Sorry to hear about the issues. Grand Design might have responded correctly in your case, but we cannot give them a pass on the very poor engineering of these rigs. I have no idea why they still build junk after DECADES of making these things. One engineer said "Well.. it's like going through an earthquake every time it goes down the road". My response was - If I was building a house on a fault line; I would be smart enough to be build my house strong enough to be on a fault line. The engineer had no response...
We can devise the development of the Space shuttle, The roads in Greece that have withstood the time but we can't make a suspension or roads today to stand to the use its being made to do?
This is so true. Our house in Alaska came through the 2019 7.2 earthquake unscathed...because it was built for it's environment. I have a 2023 390RK that has had structural issues since the very day we took delivery and spent over 50 days at GD.
I think it’s tough to strike a balance. If they could build these to withstand an earthquake, they would be unaffordable. It’s always a balance between weight, cost, and affordability. GD is not to bad compared to all the brands out there in my opinion. Certainly not the best, certainly not the worst. Quality control could certainly be better even given the materials they do use though. I’ve owned a GD Reflection, and then down sized to a Imagine XLS, and the quality of the latter was fairly disappointing.
@@Hawk89gtyes, I was thinking that the engineers are struggling to design a frame with strength to weight ratio, and a large floor plan, and still be towable by an F150 V8 or equivalent. Now pickup truck manufacturers are going to V6 turbo charged, and this is going to be an issue? Another TH-camr says he talked to a tech, and this guy said there are 7 out of ten (?) trailers with failing welds, and eventually these failures zipper throughout.
Sold a class A. When I jump back in, it will be very small and simple and with as few moving parts as possible. This constant maintenance takes the fun out of life.
Build out old moving vans semi trailers, I've broken down several toy haulers and fifth wheels back in the day, now own an ex Mayflower moving van zero leaks and Zero frame suspension issues at a fraction of the cost
Thank you very much for sharing your POS with us so we know what not RV to buy ever. And no grand design does not stand behind any of this. Specially, if you say the words frame flex. Grand design will be the last RV I would ever look at to think about buying, good luck everyone😮😢
When I see chip board in construction I get a bad feeling all over. Having been in the construction business for 35 years I think that stuff should be outlawed. But good luck with you fifth week enjoy your travels.
They should be using marine plywood for the roofs and inside these campers That OSB and compression board cant handle the damp But its all about building cheap cookie cutter campers now and making tons of money
It's good that Grand Design took care of your sagging front end problem so quickly and sent a tech to your camp spot. I think they are trying to manage this defect in their frames as you aren't the only one who has made a video about this defect which resulted in weld failures. I'm amazed how upbeat you are dealing with this issue. I'd be pissed. Also, stupid how they ran the sewer hose so close to your suspension links so they aren't serviceable or greasable.
I’ve seen other videos as well with this issue. Most manufacturers use the same frames and I know they recently made changes to that design so hoping the newer models don’t have the same problems.
@1StrangeAdventure sadly I've seen 20 or 25 different you tubers with the issue that's prob and miniscule number to reality .... I'd say it's every widebody built on that frame is in danger or folding 😮
Took a break from working on my Neighbor's 1999 Fleetwood Storm motorhome and I feel like travel trailers and fifth wheels are 'supposed' to be simpler because they don't have an engine but manufacture's of mega fifth-wheels added so much weight and complexity they have managed to make them less reliable. Shouldn't need to replace suspension components in an almost new unit. The main issues I'm dealing with are rust and corrosion from non-existent maintenance and the only damage in the suspension is melted bushings on the rear stabilizer due to age and that is an easy swap out.
Once that frame flexes. The whole camper just falls to pieces . Worse than termites... But you will end up with termites eventually... My advice is come to California and I'll buy you a drink
Yup, I am also starting to notice some issues with screws coming up through the floor in the master bedroom of my 2022 Momentum. I feel QC is getting out of control with all these manufacturers of RVs. Yet prices for these big RVs keep going up and on the other hand quality keeps going down. This has to stop
Not sure how old you are, but back in the day it was known as “ trailer quality”. The fact that “a fool and their money soon parts way” is at play in many of these cases. Sounds harsh, but the proof is in all these failures. The people hired in the trailer factories are not the cream of the crop.
My best friend has been an rv tech for 30 years. He's worked for big manufacturers and dealers and now runs his own rv service center.. the best advice he ever gave me was to only buy Northwoods products, specifically because their frames are 2nd to none, sure you're not going to get a huge rv with a garage etc but the artic fox campers are built to the highest standards, and you won't find a single one with a broken frame, I've owned mine for 8 years now, and I've had zero issues, zero.. everything has worked as it should..
