This League WANTS to bring pro/rel to US Soccer
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- USL, United Soccer League, want to bring promotion and relegation to soccer in the USA. Something MLS has never done and likely never will.
Today we bring in Greg Lalas to talk about the possibility of pro/rel coming to soccer in the USA.
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My hometown club is Union Omaha (USL1). In Open Cup play, we have beaten clubs from USL Championship and MLS. Since our club's formation four years ago, we have won the Players' Shield (regular season title) twice, League Cup (playoff championship) once, reached the playoff finals a second time (cancelled due to COVID-19), and made an Open Cup quarterfinal run.
The fact that we are still sitting in USL1 is a travesty. Any club with that resume has done more than enough to warrant promotion.
Big things happening for Union Omaha! New stadium bill passed and getting built and upcoming USOC game against Sporting KC! Rooting for y’all!
🦉
@@TMAC803210
Tough to draw SKC this early. But, we do get them up here. They put us to the sword a couple years ago.
In a universe in which pro/rel existed across the entire American pyramid, an Omaha/KC derby would potentially be pretty good. We have been KC's little brother for decades. Culturally, the two cities are quite similar.
But, we're a smaller, minor league city. They've had Super Bowl champions, World Series champions, and MLS since the league's inception.
The thing is, Omahans are proud. We are accustomed to running things within our own state. We don't like being patted on the head and told we're cute. And generally, when we decide to do something, we do it big and do it well.
Honestly, I feel Omaha would be a fantastic city to host a top flight, premiership club. The locals are fanatically loyal. We already turn up in huge numbers for other events (Creighton basketball, College World Series, Division 1 hockey, Berkshire Hathaway shareholders meeting, a half dozen arena and theatre venues for music, Nebraska football down the road in Lincoln, etc, etc). An MLS club (or whatever they might call themselves after some future hypothetical reform of the US pyramid) is hardly a stretch to consider.
As excited as I am about the new stadium and the entertainment district surrounding it, I was mildly disappointed by the size - 7-8 thousand, I believe. I was hoping for twice that size, TBH. Baby steps, I guess.
As someone on the far side of the country from you, I love you guys and am excited for your new stadium!
@@gabrielgroen2522
I certainly appreciate that. I'm looking forward to the new stadium. The great thing about it will be its location, called "NODO" (NOrth DOwntown) by the locals. The area has a lot of bars, restaurants, a nice riverfront walk, and mid-range to upscale condos and apartments. It's also walking distance to other sports arenas, concert venues, and the city's principal entertainment/nightlife district. A new light rail system will take fans from mid-city to the stadium (or quite close to it).
As for being on the other side of the country from us, join the club.
We are as far as we could possibly be from any part of the US one might call interesting, or so many people say. They call us flyover country for a reason. Others simply say that Omaha is the government's default destination for Mafia snitches in witness protection. (That last bit is actually true - Henry Hill of Goodfellas fame lived here after testifying against Jimmy Burke and Big Paulie).
Regardless, thanks for the love.
COYO (Come On You Owls)
My local club is in USL League 1. If they were to introduce Pro/Rel, it would officially become my favorite league!
EDIT: (in case you misread)… my local club is already my favorite club; I’m talking about the league
which team do you support?
@@kevinbarnes218Forward Madison
Why do you not support your team now?
@@davidday2373Who said he doesnt?
This is exactly what I point out to people and use minor league baseball teams as an example. Minor leagues have may small attendance since people care less if it's not the top league. But if you allow the opportunity to let them move up, you would ignite a fanbase like crazy.
You'd imagine the UPSL, NPSL, & NISA teams would quickly be absorbed into USL if they implemented pro/rel. If they can unite the rest of the pyramid under the USL umbrella it would be massive. To officially get the MLS vs the rest
USL is still expanding. If they can absorb other leagues later, then PRO/REL might work
@@nateskie75 Chicken vs the egg man. The people in these leagues are selfish that's the truth. I think this is a build it and they will come situation. There is NISA, USL, NPSL, UPSL nationally. And then there are other regional adult leagues not affiliated with what I listed. There is also some other league that says they will start at a 3rd tier league at some point. Getting them to unite isn't going to happen with "talks". If you offer these clubs the chance to actually move up the pyramid that's going to be the thing that brings in everyone. The American soccer scene is working more like a monopoly board because the federation has and is subservient to the MLS.
For what?
The only problem is USL has territory rights. Some clubs compete in NISA/NASL because they _can't_ join USL because another club already claimed the territory.
