Microgreen Lighting: Fluorescent vs LED's - On The Grow
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ต.ค. 2024
- ✅ In today’s video we put three different types of lights to the test, T5 HO Fluorescent's - vs - 18watt LED's - vs - 300watt LED's to see which one comes out on top for growing Microgreens. All the details about the lights are in the video - such as LUX, light distance, cost to run the lights and so much more…. The results are worth the watch! 🤯
This video is one of many of our experiments Microgreen lighting experiments and if you would like to see more on what the effects lights have on Microgreens --- be sure to check out our TH-cam Playlist on lighting, and if you would like to see the complied data from all our lighting tests leading up to 2021 it's available in the "lighting" section of our book "Becoming a Microgreen Master".
IN THIS VIDEO →
➽ Full Article: onthegrow.tv/B...
➽ T5 HO Fluorescent: onthegrow.tv/T...
➽ 18watt LED: Suppliers on Amazon changed the listing to 20W
➽ 300watt LE: onthegrow.tv/300W
➽ Our Favorite Microgreen Seeds: onthegrow.tv/M...
➽ Best 1020 Trays for Microgreens: onthegrow.tv/T...
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➽ Full Article with table breakdowns now available: onthegrow.tv/BlogFluovsLEDs
Interesting that 4.13 times more light ONLY produced about 16% more end product.. reasonable to speculate the limitation is the surface area of the leaves to absorb the light. Theoretically, a 28 watt LED of equal lumen output could yield the same as the other harvests at half the T5's power consumption. Realistically, I don't think it would as it would most likely use less bulbs decreasing the uniformity of light distribution.
Amazing experiment, thank you. I am as a city farmer (indoor) for more than 10years made my personal conclusions from this video: 1. Total Wattage does make difference 2. Shelf 2 and Shelf 3 - how to get near similar produce & product top look from cheap shelf 2 same as shelf 3 -> place 4 LED lights 30W-35W each on shelf 2 -> you should get these extra 60-70grams. Also if 2 lights will be 6500К and 2 lights will be 6500К+2700К you will get that vibrant look of mg's. And all that will be for the 1/3 cost of Shelf 3 😁😂Did you get to that and experiments in these 3 years ? Interesting to know what you finally came to in years. Healthy harvests)
Put silicone mesh on top of soil. Put seeds on that silicone mesh. It will be zero soil contamination during harvest.
Where would one find those?
Silicone is not food safe no matter how much someone tells you it is.
@@auspiciouscloud8786 you grow on it, not cook in it.
@@auspiciouscloud8786 you can do it even without spreader mat. Like this grass... just do it with any sprouts
th-cam.com/video/TCk6LeLZF0M/w-d-xo.htmlsi=qtvLuat1s7g3McL8
@simonci5177 and certain cancerous implants are silicon also... sorry I was harsh. It seems if you go through all the work to grow these, why would you use a sketchy product. Great idea just wish it was silicon... 💕
so wait - how much is radish per gram? -- you had a higher yield from the more expensive and brighter lights - how long would it take to recoup the higher expense? even if it took 6 months you would have years of higher crop yields --- you would make more money and have a better looking product. makes no sense not to use the more expensive lights.
so - how long would it take if you always get better yields to pay off the added expense? it's all money in the bank after that (unless the lights wear out too soon).
also, the middle tray was probably drying out faster because of the hotter, higher wattage light being beneath it. next time put the high powered lights on the top shelf.
How long will the lights last? so many variables...
Great content! So - and correct me if I’m missing something - on a 48” long shelf, using the 42 watt LED grow-cycle cost of $0.55 - the energy cost/tray would average just under $0.14 per 358 g of greens... Not bad, bud! Even using the expensive lighting, split between 4 trays you’d be at $0.3125 per tray per grow. Sweet!
That is correct 🥳
Just wanted to point out that because the top 2 were sitting on top of warm lamps; this may be the reason that they dry out more. This might also account for the lower harvest weight.
Great observation! Yes, they both had the heat rising from the lights below, but we actually found that a little heat helps with the growth... It could potentially dry it out more though, so you are correct. We will find a way to experiment better with it!
Or maybe shadows in dense vegetation made those variations. Better to make a growth with not that dense vegetation... That would be a better comparison with those different lux. What I have read about lettuce for example it's better to have more space between plants... It will get bigger yield.
So impressed I'm subbed after just watching two of your videos. Love the scientific approach.
Thank you so much for the support!
Yeah, I am scientist and I’m so impressed with these guys.
Although in your case its not really a big deal, but you can't use a lux meter to compare lights that have different color temperatures. Lux meters measure mainly in the green part of the spectrum. There is actually a green gel over the sensor within the housing. So its very likely that your yellow looking LED's are actually putting out more umol than that what the lux meter can tell you. Essentially the lux meter is just measuring the intensity of the portion of the spectrum that the human eye is most sensitive to. Ex- If you measure a blurple led (pink, red/blue) with the lux meter it will give you a lower number while the actual intensity (umol) could potentially burn the plants with intense red light that the lux meter hardly measures. You really need a par meter to be fair when plants are involved.
