RPG Retro Review: Dungeons & Dragons: Holmes Basic
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ต.ค. 2024
- A very special RPG Retro Review as I take a look back at the very first revision of the Dungeons & Dragons rules, the Blue Box Set of Basic D&D, or simply Holmes Basic. Stoke the campfire, sit back and relax as I tell the tale of how this edition came to be. Also, Check out these links:
Part 1: RPG Retro Review, D&D Rules Cyclopedia: • Retro RPG review 10: P...
Blueholme at Drive Thru RPG: www.drivethrurp...
Blueholme at Lulu: www.lulu.com/sp...
Zenopus Archives: sites.google.c...
This was the version of D&D that I started playing with. The paper dice. I could have ordered the polyhedral dice through the mail, but my parents refused to pay for it. "Why do you need special dice? Use the dice from one of your other games!" "But mom! This game needs special dice!" "Why should we order special dice when those paper chips work just fine for you? That game was expensive enough!" "But Mooooooooom!!!" That was pretty much the conversation.
Oh. My. God. The blue boxed set.
It's my first time playing again... You hit me right in the nostalgia.
Glad you enjoyed!!
me too, I had the basic set with B1 in it, not B2... it was all so new
The Blue Book cover art is iconic & for me captures the essential mood of D&D RP, putting the dragon and the dungeon into Dungeons & Dragons. The dragon stares menacingly out of the page & you get a sense that fiery breath is going to roar out of the picture. My response to that: 'This is a game I want to find out about and play'. Straight into the action. Although my obsession with D&D started with the original Gygax & Arneson rules set this edition is where the magic began. With this & Basic 2e Expert you have all the rules & content you need to play classic D&D. Don't bother with AD&D you won't be missing much & you will save a lot of money & space on your bookshelf.
I'm finding myself absolutely fascinated with the early history of D&D. The fact that the OSR has so many different retroclones of the same core rulesets might seem redundant to a lot of people, but I find it sort of charming, in a way. I especially love any books that try to replicate the look and feel of vintage books.
So while I love Basic Fantasy for its convenience and its passionate community, and while I'm loving really digging into White Box FMAG, there's something charming about the Blueholme Prentice Rules book that tells me I need to add it to my collection too, for the sake of...completion, I guess? ^^;
All I know is that I love the OSR community and its dedication to both historical preservation and reinvention. :)
Starting a sandbox Holmes game this afternoon and starting out with the Zenopus dungeon. :)
So many threads to pursue is this. Where did the mask come from? What happened to Zenopus? What else are those pirates up to? etc. Love it!
Excellent! It inspired me to dig up my original Holmes boxed set and Keep on the Borderlands. I uploaded a vid “Dungeons & Dragons 1st Edition Holmes Box Set TSR 1979 Grenadier Minis Keep on Borderlands Primer” I show the small white dice you had to rub with a crayon. I didn’t want to repeat what you said so I gave an overview and leaf thru the Holmes rulebook page-by-page. I give a primer to non-D&D players while I leaf thru Keep on the Borderlands. D&D had a stigma attached to it until the 300lb football coach started a D&D club then it was cool lol
Interestingly enough, I only recently noticed that my B2 Keep on the Boarderlands in the Holmes basic box is DIFFERENT from other B2 modules I have. It is written for Holmes version in that there is a DX score for all the monsters... AND most of the weapons do 1d6 damage. The 'tear away' sheet in the middle is also a duplicate of the tear away at the end of the Holmes booklet as well.
If I had noticed this before I would have included it in the video.
+captcorajus Very interesting! I hadn't seen other KotB modules. Yeah mine has a bomb burst violator is what we call it in graphic design "Special Instructional Module" and has the DX values and the reference sheet. The 4e Keep on the Shadowfell was a little different in that I think it had descriptions of the monsters instead of equipment at the bottom of the stat blocks which I think was helpful especially for a n introductory module. I know some of those old D&D modules were meant for organized tournament play. You can always add an annotation note to the vid. But yeah I wish I had shown a closeup of a Magic user and Cleric spell in mine ; )
I love this. Interestingly, my friends and I (aged 12 or 13 at the time) never found anything in this set confusing or frustrating. The fact that it was in print seemed to give it enough clout at our age, and the fledgling rule system sparked many discussions, imaginative improvisations, and research breaks when a PC's life was at stake. I benefited greatly from the comradery, problem-solving practice, and vocabulary jump-start that this game offered, and it's fun to see your take on this and others. Looking forward to your take on Gamma World and Top Secret. Thanks!