See OCSC/Irvine Zeta in the same region (USL1 vs NISA, same stadium)
NISA is professional; UPSL and NPSL are amateur. What does that add to the convo? Probably nothing, but still 😂
It's little funny when you were discussing regionalisation it was mentioned about England being geographically small and getting around on a bus. The English pyramid structure is very heavily regionalised when you get towards the bottom. And this is for the exact same reasons, travel costs etc. The 11th tier is basically county level with small villages taking on works teams. Every Saturday at 3pm there over 5,000 clubs kicking a ball around, and thats just the official pyramid in the Mens game.
Facts! The French league is like that too.
Always lots of comments “if pro/rel happens, THEN I’ll support my local team” your local team needs support NOW! Don’t just virtue signal, help the sport grow in the US!
Definitely agree with you 100%!
11 Yanks has left the chat. I appreciate you actually calling out people for phony support.
Agreed, I’ll be going to my local upsl club’s home opener on Sunday!!
@@asapaul7671 nice! Doing your part to grow the game👍
😂 True! They won't support now they won't support later. Heck, they won't support when their team never reaches the top division after years of trying 😂
Greg attempted to sidestep the question about MLS and USL competing. He was a little bit on edge when Filippo decided to push further 23:10. Good journalism Tac, no softball questions like the big broadcasters.
A closed system like MLS limits the number of teams to around 30 or so. Already we have major league cities that are excluded because it's too late unless a smaller city team relocates. With pro-rel you multiply the number of candidate cities, even though they can't all be in the top division at the same time, they do have the opportunity to get there. That should increase competition, which can only raise the level of play. Something one might consider if there are enough teams is to have two regional but equivalent "leagues" or "divisions" that play each other in an end of season playoff. (Baseball has two leagues and it used to be the World Series was the playoff.) Otherwise keep their schedules within the region. We easily have the potential for 40 or more big league cities.
As a Birmingham Legion fan I really hope that the USL actually does it. That being said this all feels very disingenuous at this point. They have been promising this for five years and as a fan and a spectator it seems that very little, if anything, has actually happened. I was always raised and told that if you don’t mean it, don’t say it. If you say it and don’t mean it and keep saying it, nobody will believe you. It’s starting to feel like the USL is the boy who cried Wolf with promotion and relegation. Either stop fake promising it or actually do it. And look, if y’all don’t want to do promotion and relegation… That’s fine. No other sports league in the US does it. If you want to do it, that is great and I want to see it. Just don’t lie to us about what the actual plan is and keep promising something that isn’t coming.
To be fair, they haven't been promising it. They've only said they're interested and to do it they would need to be extremely strategic about it. The way league standards are set up and how few support they have compared to MLS, it would be a mess if they just flipped a switch. A lot needs to be done.
Keep in mind that they have needed more clubs for pro/rel and it takes time, but the USL is getting a lot more clubs, more clubs means pro/rel is more likely imo
as a Birmingham native, i think people should think more realistically. I don't see Soccer being big in the States especially when the sports haven't made it to the inner cities and the salaries are not as big as the BIG 3. NBA, NFL, MLB. Plus Soccer being a pay to play sport like all sports in the US is not helping its case. As far as I'm concerned, The MLS will be smaller than the WNBA or NCAA Women's Basketball in the upcoming years.
@@cuzzozanteeno2127 soccer is on a long growing trajectory in the states. MLS average attendance is 80% of MLB (though MLB has waaaay more games) and higher than NBA or NHL (which granted have lower arena capacity). USL and NWSL are on the rise too. The revenue isn't there yet but it's heading in the right direction. Plus with the world cup coming to the US in 2026, it is pretty clear that pro soccer is on the rise in the US.
There definitely need to be more teams that join the league. The USA is a huge country. There should be at least a couple teams in every large city
He says it in the video but for those who missed it & want to catch future USL games, all games are usually on ESPN+, certain games will be on CBS Golazo, and a select few throughout the season on CBSSN & actual CBS. Go Riverhounds !
I think that people are carefully thinking about but not mentioning is that American investment into football clubs are already happening and growing in Europe, seeing movie stars, athletes, singers want to convert their money into investments. The English football system has 22 American owners/minority owners in the top 3 leagues already. I wouldn't be surprised if more minority owners and sponsors would put more interest into investing once ESPN and CBS picks up USL, making it the next gold rush.
My hometown had a USL team. I would get free tickets to the supporters section from friends who were there every home game. Unfortunately the team died during covid
to be fair MLS does a shitty job of advertising their teams too. lets not kid ourself here. USL has plenty of room to advertise. Sorry about ur team
I'm glad you brought up the way Brazilian teams qualify for Serie D, most people don't know that. I actually think that's the route we should go if we do it, Brazil is the best comparison we have globally.
The whole world uses the same system. Brazil is not unique in this regard.
