Caterpillar - D8 - Diesel - Cold Start - Cat - Tractor - WW2 - Normandy
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ก.ย. 2024
- Caterpillar D8-8R Built in Illinois USA in 1941 then shipped over to England to join 79th armoured Div 819 Dozer Squadron. This actual machine took part in Normandy and D-Day events. Filmed on 19th July 2008 at Barton under Needwood Steam Rally ( near Lichfield Staffs ) What you are watching is the start process needed before the Big Cats diesel engine can be started. The petrol driven starter motor ( donkey engine ) is fired up first. This generates heat which inturn is used to warm up the big diesel engine prior to starting. The action of the starter motor also builds up the oil pressure in the big diesel engine. When the required oil pressure has been reached you will see the guy activate the start mechanism on the diesel engine. Once she has fired up the primary petrol engine is shut down leaving the Big Cat Diesel engine purring away....Sweet
![Starting a WWII Caterpillar D-7 [1080p HD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/SL4PXcSLtT0/mqdefault.jpg)
![Starting a WWII Caterpillar D-7 [1080p HD]](/img/tr.png)
I work for Caterpillar Inc. here in central Illinois and worked in the crawler factory in the 80's. After watching this video I am amazed on how far crawler technology has progressed. Love old iron and seeing them start and operate. It often makes me try to imagine how it really was ! Wow, 1941 army model and a D-day vet to boot. Amazing !!!!!!!
I don't think there's a better sound , than an older model diesel engine purring like this Caterpillar!
A superbly maintained and presented piece of England's mechanical heritage. Excellent camera skills - neither shake nor willy-nilly, confused use of the zoom. Well done and thank you. Greetings from NZ.
There aren't many machines like this...much less a military version that saw historic action. Amazing.
Prior to enlisting in the Army in WWII my dad was in the CCC's (Civilian Conservation Corps.) at age 16. He had no parents & this was the best for him to do. The CCC's built dams, state & national parks, forestry etc. He was 16 & running a Cat like that skidding trees to the mill or dozing roads. He told me many stories of living at the camp & working in the wood. He was based at Voluntown Ct. the state park & forest still exists today .
Ok I'll give you that. I have been involved with the vintage scene for most of my life and I guess we can all say we have had days like that. It can work the other way though. I remember my father starting our Foden on the London to Brighton run with a huge audience and he just rested on the starting handle and it fired into life much to his, and everyone else's amazement. It had never started like that before.
A superb D8 that even makes music as the engine warms up for a start.
Just remembered a piece of history in my home town you may not have seen before. Back in the 50's, the King Ranch here in Texas had Holt Caterpillar build them a custom twin D8, not to be confused with the SxS D9's of the 60's. I've never seen it personally, but two of my uncles working in the oilfield at the time said it was massive. If you image google "twin D8", the site that shows them has the one from here at the bottom, with their trademarked running w brand on the root plow.
wonderful to hear it running so healthily, thank you kindly.
That looks like a piece of history. It had a 1959 D-8. It started exactly the same way. The poney motor was a pain to start with the hand crank when it was cold. My poney had the luxury of a place for an electric starter so I found one. Much easier when cold. However when it was hot I used the hand crank. 2 pulls and it was running. Those things big cats have unbeleivable power when the governor kicks in.
Thanks, I too liked this old girl, and to think she saw some action on Normandy beaches.... Long live the Cat !
My stepdad was in the Army during WWII and was in the engineer unit that crossed the Rhine River heading for Berlin. He told harrowing stories of using his D-8s Blade to keep enemy fire off of him when driving into the river to push gravel to make bridge supports for the following units to bring the tanks and trucks and supplies needed to take Germany after getting to Berlin and hoping to end the war. He told me German snipers were constantly dinging rounds off his Cat while working at night time to drive into the river and push gravel back to the shore line and then push it into a lane for the suspension bridge spans to rest on. He slept during the day and worked only after full darkness to keep from getting shot off the D-8 while out in open river working. My Dad told me several Cat operators were in fact shot while working this job and he just knew his time had come when he was on the front of the unit pushing across the river at the end of the job. To the day he died in 2010 he credited that Cat D8 for saving his life several times.
