Whoops - had a brain typo half way through this video. Hoag's object dimensions should be 17 *thousand* light years, 75 *thousand* light years and 125 *thousand* light years - d'uh.
That made me curious, is there a definitional upper and lower limit on what constitutes a galaxy? Like do you need at least a certain amount of stars or volume before it's a galaxy and not just a.. lesser-axy? And is it conceivable that there could be a galaxy so big that it would be more correctly categorized as part of some superstructure? Is there some kind of galactic roche-limit?
Well, they do have "SDSS J151713.93+213516.8" , aka the ring galaxy we can see behind Hoag's galaxy when we view it; a lottery winner booked up with a lottery winner than can probably see each other.
We're already in a very similar situation. Our Solar System is quite unique in comparison to the majority of other systems we've found... and it certainly leaves us scratching our heads.
This is what I was wondering as well.. many of the collision galaxies shown seem like they could look identical to the Hoags Galaxy if pictures at the right angle.
I think it would look more like... a ring planet, or, those pogo jumpy ball things. Where as a spiral galaxy formed as one unit, thereby having a more gradual connection between the core and the arms/ body; with a 25 LY gap in between the two, seen perfectly edge on, it would likely look like a ball with a plate through it... muck like a Saturn, except, well, a galaxy.
@@faulkgough1768 Did you noticed the correction (by Dr. Becky), this galaxy is actually 125 000 light years (not 125) and gap is 58 000 light years (not 58)
@@vesa.tamminen yes, yes, I did. The Milky way is 100,000 ly across. where she did not correct in the post is that does not make it the 20 some odd times bigger. She made a very good video, goofed on a few numbers, but still got her point across.
In your video about the cartwheel galaxy you kinda said that it trumps Hoag's object. Glad to see you pointing out how beautifuly symmetric and aesthetic Hoag's is in this one! And the other distant ring galaxy visible in the gap! The cartwheel might be more interesting to your research but in my opinion Hoag's object is near the top of most beautiful things we've observed in the universe 🥰 gives me goosebumps every time I sink into images of it
Great video again! And the sound is so much better now with the lavalier microphone. One remark: the distances in the image (and your narrative) should be in kly (kilolightyear).
Why youtube didn't recommended this channel to me before? Love it! And the way you not only explain but the way you talk about it and gave your view. Very nice content, go t a new sub. :)
With a big difference; she's actually a scientist who knows her stuff. Anton is a wonderful person, but lacks the knowledge and education level of Becky, which shows in their videos. It is (probably) fun to watch his channel if you have absolutely NO knowledge about astronomy, but if you do, you gonna get annoyed by his videos at some point :-)
You should look in a straight line from the center of Hoag's, and the other more distant ring galaxy. If there's more in that line, then it's probably just from Thor throwing Mjölnir across the universe.
There's possibly a lot more truth in what you said than you thought. I've noticed that things form in strings in the universe . . . part way through I was thinking look in a line to see if there's another one.
It does look like something huge shot through it. Maybe a supper massive black hole, or holes, are in orbit around the central core and either ate all the stars or pushed them inward or outward.
@Don Mac It's AMAZING how many people out there have dreams/ visions/ near-death-experiences where they see Loki, but these foolish people misinterpret what they see and they _think_ they're seeing Jesus instead. Silly, silly, gullible fools!
@@thomasfleig1184 What I'm getting at, though, is how would you know if you saw Loki? For all we know, the Germanic people got it right and Loki, Odin, Freya etc... are the only real gods and the only reason anyone thinks otherwise/ believes in christianity/ islam/ thinks they saw jesus/ Vishnu/ etc is because of Loki's trickery.
It seems odd that the other known ring galaxy is so close in angle to this one. Has nay one looked along that line of sight in the opposite direction to see if there are any ring galaxies out that direction as well? And while on that topic is the orientation of galaxies random or is there some pattern or commonality among them?
Ancient Alien Astronaut Theorists say Hoag's Object is a wormhole teleportation device, used for transporting stones to Egypt to build the pyramids .. because that is what Aliens do .. build stuff with stones on other planets. Seriously - its nice to see a video with useful intelligent accurate information .. greatly appreciated, as opposed to the above, LOL.
A smaller galaxy that hits the center will affect the orbits inside the center but leave most of the outer stars in place. It seems odd that no one thinks of small galaxies colliding with massive ones
The size and distances of these kind of things just blows my mind. We're talking about things tremendously huge. Isn't that amazing? The universe is quite large to say the very least.
Hey Dr. Becky, just found your channel and love it. Just curious, since I watched this video, after watching your video about dark matter in black holes. Could the ring be a space of dark matter, since it doesn't collide and spiral down as quickly. If so, would that be something possible to test in anyway. Disclaimer: I'm not a physics person, just find the various concepts you talked about fascinating.
Thank You, Dr. Becky for explaining the mystery of Hoag's Object. I see some similarities between it and any classic spiral galaxy that makes me want to offer a hypothesis of how it formed. Please notice how the core looks "old" and the arms in the rings look "young". It is my opinion that the arms of a spiral are the discharge of the jets of the black hole, from the distant past, that has "condensed" into normal matter. If the black hole was a bit unsettled and the jets were precessing, then the product of the jets would be a double cone. If the "condensation" happened at just one distance, then the arms would form a ring as the jets precessed. And we, viewing it perfectly on axis, can see only one ring. The impossible orbits would clear themselves. Does the butterfly nebula look like the side view of two cones to you? The jets lay down a bit more with each rotation. There are other examples of cone and ring formations.
Great video Dr. Becky! I wondered throughout the video how dark matter affected the strange formation of this structure. Did the recent paper use dark matter in their simulations? If they did, how do they know where the dark matter is? Seems like assumptions would have to be made. Also, for a "clean" gap in a ring system, we have seen larger, but perhaps not obvious bodies, sweep out a clean section. Some of Saturn's moons create this affect. Maybe there is (or was) something large (black hole/s) that are hoovering out a section! Just spitballing here, but what an awesome system!
A pair of large size black holes orbiting each other 10k ly apart, orbiting the core, would have sucked up all the gas, and ejected all the stars, from the empty ring. If two of us think this we must be right. How you gonna spend your Nobel windfall? I'm gonna build an airship.
Their orbits would need to closer the 30,000 LY and their mass would need to be in the 100’s of billions of solar mass to achieve this. Also when they spiralled down they would either interfere with each other and launch one or both into deep space and/or merge and the resulting blast wave of billions of solar masses being lost in the heat caused by this merger that we’d easily detect such an event clear across the universe assuming it was within our apparent horizon. I’m not sure this has been ruled out but since it’s reasonably obvious, but ludicrous, some first year has already tried and had the idea shot down, (probably hundreds of such students actually). I thought of this as well, but dismissed it for those plus dozens of other reasons, but definitely a really cool idea, just imagine it!
Good point. Maybe this galaxy will end up being the key to understanding dark matter. Btw they CAN and DO measure where dark matter is by it's gravity.
Hoag’s Object is an unusual ring galaxy. It has a radius of 121,000 light years bigger than the Milky Way Galaxy. It was discovered by Arthur Hoag in 1958.
Oh wow that billions of years clock is so mind-blowing to watch, to imagine how many millions of beings may have evolved lived, and died whilst those galaxies were merging. Cosmic time and distance measures are so huge!! thanks, Dr. Becky for another mind-expanding exercise :)
In the second theory you provided, similar to how we think planetary rings like Saturn's form, could there be some mechanism that the collision could drag the increased hydrogen concentration out of the elliptical core galaxy? **edit** I was just wondering this very moment if there was some "third party" galaxy involved that got flung out of orbit, but I would think there would be some traces of such an object, even if an event like that happened billions of years ago. Unless! It was mostly composed of dark matter! Seems like a crazy number of coincidences, but then again, this seems like a pretty extraordinary object.
@@sanders555 I was just wondering this very moment if there was some "third party" galaxy involved that got flung out of orbit, but I would think there would be some traces of such an object, even if an event like that happened billions of years ago. Unless! It was mostly composed of dark matter! Seems like a crazy number of coincidences, but then again, this seems like a pretty extraordinary object.
