The Grenfell Tower Fire
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can someone tell me if this is actually good??
A 15 minute video hastily put together omitting certain facts and getting others outright wrong does not seem in good taste when so many people died….
You forgot to add the fact that the aluminium in the ACM cladding also acted as an oxidiser to which accelerated the spread. Ours failed the original Building Research Establishment test, then passed when it was tested again by some miracle. 🤷♂
14:55 what do you mean by "white"? Are you trying to fuel tensions
@@jaz093that's exactly what he meant. You know Simon and his writers are quite liberal and will never fail to pull one of their cards 😂
Firefighters are truly some of the most courageous and selfless people in our society. From literally charging up the stairs of a burning building to rescue people they don't know to "smaller" things like when my elderly mother fell while i was far from home and they came and helped her up into her chair and made her a meal. Thankfully, the only thing hurt was her pride.
I'm sure someone has some firefighter horror stories out there, but no profession is 100% pure.
When I was fairly small, the dad of the house next door was a firefighter (and one door down, a policeman, and the other side of our house, a paramedic. We had the whole EMS on hand at our neighborhood barbecues! Lol.).
Like nursing and special education, going into emergency services is definitely a calling, it is NOT easy to get there and the pay is piddling compared to the danger many put themselves in. My hat’s off, I certainly couldn’t do a job like that day in and day out, but I’ve needed police, fire and ambulance all at least once in my life.
The cost of the original renovations around £8.5 to £9.2 million.
The cost of a sprinkler system in the hallways and stairs £200,000.
Sometimes the basic figures, can say more than a thousand words
@@charleschristner7123 It is infuriating how sprinklers were given as a suggestion prior to Grenfell
Grenfell was classified as a building not requiring sprinklers the truth is if the building didn't have cladding nobody would have died. How do I know? I work for the company that made the insulation and they didn't use it to the specs it was made for
The cost of making the exterior fire proof? About 20,000 pounds.
In my jurisdiction the cladding used would have required the use of non-combustible insulation underneath AND a 1m fire break every two floors (also non-combustible). IIRC the insulation used had a reaction to fire rating of D (in the applicable EN standard) which in my jurisdiction makes it only legal to use on buildings with fewer than 3 above ground floors or a evacuation height of less than 7 meters (~23ft).
it didn't need cladding anyway its just because all the rich people who moved to the area didn't like seeing the poor housing, I live in West London and detest what social cleansing has done, normal family homes that were 30k in the 80s are now over a million and the whole area is turning more crap by the year, full of rubbish, beggers on the streets and boarded up shops. seeing that thing on the horizon every day was very ominous and the stink of burning in the air for weeks, its just as ominous now its covered in a big sheet with a heart painted on it, while its getting increasingly hidden by "luxury apartment" sky scrapers being built around white city for foreign investors to buy and leave empty, they are are destroying the social housing estates one by one for the sake of "investment"from people who don't even live here and pushing londoners out of our own city, I read 67% of home owners in London now are foreign born, everyone I knew as a child has left and gone as far afield as wales and poland because they can't afford to live here. its so telling that none in the council have gone to prison for what they did, all because they can't stand the sight of poor people housing and think it lowers the tone of an area and thus property values.
This happened the first week I moved to London from America. I had gone to the IOW festival, then one of my flatmates and I got a room in the area near grenfell (our other flatmates in morden were going through a nasty breakup, so we gave them some space). Cause I had gone from america to a festival, where you stay up all night, my sleep schedule was still off. I went outside for a cig around 2 or 3am, and noticed a fire in the window of a building nearby. Having grown up in the woods, and survived 2 forest fires (the 3rd in 2020 finally took our whole property), I know fire. So that night I was just in shock… the building went up SO FAST, and there was no way that could happen without something very wrong in the building materials used. It was awful. You could see people’s phone lights in the windows, you could hear screams and people yelling to get out. But there was nothing you could do to help. We all just stood there watching people’s lives end in the most horrific manner. I send not just my “thoughts and prayers”, but my shared outrage at the cruel conditions forced onto the families of grenfell. I hope you get the justice you deserve!
@@thefreedommovement I had some porridge for breakfast.
@@heretic0001 neat!
damn.. must have been horrible to witness. Did people try to jump out the windows? A fall from 20 stories is survivable (more survivable than staying inside the building) in rare cases...
@@californianking5662 did any of them do any backflips?
@@californianking5662 I didn’t see anyone jump. I saw what looked like a baby go out a window on the right side from where I was looking, but it could have just been a large chunk of something falling off the building, and I didn’t see where it landed.
A minor edit is needed @ 1:11 where Simon says, "In the early hours of the 14th of June 2007, a quiet London neighbourhood was shaken by a tragedy that would forever alter its landscape and scar the community." The correct date is June 14, 2017.
I always look forward to the incredible videos Simon and his team create for this channel. Thank you so much!
This isn't America learn how to write the date the correct way round
@@GreatSageSunWukongmaybe learn how to read correctly. There is no onscreen text with the date. They are stating that Simon said the wrong year for the fires. It was in 2017 not 2007. Nothing to do with writing the date a certain way. Take your anger and stupidity elsewhere.
@@teganofford-is9rx I did read properly you said "The correct date is June 14, 2017" no its not thats American format, its day first then month, then year.
I was recently in London for vacation and drove past the tower. It's still wrapped in plastic which shocked me that the tower hadn't been taken down yet. I hope the families of those lost get the justice they deserve. Rest in peace those who were lost.
lots of people don’t want the tower taken down. they want it left as a reminder of the consequences of governmental inaction. at the moment it sort of acts as a memorial in of itself.