@@ivanpetrov5185 Brazil has a different take on pro/rel. It's not like the rest of the world. Japan does things differently also.
@@rq7284 could you explain what are the main differences (compared to European countries)?
@@axelll971 they have the top 4 tiers that are run by the federation. but below that it's only the state leagues. They have the national leagues that run for most of the year. But they also have the time when big teams play just the state league will smaller teams within that state.
For the lower leagues below 4, the 5th tier champions don't automatically qualify to the Serie D. And teams don't really relegate out of serie D. So they gave two separate pyramids (1-4) and the state pyramid. It's very complicated
@@rq7284 thx for the information.
I don’t really see the major differences with other countries. For instance, the French league has three professional divisions: ligue 1, ligue 2, and national 1. All of them have a promotion and relegation system (and playing across all the country). Below these professional divisions, there are (pseudo-amateur or) amateur divisions: national 2, regional 1, regional 2, division d’honneur, etc. All of these amateur divisions are played locally inside their distinct geographic areas and overseas French regions. Regional 2, and division d’honneur does not allow direct promotion to the other divisions. The teams in these divisions stay at the amateur level and play locally (as the logistics to made overseas French teams travel for playing every weeks against other French teams will be too costly).
In parallel there is the French national cup tournament. In this cup, the amateur teams start to play between each other in their respective division. The resulting winners travel and play against the professional teams (they travel one at four times if they made it too the final).
NISA and USL should merge in my opinion because they both want an open system and plus NISA would benefit from the financial help.
My team is one knox in league 1. Been going to games since their inception. But even regular sports fans/ casual soccer fans all think pro-rel would be amazing. Some are confused that it doesn't exist.
Don't like the "coming soon" in the thumbnail as it feels like bait. In my opinion pro/rel is indeed a possibility but won't happen for 5-10 years. They need heavy investment into stadiums to meet D1 standards. And they need a lot more teams across the board, but specifically in Championship, to break off a division to have in between Championship and League 1, so they can have a D1-D3 system. Because pro/rel from D2 below between two leagues isn't too attractive especially for casual fans. It's going to take a long time and a lot of work, but it's possible.
Im a Louisville City fan and I love the USL but wish it got more recognition. The CBS deal was great exposure but I still think there needs to be better promotion to the general public about the league. I’m for promotion/relegation and hope in the future it is a thing but the way MLS clubs shell out big money to become a franchise makes me weary it will ever happen
Right now a theoretical "relegation" from MLS to USL would be a loss in franchise value in excess of ninety percent. That gap must close to make pro/rel feasible, and at the moment it just isn't happening. You put that kind of risk into the investment, say goodbye to your big expansion fees and fancy new soccer stadiums.
MSL sucks Louisville better not join MLS USL is planning to take over the US soccer seen it won't be long before a mls joins USl,lf Indy 11 joins MLS it will be destroying its franchise
I would love to see it. If MLS wants to expand they could look to the top USL teams, maybe some agreement can be made there. The logistics of travel has got to be the biggest burden by far.
through watching this video I was able to find out that I have a USL 2 team that plays in the fields across from where I coach. I will be supporting them this year even though their youth teams are rivals...
I didn't even realize that Las Vegas Lights FC existed until your last video. Now I want to go check out a match.
I"m a huge San Antonio FC fan and big fan of USL Championship and support the local team. Always concerned with MLS muscling into USL markets such what happened to San Diego and also what appears to be happening in Indianapolis. I think Pro/Rel would be a game changer!
The USL tried this before. Its not so easy, you don't just win the league and move up there is so much more involved. 1. every club needs to play on a pitch with lighting, 2. you need locker rooms; 3. the size of pitch; 4. to be competitive you need to pay your players more 5. the league fees goes up 6. the seating capacity has to meet a minimum size 7. the traveling cost can increase; 8. your front office staff needs to increase 9. your media and commercial footprint increases 10. the number and size of your sponsorship needs to increase to help cover your expenses; and there are more. For this reason most clubs put together a business plan and sign onto the league and division they do because of the costs, and the wealth of the ownership group involved with the club. The last time the USL tried something like pro/rel (this was back.... if I remember right in the mid 90s I think maybe only 2 clubs participated and moved up no one moved down, and then the league dropped the idea.
16 teams E&W = 30 games per Conference, the 8 or 4 extra games should be ranked games, top 4 East play top 4 West from last season results.
Multi-tiered professional football leagues are not a nice to have, it’s a MUST HAVE for Promotion & Relegation to catch up to the European Leagues.
