This is why some higher end CNC machines (DMG-Mori NV5000 apparently) have motion sensors inside.... Once moved, you have to call HQ to unlock again, total nightmare for used market, IMO. Also fun, because LinuxCNC is fully 5axis capable, a cheap computer and maybe $500 for a couple of Mesa cards is all that's needed ;-D
@@unclejoeoakland PLCs aren't used to run CNC equipment, only as IO expansion, if at all. And if you weren't afraid of using google, you'd know that it's G2, G3, G8, G9.
@@KOTYAR1 To be fair, it's only on a few machines, mostly as a government thing, and quite arbitrary. You can run a Kern Micro HD inside a flying truck, and arguably it's way more spicy in terms of regulations than an NV5000.
I just want to say thanks for such interesting videos. I had no idea chips could be so fascinating, and the politics behind them even more so. You have really opened my eyes to what an interesting field this is. Your hard work is very much appreciated.
I've thought that chips were fascinating since I was a kid in the 1980s... Probably why I'm an electronics engineer now (we usually call them integrated circuits, or ICs). Politics, not so interesting to me.
Small note about Kongsberg, "våpenfabrikk" translates to "arms manufacturer", and is a branch of the Kongsberg firm. It is not usually necessary to include the second part, unless you are talking about several branches and want to adress them separately, i.e. "Kongsberg Marine" vs "Kongsberg Defense and Aerospace".
@@foobar6846 Don't be pedantic. Kongsberg might be best known as being a name of a city, but Kongsberg is also the name of many other places and things. Using the name 'Kongsberg' in the context of technology and manufacturing when referring to Kongberg Gruppen or it's relevant subsidiary is fine. It isn't like there are multiple arms manufacturers using the Kongsberg name, so it should confuse none.
16:22 "The fine for the 17 million dollar sale was a tiny 14k dollars" - there is the saying "A fine is called a fine, because of the sound companies make when receiving one: 'Oh, fine...'"
The technology in question was also not the propeller CNC machines directly, but rather the lithography equipment to make microelectronics to control them
Speaking about submarines, more recently Thailand had found iteslf in a fix as it's planning to buy subs from China, whose engines are to be supplied by German company MTU, but which is no longer possible as EU is now more strictly enforcing export sanctions (introduced after the _Tian An Men_ incident in 1989) against the engines being sold for use to China (since the engines could be used not only for civilian but also for military applications)
I remember when this story broke. It was quite the scandal. This allowed the Soviet subs to run quieter. Before this the joke was that all you needed to hear a Soviet sub was to stick your ear to the pressure hull of your ship.
Frankly I don't see why anybody should pay attention to what the US Government wants. Not like they have a squeaky clean reputation. Rather, they make the CCCP look like nice guys,
Having grown up learning to "duck & cover" before the Nixon administration gave up on the concept of protecting the civilian population from nuclear attack by signing the ABM Treaty embracing the doctrine of Mutual Assured Destruction, when news broke that Toshiba had assisted the Soviet Union learning to evade our boomer subs I swore I'd never buy anything they made ever again, and still avoid it where possible. I've found a few Toshiba hard drives in various computers I've owned, but I still won't buy anything branded by them. I love Holland and have visited their country five times, but if they fight a ban on shipment of 5nm lithography machines to Chynah, I'll boycott Dutch products for the rest of my life, short though that may be. Every dime hurts.
Great video, as always. In a similar vein, it would be great to get your take on the sale of Imagination Technology to China (after Apple dumped them / poached their staff for "Apple" silicon) and the licensing of their IP in the new "home grown" Moore Threads GPUs.
Remembering this breaking the news i 87. I was 7. My father explained it as having sold silent electric motors to the CCCP. Makes me wonder if initial coverage was not accurate, and if so, was it on purpose?
I remember this very well. I wouldn't buy Toshiba anything after that, to this day. What I didn't know was that Kongsberg WF was involved. My uncle worked there!
There is another example on selling the technology of producing '286' microchip by Japan to East Germany. US preasure on Japan reversed the whole deal. Japan returned every penny (1 bill). With a gusto.
Saudi Arabia: an acceptable dictatorship? Why so much tolerance towards a regime that violates human rights The Russophobia of the Atlanticists knows no bounds When the dollar lost its gold standard because there was not enough American gold in 1973, an offer from US Secretary of State Kissinger to the Saudis was that the Americans would provide military protection to the Saudi royal family. to agree to denominate all of the kingdom's oil sales. exclusively in dollars. America funded its research programs by printing dollars and assigning European minds
I remember a Soviet engineer not long after the fall of the Soviet Union. He said that the USSR built the worlds largest hydraulic press, the world's largest aircraft, the world's largest dam, and the world's largest microchips.
Just as with the Soviets choosing to steal western electronics technology, the downside of copying is crippling your own research and development infrastructure; your scientists and engineers spend time learning old technology and fall further behind new advances. It also makes you vulnerable to being cut off from copying in time of war. Sometimes the shortcuts take longer.
That was Regan's times, he was not a businessman. Another president would sold the rope to hang himself for another "Trump tower". 8 years without technologies and bunch of presidents, lobbyists and businessmen to give it all for money. All they needed is war, there is no reason to spend time and resources on something else.
That's the theme of a previous video of this channel about Soviet computers: They copied IBM's mainframes but when they had a "workable" system they were late to move from mainframes to minicomputers to PCs. The Soviets weren't fighting toe-to-toe with the entire West but with IBM.
One story I heard about back in the 80's was when the Soviets managed to have a Digital Equipment VAX 11/780 shipped, which at the time was a top-of-the-line minicomputer. They were able to get the order through a bunch of shell companies and the computer, which was the size of a number of large refrigerators, was crated and in transit. However, US Customs was on to it and managed to intercept the shipment in one of the Scandinavian countries, I forgot which. US Customs agents removed the computer from its crate, replaced it with a bunch of concrete blocks, sealed the crate, and sent it on its way. The agents said they would've loved to see the look on faces when the crate was delivered and opened. Another story had to do with microchips. Chip designers at Digital Equipment wrote on their chips in Russian, viewable under a microscope, "VAX - When you care enough to steal the very best."
I heard a story about the VAX that did get through the customs. The Soviets started to use it, but it quickly run out of disk space. So they did an in-depth investigation of what was going on. It turned out that Western intelligence had added come code to the operating system, to collect data on what was done on the computer. The data was supposed to be periodically sent out. But in the USSR the network was much less developed, and the computer was simply not connected to the Internet. While the routine was unable to communicate with the control center, in the meantime it just kept writing the data into a file. Since this continued for some time, eventually all the space was filled. And that's how it was discovered. Sounds too dumb to be true, but who knows...
Thank you for bringing up historical parallels in the subjects you explore. It is a great contrast to the headline-chasing click-baiting dreck that worms its ways into the explainer/video essay corner of TH-cam.
If we look at the Russian defense industry today, the entire floors at the top factories there are filled with ultra-precision CNC machinery from Germany, Switzerland, Austria. Yesterday's story about the relatively mundane american CNC machines recently delivered to Russia during the war is just the tip of the iceberg.
Yup, If you watch the TH-cam channel of the Russian Defense Industry "Combat Approved", they showcase different Russian weapon systems and their manufacturing process, their factories and manufacturing complexes are indeed filled with western equipment from CNC to PCB verification machines.
It always strikes me as a weird double standard that no business in a western nation manufactures without a completely global source of tooling (German, Italian, Chinese, American machines all under one roof) but the second its a non-western country people say its a lack of independence, national capability, copying, or even being directly "enabled" as a puppet state if the VAST majority of machines aren't entirely indigenous (as in design, manufacture and support). And for reference I work quality control for manufacturing these days, so while that doesn't give me any "expertise" to judge design, I can speak with reasonable authority about how quickly the phone call goes overseas if something isn't going as planned.
