Excellent podcast! Really appreciate you bringing up the perspective of the amateur riders who are traveling to these large gravel events, and the demand for in-race online content. Your comment about constantly hitting refresh during these races to find out what's going is spot on.
Drew, I've peeled off a boa in a race TWICE! First time, it was lost to the forest gnomes in the George Washington National Forest. I was fortunately to get some duct tape at the next aid station and simply wrap my shoe. Second time, I found the boa about 5' away from where I crashed and was able to snap it back in and continue. But your point (and Dylan's) is right on. The SMALLEST thing can shut you down for a relatively long time.
I did the mud Kanza in 2015 which was far worse than this year and my bike blew up at 7 miles. Chain broke and twisted so I couldn't single speed, derailleur gone. I walk back to town, found a bike shop got my bike fixed, and did the race still. People have 24hrs or whatever the time limit is. Did it suck? Yes, but, that is gravel racing.. People just need to suck the S**T up be prepared for what it is. An Epic Adventure and use the time you got to do what you set out for. Plan change, weather changes, it is life. Outside of that great podcast guys
So glad that I came across your channel/podcast. I will just start off by saying that I started riding bikes in the mid 70's with BMX and then moved to road, track, cross, mountain, cross and now gravel. I worked as a mechanic both in shops and with trade and national teams for close to 20 years. I say mountain eclipse road in popularity back in the 90's then cross do the same in the early 2000's and now with gravel. Over the years of real racing that I did when in my 20's and 30's I got the privilege to be pack filler with some of the best cyclists in the nation at that time. We were all young, thin, fit and fast at one time, then we get older. As to the Unbound mud this year...yeah it was bad. The 250cc motorcycle that was buried up to it's wheel hubs and crankcase sitting upright in the mud at about 3 miles into the hike a bike spoke volumes. Now then any mud can turn into "peanut butter" mud. It all depends on how much water you add to it and how long the water has taken to soak in as well as how hydrated the soil/mud is. This is why when it is actively raining what mud there is does not stick. This was what happened at US Cyclocross Nationals in Austin TX. The day the Championship races were supposed to happen Saturday, it was actively raining and nothing was sticking but due to concerns for the trees at the park the races were not held and delayed a day...the next day it was peanut butter sticky mud...it was horrible. Racers were coming into the pits every half lap to switch bikes. The night before Unbound it rained heavily and the heaviest part of the rain was on the South part of the course and on many of the XL riders. The organizers at Unbound fully KNEW just how muddy it was gonna be. As to the points that both Drew and Dylan make...sure as an age group amateur racer there is the issue that it is a gravel race/ride we do kind of want it to be "Epic" that said, we also want it to be "FUN." It is no fun if you are walking in shoe sucking mud for 4 miles...scraping mud off your tires so that they will roll through the frame every quarter of a mile. Then there were those who snapped off their rear derailleurs. Here is the fact...for those of us who ride the age group general prison population ride...we all have JOBS...we PAY for our own bike equipment. We have to get VACATION time away from JOB and FAMILY in order to do the event. Also in many cases people WAITED years to get into what ever ride we did because of lottery entries. I was really fortunate, I got into every event I wanted, my job affords me the time off due to my schedule but I am a shift worker and I work nights. As to would Dylan have made the lead group at Unbound if he had a different bike or tire choice? That depends on when he hit the mud. I was at the back end of the lead group on the Age Groupers, my bike had clearance for 50mm tires and I was running 40's. I was stopped because wheels stopped rolling through the frame many times. The top of every hill I though the mud was gonna end yet, all I saw was people doing "hike a bike" as far as I could see ahead of me and as far as I could see behind me. Does it require skill to ride mud? Yeah if you come from a mountain or cross background then yes it does...kind of like sand or snow riding but it is in the middle of the two... Why is gravel so popular? Well, there is not the skill set that cross or mountain require so many more pure roadies can do it. I cannot say how many people who I know that were uber strong roadies who tried cross or mountain, maybe both. They got dropped by their buddies, did not ever develop the skills to be successful and later sold the cross or mountain bike. Were the downhills at Big Sugar scary...OH HELL YES! fist sized sharp rocks, loose stuff on top of hard pack that your tires just slid on if you leaned the bike. I cannot even say how many people I saw crash...then there were all the flats. Great channel. Thank you for your time and effort.