My USL Championship club is RGV Toros. We completely dissolved in 2024 after around 8 years of existence. We had a fairly solid team too. Many, and I mean MANY USL teams, cannot financially support ourselves. Our stadium was usually 20% full most games. Right now, promotion is a very bad idea. Maybe in the distant future tho.
That's always been common with American soccer teams. Even former mls teams have folded in the past due to financial reasons. For a team to be successful there has to be a strong market to cater to. Without that how can a team survive unless they relocate to a market that is willing to support a soccer team
@@sergiorodriguez956 A lot of the problem is attendance competition from other leagues too. Most large cities have an NBA, MLB, and an NFL team. How many games overlap and how many people are willing to forgo attending another sport to see a soccer game. This doesn't even include college sports that are essentially D2 leagues. I think everything will have to wait on the 2026 World Cup... and that the USMNT will have to perform well in it to inspire the older generations to attend games.
I agree for USL to implement the pro/rel system, as it gives more recognition for the teams. Plus, three of the USL Leagues are not far off each other in league attendance, financial, and supporters profile. So, for USL is no problem in the future if they implement pro/rel.
time to support USL, boys! LFG!
If USL can SUCCESSFULLY implement a form of pro/rel and unite the other smaller leagues into it as well, then it will really force MLS’s hand.
When USL implements pro-rel and leapfrogs the MLS in prominence, it shouldn't even entertain the MLS. If some MLS clubs want to pay the fee to join to the ULS from the bottom-up then that should be open, of course.
If USL adopts pro/rel I become a season ticket holder of my local club Forward Madison. That is my promise.
Forward Madison is two and a half hours from me does that count as local club?!? Lol
I am about 2 hours away from two League Two teams Lexington and West Virginia. I may go check them out this summer. Cincinatti FC is fours from my house, but tickets are outrageous.
I am a North Carolina native who has lived in Lexington Kentucky for the last three years. I have a child playing in the LSC youth league but I also watch out for NCFC. I'm a fan of both.
Doing it "right", just means pulling enough fans away from MLS to USL to make it matter and to bring MLS to the table.
That would never happen. This is some weird USL cope.
@@AKPhillythere are many (like me) who would choose USL over MLS if they adopted pro/rel. But are there enough MLS fans like me? I don't know. I don't think USL believes there are at the moment
@@khalilshahyd9063 MLS has a lock on the biggest markets. Nothing USL does will be able to compete with MLS.
@@AKPhillythat's the point of this discussion. USL needs something that can be a breakthrough for them. They are hoping pro/rel could be it, but will it? Are there enough people like me who are digusted by MLS ready to jump ship? We dont know.
@@khalilshahyd9063 pro/real is irrelevant in terms of competing with MLS.
Here up in Maine I never thought would would have a team, but yet the name is being revealed tomorrow on the 27th for a league one team! Love the growth and great to see!
If USL adopts Pro/Rel I'll become a season-ticket holder at Orange County SC.
You want a pat on the back, Pete? What’s the need to announce that other than trying to get likes lol
"If" ... wow.
@@davidday2373 lmaoo, right? Pete really doing his best to virtue signal looks pretty lame if you unpack that statement.
“If I get my way, then I’ll like you.”
Nothing is stopping you from doing so right now!
@@Phogadacbiet Conditional passion, I guess.
Thanks for telling your following about the USL we appreciate the love
The *regional* league thing is a thing - in Germany…
[it's one part of] _"the hierarchically interconnected league system for association football in Germany that in the 2016-17 season consisted of 2,235 leagues in up to 13 levels having 31,645 teams, in which all divisions are bound together by the principle of promotion and relegation."_
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_football_league_system
Phoenix Rising. Great atmosphere just a little hot in the summer.
Colorado Springs Switchbacks season ticket holder. Great intimate stadium. Exciting action with players who want to play soccer professionally. Love the USL.
My community, the Antelope Valley in Southern California, will be getting a USL team next season in 2025!
AV Alta FC! USL League One!
It’s interesting I came across this video because I was at the Crest and team name reveal yesterday evening where the team founder and president mentioned to the crowd that the team will have the opportunity to get promoted into the USL Championship. So he made it appear that promotion/relegation will in fact happen.
I grew up going to Richmond kickers games and got to see the undefeated season that resulted in Kahos winning that season. LA galaxy has been my mls team since I was choosing teams
If the US does do Relegation it can’t be the European model. There is a reason why when UK football was going to relegation the US was creating minor league systems for baseball. Probably one of the warnings for relegation is Luton. First off Luton is probably he feel good sports story of the decade. They’ve already done what Wrexham is trying to do while spending a lot less money to do it. On the other hand this year they were clearly overmatched and were not ready at all for the Premier league. Not just financially, but in facilities as well since it’s taking forever to get a bigger stadium. More to the point teams run themselves into serious debt trying to get promoted out of the championship league. It’s not just UK football, this is happening all over Europe. So if the USL and MLS do somehow figure out how to do this they need to figure out a system that doesn’t cause teams to go into bankruptcy trying to move up.