Totally agreed! This was just a slap together test to see what three very different lights could do to the growth of the same crop.
We will eventually dig deeper into PAR and PPFD, but for now, we're just having fun.
Hey guys, great video. I use the cheapo Wal-Mart daylight spectrum LED shop lights, something like $22 each, only cost $5 a month in electricity to run. I've grown everything from cucumbers, lettuce, peppers, herbs, and microgreens with them. Fantastic results. For anyone on a budget they can do a complete setup for
Thank you so much for sharing!! We will try to get some like these to try out! We are all about budget here and it sounds like you are getting some great results with them!
Can’t find these what watt size
Great research! Have you ever reviewed the extensive research done by Dr. John Ott, during the 1980's? One of the many things he learned was that the color of the light affected the growth of plants (and animals) AS WELL AS the electro magnetic field produced by the cathode and anode ends of his lights. His work was mostly before the l.e.d. era. He created a research foundation to promote and collate his discoveries.
Thank you so much! We haven't done much research into lighting yet, we're just kind of playing around! We will check this out!
I'd be interested in this too. I have seen some places do a blend of red and blue LEDs and change the intensities of each color depending on the produce
Very informative, your right huge investment for full spectrum, I will stick with the LED's I have just like the ones you currently use. Thanks for the video!
The 18watt LED's do a great job, especially for the upfront cost and the cost to run them! Thank you for your continued support!!
If you took the extra 2 ounces from the sprouts on the bottom shelf, and sold it for six dollars a container at the farmers market, that would be an extra $120 for 20 racks, providing that you got the same extra yield every time. That would pay you back for the more expensive lights in seven weeks, then after that you would have an additional $120 in profit per rack, or approx $12k per year for the two racks I can visible see on screen.
Great video! Thank you for sharing so much great information on your channel! I just finished my seedling germination rack and modeled a lot of it around your shelves.
Thank you so much for the support! This setup has worked well for us so far! We have about 70 varieties that we have grown with great results so far. Excited to see how we can continue to improve the rack while keeping it cheap...
It was an honor and a pleasure to observe and to learn from you friend. You have an excellent heart. A true Offspring of GREATNESS.
Wow! Lights in your country are cheeeeap!!! I’m paying double I think? Plus our energy costs are way up, but that’s another story!
I’m eating up all of your content and applying the knowledge daily. Keep at it please.
hahaha that's so wild how different things can be. Thank you so much for watching and supporting us! Glad you enjoy our channel 😃
I'm confused slightly, from watching many videos, isn't PAR more accurate for measuring lighting for growing purposes compared to lux or lumens? Essentially comparing usable /spectrum vs brightness? Awesome video overall
You are correct! All new videos use PAR and this video used Lux/Lumens cause it’s the only meter I had on hand and wanted to share a reference point.
Great information here!
Clearly state that we should stick to the cheap LED.
Can’t wait to see an experiment to compare 3 unit per shelf to 4 unit to see if more lumens lead to more yield...and if it’s worth the initial + running cost + amortization
Thank you!! 🥳 We just started some new LED tests today. Appreciate you watching!
Another Great vid! Thx !
maybe try this one...
Spider Farmer SF-1000 LED Grow Light
Thank you for the support! I actually considered that one recently... I’ll look into it! Thanks for the suggestion!
Try Mars Hydro TS1000 👌🏻
Thanks for a great, informative video! A key advantage of higher light output is the ability to support thick canopies. That manifested as greater yield in your bottom sprouts. High light output becomes especially important for grow tents with mature plants such as tomatoes, whose leaf canopies are at least a foot thick or more. However, for microgreens, super thick canopies may be less important given that growth time is so short. In particular, the intensity of COB lights would require greater shelf heights to avoid burning the sprouts and would thetefore actually decrease yield per square foot.
Your video has inspired me to retire my blurple sprouting leds and I will now invest in the full spectrum panels that you used for your bottom shelf. Thank you!
Thank you so much for the support!! We are beginning a lot more light experiments with about 5 more types of lights. Excited to see what the differences will be! Thanks again!
LUX doesn't tell you anything in this case. For plants you need PAR meter en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photosynthetically_active_radiation
You are correct, thanks for sharing!
Great job you guys! What are you using on top of the shelves? Looks like there are two different mats - one clear and one reflective. Which do you prefer and why do you use them?
quick question. Is it one harvest per tray? Or do the plants come back and you can get another harvest before composting the grow medium?
Great question! Most varieties will not grow back again, but some will like Pea microgreens. I'm actually working on a video for this right now...but it will still be a bit till its out on TH-cam. But what I can tell you is it's really not worth it. I noticed that on the first harvest I got an amazing harvest, then on the 2nd harvest it was more than half the weight of the first harvest I got haha. Really disappointing. So I found that it's more worth it to just replant.