@@katemartin113good luck with that. I can’t even imagine how you would seal it up to ensure people aren’t climbing on it/ setting up shop in it. Interesting idea though.
There are plans for it to be removed however no design has been finalised as well the monument that would take its place.
If they take it down it’s only a matter of time before a new building is put up in its place…more than likely flats. But no one deserves to profit off greed like that, especially since that’s what killed all those people. To be clear, the space is in an expensive area but due to its past, is not going to sell for full price…it’s just profit
the building is sound, its solid concrete that was standing for decades before they covered it in crap to murder everyone inside and make it look nicer to rich people living nearby while ignoring the electrical issues that had plagued it for years, its surrounded by sister towers and other lower estate buildings it would be very hard to knock it down without causing a disturbance to the other buildings and no doubt the council would love to knock it all down and push all the poor people out so they can sell the land for all the luxury apartment crap thats springing up all around white city since Westfield was built or sell the land to the endlessly expanding UCL
This happened in 2017, not 2007.
Time Traveller
Oops.
Oops
Another to add to the 'FactBoi Done A Silly' file.
He's a busy man. Everyone makes an oopsie.
You'd think that it would be MANDATORY for apartment building to have sprinklers installed in EVERY unit
Its not even now its not still, its regulatory to have a fire alarm system installed though but that's about it really and well I don't know about extinguishers, see it depends on the place.
As far as mine experience, knowledge goes fire activ countermeasures like sprinklers, fire extinguishers are not required, nor recommended on any residential property, but I will say it will be a common sense to have at least 1 in kitchen area if you living in such "fraying cage apartment " on multistorey building..@@jeremysmith54565
The UK Building Regs for fire are quite prescriptive and include regulations around escape routes, fire extinguisher provision, "protected" routes, fire proof doors and walls, maximum open spaces, when provision for Rising Mains (Essentially a dedicated water main for fire fighters) should be made, etc. And there are regulations about when sprinklers should be used, generally associated with the construction material of the structure.
The problem is not every building can have sprinkler systems due to available space within the building, the age of the building structure (Water is heavy, and sprinklers chuck out a LOT), the local infrastructure (Such as water pressure, system capacity). It's also the case that not every sprinkler system is the same so what is required in a tower like Grenfell would differ from a concert hall, which would differ from a Victorian-era building, which would differ from a sky-scraper. It's why a passive system of containment and resistance has been favoured.
If mandatory regulations for sprinklers would put in place, those regs would need to be set out in such a way that 1. they can be flexible across all building types, but 2. not easy to abuse and circumvent. So it's not as simple as "Every apartment building must have a system". Getting the Building Regulations changed is, by design, not simple to ensure they themselves can't be abused, so a huge change like mandatory sprinklers is slow to implement.
And Grenfell is an example of how regulations can be side-stepped; the panels that were installed were stated by the manufacturer as NOT to be used on the spaced mounting system they were put on, because of their combustibility (The selling point was them being cheap and light) and the chimney effect it would create, and the Fire Regs also state the materials the panels were made with shouldn't be mounted above certain heights (Essentially the height a fire fighters rig can reach) but because literally everyone involved in the refurbishment, including the local Council, just ignored it or declared it not their problem, we ended up where we are.
The most infuriating thing is Grenfell's design *should* have been perfectly adequate, but a series of "not my problem"s, f**k ups, incompetency, complacency and lack of responsibility caused this tragedy.
@@deaks25 its why with some old victorian prisons its a problem with them having toilets (or it was) in each of the cells, as 'slopping out' as its called is just horrible according to a former female govenor of a prison. Obviously thats from an entirely different subject though and nothing to do with fire prevention (victorian buildings in general).
Only in buildings occupied by the rich.
I highly suggest watching Plainly Difficult's video on this. He going in depth of the building and what actually happened and why. Between both these videos gives every side to this story. Very well made
It’s too little, too late now, but that building and heaven knows how many others should probably never have been given consent. I’m a career firefighter, and former specialist fire investigator with 33 years on the job and what I can say with some confidence is this: If that building had been equipped with sprinklers, drenchers (sprinklers on the outside of the building), and an alternative means of escape, the fire, most likely would’ve been contained to the unit of origin and no one would’ve died. This is a classic case of corporate greed meeting bureaucratic incompetence at the expense of society’s most vulnerable.
It’s not rocket science.
I am personally baffled that the architect sat in the hearings and said "I didn't know anything about fire protections for such a building and I didn't educate myself." (paraphrased) - I went to a civil engineering technical high school (in a different jurisdiction). I was taught as the age of 16/17 where I can go and look up the requirements regarding fire protection ... it is pretty clear as long as you can read. And yeah, since at least 2007 my jurisdiction required either a sprinkler/drencher system capable of limiting the spread of the fire OR a 1.2m (~4ft) of a fire break on every floor made from a non-combustible material capable of withstanding the fire for at least 90 minutes.
Well, I understand they saved ten thousand pounds by using the flammable version instead of the non-flammable version. As soon as I saw the picture of the tower on fire it was obviously a cladding fire, just like the Marina Torch fire in Dubai. I have no idea how this material was approved by the building inspectors in a Western country. "Rocket fuel kitchen flooring? Where do I sign the approval?"
One big issue was a gap between the cladding and the wall, the fire went up that. So drenchers on the outside wouldn't have helped much. Also, the main gas pipe went up the stairwell. Gaps between apartments where pipes and electricals went were meant to be sealed and weren't.