I'm not a structural engineer but these massively large RVs take a tremendous beating down the road. I'm guessing at some point the compromise between size, features, strength and weight become more and more problematic.
While at the GD Rally, I had Performance Trailer repack my bearings and they found a cracked wet bolt. I had them replace all of them and they put them all in with the grease fitting facing outward so that greasing would be easier. I guess that means you can put them either way. I also notified GD of the broken wet bolt and there is an investigation underway due to the fact that they should not break.
@@bfqywqd inferior materials and welding practices. In one case it was actual material that had sheered not the welds. The material wall thickness was half of what it needed to be. I replaced the 2x6 tubing with 3/16" wall thickness and has not moved or cracked again for years now with many trips from Maine to FL. to TN and everywhere in between. It is a Lippert design and failure. They are building chassis with high carbon recycled steel not adequate for a trailer. If you ground or welded on the Lippert steel and you are an experienced fabricator you would know the difference immediately.
Interesting to watch another video of Grand Design frame flex issues. A channel I just watched quoted a Grand Design person stating that probably 70% of those frames are defective. Be careful because one channel the Grand Design techs did not disconnect batteries before welding on the frame and fried thousands of dollars worth of electronics including 6 Battle Borne batteries.
I have a 2017 Heartland Road Warrior 44ft triple axle Toyhauler. I also have the CRE 3000 equalizers but no wetbolts....so I replaced all the bolts and shackles withe the MorRyde wetbolt upgrade kit. I also was able to install the MorRyde X-Factor Crossmember on the rear most axle. I too could not install an additional crossmeber due to my sewer drain pipe clearance on the center axle. Good luck with your frame flex issues. Hope you enjoyed your visit to my hometown of Pensacola!
Just remove the zerk fitting then you can hit the wetbolt with a mallet (not hammer) and pop the zerk back in. Easy Also buy a large battery powered impact gun so you can remove tires easy. No more breaker bar.
I remember the RVing days I had diesel Pushers and there was always something to fix. I sold my last one in the summer of 2022 and for a profit after owning it for three years. The Coach I had before this one got totaled out in the mountains of Tennessee fortunately we weren’t injured but the truck that caused the accident did not stop. I n 2016 I made the mistake of purchasing a brand new Thor Tuscany 45 footer which was nothing but one issue after another so after a year I sold it. Our first pusher was a 2011 Itasca Meridian 40 U a nice Coach but the negative was how the toilet area was so cramped. We had many fun times traveling the US and Canada and now we have moved to another stage of our lives we do the Airbnb’s. We do a lot of Cruises so this works for us now but the best part of RVing was the awesome people we met on our travels and the beautiful places we visited.
Thanks for the video, good effort on your part. Sorry for the issues you are having. 😢 Living in a 5th wheels in an RV park or on off-grid land seems appealing, but traveling in one on a regular basis seems exhausting.
Excellent point. I am a retired OTR commercial driver and being on the move constantly is a full time job. Also, road vibration destroys modern RV frames, walls and suspensions. I currently live full time in a 2014 Keystone Sprinter wide body 299RET in a senior mobile home park (mostly single wide mobiles homes and 10% RVs). My trailer has held up great, it's been stationary practically since new. I'm looking to buy a late model 2020 or newer Riverstone Legacy 39RKFB. It too will be a stationary full time primary residence.
The issues all occur with Lippert built frames that most of the mainstream manufacturers utilize! Stay clear from these manufacturers frames as they are all junk. Rather choose manufacturers who utilize Dexter frames and you will never have an issue. So sorry that you are just one of many people who are going through this issue.
So many RV 's are under engineered now. The quality of the big three manufacturers has degraded to the point where I don't think I would buy any of their designs right now. Hearing major issues about Grand Design, which in the past were good quality. Good luck hope you get your unit fixed correctly at the manufacturer.
Spot on. Quality builds in anything went out the widow decades ago. I see the appeal of wanting to travel but these RVs are not even close to being made for full time living. My wife and both been working from home for about 12 years now and she ask me if I ever wanted to RV travel full time….I told her she was out of her mind. I work to hard not to live in a single wide trailer..Lol. But I love to weekend travel in my GD as well. Best of luck to you and yours. Great memories for sure.
I remember all the way back to the 90’s that RV’s that had triple axels were prone to breaking springs/ shackles. This was due to the stress in turning… sorry to see you having such issues.
