures. I made up a 1/4" ratchet with a 90* head so I could use a socket wrench to run down the bolts snug before going to the TW. saves a lot of fingering effort, especially for a tech who does frequent head jobs. Keeping the faith.....RooDog....
MAC tools used to make a ratcheting torque adapter set. I don't know if they, or anyone else makes them anymore. They would sure make torquing the head bolts faster and easier.
Thanks for a great video. The information you share on these are great. I’m doing a top end rebuild on a stroker shovel engine, watching your videos is helping no end
Hi Mike, I'm sure you just forgot, but ONLY at 90 degrees will the torque wrench read correct when using torque adapters. In line and you have lengthened the effective lever, modifying the setting. At 20 ft lbs the skew is negligible, but at 65 ft lbs it would be dramatic. There is a formula to correct for this, I think Snap On includes it with their TQ wrenches, I don't want to quote off the top of my head, and my shop is just too far away this close to nap time... When I go out this evening I'll copy it down. I have a little cheat sheet with my correct torque values calculated for my 2 valve Ducatis where I prefer to come straight in. Love your videos, I should have kept the old Shovel... oh well
Sorry. Don't mean to bore anyone, but here's the formula for calculating the torque setting when increasing the length... I always use inches and foot pounds, but I think if you keep all the units similar it still works. The proper setting, or dial reading of the torque wrench for the desired torque value is the torque wrench length (center of square drive to center of handle) TIMES the torque desired DIVIDED by the torque wrench length PLUS the extension length (again, center to center). So a 12 inch long wrench times 30 ft lbs divided by 12 inches plus an adapter length of 6 inches would be 20 pound feet setting for the desired 30 foot pound torque value. 12 times 30 equals 360. 12 plus 6 equals 18. 360 divided by 18 equals a setting of 20 foot pounds on the wrench for the desired 30 ft lb result. If it's necessary that the extension be at an angle other than 90 degrees, measure the total length parallel to the torque wrench. This is something I use on occasion in my shop, and I just thought it would be handy to know...
Hi Mike thanks for the informative awesome videos. I have a 56 pan with STD heads S&S E carb and a shitty intake leak, I’ve tried everything except loosen the cylinder heads off and realign the intake manifold. A question I have is, do you realign so the intake manifold has no gap between heads and manifold or something like a .020 gap and square?? Keep up the awesome work. Thank you Sir
You can easily drive yourself nuts here. I don't know if you have 0-ring heads and manifold or "rubber band" type. My STD Shovelheads had the "rubber band" type which just about drove me nuts. But, at the time, I had a buddy with a mill and he was an excellent machinist. He machined "half grooves" on the the intake ports of the heads. I then used a manifold with the other "half grooves" on it. I then assembled it with 0-rings, like your Panhead originally had, as did my Shovel. When we mix and match years and brands, these are the problems. You'd like a "minimal" gap in there. If you have one side with a groove (like grooved ports on the head and not on the manifold, or vice versa, then call Ammerican Prime Mfg. and tell Ben you need those little filler rings for your intake. American Prime Manufacturing Inc. (562)-889-8665
Lot’s of memories watching this video…reminds me of having “custom” shitty braided stainless external oil lines on a my shovel motor and having the the hose blow off of the fitting spraying my crotch with hot oil at 70 on the freeway…The original hard lines work perfect..I had my cylinders bored to next oversized by Bud’s motorcycle shop in downtown Austin tx. In 1981 .I asked Bud”What’s a good torque# for the heads?” Bud replied “About 2 grunts” never forgot that ! Nice to see you do a great job on this bike,thanks Mike for the great videos.
Hey Mike have you ever heard of oiling the head bolts before you put them back in? A little oil under the head of the bolt supposedly to get accurate torque... Anyway thanks for all the great info!
Hi Mike. It is so good to see u and what u are doing in your garage 👍. I myself had some surgery in my right foot 2 of March,and now i am back home from hospital with a big cast for 6 to 12 weeks. But it is nice to be home in my own bed 🙂. Ok can't wait to see next video. How are things with the "Project bike?" Kjell"the Swede"🇸🇪
Repeated on and off of cylinder heads pulls the metal from the first couple of threads. The best way I know of correcting this is to do a counterbore into the inserts on a mill. Usually .040 - .060 will do it. The inserts are still more than deep enough.
Unless specifically stated, all torques in a Harley Davidson Service Manual are "Dry Specs" My latest manual spells out to use Loctite Anti-seize compound.
Mike. Thanks for the video. I’m really needing to buy that Snap On tool. Would you please tell us the tool number or name. My back bolt on the rear head is loose and I can’t get to it. Grrr. Oil is leaking out on my exhaust and oil tank.
Mike when you have the dog bone in a straight line with the wrench you have increased the leverage on the torque. I know you final torqued at 90 but... Your videos are great! Thanks for doing them!
Hi Mike I have a 1973 Shovelhead wonder if you could explain the difference in valve adjustment between stock and s&s limiting lifters? Very hard to identifying what’s in it and ty in advance
Awesome, job, brother Mike! It looks like that tool you! Used on your torque wrench! Or one, just like it! Would be good for an ironhead sporty! Rear cylinder head! Where the bolts on the right side! Are hard to get to! Of course you'd have to use it! Before the pushrods installed! Great video for sure!
Really appreciating the clarity of your educational videos. I'm curious if the torque on those bolts will have changed after the engine gets run and there is heat exposure? Do you advise your customers to check the torque again after some time using the bike, or have you do it? Thanks.
Yes, they should all be retorqued after several heat cycles, except the motors later than Shovelheads. Evos and later Harleys use "stretch studs" and are not to be retorqued.