Great interview. Maybe I missed it but was there any talk about how deep pro/rel would go? Obviously keep it in USL and get it right but eventually it would be great to bring smaller leagues into it.
Nice Ralph's Mob shirt. Come On You Rowdies! 💚💛
Love the shirt! I used to be a season ticket holder before I moved away, COYR💛💚
Bravo. Just watched both parts. Great interview.
Rhode Island FC season ticket holder from day 1!!! Anchors Up
I'm not convinced it'll take in America in a major way, here in England, clubs are big parts of certain communities (it is a ride or die mentality) ironically a club near me (Port Vale, I live in South Cheshire Vale Park is about a 30 minute drive from me) got relegated to League Two last week, and another club near me (Crewe Alexandra are about 25-30 mins away too) could qualify for the League Two promotion playoffs, im not a fan of either (my club is Arsenal, its my family's team) but I do go to some games at Vale and Crewe (also Stoke City, but that's the far side of the city) the crowds aren't overly big at Vale or Crewe (about 4000-5000 fans), it's a nice theory for the US, but it's not a part of your guys culture, so I'm not sure if the interest would be there if you suddenly switched to pro/rel, I think if the MLS keeps expanding they might toy with an MLS Premier and MLS 2 eventually, im just not sure Americans will take to pro/rel, like I said its just been part of our culture forever, you guys have never had that in any of your leagues
You make a fair point, with respect to American sporting culture. Promotion and relegation is indeed a foreign concept to us. Furthermore, the traditional pro/rel format does have serious problems which its advocates, both in Europe and the US, tend to ignore.
I believe that the American pyramid needs reform. MLS is far too large - 30 teams... No way. And there are too many different leagues occupying more or less the same space in the lower divisions.
Our target ought to be four fully professional leagues, each with 18-22 clubs. The good news is, the clubs already exist.
Next, promotion and relegation ought to be conditional.
First, a promoted club ought to have facilities adequate to the next higher league. That is a reasonable stipulation which already exists in England.
Second condition: a four team, two legged playoff between the bottom finishers of the higher league and the top finishers of the higher league. Any promoted club ought to show it can take points, score and defend against the worst clubs of the next highest league. Otherwise, what hope have they got to compete with anyone else at the next level? Conversely, any club which cannot take points from an inferior side with a smaller payroll has earned relegation. In fact, they've earned it twice - first, by being sh1t all year, second by losing to a club from a lower league.
A pro/rel playoff would be exciting and compelling. It would lend drama to lower divisions with less exposure, and a chance at redemption to clubs which have suffered a disappointing season. It would minimize the promotion yoyo effect we see in Europe.
I have been a fan of the world game since the mid 1970s. I have been a Celtic fan since the 1980s (yes, yes... Champions of a farmer's league). I desperately want to see my country embrace the Beautiful Game. I also want us to influence it positively by implementing the best parts of European and Latin American footballing culture whilst retaining the genius of Yankee ingenuity in the marketing of sports and entertainment.
@kentgrady9226 your right there are plenty of scenarios that could be used like the bottom team automatically goes and the 2nd bottom club has a pro/rel playoff with the runner up from the lower division (the top team is automatically promoted) like you said if you can't beat the lower league team you deserve to go down, I said to a few Vale fans the other week they deserve to go down, they played Exeter the other week were 2-0 up at half time and bottled it losing 2-4 in the end, to me the only problem I see is the culture thing with American sports, and will the support hold enough for the relegated clubs to stay in business, the MLS kind of works because its a massive country, and the East/West thing breaks things up a bit, with an MLS 2 there'll need to be a East/West dynamic again, like the best team from the East gets promoted to MLS 1 East and the best in the West goes to MLS 1 West and there's a playoff between the East runner up and the 2nd bottom Eastern team and the same with the West, I think it might happen some day with the MLS but not right now
Be careful what you ask for. Are League 1 teams financially able to compete in the Championship? If so, fine, but you may end up with League 1 teams electing not to take promotion, or teams self-relegating because they don't have the $$$ to compete at the USL Championship level. Would the Rowdies or Louisville City be able to maintain the same support playing Tormenta or Forward Madison if they were to be relegated? Just food for thought. I'm not against it, just not convinced it will work this late in the game.
Much rather watch and support USL teams than mls. Our original team is Little Rock rangers. Moved to Jacksonville Florida three years ago. Have been to a rowdies game, it was dope.