Welp, the industrial base in post soviet Russia deteriorated heavily. So much infact, a tractor company funded to make 100% homegrown russian tractors couldnt do better than buy disassembled czech tractors and assemble them in their factory, its that bad.
The current cars made at Moskvich car assembly after French cut ties after Putin's aggression on Ukraine, are in fact Chinese cars, disassembled and put together at factory. One can purchase the same car Chinese outside of Russia and lover cost. I remember when being a young tennager purchasing a small 2.5ccm model motor, which failed to run. After taking it apart and inspecting, I knew why it never built compression. I guess many living Eastern Block had the same experience with products from former USSR.
@@SheepInACart It's not a double standard because western countries don't usually claim to be independent of other (western) countries. We don't see dependency on another country as a major issue. Countries like Russia or China are held to a different standard because they strive to be independent entities, not aligned with the west but in competition, and so we expect their supply chains to be independent of the west as well.
Toshiba got really fucked in the warrantee area because of this. They were a major manufacturer of consumer electronics that were exported to the USA. When Toshiba got banned from importing to the USA, they lost the ability to supply repair parts to USA retail establishments. They still however had to maintain their warrantees. This meant that whenever something as simple as a fuse went bad, Toshiba had to refund the entire wholesale price if the product was still under warrantee and VCRs broke very easily during that time. I don't know if Toshiba paid to have the refunded merchandise shipped back to Japan or if they were even allowed to. They may have just gotten dumped in the trash.
This just shows how sick and rotten the American system of trade restrictions and embargos is. Thanks to the Great China their time is over. The new century will be one of Chinese trade and not American (trade) wars.
Was there any consequence on the French company for selling the similar machine? How come both company selling similar machines but only the Japanese got blame ?
They were put on trial in Luxembourg, see the Oct. 1987 NY Times article "FRENCH LINKED TO SOVIET SALE" (I'd post a link but TH-cam seems to delete them). The French company involved did not sell a propeller CNC milling machine, they sold American-made lithography equipment to make microelectronics to control said CNC machines.
Unregulated capitalism proves it will risk giving an enemy a figurative gun to make a buck. Companies in large don't give a shit what happens with their product as long as its profitable. This whole "not my problem" attitude is why we need so much regulation.
"The imperialists are so hungry for profits that they will sell us the rope with which to hang themselves." PRC's CCP listened and followed through with Nixon
@@engineeriumm Yeah, aware but it seems like they spent too much building their HSL network and they overbuilt, just need him to cover the economics and the current state of it
Toshiba was the Huawei and Astom. Japanese politicians were too corrupt and too weak. NHK ran a documentary programme about Japan was told to stop their OS that was way ahead of DOS.
I was at a conference in 1987 when I heard a Compaq engineer say to a Toshiba rep that selling the propeller tech to the Russians really upset the US. I thought propeller-Toshiba? Toshiba was a laptop leader then...Compaq took over.
@pais culebra OK, there was an undercurrent of fear and loathing of Japan. But you are basically saying that asianometry's post was off base. In spite of a very robust yen which impacted Japanese exports, Japanese computer companies such as Hitachi, Fujitsu/Amdahl and NEC were doing great in the US before the scandal.
@pais culebra The tarifs were imposed 1 month after the US found out about the scandal. Even Electronic News had troubling figuring out the problem the issue with the semiconductor agreement
@pais culebra Had an uncle who was in international business in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s. Fought against the Japanese in WWII. A quiet, intelligent peaceful man. He would do no business with the Japanese. Times change but could never forget or forgive whatever it was he had seen.
Most people don’t know that a lot of the Japanese companies that makes cars and electronics today were building military ships, submarines, aircraft…etc for the Japanese army before defeat. If Japan starts to build their own military again we will have a superpower in no time.
There really isn't much of Japanese electronics industry left, not like it used to be. Engineering subcontracted to Taiwan, manufacturing anywhere abroad. I don't know if they can rebuild it like that. Automotive and heavy are holding on. Foremost if they were to become a military power like that, it would be weak to sanctions if they were to choose the wrong enemy, not necessarily threatening. But i do expect that militarization of Japan is potentially starting soon, in order to have defensive capability against China.
So apparently USSR build their economy after ww2 with lend lease lefovers which were: 400,000 jeeps & trucks 14,000 airplanes 8,000 tractors 13,000 tanks 1.5 million blankets 15 million pairs of army boots 107,000 tons of cotton 2.7 million tons of petrol products 4.5 million tons of food And then stole technology of a first launch satelite to lauch a first satelite and then stole Gagarin to launch him first into space. Bold assumption that country that is right now have the largest fleet of the most advanced nuclear submarines (which they designed and built) can't do stuff on their own. US and west only good at buying out and capitalizing on other people's techologies. Not that good at actually creating them any better than anyone else.
About the Toshiba propeller issue, I am proud to say that in the late 1980s I worked for a major PC and peripherals distributor where I bet my career to terminate carriage of all Toshiba products. I won the argument, so to speak. Inquiries or RFPs from major accounts thus affected were referred to me, where I presented a package of relevant published materials describing the damage to US/western security. This was generally well received. Over the next half decade this cost Toshiba..... well, a lot of sales revenue. Very satisfying. But enough was enough, and today I own a Toshiba laptop.
I have a New in Box old-tech Toshiba rice cooker from the 70s. Toshiba doesn’t make any new compelling products. Instead of Cloning IBM mainframes, MITI failed to fund basic science investments. Toyota vehicles are favored by insurgents. (Free advertising). Toshiba is a conglomerate and one arm did something bad. Glad if your laptop choice fits your need. I’m winTel/Apple/*Nix & retired, but loved Fujitsu SANs.
There isn't anyting particular about Toshiba laptop is there? Last i looked they were mostly Compal machines like many others, basically every brand carries somewhat customised macines made by Taiwanese ODMs. Which is a story in and of itself, since back then i expect Compaq was one of the major benefactors of Toshiba business being shunned. And guess what Taiwanese company they spun off.
@@SianaGearz Wasn't bragging on Toshiba laptops. Client gave me one out of a lot, as a tip/gift. So, it picked me, and we get along. Honestly, it doesn't matter anymore except at the very extremes, does it? The vast middle are all overkill. Cheers.
@@SianaGearz Toshiba branded laptops used be reasonably priced and reliable way BITD. As a conglomerate/Zaibatsu, Toshiba did naughty on the CNC and iirc NEC had input as well. As a US partner country it was a dumb move that a Toshiba’s Conglomerate’s Branch did something so stupid along with NEC.
So. Toshiba went under then just like Enron did for accounting fraud ?... So basically your decisions to kill their sales forced them to be creative with their accountancy. And this indirectly also led to the 2008 financial crashes.... Lol... God.. everything makes sense if we stopped to think about things. This indirectly boomed a sector of accounting software's to ensure that everything was above board etc. And even now. Same things...
Well..I have an other one for you. In short... How Pakistan got his nuclear bomb. The dutch in all their innocense and naivitee had a pakistani scientist working with their most sensitive documents and took a one way trip back to pakistan when he had it all... sorry..
I bought myself and my father a Toshiba CD player just prior to the espionage story came out. They still work. Soon, those CD players disappeared from the market.
"In any system of energy, Control is what consumes energy the most. No energy store holds enough energy to extract an amount of energy equal to the total energy it stores. No system of energy can deliver sum useful energy in excess of the total energy put into constructing it. This universal truth applies to all systems. Energy, like time, flows from past to future".
If we compare CNC machines to cars, Haas would be an equivalent of a Chevrolet Cavalier. Russians mostly buy expensive German machines which are like a high-end Mercedes. One should certainly investigate why American machines are still being delivered to Russia, but focusing on Haas as something exceptional is barking the wrong tree.
@@cogoid - Keep in mind the accusations came from the Ukrainian government (which is almost as dishonest as the Russian government) and they were vehemently denied by Haas. But to your point about German machines: they may be “German” machines, but there’s almost certainly a lot of American tech in those things.