May I suggest that you complete your calculations to include the yield in grams/$ of light operational costs? That would yield a very telling number of cost per gram of product produced. Great educational video - thank you for taking some of the guesswork out of growing micro greens for us nubies!!
Good remark. It is obvious that the LED at the middle shelves is the more efficient. It costs 50% less than the lowest shelves, which one produces only 20% more.
Clark Kent is Superman because of our yellow sun. Obviously, the microgreens agree that the yellow wins because of the full spectrum of light put out.
Lol, exactly! Those lights do amazing, excited to see if the spectrum is a big factor. I feel like it will be...
Great video very interesting thumbs up
Thank you so much for the support!
I started my first grow on radishes 3 days ago. I have grown lettuce in the winter for a couple of years in MN. Looking forward to have them to add to fresh salads. Thanks for the information to get me growing.
That's exciting! Radish is a great addition to salads, adds a nice spice. Hope they turn out perfect! Thank you for watching 😃
LUX per watt is 269.6 for lower shelf, 129.6 for middle shelf. Grams per watt was 3.69 for lower shelf, 6.65 middle shelf. Considering the quality difference, I would probably go with the lower shelf lighting, especially for taller, longer growing plants. This would probably show a better weight to cost ratio.
The strongest light could probably light twice the area it was used for in this experiment, so with a bit more distance to the plants, it could be the most cost-efficient.
Awesome! It is very important experiment for growing plants with LED.
Thank you so much for the support! We really appreciate it!
please try the kingbo 45watt and the Barrina 4ft 6500k and 5000k t5s. they are both cheap and available on amazon. thanks for all you do. peace.
We will give these a try! Thanks for the suggestion and the support!
I really enjoy your videos guys! I saw a lot comparisons you did and appreciated the dedication, level all detail, quality and quantity of information and data.
Far for being a critic, I think that providing the gap between the different units of measure (weight, price, watt, etc) also in percentage, could better highlight the differences!
Thanks for sharing your passion, knowledge and curiosity with the us the rest of the world!
Hello I just subscribed. Do you have a source for the 18 watt LEDs. Are they the ones on your site? Thanks for the video.
Thank you for the support! We no longer have a link to them because the manufacturer switched the lights and no longer offers them. We have our other 20watt Barrina lights that we've also used for 7 months in the shop. Those work great as well and we are about to begin a lot of tests with them. www.amazon.com/shop/onthegrowfarms?listId=300RR4HQRM5I9
Hope that helps!
Great experiment ! Could you make another comparing 2, 3, 4, 5 LED tubes ?
Absolutely! We’ve got some more tests with different light setups coming soon!
Yes. You cannot tell whether the differences were due to light type or light intensity.
Cooler temps and more red spectrum light will give them more purple color. Being on the bottom and not having lights under it to heat the tray as well as including more red spectrum, it's easy to see why the LEDs on the bottom gave different results.
We will have to switch up the lighting order to see! We're also about to start some experiments using different levels of yellow/red light to see what the impact is.
I have heard of cold-treating microgreens on their last day to pop the color... might have to experiment with it... Thanks for sharing!
Hello,nice work and keep going,on growing lights you need to look after PPFD(avg at certain heights) for plants and efficacy for your wallet( PPE as μmol/J);also between the three of your testing lights only the bottom one is a real growing one,but imo is overkill for microgreens - you can grow plants into flowering stage successfully with that,tho it has a nice feature being the lenses wich improve the light coverage (and maybe the PPFD);sadly a good spectrophotometter is starting at 2000$;P.S. radish is not a demanding crop,you could try a slow/hard growing crop to test for a more acurate result.Cya!
Thanks for the suggestions! Yeah, we’re not trying to be perfect on this experiment and simply wanted to provide some form of measuring the light. $2,000 is way too expensive and we just care about the results really...
We chose radish because of its coloration and we have a lot of other crops that we have filmed and will be posting soon.
Thanks for the suggestions!
One thought. The bottom shelf of Rambo radishes did not have a light immediately beneath it. The upper 2 shelves did, so they had warmer soil. I wonder if radishes enjoy cooler soil? Can you repeat the experiment to see if the difference is only in the light, or a combination of light + cooler soil?
Great observation! That is a flaw in the experiment...
We are conducting tests with heat mats right now and we see a positive effect from the heat being applied to the grow medium. We have tested three crops already and all germinated and grew better with the heatmat being 8 degrees warmer.
So I would think that the two trays above it would have an advantage over the bottom tray.
Either way, it would be nice to recreate it and move the lights around and see if we get the same results.
Thanks for sharing!
You did a truly thorough job of explaining lighting for this newbie...so because you did for me, I subscribed. Thank you.
Thank you so much! We're excited to be doing more light tests soon and we greatly appreciate your support!
I'm regretting purchasing the ActiveGrow LED lights...$175 for two 4ft lights isn't cheap. I would love to see if you can get even higher output out of that brand. For now, I'm going to try some different variations as well.
Yeah, "grow lights" tend to be very pricey, but standard LED shop lights grow produce really well... We have 4 more sets of different grow and shop lights that we are about to begin some tests with so hopefully that will help you!