I too started here. Unbelievably I saw this on a shelf on a local Kmart and lusted after it for weeks, saving my chore monies. I excitedly picked it up and proceeded to be dumbfounded by the rules for about two years until we found a friend who’s brother knew how to play. My set was during the dice shortage so had the cut out chits. I found my first set of dice in the front counter of a local hobby/train shop.
This was a great synopsis of the beginnings of D&D! Cleared up some confusion I had in my mind in regards to how the ODD and Blue Book and AD&D are all related. Thanks! Keep churning these vids out!
This is the box I learned to play with! OH man I was hooked. Except for stepping pn that damn yellow D4 and a trip to the emergency room. I often wish I still had it.
Gary Gygax loved the passive voice.
"Why are you casting Magic Missile? There's nothing to attack here!"
"Uh, I'm attacking the darkness!"
LOL
Thank you for these videos on the history.
You're welcome!
That’s a good lookin doggo in the intro! Great review as well.
Yeah. I ended up with a copy of the "Blue Box" set as my first set. I can say this much. They did NOT achieve their goal of a "Beginners Set of Rules". Haha! I remember reading that book from cover to cover and still wondering where the rules were to actually PLAY the damn game. It wasn't until the release of the Red Box that we actually got rules that were somewhat comprehensible where I was able to say, "Okay. Now THIS is a game.". They wanted to write the "Blue Box" for people who were new who weren't experienced with these types of games, but I think the problem was that, like people who write technical manuals, just didn't know how at the time. Things that were obvious behaviors to them would never occur to the average person who had never gamed before.
Yeah, that's true. I got the blue box after I had already played the game so reading them was pretty upfront to me, but if I had never played the game before I probably wouldn't have understood how to play either.
This is where I started as well.
Took it with me on a week long geography field trip to the Lake District in high school, May '81 (age 15). Really didn't know how to play, but neither did anyone else and it didn't seem to detract from a hysterical evenings entertainment down the sample dungeon.
The party encountered a random group of Gnomes who teamed up with them. Unfortunately for the Gnomes, the party decided that physically throwing a Gnome ahead of them into each new room was tactically astute. I vividly recall the onlooking girls in the class (mostly Susans), who opted not to play, were in stitches.
Sheesh - that was nearly 40yrs ago.
Played AD&D 1e for the rest of the 80s and beyond (and most other RPGs as well). Just, finally, got the 5e rules (Xmas present) to see what has changed - unfortunately my old group(s) are scattered to the winds now.
I love your reviews. They're always on topics I enjoy, and your overview is a great way to get a feel for each adventure... BUT the intro music is so upbeat and I love to fall asleep listening to your playlist... That music at the beginning of every video is a sure thing to wake me back up!
Whatever the case, please keep up the great work!
I missed out on Holmes and by the time I got back to look at in adulthood, I was already in love with Moldvay B/X.
One rather quaint tidbit of trivia concerning the Holmes Edition is that unlike the later box sets that came later, it did not come stock with any dice. Instead, it came with a piece of cardboard with little numbered squares printed on it that you cut out and then draw from a hat or other container. It did come with a TSR brochure on other products that you could order, such as dice, modules, 1st ed AD&D books, and other games such as Gamma World, Top Secret, and Gangbusters. I actually played Gangbusters over at a buddy's place, come to think of it.
Actually, that's only true of the third printing. Later editions had rather poor quality polyhedral dice, but there was a dice shortage. I actually have copies of both. In addition the bonus material were different depending on the printing you have as well. The first printings came with dungeon geomorphs, after that it was B1, in search of the unknown, and the last few printings came with b2 Keep on the borderlands.
In addition, the KOTBL version in the Holmes set differs from the Moldvey version in that the monster statistics have Dexterity (DX) scores.