No-one in the refurbishment project cared about fire safety.
so what do you think of all the new builds going up with a central lift/stair block and 30+ stories high? personally I'd never live in a new build. I grew up in a council place built in the 70s that had asbestos in the floors and ceilings, upstairs had their kitchen get completely burnt out and it didn't affect either the upper or lower floors at all.
I thought it was that the building was fine but the 'renovation' that installed the thermite insulation was the cause?
Being trapped in a burning tower is my worst fear, I live in a building with sprinklers but I'm always thinking of what do do in a worst case scenario. Throw anything combustible out of my place onto the courtyard below? Throw my mattresses down there, inflate all my pool floaties, tie them to myself and jump, aiming for the mattresses? Soak every blanket and other piece of fabric I own into a giant wet pile and crawl into the middle of it? This is the kinda stuff that keeps me up at night
I refuse to live anywhere higher than the 3rd floor for that reason. What if help *can't* get to me in time? Am I going to rely 100% on being rescued? I don't think so.
you can buy a fall arrestor.
@@celticlass8573well realistically it’s super super super rare. And honestly just trust your gut if things look bad leave
@@michaelf.2449 True, though why make your chances of survival less, if you can do anything to mitigate it, right?
@@michaelf.2449 by the time things look bad it's often too late
Many people forced into tower blocks as an alternative to homelessness predicted Grenfell before it happened. I was one og them. Many of them are used as temprary accommodation while people wait years for a permanent home, being let down by unsympathetic councils. You know as soon as you walk into a block of flats that you're entering a potential fire tube. But when there's no alternative shelter, you have no choice but to hope nothing happens. Having disabilities, had I been higher than the first floor & a fire broke out, there was no way I would get out without help, as the lifts automatically shut off for safety reasons. I know there were people on higher floors who would never get out if a fire broke out.
People were warning of this happening years before it happened at Grenfell, but the people in power refused to listen. What's worse is that since Grenfell nobody has done anything to prevent it happening again. It's sick & messed up.
Sadly, this isn't the only time this has happened around the world. The town I grew up in , in Canada, had a similar incident in a low income building. The fire started on the top floor and spread into the attic within 20 minutes. Despite compartmentalized apartments, the fire roared through the open attic, across the roof and down through the ceilings of the top apartments. Blessedly, nobody died but many of the poorest in town were left homeless ☹️
If your talking bout 200 Wellesley st, like 8 ppl died, it’s still up and a bunch of my friends live their
I live in London and remember this well. The cladding itself was a cost-cutting measure made by the council (? - might've been the construction company who did the renovations, I don't fully recall) and from what I remember it wasn't to code so was technically illegal for it to have been used. Nobody has ever been held responsible for this decision and every time I talk about it to anyone, they're pissed off about it.
I think it was a little more complex in that part of it was to code but not once it was stuck to the other bit, or not in the way it was used. It was the construction company that were at fault for saying it was fine and for the way it was installed. The council didn't have the necessary technical expertise.
This reminds me of a fire that happened in Bucharest in a club. The club was basically a basement in an old building with only one small door. No proper fire exits and safety. It was allowed to function due to bribes and corruption and so many people died, some died later in the hospitals due to poor hygiene standards and carelessness from medical staff. I would like to watch an episode on this incident!
"Eye wateringly high prices" Thank you, Simon, for adding this phrase to my vocabulary! I'll have to use it, next time I go to the grocery store.
Also, you've just described every major city. There's the good parts, the touristy areas, and the crappy parts.
London is divided into boroughs. Kensington and Chelsea is one of those boroughs, just like Westminster is a borough. Some of the wealthiest people in the country live in Kensington and Chelsea and the houses of the wealthy might be on the same road as a council estate where poor, middle class and working class people all live together in apartment buildings. They live almost cheek by jowl in London, much more so than I have ever seen in any American city.
I lived in high rise in Portsmouth and several small fires broke out. No sprinklers or extinguishers. Gas pipe in stairwells. Council is supposed to give details to fire brigade re vulnerable n disabled tenants but hasn't for far too long. Every time there was an incident I had to call fire brigade n tell them who on two top floors need help to evacuate. I soon moved out. Cladding is STILL on homes in Portsmouth n not been removed n dealt with so tenants naturally worried. When the shite hits the fan we are on our own. The council n government etc won't help us.
its not just councils, a friend of a friend lives in a block built about 15 years ago with shiny multicoloured cladding tiles on the outside, her mortgage is 1,700 a month on the dump and the owners won't tell them what the cladding is made from they have been asking since grenfell all the residents are worried and don't trust the building owners at all, they either don't know or do and its bad.
@@GreatSageSunWukong oh I know, there's many still being built with dubious materials. Money talks louder than safety sadly. Welcome to the UK in 2024!
@@englishmadcow7461 Yep this country is going to the dogs. tofu dreg buildings, the youngest building I've ever lived in was built in the 1970s and frankly I would never trust anything built after the 90s enough to live in one.
I remember this, I was working at American Red Cross at the time and our disaster Volunteers were asking if they could fly over to help. Sadly we couldn't send them in a timely way, but we did raise thousands of relief funds locally that were sent to the British Red Cross to help pay for hotels and medical equipment. I remember talking about what we can add to our current fire prevention program to help prevent this in the US. Sadly we are unable to influence public policy enough right now to accomplish much. But we've installed millions of smoke alarms in homes nation wide and educated families during the installations. Haven't been able to get into apartment buildings like this though. We will keep trying.
Don't let the man tell you to "stay put" when you should run like hell.
