TaylorMade Golf Irons Comparison | Same Loft Golf Irons Test
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ย. 2024
- This TaylorMade golf irons comparison uses Trackman to break down each of the TaylorMade golf irons currently in line, including the TaylorMade Stealth, TaylorMade P790, TaylorMade P770, TaylorMade P7MC, and TaylorMade P7MB irons.
In this video, 2nd Swing's Drew Mahowald and Thomas Campbell set each of these TaylorMade golf irons to the same loft - 32°- and used Trackman technology to conduct a head-to-head test. Which TaylorMade irons are the longest? Straightest? Most forgiving?
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Please do this with Mizuno too.. I've always wanted to see this.
The results will be similar as with other OEMs. It's just a hunk of metal .
Yes!
@@cgasucksechnology matters, here one club is 2-3 yds longer than the other ones, and that’s a 7 iron, difference will probably be even more in lower clubs.
There was no difference once you bend to same loft except stealth. This proves loft is the only thing driving distance. It’s really about off center forgiveness
Really enjoyed this test, guys, and interesting findings. Side note, the P7MCs are some of my favorite irons ever. Played them last year. They're so, so consistent, and the turf interaction is exceptional too with that very slightly rounded leading edge compared to similar players' CBs from Mizuno, etc.
I tested both the P7MC and P7MB and the P7MC blew them away. It wasn’t even a contest, I felt the P7MCs were better in every aspect, they even got almost as much distance and forgiveness as the P770 in a Forged Iron that you can work. The Mizuno 223 Pro and the Callaway Apex TCB are the three best clubs Money can buy this year by a mile. I don’t know who so many people are still flocking to Titleist and Ping. They aren’t even in the same playing field right now, they’re just going off past reputation.
It's interesting you dismiss the loft convo so quickly, like "we debunked that" - have you though? I don't think anyone was saying that was the ONLY difference but it's absolutely the main one. The real tech is that they can make a 28 deg 7i easy enough to hit. But it's the extra loft that is accounting for a LARGE majority of the distance gains. The rest is lowering spin. It's only 2-7 yds further in carry b/c it's the lowest spin. The 7 v 7 would have put the Stealth about 12-17 yds further. So no, you confirmed what we all knew imo.
Sample size as well. You hit 6 shots you'll see closer averages. But if you look at the circles there are 3 clubs that are clearly longer and if you hit 30+ shots you'd see it
I disagree with the conclusions of the video, once you take into account standard deviation most of the irons performed functionally the same - you would need to take the data and run a p- value stat test (or similar) but I suspect the difference in averages is more down to chance than real differences and you would get slightly different results if you did the same test on another day. Arguably the P770s and P7MC had a touch more spin than average and the Stealth a little less, equally you can argue that the P7MB flew a little lower and as a consequence had a shallower descent angle.
At the end of the day a TM iron set at 32 degrees will carry for Thomas 190 yards spin at 5000 rpm with a peak height of 100 ft and a descent angle just over 47 degrees.
For me the biggest take away is that the blade appears only sensible for someone who wants a lower flight and the P7MC is just a better option.
You don't sound like someone who really knows stats. Anyone who knows statistics at all can see that the standard deviations are small enough to suggest that the mean differences between the Stealth and the MBs are almost certainly statistically significant
@@maxyroo I am not a professional statistician but stats in YT golf analysis is a bug bear of mine.
Let me start by saying that Thomas, Drew and the 2nd Swing team did the fairest test they could within the limits of the equipment they had - the difference in shafts between clubs may cause differences but the only way to be sure is to run the same test with identical shafts and a lot more shots.
In terms of statistical significance of differences there are 2 simple ways of determining that and many highly complicated ways (p- values or similar tests). The complicated ways are beyond my ability to compute even if we had all the data for every shot, so I will concentrate on the 2 simple tests. The first test is that if the results between 2 clubs show that that when the SD is taken into account they overlap (this is something Mark Crossfield uses) then the 2 results of functionally the same. The second test looks at whether 1 result is within 2 SDs of the other on the basis that 95% of the data will be within 2 SDs of the average. The second test is pretty crude and if we had p- values or similar I would ignore it
Let us start with club head speed on the basis that unless that is the same, that will impact on all the results. Effectively the results prove Thomas is a robot, the club head speed is functionally identical across the board.
Now let us consider carry distance. With the exception of the difference between the Stealth and the MB every club's result including their respective SD overlaps each other so they are functionally identical. There is a difference between the Stealth and the MB about 2 yards under the overlap test and 0.5 yards on the 2 SD difference test. That might be statistically significant depending on the number of shots but the difference is very marginal, are you really going to notice 2 yards difference in carry?