@@snowballeffect7812 Dark matter crossed my mind as well... Perhaps a combination indeed. Mr. Worf, program a level 3 probe with a trajectory into the anomaly and launch when ready.
i recall an astronomer once pondering that the arms of any given galaxy pose something of a dilemma because the 'wrapping' around effect ( spinning of the galaxy ) should destroy these 'arms' but this presupposes that the arms were once sticking straight out, which is of course, completely bonkers ! So i formulated the opposing theory at that moment, that the arms were formed from a general cloud of stars that were 'clumped' together from gravitation ( and electrical ) forces that pulled them into arms. / for this Ring Galaxy, the same effect ( due to ( ??? ) ) occurred when the center pulled the inner stars towards the center, leaving the outer stars that 'clumped' into the outer ring. ( ? )
Hey Becky, I know there is already a video on M104 on DeepSkyVideos but is M104 also a ring galaxy? Or can we not say that, since we are looking at it from the side?
I love videos that talk about subjects of active research, and this one is a major treat! One minor "paper-cut" request: I worry that characterizing galactic interactions as "catastrophic" and talking about them being shredded and destroyed might lead to people imagining that it's a dangerous and probably fatal thing to happen to any possible inhabitants in the galaxies. When in reality, a tiny fraction of star systems would be disrupted by galactic collisions. The only thing that gets "destroyed" is the general shape and macroscopic structure of the galaxies. Maybe it would be better to talk about "distorting the disks into strange and beautiful shapes", and creating "interesting streamers and filaments". Possibly even point out that the star birth might lead to eventual new biological life in the universe, although that could get off-topic pretty fast. :-) Thanks for the video!
Have any of these Hoagies been discovered that are NOT center-on to our point of view? Are there any that we observe at an oblique angle? If not, doesn't that seem impossibly coincidental?
Well, there have been a couple Ring Galaxies discovered of that type, however, we have never knowingly observed one directly head-on, and that's because there is no way of telling say The Whale Galaxy or the Cigar Galaxy of their galactic shape, as no defining features or characteristics are inherently visible. It's why we still don't know the nature of the Milky Way for this same reason. We're directly on the galactic plane of it.
Cool. While intuitively it would be super rare, what would happen if two smaller but similarly sized satellite galaxies with a similar orbital plane encountered an elliptical galaxy at the same time and happened to be at the perihelion and aphelion of the same orbit? Could they essentially unravel and eventually stabilize into a ring like structure? -Jake
What if the outer ring accreted slowly, but in a retrograde orbit compared to the spin of the central core? I'm imagining things in the gap between the ring and the core interacting gravitationally to clear those orbits, until there's nothing left to interact. Counter-rotating gas would slow down via friction between the two directions, and fall inward, creating a smoothing 'blanket-like' effect on the inner core. All that would be left would be stars, and not nearly as many since there'd be little gas left for star formation, leaving a very empty ring in between the two counter-rotating masses. Could it be possible for this to form based on a very precisely aligned (and slow) collision between a small elliptical and a larger (but not very dense) spiral or disc? If the angles were just right, it could almost be like the semi-stable vertical oscillatory orbit through the center of a toroidal body, with the two oscillating until they stabilize, then smoothing out over the course of a few more rotations. It also reminds me of the way a planet clears its orbit, though I wouldn't think that would leave such clean and even distribution.
1. get the numbers that represent your hypothesis 2. do the math 3. publish the paper in a peer reviewed journal 4. brag that you "solved one of the mysteries of the universe" (Sounds plausible enough to be worth falsifying)
It's not a result of anything gravitational. Gravitational interactions cannot account for accretion of stars from gas clouds much less the observed structure of any galaxy. It's an electrical phenomenon. The plasma current feeding that particular galaxy is what gives it the structure observed.
@@t00by00zer 1. get the numbers that represent your hypothesis 2. do the math 3. publish the paper in a peer reviewed journal 4. brag that you "Finally proved the Electric Universe" (Sounds like E.U. psuedoscience to me - publish and prove me wrong)
Your theory could be verified by long duration observation. If you have tge resources you could set up an observatory and make a lot of observations over several years. Then you coukd determine the movement of the ring structure. Of course determing the movement of the center mass requires very high magnification and resolution immaging. That means you need a very powerful tellescope.
Over the last couple of decades, we’ve all had beaten into our heads that galaxies are embedded in halos of dark matter and that dark matter drives much of large scale galaxy dynamics. In your discussion of Hoag’s object, I did not hear you talk about dark matter. That orbital dynamics model, with a forbidden zone, seems a lot more speculative if we have to assume there is a dark matter matter halo with several times the gravitational mass of all the normal matter. What would that do to the orbital dynamics?
Caldwell Transport Columbus, GA I don’t think calling dark matter a kluge really describes the situation usefully. We have, beginning most importantly with the surprising observations of galaxy rotation behavior by the late Dr Vera Rubin, good evidence that galaxies are surrounded by something creating gravity, a lot of it. Nobody has yet observed, despite looking hard, any sort of normal matter, matter that interacts with light, to account for this gravity, so the name “dark matter”. Perhaps a better name would be invisible matter, or invisible source of gravity, but whatever the name, there is something out there in space that we have good evidence for, but no explanation.
@@markholm7050 Or... our maths are wrong. But its much less embarrassing to say there is something wrong with the universe instead. So lets assign it an arbitrary bit of extra mass and energy so our equations match what we think we see. A "kludge" is accurate.
Prime dimensional space-time could be the answer for dark energy and dark matter. Prime one space time is a nano. If one can conjecture of a universe of Chaos in the Nano phasing of the Prime universe possibility. Imagine, or if you think about it, is there a possibility of a scale of astrophysics that is really really big. Bigger than all of our best instruments will ever be able to tell us. Within each Nano is the chaos of possibility and that we are stuck in a 3D Prime Nano space time. Since there was no Doppler shift looking for the center of the universe with the Big Bang Theory, Other kinds of universal interactions four theories are at play. What if all the possibilities of the Nano space time exist in the chaos field, but we live in a long time compared to the time of the phasing of the Nano space time. So prime one, is that so-called Big Bang Theory thing. And prime one is still in existence but not for our 3D sentient bodies. Everywhere in this verse prime-1 exist for part of the phasing of the Nano cycling in the space time continuum. And also, Prime 3D, Prime 5D, Prime 7D and etcetera Etc all going on within a billionth of a second in a nano space time continuum. If one uses the rubber band affect in the possible interaction of the Prime dimensional space within the Nano space time continuum, there could be a theory that sets up how the universe is constantly in chaos with dimensional Prime space, and as always returning to the zero-point reference of the non chaos universe within the Nano space time continuum. We don't understand the principles behind all this, yet. But it starts making sense, if one learns of the entanglement Theory, and the idea of time being a product of matter and energy interacting in the Nano space time phasing Covenant of the properties of the universe. In other words, in order to understand the grand large, one has to see the greater small. The phasing of the Prime dimensional spaces of the Nano chaos Matrix is what is in the mathematical mind of all the genius on the planet right now. These are very Advanced ideas, and the mathematics require a helping hand. When and if AI become sentient, this will be the grand question for AI to bring to the halls of Academia to take us again into a technological future. Once again, will have the flying carpet, the genie with the wishes, and the Open Sesame world of widgets. And the children of the whole wide world are watching
The calculations on where stable orbits exist apply equally to dark as real matter. The models of mass distribution are just as valid even if we can't see the majority of the mass.
This video gets released a few hours after I switched my phone's lock screen to this galaxy. I guess you could say the chances are about as much as two ring galaxies aligning😋
The last explanation sounds a lot like an exercise in elementary Catastrophe Theory; where you have two stable modes separated by an unstable (splitting) ridge. Nice lecture/explanation :)
Or, to go more SFIA on it... what if it's an alien species that can build Dyson Swarms, but either can't or don't like to colonize those older core systems, maybe due to the more intense radiation, or maybe they just lack the resources they need... and also are leaving the outer star-forming regions alone for ethical reasons, in case new life emerges there in the future? Do we have a nice crisp infrared image of that galaxy? If there are IR signals from the "gap" section, this theory could be plausible. If the gap is there in IR too, then not so much. XD
Or if there is no IR signature, maybe they constructed stellar engines to move the star systems closer to the core, so as to reduce communication and travel times. Maybe they're constructing a Birch planet... Its nice to dream.