Excellent interview and insight from Drew and Dylan. Great stuff! I have a thought about the unbound mud. We have a race here in Wisconsin called the Red Granite Grinder. There are two sections that come to mind. 1 there is close to a mile of Hike a bike over Rocky very uneven terrain that is not even rideable on an MTB in my opinion. This section is only apart of the 85 and 144 mile options. 2 There is a corn maze which they do mark.This is in the 55 mile option of the race, But we had 2+ inches of rain this year and caused a mud pit. I have done both the 85 and the 55 versions of the race and in my opinion those two sections honestly just suck. Section 1 it would be very easy to fall and hurt yourself and or damage your equipment. Section 2 could easily become an unbound situation where equipment can become damaged by mud. BUT, they honestly add so much to the race and I just sucked it up in each instance. Others were mad. I dont blame them. All this being said, I believe it comes down to keeping athletes safe first and foremost and then making sure it is a good overall event experience. Maybe over the course of time event coordinators will come up with a set of criteria where they will change a course or give a 2nd option for a course to make sure that the event is enjoyable for all. Just thoughts. Great episode!!
Flagman at active intersections and rail road crossings. Cars on the road, inherent risk but signs need to be posted for drivers along the route. Bwr SD 2023 was much improved over 2022 for traffic control.
On altitude: I live at 9,300' in CO. I suffer at lower elevations, because my training here trains my aerobic system more than my muscular system. So races at sea level are a disadvantage for me. Races need to be held both at elevation and at sea level. Learn to deal with the adversity.
Great bunch of guys. However, holy verbal tick. Once you notice the wall of likes, it's like really hard to like listen to this... I get that American's have an issue with valley speak, but given that a podcast is just folks talking, maybe attempt to reduce the likes. Three in one sentence is borderline ridiculous...
![ILLSLICK - KILLSHOT REMIX [FULL VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RIK8RrqIAzE/mqdefault.jpg)
More smack talk please. Give him some BH Dylan !
@mikesima9396 agreed, what would a world without smack talk among friends racing bikes be?
Can’t wait for Johnson v. Dillman II!!!
Excellent podcast! Really appreciate you bringing up the perspective of the amateur riders who are traveling to these large gravel events, and the demand for in-race online content. Your comment about constantly hitting refresh during these races to find out what's going is spot on.
Thanks for listening @mattregan9134, when you only get to travel to a big race once or twice a year it can be tough to get in a groove.
Drew, I've peeled off a boa in a race TWICE! First time, it was lost to the forest gnomes in the George Washington National Forest. I was fortunately to get some duct tape at the next aid station and simply wrap my shoe. Second time, I found the boa about 5' away from where I crashed and was able to snap it back in and continue. But your point (and Dylan's) is right on. The SMALLEST thing can shut you down for a relatively long time.
I did the mud Kanza in 2015 which was far worse than this year and my bike blew up at 7 miles. Chain broke and twisted so I couldn't single speed, derailleur gone. I walk back to town, found a bike shop got my bike fixed, and did the race still. People have 24hrs or whatever the time limit is. Did it suck? Yes, but, that is gravel racing.. People just need to suck the S**T up be prepared for what it is. An Epic Adventure and use the time you got to do what you set out for. Plan change, weather changes, it is life. Outside of that great podcast guys
Love this thanks for sharing. That’s choosing the hard way!
So glad that I came across your channel/podcast. I will just start off by saying that I started riding bikes in the mid 70's with BMX and then moved to road, track, cross, mountain, cross and now gravel. I worked as a mechanic both in shops and with trade and national teams for close to 20 years. I say mountain eclipse road in popularity back in the 90's then cross do the same in the early 2000's and now with gravel. Over the years of real racing that I did when in my 20's and 30's I got the privilege to be pack filler with some of the best cyclists in the nation at that time. We were all young, thin, fit and fast at one time, then we get older.
As to the Unbound mud this year...yeah it was bad. The 250cc motorcycle that was buried up to it's wheel hubs and crankcase sitting upright in the mud at about 3 miles into the hike a bike spoke volumes. Now then any mud can turn into "peanut butter" mud. It all depends on how much water you add to it and how long the water has taken to soak in as well as how hydrated the soil/mud is. This is why when it is actively raining what mud there is does not stick. This was what happened at US Cyclocross Nationals in Austin TX. The day the Championship races were supposed to happen Saturday, it was actively raining and nothing was sticking but due to concerns for the trees at the park the races were not held and delayed a day...the next day it was peanut butter sticky mud...it was horrible. Racers were coming into the pits every half lap to switch bikes.