Jim London wow! That's a fantastic story. Thanks for sharing that. I was trying to picture the scene in my head, wondering how I would have coped had it been myself. Such brave men eh? That really is a brilliant story to tell. Thank you.
That spirit is still alive. Combat engineer here.
When I started my career with the State of Nevada in 1985 one of the fun things I was involved with at the time was the start of a D-8 Cat with a pony motor. I want to say it was an an early 50's Cat with electric start for the pony motor and a huge winch on the back for the operation of the blade (no hydraulics) as I recall it took some time to bring it up to temp but when you hear that Caterpillar rumble the first time it is unforgettable. Unfortunately, it was send off shortly afterward.
Love the old Cats. You gotta shut off the fuel and let the carb run dry though. Keeps the petrol out of the crankcase that way. Good looking tractor. A friend of mine's dad was on the beach at Normandy on D-Day plus 1 or 2. He may have driven something similar as he was an operator in the U.S. Army.
I'm a Yank myself but me mum was from Harrogate, Yorkshire. Her two brothers fought and returned home. Her brother in law was a Canuck pilot. He was killed when his Lancaster went down. Rough time.
Thank you for getting a fire lit in that diesel and drowning out the extra crappy calliope music!!! 🤠👍
When dozer blade was applied, often cable operated all you had to know was 2nd and Hi reverse. They were opposite on the 6 speed transmission and allowed the cat shifter to be used like a johnson bar. Had a hyster winch on the back. By the time late 1950s rolled around pony motor had electric start and remote controls
Incidentally, here in the north woods, we call that a pony motor. Donkey is most often associated with Diesel or Steam multi drum cable winches.
Ran one of these as a teenager.
Now you mention running the carb dry, prior to me filming this video the donkey engine did have petrol flooding out of the carb, this could well explain the difficulty in starting, it was simply flooded. Nice story you gave, just to stand close and actually touch these machines makes you wonder what stories they could tell if only they could speak...
I used to run an old 8-H that the pony motor had a lot of wear on and if you didn't let it idle and warm up itself it would foul a plug and then you played the devils advocate trying to get the diesel started. I'd always fire up the pony motor and let it idle while turning the diesel over with the compression off and no fuel and drink a cup of coffee. By the time I drank the cup the pony would be warmed up and would fire off the diesel with no problem. One cylinder at a time. Thanks for posting this. Good job!
+Lewie McNeely Thats a great story, Thanks :-)
Nice big beastie!
It's good that you've included information in the description so that people who don't know much may learn some more. (I know a little, but i'm always eager to learn a little more.)
8-)
I wish I was around when things like this were commonplace!
Im sure it would, It was a real pleasure to stand next to and actually touch this D8 especially knowing its background history. Im glad you enjoyed the video and Im grateful for your advice. I found your remarks very helpful, constructive criticism is always appreciated. Thankyou.
Oh man, you guys across the pond get all the good WW2 stuff!! I would kill to have one of those. Or the veteran i really want, a Sherman Tank. Anyway, That sure is a beauty, iv never actually seen a CAT being started with a Pony Motor, thanks for sharing.
By the by, I saw this Cat in your steam vid and was immediately impressed to see such a monster was saved...
That engine is perfect hey, the diesel is running better than factory new. Very well done
When it was really cold out, and especially after the engine had some ware on it, the farmer used to start the pony motor and let it spin the engine with the fuel lever in the off position while he went and had his morning coffee. By then the engine would be warm enough to to run.
To be fair to the chap doing the starting up, he did have what appeared to be flooding problems with the Donkey / Pony engine. I actually saw with my own eyes Petrol leaking out from the float chamber. Seemed to be just one of those moments that happens when you have a crowd of people watching your every move, and the last thing you want is a problem occurring when your performing to an audience...