Next consider how the ball flies off the club - ball speed, launch angle and peak height. Launch angles are functionally identical on the overlap test as are, again with the exception of the Stealth v MB, peak heights. When you consider the Stealth and MB on either test there is only 1 ft between the difference in peak heights being functionally identical. Again I have to ask, would anyone notice a difference even of 3-4 ft nevermind 1 ft? Then there is ball speed, the results are with the exception of the difference between the P770 and MB, functionally identical on the overlap test but on the 2 SD difference test are at the outer margins of being functionally identical
Finally there is the issue of spin rates. If you look solely at the overlap test the Stealth does seem to be a low spinner but that difference disappears under the 2 SD test.
So overall the differences are small and probably statistically insignificant. I appreciate this is my opinion but if the test was run again with identical shafts and a lot more shots I suspect the lower peak height of the MB would come statistically significant, the Stealth would be shown to be a little lower in spin and that there would be a statistically significant difference between the Stealth and the MB in carry distance but probably only 3-4 yards. The interesting one is the ball speed of the P770, I suspect that if the test was rerun with a lot more shots, the P770 probably has a significantly hotter face than the MB and that might result in a statistically significant increase in carry distance but whether that difference would be noticeable on the golf course is questionable - at best we are talking maybe 5 yards of carry
So, if I'm reading this correctly, for you the P7MC would be the best? Ultimately, it would be hard to beat that noticeably superior dispersion. If I could land all my balls in the same place at a given distance, I wouldn't care what the club looked like or what number was stamped on the bottom to get there. The distances here don't seem to be dramatically different anyway when applied to a typical hole of golf. Is there a chance that these all behave radically different given a different swing speed though? Say 70mph for example?
Stealth 790 and 770 were clearly longer but you have a small sample size with a few really bad blocked shots that skew the numbers for those 3 and then the mb is very centered pattern and the Cb has a few big pulls. If you hit 25 shots and control for the dispersion you'd definitely see distance gains as advertised. Shocking that these so called "expert fitters" are so clueless.
For sure. Unfortunately we don't have the time to gather the sample size you're referring to. Ideally, we could do all of our tests with hundreds of shots. Bottom line - loft is a significant factor in iron distance, though the construction of the club also has a great impact as well.
The offset after bending them that strong must of looked a bit odd!!
The bounce would be off too!
Most of us know from experience that different heads produce different launch, speed and spin, although the player ultimately has far more influence than the club
This is all true!
Such an underrated video, please post more of these
Great test and probably what most would expect. This year I switched to a combo set of P770 4 & 5 / P7MC 6-P and have never had a better feeling more consistent set of irons…especially the MC. Which is saying something coming from the Mizuno MP18-SC. Had to play with lofts for gapping (1* weak on 770 / 1* strong on MC). Taylormade knocked it out of the park with the P series!
P Series best series of iron ever made
Just order that exact same combo set with dynamic gold tour issue x100’s. Super excited to break them in
Please get some old guy in there and test/compare some of the newer iron/hybrid set, Cobra T Rail, Tour Edge E523, Sub70 799 and Cleveland XL Launcher. Thanks
Great comparison with all of the lofts matched. P7MCs are awesome irons and underrated in the players CB category.
The three best irons are produced by Taylormade, Callaway and Mizuno this year by a fair margin.
Great test 👍🏻
Well done guys, these kind of comparisons are interesting.
I also think this is pretty unique on TH-cam, most creators just regurgitate the marketing!
Thanks for watching David!
Are they the same lengths?
Guess I’m getting stealth irons 5-A with TI x100’s😂
I too am curious about the RPMs, I was told 5500 to 6k was pretty low on a 7 iron, but I assumed that was dependant on other variables as well.
I'm curious how much changing the bounce affects the strike quality when you bend an iron a few degrees strong. Probably won't show up on a mat.
Play P770 for couple seasons now, but was thinking of switching to P7MC RAW. Thanks for the review.
Very nice video - and I like the fact that you picked 32-degrees - this seems to be the loft that I hope more manufacturers will start centralizing around and that this yearly loft 'jacking' is stopped and we come back to the range of 32-degrees +/- 2-degrees being the range that the spectrum of clubs are built around: [Blades-34, Cavity Blade-33, Modern Players-32, Players Distance-31, Power Spec]. Everything currently in the 20s needs to be re-labeled 6-irons.