@@FlyWithFitz81 nobody forced them to live there?
@@heretic0001 This is one of the most brain dead comments I've read. When you're poor, you don't get many options on where you can live. Most people didn't have much choice when it came to living there. They lived there because it was what they could afford.
@@l3ete1geuse if you say so.
@@l3ete1geuse Some people take their options for granted. Being poor in London is a lot like a prison.
@@heretic0001 I do say so.
I spent over a year driving past that scared remain on my way to and from work. I'm a strong man but every time I see it my emotions overwhelm me you can feel the suffering of those who didn't survive every time you set eyes on it.. having spent years as a contractor for plumbing and heating for many housing associations and local authorities across the capital I find it hard to come to terms with peoples who homes I attended to carry out repairs perished in the worst way possible. Across the road from Grenfell you have some of the most expensive properties in London I can guarantee if a similar event happened less than 100 meters away not a single life would have been lost. Just to be clear I'm not blaming the fire service I can't imagine how hard their job must be. Rip Grenfell
I saw the smoke coming over the horizon, from my bathroom windows. It was June 2017. I cannot forget what I saw. I live in the London Borough of Brent. 😔
The fact that The Queen felt the need to speak up spoke volumes
It is impossible to underestimate how gruelling this incident was for the fire brigade members. Each breathing apparatus is only going to last between roughly 30-50 minutes depending on the model. And then having to climb 20+ floors through the stairwell with about 40 kilos of kit on you (air pack, hoses, nozzle, breaching tools, thermal camera, radio, rope bag, escape hoods, etc). Just imagine donning the thickest winter clothes you own and then running up to the 20th floor having to carry a sack of concrete with you. That’ll give you an idea. And the actual work only starts *after* you are done climbing the stairs. Oh and if you find an injured person you need to help carry them out, meaning you might be carrying another bag of concrete worth of weight on your way out at least part of the way. Once you are back out, you are beyond spent. You will have lost several litres of water through sweating. You will want to sit down. Every muscle in your legs and arms is going to be screaming. Your turnout gear will be soaking wet from sweat and you probably have steam rising off of you. Your ears will be ringing because the fire alarm and the smoke detectors are still blaring. And the low pressure warning on your air pack is probably also wailing. Your throat will be sore from a mixture of having to yell through your mask all the time over the racket inside the building and breathing the bone dry air coming from the tank. And then you feel two comrades pulling the gloves off your hands. You get to put on disposable gloves. They are hard to get into because your hands are wet. Next you feel someone lifting the air pack off your shoulders and taking your helmet off. You still have your mask and flash hood on. You open the jacket and feel cold, even though it might be 25 C outside. You finally take off your flash hood and mask. Someone hands you a bottle of water and you can finally sit down. One of your mates comes along and asks if you’re alright, patting you on the back. You nod and give a thumbs up. The sort of rush you feel is indescribable unless you have experienced it yourself.
And all that is just the physical side of things.
I lived not too far from the area and often took the bus passing almost by the flat. For months after you would see loads of "missing person" posters at bus stops and you just knew these were the faces of people killed in the fire, it was heartbreaking
I for one love that Simon is not afraid to call out the failures and inequities present, unlike most media, he tells the story without filtering out and sweeping aside the rich and powerful who are at fault
and offered exactly zero evidence of owners not following the laws or fire codes. If the codes were lax, it affected all buildings, rich or poor.
But that doesn't fit Simon's narrative.
His attempt at generating sympathy for economic migrants mooching off public housing falls on deaf ears...justifiably
I hope whoever approved the foam insulation for use in this project knows what happened.
Bold of you to assume that the responsible party cares
There’s been no reparations or real accountability. They know it’s the cladding but have done little about it. A lot of the families still don’t have homes.
It wasn't the foam insulation per se. It was a combo of multiple things.
The way the cladding was installed was incorrect, the foam shouldn't have been used with those panels, those panels shouldn't have been used that high up, the windows were of the wrong type, the materials shouldn't have overlapped compartments etc.
Nope...The council, the developers, the providers of the insulation, the manufacturers of the insulation and the testers of the insulation all blame each other....😡😡😡😡☠☠☠☠☠
I remember hearing about that fire on the New York TV stations. It was covered for 2 days and then the only way to get info was on the computer.
There is an epidemic of that flammable cladding installed in Victoria, Australia. Being of an engineering background I have looked into the problems and IMO it stems from cost-cutting and willful ignorance. The manufacturers of the composite panels clearly indicate what grade of panel is suitable for over 3 story building use and these directions were simply ignored by the installers. The fireproof panels are more expensive and not as easy to obtain. The blocks here are not all social housing, most are personal residences in expensive prestige areas, but the residents are still unable to afford to easily pay for the remediation.
We narrowly escaped a similar, smaller block, fire here in Melbourne when a cigarette butt flicked off a balcony ignited the cladding on the outside of a building near a bridge. Fortunately the Fire Brigade were able to park on the bridge to extinguish the blaze as it spread up the side of the building as without the bridge they would not have the height to have extinguished it.
What it seems overall is a lack of professional accountability. You installed it, you are responsible. But these days there are so many layers of sub-contracting and tendering that it becomes impossible to determine who made the fatal choice to not use the fireproof cladding or who failed to check the delivery was as ordered. Everyone points fingers to everyone else, but, somewhere, someone made a decision that killed 70 people and traumatized a neighborhood. Someone failed to read the product guides, or order the expensive panels or check that the product ordered had been delivered or inspect the work and ensure it met with regulation and the manufacturers guidelines.