Hello Mike, I so admire your calm precision approach to all you do, the outcomes magnify it. I am inspired to refresh a long neglected 73 shovel, and I am curious about the twelve point head bolts. As I have not yet begun disassembly can you tell me their dimension? dia, x tpi x length. What grade material? Many thanks
They are 7/16 bolts and they are specific bolts for this purpose. I use them because with 7/16 heads, they're nice to deal with. You'll find them with all of the major aftermarket suppliers for Harley parts.
Hi Mike enjoyed the video ty. I know another question about the tool LOL is that wrench a specialty tool just for that job? Just curious. All the best Kenny
I don't think so. But, it's pretty straight forward. I will show it next time it comes up. We have 150 videos up now. I did put my Shovelhead together on the videos. I used an early (58-72) swingarm. Go to our home page and click on "videos."
I do it the same way drop them in at several passes at 10lbs increments .wrong right or indifferent i believe it reducece the chance of head crackage or worpage .
Mike, am I correct in remembering that having the torque adapter straight [in line] with the wrench actually increases the applied torque to the fastener? Would you not want the 90 degree setup with ALL the bolts? Thanks.
Hey Mike! I've been loving your videos. Great info on the old bikes. I have a 60 pan motor that was rebuilt by a friend several years ago. I finally have the bike together and ready to start for the first time. How would you go about a first start/breaking in a fresh motor?
Make sure you have oil circulation before starting it. Run it "til it gets up to temp. Shut it off. Let it cool completely and retorque the heads and cylinders. Repeat these heat cycles a few times. Then, ride it like you love it, carefully. Check the torques cold and retorque til' the torque spec hold. Change the oil after a few hundred miles. Check it all over often fore those first few hundreds. At a thousand miles I trust it, I try some travelling ( for me 60- 65). After that, it's game on. You feel it getting happier and happier.
A buddy of mine decided that he didn't want to take one of his fuel tanks to do a top end job on his 1978 Electraglide. Well one of the hose clamps from the fuel line cross over tube fell into the bottom end. Well you can imagine what that little clamp did to his bottom end. Man I felt sorry for him. Total catastrophic engine destruction.. What do you do . Start all over from scratch.
If you do need to torque down your shovel, then this man has your wisdom in spades . . . his twelve sided nuts, improve all the cuts, as the angle of dangle is laid. (literal apologies, again) For to achieve even squeeze on the pull-down, with same pressures all round as they gain, 'little & often' are keywords, to avoid any 'head gasket' pain. (Dr. Frankenstein had the better idea of course, one head bolt, clever . . . Ah, sunset over Sherwood, it must be teatime : )
Hi Mike, as usual great video content and love your demeanor. I was hoping you could advice on the wrench tools you have for the process. Thank you for all you do to educatain us!
Thank You. We have a lot of videos up and have shown the tools putting Shovel Heads on. Go to our TH-cam Homepage and click on "videos." There are about 175 videos up and a few good "playlists." Try clicking on that one too. Glad you like our stuff.
Hello Mike from Down under Australia. First up big high five on all your videos, only one around that explains it for all to understand with so much detail. My question is, how many kilometres later would you recommend to re torque the Cylinder barrels and heads after a top end rebuild? Thank you.
I'm assuming you're working on a Shovelhead. Evos and later must be addressed as per the service manual. The way I do a Shovelhead is to torque the heads and cylinders as per the factory specs and pattern. Then, I start it up and run it until it reaches operating temp. Then I it shut off and let it cool down completely (overnight). Then I retorque the heads and cylinders. Then I run it up to operating temp and shut it off.to repeat the entire procedure again. I do this three or four times, waiting for a complete cool down each time. Then I run it a couple hundred miles and let it cool down completely and torque it again. Maybe one more time at 500. Nowe, she should be ready to travel.
@@pacificmike9501 Thank you, wow that's a lot of torquing but obviously the way to make sure it stays at the settings recommend, and yes it's a 76 shovelhead. I actually did run it for 20 mins then cool down 20 then again to cure the black Matt paint recommendations. Then went around the block so I will now re tension it all again. Thank you for responding so soon and keep up the great work 👍
Maybe I'm a little excessive, but once everything is the way you want it, it's well worth it. You'll be amazed how quickly you can do it with a little practice. Always make sure of your intaske manifold alignment.
@@pacificmike9501 My intake manifold has 2 rubber sleeves that goes over both sides of manifold to heads secured by special clamps, so if slightly out of alignment its ok. My issues was getting tools like you have in the US and to retention the heads and barrels I have to again take off exhaust, oil lines rocker pushrods. Thank you again I do appreciate your time and help. PS It runs like a charm 😎
Great work Mike, about how many shovel head engines have you rebuilt in your lifetime. Also, how did the shovel head get its name, from? Was the shovel head the best/easiest Harley engine to work on? Thanks for the educational informative videos.
I don't know. Someone decided the rocker boxes looked like inverted shovels. I don't know who. I love Shovelheads. Are they the easiest? Each incarnation of Harley engines is different, not really easier or harder, just different characteristics.
@@pacificmike9501 - thanks Mike, I have a friend who has a 1994 Fatboy, carburetor, low miles and one of the lower cylinder head gaskets was leaking air out of bottom cylinder gasket. The shop he took it to recommended a complete engine rebuild. The Bike ran great and was babied its entire life, then all sudden started making this piffing sort of sound from beneath lower cyclinder. Have you ever heard of someone just trying to torque the cylinder head down first? or just replacing the gaskets only? Or is the rule of thumb is, if you’re going to go through that much work, replacing the gaskets, you may as well rebuild everything because you’re already there ? Thanks Again Mike!