@@ClockworksOfGL It is quite possible that Haas machines were delivered to Russia in October 2022, as the story alleged. But I also think Haas is being factual in their rebuttal -- if they say that no machines have left from their factory in California for Russia once the sanctions were imposed, it is probably so. Considering how long it takes for a distributor to deliver the machines, both facts can be true simultaneously without contradiction.
Airbus also benefits from the experience of Russian experts and has a design center in Moscow. Founded in 2003 as a joint company by Airbus, AFK Sistema and KASKOL Group, the Aiurbus Engineering Center in Russia (ECAR) was the first to be established by the company outside the EU.
A friend of mine worked on the Soviet space shuttle they all flew down too cape Canaveral and bought every poster and book on the US space shuttle. It's how they copied it.
I remember this well. I studied in the city of Kongsberg 85-88 and we were working on a project to connect the CNC machines at the school to a LAN. The CNC machines was programmed using a paper strip that was fed into the reader. By connecting the reader to the LAN the communication with the CNC was greatly improved. I remember that the Kongsberg company was split into smaller companies after the incident.
As egregious as the French sales were, The Toshiba kongsberg scandal was far worse. France did not share a land border with the Soviet Union. Norway did. The Japanese considered some of its islands occupied by the Soviets and now Russia. I Soviet submarines were a constant hazard for Japan. The sale should have been treated as nothing short of treason with the result being industrial sepaku to set an example for others. Unfortunately, living under the American nuclear umbrella and having American bases on countries infantilizes their politics. Grievance is a poison to the mind and soul and destroys the body politic. We are seeing what it does in America now.
for Japan, non of those actually matter because they have already surrender all their sovereignty to the US. The best they can hope for is somehow the US get into conflict with another super power and they'd be free from it.
Was in the U.S. Navy submarine service. When these two companies sold computerized milling equipment to the USSR, the Soviet submarines all of a sudden became a lot more quieter. That put U.S. sailors at a higher risk. I haven't owned a Toshiba product since nor will I in the future. My Toshiba stereo system went flying out my bedroom and into an alley, where it shattered into many pieces.
@@Razielchan666 The U.S.S.R. was more of a threat to their own sailors. Had to change out the crews every three year because the had hit the life time dosage of radiation.
Like many international organizations (UN such as UNCLOS violations, WTO on technology theft, etc.), it seems like these organizations don't have a good way to police themselves and punish violators. At best complaints are raised but no one suffers from the violation of the rules agreed to.
It's really ironic... If this had been stopped as it should, Russia wouldn't be able to produce anything to modern standards of tolerance and efficiency, leaving them dead in the water... Seems to me though, that this "drip-feed" of manufacturing equipment, slows down Russian manufacturing enough for them to be a threat that requires a strong and profitable western military industry complex, but still weak enough that they can't take on the west head on, AND makes bank for western companies from sales of the equipment.
_a demonstration that this was no ploy to win sales for American businesses_ ... or maybe a demonstration that that is exactly what it is: _He also pointed out that the lithography ban directly benefitted American semiconductor equipment makers of items not covered by the bans_
One thing is wrong: There are no international trade restrictions, but american imposed trade restrictions. Giving a shit about COCOM, was a brave and admirable attitude of the japanaese industry and government.
I don't get why USSR couldn't build their own. They had the tools to build the tools. And regardless of what one thinks of the USSR or the quality of their products, they had no shortage of brilliant engineers. If you can build a submarine, you can build a damn CNC milling machine.
It is an excellent question. USSR did build some unique metalworking machines -- there is a famous example of an extra large mill which Japan bought from the USSR. Soviets also originated some important technologies, like EDM machining -- but were never able to commercialize it as successfully as western vendors did. I think there are many reasons, but the most basic one is that nobody really builds anything on their own. Stuff gets built within an ecosystem of whatever components and know-how is available. And it is prohibitively expensive to grow such advanced ecosystems in isolation, unless there is a real market for them. For example, US military have spent serious money on development of image sensors, and they had respectable results. But when image sensors became essential for a consumer market, the amount of investment became so much larger, that the progress accelerated enormously, and now every smartphone has inexpensive cameras with such performance which a decade ago no secret agency could afford. So, USSR was simply missing too many parts -- power electronics, precision bearings, drives, etc. They could not import them, and bootstrapping the whole CNC industry in a bubble was beyond their means. There were probably other important structural reasons, but that would require a dissertation to cover.
It is not the engineers. It is the leaders who screwed up. Not saying western political leaders are smarter but they know to get out of the way from consumer-business-research relation enough to let private development breathing space.
But can they make a better one than what they can steal cost-effectively? Really they did a mix of both and stuck with whatever worked best. It takes an ungodly amount of resources to develop and manufacture top of the line microchips, something the soviets had a hard time justifying. Obviously you need those for a good CNC machine and military equipment. They took the approach of making "good enough" chips instead of trying to take the technological lead. Who knows where else they would have had to cut corners if they put all their resources into microchip R&D
Asianometry did a video on soviet computers you may want to check out that covers the whys in part. But another reason is the lack of precision, computerized machining necessary to build these things among others. There is also the same reasons why the Russians cannot replace Western technology with indigneous solutions on their private markets and why they expect all the BMWs, Audis and Mercedes cars on their roads to blow out eventually. They cant source the parts and their manufacturing is not sophisticated enough for production of indigneous, adequate replacement parts.
I remember when Nixon opened up China they were going to build 707s under license. But they didn't really care about the 707. What they were interested in was the inertial navigation systems. "In fact, it was President Nixon's visit to China in 1971 that inspired the sale of Boeing 707s to China. " "Working in secret, Chinese aircraft engineers have taken one of the Boeing 707 jetliners bought by China in 1972 and built their own copy of it" (Including it's inertial navigation system.....which could be used on their ICBM program.
From the video, I didn't sense any proof that Toshiba's machine was the main source for improvements to the Russian propeller as many other European countries also supplied various equipment and technologies. The main enabler would be the software design tools as no matter how sophisticated the milling equipment, the result only be as better if the design was more advanced. It may be picking on Toshiba because US biased for Europe.
You don't think Soviet Union has top notch engineers and mathematicians who can throw together a program that spits out specialised G-code, or even hand write G-code with logarithmic rulers and punch cards? I saw the tail end of that era first hand there. Things they could develop on paper were well far ahead of things they could actually manufacture. Getting from quantity of 1 to quantity of 100 or more was a problem. I don't have any particular rebuttal to your conjecture that they would have achieved this result with French made machines, i don't know about that. But by all reason you do need more axis for the surface quality, not suitable for simple copy milling.
I thought ASML EUV machines had systems and intellectual property rights in them from the US. So, even is ASML did go against the US and said they would sell the machines it couldn't. Not sure if the same applies to Deep UV.
I think that you will find that it was the British Labour government of the day that sold the Rolls Royce engine design to their mates in the Soviet union.
The chain is only as strong as its weakest link. This is especially problematic when your technology is pretty much alone at the top of the world, and your enemies are prepared to go to great lengths and pay any price to get their hands on it.