Huge fan of your guy's work and rigor in collecting the data for these different variables! It's been very fun and helpful watching you guys grow (both channel and product). I was wondering if you guys tried playing around with different wavelength lights for your grows? Have you tried using "grow spectrum" lights that blast the blue-red spectrum? Haven't seen any of these lights in your videos, so is there a specific reason you guys decided against them? Thanks for the content, keep up the great work!! By far favorite microgreens channel on YT.
Thank you so much for the support Timothy! It means a lot to us!
We are about to begin playing with more spectrums like what you are discussing. We have some blurple lights we are going to test first with some more powerful daylight LED's. We don't love looking at the multi-spectrum lights because they are so hard on the eyes... We have used them in the past, but you have to wear glasses to observe the crops. We did love our blue spectrum lights, they gave us amazing results... but for some reason the vendor stopped selling them :(
Stay tuned for some more lights tests soon!
Thank you so much for the kind words, we really do appreciate your support.
I love watching stuff like this, but I always wonder how relevant it is when tested on a specific plant. I wish someone would make a really video about different classifications of plant light spectrums and circadian cycles.
Gary Barbour II try looking up dr Bruce Bugbee here on TH-cam. He’s doing cutting edge research on plant lighting.
@@Agr414 thanks for the suggestion! I watched a few of his videos, they're great!
Glad this got worked out!
What happen to the old beat ☹☹☹everytime it came on me and the wifey had to dance lol
Lol, we will see if we can’t bring it back! We like to keep it fresh and switch it up every now and then.
Another cost issue that needs to be addressed is the longevity of those different lighting systems - the lights AND the ballasts. I think in most people's experience the old adage about 'you get what you pay for' is generally true. What are the manufacturer claims for the life of those lights? I'd love to see you update this - now 2 years on since you first posted this - on how they're all still doing. And don't forget that increase in product from the bottom light is cumulative over it's lifetime, which is a further cost reduction overall.
Beyond that, most people also don't have dedicated growing sheds and have to grow them in their homes. Cold light isn't only irritating but the blue spectrum is bad for eyes - pets and people. The warm light of that third rack is much more beneficial and easier on the eyes for everyone who has to see it. So, yeah, I'd say it's worth the extra dosh.
How much would the lux increase by adding a fourth led lamp in the shelf - did you made any testing in regards to this?
Great question! It will increase it by about 2,000 lux per 18watt LED. We will be testing that soon!
@@OnTheGrow I was wondering the same thing... if you doubled up the leds from 3x to 6x would you outperform the yellow in growth... with comparable power usage.. but still less up front costs... keep up the great content...
I love your guys vids can you please try the LED regular how bulbs please because i want to use the daylight ones that go in the house lamps thank you for sharing. 😘
I'll see what I can get setup for a test with some of those! Thanks for the suggestion and the support!
Great vid!! Did you add nutrients to the water and if so at what day did you start the nutrients. Thanks and keep up the great work!
Yes we did, we used Ocean Solution 2-0-3 and our general rule of thumb is we start bottom watering with nutrients the same day we introduce them into the light. Thank you for watching! 😃
I wonder if the fact that the bottom lights were full spectrum, rather than a limited spectrum, factored into the growth and/or color.
I would guess that it did! We are going to be testing out 4 new types of lights within the next few days!
Great video, thank you for sharing. I think you should try a mostly blurple light, like the JCBritw 90W Transformer, two per shelf. Each one draws 25w from the wall, and only $30 each, so $60/shelf up front cost. Would love to see how it compares to the 3x T5 LED's per shelf you presently use.
We will get two of these ordered! Thanks for the suggestion!
shouldn't the light be measured with PAR meter instead of lumens meter?
Yes! We didn’t have a PAR meter at the time so we used what we had! New lighting videos use PAR.
Thanks I really enjoyed that! I do like T5’s for my growing but I do use some LED’s as well.
Klaus
Thank you so much for the support! We really appreciate it! I loved my T5 HO lights but the amperage draw is why I moved away from them. We are limited in our space to a maximum of 50 amps total draw with the A/C, Heater, Fans and everything else... That's the main reason we moved to LED's so that we could get the same light for less energy.
Nicely done. You mentioned that the bottom led is full spectrum, however it looks heavily in the 2700k-3000k range much like a high pressure sodium (HPS) bulb. When I think of full spectrum I think of a Quantum board with a mix of 3000k-5000k diodes with infrared and far-red in the mix (which almost produces a normal day light looking light) with little to no yellowish tones. Either way brother nicely done. If I wasn't so poor I would send you a real QB with a real full spectrum!
Agreed on the temperature being around the 2700-3000k. I just took what was stated in the description on the LED and used that to describe it. My other full spectrum lights are like you describe with little to no yellow.
We will be playing with a lot more lights soon!
Thanks so much for this test! I am due to buy some lights and you really helped!
Thank you so much for your support Penny, it means a lot to us!