We did a bunch of them. In the beginning, Evos blew base gaskets. When an Evo had some miles on it, no big deal. We would pull the heads and cylinders, ball hone the cylinders, hand lap the valves, and replace all of the top end gaskets. This would freshen it up and prepare it (assuming it isn't abused or hot rodded too much) for the next 100 thousand miles. But this worked well, if the engine was in good shape to begin with.
I assume we're talking about a Shovelhead. I run 'til it's good and warm, shut it off. Let it cool comppletely, then, retorque the heads. I do this until I feel good about it. The heads don't tighten any more. Then I carefully enjoy riding the bike. After riding it, like ride it around for a couple times until I've put a couple hundred miles on it, maybe more, then I change the oil and retorque the heads. Now it's breaking in nicely. Let's try a little faster riding. Just remember, we don't retorque Evos or Twin cams cylinder heads.
Patience of Job! Was wondering how you were going to torque the head bolts. By using the " crow foot" wrench do you have to increase the torque wrench setting or keep it the same as factory specs. As always great video. Thanks.
Don’t you have to keep your Dog Bone wrench at 90 degrees in order for the correct torque value to be applied? Doesn’t having the Dog Bone wrench straight forward apply excess torque to the bolt?
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks Mike for getting back to me. I misunderstood what you were referring to by keeping the Dog Bone straight or at right angle. I didn’t realize you were referring to only the pre-final torque value. My mistake. I should have known you were correct. I’m anxious to see all of the videos that lead up to the completed bike build and viewing it being started up!! That will be a GREAT DAY!!
It sure feels good to be home and watching your show I used to reply love working on my bikes to at the time I lived in Auburn california my favorite trip was going to Bodega bay and Fort ROSS CALIFORNIA I LIVE IN VACOUVERWASHINGTON NORTHWEST LEMAY NELSON
Good morning Mike....just rebuilt my 1981 80 cu in shovel and torqued the heads, 20, 40, 60, and final torque of 65. I've run 2 heat cycles on the motor now. Do I need to go back and retorque the heads? Thanks for all your great videps. I have learned a lot from you....Peace
Retorquing on all of the pre-evo Harleys is standard practice. You can do more heat cycles and retorquing. After a hundred miles, do it again. With my customers, I always required they bring it back by 500 miles for me to retorque again and look everything over, test ride. Then I'd turn them loose to go play.
@Pacific Mike, Greetings. I tried to start the engine today. when it warmed up, the oil pressure light began to lights again. when you give more RPM, it goes out. I remove the hose from the oil filter to the tank. The oil does not flow evenly. what should i pay attention to? "Google translate"
@@pacificmike9501 ok thanks that will make it easier for me putting my evo together! And I have in the past done up an intake or two on heads already installed.!
Yes. I actually run a few heat cycles and retorque a couple of times before even riding the bike. Start it up. Get it good and warm. Let it cool down completely. Retorque the heads and cylinders. Do it again. Then I run it some miles, like a hundred. Cool down and retorque. Remember, Knuckles, Pans, Shovels, these all apply. Evos and later, not so.
Wouldn’t it be easier to bolt down the heads with the intake attached to both of them? Just asking bc I am about to tear down my Shovelhead for the purpose of restoring it.
You need to install this stuff in order. Put the heads on. Line up the manifold while rotating the heads. Take the heads down gradually as you keep checking the manifold alignment. By the time those heads are torqued down, the manifold should be in perfect or near perfect alignment.
With the manifold on and no carburetor, get your fingers in there and feel a real good fit. Use a flashlight and see a real good fit. Don't forget, I'm on your side.
Hi pacific Mike I am in Australia and we have very little H.D specialist here and if you find one you will pay $30 per spark plug and when you go to get say a clutch adjustment they always simply say replace it or nothing so trying to learn myself and while I am a car and bobcat mechanic I am not a motorcycle mechanic but I have a full S&S engine and andrews gearbox but slippery clutch can you please help me out with where to start without spending a ton of cash i don't have Cheers.
I have no idea what your primary is. Is it designed for a wet clutch or a dry clutch? Is it late or early style? What is the transmission? 4 speed? 5 speed? Belt drive? Maybe you could give me a part number cast into the inner primary.
Good morning Mike sorry I'm late to the thread. Quick question, I did a top end on my 1980 fxwg and I'm approaching the 500 mile mark. Do I need to re-torque my head gaskets at this point and if so, would I just re-torque to 65lbs?
@@pacificmike9501 I appreciate ya! Gonna go ahead and change my oil torque the heads and check the plugs. Can wait to see the next episode of the flathead build. See ya on the road 👍
A question not related to the heads; if I may? I just discovered (the hard way) different threaded engine crank seals are available (-.002, stock, +.002). Why is that? To what purpose? I'm writing of a '62 FL.
Although the timkens control the endplay, the spacer between them also sets the "preload." You don't want to try to install a spacer that won't fit. I think I need to word things more carefully.
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Greetings from Perth, Western Australia again... Well I'll be buggered !!! In the 50 + years of wrenching and riding Harleys from FlatHeads, Knuckles, Pans & Shovels & my latest ride, the '85 Evo Bobber, I have never torqued down a set of heads... It has always been ''Three grunts & two smacks of the ring spanner with a rubber mallet'' type of tensioning... I reckon I ''jagged it'' all these years 'cos I could never figure out how to use the tension wrench in those awkward spots... Now I know !!! Thank you kind sir for your excellent tuition... Invaluable...