It's like a version of the bystander effect. Everyone thinks that someone else will take action and in the meantime a lady drowns in a foot of water. In this case, everyone thinks someone else made the right decisions and they are just following work orders.
Another Fire in London is worth a video. The Kings Cross tube station fire was horrendous and there are many stories of heroism. The reason it was so deadly and the investigation into the fire is fascinating and heartbreaking. More people should know about it and your the man to do it. Thank you and your team for the amazing work you do.
I saw the Seconds from Disaster episode on that one. Terrifying!
I think Plainly Difficult or Fascinating Horror did an episode on that. They're both good at explanations of how things happen rather than being sensationalist.
fire safety tests on materials are often flawed. In Canada, the original tests for firerating of styrofoam material was to torch them in the flat positon, when in reality, most stryrofoam is mounted vertically on walls. On the flat, the panels perform well, on the vertical, they quickly turn into an inferno. Obviously, the testing procedure changed.
I don't understand what it was in the kitchen where the fire started would be so flammable as to allow the fire to completely engulf that kitchen in such a short time. I have a feeling that, perhaps, the very materials used for the installations in the kitchen were highly flammable. Which, disturbingly, suggests that it was not just the cladding that contributed to the fire's incredibly quick spread. What a terrible tragedy! RIP to all those who perished in this disaster.
My thinking too. I lived in a fairly run down low income apartment for most of my teen years and my early 20’s- and I came home from school one day to find the building super mopping up a heap of water damage in our hallway and the building smelling of smoke. Our next door neighbours had accidentally left a deep fryer on, fallen asleep and set their kitchen on fire (since our apartments opened straight up into a galley kitchen and a small hallway, apparently he got out by climbing out the bedroom window and down the bricks. Luckily we were only on the second storey so it wasn’t far to go). Their kitchen and part of their living room was absolutely ruined, it was charred black and only the stove and sink was still recognizable in the kitchen. He didn’t wake up until the fire had fully taken over the kitchen and all the smoke alarms started going off in the hallway and their own unit, he couldn’t have done anything to fight it before firefighters arrived.
And yet, in this old 1970’s thin-walled building, we didn’t have a lick of damage to our own unit except for it smelling of smoke. How the hell did a modern building with supposedly much better safety tech and engineering have that happen *any* other way than “We actually didn’t check that ANYTHING was safe to use for fireproofing”? 🤬
It was a faulty fridge, there's been a few of that model catch fire. It wasn't that the kitchen went up that quick, the fridge was next to the window. So as soon as the flames were getting out of the window they were touching the back of the flammable cladding and going up the gap behind it. The fire had probably gone up a few stories before the rest of the apartment was on fire.
Yes that's correct. Later investigation found the fridge was not installed with enough fire safe material between it and the oven next to it. It was one of many building defects which made this happen when it didn't need to
I the intro you say 2007, but it was actually 2017!
Oops.
Oops
I was confused as well, because he said the renovations took place between 2014-2017, so i had to rewind to the intro, which said 2007.
A perfect example of greed and complacency killing people who had no say in any of it
I can already hear the baseless argument - "well they didn't HAVE to live there!"
@@nadapenny8592 Aye, except being affordable housing, they most likely did
@@theteenspirit if the council offers you a home and you refuse it they kick you off the housing list, you have to take what you are offered, my parents were socially clensed from my family home an estate built in the 1970s that was perfectly fine and solid, thats since been knocked down and the land sold off for luxury flats which look terrible, the council made them move to a small house built in the 1920s that has rising damp, old gaslights sticking out the walls, a badly repaired hole in the kitchen celing that water comes thru if you use the bath but then thats not an issue as the only hot water in the house comes from the electric shower, the boiler has never worked and council workers can't seem to figure out why, it also has alarming cracks running up the walls and in summer masses of ants come up thru the floorboards around the door frames. in other words its a dump because the council think the tenants are scum but if you don't take it you get kicked off the housing list and barred for a set period for refusing a offer of a property. and thats a labour council in london by the way so I expect worse now they are in power of the country again.
Whelp .. 7 years on and it's still standing as a grim reminder of an entirely preventable, utterly inexcusable tragedy ... but they've put a great big green heart on it.
So that makes it all *ABSOLUTELY FINE...*
Thankyou guys for covering this
I appreciate you guys bringing this to attention for those who may not have known. Strong writing, strong delivery.
Justice for the 72.
I could see the smoke from where i live. It was horrible how many people lost their lives that day. And how many are still impacted
This is some of the reasons why the building sector and social housing sector is some of the most regulated areas in my country after taxes.
Fire Safety regulations were very strict. These had been put in place after a similar horrific disaster in 1973 ...The Summerland Fire On the Isle of Man. However since then rules and regulations had been watered down, obfuscated and compromised. This had benefited developers and authorities at the expense of safety. Ultimately the Grenfell disaster happened....Luckily "only " 72 people died, it could have been much much worse. 😢😢😢😢😢
When there is fire and the "experts" say to stay in place, you know you do the exact opposite
Grenfell was an incident that could’ve been avoided, the pennypinchers had other ideas
And this stuff is a ticking time bomb yet is still on many residential buildings to this day.
This is why I bought a condo on the 3rd floor in n a building made out of concrete. Windows in each room. I can hang and drop and it’ll break a few things but I won’t have to experience this horror. Unbelievable.
Investigate fire escape units. They’re pricey but you can buy evacuation equipment for personal use. I looked into it after this for my friend who lives in an apartment. I’m in Australia but I’m sure there’ll be something in most countries.