In 1870 the Russian Aeronautical Society was established. In 1880, on the initiative of Dmitry Mendeleev, Mozhaisky's aircraft became one of the world's first heavier-than-air aircraft. 1904 an aerodynamic institute was established in Kuchino, led by Russian scientist Nikolai Zhukovsky founding creator of hydro and aerodynamics Dmitry Grigorovich the world's first seaplanes 1911, the Russian Technical Society organized the first international aeronautical exhibition a galaxy of scientists Keldysh, Sedov, Lavrent'ev, Khristianovich, H E. Kochin, L. N. Sretensky and...' Sikorsky's Russian aircraft Russian aircraft Roussky Vityaz 1913 inventor the Russian helicopter fleeing the communist regime Igor Ivanovich Sikorsky 1920 Sukhoi, MiG, Tupolev, Iliushin, Yakovlev, Beriev and Irkut ....... more than 30 design offices and builders, most closed after the fall of the Union father of RUSSIAN stealth technology Pyotr Yakovlevich Ufimtsev a physicist and mathematician 34% of civil aircraft were exclusively manufactured by Russia in Soviet times Russia is the only republic in the Soviet Union that builds aircraft russia over a century aircraft industry France buys engine technology from ge aviation 1975 CFM International airbus 1979 Franco-German-Spanish project
Russian planes for over a century in the aviation industry Russian planes for over a century in the aviation industry (Before the communist era) Boeing 787 designed by Russian engineers at Boeing's Moscow offices Do not believe me you have a search engine In 1880, on the initiative of Dmitry Mendeleev Mozhaisky, the aircraft became one of the world's first heavier-than-air planes 1904 , an aerodynamic institute was established in Kuchino, headed by Russian scientist Nikolai Zhukovsky, founding creator of hydro and aerodynamics Dmitry Grigorovich the world's first seaplanes 1911, the Russian Technical Society organized the first international aviation exhibition a galaxy of scientists Keldysh, Sedov, Lavrent'ev, Khristianovich, H E. Kochin, L. N. Sretensky and ... ' Russian aeronautics by Sikorsky Rousski Vitiaz 1913 1920 Sukhoi, MiG, Tupolev, Iliushin, Yakovlev, Beriev and Irkut ....... more than 30 design offices and manufacturers, the most closed after the fall of the Union father of RUSSIAN stealth technology Pyotr Yakovlevich Ufimtsev a physicist and mathematician inventor the Russian helicopter flee the communist regime Igor Ivanovich Sikorsky 34% of civilian airplanes were exclusively made by Russia in Soviet times Russia is the only republic in the Soviet Union that has been building Russian planes for over a century in the aviation industry Airbus 1979 Franco-German-Spanish project Sikorsky Russky Vityaz 10 May 1913 The Father Of The Helicopter The civil war began in 1917 and ended in 1923 with a communist coup, killing 12 million Russians and escaping 3 million of the scientific elite. You can verify every piece of information you wrote There is a huge media war against the Russians, the American political class has not changed for 40 years and the death of communism are you a communist Why did you only destroy churches and kill Christians? Why did you bring minorities to Russia, why did you make Ukraine and Belarus republics? When Caesar is killed, how do you kill children by order of Lenin the killer?
Typical example of why EU is an American colony, and not a union of independent states. "We (Dutch company) are not allowed to export EUV to China". The Big Sam said so, so we have to obey.
lesson #1 don't spend anything on the military. million$fake hole plugged w/billion$ temporary&leaking cork. billion$fake hole plugged w/trillion$ temporary&leaking cork. price of fish&rice? anyone hungry?oh poo,hadda giv all the food to the world's soldiers
What's strange is the TV pundits Terrible confusion Between Russia and the Soviet Union They don't believe the Soviet Union disappeared like Yugoslavia
There are Chinese PLA Generals within the last few years that have talked about their future plans after they defeat the US and how they will use the mainland United States as one giant plantation with all non-Chinese being second class citizens who will work on the farms to feed their Chinese overlords. They want to do this because most of China's soil and groundwater is completely contaminated. Obviously, that's a very weird and creepy thing to say, but it just shows you that the PRC is not a peaceful government, and they absolutely have neo-imperial goals and weirdly enough their plan seems eerily similar to Heinrich Himmler's plan for Russia after they defeated the Soviets. The point of all of this is to remember to never willfully sell your enemy the means in which to destroy you with.
Restrictions are not fair by default. You canot make them fair in any way. They might be needed, but never fair. It is one player that has control pushing those that they control to unfairness towards one that they don't like which does not have such control. It is an unfair act by nature. Think of it like the populars in school that tell to their friends: you can be my friend only if you bully this guy that I like to bully. Oh, that's exactly what it is: economic bullying.
please for the love of all that is holy look up how to pronounce Norwegian words if you're going to say them! "vappenfabrikk" got a good chuckle but it's so simple to pronounce the "Å" it does frustrate me slightly :P
So again in the case of chip technology and machines it is oke for American companies to sell the technology to china but it’s not alowed for other countries…. While at the same time America itself uses /makes technology from the stone ages 🤣…. That nobody wants to buy.
I always wondered how the Soviets managed to produce the Akula which was so ahead of it's time - and as always it's STEM technology at the end of the day. Thanks for covering such interesting episodes in recent history!
This is why some higher end CNC machines (DMG-Mori NV5000 apparently) have motion sensors inside....
Once moved, you have to call HQ to unlock again, total nightmare for used market, IMO.
Also fun, because LinuxCNC is fully 5axis capable, a cheap computer and maybe $500 for a couple of Mesa cards is all that's needed ;-D
Motion, tilt, and GPS. All battery-backed, and none can be turned off or the control locks out.
What brands of PLC can handle ellipses? For that matter, what is the G code for ellipse?
@@unclejoeoakland PLCs aren't used to run CNC equipment, only as IO expansion, if at all.
And if you weren't afraid of using google, you'd know that it's G2, G3, G8, G9.
Holy s***. I've heard how in USSR it was punishable for workers to discuss politics near the USA made machinery, amusing to see it become reality
@@KOTYAR1 To be fair, it's only on a few machines, mostly as a government thing, and quite arbitrary. You can run a Kern Micro HD inside a flying truck, and arguably it's way more spicy in terms of regulations than an NV5000.
I just want to say thanks for such interesting videos. I had no idea chips could be so fascinating, and the politics behind them even more so. You have really opened my eyes to what an interesting field this is. Your hard work is very much appreciated.
Hear, hear! ❤
I've thought that chips were fascinating since I was a kid in the 1980s... Probably why I'm an electronics engineer now (we usually call them integrated circuits, or ICs).
Politics, not so interesting to me.
Small note about Kongsberg, "våpenfabrikk" translates to "arms manufacturer", and is a branch of the Kongsberg firm. It is not usually necessary to include the second part, unless you are talking about several branches and want to adress them separately, i.e. "Kongsberg Marine" vs "Kongsberg Defense and Aerospace".
You say Kongsberg Gruppen or Kongsberg Group when you refer to the technology group and their subsidiaries. Kongsberg is a city.
@@foobar6846 Don't be pedantic. Kongsberg might be best known as being a name of a city, but Kongsberg is also the name of many other places and things. Using the name 'Kongsberg' in the context of technology and manufacturing when referring to Kongberg Gruppen or it's relevant subsidiary is fine. It isn't like there are multiple arms manufacturers using the Kongsberg name, so it should confuse none.
16:22 "The fine for the 17 million dollar sale was a tiny 14k dollars" - there is the saying "A fine is called a fine, because of the sound companies make when receiving one: 'Oh, fine...'"
@@TUXmint1.7 million wouldn’t hurt
Another high quality video. Thank you Mr Asianometry
Indeed. But it was Nixon who was responsible for opening up China. Carter didn't help, but Nixon started it.
Excellent video as always! What happened with the French company that violated the restrictions first with propeller machines?
Nothing.
The technology in question was also not the propeller CNC machines directly, but rather the lithography equipment to make microelectronics to control them
Speaking about submarines, more recently Thailand had found iteslf in a fix as it's planning to buy subs from China, whose engines are to be supplied by German company MTU, but which is no longer possible as EU is now more strictly enforcing export sanctions (introduced after the _Tian An Men_ incident in 1989) against the engines being sold for use to China (since the engines could be used not only for civilian but also for military applications)
another well researched, well presented and very informative video. thank you for all the work and then sharing.
ITAR violation penalties should be extreme as a deterrence to protect us all from our enemies and potential enemies.
I remember when this story broke. It was quite the scandal. This allowed the Soviet subs to run quieter. Before this the joke was that all you needed to hear a Soviet sub was to stick your ear to the pressure hull of your ship.