Glad you liked it.
One of my favorite TH-camrs of all time
Thank You
THANK YOU...for sharing. Hello Mike and Cameraman-Mike, great video.
Thank you too!
👍😊
Snap-on torque adapter is the way to go. Can get at that rear cylinder rear bolt. Like the tip about using the 12point bolts. Thank you
Glad you like it.
I just did this for my shovelhead and so far everything seems ok. Iv learned alot about shovelheads watching these videos you do. You always do a great job.
Thank You
Yup! He got a few evo videos as well , I earned a boatloads of information from this cat.
To be honest I did not know much about HD until I became the Manager of all the Police Bikes in Atlanta. I had two full time Harley Mechanics and I learned a metric ton of information from both of them. It's fun to watch your videos on the older bikes. Be Safe.
Thank You. I've known some guys that managed the bikes for different police departments. They seemed to love it. I probably know one or two guys you know in your area. Take care.
Never had an appreciation for Shovelheads. The whole AMF thing cast a bad stigma. Watching your videos Shovelheads are growing on me.
Remember, AMF bought out a failing company with worn out tooling and made a pretty good go of it. They did awful things like alternators and disc brakes. The electronics promptly failed in every industry. It took a while for everyone to get it right. I've had my 77 AMF Shovelhead since it was new. Just sayin'. Thanks for watching.
Hi MIKE,
Too cold outside to do much in the SHOP this morning - so I'm furthering my SHOVEL-HEAD Education ...
Thank you for the "HINT" on drilling the "OILER" Holes out to ease the fitment & installation
I'm glad to see those " STD " Heads finally finding their "HOME" !
Thanks AGAIN
COOP
.......................................................
Thank You
Mike, you stirred up old fun memories of 1983 when I did the top end on my 71 FLH. No garage and hotter that a Jalapeno's backside. I pulled it inside of the TV room through the sliding doors and proceeded to button things up. Was loads of fun and a learning experience. Loving your work...
Thank You. And, I enjoy hearing about your experiences.
Thank you for another interesting & educational video. Your tips and tricks are fantastic and am sure are saving many people unexpected grief. Am sure you have made your fair share of custom made tools. For the initial tightening of the head bolts a shortened up cheap ratcheting box end works well. Take care and keep the rubber side down.
Thank You and you too.
That would be my dream job working on old motorcycles every day.. Thanks for sharing 👍
You can do it!
First, I was attending a lecture by an expert who has not grown tired of his subject. And then treated to an amazing display of patience and coolness. (I would need to be sedated)
It's just fun. Thank You
Yep, Pacific Mike is Zen that way.....
Thank You.
Love stopping by the garage have a blessed week my friend.
Thanks, you too!
First day off my TH-cam strike and headed straight to your awesome channel! Absolutely beautiful bike
Thank You. That's my faithful old road bike.
@@pacificmike9501 😁
I was tough to put the manifold on temporarily to line the heads in place until the heads are torqued the first 20 pounds. If the motor is out of the bike I do everything I can while it is in the engine stand. I have only rebuild six motors three flathead two panhead and one shovlehead so you have a 100 time my experience. It is great to be able to watch how you do it since no one explains things better than you.(This was my late wife's youtube account I'm a guy)
That's quite a compliment. Thank You.
I'm from Germany and i really love your videos. Thank you for your work.
Thanks for watching!
I love the ping sound the heads make when you put a wrench to them
Okay.
Hey Mike. Another great video. I never miss a single episode you post. You do a great job and I wish someday we could meet. I also restore a lot of vintage motorcycles although mostly of the British persuasion. I would like to point out something about the use of the torque wrench. You are correct that as long as you keep the attachment at 90 degrees, you are in fact maintaining the same torque value. However, when you have the torque wrench at any other angle (including straight ahead) you have changed the torque and must adjust the torque setting of the wrench to compensate for that. There is a formula for it: (Torque Wrench Length X Torque Desired)
Divided by:
(Torque Wrench Length + Extension Length).
Anytime you change the length of the torque wrench you need to use that formula. That's why 90 degrees is perfect because it does not change the length of the total torque wrench. So assuming your attachment is about 2 inches long and your wrench is about 1 foot long - when you point it straight ahead, your setting of 20 ft/lbs that you want to achieve should actually be set to about 17 ft/lbs on the torque wrench to achieve the 20 you want at the bolt.
Just thought you would be interested.
Thank you. Well said and appreciated.
That is correct!! that adapter at 0 degrees is 10-12lbs more torque than at 90 degrees. bad info in the video regarding this point!
Appreciate your time and patience for your audience.
Thank You
Mike.
Great video.
I use the same setup with every thing you use on my own jobs.
One note, for every one else watching, is that even though the 90 degree setting with the "dog bone" may not be 100% accurate, the difference is negligible, the important thing is that all the bolts are torqued to the same value.
I wish there were a way to include pictures. I made up a 1/4" ratchet with a 90* head so I could use a socket wrench to run down the bolts snug before going to the TW. saves a lot of fingering effort, especially for a tech who does frequent head jobs.
Keeping the faith.....RooDog....
Thank You. Great stuff from you.
Great work and great patience.
Thanks 👍
Another great video and love the see the Shovel coming together. Thanks again for posting and Sharing your knowledge, your awesome Pacific Mike.
Glad you enjoyed it. Thank You
Ive always used the intake clamps to hold the manifold and heads aligned when torquing the heads..Great videos
Everybody has their "touch." However it works best.
Good Video Mike! I was lucky got a set of torque adaptors. Installed my Cylinder heads 2 years ago. Installed them the same way.