It's that Monty Python 'Architects Sketch' come to life...
Maybe a decade ago, an adjoining pair of apartment building in our downtown was destroyed by a resident who'd accidentally set fire to a chair and in a panic tried to shove said chair out his door. This had the effect of spreading the fire to the rest of the buildings. He was one of the many residents killed in the conflagration.
Our late brother had lived the back in the early '90s. Used to have a brick and a chunk of the stonework from the building. Don't have them anymore.
I spent my teen years living in a fairly scuzzy apartment building in a low class neighborhood. But even though most of our fellow tenants were on benefits or working class at best, the kind of people who would rarely get housing up to code and not rundown, the building had TWO fireproof staircases (one per side) to enter/exit from, and heavy fire doors to access the stairwells. That’s the legal minimum required for any apartment building over two stories in Canada (or a fire escape for the second, but those are only still a thing in old buildings). We also needed them- we had one unit burn in a kitchen fire and several times we had people who were drunk or homeless sneak into our building and light fires in one of the stairwells in the middle of the night, so if anyone went to get out after the alarm tripped, finding a stairwell full of smoke meant you took the other one at the other side of the building and got out safe and quick.
As such, I was HORRIFIED to find out that high rises in the UK don’t have two stairways as a safety standard. We only lived on the second floor, so in a dire emergency we could have gotten out through the windows, but the thought that I could have lived in a building that would trap you in a fire and might have never been able to do that simple act of running down the other set of stairs when I smelled smoke (and there was never a panicked rush, everyone got out quickly but safely down the stairs) when the fire alarm went off in the middle of the night and get outside safely in moments, made me feel physically sick. And our building was put up in the 1970’s!
That Stay Put policy made me scream the moment I heard it. Here in Australia we're taught regarding bushfires that you leave early or you're on your own because after you take too long to leave then you WILL die. It would have taken zero to no more effort for the emergency services to just call the residents and evacuate level by level. ALWAYS. ALWAYS GET OUT. Don't rush, don't push, wet a piece of cloth and cover your face and go slowly to avoid a human crush but ALWAYS leave.
And that burnt out monolith is still there, a testament to the greed in this country
It's so sad, that Grenfell Tower is gone. I can't believe that 72 people were trapped inside and killed. The people blamed the government for cladding in the building. God bless those victims who were killed and didn't make it.
And the victims who did, but will be traumatized for a very long time because of it.
I'm from outside of London but I remember that night and the morning after vividly. I think you ended this perfectly, Simon. Grenfell was one of the most brutal allegories of the wealth gap where a fire of this magnitude or a death toll in the dozens would most likely not have happened in an affluent area of London.
On the subject of fires exacerbated by improper fire safety procedures and the use of inflammable materials, have you considered a video of the Summerland disaster?
I was booked to check the 4 water storage tanks on top of tower the day after the fire... Still haunts me.
(note, I'd be up there if the fire hadn't happened)
@@KhaiJbach would’ve been a waste of a day’s labour for nothing, I know what you mean
I’m a massive liberal in the classic, personal freedoms, personal responsibilities sense, particularly by UK standards, but even I am outraged by the continued lack of action - from start to finish - by government or private sources across the country, both during and after the fire.
The basic standards we set for our homes, the ‘right’ to safe and secure housing is surely a fundamental principle of basic rights, and that includes not cramming the poor into crumbling half a century or longer old tower blocks that were not built to last longer than a few decades, apparently, then fumbling the hall constantly in how those buildings are made cheap and safe to live in.
When these things happen, I always think “If someone drunk drives and ends up killing someone in an accident, they are immediately arrested and face decades in prison for manslaughter. If someone cuts corners to save some money, resulting in unsafe conditions that result in scores of deaths… they may face a year or two in prison, or a monetary fine… if they live long enough for the case to be brought.” That’s where the biggest social/economic divide is apparent. Cause until they face the speed and harshness of justice the rest of us are held to, they wont stop risking the lives of others just to save some more money they don’t need.
Well said, 👍
Just for the record, in the UK, drivers virtually never get a manslaughter charge, the maximum for causing death by dangerous driving is 10 years and virtually never given.
@@nlwilson4892 yeah, I was talking from an American perspective, where we still have people serving life sentences over drug possession
Ooh, Simon is feeling spicy today! Talk about a call out in the end. 😂
The rich owners surrounding the tower have teams of high-priced lawyers trying to sue the council and city concurrently, to have it pulled down as an eyesore. That speaks volumes. Leave it standing as an epitaph without the shroud. Some in that expensive area bear the guilt for its spectacular demise. Let them see the evidence of their work daily. Maybe then, things will change. But don't hold your breath.
It is unfathomable to me how someone could be advised to stay in their homes during a building fire... eveything I've ever been taught has emphasized evacuating the area immidiately
The idea is that it would be safer for people to stay in their homes as the fire doors should significantly reduce the speed at which the fire spreads. By staying in the apartment with the fire doors closed, the risk of the fire and smoke reaching you is reduced. However, in the case of the grenfell fire, the fire spread up the outside of the building due to the cladding, as opposed to the conventional idea of a building fire spreading within the building.
It was a sensible idea originally, but the advice to stay put should have been rescinded much sooner once it was evident that the fire was out of control
The Valencia apartment block fire from February this year was similar to Glenfell. Something burned on the facade. Investigations are still ongoing.
You could cover the Ahrtal flooding in Germany at 2021 with 134 fatalities. There were slow decisions (Better not warn the people, they could panic!), data on fast rising water levels that were not believed, confusion of competences (a mayor wanted to evacuate her town but was not allowed to because it was not her competency), warning systems didn't work, a politician laughing when the German president held a speech at the desaster site. Even at this day there are people who still live in temporary shelters.