The only personal reference was the Holmes box set that my mother bought new back in the day. I didn't realize that there were different printings of that set...
Ours came with B2...
Frequent viewers of my channel often kid me that I have a PHD in D&D because I know trivial stuff like this off the top of my head. lol
i just started a 5th ed game with the tower of Zenopus witch i fleshed out to some small degree , namely got rid of the MT rooms and made the wizard a Necromancer . and all thanks to your review !
Not only did every weapon do the same amount of damage, there was an optional rule that small, light weapons could attack twice per turn. So if you used that rule daggers were twice as effective as spears or longswords.
This video made me realize why race as class seems so odd to me. I started with a Holmes blue box in 1980 and then went straight to AD&D. Thus I never encountered B/X or BECMI, or at least I never noticed that those use race as class, and Holmes and AD&D do not. Thank you for helping me solve this personal mystery!
This was so good. Thank you.
I'm binging on B/X / B.E.C.M.I. goodness and i want more .
I really want a series on how to play B/X \ B.E.C.M.I.
The more i watch & read .
The more i want in on joining the goodness .
My first D&D set! By the time any other kids I knew heard of D&E they were all getting rhe red box set and AD&D. I used my own books anyway, not knowing any different. When your DM is 10 years old the rules are stacked against you no matter what anyhow!
This was the place that I started at. I remember getting a set of somewhat disappointing dice included in the box. I think I got it shortly before the AD&D books started coming out because I never owned any of the original books and jumped straight to the monster manual and subsequent AD&D books. I agree about the sample adventure, I loved it so much.
Man i LOVE your Reviews. keep them Coming. Love the D&d old stuff. so much you havent scratched the surface..
I still have, and play, with the dice from the 1980 blue box set.
Hoping to See a Ravenloft Review. the Boxed set or the Castle Ravenloft module would be killer
I just purchased Blueholmes from Lulu. I want to compare it to other rule sets like White Box FMAG.
How did you like it?
This is the one I have, and it came with an awesome advert for a bunch of their other games, which is a trip.
Looking forward to your next Review
Good to see it again.
I enjoyed this video.
It’s interesting that BECMI and B/X versions are on DriveThruRPG by WotC but not the Holmes version.
Well done as always.
I started playing in late 79.
insane. fantastic historical context. very interesting
Nice one! You mention variable damage as being "much superior" to one die for all weapons. I've always been in two minds about this. ODD didn't (initially) use dice other than D20 and D6 so one die for weapon damage seemed sensible. The difference between D4, D6 and D8 are minuscule (well, 2 points) and becomes completely irrelevant as soon as the characters start levelling up. So for first levellers, it's a +2 or -2 bonus or penalty that averages out to 1D6. And...before I forget variable weapon damage was still an optional rule in Moldvay basic. Ouch! I've just realised the video is from 2015. So sorry to tap into an oldie but I'm working through them all. :-)
I came into D&D with Moldvay, through friends, but I actually purchased the Holmes set by accident as it was still out back then.
Greyhawk Supplement I introduced variable weapon damage, and I just think having different weapons doing different damage makes sense.... and lets face it... playing with different dice is just more fun IMHO.
So glad to hear you're enjoying the reviews. Game on!
@@captcorajus More fun? Definitely! I owned the Holmes version but couldn't fathom it (too young or too stupid) but when the Moldvay edition turned up at Christmas I was a very happy lad. Yep, I used variable damage. Today I'm an old-schooler (Delving Deeper is among my faves) and D6 is the way to go.
Ruins of the undermountain! Can't wait to see!
(My wallet on the other hand is terrified)
It's been said before but there's something charmingly terrible about that old artwork.
yah I agree...I preferred the early art--it still had that 70's vibe in there...it wasn't REALISTIC---I prefer the caricature style of the old
Nice one!
Could you a review on ACKS?
An OSR game that's getting quite an interest...
I've always wanted to get into D&D but unfortunately I don't have any friends T^T
PheseantNetsuke There are any number of ways to get involved. Some people run campaigns online, and local gaming shops sometimes have D&D events where you can get started. You can even download the current basic rules free from Wizards of the Coast, and many retroclone versions of earlier versions are completely free as well. ☺
thank you for sharing this.