Good stuff
Darn that gravity! Kept yankin' the tool out of your hand... hate it when that happens!
Just routine.
Well done Mike always enjoy your videos Good information and cool tool's 👍
Thanks 👍
MAC tools used to make a ratcheting torque adapter set. I don't know if they, or anyone else makes them anymore. They would sure make torquing the head bolts faster and easier.
I like what I'm using. But, it sounds like fun.
Thanks for your time young fella....
Thank You.
Thank you Mr Mike. Your inspiring sir
Thank You
Thanks for a great video.
The information you share on these are great.
I’m doing a top end rebuild on a stroker shovel engine, watching your videos is helping no end
Glad it helped
Thanks Mike
Thank You
Thanks Mike, I appreciate the video!
You bet!
Hi Mike, I'm sure you just forgot, but ONLY at 90 degrees will the torque wrench read correct when using torque adapters. In line and you have lengthened the effective lever, modifying the setting. At 20 ft lbs the skew is negligible, but at 65 ft lbs it would be dramatic. There is a formula to correct for this, I think Snap On includes it with their TQ wrenches, I don't want to quote off the top of my head, and my shop is just too far away this close to nap time... When I go out this evening I'll copy it down. I have a little cheat sheet with my correct torque values calculated for my 2 valve Ducatis where I prefer to come straight in. Love your videos, I should have kept the old Shovel... oh well
I'm sure you are correct. That's why I said to be sure and do the final torqueing at exactly 90 degrees.
Sorry. Don't mean to bore anyone, but here's the formula for calculating the torque setting when increasing the length... I always use inches and foot pounds, but I think if you keep all the units similar it still works. The proper setting, or dial reading of the torque wrench for the desired torque value is the torque wrench length (center of square drive to center of handle) TIMES the torque desired DIVIDED by the torque wrench length PLUS the extension length (again, center to center). So a 12 inch long wrench times 30 ft lbs divided by 12 inches plus an adapter length of 6 inches would be 20 pound feet setting for the desired 30 foot pound torque value. 12 times 30 equals 360. 12 plus 6 equals 18. 360 divided by 18 equals a setting of 20 foot pounds on the wrench for the desired 30 ft lb result. If it's necessary that the extension be at an angle other than 90 degrees, measure the total length parallel to the torque wrench. This is something I use on occasion in my shop, and I just thought it would be handy to know...
@@geraldchristensen2826 ahhhhhh, stop that! Please! :)
@@charlottesantafe1709 lol
Hi Mike thanks for the informative awesome videos. I have a 56 pan with STD heads S&S E carb and a shitty intake leak, I’ve tried everything except loosen the cylinder heads off and realign the intake manifold. A question I have is, do you realign so the intake manifold has no gap between heads and manifold or something like a .020
gap and square??
Keep up the awesome work.
Thank you Sir
You can easily drive yourself nuts here. I don't know if you have 0-ring heads and manifold or "rubber band" type. My STD Shovelheads had the "rubber band" type which just about drove me nuts. But, at the time, I had a buddy with a mill and he was an excellent machinist. He machined "half grooves" on the the intake ports of the heads. I then used a manifold with the other "half grooves" on it. I then assembled it with 0-rings, like your Panhead originally had, as did my Shovel. When we mix and match years and brands, these are the problems. You'd like a "minimal" gap in there. If you have one side with a groove (like grooved ports on the head and not on the manifold, or vice versa, then call Ammerican Prime Mfg. and tell Ben you need those little filler rings for your intake. American Prime Manufacturing Inc. (562)-889-8665
Lot’s of memories watching this video…reminds me of having “custom” shitty braided stainless external oil lines on a my shovel motor and having the the hose blow off of the fitting spraying my crotch with hot oil at 70 on the freeway…The original hard lines work perfect..I had my cylinders bored to next oversized by Bud’s motorcycle shop in downtown Austin tx. In 1981 .I asked Bud”What’s a good torque# for the heads?” Bud replied “About 2 grunts” never forgot that ! Nice to see you do a great job on this bike,thanks Mike for the great videos.
Thank You. And, a good story.
HAHA love that derby cover Mikey. Is it laser etched?
No, it is 30 hours of hand engraving.
Yeah! Great! Thank you!
Thank you too!
Hey Mike have you ever heard of oiling the head bolts before you put them back in? A little oil under the head of the bolt supposedly to get accurate torque... Anyway thanks for all the great info!
Wiping the threads with a film of light oil is a fine idea.
@@pacificmike9501 Sounds good thanks!
Lovin' the etching on the derby cover.
Didn't realize it was showing. Thank You
Great Video! one question, do you retorque the heads, after it's been warmed up and run a while?
Yes on Flatheads, Knuckleheads, Panheads, and Shovelheads. Look at your service manual. No retorque on Evo or Twin Cam cylinder heads.
Hi Mike. It is so good to see u and what u are doing in your garage 👍. I myself had some surgery in my right foot 2 of March,and now i am back home from hospital with a big cast for 6 to 12 weeks. But it is nice to be home in my own bed 🙂. Ok can't wait to see next video. How are things with the "Project bike?" Kjell"the Swede"🇸🇪
Stuff happening. We'll get back on the project bike soon.
Mike will you explain how inserts pull through and blow gaskets, and the remedy?
Repeated on and off of cylinder heads pulls the metal from the first couple of threads. The best way I know of correcting this is to do a counterbore into the inserts on a mill. Usually .040 - .060 will do it. The inserts are still more than deep enough.
Great work as always 👍. Heads look awesome.