Shame we never got to see it move. The show organisers would'nt allow it. It saw action in Normandy though. It was certainly a lovely piece of machinery to look at and listen to.
Pretty cool story. You never forget a rig like one of those when you have a chance to be hands on with it.
my grandpa has one of these. I love to run it. A little hard to get started somtimes.
What a nice machine,those donkey engines can be temprimental.Never seen a D8 that sounds like a fairground organ before it starts,is it a modification lol
Thanks for posting,well done
@Bevoin1970 i basically is a gasoiline powered starter, it just cranks the big engine over, and shares the same cooling system,so it helps warm up the coolant in the big diesel,and the pony exhust is routed through the diesel intake maifold to help warm it up too.
@VYXtreme Sounded very nice being stood next to it. Thanks :-)
I get the impression that once these babies were running, you left them running... ha ha. Must admit I felt quite humbled myself as I stood next too this veteran. Thanks for telling your story. :-)
Hats off,thatat machine is in MINT condition.And Caterpillar still makes them I would bet one could still get parts for these :)
That's quite correct according to the chap who owns this machine. He also says that they throw out less black smoke too....
A musical Cat D8 8r lol , nice machine. It ran well at the Dorset in 2017
@greenjeens It provides heat from its exhaust gasses, which in turn help warm up the large diesel engines oil, thus making it easier to turn over and hopefully fire up - it also builds up the oil pressure in the large diesel engine before firing up can commence, by checking gauges the operator can determine if all is ok prior to slipping the clutches which allow the diesel engine to begin turning over and eventually fire up into life, so the little donkey engine does quite a bit of work... :-)
Brilliant !! Would have loved to have seen that. One of those priceless moments eh.
Wow. So glad I stumbled on this video, I have never seen that before, EPIC!
Great video, Brilliant old Dozer... Just glad we don't have to do that every morning!!!
Damn, didn't think the pony motor was even gonna start lol!
Yes same difference, You call it a Pony engine, and over here in England we would call it a Donkey engine.
actually cats of all sizes had donkey engines until the 60s my dads first D6B had a donkey, we had 2 D8Hs on the farm for many years 1 was donkey start built '64 the other built 66 started off life with a donkey but was converted to direct start- the donkeysthem selves were electric start only in the 50s
for those that dont know cat eninges up until the late 80s were "indirect injection - these engines take alot of starting & smoke alot when cold- dont be fooled tho they are very good motors!
Thats ok glad you enjoyed it. Wished I had the opportunity to re make this video in HD and on a much nicer day. Maybe one day If I ever see it again at a show... Thanks for watching and good luck in getting a Sherman.... :-)
Bevoin1970
That sounds like a good idea to me...... Nice 1
I am only going on what I see in the video and what I see is a very well presented Caterpillar which is a credit to the restorer but bearing in mind this must be in the summer as it is at a rally I would want it to start a lot better than it appears to. I have seen many D2s and D4s and even the rough looking ones have started very well. .
Can any of the Caterpillar people explain what the blocks or filler pieces are put on the track for and the proper name for them would be great .
Great video thanks for taking the time to document this .
"thats all there is to it" lol
great vid and great lookin piece of iron
If this beauty can't pull you out then nothing can !!
Gave me Goosebumps and I found myself thinking,"If only she could talk"
State of Idaho with a D-6 cable-blade. The pony did not have enough hp to run and spin the diesel for mor than 15-20 sec so it had to be engaged and dis-engaged several times. Exhaust was inches above the pony motor clutch and shift levers...You only forgot gloves once! Built a back-country firefighting airstrip with that little thing.
Great video, but that thing starts hard. Dad has a 1953 D-8 2U1976. Until this year it has started much easier than that. Even in the cold. Choke her till she starts, push it in some and it will run. Warm her up a bit then open the throttle up and let her crank on teh big one for awhile. Our has the crank up through the hood, saves climbing on the machine to adjst the choke or run things, you are already up there. Also a better set up with the dozer blade on it.