Better yet would be to educate that the number of the club is purely there for the purpose of being able to easily identify one club from another within the same set.
Find the irons that get you the ball flight characteristics, forgiveness, and accuracy you need. Everything else is just how it got there. Over-focusing on static loft in relation to the number on the sole of the club is ignoring so many other variables.
do you know about dynamic loft?
Interesting test, shows you can't compare modern day gear to old school stuff. My 6 Iron is 32 degrees. MP33 still rocks!
Great scenario.
Wow, sure wish i could hit my Stealth 8 Iron 195, that's a long ways..
For the stealth could it be possible that the shaft lenght was different and impacting results
Thomas on 190y par3 will be hitting stealth 8i .. i hit 5i!!! Just nuts
For some it's a 3 wood 😂
Would have been better if they were the same shaft and swing weight, the results would probably be even closer.
Agree, why do a test like this and not take out all the variables. Different shafts, weight, shaft lengths, etc make this test kind of worthless.
Pls do this again for current 2024 models ❤
Would be curious to see this test done with a robot. To see how close these results would be vs the human . Seems like you are doing a pretty good job with consistency. 😉
Thomas Campbell IS a robot. He is wireless.
I can think of at least one benefit of human tester - it can factor in the forgivness level of clubs for less-than-perfect strikes.
Stealth seem to be the best they hit better and are half the price
Guys I appreciate this video! Thanks for videos like this one. Are you thinking of doing something similar in other manufactures? Ping???!!!!!
Thanks for watching!! For other manufacturers it will depend a little bit on their iron family and standard lofts within. It worked out nicely here to use the Stealth 8-iron at 32 and then bend the forged irons to that loft. But we definitely have it on the list to try to complete with other brands
Great video! Regardless of club, why are the spin rates so low on your swing? 5000 vs 7000 tour average on a 7 iron? Curious!
Loft on 7 iron for tour players is typically 34 or more, I guess. Here the loft is 32, where the difference is about half a club, implicating 400-500 rpm difference. Also dynamic loft has to be checked, plus some other impact parameters.
I got the P7MC’s a couple of months ago and they feel incredible and really consistent which was also reflected nicely in the video. Very interested content though so thank you 👍
Thank you for watching!!
Offset tends to increase dynamic loft too
As a high handicap high swing speed player tired of the hugely inconsistent distances on my game improvement clubs, why would i not choose the p7mc if the goal is to get the most consistent results possible, regardless of distance?
Great question and thanks for watching. The benefit of game improvement irons is that your mishits will perform much better than a players-type iron. So it's finding that balance of what you're looking for in your game between distance, forgiveness, and consistency.
Very cool test, thanks!
If you guys aren't already using them, get some RCT balls for indoor testing. That way trackman can more accurately read spin rates. My guess is that we'd see much lower spin with the game improvement vs players irons.
You won't see much difference in spin if loft is all the same and strike is controlled for. They obviously didn't control for strike here so no real way to know if he wasn't hitting slightly more toe side vs heel side on other clubs or high and low strike caused from bounce change due to bending of the lofts etc etc. But when I've tested on gcquad typically spin rate is within 200-400 rpms when controlled for everything else.
Thanks for watching!! We have RCT balls in each of our fitting bays to use for fittings in addition to our testing.
All these videos are good, but the theory for me is not. I want weaker lofts, 7 is 36 degrees, I want higher flight, more spin to stop quicker on the green, if I need distance,I'll go to a 6. I play 1990 Tommy armour 845's, best irons I've ever hit, better players know when you play it back in your stance, the ball will fly lower, but will still stop quicker if struck correctly.strong lofts are for people who need distance or have an ego with how far they hit a particular club, to a good player that doesn't mean anything, and I've been doing this for 50 years.
I still like my current irons JPX 900. But as I age 😪 I'm going to have to go with game improvement irons. You just give up too much distance.
But one thing to remember -- it's not just about distance, it's about precision and consistency as well! Don't want to gain distance if it means sacrificing the other pieces
@@2ndswing true. But how accurate will I be when I'm hitting 5 iron into a 160 yard par 3? 😄
change tee box
Love my P7MB
I just ordered a combo set of CBs and MBs. Switching from the 790s for the reasons you see above. The front to back dispersion is something overlooked consistently. Im tired of the flyers. The CBs and MBs are so accurate.
Wow!!! A whole 7 yards in the 180 yard circle. 98 gram high launch shaft in the Stealth vs 130 (or 120) gram mid launch shaft in the MB. Let's see the same thing with the same shafts and same length of shafts. Don't make laugh!