I been fascinated by that photo for a long time. Have been looking at other galaxy photos too. Your explanation was very clear and I understood all of it. Love it. I guess I been watching to many astronomy videos,. New sub.
@01:24 -- planetary nebula normally does not refer to a new-formed star that is forming planets, but to an old star that is ejecting mass in a way that gave a planetary appearance in 19th Century telescopes.
Honestly, I think everyone is thinking too small. It’s clear the central collection of blackholes that’s in every galactic core have merged into one. The resulting gravity has sucked the inner material into a giant accretion sphere. The resulting radiation from all that material falling into the central blackhole creates a massive galactic wind that pushes all the rest of the material into a ring and compresses it into a hot star forming area.
I wondered that as well, but thought the distances may be too great. At the same time I also do not want to underestimate the power of Supermassive Black Hole collisions and what they can do to free floating non bound hydrogen gas. You may be right.
@@stefanschnabel2769 I'm not sure that's entirely true, but in any case the gravitational exclusion band described in the video would eventually pull the stars out of the empty area. It wouldn't clear out all the dust though. However, a shock-wave from multiple stars falling into a massive black hole would clear out all the dust quiet quickly.
So thinking bigger , it is whitehole that pushed everything out to more stable orbit. It is lonely that pointing something and it has gas but no other sources nearby.
No aliens, huh? Not even on a fringe note. A distant type 3 civilization having scooped out the inner, turmultous regions of their home galaxy and using the material to build in the farther more stable and benign areas. That definitely would be my go-to theory anyway.
Of cause not, @Poul. I don't live to be a million years - which is required if I want to find out which it is first hand. So I might as well go crazy on conjecture, quickly seizing on the disciplines of philosofy as a guideline to extrapolate on stuff I am able to observe. For example, consider that weird question, "do God exist?" Using philosofy, there is one answer to this, that in it's simplicity and ability to satisfy both religion and science, must simply be true! (Although, always keeping in mind also that "the only thing I know with any certainty is, that I do not know anything at all" to prevent me from growing too frustrated at the state of things over the fact that cosmological timescales laugh in the faces of even our gravest concerns. It simply doesn't matter a thing, when you get right down to it.)
Now imagine you are a member of a species of critter on the verge of spaceflight, whose homeworld is somewhere near the middle of the 58,000 light year gap. Imagine them feels, staring into the void, a barrier 20,000 light years wide, while all around you, as far as your instruments can see, the universe is full of galaxies with no such obstacle.
Yeah, they can even answer "what 2+yellow". The holy books also have a lot of answers to everything. But there is one problem with all of them : they actually just claim "this is the answer" withtout any proof, so get out.
@@drgt3.1 pfffft.. are you talking about the electric universe?? GTFO with that psuedo science mumbo jumbo.. lol. If I wanted alternative facts, I'd watch a trump presser.
The universe is so cool maybe a previous massive black hole that is now decaying sucked all the matter out of the middle but could not get to the outer ring- Thank you for explaining and compiling
Hoag’s object shows the detailed features of the ‘penumbra’ of a plasma focus discharge. the ELECTRIC UNIVERSE can point to a simple explanation, which fits neatly the plasma cosmology model of formation of galaxies in a magnetic pinch at the intersection of cosmic Birkeland current filaments. It's not a mystery at all - the only mystery is why anyone is stil clinging to a gravity centric cosmology when the magnetic signatures of vast electric currents in space are plain to see www.holoscience.com/wp/electric-galaxies/
Seachangeau. This new Electric Universe myth is becoming more like a cult, desperately trying to force Nikola Tesla and Jesus Christ into astrophysics. Have some shame, man.
@@henzy7397 It is, they call it the Electric Universe. Most of their followers have never taken a physics nor an astronomy course in their lifetime. They think the universe is a vast field of electricity where galaxies are powered on by plasma cosmology. It's psuedo science.
Hoag's object looks like the formation of a spiral galaxy. Which follows on from the idea of the stars actually accelerating each other along their paths within galaxies. So the stars in the outer belt accelerate until they start moving the stars in the center and then the motion is merged from the outside in. So the arms of galaxies would stretch inward to the the center, not outward from it. But who knows, it really could be any one of a number of mysterious dynamics.
Since when has it become illegal to say a beautiful girl that she is beautiful ? She's smart and beautiful and nice. Not an easy combination to come by these days ! Obviously she will have lots of admirers.
your eyes are brilliant like this galaxy. thanks for the science :) always nice to listen to someone who knows they're talking about, talking about something they find interesting.
The spiral structure in spiral galaxies is thought to arise from objects that propagate through density waves. It is in these density waves (the current spirals) where star formation happens at the highest rates, with young open clusters, OB associations, H I and II regions and dust, with the centre usually composed of older, redder stars. I wonder if Hoag's Object was a galaxy where the density waves and interacting objects was disrupted in some fashion where the active density wave all "fell" out of the unstable region and formed a ring shape, perhaps some nasty resonance... this is clearly a unique object, so the circumstances must have been statistically unusual.
This is fascinating! There are so many possibilities of different structures in our universe... it's really mind blowing! Question: is there any explanation to what seems to be a concentration of mass on the bottom left (7 o'clock) on the outer ring?
Being just a humble layperson I don't have any fancy mathematics to support the idea, but couldn't it be the evolution of a regular spiral galaxy under some set of circumstances? The outer ends of a spiral galaxy always looked to me like they "wanted" to break free of the galaxy center. Whatever it is that causes that no-man's land in the middle might just be a natural, albeit rare, variation that causes the arms to sort of flare out into a ring eventually.
We don't really know what these so called ring galaxies are. The image in the title to this video looks like a light body in the centre with a big ethereal looking circle halo around it. This is so similar to the ethereal circle halo's we occasionally see around the Sun and the Moon. All are of awesome beauty, they are truly divine. They are best left alone in the majesty of the heavens for us to admire. Sometimes on a light-Moonless night, the skies are clear of clouds and visibility is good, when we stand in a place where there is no ambient man made light - say out on the sticks, and look up to the heavens, what do we see? Well, there is so much to see, it is of such immeasurable beauty, it is so awesome that it may easily momentarily take your breath away. We are so fortunate have this magnificent display before our eyes and whilst many may wish to go up there and see them closer, this is not possible. We must learn to accept that our view of them is limited in this respect.
When I was an astronomy student way back in 2007, I saw a very bare-bones simulation that if two galaxies collided, perfectly parallel and in the direction of opposing normal axes, then a ring like Hoag's Object would form. I can't find the simulation anywhere, but it was a very convincing simulation.
Thanks Dr. Becky for the video. I think the biggest clue to this mystery is that 2 of the same uniquely shaped galaxies are closely aligned together. Which could indicate an unexplored affect between the galaxies and their surrounding area of space.
The calming process for these odd galaxies could be a Type 3 civilisation... bearing in mind there are two of them in the same telescope shot; which can't be just coincidence surely?.... Awesome stuff here on your channel... Thank you...
Hoag's galaxies are created by disc side on disc side collisions between two galaxies in slow motion think of two dinner plates that stack that is how they merge. The merged black holes either stay put and the disks wrap tight about the and fling out or the black holes scatter at near light speed away and the disksslowly disy disipate outwards and up and down from the merger point. I simulated this using a program called galaxcrash over 15 years ago. You canoffset one galaxy by a 4-10 degrees X or Y coordinates but they must both be Z = 0
Great post! Most puzzling! It may turn out that Hoag's object is so solitary has something more specific to It's apparent mass as a whole? And I would include 'Dark Matter' here too, which obviously plays a large part. Of course, our own galaxy will begin to collide with Andromeda in around 4.5 - 5 billion years or so; probably followed by a huge galactic dance for maybe another 5 -10 billion years or so until it settles down to some sort of stability; but this is very difficult at present to approximate given the proximity of the rest of our Local Group also. Thanks again!
Auto-corrected too but at least you address your errors unlike a lot of TH-camrs. 125kly still isn't that huge though, probably smaller than our own if it wasn't for the hole.
Dr Becky, thank you for such intelligent conversations! Could the inner clearing of Hoag's Object be from a black hole clearing out the inner mass from this galaxy? Sort of like how planets clear out mass from a solar system.
There’s a chance that it takes three galaxies to do this. One of the three is cannibalized. What you have left is Hoag’s object number one, in the foreground, and the other object far away (3:21) and a non-spinning naked black hole, at the midpoint, in the dark. Try this in your computer models.