I live in Atlanta and ofc we have Atlanta United but if it came down to it I’d support a USL team in ATL 100% of AtlUtd if USL gets pro/rel. The deliberate financial restrictions and points rules in MLS frustrate me to no end.
That makes no sense. You have Atlanta United, be glad and enjoy. Do you support Georgia Bulldogs or G Tech?, the Hawks?, the Braves?, the Falcons? Or are you just a Soccer guy?
Richmond Kickers
USL needs to partner with UPSL. UPSL has done what everyone wanted and organized the entire nations best sunday leagues into a proper conference across the nation. USL simply needs to absorb that into USL 2 since the better USPL premier teams can compete there. There are even UPSL premier teams that can go toe to toe with USL 1 or USL championship as seen at times by Foro (Dallas), el Farolito, Chicago Nation, etc.
He mentioned this “keep everyone happy mentality” and thats whats killing the game. Its not all about being happy… compete.
The "Pro/Rel" process is not a "necessary" component of a league in the US. Most pro teams go through boom & bust cycles any way, in which if they aren't successful, they fire the coach & GM, and start over. That amounts to the same thing as what happens in pro/rel situations. If you insititute pro/rel, you destroy an owner's ability to have his initial investment preseved which will discourage other smaller equity investors from contributing to a team. This will drive down balance sheets and a team's ability to buy more players, build nicer facilities, etc.... You will end u with just a few teams that are owned by very wealthy owner's which are likely from major cities as opposed to smaller, mid-size cities. The "Pro-Rel" process sounds cool when looked at from afar, but it is really a shit show. One example - When a team drops down, how many of that teams true star player's actually stay with the team & fight for promotion the following year?? Almost ZERO. Once in awhile a some stay, but the majority leave. I rest my case. I like Greg Lalas; seems like a solid dude, but not every aspect of Euro football is the "right way" to operate.
Will US investors/owners buy into the relegation idea? Americans are all about profit first. If a team is relegated, will this hurt investment? I am all in, but doubtful it will work here. It would be interesting to see the process.
Great 2 part video! Recently attended a Rhode Island FC match, and honestly found it fun and exciting . I used to be a season ticket holder to the NE Revolution, but that was some time ago, and I find the vibe with USL a bit more authentic than MLS now, and I'm not knocking MLS, but I feel more drawn to USL rather than MLS. Thanks for the video.
Phoenix Rising is my USL team. Was beginning to be a fan when they used to be Arizona United. But out of nowhere Drogba came by and me also being a Chelsea fan I was on board. Still am. Frustrating season so far but this team needs to be better. Doesn't look good so far but they better pick up the pace.
Adding pro/rel won’t significantly boost USL, the main thing I hear from people is the quality of the games.
FC Cincinnati is a great example. They had a small but loyal fan base then joined MLS, fan base grew a little, then got better players and were fun to watch and support.
Maintaining stability so teams can build revenue and afford quality players has increased the popularity of soccer in these markets. Cincy is one of the best examples
I’m a Tampa Bay Rowdies fan and sour grapes hater of MLS… but only because my city had a franchise and had it taken away by the league.
I definitely long for pro/rel because Garber has proved there is no way he will ever let Tampa Bay back into the league.
If pr/rel is established in USL, I hope that will apply pressure to FIFA etc to either force MLS to adopt pro/rel or allow USA to have two premier leagues… allowing USL to outcompete MLS. Ideally, entry to MLS should be based on spending on YOUR team and YOUR facilities… not finding an oligarch level owner who will pony up an exorbitant MLS franchise fee. Screw bribing all the existing mls owners with franchise fees to gain entry into the owners “club”.
I’d love if MLS will, out of the goodness of their oligarch hearts, allow pro/rel to permit hungrier cities to gain entry to the league… but I don’t see that happening.
@TacticalManager
I wanted to revisit this topic. What are your thoughts on what is happening between the City of Indianapolis trying to stop the Indy Eleven from building Eleven Park to hopefully attract an MLS expansion?
Overall great show and insights. Football in the USA lacks culture and d competitiveness. Give the game to the people and watch it flourish naturally. These millionaires only care about their bottom line. Not the community, not the players development, and definite no love for the game. Retirement league, the MLS. Even the “best” young American players go over seas when they can. I hope USL can figure it out. Would to see it shine. The game is free. Let it live..
Shout out to Flint City Bucks in USL2! Really great club
I remain unconvinced this is a good idea for the American sporting system. Why doesn’t the NFL, NBA, NHL, or MLB use pro/rel? I just need convincing.
The talent pools available are smaller for those sports so you can funnel talent to the NFL or NBA easier. For as big as these sports are in the US they are nonexistent in other parts of the world. In essence you control the talent pipelines you control how the league is run.