Surprised there wasn't a bigger difference between the p7mc and 770. Thomas is a swing machine
7:13 is why the top players play blades. Distance dispersion is far tighter. No flyers from the fairway with a blade like a GI can have.
Yes! This is the video that I have been waiting for. Thank you 2nd Swing Golf! It would be of interest to get Thomas’ to rank these 5 clubs by feel. Could definitely here a difference between the Stealth and P7MB, so am guessing there was some difference in feel. Given the data, feel (and workability) could be the difference for someone choosing between the Stealth and P790, for example, with only about 2-3 yards difference in distance at same loft.
It's interesting how maybe the offset between the clubs for different as they were all same in Loft and there was no change in dispersion. Not sure if offset is a focus when fitting
Pointless test as shaft, and shaft length aren’t the same. Also stealing video from Shiels without credit, really?
Yes fascinating and a good test given the many comments about strong lofts etc. Have had my eye on the p770s but in testing previous years versions di not make my final shortlist but maybe in future. Certainly like the looks of them.
So with same lofts stealth went farthest and it’s also shorter by half inch correct? Or did you extend it.
What a video!
Personally distance is the last thing I would base my iron choice on. I want my irons to get close to the target. If I need a longer flight, I pick a stronger iron. You should measure the area of the landing oval and choose the iron that consistently gets close to the target.
You nailed it Robert! What good is distance if it winds up farther from the target?
this, 100%. If you need longer irons to hit more greens, change tee box
@@2ndswing 10 Yards in the rough left is worst than 10 yards front of the green most of the time.
8 hdp here. Anyone know how forgiving the P790’s are?
Manufacturers claim because the technology is helping to launch the ball that if they didn't strengthen the lofts a shots peak height would be to high and result in shorter distance. This test didn't show that to be true. So based on this test what is the reason for strengthening the lofts?
Shafts make a huge difference you goobers
Thanks for watching us goobers 😎
Great comparison and break down, though I can see how the numbers can be factored in by a great hit and the not so great hit and seems you all don't remove the off hits, which I like. Changed to P790's thru you all (traded in my PXG 0311 Gen3) and can't complain, game changer for me. You all have been so great with trade in's, best value around and then quality of purchases I've made on top of that between clubs and other things. As I can afford clubs this is the only place I will go new and used, Thank you.
Pure class in this video!
thanks for watching!
P770, best iron on the market right now, change my mind
Great video...maybe I missed it but do they all have the same shaft? I would think that may make a difference too.
Enjoyed the video! Just to let you know when you showed the numbers with the red background they were too small to see.
shaft length ? was the 8 iron shorter .? losing speed but gaining strike ?
8 irons are shorter than 7's. Was the Stealth 8 the same length as the other 7 irons?
With different shafts how does this test really make sense ??
The 4th shot with the 70’s sounded like and was a bomb!!
Excellent comparison thank you
I have the stealth and my gapping is 15 yards which is a bit high
Good proof that static loft is only one variable in the equation.
Sounds like a kiwi accent under that twang?
A great video and it was very informative to
Was the stealth 8 iron the same length or shorter than the rest ?
Hi there. Please would you clarify. Are we being shown the standard deviation or range of the sample data with the “+/-“?
This matters.
Hi James! The +/- is the standard deviation
Good fun guys, I loved this one.
Almost every video I see comparing distance/game improvement irons to players irons show the same as far as dispersion. Higher spin players irons typically show less dispersion, not sure I’ve seen 1 that hasn’t proved this. Can certainly see the benefits of a game improvement iron in longer irons, but would stick with more spin on my approach irons.
I would be surprise to see if I slicer would slice more with a P770 than a Stealth?
this was a very nice video, thanks
The stealth iron is a great iron 👌
P7mc look great
Awesome video!
Great video
Hi guys, love the channel! Question, I am a 12 HC, 29 years old, and currently playing the 2019 TaylorMade M2s (they were what I could afford when I got more serious about golf in 2020). The rest of my bag is dialed and I love it. But given that the P790 could see a refresh this year, I am looking at the Stealth or the 2021 P790s (since they will go on sale). I don't have any concern about distance as I can adjust accordingly and play the Bridgestone B XS and have plenty of spin. My main concern is whether or not the P790s have enough forgiveness compares to the Stealth (or my current M2s). From 4-PW I have confidence stepping over the ball and rarely hit it offline, only misses are distance wise. My worry is that I'll get the P790s and it will uncover something that M2s were hiding, vs the Stealth I'm sure forgiveness is similar. Thoughts? Am I letting ego get in the way with the "game improvement" sector too much?