That one nice old machine!
Just looking at your most poplar download. Nothing like a old machine getting the rev.Now like a say to many tubes support this video with something similar.
This old beast looked like something which would drive out of Thunderbird 2 pod with the Mole on top.
Thanks for the advice, Im not a camera man or into photography, at least I wasn't when I made this. I used my Sony digital camera in video mode, it was made on the spur of the moment and was the first decent video that I made and uploaded to You Tube. Since this film I have learnt a lot more & become more into what makes a good video so to speak, but Im still no expert. If I could remake this video it would be much improved. Alas I can't but have taken onboard your comments and tips. Thankyou.
The 4 stroke marine diesels had de-compressors for ease starts; two stroke recoil start donkey engines were used on Soviet made "Belarus" tractor (1978) to start 4 cylinder 4 stroke diesel engine.
Even in the 40's a cat still sounded like a CAT!!!
Thanks for the info, will take a look.
I know this guy knows what he’s doing but it’s never safe practice to stand in front of a running machine. No disrespect intended. Hoorah Carry on and thank you for your service.
Thanks for all the info, fascinating stuff... :-)
Thank You. Greetings from England. :-))
The high rate of compression on those (diesel) pistons, and their bore size, requires a tremendous amount of torque to turn over which would not be humanly possible safely. The pony motor (starting engine) was used back then to accomplish this feat. Also for lack of battery power on most equipment.
@Bevoin1970
I see so many tubers with what I call one off hit videos. My first advice is as above back it up if you can, my second is annotate from this to a video you want to promote.
It is a very effective way of getting other videos noticed. Videos tend ot go to sleep on the tube network if no one watches them. I feel it is strung up to load popular content faster well before sleepers.
Thanks for watching and glad you liked it, its nice to see and hear about these old machines and their history. They all have a story to tell.
@the124Lscania I dont suppose they had electric starts in those days, with enough power to crank over a large diesel engine such as this. However saying that, the heat generated by the petrol engine is used to warm up the diesel engine before she fires into life. You couldn't do that with an electric starter... Technology was very limited back in the 1940's
that is in very very very very very good condition i like it!
I love old machines proper basic no fucken electrics and fuses, Just pure mechanics
Ah wonderful i love it. Caterpillar really knows how to make a dozer.
Caterpillar, even today build great engines, although you don't want to run today's unit injection ones out of fuel as they are pigs to bleed. With the use of a laptop you can cut the injectors out and run a modern six cylinder on just one injector. Quite impressive
Even better close up !!
@Bevoin1970 Interesting pictures. Always wondered what the extra holes in the pad were for. We always added hard metal welding to top of pad treads to extend life of pads.
Yes I totally agree with you...
Thanks for watching. :-)
these are the unsung heros of WWII
Me too buddy, I would so love to have a dozer, if only I had the money and the space to keep one..... I can always dream eh?
ha ha...... Thanks for watching.
Thank You !! Im happy you enjoyed it.
Thanks for watching. :-)
@Bevoin1970 My grandpa said these baby's used to sit and idle for days without needing to be refilled with diesel. He said he remembers starting one in the middle of winter, and didn't shut it off for about a month
It was that hard to start the "pup engine". Can you imagine how hard it would be to hand crank the diesel!
It probably is a lengthy process by todays standards, however you must stop and think. This machine was built back in 1941, hence technology has changed hell of a lot since then. Also read comment by FFmike790 below. Technology today means large diesels like this have different starting techniques to the 1940's CAT
@DOCTORDROTT I think he had a CD playing in his player... LOL
The chap reckoned it was because he'd got an audience, and that normally it fired up quite quickly and without much fuss.
Was a very nice machine though, shame he wasn't allowed to drive it - Health & Safety as per usual...