Based on the other lights Id go for a single diode row 4ft samsung f-series (about 18000 lm for every 100W) or even one of their horticultural strips, at about 25W for a row like that. The hortistrips have some extra spectrum like 660nm in which really adds to leafy greens like lettuce
I'd experiment with 3000k and 4000k in those
We can try to experiment with some of these! Thanks for the suggestion!
Excellent video. I like the level of details and price comparing on screen, like an extra layer of content. Nice work!
I would like to see red and blue LED lights in your next comparison. Thanks!
Please, see this: www.freightfarms.com/blog/indoor-grow-lights
We will get some mixed LED's in the space soon! Thanks for the suggestion and support!
Why aren’t you using PAR to measure instead of Lumens?
We didn't have the $500 meter at the time of this video. All our new lighting experiments use PAR!
That led full spectrum has a power consumption of 65w +-5%
Correct! I put 115watt combined in the notes for that light. The company calls it a “300watt equivalent” so that’s what I referred to it as.
Hi I love your videos. I am in Canada 🇨🇦 working on starting my own business. Small business. I would love to learn more from you. Thanks 🙏
How much did your trailer set up cost with all the equipment, minus the grow medium and seeds?
It was 15k for the decked out trailer, then about 5k in racks, lights, fans, dehumidifier, washer for spin dry and a lot of the supplies needed.
All in about 20k. It could be done for much, much cheaper though. Buying a used trailer and converting it myself would’ve saved 5-10k at least.
With microgreens, you could make that back in 3-4months with the growspace.
Check out our website for more information about the space! I’ll try to get a more accurate price on everything added together on the website! www.onthegrow.net/growspacefaq
What is a ball park number for how much you charge for a gram of product?
It depends on the variety, but for exp Broccoli would be $0.04 per Gram. Most growers in the industry try to get minimum of $15 per tray no matter what they yielded.
Awesome video thanks, would the 18 w led be good for starting my vegetable seedlings
I believe so! You could lower the lights more than we have them so that they don’t stretch as much. We only stretch ours so it makes for easier harvesting, but if we were growing these to be planted, we would put the lights closer so they stay short. Thank you for the support!!
Great video! I sub'd after watching this video. Would the same hold true for Growing lettuce and herbs under these lights? Thanks!
Is there a way to know if the nutrient content is higher w the different lights ?
Yes, but we would have to send it off to a lab and it costs $1,000 per test :( We've looked into it, but just can't afford that at this very moment. Hopefully in the future though!! 😄
On The Grow for what its worth I pendulum tested it and they are all the same vibration so that’s good !
@@susanfitch8698 What's a pendulum test?
those lights were so deeply buried in amazon, I would have never found them without your link. The other choices were crap so THANKS so much! BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUT... Now i need the racks :D I have muscle racks for the garage, blah. I see commercial ones all over, but adjustable 24" deep 6 tier. Where did you get those? I see a few choices at sams club. Maybe you've sniffed out the best source?
I have gotten similar racks on Amazon, I think they are called chefs racks
haha So glad we were able to make it easier on you!
www.amazon.com/dp/B07BT69ZKS/?ref=exp_onthegrowfarms_dp_vv_d
@@OnTheGrow excellent, thank you!!!! My lights are up and working beautifully!!! and so easy to install. thank you!
You, sir, are a scientist. That was an easy subscribe decision. Thanks!
Appreciate that! Thank you for subbing 🥳
The yellow light tray leaves seem to be bigger and flatter. Is that just me?
We would agree!
Middle tray is drying out because of the heat produced by your 'yellow' LED light
You are right! Thanks for sharing!
Plus the middle space gets heat from above AND below, besides from its own lights.
Led on the top
I recently discovered you guys and the content is awesome. I've got a small indoor nft lettuce system going and starting wheatgrass/microgreens now. My question is I believe the test may be more fair to the led tubes if you use 6 per rack to get the power draw per shelf even between types. There only $5ea in the 10pack which would be $30 per shelf for lighting with yield closer to the best one. This could be very cost effective and profitable if it makes gains over only running 3 per shelf.
We will give that a try!! Thanks for the suggestion! Thank you for your support, it means a lot to us!
Your welcome, it’s nice how much faster we can learn and improve through shared experiments. After watching your videos I’m running a test on those same lights on leafy greens grown to adult size in nft. NOTE I suggest using foil or something reflective on the shelf directly above these lights. In my initial check with a cheap light meter I got 3x more output with a reflecting top. The lights have a wasteful reflector for plant use
Good to know!! We will try and get some form of reflectors above it! Thank you for sharing 🤗🌱 We completely agree that it is nice when people openly share information as everyone can benefit from it so quickly!
I’m not very good on camera but if you search monster lettuce I just added a short video clip of the test setup
You need to replace one fluorescent T5 bulb with a warmer 3000K or 2700K bulb. They are sold by Vivosun, iPower and Lightwise. This is a low cost upgrade that does not require a new fixture.