People were so angry, and in January 2024 there was another big flood in North Germany and in June 2024 in Southern Germany the next. I think we have to get used to it.
“London has shops where you can buy overpriced art. Or you can get it from today’s sponsor, Masterworks.”
Wasn't just Londoners that watched in horror. I remember it well. Absolutely terrible and the official response wasn't great afterwards either
The sad thing is, I suspect there will never be any one person or group that can be prosecuted, because literally everyone is at fault.
The makers of the cladding panels didn't ensure the product was being used in accordance with their guidelines, the installer didn't check they were installing a product that was fit for purpose, the designers didn't ensure/ignored if the product was appropriate, the building managers didn't check the panels were safe to be fitted to the building, the local Council didn't review the proposals before signing off on it all, the fire safety officer didn't question whether the panels (and the refurb in general) was to a sufficient standard, and that's before you get into the bureaucratic problems that have come with reduced resources within Councils such as Building Regs and Fire Safety Inspectors (Which have all but been abolished) in favour of a self-certification system.
There isn't one company or individual who can be found at fault or guilty of negligence, because literally everyone involved is equally guilty, and is one of the reasons why the various inquiries have taken so long; everyone is pointing fingers at everyone else.
The worst part is, the construction industry warned Government that saving money by reducing official oversight in the form of Council and Government inspectors would cause problems, a prediction that has sadly come very true, with Grenfell being the most tragic and public.
I work in building design and Grenfell was the first time in my professional life that I was ashamed of the career I chose. I had zero involvement in Grenfell, but there was also an element of Guilty By Association, because I can very easily see how it came to pass that those panels were on the building.
I agree with everything else. It's not the manufacturers responsibility to ensure a product is used in accordance with guidelines. Answer questions and advise on a qualified inspector sure.
But, everyone else along the way is indeed responsible for not asking the right questions. Engineers, Site Managers, Project Managers, Installers and Logistics/Procurement people.
@@stuartlaird7341 I've assumed the manufacturer was involved in the design process, given the size of the project, but if not your point is fair.
@@deaks25 Its a stock product. There are typically 3 grades. One fire resistant for single story, one fire retardant for up to 3 and then one non-combustible for high rise.
IIRC Grenfell had foam PU core fire resistant when it should have had foamed aluminium non-combustible.
My father was a chartered building surveyor. He knew it was the cladding before full investigations had been conducted
Why didn’t he say anything then?
@@heretic0001 "Before full investigations had been conducted". Meaning the building already burned.
I've studied physics. You could see it was something attatched to the building causing a chimney effect. It was heatbreaking.
I'm not a surveyor and I could tell it was the cladding by simply watching the video as well. It was so obvious it was spreading on the outside, and following something.
Londoner here who was born, grew up in and now again live in a similar tower block here (albeit one with far less cladding and now improved fire safety bc of Grenfell) - Watching that happen was one of the most shocking things I've ever seen. Hit me as much, if not more, than some of the terrorism we've had in London. I had nightmares growing up about fires in the block causing something like that. That night bought those nightmares back. It's not a tragedy, it was an avoidable disaster. It's also a crime scene and the developers & 'safety inspectors' need to go to prison. Highly doubtful they ever will though. The building also needs to come down - brick by brick if needed and a memorial built on its site.
Finally, I wish this vid had focused a little more at the end about the political response - the local Conservative council only exist to serve the rich parts of the area and their earlier lack of care and interest in social housing issues was exposed when people started looking into their council records. They had to be forced multiple times afterwards to speed up their response after it happened. The Conservative government also pretended to care but in reality did the bare minimum in response - inc excluding social housing tenants from a later Renters Reform Bill, which even then they never actually bought to a vote because too many of their own MPs & cronies are landlords who fought against it. One government minister a few years later even disgracefully victim blamed, saying in an interview that the people that died should've 'used some common sense' and got out of the building. They actively hate poor people - as shown by their 14 years of economic policies (mentioned by Simon). Thankfully we've got a week until the general election here and it looks like the Conservatives are going to lose 75% of their seats. So we'll very likely have a new government that might actually do something.
This was incredibly sad. I remember when it was on the news and all I could think about was the people jumping from the towers after 9/11.
Beard got trimmed. Manscaped read would be more appropriate.
That's.....not what Manscaped is for dude.
@@Tactical_Hotdog he must learn
@@Tactical_Hotdog they do also make beard products...
I randomly felt like searching this up and you’ve made a video 7 hours ago
After the South tower on 9/11 & Grenfell I’m evacuating as soon as possible. I’m legally blind and I won’t live above the 6th floor. If I were to work in a high rise I’d evacuate immediately. It’s “comforting “ to think that firefighters will come and help me but I’ll count upon myself.
In lower floors you might also be in danger. At the Ahrtal flooding in Germany 2021 with 134 fatalities people waited to be rescued, but the flood was so big, so fast, and streets were washed away, firefighters couldn't reach everyone. They had to prioretize, evacuate hospitals first, having not enough resssources for a disaster of this magnitude, with also destroyed fire department stations and trucks/cars.
One woman waited for evacuation, but when nobody came, she went to bed in her first floor apartment and drowned. Well, if the water reaches the ceiling in the basement and the street is a raging torrent, I'd never ever go to bed. I would run, or if it is no longer possible, I would climb upon the roof or ask neighbours on higher floors to let me in.