jmac_BTC, really excellent questions and a popular dilemna for golfers in your exact position. "Do I stick with the Larger Game Improvement iron that I like but don't love, or do I take a chance on something a little smaller that has the potential to look and feel better and give me more confidence?" Without knowing your specific tendencies with face contact, I personally would not hesitate recommending the P790's to a 12 HDCP. Truth is, it really comes down to your ballstriking more than just your average score. If you are consistently hitting less than 6 greens in regulation, you'll probably want the Stealth irons to see improvement in your score as they are a better comparable to what you are playing now. If you're gaining confidence in your irons, and want something with a little better profile I think you'd be smart to try a p790. Give our fitting team a call anytime to discuss further! 612-216-4152 ext. 2 or chat with us live on 2ndswing.com.
-James
go P790 or P770 100%
P770’s are money! Long and workable
Absolutely! one of the best performers in fittings
That was fun and very interesting. Does grip size make a difference?? Would love to see that tested. Also - time to take us on a shop tour including THE VAULT!
It help me with control. I prefer the larger grips and I have small hands
Grip has been tested. It has two effects; one is larger grips are heavier, thus can contribute to counterbalancing and the other is you may have a tendency to go right by about 1º for midsize, and 1º more for jumbo… and you'll quickly start correcting for that.
Please do the same with other brands in the same loft and then do a comparison of all the data (all brands)
I think you would get the same result...
@@glenburr6755 It would be interesting to compare all the brands and how their tech affects different aspects.
@@arthvader1 I was just thinking that every manufactures blade and small cavity back iron would spin more and fly shorter than their thin faced hollow or big cavity back models. But I would watch. 👍
Technology wins!
Yes, but 7 yards between the two extremes in the range! That's a tiny difference across that many clubs and that much difference in design.
@@jaywalk4446 yep, that's approximately 0.6 of a club differential longer.
Nice. Great test with noticeable differences between GI and blades. Stealth performed well but six degrees loft difference between 9 iron and PW and GW is way too much.
I play the P7MCs and absolutely love them. I'm also a 3.2 Handicap and fit my game very well
Thank you Drew and Thomas for sharing your results. Would you please also provide info about the shafts ?
Thank you so much!
Outstanding comparison. One other factor that wasn't mentioned and maybe yall could clarify is the fact that the stealth used was the 8 iron. So if the others were 7 irons want the 8 iron stealth a ¼ to ½ inch shorter? Thanks guys, the video was great.
Club head speed of all matches very well. In that case, club shaft length difference is already facted in.
In my opinion 5 shots per club by a human are not enough to get any type of conclusive data for this test. One semi poor strike would greatly skew the numbers. One simple explanation for the MB not performing as well was that he hit them first and was not as dialed in. By his own admission they were all going left. If he was hitting the shot slightly out of the toe, that would create a gear effect pushing the ball left and also producing a slightly lower ball speed. As he hits more balls, he starts striking them better and gets better performance. All I am saying is we need a lot more shots to draw any type of conclusion. Two yards of carry is not a statistical difference when you are talking about 5 shots, especially when a human is hitting the ball.
Hi JD and thanks for the feedback! We will include more shots in our testing going forward. Due to time constraints (and golfer fatigue, LOL) we likely cannot do much more than 10 per club in a test like this with five clubs. However, you're right in that it can be tough for real trends to emerge with 5 per club. We will increase that number moving forward when we film
Nice video but it completely missed the point of why players choose blades. Notice that the variation in distance was far more consistent with the blades. I don't want to suddenly hit my 6 iron 202 yards when I average 180. Distance control and consistency is highly important and its hardly ever even mentioned in these videos.
Great test. I need spin. I don’t like hitting partial shots from the ruff and watching the ball roll off the back of the green. So, as someone stated, technology wins, if you need it. That’s why TaylorMade, and every manufacturer, makes more than one iron head. You still to fit the player into the model their game needs. Nice job! ⛳️🏌🏽♂️
You’ll stop a ball from the rough faster with more descent angle than you will with spin, when hitting out of he rough your thought should be “how high can make this go” if you are trying to stop it faster.
@@jim60631 Thanks for the tip. With my game, I play a lot of partial shots, which I try to flight down. Just the way I play the game. I have tried playing irons like Titleist T-300 and Mizuno Hot Metals. I always get the same results, low spin shots that don't hold greens. Whether that's from early morning wet fairways, ruff, whatever. i don't like hitting a 3/4 shot high in the air and hope that landing angle will stop the ball.