Yikes, my cousin worked at Kongsberg Automotive i Sweden, but was stationed in Japan from 2017-2019. I'm gonna ask if he's heard about this 😏
Frankly I don't see why anybody should pay attention to what the US Government wants. Not like they have a squeaky clean reputation. Rather, they make the CCCP look like nice guys,
Having grown up learning to "duck & cover" before the Nixon administration gave up on the concept of protecting the civilian population from nuclear attack by signing the ABM Treaty embracing the doctrine of Mutual Assured Destruction, when news broke that Toshiba had assisted the Soviet Union learning to evade our boomer subs I swore I'd never buy anything they made ever again, and still avoid it where possible. I've found a few Toshiba hard drives in various computers I've owned, but I still won't buy anything branded by them. I love Holland and have visited their country five times, but if they fight a ban on shipment of 5nm lithography machines to Chynah, I'll boycott Dutch products for the rest of my life, short though that may be. Every dime hurts.
But i bet you love Ford dont you...
@@newone-gd9sk I've never owned one. I've purchase five Toyotas new, and driven them until the wheels fell off.
Great video, as always. In a similar vein, it would be great to get your take on the sale of Imagination Technology to China (after Apple dumped them / poached their staff for "Apple" silicon) and the licensing of their IP in the new "home grown" Moore Threads GPUs.
"Coffezilla investigation" that was a nice one
Yeah it is very strange how the US have always traded with countries that were considered mortal enemies shortly before or at the moment of trade.
Remembering this breaking the news i 87. I was 7. My father explained it as having sold silent electric motors to the CCCP. Makes me wonder if initial coverage was not accurate, and if so, was it on purpose?
I remember the reports at the time. They were definitely about machines for making propellers for subs.
I remember this very well. I wouldn't buy Toshiba anything after that, to this day. What I didn't know was that Kongsberg WF was involved. My uncle worked there!
BAD Toshiba, very bad!
10:20 Toshiba
4:45 marshall plan true intentions
12:35 disadvantage for Japan
14:45 whistleblower
Nice nod to Coffeezilla.
High quality video as usual
So the machines the French sold weren't the cause , only the machines the Japanese sold?
15:25 Why is it amazing that Toshiba's president kept the lie up?
Soviets searched the west and found one "Toshiba"????.... Its from far east(Japan) for god sake..
There is another example on selling the technology of producing '286' microchip by Japan to East Germany. US preasure on Japan reversed the whole deal. Japan returned every penny (1 bill). With a gusto.
This is totaly BS. Get your Red Pill.
Saudi Arabia: an acceptable dictatorship? Why so much tolerance towards a regime that violates human rights
The Russophobia of the Atlanticists knows no bounds
When the dollar lost its gold standard because there was not enough American gold in 1973, an offer from US Secretary of State Kissinger to the Saudis was that the Americans would provide military protection to the Saudi royal family. to agree to denominate all of the kingdom's oil sales. exclusively in dollars.
America funded its research programs by printing dollars and assigning European minds
Credibility of historical information is optional, according to how much you're paid to believe.
Great reporting, thanks.
I remember a Soviet engineer not long after the fall of the Soviet Union. He said that the USSR built the worlds largest hydraulic press, the world's largest aircraft, the world's largest dam, and the world's largest microchips.
They used vacuum tubes for many things. This was actually a benefit in some ways. Nuclear EMP proof.
Lol
"Coffeezilla style investigation" - never though I'd see the day when that phrase would be uttered.
Just as with the Soviets choosing to steal western electronics technology, the downside of copying is crippling your own research and development infrastructure; your scientists and engineers spend time learning old technology and fall further behind new advances. It also makes you vulnerable to being cut off from copying in time of war. Sometimes the shortcuts take longer.
That was Regan's times, he was not a businessman. Another president would sold the rope to hang himself for another "Trump tower". 8 years without technologies and bunch of presidents, lobbyists and businessmen to give it all for money. All they needed is war, there is no reason to spend time and resources on something else.
Reminds me of university exam's days
That's the theme of a previous video of this channel about Soviet computers: They copied IBM's mainframes but when they had a "workable" system they were late to move from mainframes to minicomputers to PCs. The Soviets weren't fighting toe-to-toe with the entire West but with IBM.
@@EduardoEscarez Yes, that's why I mentioned it :)
@@grizwoldphantasia5005 😅
One story I heard about back in the 80's was when the Soviets managed to have a Digital Equipment VAX 11/780 shipped, which at the time was a top-of-the-line minicomputer. They were able to get the order through a bunch of shell companies and the computer, which was the size of a number of large refrigerators, was crated and in transit. However, US Customs was on to it and managed to intercept the shipment in one of the Scandinavian countries, I forgot which. US Customs agents removed the computer from its crate, replaced it with a bunch of concrete blocks, sealed the crate, and sent it on its way. The agents said they would've loved to see the look on faces when the crate was delivered and opened.
Another story had to do with microchips. Chip designers at Digital Equipment wrote on their chips in Russian, viewable under a microscope, "VAX - When you care enough to steal the very best."
I heard a story about the VAX that did get through the customs. The Soviets started to use it, but it quickly run out of disk space. So they did an in-depth investigation of what was going on. It turned out that Western intelligence had added come code to the operating system, to collect data on what was done on the computer. The data was supposed to be periodically sent out. But in the USSR the network was much less developed, and the computer was simply not connected to the Internet. While the routine was unable to communicate with the control center, in the meantime it just kept writing the data into a file. Since this continued for some time, eventually all the space was filled. And that's how it was discovered. Sounds too dumb to be true, but who knows...
So the US Customs was a thief and what were they doing in a Scandinavian country? What right did they have to take another's property?
@@anthonyxuereb792 This is a spy craft - they had the same right as the soviet agents who bought the equipment via shell companies.
@@DigitFalconer Fair enough, thanks
@@anthonyxuereb792 The law that is the subject of this video most likely.
Thank you for bringing up historical parallels in the subjects you explore. It is a great contrast to the headline-chasing click-baiting dreck that worms its ways into the explainer/video essay corner of TH-cam.
If we look at the Russian defense industry today, the entire floors at the top factories there are filled with ultra-precision CNC machinery from Germany, Switzerland, Austria. Yesterday's story about the relatively mundane american CNC machines recently delivered to Russia during the war is just the tip of the iceberg.
Yup, If you watch the TH-cam channel of the Russian Defense Industry "Combat Approved", they showcase different Russian weapon systems and their manufacturing process, their factories and manufacturing complexes are indeed filled with western equipment from CNC to PCB verification machines.
It always strikes me as a weird double standard that no business in a western nation manufactures without a completely global source of tooling (German, Italian, Chinese, American machines all under one roof) but the second its a non-western country people say its a lack of independence, national capability, copying, or even being directly "enabled" as a puppet state if the VAST majority of machines aren't entirely indigenous (as in design, manufacture and support). And for reference I work quality control for manufacturing these days, so while that doesn't give me any "expertise" to judge design, I can speak with reasonable authority about how quickly the phone call goes overseas if something isn't going as planned.
Welp, the industrial base in post soviet Russia deteriorated heavily. So much infact, a tractor company funded to make 100% homegrown russian tractors couldnt do better than buy disassembled czech tractors and assemble them in their factory, its that bad.
The current cars made at Moskvich car assembly after French cut ties after Putin's aggression on Ukraine, are in fact Chinese cars, disassembled and put together at factory. One can purchase the same car Chinese outside of Russia and lover cost.
I remember when being a young tennager purchasing a small 2.5ccm model motor, which failed to run. After taking it apart and inspecting, I knew why it never built compression. I guess many living Eastern Block had the same experience with products from former USSR.
@@SheepInACart It's not a double standard because western countries don't usually claim to be independent of other (western) countries. We don't see dependency on another country as a major issue. Countries like Russia or China are held to a different standard because they strive to be independent entities, not aligned with the west but in competition, and so we expect their supply chains to be independent of the west as well.
Toshiba got really fucked in the warrantee area because of this. They were a major manufacturer of consumer electronics that were exported to the USA.