Thank You
Unless specifically stated, all torques in a Harley Davidson Service Manual are "Dry Specs"
My latest manual spells out to use Loctite Anti-seize compound.
Thank You.
Mike. Thanks for the video. I’m really needing to buy that Snap On tool. Would you please tell us the tool number or name. My back bolt on the rear head is loose and I can’t get to it. Grrr. Oil is leaking out on my exhaust and oil tank.
It is called a "torque adapter."
Thanks. I just found it on Amazon for $20. They call it a “dog bone” made by snap on. I’m guessing it is 9/16”. The length is only 2.5”!
Sounds right.
Mike when you have the dog bone in a straight line with the wrench you have increased the leverage on the torque. I know you final torqued at 90 but... Your videos are great! Thanks for doing them!
Thank You
Love ya Mike. Take care of yourself amigo. Long live Mike
Thank You and my best to you.
Thank you for the content
Thank You
Thank you for showing me so much very helpful really enjoy your show
Thank You. I'm really glad when it helps someone.
Another great Video Mike, she coming along nicely. Mike what's that little tool called?
I believe it is called a "torque adapter."
@@pacificmike9501 thank you Mike
Another great tutorial, Mike!
Glad you liked it!
Hi Mike I have a 1973 Shovelhead wonder if you could explain the difference in valve adjustment between stock and s&s limiting lifters?
Very hard to identifying what’s in it and ty in advance
Yes, adjust stock lifters according to Harley's Year and model specific manual. Adjust S&S according to S&S instructions.
Awesome, job, brother Mike! It looks like that tool you! Used on your torque wrench! Or one, just like it! Would be good for an ironhead sporty! Rear cylinder head! Where the bolts on the right side! Are hard to get to! Of course you'd have to use it! Before the pushrods installed! Great video for sure!
Thanks 👍
Really appreciating the clarity of your educational videos. I'm curious if the torque on those bolts will have changed after the engine gets run and there is heat exposure? Do you advise your customers to check the torque again after some time using the bike, or have you do it? Thanks.
Yes, they should all be retorqued after several heat cycles, except the motors later than Shovelheads. Evos and later Harleys use "stretch studs" and are not to be retorqued.
Hello Mike, I so admire your calm precision approach to all you do, the outcomes magnify it. I am inspired to refresh a long neglected 73 shovel, and I am curious about the twelve point head bolts. As I have not yet begun disassembly can you tell me their dimension? dia, x tpi x length. What grade material? Many thanks
They are 7/16 bolts and they are specific bolts for this purpose. I use them because with 7/16 heads, they're nice to deal with. You'll find them with all of the major aftermarket suppliers for Harley parts.
Very cool - thanks Mike.
Thank You
Hi Mike enjoyed the video ty. I know another question about the tool LOL is that wrench a specialty tool just for that job? Just curious. All the best Kenny
Actually, I believe it is called a "torque adapter." It is a great tool.
@@pacificmike9501 very cool!
How long have you been tinkering on motorcycles? Greetings from Bavaria \m/
Since before I was old enough for a driver's license.
Thanx for the video, preciate your skill. Do you have any videos on swing arm install for a 77 Shovel
I don't think so. But, it's pretty straight forward. I will show it next time it comes up. We have 150 videos up now. I did put my Shovelhead together on the videos. I used an early (58-72) swingarm. Go to our home page and click on "videos."
I do it the same way drop them in at several passes at 10lbs increments .wrong right or indifferent i believe it reducece the chance of head crackage or worpage .
You bet. Certainly worth the time.
Mike, am I correct in remembering that having the torque adapter straight [in line] with the wrench actually increases the applied torque to the fastener? Would you not want the 90 degree setup with ALL the bolts? Thanks.
Please follow to the end of the video. All of the final torqueing was done at a right angle.
@@pacificmike9501 Yep, so it was. Sorry I didn't catch that! Thanks.
Didn't mean to make it hard to find.
Thanks for posting good job👍
Thank you too
Thumbs up (as always)!
Thanks again!
Great stuff as always.
Thank You
Mike, you need to add “ASMR” to the titles of your videos... Guaranteed to get you 1M+ views!
I am flattered.
Hey Mike! I've been loving your videos. Great info on the old bikes. I have a 60 pan motor that was rebuilt by a friend several years ago. I finally have the bike together and ready to start for the first time. How would you go about a first start/breaking in a fresh motor?
Make sure you have oil circulation before starting it. Run it "til it gets up to temp. Shut it off. Let it cool completely and retorque the heads and cylinders. Repeat these heat cycles a few times. Then, ride it like you love it, carefully. Check the torques cold and retorque til' the torque spec hold. Change the oil after a few hundred miles. Check it all over often fore those first few hundreds. At a thousand miles I trust it, I try some travelling ( for me 60- 65). After that, it's game on. You feel it getting happier and happier.
A buddy of mine decided that he didn't want to take one of his fuel tanks to do a top end job on his 1978 Electraglide. Well one of the hose clamps from the fuel line cross over tube fell into the bottom end. Well you can imagine what that little clamp did to his bottom end. Man I felt sorry for him. Total catastrophic engine destruction.. What do you do . Start all over from scratch.
Sad story.
Do you torque them with everything dry or is there thread lock or lube on the bolts?
Clean. Dry is fine. Maybe a very light film of oil.
Thank you
Thank You
If you do need to torque down your shovel, then this man has your wisdom in spades . . .
his twelve sided nuts, improve all the cuts, as the angle of dangle is laid. (literal apologies, again)
For to achieve even squeeze on the pull-down, with same pressures all round as they gain,
'little & often' are keywords, to avoid any 'head gasket' pain.