Thanks for watching
Paul :-)
@seasonedtoker Sorry my mistake, the donkey engine is providing warm exhaust gasses that are used to begin warming up the large diesel engine, making for easier starting, also oil pressure is slowly being built up in the large diesel engine at the same time, and until it reaches a specific pressure, firing up cannot begin. Hence it takes a little time for all these stages to be complete before the big fire up...
@seasonedtoker It was just one of those things at the time. The owner had a small crowd of people stood around him, and I think he flooded the engine with petrol, that made the spark plug all wet, and so it didn't want to fire up.
I dare say under normal conditions, it would fire up 1st time, usually the way when no one else is watching.
Thanks for watching. :-))
Bevoin19
70
If it is very cold the pony start is actually a little more reliable than a modern direct electric start.
@Lmancates You certainly are, you may well be the future keeper of such a machine. Wish I had the chance to have a go on one...
Enjoy it :-)) Don't forget to film the cold start though if you get chance.
Thank You Bevoin1970
i imagine with the trouble he is havin to start it, it would have been really fun in the cold europe winter.
tom o
@leokimvideo Thanks for all the advice and tips etc... I'll have to get my thinking cap on and see what I can come up with.
I believe your right though in what you say about sleepers...
I like the video...I like old CATs.
it also sounds like a tractor trailer truck idling hehe i like it lots
I think indirect injection is from the side of the cylinder wall somehow, and direct is squirted in from the top, but Im no expert.
GREAT video! thank you!
Current D8s are just under 900 cubic inches. This one will be close to that.
We used to have a very old D4. Same starting setup, just not quite as big...
@FJSchrank Where do you get the air from on the initial start up? The Pony engine gives off heat, which is then used to help pre heat the big diesel engine, no air start could do that for you.
Im pretty sure this diesel doesn't have a glow plug system like your thinking... It uses heat from the donkey, Pony engine to help it start up. Please feel free to correct me if Im wrong.
Bevoin1970 the pony motor actually rolls the diesel over at a fairly good clip, while the diesel has the decompression lever holding the exhaust valves open far enough to prevent full compression stroke. The oil is being circulated and warmed up, the rings, pistons and sleeves are all being lubed and preheated, and the fuel pressure is brought up to the right pressure on all cylinders for combustion. Then the decompression is released, starting the diesel. After that, the fuel is shutoff to the pony motor, and it is allowed to consume what’s left in the carb and fuel lines.
No cold starts, no DRY starts, and no lube/fuel issues with low RPM starts.
That is interesting James. What do large Caterpillars do now instead of using the "Pony" motor. And can you tell me how some old engines used a "shot gun" start. I think even some airplanes used a "Shotgun" starter. I am not a diesel man. I just like watching these old engines start
Wow! Is that in good shape!
so the donkey must be connected to the diesel via a CV belt or something? as a direct gear drive would cause the donkey to seriously lug
great video, thanks for shareing
I know sorry !! it was a Fairground Organ playing in the background, plus a very windy day, not at all ideal conditions for making such a movie. If I had my chance again then I would make a much better job of it second time around. I have a HD camera these days, plus a little more experience. I did what I did at that time. Maybe next time this machine will appear at another show, who knows ? Thanks for watching. :-))
@peteacher52 Thanks, I only wish I could go back and remake this film. I now use a HD camera and know a little bit more than I did when I made this.
Still glad I captured this beast rather than not at all.
Thanks for watching :-))
Hello NZ.
My favorite piece a diesel engineering!
diego hermosillo ĺiiu
@hwoods01 what i ment, when someone talks bout WWII , they always mention the B-17,P-51,P-38,B-29,and all the other great machines of WWII,but something had to clear the land, knock down the hills,fill in the low spots,and level the land, so they could take off and land,and build the roads,and the bridges,so the shermans,and the jeeps and trucks could where they needed to
Until a few months ago I'd never heard of pony motors. Was there a reason for using them instead of electric starters? Great video by the way
Thank you, glad you enjoyed it. Take a look at my some of my newer video's I have uploaded some more Caterpillar stuff and International Crawlers, hopefully something for all tastes...
Thanks for watching.