When Toshiba got banned from importing to the USA, they lost the ability to supply repair parts to USA retail establishments. They still however had to maintain their warrantees. This meant that whenever something as simple as a fuse went bad, Toshiba had to refund the entire wholesale price if the product was still under warrantee and VCRs broke very easily during that time. I don't know if Toshiba paid to have the refunded merchandise shipped back to Japan or if they were even allowed to. They may have just gotten dumped in the trash.
This just shows how sick and rotten the American system of trade restrictions and embargos is. Thanks to the Great China their time is over. The new century will be one of Chinese trade and not American (trade) wars.
Too bad for them.Hope they enjoyed their $25 million "profit".
@@burtbacarach5034 hypocrisy at it's finest
@@burtbacarach5034 But the British and French got away with their sales and no punishment for them. Hypocrisy.
@@burtbacarach5034 just proving why more are moving away from american hypocrisy of "only we are allowed to sell" protection racket chemes.
Was there any consequence on the French company for selling the similar machine? How come both company selling similar machines but only the Japanese got blame ?
because japan is dog in American eyes
They were put on trial in Luxembourg, see the Oct. 1987 NY Times article "FRENCH LINKED TO SOVIET SALE" (I'd post a link but TH-cam seems to delete them). The French company involved did not sell a propeller CNC milling machine, they sold American-made lithography equipment to make microelectronics to control said CNC machines.
because they can never on the same level with us white
Not sure. A French company stopped advanced optics to RUF after the invasion.
What about the one UK, sale to China?
I have to ask what missile system the US Army cancelled from Toshiba, Japan has very strict export laws on military equipment, even to allied nations
Unregulated capitalism proves it will risk giving an enemy a figurative gun to make a buck. Companies in large don't give a shit what happens with their product as long as its profitable. This whole "not my problem" attitude is why we need so much regulation.
"The imperialists are so hungry for profits that they will sell us the rope with which to hang themselves."
PRC's CCP listened and followed through with Nixon
clueless.
ESL?
You got the imperialists part right. That’s how you get American Samoans that aren’t US citizens but US nationals.
@@zeitgeistx5239 Guam, Puerto Rico, Northern Mariana Islands, and American Samoa all need to be independent nations asap.
@@tzenzhongguo So should Tibet.
I would give anything to see you make a video on China's high speed rail network
You mean how CCP steal the high speed railway technology from Japan?
Those trains must be soo cool! All the payed, pro-china shills LOVE them!
Japanese tech rebranded
@@engineeriumm Yeah, aware but it seems like they spent too much building their HSL network and they overbuilt, just need him to cover the economics and the current state of it
@@engineeriumm Japan didn't build any of their stuff in China
I'm old enough to actually remember this. Would love to see a review of the IP theft of Cisco Systems technologies.
Or Nortel...
(they had to strip the former Nortel head office down to the concrete to eliminate all the bugs)
Toshiba was the Huawei and Astom. Japanese politicians were too corrupt and too weak. NHK ran a documentary programme about Japan was told to stop their OS that was way ahead of DOS.
HAAS, an industrial machine company in the US was just caught selling restricted CNC machines to Russia. They will be in a world of hurt!
Japan's answer to «Plaza Accord».
A new Asianometry! Just what I needed :)
USA be like let me steel what ever from others. But my propaganda machine will highlight others only for there stealings😂.
Just in time with news that Haas allegedly sent their products to Russia
I was at a conference in 1987 when I heard a Compaq engineer say to a Toshiba rep that selling the propeller tech to the Russians really upset the US. I thought propeller-Toshiba? Toshiba was a laptop leader then...Compaq took over.
IBM was involved in the restrictions placed on Toshiba and NEC. Also the US memory chip manufacturers were involved. It was “get even time”
@pais culebra
OK, there was an undercurrent of fear and loathing of Japan. But you are basically saying that asianometry's post was off base. In spite of a very robust yen which impacted Japanese exports, Japanese computer companies such as Hitachi, Fujitsu/Amdahl and NEC were doing great in the US before the scandal.
@pais culebra The tarifs were imposed 1 month after the US found out about the scandal. Even Electronic News had troubling figuring out the problem the issue with the semiconductor agreement
@@paisculebra I highly doubt it
@pais culebra Had an uncle who was in international business in the 60’s, 70’s and 80’s. Fought against the Japanese in WWII. A quiet, intelligent peaceful man. He would do no business with the Japanese. Times change but could never forget or forgive whatever it was he had seen.
Coffeezilla style investigation 😅
The Walker spy ringleaders should've been drawn and quartered.
Thanks, I remember the Toshiba scandal from the late 80's, but this gave a lot of background information that I wasn't aware of.
Damn, you ALWAYS find interesting stuff!
Gotta love Toshiba saying that COCOM was dumped on them by the US even though they knew that the Japanese government literally asked to join it 🤣🤣🤣
Most people don’t know that a lot of the Japanese companies that makes cars and electronics today were building military ships, submarines, aircraft…etc for the Japanese army before defeat. If Japan starts to build their own military again we will have a superpower in no time.
There really isn't much of Japanese electronics industry left, not like it used to be. Engineering subcontracted to Taiwan, manufacturing anywhere abroad. I don't know if they can rebuild it like that. Automotive and heavy are holding on. Foremost if they were to become a military power like that, it would be weak to sanctions if they were to choose the wrong enemy, not necessarily threatening. But i do expect that militarization of Japan is potentially starting soon, in order to have defensive capability against China.
So apparently USSR build their economy after ww2 with lend lease lefovers which were:
400,000 jeeps & trucks
14,000 airplanes
8,000 tractors
13,000 tanks
1.5 million blankets
15 million pairs of army boots
107,000 tons of cotton
2.7 million tons of petrol products
4.5 million tons of food
And then stole technology of a first launch satelite to lauch a first satelite and then stole Gagarin to launch him first into space.
Bold assumption that country that is right now have the largest fleet of the most advanced nuclear submarines (which they designed and built) can't do stuff on their own.
US and west only good at buying out and capitalizing on other people's techologies. Not that good at actually creating them any better than anyone else.
About the Toshiba propeller issue, I am proud to say that in the late 1980s I worked for a major PC and peripherals distributor where I bet my career to terminate carriage of all Toshiba products. I won the argument, so to speak. Inquiries or RFPs from major accounts thus affected were referred to me, where I presented a package of relevant published materials describing the damage to US/western security. This was generally well received. Over the next half decade this cost Toshiba..... well, a lot of sales revenue. Very satisfying. But enough was enough, and today I own a Toshiba laptop.
I have a New in Box old-tech Toshiba rice cooker from the 70s.
Toshiba doesn’t make any new compelling products. Instead of Cloning IBM mainframes, MITI failed to fund basic science investments.
Toyota vehicles are favored by insurgents. (Free advertising). Toshiba is a conglomerate and one arm did something bad. Glad if your laptop choice fits your need.
I’m winTel/Apple/*Nix & retired, but loved Fujitsu SANs.
There isn't anyting particular about Toshiba laptop is there? Last i looked they were mostly Compal machines like many others, basically every brand carries somewhat customised macines made by Taiwanese ODMs. Which is a story in and of itself, since back then i expect Compaq was one of the major benefactors of Toshiba business being shunned. And guess what Taiwanese company they spun off.
@@SianaGearz Wasn't bragging on Toshiba laptops. Client gave me one out of a lot, as a tip/gift. So, it picked me, and we get along. Honestly, it doesn't matter anymore except at the very extremes, does it? The vast middle are all overkill. Cheers.
@@SianaGearz Toshiba branded laptops used be reasonably priced and reliable way BITD. As a conglomerate/Zaibatsu, Toshiba did naughty on the CNC and iirc NEC had input as well.
As a US partner country it was a dumb move that a Toshiba’s Conglomerate’s Branch did something so stupid along with NEC.