I can give you a very obtuse yet quantifiable concept of an old spiral galaxy (after a disseminated black hole has left a very structured accretion disc behind) meets perpendicularly with a ball galaxy shooting slowly through the center of the ring... counteracting with the minimized black hole. ...think of the "ring" galaxy as a sideways spring (one long corkscrew band offset from 12:00 to 3:00 to 6:00 to 9:00 to 12:00 and so on) with an old minimizing black hole at the center... now have a smaller ball galaxy merging with it at a right angle, the gravitational pulls on each other turning the ball into an egg shape... pulling everything along with it and increasing the egg shape as well as the spring expanse as the ring continues to revolve around the new-formed dual-core, soon to be single core. ...all this happening alone and away and nearer to the beginning of our current particular multiverse as we see it now. ...I can also count around 8 different potentially separate items that may need to be removed/isolated from the "ring" image as to be possibly other galactic entities not directly involved in the makeup of the ring.
Awesome video! I'm an astronomy enthusiast and I really like your videos and you explaining style both here and on deepskyvideos! The topics you choose are awesome as well!
The ring galaxy reminds me of what the bottom side of a water-spout might look like looking at it straight on, you've got this stable ring of central, slower moving matter with a ring of swift moving matter, and a flow in-between preventing any stability, but the ring effect of cooler gasses making clumps of new star formations while the central mass is always fed by a steady stream of hot plasma, could be what we might witness as a white-hole? I'm trying to envision the reverse mechanics of a black hole persisting into a universe formed of the matter that fell into the black hole in the first place. If we can see evidence of a black-hole, it would help to recognize the reverse mechanics of a black hole working in our universe on the flip-side of the event horizon. The really tricky part of "seeing" a white hole, would be the ability to witness optical events in another universe that had no gravitational component to the witnessed event, but all that light would have been blueshifted as well as red-shifted going into and out of the event horizon on it's one way travel towards the singularity. How can we start applying those suppositions on a reality we see? Can we measure gravity of distant objects as a different and separate spectrum yet? How can we discover a gravitationally neutral position in our universe to make any observations? I'd like to be a spaceman one day, and don a pair of sunglasses that let me see the gravitational spectrum of the earth in real time; it would lend itself to an entirely new view of the internal workings of our planet. I love it when science fiction of the past becomes our reality. We can see over vast distances and make calculations with the aid of computers that could never be done by any single master physicist in history. It is truly a wonderous time to be an astronomer.
in a nutshell, the galaxy perimeter is accelerated by blackhole collapse (reduction of matter and energy to vacuum gound state). Each star accelerates in the field pressure drop due to transition of the alcubierre metric (linear framedragging) subsequent to the pressure drop and the new velocity adds mass which requires a faster velocity. The core becomes exhausted and the perimeter becomes the dominant gravitational attractor akin to a hollow newton sphere.
Seems a ring galaxy development project is something a type 3 kartashev civilization would do to show off to all the other sentient lifeforms in the universe.
1:29. A planetary nebula is not a new formed star forming planets, it is "a type of emission nebula consisting of an expanding, glowing shell of ionized gas ejected from red giant stars late in their lives. The term "planetary nebula" is arguably a misnomer, since this phenomenon is not associated with observations of actual planets..."
I might guess this is a "splash" from a perpendicular collision we can't see, so the ring is not rotating around the center as much as moving radially outward.
It almost looks like there was an enormous explosion at the center of the galaxy - the center is still on fire (yellow) and it pushed everything outwards in a circle around it - kinda like the shock wave that gets created when a nuclear bomb goes off... is this a possible explanation?
My theory is an elliptical and spiral galaxy collided and the remains of the spiral are orbiting around the black hole kinda like how the rings orbit saturn
I used to live in a ring galaxy as a young lad and we thought nothing of it. To be honest, they are not quite all they are cracked up to be. Most people actually preferred to live in a beautiful spiral galaxy of just about any kind, such as this one.
Kind of makes me wonder what the end of this galaxy would look like. Clearly it's not possible (or just extremely unlikely) that the stars will slowly sink into the center. So do they just spin around the central mass indefinitely? Or do their circular orbits eventually decay. Do new black holes slowly form and collide into supermassive black holes and create a wrestling match between the galactic center? What if that could cause Hoag's object to move and slam into distant galaxies? Obviously, we'll have no idea until we see something like it, but I'd love to hear the theories.
"Very slow accretion from the intergalactic medium" [10:50] around a globular cluster would make sense if it were near the center of a spinning Filament; if this were the case then the ring galaxy seen through Hoag's Object [3:22] would not be cosmic coincidence, but a result of being linked by a Filament axis.
3:25 At 2:30(clock position) on the ring, there is another red ring which looks similar to the distant ring galaxy. Are they the same due to gravitational lensing?
I am wondering if strong AGN feedback could have driven matter out to trigger the Starburst in the ring. While the Lagrangian stable equilibrium math makes sense, there still seem to be more to it than just that. Fascinating indeed.
Whoops - had a brain typo half way through this video. Hoag's object dimensions should be 17 *thousand* light years, 75 *thousand* light years and 125 *thousand* light years - d'uh.
What's a factor of a thousand between friends :)
Piddly factors.
dawww i thought it was a tiny cute galaxy.
Weird, my brain heard the thousands. Maybe I was just expecting them?
That made me curious, is there a definitional upper and lower limit on what constitutes a galaxy? Like do you need at least a certain amount of stars or volume before it's a galaxy and not just a.. lesser-axy? And is it conceivable that there could be a galaxy so big that it would be more correctly categorized as part of some superstructure? Is there some kind of galactic roche-limit?
Imagine being an astonomer living in Hoag's Galaxy and looking out in the skies, wondering why the hell all the other galaxies are different.
Well, they do have "SDSS J151713.93+213516.8" , aka the ring galaxy we can see behind Hoag's galaxy when we view it; a lottery winner booked up with a lottery winner than can probably see each other.
We're already in a very similar situation. Our Solar System is quite unique in comparison to the majority of other systems we've found... and it certainly leaves us scratching our heads.
Depending where you are in Hoag's Galaxy, you might not know the misfortune of your own shape.
@@Strype13 How is the solar system unique?
@@locoattack1210 The Oort Cloud,the amount of planets we have, etc
There's something deeply satisfying about the fact that Mr. Hoag lived long enough to find out what a marvelous discovery he made.
It's an amazing coincidence that we have such a perfect, polar view of it.
The greatest cosmic coincidence is that Hoags object and the other ring galaxy are both perpendicular to us allowing us to view them in detail.
Not a cosmic coincidence. Those are the rings that Starfox flies through to get his power-ups.
Hyaaaaaah!
Just discovered your channel. Great presentation, clear with great supporting images. Also love your enthusiasm. Thanks.
It is amazing how much the production quality of your videos has increased in just a couple of years.
Question: How would a ring Galaxy look to us edge on? Would we have any way to difference it from a spiral?
This is what I was wondering as well.. many of the collision galaxies shown seem like they could look identical to the Hoags Galaxy if pictures at the right angle.
I think it would look more like... a ring planet, or, those pogo jumpy ball things. Where as a spiral galaxy formed as one unit, thereby having a more gradual connection between the core and the arms/ body; with a 25 LY gap in between the two, seen perfectly edge on, it would likely look like a ball with a plate through it... muck like a Saturn, except, well, a galaxy.
@@faulkgough1768 Did you noticed the correction (by Dr. Becky), this galaxy is actually 125 000 light years (not 125) and gap is 58 000 light years (not 58)
@@vesa.tamminen yes, yes, I did. The Milky way is 100,000 ly across. where she did not correct in the post is that does not make it the 20 some odd times bigger. She made a very good video, goofed on a few numbers, but still got her point across.
@Faulk Gough She said "it's about 25 percent bigger" not 20 some odd times bigger.
I've never heard of ring galaxies before. Thanks for introducing me to these objects!
In your video about the cartwheel galaxy you kinda said that it trumps Hoag's object. Glad to see you pointing out how beautifuly symmetric and aesthetic Hoag's is in this one! And the other distant ring galaxy visible in the gap! The cartwheel might be more interesting to your research but in my opinion Hoag's object is near the top of most beautiful things we've observed in the universe 🥰 gives me goosebumps every time I sink into images of it
I caught that typo too when I thought, "Wow, only 125 ly across, only enough room for a few 100 stars or so..."