(Dr. Frankenstein had the better idea of course, one head bolt, clever . . . Ah, sunset over Sherwood, it must be teatime : )
Awesome. I'm having tea in you honour.
Hi Mike, as usual great video content and love your demeanor. I was hoping you could advice on the wrench tools you have for the process. Thank you for all you do to educatain us!
Thank You. We have a lot of videos up and have shown the tools putting Shovel Heads on. Go to our TH-cam Homepage and click on "videos." There are about 175 videos up and a few good "playlists." Try clicking on that one too. Glad you like our stuff.
What is the catalog # of the Snap On tool that you are using and the tool's actual name?
I believe it is referred to as a "torque adapter." The number on the tool is: FRDH181.
Thanks Mike
Can you show pawl adjustment on a five speed?
Next time I do one.
Hello Mike from Down under Australia.
First up big high five on all your videos, only one around that explains it for all to understand with so much detail.
My question is, how many kilometres later would you recommend to re torque the Cylinder barrels and heads after a top end rebuild?
Thank you.
I'm assuming you're working on a Shovelhead. Evos and later must be addressed as per the service manual. The way I do a Shovelhead is to torque the heads and cylinders as per the factory specs and pattern. Then, I start it up and run it until it reaches operating temp. Then I it shut off and let it cool down completely (overnight). Then I retorque the heads and cylinders. Then I run it up to operating temp and shut it off.to repeat the entire procedure again. I do this three or four times, waiting for a complete cool down each time. Then I run it a couple hundred miles and let it cool down completely and torque it again. Maybe one more time at 500. Nowe, she should be ready to travel.
@@pacificmike9501 Thank you, wow that's a lot of torquing but obviously the way to make sure it stays at the settings recommend, and yes it's a 76 shovelhead. I actually did run it for 20 mins then cool down 20 then again to cure the black Matt paint recommendations. Then went around the block so I will now re tension it all again. Thank you for responding so soon and keep up the great work 👍
Maybe I'm a little excessive, but once everything is the way you want it, it's well worth it. You'll be amazed how quickly you can do it with a little practice. Always make sure of your intaske manifold alignment.
@@pacificmike9501 My intake manifold has 2 rubber sleeves that goes over both sides of manifold to heads secured by special clamps, so if slightly out of alignment its ok. My issues was getting tools like you have in the US and to retention the heads and barrels I have to again take off exhaust, oil lines rocker pushrods. Thank you again I do appreciate your time and help.
PS It runs like a charm 😎
Great work Mike, about how many shovel head engines have you rebuilt in your lifetime. Also, how did the shovel head get its name, from? Was the shovel head the best/easiest Harley engine to work on? Thanks for the educational informative videos.
I don't know. Someone decided the rocker boxes looked like inverted shovels. I don't know who. I love Shovelheads. Are they the easiest? Each incarnation of Harley engines is different, not really easier or harder, just different characteristics.
@@pacificmike9501 - thanks Mike, I have a friend who has a 1994 Fatboy, carburetor, low miles and one of the lower cylinder head gaskets was leaking air out of bottom cylinder gasket. The shop he took it to recommended a complete engine rebuild. The Bike ran great and was babied its entire life, then all sudden started making this piffing sort of sound from beneath lower cyclinder. Have you ever heard of someone just trying to torque the cylinder head down first? or just replacing the gaskets only? Or is the rule of thumb is, if you’re going to go through that much work, replacing the gaskets, you may as well rebuild everything because you’re already there ? Thanks Again Mike!
We did a bunch of them. In the beginning, Evos blew base gaskets. When an Evo had some miles on it, no big deal. We would pull the heads and cylinders, ball hone the cylinders, hand lap the valves, and replace all of the top end gaskets. This would freshen it up and prepare it (assuming it isn't abused or hot rodded too much) for the next 100 thousand miles. But this worked well, if the engine was in good shape to begin with.
Very helpful videos. Do you re torque the heads after heat cycling the engine or after so many miles?
I assume we're talking about a Shovelhead. I run 'til it's good and warm, shut it off. Let it cool comppletely, then, retorque the heads. I do this until I feel good about it. The heads don't tighten any more. Then I carefully enjoy riding the bike. After riding it, like ride it around for a couple times until I've put a couple hundred miles on it, maybe more, then I change the oil and retorque the heads. Now it's breaking in nicely. Let's try a little faster riding. Just remember, we don't retorque Evos or Twin cams cylinder heads.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks Pacific Mike
Holy shit did you go to a wireless mic lol
Quite a while ago. Welcome back.
Awesome, came to watch how you did that back bolt PITA lol
Thank You.
Patience of Job! Was wondering how you were going to torque the head bolts. By using the " crow foot" wrench do you have to increase the torque wrench setting or keep it the same as factory specs. As always great video. Thanks.
Just my normal way of doing it. The right angle gives the same torque as no tool on the end. It is called a "torque adapter."
Don’t you have to keep your Dog Bone wrench at 90 degrees in order for the correct torque value to be applied?
Doesn’t having the Dog Bone wrench straight forward apply excess torque to the bolt?
Yes, go all the way through the video. Final torque is all right angle.
@@pacificmike9501
Thanks Mike for getting back to me.
I misunderstood what you were referring to by keeping the Dog Bone straight or at right angle.
I didn’t realize you were referring to only the pre-final torque value. My mistake. I should have known you were correct.
I’m anxious to see all of the videos that lead up to the completed bike build and viewing it being started up!!
That will be a GREAT DAY!!
Coming soon.