So. Toshiba went under then just like Enron did for accounting fraud ?... So basically your decisions to kill their sales forced them to be creative with their accountancy. And this indirectly also led to the 2008 financial crashes.... Lol... God.. everything makes sense if we stopped to think about things. This indirectly boomed a sector of accounting software's to ensure that everything was above board etc. And even now. Same things...
RnD = Research and Development
RmB = Research More Burglary
Well..I have an other one for you. In short... How Pakistan got his nuclear bomb. The dutch in all their innocense and naivitee had a pakistani scientist working with their most sensitive documents and took a one way trip back to pakistan when he had it all... sorry..
I bought myself and my father a Toshiba CD player just prior to the espionage story came out. They still work. Soon, those CD players disappeared from the market.
Why do you drag your videos out? The first 9 minutes of this video are completely unnecessary. Downvoted.
Love your work man. Keep it up!
"In any system of energy, Control is what consumes energy the most.
No energy store holds enough energy to extract an amount of energy equal to the total energy it stores.
No system of energy can deliver sum useful energy in excess of the total energy put into constructing it.
This universal truth applies to all systems.
Energy, like time, flows from past to future".
I love this. I am going to say this all day long tomorrow.
Today it is HAAS skirting restrictions
Maybe Gene wants to have another stay in jail.
If we compare CNC machines to cars, Haas would be an equivalent of a Chevrolet Cavalier. Russians mostly buy expensive German machines which are like a high-end Mercedes.
One should certainly investigate why American machines are still being delivered to Russia, but focusing on Haas as something exceptional is barking the wrong tree.
@@cogoid - Keep in mind the accusations came from the Ukrainian government (which is almost as dishonest as the Russian government) and they were vehemently denied by Haas. But to your point about German machines: they may be “German” machines, but there’s almost certainly a lot of American tech in those things.
@@ClockworksOfGL It is quite possible that Haas machines were delivered to Russia in October 2022, as the story alleged. But I also think Haas is being factual in their rebuttal -- if they say that no machines have left from their factory in California for Russia once the sanctions were imposed, it is probably so. Considering how long it takes for a distributor to deliver the machines, both facts can be true simultaneously without contradiction.
I love it every time you say Check Losovakya.
I just want to remark how "Coffeezilla style" was thrown in there. He really has become the standard for investigative journalism on this site.
It ages the videos a bit too much. No reason to think anyone will know who that is in a year.
Airbus also benefits from the experience of Russian experts and has a design center in Moscow. Founded in 2003 as a joint company by Airbus, AFK Sistema and KASKOL Group, the Aiurbus Engineering Center in Russia (ECAR) was the first to be established by the company outside the EU.
A friend of mine worked on the Soviet space shuttle they all flew down too cape Canaveral and bought every poster and book on the US space shuttle. It's how they copied it.
lol how brainwashed do you have to be...
I remember this well. I studied in the city of Kongsberg 85-88 and we were working on a project to connect the CNC machines at the school to a LAN. The CNC machines was programmed using a paper strip that was fed into the reader. By connecting the reader to the LAN the communication with the CNC was greatly improved. I remember that the Kongsberg company was split into smaller companies after the incident.
As egregious as the French sales were, The Toshiba kongsberg scandal was far worse. France did not share a land border with the Soviet Union. Norway did. The Japanese considered some of its islands occupied by the Soviets and now Russia. I Soviet submarines were a constant hazard for Japan. The sale should have been treated as nothing short of treason with the result being industrial sepaku to set an example for others. Unfortunately, living under the American nuclear umbrella and having American bases on countries infantilizes their politics.
Grievance is a poison to the mind and soul and destroys the body politic. We are seeing what it does in America now.
Yet, somehow we still create and build greatness. Greatness that is co-opted and stolen by the obviously lazy and less able.
for Japan, non of those actually matter because they have already surrender all their sovereignty to the US. The best they can hope for is somehow the US get into conflict with another super power and they'd be free from it.
Was in the U.S. Navy submarine service. When these two companies sold computerized milling equipment to the USSR, the Soviet submarines all of a sudden became a lot more quieter. That put U.S. sailors at a higher risk. I haven't owned a Toshiba product since nor will I in the future. My Toshiba stereo system went flying out my bedroom and into an alley, where it shattered into many pieces.
I served on submarine in the eighties as well. I will never knowingly buy a Toshiba product.
Yet you love Ford dont you...
@@newone-gd9sk Nope, never assume.
Look on the plus side, they put Soviet sailors at a lower risk.
@@Razielchan666 The U.S.S.R. was more of a threat to their own sailors. Had to change out the crews every three year because the had hit the life time dosage of radiation.
Like many international organizations (UN such as UNCLOS violations, WTO on technology theft, etc.), it seems like these organizations don't have a good way to police themselves and punish violators. At best complaints are raised but no one suffers from the violation of the rules agreed to.
It's really ironic... If this had been stopped as it should, Russia wouldn't be able to produce anything to modern standards of tolerance and efficiency, leaving them dead in the water... Seems to me though, that this "drip-feed" of manufacturing equipment, slows down Russian manufacturing enough for them to be a threat that requires a strong and profitable western military industry complex, but still weak enough that they can't take on the west head on, AND makes bank for western companies from sales of the equipment.
_a demonstration that this was no ploy to win sales for American businesses_ ... or maybe a demonstration that that is exactly what it is: _He also pointed out that the lithography ban directly benefitted American semiconductor equipment makers of items not covered by the bans_
One thing is wrong: There are no international trade restrictions, but american imposed trade restrictions. Giving a shit about COCOM, was a brave and admirable attitude of the japanaese industry and government.
I don't get why USSR couldn't build their own. They had the tools to build the tools. And regardless of what one thinks of the USSR or the quality of their products, they had no shortage of brilliant engineers. If you can build a submarine, you can build a damn CNC milling machine.
It is an excellent question.
USSR did build some unique metalworking machines -- there is a famous example of an extra large mill which Japan bought from the USSR. Soviets also originated some important technologies, like EDM machining -- but were never able to commercialize it as successfully as western vendors did.
I think there are many reasons, but the most basic one is that nobody really builds anything on their own. Stuff gets built within an ecosystem of whatever components and know-how is available. And it is prohibitively expensive to grow such advanced ecosystems in isolation, unless there is a real market for them.
For example, US military have spent serious money on development of image sensors, and they had respectable results. But when image sensors became essential for a consumer market, the amount of investment became so much larger, that the progress accelerated enormously, and now every smartphone has inexpensive cameras with such performance which a decade ago no secret agency could afford.
So, USSR was simply missing too many parts -- power electronics, precision bearings, drives, etc. They could not import them, and bootstrapping the whole CNC industry in a bubble was beyond their means. There were probably other important structural reasons, but that would require a dissertation to cover.
It is not the engineers. It is the leaders who screwed up. Not saying western political leaders are smarter but they know to get out of the way from consumer-business-research relation enough to let private development breathing space.
Soviet censors and processors were far behind the west
But can they make a better one than what they can steal cost-effectively? Really they did a mix of both and stuck with whatever worked best. It takes an ungodly amount of resources to develop and manufacture top of the line microchips, something the soviets had a hard time justifying. Obviously you need those for a good CNC machine and military equipment. They took the approach of making "good enough" chips instead of trying to take the technological lead. Who knows where else they would have had to cut corners if they put all their resources into microchip R&D
Asianometry did a video on soviet computers you may want to check out that covers the whys in part. But another reason is the lack of precision, computerized machining necessary to build these things among others. There is also the same reasons why the Russians cannot replace Western technology with indigneous solutions on their private markets and why they expect all the BMWs, Audis and Mercedes cars on their roads to blow out eventually. They cant source the parts and their manufacturing is not sophisticated enough for production of indigneous, adequate replacement parts.
well done! please do an episode on OKUMA cnc they are a vertically integrated juggernaut, the apple of the CNC world. TY
I remember when Nixon opened up China they were going to build 707s under license. But they didn't really care about the 707. What they were interested in was the inertial navigation systems.