Hey, I'm a Tampa Bay Rowdies fan 💚💛💚💛⚽️💪🏻💪🏻👍🏻👍🏻👏🏻👏🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻 I Love that the league wants to do an open system of Pro/Rel
If Pro/Rel is instituted, everyone needs to support their local USL clubs. This has the potential to transform the sport here
I’m afraid that won’t happen. You’ll see the same people who will only support their local club under conditions come up with new terms. “I’ll only support Orange County if they spend big money on players”
@@TMAC803210Those type of fans will just stick to watching the big clubs of Europe.
I think we need to grow the culture and the identity of local clubs to give fans a reason to care about them other then "be the best".
Why would I do that when my city has an MLS team
thank u for this type of discussions
I don't love soccer but this was a very interesting video
In the USA there is a problem of scale.
The promotion/relegation should start at the state level with 2 or 3 leagues.
The 1 or 2 best teams from each state (We can adjust according to the level of the teams in each state with an elo ranking or in number of teams, some with 1 team and others with 3) would have access to national leagues USL and prom/rel with the MSL.
Organize a meet and greet go to rowdies !
Yes to pro/reg. Charleston Battery!
I live in Spokane, we just got a USL one team. I can firmly say that the soccer IQ in this market is low. They don’t know and or care about pro/rel, we are just happy to have another sporting event to go to. I am a season ticket holder for both Spokane and Seattle clubs and I honestly do not care about pro/rel. I don’t think it will improve either leagues and I do think it is going to get people interested in caring about soccer in the US if they watch European soccer. Those fans are not going to convert because the quality is poor in their opinion. We honestly don’t need pro rel in the US
Awesome to hear you have the Velocity to support! When MLS eventually returns to USOC, seeing Spokane face off against Seattle or Portland will be so cool.
So is ULS2 also included in the potential pro/rel?
It doesn’t seem like it’s been determined but most likely it’s the goal.
@@TacticalManager hopefully it is. Hell, if not they just need to rebrand and make a new USL2.
Doing it right is more important than doing it big. Hype is fine but it needs to be anchored in solid ground. Solidarity before the dollar.
Edit: Just like having better teams in the Prem makes the rest of us better, having a competitive league in the US is only going to improve the standard of world football. I hope they pull it off.
Dunno, boys. As a Brazilian, I love our pyramid. It is something very particular to the history of the game here, and it needs some adjustments, but works well (especially when considering Brazil is a continental-size country).
Maybe the JLeague system would work better in the US. A league with clubs across all the country, big and small, united under a code of requirements, organizing the league and selling transmission rights together.
Where are my Richmond Kickers Red Army comrades?
Knox one will one day when concacaf champioins 🏆
Video idea: how a well funded Amtrak and local public transport system and better regulated freight rail will save nationwide pro/rel soccer
i hope we get pro/rel
I used to be a big MLS fan. I went to games, watched it on TV etc but it just didn't feel right. It was missing pro/rel. Eventually, I stopped watching. If USL brings pro/rel, I will get invested again. Until that day, I'm not interested In US soccer. The teams feel soulless because you can't really say that it's the best team around. The team was placed there and given money. It never grew organically.
You still got to have East and Western Conferences, can’t be the same as Europe.
I don't understand the American fixation with pro/rel. In almost feels like we have a complex because we aren't a top contender in the sport. And by adopting the European model it will be a "fix all" that will make us compete with the rest of the world in football. Personally, I think youth development and strict spending/salary cap are much bigger issues currently.
I don’t care about being a top league, I just want tables based on merit and not money
Or maybe we want compelling soccer that isn’t entirely centered around ROI and corporate branding.
@@asapaul7671 Tables based on merit over money... Isn't that a bit of a contradiction? It's the European leagues that have the same few super clubs at the top of the tables year after year, due to how much money they have to spend. I'm not necessarily anti pro/rel. As I said in my original post, I just don't see it as a fix all for us soccer.
@@asapaul7671fuck are you even talking about? Money is the only thing that determines European leagues.
Smart move, otherwise, there is no excitement at the end of the season. What’s the point of trying and give you never get promoted or relegated?
Just call USL top league "First Division" and the next one down "Second Division" and let MLS deal with it and do whatever they're gonna do. Don't call USL "Second Division" if you have true promotion-relegation.
If USL implemented Pro-Rel it would quickly become the top league leapfrogging the MLS.
The way the guest describes potential problems with travel or with geographic imbalance is incorrect. The way you handle that is by having two permanent Conferences. East and West should be treated like their own parallel league structures, each with their own regional divisions the lower you go down the pyramid. Two clubs from each of the top-flight Conferences should be promoted or relegated each season.