One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them
Awww the line from the Big Bang theory
Just kidding I know it game of the rings
(Yes of course I’m kidding I know it’s lord of the thrones)
Great video again! And the sound is so much better now with the lavalier microphone. One remark: the distances in the image (and your narrative) should be in kly (kilolightyear).
I had to watch this three times before I could hear the words . Her beauty keeps freezing my mind. 😍
Why youtube didn't recommended this channel to me before? Love it! And the way you not only explain but the way you talk about it and gave your view. Very nice content, go t a new sub. :)
Omizuke yes I was wondering the same thing
@@maryseeker7590 Bet YT also spam you with a bunch of BS you don't care for. XP
This woman is just as awesome as anton petrov channel
In 1600’s Europe, she would been taken for a witch for her science knowledge and appearance.
With a big difference; she's actually a scientist who knows her stuff. Anton is a wonderful person, but lacks the knowledge and education level of Becky, which shows in their videos. It is (probably) fun to watch his channel if you have absolutely NO knowledge about astronomy, but if you do, you gonna get annoyed by his videos at some point :-)
@@merveilmeok2416 She looks like a witch to you? Jeez
@@silverXnoise wtf
She's way better than Anton Petrov. Don't get me wrong, Petrov is very good but he's just not Dr. Becky's level.
You should look in a straight line from the center of Hoag's, and the other more distant ring galaxy. If there's more in that line, then it's probably just from Thor throwing Mjölnir across the universe.
There's possibly a lot more truth in what you said than you thought. I've noticed that things form in strings in the universe . . . part way through I was thinking look in a line to see if there's another one.
It does look like something huge shot through it. Maybe a supper massive black hole, or holes, are in orbit around the central core and either ate all the stars or pushed them inward or outward.
@Don Mac
It's AMAZING how many people out there have dreams/ visions/ near-death-experiences where they see Loki, but these foolish people misinterpret what they see and they _think_ they're seeing Jesus instead. Silly, silly, gullible fools!
@@Raz.C.... If I saw loki, I wouldn't think I had a near death experience. I'd think someone slipped some LSD in my beer.
@@thomasfleig1184
What I'm getting at, though, is how would you know if you saw Loki? For all we know, the Germanic people got it right and Loki, Odin, Freya etc... are the only real gods and the only reason anyone thinks otherwise/ believes in christianity/ islam/ thinks they saw jesus/ Vishnu/ etc is because of Loki's trickery.
THE PERFECT CHANNEL AT LAST! Im sure im gonna like this vid : 3
p.s. please get a 4k camera (upload 1080 if you like, but get the 4k version)
It seems odd that the other known ring galaxy is so close in angle to this one. Has nay one looked along that line of sight in the opposite direction to see if there are any ring galaxies out that direction as well?
And while on that topic is the orientation of galaxies random or is there some pattern or commonality among them?
Ron Wilson there are some patterns
Here is a good video
Very cool. Every little thing you find out there creates a lot of hypotheses and debate, which progresses our knowledge of what is what in the cosmos.
Larry Niven:- Hey, my Ringworld is cool, 180 million miles diameter, a million miles wide!
Arthur Hoag:- Hold my beer.
Ancient Alien Astronaut Theorists say Hoag's Object is a wormhole teleportation device, used for transporting stones to Egypt to build the pyramids .. because that is what Aliens do .. build stuff with stones on other planets.
Seriously - its nice to see a video with useful intelligent accurate information .. greatly appreciated, as opposed to the above, LOL.
I'll take "what does Dark Matter do" for $500 please, Alex.
Also stop lighting your eyes like Hoag Objects, that's just not fair. :p
A smaller galaxy that hits the center will affect the orbits inside the center but leave most of the outer stars in place. It seems odd that no one thinks of small galaxies colliding with massive ones
Fascinating stuff.
The size and distances of these kind of things just blows my mind. We're talking about things tremendously huge. Isn't that amazing? The universe is quite large to say the very least.
Hey Dr. Becky, just found your channel and love it. Just curious, since I watched this video, after watching your video about dark matter in black holes. Could the ring be a space of dark matter, since it doesn't collide and spiral down as quickly. If so, would that be something possible to test in anyway. Disclaimer: I'm not a physics person, just find the various concepts you talked about fascinating.
Thank you! An extraordinary report!
At 4:53 - If the overall dimensions are 17/75/125 kly the gap would be 58/2=29kly and the ring would be 50/2=25kly wide.
Thank You, Dr. Becky for explaining the mystery of Hoag's Object. I see some similarities between it and any classic spiral galaxy that makes me want to offer a hypothesis of how it formed. Please notice how the core looks "old" and the arms in the rings look "young". It is my opinion that the arms of a spiral are the discharge of the jets of the black hole, from the distant past, that has "condensed" into normal matter. If the black hole was a bit unsettled and the jets were precessing, then the product of the jets would be a double cone. If the "condensation" happened at just one distance, then the arms would form a ring as the jets precessed. And we, viewing it perfectly on axis, can see only one ring. The impossible orbits would clear themselves.
Does the butterfly nebula look like the side view of two cones to you? The jets lay down a bit more with each rotation. There are other examples of cone and ring formations.
Great video Dr. Becky! I wondered throughout the video how dark matter affected the strange formation of this structure. Did the recent paper use dark matter in their simulations? If they did, how do they know where the dark matter is? Seems like assumptions would have to be made. Also, for a "clean" gap in a ring system, we have seen larger, but perhaps not obvious bodies, sweep out a clean section. Some of Saturn's moons create this affect. Maybe there is (or was) something large (black hole/s) that are hoovering out a section! Just spitballing here, but what an awesome system!
A pair of large size black holes orbiting each other 10k ly apart, orbiting the core, would have sucked up all the gas, and ejected all the stars, from the empty ring.
If two of us think this we must be right. How you gonna spend your Nobel windfall? I'm gonna build an airship.
Their orbits would need to closer the 30,000 LY and their mass would need to be in the 100’s of billions of solar mass to achieve this. Also when they spiralled down they would either interfere with each other and launch one or both into deep space and/or merge and the resulting blast wave of billions of solar masses being lost in the heat caused by this merger that we’d easily detect such an event clear across the universe assuming it was within our apparent horizon. I’m not sure this has been ruled out but since it’s reasonably obvious, but ludicrous, some first year has already tried and had the idea shot down, (probably hundreds of such students actually). I thought of this as well, but dismissed it for those plus dozens of other reasons, but definitely a really cool idea, just imagine it!
Good point. Maybe this galaxy will end up being the key to understanding dark matter.
Btw they CAN and DO measure where dark matter is by it's gravity.
Hoag’s Object is an unusual ring galaxy. It has a radius of 121,000 light years bigger than the Milky Way Galaxy. It was discovered by Arthur Hoag in 1958.
Still waiting on the discovery of Hoag's Boson.
It's speld" hoax "boson
Surely you mean the Hoag's Bison.
Hog Buffalo??
I'll get on lit, as soon as I'm done with Hoag's Hoagie.
Or, the Higgs Bison.
Oh wow that billions of years clock is so mind-blowing to watch, to imagine how many millions of beings may have evolved lived, and died whilst those galaxies were merging. Cosmic time and distance measures are so huge!! thanks, Dr. Becky for another mind-expanding exercise :)
In the second theory you provided, similar to how we think planetary rings like Saturn's form, could there be some mechanism that the collision could drag the increased hydrogen concentration out of the elliptical core galaxy?
**edit**
I was just wondering this very moment if there was some "third party" galaxy involved that got flung out of orbit, but I would think there would be some traces of such an object, even if an event like that happened billions of years ago. Unless! It was mostly composed of dark matter! Seems like a crazy number of coincidences, but then again, this seems like a pretty extraordinary object.
I was thinking that, too. A galactic-level Roche limit? I don't know the maths well enough.
@@sanders555 I was just wondering this very moment if there was some "third party" galaxy involved that got flung out of orbit, but I would think there would be some traces of such an object, even if an event like that happened billions of years ago. Unless! It was mostly composed of dark matter! Seems like a crazy number of coincidences, but then again, this seems like a pretty extraordinary object.