Yes, think for yourself. Watch the circumstances, know the danger points. Think of worst case scenarios.
It was not in 2007 at all. It was in 2017.
Working for animal rescue and being told people don't want to buy pet carriers because it's unnecessary expense and they don't need them... You do... Have you seen these residents carrying freaked out cats in laundry baskets because they didn't have something so essential as a secure carrier?
you might be the most productive person on youtube😅 seriously goals for me
This is another example of why people need to stop government dependence! Self sufficiency and hard/smart work to support yourself and family.
I remember watching this fire on the TV. My stomach still churns now as much as it did on the day.
Videos like this, the NYC apartment fire, and the Triangle Shirt Factory fire are absolute nightmare fuel. Thank goodness for improved fire security!
Based on the lack of proper fire safety standards in the building, I'm gonna assume the residents were not supplied with residential fire extinguishers either. A 2kg single use ABC dry powder extinguisher costs about £15-£17 ($20 USD) and an ABCK is about £20 ($25 USD). The only difference between the two is an ABCK is also rated for kitchen grease fires. At standard retail price, the cost to supply all 120 flats with ABC extinguishers would cost around £2,100 ($2,700 USD) or ABCK extinguishers for £2,400 ($3,100 USD). It would cost even less if buying in bulk.
If the building owner(s) had just invested the £2,400 up front, it could have possibly prevented this entire tragedy, and stopped the fire at the origin point before it at the chance to spread. Instead, it cost many people their lives and did around £1.2 Billion ($1.56 Billion USD) in damages. This is why I keep a 2kg ABCK extinguisher in my kitchen, that I paid $25 for, and they only need replaced every 10 years. Seems like a good investment over my $180k home with thousands of dollars worth of personal items going up in smoke.
My childhood home burned down and I'm not too keen on having this one burn down as well. I've instructed my children on how to use it if my wife and I aren't home and they understood the instructions no problem. Especially since there's picture instructions on the side. A little extra effort put into safety goes a long way. The building owner(s) may not care about the residents but I'm sure they cried crocodile tears when they took that hit to their bottom dollar.
The podcast Well There's Your Problem did an excellent episode on this.
We were once known as a nation for fire safety.
we all know it was the council cheaping out
The footage from the back of an appliance was interesting.. They were joking about someone fking up when word came thru it was occupied.. Suddenly everyone's very serious and they put the foot all the way down on the pedal..
I can't believe that Grenfel Tower is still standing 7 YEARS later, it should be removed brick by brick ASAP, those poor people having to look at it on a daily basis, it would drive me crazy, those poor souls that lost their lives in that fire that night, I remember watching it on TV.!, just AWFUL.!
If its safe to do so just refurbish it and give the victims a new home for free if they want it. idk
No one will live in a refurbished chimney@@clownavenger0
Please please please read the book by the journalist who covered and followed this for many years before and after ‘show me the bodies’. It could start a revolution if more people learnt about it all
One reason an investigation likes this takes so much time is BECAUSE it i the government that is being investigated. Yes, results might happen quicker in a more affluent area, but that is because government can blame someone else.
*sips tea* bloody hell
Stay put? Never heard of it. 😅 Gold fuxkin luck. I'd there's a fire. I'm out
I remember doing a current event report on this when it happened. It wild learning how the cladding was the problem
I heard of this event years ago. Over here in America the information we recieved misled some of us into believing that the building was restored and reopened.
I guess not, if ever at all.
Terriblee event.
You should cover the Stardust disaster in Ireland
This has the chilling air of it could happen anywhere
When business men have the opportunity to save money by shortcuts, they usually will.
Paramount safety costs money. Gaslighting you is free.
Risking the life of 300 strangers is worth it, if you can buy a 2nd house in paradise.
They were *poor* strangers. No more worth than the black under the nails of the rich.
I worked for a European glazing system company, our products were too high a standard for the UK, we had to make them to a lower standard just for the UK. In Germany and France this would not be allowed. Not saying they were unsafe, just that the UK had lower standards.
I didn't know that the building is still standing 7 years later.
The cladding could probably have been gun cotton and magnesium and not killed anybody if the windows hadn't been pvc and plexiglass. Fire code doesn't allow for pvc and plexiglass windows the same as it doesn't allow for wicker doors and hessian wall panels.
To be fair, most of the windows were open that night as the weather was hot. Although, it might have helped to some extent once people had awoken if the fire hadn't actually got in to their apartment.
So sad. So tragic. RIP poir lost souls. 💔
Another great video! Thanks!
I remember that day, I was off sick from school and I woke up to news of this and I had nightmares for weeks
Find out how high the tallest fire truck ladder is in your town. Don’t live on any floor higher than that.
When you are documenting a disaster as major as Grenfell, you could have, at the very least, the courtesy to get the dates correct.
This one gave me chills. So sad.
Corporate greed, there, end of video.
I always see Grenfell tower every time i go to Westfield
You should cover the surfside condo collapse
The horrendous Joelma Tower fire Sao Paulo 1974 saw people jumping out of windows.
Ah-Gawd. That's all I can rhink to say, right now. Oh yes, and the Horror. The Horror
And it's a rich, very rich Council. If they could get away with refurbishment AND THEN SALE??? They'd do it in a heartbeat. It would have to be council flats only. Not worth their budget. 3m on an Art's fairs. Now that would touch the fuse. It's simmering and this coming election is increasing the grumbling. We're at a cup of tea stage.
Has anyone filed either a lawsuit or a class action lawsuit against the various parties involved in the tower fire?
Thw government did