"In fact, it was President Nixon's visit to China in 1971 that inspired the sale of Boeing 707s to China. "
"Working in secret, Chinese aircraft engineers have taken one of the Boeing 707 jetliners bought by China in 1972 and built their own copy of it" (Including it's inertial navigation system.....which could be used on their ICBM program.
Kelly Ann Conway, in 1987, says, "the GOP can't do worse," LOL! Nice. (15:17)
From the video, I didn't sense any proof that Toshiba's machine was the main source for improvements to the Russian propeller as many other European countries also supplied various equipment and technologies. The main enabler would be the software design tools as no matter how sophisticated the milling equipment, the result only be as better if the design was more advanced. It may be picking on Toshiba because US biased for Europe.
You don't think Soviet Union has top notch engineers and mathematicians who can throw together a program that spits out specialised G-code, or even hand write G-code with logarithmic rulers and punch cards? I saw the tail end of that era first hand there. Things they could develop on paper were well far ahead of things they could actually manufacture. Getting from quantity of 1 to quantity of 100 or more was a problem. I don't have any particular rebuttal to your conjecture that they would have achieved this result with French made machines, i don't know about that. But by all reason you do need more axis for the surface quality, not suitable for simple copy milling.
Been waiting for a long time for someone to cover this. Thank you Asianomitry
I thought ASML EUV machines had systems and intellectual property rights in them from the US. So, even is ASML did go against the US and said they would sell the machines it couldn't. Not sure if the same applies to Deep UV.
they got nothing, its just US trying to save its hegemonic spot...
6:42 is that the old Canadian Flag 😳😮🫢🤔🫣
I think that you will find that it was the British Labour government of the day that sold the Rolls Royce engine design to their mates in the Soviet union.
The chain is only as strong as its weakest link. This is especially problematic when your technology is pretty much alone at the top of the world, and your enemies are prepared to go to great lengths and pay any price to get their hands on it.
Always interesting to let them steal your designs that have one or more catastrophic flaws.
In 1870 the Russian Aeronautical Society was established.
In 1880, on the initiative of Dmitry Mendeleev, Mozhaisky's aircraft became one of the world's first heavier-than-air aircraft.
1904 an aerodynamic institute was established in Kuchino, led by Russian scientist Nikolai Zhukovsky founding creator of hydro and aerodynamics
Dmitry Grigorovich the world's first seaplanes
1911, the Russian Technical Society organized the first international aeronautical exhibition
a galaxy of scientists Keldysh, Sedov, Lavrent'ev, Khristianovich, H E. Kochin, L. N. Sretensky and...'
Sikorsky's Russian aircraft Russian aircraft Roussky Vityaz 1913
inventor the Russian helicopter fleeing the communist regime Igor Ivanovich Sikorsky
1920 Sukhoi, MiG, Tupolev, Iliushin, Yakovlev, Beriev and Irkut ....... more than 30 design offices and builders,
most closed after the fall of the Union
father of RUSSIAN stealth technology Pyotr Yakovlevich Ufimtsev a physicist and mathematician
34% of civil aircraft were exclusively manufactured by Russia in Soviet times Russia is the only republic in the Soviet Union that builds aircraft russia over a century aircraft industry
France buys engine technology from ge aviation 1975 CFM International
airbus 1979 Franco-German-Spanish project
10:31 - "We all live on a quiet submarine, a quiet submarine, a quiet submarine" 😝
Russian planes for over a century in the aviation industry
Russian planes for over a century in the aviation industry
(Before the communist era)
Boeing 787 designed by Russian engineers at Boeing's Moscow offices
Do not believe me you have a search engine
In 1880, on the initiative of Dmitry Mendeleev Mozhaisky, the aircraft became one of the world's first heavier-than-air planes 1904
, an aerodynamic institute was established in Kuchino, headed by Russian scientist Nikolai Zhukovsky, founding creator of hydro and aerodynamics
Dmitry Grigorovich the world's first seaplanes 1911,
the Russian Technical Society organized the first international aviation exhibition
a galaxy of scientists Keldysh, Sedov, Lavrent'ev, Khristianovich, H E. Kochin, L. N. Sretensky and ... '
Russian aeronautics by Sikorsky Rousski Vitiaz 1913 1920 Sukhoi, MiG, Tupolev, Iliushin, Yakovlev, Beriev and Irkut ....... more than 30 design offices and manufacturers,
the most closed after the fall of the Union
father of RUSSIAN stealth technology Pyotr Yakovlevich Ufimtsev a physicist and mathematician
inventor the Russian helicopter flee the communist regime Igor Ivanovich Sikorsky
34% of civilian airplanes were exclusively made by Russia in Soviet times Russia is the only republic in the Soviet Union that has been building Russian planes for over a century in the aviation industry
Airbus 1979 Franco-German-Spanish project
Sikorsky Russky Vityaz
10 May 1913
The Father Of The Helicopter
The civil war began in 1917 and ended in 1923 with a communist coup, killing 12 million Russians and escaping 3 million of the scientific elite.
You can verify every piece of information you wrote
There is a huge media war against the Russians, the American political class has not changed for 40 years and the death of communism
are you a communist Why did you only destroy churches and kill Christians?
Why did you bring minorities to Russia, why did you make Ukraine and Belarus republics?
When Caesar is killed, how do you kill children by order of Lenin the killer?
Typical example of why EU is an American colony, and not a union of independent states.
"We (Dutch company) are not allowed to export EUV to China". The Big Sam said so, so we have to obey.
lesson #1 don't spend anything on the military. million$fake hole plugged w/billion$
temporary&leaking cork. billion$fake hole plugged w/trillion$ temporary&leaking cork.
price of fish&rice? anyone hungry?oh poo,hadda giv all the food to the world's soldiers
What's strange is the TV pundits Terrible confusion Between Russia and the Soviet Union They don't believe the Soviet Union disappeared like Yugoslavia
There are Chinese PLA Generals within the last few years that have talked about their future plans after they defeat the US and how they will use the mainland United States as one giant plantation with all non-Chinese being second class citizens who will work on the farms to feed their Chinese overlords. They want to do this because most of China's soil and groundwater is completely contaminated. Obviously, that's a very weird and creepy thing to say, but it just shows you that the PRC is not a peaceful government, and they absolutely have neo-imperial goals and weirdly enough their plan seems eerily similar to Heinrich Himmler's plan for Russia after they defeated the Soviets. The point of all of this is to remember to never willfully sell your enemy the means in which to destroy you with.
Restrictions are not fair by default. You canot make them fair in any way. They might be needed, but never fair. It is one player that has control pushing those that they control to unfairness towards one that they don't like which does not have such control. It is an unfair act by nature.
Think of it like the populars in school that tell to their friends: you can be my friend only if you bully this guy that I like to bully.
Oh, that's exactly what it is: economic bullying.
please for the love of all that is holy look up how to pronounce Norwegian words if you're going to say them!
"vappenfabrikk" got a good chuckle but it's so simple to pronounce the "Å" it does frustrate me slightly :P
So again in the case of chip technology and machines it is oke for American companies to sell the technology to china but it’s not alowed for other countries….
While at the same time America itself uses /makes technology from the stone ages 🤣…. That nobody wants to buy.
Making business with the enemy... maybe all involved party should get invaded by the very enemy they're supplying
and so Japan was punished severely with a stock bubble creating a lost decade and deflation almost to this day
Today the history of the USSR has definitely ceased to be the prerogative of sovietologists to become a field of study for contemporary historians.
Apparently it is still a problem for us to detect the noise of Russian submarines.
If you go down this road of the West selling militarily useful technology and equipment to the Eastern bloc, you will have material for many videos.
I always wondered how the Soviets managed to produce the Akula which was so ahead of it's time - and as always it's STEM technology at the end of the day. Thanks for covering such interesting episodes in recent history!