Great video! Thanks for making this. I always wanted to know the difference between the lights. I'm really pleasantly surprised. I just bought the ten pack of led lights you're using (for my two car garage, not to grow with), and am super impressed with how well they light the whole area with very little wattage. I need to get another ten pack and get some racks going! Thanks again!
Thank you for the support and we agree, they put out a ton of light for the energy usage!
What is the lifetime cost of the daylight led lighting versus the cheaper led strip, do the cheaper ones have to be replaced every year for example. I have 4inch red/blue led lamps, same ones for 3 years about 4 or 5 euros each on Ali Express and they do a great job on my vegetable seedlings.
I see you answered the question of lifetime costs, regards, Ian.
Glad you were able to find your answer! Sorry it took so long to respond. We're a little behind since we're also about to move. Appreciate you watching and supporting us 🥳
lol TLDR: the more powerful light grew more product
Exactly! But was it worth it, and, what is the happy medium for price/growth?
YEP BEFORE WE HAD QUALITY 28w LED TUBES, i WAS USING AQUARIUM TUBES= $$$$$$$$$$. Plus, most people don't realize that 100% of led light goes straight to the canopy, wheres T5s do not requiring a reflector to bounce SOME of the light on the opposite side of the grow
Hey guys what about the FANS energy comsumption could u guys share the info...
Also thank you for the content u give very informative and genuine...
It's pc fans, so they don't use any thing worth mentioning (12v each) and the way they are installed, I doubt they have any effect
Lol, okay expert.
The fans cost like 2 cents a day to run or something like that. They work great for preventing microclimates above the canopy of the crop. Get a big fan to move most of your air, then the small ones to prevent microclimates on each shelf.
GREAT VIDEO MATE!👌👍👍👍
Do you leave the LIGHTS on for 24hrs? I am going to Start growing Not only for my Wife and myself, but also for my Birds in their Breeding SEASON'S. Thank you Guys FOR SHARING! Cheers FROM AUSTRALIA...👌👌👌👍👏👏👏🙏
Fantastic analysis brother. This is the best one on the subject.
Thank you so much for the support!
Hey guys I'm going to be trying to grow/start my first tray of microgreens! I'm really interested in your trailer concept, I'm considering it for myself. I'd do it because it's self contained and easily separately observed as a profit center! Do you have similar stats on what the entire trailer is costing to operate by day/week/month, ect. I'd really like to know that.
I can try and get that information together for you! I know that it is really not that expensive... the main challenge is the electricity cost, but using LED’s hasn’t made it bad at all. Not sure if you’ve seen it yet, but we started a page for our growspace on our website: www.onthegrow.net/growspacefaq
Great Video :), Question for you, how many grams of seeds did you use for these trays?
Thank you so much for the support! We used 25grams per tray for this experiment!
But the led would last longer, replace less??? Correct???
Correct! The LED’s will last about 8 years and the Fluorescents will last 1.5years. Huge difference in lifespan...
I want to thank ya'll for the vids.. learning alot....
would love to see a similar experiment with blue led light.
Keep up the good work
Belle
Thank you for watching!! Great suggestion, we've been searching for some blue led lights so we can do that but haven't found any yet that aren't way to pricey or to bulky. Hopefully soon will be able to do that 😃
...and for what I knew about the tech then, for MG you’ll want(unless you’ve got a special needs bunch o’ seeds) 5000K min-6500k ideal WHITE. All this rainbow splitting was jumping the gun on the plant science; PLUS, it’s REAL BAD for your eyes in separate spectrums over time if you don’t wear color correcting glasses!!! NO JOKE/ SPREAD THE WORD to fellow indoor growers. White is the least damaging. Lensing is easy for MG as well; 120* is ideal, 90* is the narrowest in relation to mounting height. And you CAN burn your plants with too much LED. The light meter to get is a mols per second/meter2; it will give you real usable light+show you WHERE it’s going. Again, not nearly as crucial as way bigger, more complex plants, yet you might wanna know what you’re getting dropping $$$ on. In theory, LEDs have at least 50,000hrs w/negligible drop off. HOW many VHO T5’s would you need to buy to= 50,000hrs?
Cool, I saved $900 by watching this video, thank you!
Glad it helped! We do our best to help clear up questions around growing micros!
thats was very interesting to see on a day to day basis .... and agree with you decision on going with the middle light that you have always used ... but here is some food for thought ... the bottom led system looked to me like you could possibly harvest a day or even 2 days earlier than the other setup thus making your turnaround alot quicker ... would like to see if that would be the case and if the earlier product would then be comparable the middle or top light with your current turnaround time .. and also maybe getting the spicyness back in the product ....? all in all that would shorten the turnaround thus being slightly more cost efficient ..maybe .... well done and thankyou for taking the time to show us the difference in lighting .... i pesonally dont do microgreens at the moment ..i am using my lights (t5) for plant starts for my traditional market garden (tomato,pepper,celery, peas ,beans, potato, and corn ,,,etc).. so im always on the lookout to make my starts stronger while under the lights before i harden them off for the field
We completely agree Debra! You are correct that we could've harvested sooner... The turnaround time would be a lot better and it would've cost less to run the lights and take up that space for 2 additional days... Thank you so much for your support and sharing!