Do we remember the cardboard Chits, cut outs that came w the set? Or is that just me.. lol
Nope, its not you. 3rd printing I believe was the dice shortage. I actually have a copy of that set, chits still uncut in the book.
awesome. I dont have dementia. lol.Its fantastic what you do. Sure you have heard this before, however, i always wanted to be an editor contributor to TSR in the old days. Thanks again.
Personally levels 1-3 are my favorites anyway.
enjoyed, great info :)
Just tried getting this on Drive thru. They DO NOT HAVE IT.
Yup. Holmes Basic has never commercially been released on PDF unfortunately.
Hey mate, thanks for the vid. Which set would you recommend for me and my 10yr old son to start using? I used to play basic then advanced about 30 something years ago. Any thoughts?
DAGGERS STRIKE FOUR TIMES FASTER THAN ZWEIHANDERS WITH THE SAME DAMAGE
Its true!!
@@captcorajus to quote a certain nerd with anger issues: "what were they thinking"
Turns out Gygax was thinking "uuuh, AD&D"
@@adzi6164 I'm fairly sure that with a two handed sword you roll 2d6 and keep the highest, so not exactly the same damage.
@@captcorajus I think this is just a very popular houserule
1d6 on all weapons could work pretty well with some "weapon type vs armor" rules... if it also applied to the natural AC of monsters (which is not the case for the table from OD&D's Greyhawk supplement)
How come there has never been a complete D&D book? Is that a fair question??? Inquiring minds want to know.
See D&D Rules Cyclopedia
The D and D rules cyclopaedia is a single volume compendium of the Basic, Expert, Companion, Master and (somewhat in summary form) the Immortals supplements. It's available from Drivethru rpg in a hardbound facsimile copy of the original print version, and is exactly the full Basic line of DnD in one single volume including the campaign world of Mystara, colour maps of the world and regions, and the bestiary. It will take you from level 1 to 36 and at highest levels permits players to become Immortals. All of the Gazetteers and adventures published for this version, and there are tons, are available on drive thru, and massively enrich the information in the races and cultures of Mystara.
"Superior variable weapon damage"? A knife in the heart kills you just as quick as a sword.
Yes, the starting adventure is magical to this day!
Thanks for the history lesson.
Alright, what's the good doggie's name?
Zeus
@@captcorajus He's a good boy. I hope he's still around (I know the video i dated).
@@larrylambert1220 He was a good boy. My buddy to be sure. Unfortunately, he's no longer with us.
That was a good review, Cap. I also loved your reviews of RC and the Gazetteers.
One thing though: Blueholme is good, but we got there first:
www.rpgnow.com/product/104536/Mazes--Perils-RPG?term=mazes+and+perils
In fact, Michael Thomas, Blueholme's author, did layout for us on Mazes & Perils.
Glen Hallstrom Wow! Very cool! I'll check it out! Thanks!
Glen Hallstrom That's very cool, btw. Do you have a Lulu project so one can get a hard copy?
captcorajus Unfortunately, no. We just have the pdf. Folks'll have to make their own on Lulu (although I had a nice spiral-bound copy made at Kinko's).
BUT, we're working on building a Kickstarter for a Deluxe version. I'm working on the cover and more art and Vince is elaborating on the manuscript. Hope to get it going by the end of the year.
Glen Hallstrom to make your game sing, you need a kickin' intro adventure, like the classic dungeon by Dr. Holmes. Don't overlook this key element.
Mike Hill Oh of course. Right now I'm running my grandson through Zenopus using Castles and Crusades and he's loving it.
Nice, brief overview. Wouldn't call Variable Weapon Damage "far superior," however.
; )
My dad had this set my mom ended up throwing it out
Tragic!!
Not sure what happened to my original copy - may still be a hidden treasure in my parents house! Don't remember ever having the box, only the book.
Bought another copy off ebay in the 2000s. I think my gf threw it out as an "old magazine" - along with a number of ICE Middle Earth modules which vanished at about the same time.
Further ebay'ing has given me two copies of the book now - a good condition copy with the wizard logo, and a more worn one with the daemon/imp logo.