The night before Unbound it rained heavily and the heaviest part of the rain was on the South part of the course and on many of the XL riders. The organizers at Unbound fully KNEW just how muddy it was gonna be. As to the points that both Drew and Dylan make...sure as an age group amateur racer there is the issue that it is a gravel race/ride we do kind of want it to be "Epic" that said, we also want it to be "FUN." It is no fun if you are walking in shoe sucking mud for 4 miles...scraping mud off your tires so that they will roll through the frame every quarter of a mile. Then there were those who snapped off their rear derailleurs. Here is the fact...for those of us who ride the age group general prison population ride...we all have JOBS...we PAY for our own bike equipment. We have to get VACATION time away from JOB and FAMILY in order to do the event. Also in many cases people WAITED years to get into what ever ride we did because of lottery entries. I was really fortunate, I got into every event I wanted, my job affords me the time off due to my schedule but I am a shift worker and I work nights.
As to would Dylan have made the lead group at Unbound if he had a different bike or tire choice? That depends on when he hit the mud. I was at the back end of the lead group on the Age Groupers, my bike had clearance for 50mm tires and I was running 40's. I was stopped because wheels stopped rolling through the frame many times. The top of every hill I though the mud was gonna end yet, all I saw was people doing "hike a bike" as far as I could see ahead of me and as far as I could see behind me. Does it require skill to ride mud? Yeah if you come from a mountain or cross background then yes it does...kind of like sand or snow riding but it is in the middle of the two...
Why is gravel so popular? Well, there is not the skill set that cross or mountain require so many more pure roadies can do it. I cannot say how many people who I know that were uber strong roadies who tried cross or mountain, maybe both. They got dropped by their buddies, did not ever develop the skills to be successful and later sold the cross or mountain bike.
Were the downhills at Big Sugar scary...OH HELL YES! fist sized sharp rocks, loose stuff on top of hard pack that your tires just slid on if you leaned the bike. I cannot even say how many people I saw crash...then there were all the flats.
Great channel. Thank you for your time and effort.
Excellent interview and insight from Drew and Dylan. Great stuff! I have a thought about the unbound mud. We have a race here in Wisconsin called the Red Granite Grinder. There are two sections that come to mind. 1 there is close to a mile of Hike a bike over Rocky very uneven terrain that is not even rideable on an MTB in my opinion. This section is only apart of the 85 and 144 mile options. 2 There is a corn maze which they do mark.This is in the 55 mile option of the race, But we had 2+ inches of rain this year and caused a mud pit. I have done both the 85 and the 55 versions of the race and in my opinion those two sections honestly just suck. Section 1 it would be very easy to fall and hurt yourself and or damage your equipment. Section 2 could easily become an unbound situation where equipment can become damaged by mud. BUT, they honestly add so much to the race and I just sucked it up in each instance. Others were mad. I dont blame them. All this being said, I believe it comes down to keeping athletes safe first and foremost and then making sure it is a good overall event experience. Maybe over the course of time event coordinators will come up with a set of criteria where they will change a course or give a 2nd option for a course to make sure that the event is enjoyable for all. Just thoughts. Great episode!!
That sounds like quite an event @thewisconsingravelcyclist, I would like to check it out!
Flagman at active intersections and rail road crossings. Cars on the road, inherent risk but signs need to be posted for drivers along the route. Bwr SD 2023 was much improved over 2022 for traffic control.
Disagree on the mud, it is a known quantity at unbound. Making choices on line and when to run-walk the bike is part of the challenge
On altitude: I live at 9,300' in CO. I suffer at lower elevations, because my training here trains my aerobic system more than my muscular system. So races at sea level are a disadvantage for me. Races need to be held both at elevation and at sea level. Learn to deal with the adversity.
Hey, I drive a RAM 1500 to a lot of gravel events and never come close to hitting a cyclist…😊
Athluencers rolls off the tongue a bit easier. 1:15:22
Dylan is great but loves to talk and not give Drew to much if a chance 🤔
Great bunch of guys. However, holy verbal tick. Once you notice the wall of likes, it's like really hard to like listen to this... I get that American's have an issue with valley speak, but given that a podcast is just folks talking, maybe attempt to reduce the likes. Three in one sentence is borderline ridiculous...
You pee in your kit - come on man