I was wondering since I switched recently to all LED's and ditched the HID's.
So far, LED's are doing an amazing job and cost nothing to run for extended periods. Also gonna save us cooling cost in the summer since they don't put out as much heat.
Hi, we get I buy the led grow light. I live in Greece
I believe results for lowest most tray are skewed as all other trays have bottom heat from light below that seems to make quite a difference. Also high par also requires higher environmental temps to be most productive 83 to 85 for high par and below 80 for t5’s and middle rack leds
Divide your costs by 4 or multiply your produce weight by 4 since you have 4 trays per shelf/light set. Also, what is your cost per gram of produce? Spread your light rig upfront cost over the estimated time to failure (should be available if they are UL listed). You take that est. failure time and divide by time to maturity for an average tray... then multiply by four for the # of trays per light. Take the total cost of the light and divide by that number to get the estimated cost per tray of produce. Then add the running cost, like you did, but divide that by 4 trays as well. That, plus your water and fertilizer costs will be your gross cost per tray of produce. Now, take the sale price per gram multiplied by the grams for gross revenue. Subtract out the previously calculated cost per tray and you have the gross profit per tray. ...now you have the harder parts of overhead... salary, transportation costs for delivery, taxes, etc... Oooorrrrrr.... you can just look at how much you made and subtract what you spent at the end of the month. 😁
Great content. Thanks for the video and the research! keep up the good work :D
Thank you so much for the support!!
So bascially you get what you pay for?
Kind of...
Please do one with different color lights, by temperature (Sunlight being 6000 degrees). Interesting to see the yellow light win ( I know it had 50% more lux). Wonder what a blueish compared to reddish temp would do?
You guys always produce great content. Have you compared these rigs taking the longevity in consideration? How long will the T5's, the LED tubes and the high tier LED panels last and how much will they cost, say over the span of a year?
Great question and thank you for the support! The LED's are supposed to last over 50,000 hours... We have used ours now for about half a year at a rate of 17 hours a day. So far we've used 3,102 hours of their life (supposedly). To get it to a year, we would be at the 6,204 hour mark. At that rate, the cheap LED's should last about 8 years. The T5 HO Fluorescents are rated for only 10,000 hours total... We've used ours for a year at the same frequency as the LED's which means we have less than a year left on the Fluorescents before they go bad. So we would have to replace all of our Fluorescents next year at their premium price if we wanted to keep using them. Glad you asked, this would've been a great point to talk about in the video. Thank you for the continued support!
On The Grow Thank you for the answer 🙂
Do you have any advice on GAP compliance for MGreens?
Dude from migro does testing and most newer led lose about 5 to 7% every 6000 hrs so after 3 to 4 years they would be around 80% of original par light.
@@MrSportystv not true do your research 50000 hours on average and no loss of or degradation of light unlike hps hid or fluorescent
eye hort 1000w hps or sunmaster 1000 hps. go big... aeroponics r fastest...
We'll give these a try soon!
@@OnTheGrow def looking forward to seeing the results of that! my eye hort 600hps would put 2-3 inches of growth per 17hr day. back when i was running my c.a.p ebb and grow hydro system. i still do small hydro stuff. mostly just single pot pre bonsai. im using both led and clf similar to your shelf set up. just with more head room.
If you thumbs-downed this... Really? This is such a great video. Well shot, good editing, easy to follow, clear, concise.
Good job and very informative.
In addition to the extra weight, has any nutritional analysis been done to assess the quality of the product?
Great question! We have been wanting to do nutrient analysis for our experiments, the main issue is the cost to analyze. The cheapest nutrient analysis test I could find was $1,000 per test... so for a group of three different trays that would be $3,000 for a single experiment test.
I have also considered using a BRIX meter, but since it only analyzes the sugar content, I don’t think it’s a reasonable measurement.
We are open to other sources for the analysis of nutrition, so if you have any, please share!
Thanks!
@@OnTheGrow ?"go fund me"?
Sue Young we’ve considered that, but running a campaign like that is a lot of work and I personally don’t think it’s worth the cost or work to run the campaign. It would have to be a pretty epic experiment for me to justify spending thousands on an analysis...
@@OnTheGrow you might want to look into something called a chromatogram or chromatograph. I think some bio-dynamic growers have used them, or Rudolf Steiner may have suggested them years ago. I'd love to see the results of them if you get enough background info as to what those tests are good for! (should be a pretty inexpensive test I believe...uses a paper filter and tests a solution/puree or extraction of the plant matter I think) If you use this test, maybe try some also grown in 'natural light only' to compare.