@@snowballeffect7812 Dark matter crossed my mind as well... Perhaps a combination indeed.
Mr. Worf, program a level 3 probe with a trajectory into the anomaly and launch when ready.
i recall an astronomer once pondering that the arms of any given galaxy pose something of a dilemma because the 'wrapping' around effect ( spinning of the galaxy ) should destroy these 'arms' but this presupposes that the arms were once sticking straight out, which is of course, completely bonkers ! So i formulated the opposing theory at that moment, that the arms were formed from a general cloud of stars that were 'clumped' together from gravitation ( and electrical ) forces that pulled them into arms. / for this Ring Galaxy, the same effect ( due to ( ??? ) ) occurred when the center pulled the inner stars towards the center, leaving the outer stars that 'clumped' into the outer ring. ( ? )
Hey Becky, I know there is already a video on M104 on DeepSkyVideos but is M104 also a ring galaxy? Or can we not say that, since we are looking at it from the side?
I love videos that talk about subjects of active research, and this one is a major treat!
One minor "paper-cut" request: I worry that characterizing galactic interactions as "catastrophic" and talking about them being shredded and destroyed might lead to people imagining that it's a dangerous and probably fatal thing to happen to any possible inhabitants in the galaxies. When in reality, a tiny fraction of star systems would be disrupted by galactic collisions. The only thing that gets "destroyed" is the general shape and macroscopic structure of the galaxies. Maybe it would be better to talk about "distorting the disks into strange and beautiful shapes", and creating "interesting streamers and filaments". Possibly even point out that the star birth might lead to eventual new biological life in the universe, although that could get off-topic pretty fast. :-)
Thanks for the video!
Have any of these Hoagies been discovered that are NOT center-on to our point of view? Are there any that we observe at an oblique angle? If not, doesn't that seem impossibly coincidental?
Well, there have been a couple Ring Galaxies discovered of that type, however, we have never knowingly observed one directly head-on, and that's because there is no way of telling say The Whale Galaxy or the Cigar Galaxy of their galactic shape, as no defining features or characteristics are inherently visible. It's why we still don't know the nature of the Milky Way for this same reason. We're directly on the galactic plane of it.
@@GameKraken - Thank you for your reply!
Love ya Dr. Becky!!! Your videos keep me interested in pursuing a research career in Astronomy & Astrophysics 😄
Cool. While intuitively it would be super rare, what would happen if two smaller but similarly sized satellite galaxies with a similar orbital plane encountered an elliptical galaxy at the same time and happened to be at the perihelion and aphelion of the same orbit? Could they essentially unravel and eventually stabilize into a ring like structure?
-Jake
Nicely done. I would never have understood all those papers if I had attempted to read them.
What if the outer ring accreted slowly, but in a retrograde orbit compared to the spin of the central core? I'm imagining things in the gap between the ring and the core interacting gravitationally to clear those orbits, until there's nothing left to interact.
Counter-rotating gas would slow down via friction between the two directions, and fall inward, creating a smoothing 'blanket-like' effect on the inner core. All that would be left would be stars, and not nearly as many since there'd be little gas left for star formation, leaving a very empty ring in between the two counter-rotating masses.
Could it be possible for this to form based on a very precisely aligned (and slow) collision between a small elliptical and a larger (but not very dense) spiral or disc? If the angles were just right, it could almost be like the semi-stable vertical oscillatory orbit through the center of a toroidal body, with the two oscillating until they stabilize, then smoothing out over the course of a few more rotations.
It also reminds me of the way a planet clears its orbit, though I wouldn't think that would leave such clean and even distribution.
1. get the numbers that represent your hypothesis
2. do the math
3. publish the paper in a peer reviewed journal
4. brag that you "solved one of the mysteries of the universe"
(Sounds plausible enough to be worth falsifying)
It's not a result of anything gravitational. Gravitational interactions cannot account for accretion of stars from gas clouds much less the observed structure of any galaxy.
It's an electrical phenomenon. The plasma current feeding that particular galaxy is what gives it the structure observed.
@@t00by00zer 1. get the numbers that represent your hypothesis
2. do the math 3. publish the paper in a peer reviewed journal
4. brag that you "Finally proved the Electric Universe"
(Sounds like E.U. psuedoscience to me - publish and prove me wrong)
Your theory could be verified by long duration observation. If you have tge resources you could set up an observatory and make a lot of observations over several years. Then you coukd determine the movement of the ring structure. Of course determing the movement of the center mass requires very high magnification and resolution immaging. That means you need a very powerful tellescope.
Hoag's Object, is that a Black Hole you have captured in the middle of you, or are you just smiling for Earth's cameras?
PS,has JWST viewed Hoags Object yet.Thanks again for the descriptions.
Over the last couple of decades, we’ve all had beaten into our heads that galaxies are embedded in halos of dark matter and that dark matter drives much of large scale galaxy dynamics. In your discussion of Hoag’s object, I did not hear you talk about dark matter. That orbital dynamics model, with a forbidden zone, seems a lot more speculative if we have to assume there is a dark matter matter halo with several times the gravitational mass of all the normal matter. What would that do to the orbital dynamics?
Dark matter is an astronomics mathematical kludge.
Caldwell Transport Columbus, GA I don’t think calling dark matter a kluge really describes the situation usefully. We have, beginning most importantly with the surprising observations of galaxy rotation behavior by the late Dr Vera Rubin, good evidence that galaxies are surrounded by something creating gravity, a lot of it. Nobody has yet observed, despite looking hard, any sort of normal matter, matter that interacts with light, to account for this gravity, so the name “dark matter”. Perhaps a better name would be invisible matter, or invisible source of gravity, but whatever the name, there is something out there in space that we have good evidence for, but no explanation.
@@markholm7050 Or... our maths are wrong. But its much less embarrassing to say there is something wrong with the universe instead. So lets assign it an arbitrary bit of extra mass and energy so our equations match what we think we see. A "kludge" is accurate.
Prime dimensional space-time could be the answer for dark energy and dark matter.
Prime one space time is a nano.
If one can conjecture of a universe of Chaos in the Nano phasing of the Prime universe possibility.
Imagine, or if you think about it, is there a possibility of a scale of astrophysics that is really really big.
Bigger than all of our best instruments will ever be able to tell us.
Within each Nano is the chaos of possibility and that we are stuck in a 3D Prime Nano space time.
Since there was no Doppler shift looking for the center of the universe with the Big Bang Theory,
Other kinds of universal interactions four theories are at play.
What if all the possibilities of the Nano space time exist in the chaos field, but we live in a long time compared to the time of the phasing of the Nano space time.
So prime one, is that so-called Big Bang Theory thing. And prime one is still in existence but not for our 3D sentient bodies. Everywhere in this verse prime-1 exist for part of the phasing of the Nano cycling in the space time continuum.
And also, Prime 3D, Prime 5D, Prime 7D and etcetera Etc all going on within a billionth of a second in a nano space time continuum.
If one uses the rubber band affect in the possible interaction of the Prime dimensional space within the Nano space time continuum, there could be a theory that sets up how the universe is constantly in chaos with dimensional Prime space, and as always returning to the zero-point reference of the non chaos universe within the Nano space time continuum.
We don't understand the principles behind all this, yet. But it starts making sense, if one learns of the entanglement Theory, and the idea of time being a product of matter and energy interacting in the Nano space time phasing Covenant of the properties of the universe. In other words, in order to understand the grand large, one has to see the greater small.
The phasing of the Prime dimensional spaces of the Nano chaos Matrix is what is in the mathematical mind of all the genius on the planet right now. These are very Advanced ideas, and the mathematics require a helping hand.
When and if AI become sentient, this will be the grand question for AI to bring to the halls of Academia to take us again into a technological future.
Once again, will have the flying carpet, the genie with the wishes, and the Open Sesame world of widgets.
And the children of the whole wide world are watching
The calculations on where stable orbits exist apply equally to dark as real matter. The models of mass distribution are just as valid even if we can't see the majority of the mass.
She is able to bring the extremely complicated down to a level that I can kind of understand. I just love listening to her.