The third-tier USL League 2 could be replaced by USL League East and USL League West, each with their own two Conferences.
Pro rel should be implemented…
I always thought the three time zone rule is stupid. There needs to be a professional santioned league by US Soccer. Let the other smaller leagues grow. There has to be some clubs looking to bigger. A path forward. That is a critical part.
Two VITAL items NOT addressed in this and in Part 1: (i) the current NASL lawsuit against the MLS and USSF. The outcome of this trial --to be decided this Fall by a jury-- will be a seismic shift could drastically determine what the USSF can do moving forward (e.g. NO MORE Division 1 vs 2 vs 3, or mandating MLS participation in the US Open Cup). (ii) the importance of Soccer-specific Stadiums (SSS) controlled by each club, to ensure financial stability and scheduling, and as a moat against MLS incursions.....
I’ve found that there are no better, more intense fans than those clubs fighting for promotion or against relegation! Bring it, USL!
MLS is trying to drive my city’s USL team out now 🙂 it’ll always be f*ck the MLS for me
This (unfortunately) will NEVER happen. While I would LOVE pro-rel here in the US, there is literally ZERO chance that MLS owners would allow their protected cash cows be in jeopardy to please soccer fans. They currently have the goose that lays the golden eggs and they do not want to share with teams on the lower tiers and have no incentive to do so. US sports fans are accustomed to single league systems and MLS won't willingly give up their monopoly unless they had a very good reason to do so and fan sentiment and lower league owners wanting a bigger (fairer) share of the pie isn't even close to being enough. It's all about the money and power. MLS owners have it and they're not interested in sharing. While I support my local MLS club, I prefer European football due to this very reason.
This is pro/rel within USL itself, not between USL and MLS
@@datboi5325 OH! Thanks for clarifying. Yeah, that would be cool. I still think USL/MLS pro-rel would be great, but it will never happen.
If it happens.... best thing to happen to US soccer ever!!!
MLS had a balanced schedule when it was at 18 teams in 2011 and 2012
I believe tactical manager is correct, if my local usl team got relegated, I honestly don't think fans will stop supporting. team before league, who cares about the league, I think fans go for the entertainment. go for it usl, it pro/relegated will revolutionize pro soccer in usa
One Knoxville
Love USA dont get me wrong, but I hate our sports leagues. We reward mediocrity. Also, no one wants to watch a game between two teams who are in the bottom of the table. This type of change would ensure viewership stays strong throughout the whole season. And we can still keep our playoff system, I dont hate that, it's just the regular season that suffers from the bad teams just being able to say 'eh, we'll get em next year, just finish this season.'
Nothing will change the fact that no one wants to watch teams at the bottom of the table... relegation or not.
That's a retarded take. The vast majority of European leagues are pointless with the same team winning every year or only 3 teams having a shot at all. US sports leagues are superior.
All pro sports leagues in the USA are non pro rel. Don't pick on MLS.
A political answer masterclass
If promotion and relegation are introduced, I'll get season tickets for Milwaukee Pro Soccer, a team that doesn't even exist yet.
Will this league be available in football manager? 🤔🧐
A well developed soccer pyramid can reach all levels and tastes. But it ultimately, we need promotion and relegation. There needs to be a path to reach the highest level.
We need local clubs that bring the community together behind something that could have an impact in many areas.
Growing up in Brazil I had my favorite club from the place I was born (Botafogo) but since my family moved from Rio to Uberaba in MG, I had no chance to watch them at the stadium, so I adopted a smaller local team (Uberaba Sport) that I could watch on a regular basis. Even thought the club was smaller, they had a path they could follow to move all the way up to the first division. They played in the fourth division a few times, but for the most part, I followed them on the state league.
As far as size comparisons, Brazil is actually bigger than the continental US, however, the US has something that Brazil does not have: a decent transportation system than can connect even the smaller towns by plane fairly easily.
They need to stop thinking about national television as a reason to grow a league. We live in the age of streaming, the absolute vast majority of the younger fans do not watch over the air tv, they stream everything, you MUST capitalize on that.
I mean, it is a challenge to implement a pro/rel in this country, American business people don't enjoy meritocracy, they like to have guaranteed incomes.
With a pro/rel system I would be interested in following American soccer, even if my region (Boise) doesn't have a local club. I would support a team in Spokane or something like that. As far as MLS goes, thanks, but not thanks. I can't watch it, it is just silly to watch soccer that does not punish mediocre teams.
WE NEED PRO/REL THROUGH ALL THE LEAGUES
Promotion / Relegation is a must specially in football.