@@OnTheGrow May be the dry weight can be a useful information for comparison too ... but unfortunately no information about nutrition
After a quick search I found a cheap product able (may be) to help to get some data : refractometer (réfractomètre en francais)
French page sorry : www.permaculturedesign.fr/mesurez-la-densite-de-nutriments-de-vos-fruits-legumes/
This refractometer is able to measure numbers of liquid (milk, alcohol, honey, salt water, Nutrient Density*, oil, and so more .. )
Measure Nutrient Density* according this video : th-cam.com/video/YO4L_jSxsAc/w-d-xo.html
I'll really interested to see a benchmark between 6 LED and full spectrum LED (benchmark for the same amount of LUX)
One last question, Did you try to make a test for Day / night growing VS 24/24 day
Thank for your great video !
Very very nice informative video sir...please sir say about different colour LED lights...
I've been trying to put together a Death Stranding critique and I'm trying to immerse myself in the post Apocalypse so I see you guys as fabulous preppers
We should hopefully have a pretty good system down for survival :) I want to get some solar and batteries on the growspace and then it could be off-grid.
How many hours a day are you running the lamps? Also have you ever considered adding skylights to the roof of your trailer to add some natural ambient light?
Great questions! We run our lights for 17 hours on and 7 hours off. We have considered it, but we wouldn’t be able to experiment with lights if we do that...
@@OnTheGrow very true plus cutting in skylights could get very expensive and not pay for itself for quite some time.
LED lights like the bottom typically have a longer lifespan too. So that would play into the cost, and you'll save money on energy use and light purchasing in the long term!
Absolutely! I discuss that in the first pinned comment. The LED’s will last 8 years and the fluorescents will last under 2 years!
Excellent test, thank you. I have the 18 watt lights in white and pink. I'm going to try 2 white and a pink pet shelf to see what happens. Keep it up man, I'm over in Azle north of Fort Worth and have 2 racks to try this out. First for the family to see how we like them, and then maybe hit a few farmers markets for fun on the weekends. I'm an aircraft engineer full time, so can't make a run at it like you guys, but I think it would be fun for the whole family to give it a go. If it works out, I have a 1200 sq foot insulated shop that I could convert if I wanted to. Solar panels coming, along with lithium ion batteries, so Browning this stuff of grid would be awesome, and doablea long as I stick with these leds. Use to grow corals when I was your age with 1200 watts of metal halide , and 440 watts of VHOs...... Want to talk about an electric bill!!!!!! Keep doing what your doing with the testing, I love it. I am also interested in doing mushrooms, if you ever decide to get into that.
Thank you so much for the support!! I can't even imagine that electricity bill! Microgreens are so dang tasty and really addictive once you start growing them... It went from hobby to passionate business for us very quickly. You could grow an incredible amount of microgreens in a shop that size! We are also interested in mushrooms and we should be attempting some in a few months. I hope they are easy enough to work with and we would love to make videos on it too! Thank you again for your support, it really does mean a lot to us.
Really good to see! I'm surprised by the results, I thought the 18w LEDs would be less productive than the others, but only just.
It would be good to see how the distance from the light to the crop would affect yield, also reflectors and side covers to
minimize light spill. Top job, subbed!
Where is the best place to buy these trays? Hydroponics shops?
They don't have them in hydroponic shops, but here's links to them on amazon and their site!
www.amazon.com/shop/onthegrowfarms?listId=DTGPX0RYY5R3
www.bootstrapfarmer.com/pages/all-products
Great test! I’ve been curious on different lights. I went with similar leds because of the low cost per light. Good to know they compare well.
Thank you for watching!!! 😄 Glad you enjoyed it!
so hard to really tell which is better on the micro scale. had a friend who did 1000w hps raddies hydro they were like beets or onions.. nothing beats 1000w hps. you'll get a tan too haha.. nice grow tho ..
Lol, we will give a big 'ol HPS a test soon. I'd likely only need one in the middle of our space to light everything :)
very cool..
Nice work, great comparison.
If my math is right, you got about 15% more product at double the energy usage between the different LED's. On paper, assuming a similar life span, it's obvious which LED's will take longer for your return of investment. But...
To me, the bottom tray was way more than 15% better looking. How many of your competitors are able to match that quality? They looked outstanding! And you said it cut better and felt better overall.
I suppose which LED's to invest in ultimately depends on who your customers will be, how much startup money you have, and what scale you want to grow your business to.
I'm going to splurge on a couple of those LED panels. Thanks for making my choice so much more informed.
Cheers!
Totally agreed on the LED's (300w) providing the best appearance and quality! I just wish that they were built to a higher quality, especially for the price. I got some new LED's in so I am hoping that they will produce similar quality produce!
Thanks for the continued support John!!
Hello, I followed your Amazon link, but I don't see the T5 LED - 18W lights, I see a 6-pack of T5 LED - 22W lights is there a link I'm missing? I assume the usage cost and heat factor would be higher with the 22W's?
As our test and clients feedback, LED grow tubes can provide 15% increase on harvest than flluorescent lamps. Nowdays, you could buy a led grow lamp with $2. I don't think these kind led tubes can really help you grain profit. Growers need high efficient but low price lamps for their plants. Maybe they can check VanqLED, who is a 13 years grow light factory.