This video gets released a few hours after I switched my phone's lock screen to this galaxy. I guess you could say the chances are about as much as two ring galaxies aligning😋
The last explanation sounds a lot like an exercise in elementary Catastrophe Theory; where you have two stable modes separated by an unstable (splitting) ridge. Nice lecture/explanation :)
Or, to go more SFIA on it... what if it's an alien species that can build Dyson Swarms, but either can't or don't like to colonize those older core systems, maybe due to the more intense radiation, or maybe they just lack the resources they need... and also are leaving the outer star-forming regions alone for ethical reasons, in case new life emerges there in the future? Do we have a nice crisp infrared image of that galaxy? If there are IR signals from the "gap" section, this theory could be plausible. If the gap is there in IR too, then not so much. XD
That would drasticly change the mass of the whole galaxy and mass distribution. The orbits of the ring would be different.
Or if there is no IR signature, maybe they constructed stellar engines to move the star systems closer to the core, so as to reduce communication and travel times. Maybe they're constructing a Birch planet... Its nice to dream.
It's never aliens
@@raidermaxx2324 Until it is.
@@archenema6792 thats some pretty steep odds, since considering it hasnt been, so far.. :P.. ill take not aliens for 100, chuck.
Your beaming blue eyes are incredible. How appropriate you showed a image of the cat's eye nebula, also an incredible blue. Kindred entities.
I wonder if this is a hoags..
I groaned but it was worthy of a thumbs up.
I been fascinated by that photo for a long time. Have been looking at other galaxy photos too. Your explanation was very clear and I understood all of it. Love it. I guess I been watching to many astronomy videos,. New sub.
Kardeshev type 3 civilization
@01:24 -- planetary nebula normally does not refer to a new-formed star that is forming planets, but to an old star that is ejecting mass in a way that gave a planetary appearance in 19th Century telescopes.
Honestly, I think everyone is thinking too small. It’s clear the central collection of blackholes that’s in every galactic core have merged into one. The resulting gravity has sucked the inner material into a giant accretion sphere. The resulting radiation from all that material falling into the central blackhole creates a massive galactic wind that pushes all the rest of the material into a ring and compresses it into a hot star forming area.
I wondered that as well, but thought the distances may be too great. At the same time I also do not want to underestimate the power of Supermassive Black Hole collisions and what they can do to free floating non bound hydrogen gas. You may be right.
Stars can't be moved that way. It only works for gas and dust.
@@stefanschnabel2769 I'm not sure that's entirely true, but in any case the gravitational exclusion band described in the video would eventually pull the stars out of the empty area. It wouldn't clear out all the dust though. However, a shock-wave from multiple stars falling into a massive black hole would clear out all the dust quiet quickly.
So thinking bigger , it is whitehole that pushed everything out to more stable orbit. It is lonely that pointing something and it has gas but no other sources nearby.
@@marsamatruh5327 I was literally about to comment this and decided to look at the comments first.
Thank you for making your videos interesting but also easy to understand
Come on, god created them on the seventh day, when he rested and puffed smoke rings around the firmament of the heaven.
I have subscribed. I love to hear about unusual objects in space and like cosmology videos. You make it fun and just looking at you is a pleasure.
No aliens, huh? Not even on a fringe note. A distant type 3 civilization having scooped out the inner, turmultous regions of their home galaxy and using the material to build in the farther more stable and benign areas. That definitely would be my go-to theory anyway.
I suppose its not impossible but thats your go too? You dont look for a solution not requiring insanely advanced aliens before just assuming that?
There seems to be a nature bias...but honestly we should lie about it just to unify earth.
Of cause not, @Poul. I don't live to be a million years - which is required if I want to find out which it is first hand. So I might as well go crazy on conjecture, quickly seizing on the disciplines of philosofy as a guideline to extrapolate on stuff I am able to observe. For example, consider that weird question, "do God exist?" Using philosofy, there is one answer to this, that in it's simplicity and ability to satisfy both religion and science, must simply be true! (Although, always keeping in mind also that "the only thing I know with any certainty is, that I do not know anything at all" to prevent me from growing too frustrated at the state of things over the fact that cosmological timescales laugh in the faces of even our gravest concerns. It simply doesn't matter a thing, when you get right down to it.)
Now imagine you are a member of a species of critter on the verge of spaceflight, whose homeworld is somewhere near the middle of the 58,000 light year gap. Imagine them feels, staring into the void, a barrier 20,000 light years wide, while all around you, as far as your instruments can see, the universe is full of galaxies with no such obstacle.
The guys in the Thunderbolts project have the answer for these kind of objects.
Great, just point me to the journal for citation!
Yeah, they can even answer "what 2+yellow". The holy books also have a lot of answers to everything. But there is one problem with all of them : they actually just claim "this is the answer" withtout any proof, so get out.
They have many interesting hypothesis and simple explanations. Only the old dogmas claims to know it all. At least they ask the right questions.
@@drgt3.1 exactly
@@drgt3.1 pfffft.. are you talking about the electric universe?? GTFO with that psuedo science mumbo jumbo.. lol. If I wanted alternative facts, I'd watch a trump presser.
The universe is so cool maybe a previous massive black hole that is now decaying sucked all the matter out of the middle but could not get to the outer ring- Thank you for explaining and compiling
Hoag’s object shows the detailed features of the ‘penumbra’ of a plasma focus discharge. the ELECTRIC UNIVERSE can point to a simple explanation, which fits neatly the plasma cosmology model of formation of galaxies in a magnetic pinch at the intersection of cosmic Birkeland current filaments. It's not a mystery at all - the only mystery is why anyone is stil clinging to a gravity centric cosmology when the magnetic signatures of vast electric currents in space are plain to see www.holoscience.com/wp/electric-galaxies/
Have you studied General Relativity? The electromagnetic field is a fundamental feature of the geometrical description of spacetime in GR.
So many words, so little sense.
Seachangeau. This new Electric Universe myth is becoming more like a cult, desperately trying to force Nikola Tesla and Jesus Christ into astrophysics. Have some shame, man.
Is this another conspiracy like the flat earth? It sure seems like it. Too much technobabble than any sort of explanation for their claims.
@@henzy7397 It is, they call it the Electric Universe. Most of their followers have never taken a physics nor an astronomy course in their lifetime. They think the universe is a vast field of electricity where galaxies are powered on by plasma cosmology. It's psuedo science.
Hoag's object looks like the formation of a spiral galaxy. Which follows on from the idea of the stars actually accelerating each other along their paths within galaxies. So the stars in the outer belt accelerate until they start moving the stars in the center and then the motion is merged from the outside in. So the arms of galaxies would stretch inward to the the center, not outward from it. But who knows, it really could be any one of a number of mysterious dynamics.
Do those galaxies have beautiful girls like you Rebecca?
I scrolled all the way down just to like this comment because she's amazing
Looks like we have another creepy stalker on our hands.
Since when has it become illegal to say a beautiful girl that she is beautiful ?
She's smart and beautiful and nice. Not an easy combination to come by these days ! Obviously she will have lots of admirers.
@@OsimheninMaskesindekiÇivi Still makes you look like a creepy stalker.
I've always loved that you can see another one in the gap of the first one.
your eyes are brilliant like this galaxy. thanks for the science :) always nice to listen to someone who knows they're talking about, talking about something they find interesting.
The spiral structure in spiral galaxies is thought to arise from objects that propagate through density waves. It is in these density waves (the current spirals) where star formation happens at the highest rates, with young open clusters, OB associations, H I and II regions and dust, with the centre usually composed of older, redder stars.
I wonder if Hoag's Object was a galaxy where the density waves and interacting objects was disrupted in some fashion where the active density wave all "fell" out of the unstable region and formed a ring shape, perhaps some nasty resonance... this is clearly a unique object, so the circumstances must have been statistically unusual.
This is fascinating! There are so many possibilities of different structures in our universe... it's really mind blowing!
Question: is there any explanation to what seems to be a concentration of mass on the bottom left (7 o'clock) on the outer ring?
Being just a humble layperson I don't have any fancy mathematics to support the idea, but couldn't it be the evolution of a regular spiral galaxy under some set of circumstances? The outer ends of a spiral galaxy always looked to me like they "wanted" to break free of the galaxy center. Whatever it is that causes that no-man's land in the middle might just be a natural, albeit rare, variation that causes the arms to sort of flare out into a ring eventually.