It sure feels good to be home and watching your show I used to reply love working on my bikes to at the time I lived in Auburn california my favorite trip was going to Bodega bay and Fort ROSS CALIFORNIA I LIVE IN VACOUVERWASHINGTON NORTHWEST LEMAY NELSON
It's beauitful up there.
Good morning Mike....just rebuilt my 1981 80 cu in shovel and torqued the heads, 20, 40, 60, and final torque of 65. I've run 2 heat cycles on the motor now. Do I need to go back and retorque the heads? Thanks for all your great videps. I have learned a lot from you....Peace
Retorquing on all of the pre-evo Harleys is standard practice. You can do more heat cycles and retorquing. After a hundred miles, do it again. With my customers, I always required they bring it back by 500 miles for me to retorque again and look everything over, test ride. Then I'd turn them loose to go play.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks Mikw
Thank You.
@Pacific Mike, Greetings. I tried to start the engine today. when it warmed up, the oil pressure light began to lights again. when you give more RPM, it goes out. I remove the hose from the oil filter to the tank. The oil does not flow evenly. what should i pay attention to? "Google translate"
Try a new sending unit. Try an oil gauge connected where the sending unit goes.
What are your favorite brand/type head gaskets?
I don't recommend brands, but, I've used a lot of Cometic MLS head gaskets.
Will evo heads wiggle around as well, or do they center up well on their own….as it applies to centering the intake….?
No. They center up on their own and have floating flanges on the manifold.
@@pacificmike9501 ok thanks that will make it easier for me putting my evo together! And I have in the past done up an intake or two on heads already installed.!
Great video Mike, just a question, do you need to re-torque the heads after you have run the bike for a few miles?
Yes. I actually run a few heat cycles and retorque a couple of times before even riding the bike. Start it up. Get it good and warm. Let it cool down completely. Retorque the heads and cylinders. Do it again. Then I run it some miles, like a hundred. Cool down and retorque. Remember, Knuckles, Pans, Shovels, these all apply. Evos and later, not so.
Wouldn’t it be easier to bolt down the heads with the intake attached to both of them? Just asking bc I am about to tear down my Shovelhead for the purpose of restoring it.
No.
You need to install this stuff in order. Put the heads on. Line up the manifold while rotating the heads. Take the heads down gradually as you keep checking the manifold alignment. By the time those heads are torqued down, the manifold should be in perfect or near perfect alignment.
Alright then I’ll do it your way I guess. Greetings from Germany 🤘an thank you
With the manifold on and no carburetor, get your fingers in there and feel a real good fit. Use a flashlight and see a real good fit. Don't forget, I'm on your side.
I like chrome as much as anyone but nothing trumps well cared for aluminum in appearance, love the primary.
Thank You. I love polished aluminum.
why can't you put your intake on first to get everything centered?
Because as you tighten down the heads, the angle changes.
Hey Mike you always put on a great show I have a 1993 evo so do I check the trany fliud on the kick stand
Don't know which model you have. Check your service manual. That's how I'd find it.
Hey Mike did you use a 7/16 crows foot for the base nuts to torque them? Thanks
It's closed end and I think Snap-On calls it a "torque adapter." I use aftermarket head bolts on my Shovelhead that have a 7/16, 12 point head.
Hi pacific Mike I am in Australia and we have very little H.D specialist here and if you find one you will pay $30 per spark plug and when you go to get say a clutch adjustment they always simply say replace it or nothing so trying to learn myself and while I am a car and bobcat mechanic I am not a motorcycle mechanic but I have a full S&S engine and andrews gearbox but slippery clutch can you please help me out with where to start without spending a ton of cash i don't have Cheers.
I have no idea what your primary is. Is it designed for a wet clutch or a dry clutch? Is it late or early style? What is the transmission? 4 speed? 5 speed? Belt drive? Maybe you could give me a part number cast into the inner primary.
things like this are why i've always left the big jobs to the pros , i can't imagine doing that
4 times !
Okay.
Good morning Mike sorry I'm late to the thread. Quick question, I did a top end on my 1980 fxwg and I'm approaching the 500 mile mark. Do I need to re-torque my head gaskets at this point and if so, would I just re-torque to 65lbs?
My personal opinion is "Yes" and "Yes."
@@pacificmike9501 I appreciate ya! Gonna go ahead and change my oil torque the heads and check the plugs. Can wait to see the next episode of the flathead build. See ya on the road 👍
A question not related to the heads; if I may?
I just discovered (the hard way) different threaded engine crank seals are available (-.002, stock, +.002).
Why is that? To what purpose? I'm writing of a '62 FL.
It affects the endplay in the flywheel assembly. It is necessary to check this as you go. Refer to Panhead service manual.
@@pacificmike9501 And here I thought the play was set up by the shim that goes between the two timken bearings.
Although the timkens control the endplay, the spacer between them also sets the "preload." You don't want to try to install a spacer that won't fit. I think I need to word things more carefully.
Great video! What the model and year of your shovel?
It is a '77 FLH. But, much modified. Lots of stuff about it on the channel. Go to our home page and click on "videos."
@@pacificmike9501 thanks for the reply, i have viewed most of the vids , learned so much, Great Channel!
Thank You.
Is there a part number for that snap on tool for the heads?
Yes. For the 12 point (7/16) headed bolts, it is FRDH141. For the standard (9/16) 6 sided heads, it is FRDH181.
Round 11:00 heard the train passing by in the video👍💪🫡
I like the train too.
Great way to spend a rainy Sunday. If you started out on the primary side. You would have one less walk around. 😉
Really?
Hi, i have a question: What is the widths of this spline drive adapter?
Probably depends on the brand. Mine is around 1/2-5/8".