We don't really know what these so called ring galaxies are. The image in the title to this video looks like a light body in the centre with a big ethereal looking circle halo around it. This is so similar to the ethereal circle halo's we occasionally see around the Sun and the Moon. All are of awesome beauty, they are truly divine. They are best left alone in the majesty of the heavens for us to admire. Sometimes on a light-Moonless night, the skies are clear of clouds and visibility is good, when we stand in a place where there is no ambient man made light - say out on the sticks, and look up to the heavens, what do we see? Well, there is so much to see, it is of such immeasurable beauty, it is so awesome that it may easily momentarily take your breath away. We are so fortunate have this magnificent display before our eyes and whilst many may wish to go up there and see them closer, this is not possible. We must learn to accept that our view of them is limited in this respect.
When I was an astronomy student way back in 2007, I saw a very bare-bones simulation that if two galaxies collided, perfectly parallel and in the direction of opposing normal axes, then a ring like Hoag's Object would form. I can't find the simulation anywhere, but it was a very convincing simulation.
Thanks Dr. Becky for the video. I think the biggest clue to this mystery is that 2 of the same uniquely shaped galaxies are closely aligned together. Which could indicate an unexplored affect between the galaxies and their surrounding area of space.
The calming process for these odd galaxies could be a Type 3 civilisation... bearing in mind there are two of them in the same telescope shot; which can't be just coincidence surely?.... Awesome stuff here on your channel... Thank you...
Hoag's galaxies are created by disc side on disc side collisions between two galaxies in slow motion think of two dinner plates that stack that is how they merge. The merged black holes either stay put and the disks wrap tight about the and fling out or the black holes scatter at near light speed away and the disksslowly disy disipate outwards and up and down from the merger point. I simulated this using a program called galaxcrash over 15 years ago. You canoffset one galaxy by a 4-10 degrees X or Y coordinates but they must both be Z = 0
An interesting video, Dr. Becky, thanks. I would ask, though, if you could post links to the papers you mention. Again, thank you for your work.
Great post!
Most puzzling! It may turn out that Hoag's object is so solitary has something more specific to It's apparent mass as a whole? And I would include 'Dark Matter' here too, which obviously plays a large part.
Of course, our own galaxy will begin to collide with Andromeda in around 4.5 - 5 billion years or so; probably followed by a huge galactic dance for maybe another 5 -10 billion years or so until it settles down to some sort of stability; but this is very difficult at present to approximate given the proximity of the rest of our Local Group also. Thanks again!
Auto-corrected too but at least you address your errors unlike a lot of TH-camrs. 125kly still isn't that huge though, probably smaller than our own if it wasn't for the hole.
YOU arr bloody good at explaining cool stuff Becky and you have a passion for it, you deserve a lot more than 6.4k subs
The idea that Galaxies collide and merge is utterly ridiculous.
Dr Becky, thank you for such intelligent conversations! Could the inner clearing of Hoag's Object be from a black hole clearing out the inner mass from this galaxy? Sort of like how planets clear out mass from a solar system.
There’s a chance that it takes three galaxies to do this. One of the three is cannibalized. What you have left is Hoag’s object number one, in the foreground, and the other object far away (3:21) and a non-spinning
naked black hole, at the midpoint, in the dark. Try this in your computer models.
I blew that first picture up and looked at in awe for years.
I can give you a very obtuse yet quantifiable concept of an old spiral galaxy (after a disseminated black hole has left a very structured accretion disc behind) meets perpendicularly with a ball galaxy shooting slowly through the center of the ring... counteracting with the minimized black hole.
...think of the "ring" galaxy as a sideways spring (one long corkscrew band offset from 12:00 to 3:00 to 6:00 to 9:00 to 12:00 and so on) with an old minimizing black hole at the center... now have a smaller ball galaxy merging with it at a right angle, the gravitational pulls on each other turning the ball into an egg shape... pulling everything along with it and increasing the egg shape as well as the spring expanse as the ring continues to revolve around the new-formed dual-core, soon to be single core.
...all this happening alone and away and nearer to the beginning of our current particular multiverse as we see it now.
...I can also count around 8 different potentially separate items that may need to be removed/isolated from the "ring" image as to be possibly other galactic entities not directly involved in the makeup of the ring.
Awesome video! I'm an astronomy enthusiast and I really like your videos and you explaining style both here and on deepskyvideos! The topics you choose are awesome as well!
The ring galaxy reminds me of what the bottom side of a water-spout might look like looking at it straight on, you've got this stable ring of central, slower moving matter with a ring of swift moving matter, and a flow in-between preventing any stability, but the ring effect of cooler gasses making clumps of new star formations while the central mass is always fed by a steady stream of hot plasma, could be what we might witness as a white-hole? I'm trying to envision the reverse mechanics of a black hole persisting into a universe formed of the matter that fell into the black hole in the first place. If we can see evidence of a black-hole, it would help to recognize the reverse mechanics of a black hole working in our universe on the flip-side of the event horizon. The really tricky part of "seeing" a white hole, would be the ability to witness optical events in another universe that had no gravitational component to the witnessed event, but all that light would have been blueshifted as well as red-shifted going into and out of the event horizon on it's one way travel towards the singularity.
How can we start applying those suppositions on a reality we see? Can we measure gravity of distant objects as a different and separate spectrum yet? How can we discover a gravitationally neutral position in our universe to make any observations? I'd like to be a spaceman one day, and don a pair of sunglasses that let me see the gravitational spectrum of the earth in real time; it would lend itself to an entirely new view of the internal workings of our planet. I love it when science fiction of the past becomes our reality. We can see over vast distances and make calculations with the aid of computers that could never be done by any single master physicist in history. It is truly a wonderous time to be an astronomer.
Heart wakes up and feels alive again to see Dr. Becky, such a Shiny Star.
in a nutshell, the galaxy perimeter is accelerated by blackhole collapse (reduction of matter and energy to vacuum gound state). Each star accelerates in the field pressure drop due to transition of the alcubierre metric (linear framedragging) subsequent to the pressure drop and the new velocity adds mass which requires a faster velocity. The core becomes exhausted and the perimeter becomes the dominant gravitational attractor akin to a hollow newton sphere.
Seems a ring galaxy development project is something a type 3 kartashev civilization would do to show off to all the other sentient lifeforms in the universe.
1:29. A planetary nebula is not a new formed star forming planets, it is "a type of emission nebula consisting of an expanding, glowing shell of ionized gas ejected from red giant stars late in their lives. The term "planetary nebula" is arguably a misnomer, since this phenomenon is not associated with observations of actual planets..."
Ahh yes the ladys love to dance! Thanks Dr.Becky for this introduction into Ring Galaxies!
I might guess this is a "splash" from a perpendicular collision we can't see, so the ring is not rotating around the center as much as moving radially outward.
It almost looks like there was an enormous explosion at the center of the galaxy - the center is still on fire (yellow) and it pushed everything outwards in a circle around it - kinda like the shock wave that gets created when a nuclear bomb goes off... is this a possible explanation?
My theory is an elliptical and spiral galaxy collided and the remains of the spiral are orbiting around the black hole kinda like how the rings orbit saturn
I used to live in a ring galaxy as a young lad and we thought nothing of it. To be honest, they are not quite all they are cracked up to be. Most people actually preferred to live in a beautiful spiral galaxy of just about any kind, such as this one.
Kind of makes me wonder what the end of this galaxy would look like. Clearly it's not possible (or just extremely unlikely) that the stars will slowly sink into the center. So do they just spin around the central mass indefinitely? Or do their circular orbits eventually decay. Do new black holes slowly form and collide into supermassive black holes and create a wrestling match between the galactic center? What if that could cause Hoag's object to move and slam into distant galaxies? Obviously, we'll have no idea until we see something like it, but I'd love to hear the theories.
"Very slow accretion from the intergalactic medium" [10:50] around a globular cluster would make sense if it were near the center of a spinning Filament; if this were the case then the ring galaxy seen through Hoag's Object [3:22] would not be cosmic coincidence, but a result of being linked by a Filament axis.
3:25
At 2:30(clock position) on the ring, there is another red ring which looks similar to the distant ring galaxy. Are they the same due to gravitational lensing?
This object is so perfectly round, which makes it so inexplicable
I love vids like this that make you think and ask the question, HOW ?
I am wondering if strong AGN feedback could have driven matter out to trigger the Starburst in the ring. While the Lagrangian stable equilibrium math makes sense, there still seem to be more to it than just that. Fascinating indeed.