Neighbour has one. They started having problems with suspension and frame. The dealer (it was new) blew them off. Lawyer got involved. Dealer took it for months. My neighbor had signs made calling the dealer terrible names because they took so long. So all I know is they are still towing it. And you’re right. 23 years ago a major Class A manufacturer (now gone after 40 years) had broken axles and lawsuits.
I would not replace what aint broke. You are just as apt to have your new part break as you are to have your old part break. Folks, I really feel for you. I live ini Fl. I know how awful it is to do that work in terrible heat. Rvs are really made to break over and over again. Sorry. Guys. My first time watching you, good video. Charley from Ocala. fl.
Harold & Cindy, I have some info you might like to here. We have a 2021 397th. 6 months ago we went through the broken wet bolt, hanger replacement problem. During the repair the mechanic advised checking our center axle spring when you get home. It was looking pretty flat with weight on it so I removed it and took it to a local spring shop. They said the spring was only rated for 3200 lbs. How that is determined is the thickness of the individual leafs. I haven’t contacted Dexter or GD yet. Good luck with your rig.
Great attitude in dealing with adversity! Really enjoyed the detail you covered. I too always carry enough tools to handle at least the simple things (not an angle grinder and mig setup though!). Must have been just horrible in that heat - at least you didn't have a hurricane! Well done and thanks for sharing.
Thank you! It’s been trying times but we have two choices: 1. Get mad and be unproductive or 2. Take it as a learning experience ☺️ we appreciate the support.
We had same problems last year, but it bust the cabinets around bed, tore wall in bed room, they came and fix it good enough to take back to factory, fix it all up and bought it back,
Because everyone thinks they want a lighter and lighter trailer to tow with an inadequate tow vehicle (think-"half-ton towable"). It's not wise IMHO to go too far that direction for engineering of weight reduction.
Harold, you are so modest when it comes to rig fixing or DIY projects. You're a great RV tech. Get yourself a harbor freight air lift jack. Doug Benjamin showed me his in Tennessee. Got one as soon as we got back. Hooks to your compressor and goes up with the push of a button. Can't wait to see you guys in Georgia. 1 week to go.
Glad we saw this coming on many Grand Design 5vers and didnt go for the influencers on utube. Sorry you got stuck… We actually have been making our own wet bolts here in the our shop. We cut the right side hangers off our good friends grand design to laser align wheels than welded and plated them. They were off by over a 1/4 inch 😬 Put a nut on the bolt before you hammer on it. Man so sorry to see
For how much these rigs cost and to have these major frame issues is just so disappointing. Our 22 Grand Design Solitude is in the shop right now having water leaks fixed along with wood replacement from the water leaks.
So glad GD has been responsive for you, unfortunately that is not the norm with them from what we have seen posted online. They took over a year to finally resolve the issues we had from DAY ONE when we bought our Imagine.
They never had the heat set high enough when doing those welds so there wasn't enough penetration Which was easy to spot as the welds look like bubble gum stuck to the steel instead of a lapped ribbon I recon there are broken and weak welds over most the frame and a lot of other frames too I recon Lipperd may have as lot of warranty work coming their way as they make frames for most the campers in Elkhart They must be hiring first day apprentice welders there for 5 bucks an hour to make those frames lol
Sorry to hear that you had these issues. This is the 2nd voice I have seen this week with the same issues, with the frame twisting and coming undone. I hope they got it fixed correctly for you. Safe travels.
Virrtually all RV frames come from Lippert, as designed by each manufacturer. A Lippert insider estimated that 7 of 10 5th wheel frames are going to fail. The other three are on campers that are permanently parked. The entire industry is selling junk - correction “selling shiny junk with pretty graphics”.
Lippert designs the frame to the manufacturer specifications. It’s high time Lippert tells them its not possible to build a frame strong enough and as light as they spec.
I have yet to see a mass market RV that is designed well and constructed well. They are nearly all weak by design and built as cheap as possible. The majority of the customer base prioritizes initial cost so the manufactures listened and deliver on the demand for cheap.
10 to 1 the reason your suspension gave up the ghost is because there is too much rv weight on them. lots of rv folks are having issues with front frames coming apart, one channel has said the frames were not meant to handle the weight they have on them. these are nothing but money pits.
I had a new 2019 Grand Design Reflection in 2018. It was the worst RV I’ve ever had. The list of defects and shoddy design was non stop. Honestly, the best thing you can do is get rid of it. It took me 3 years an i finally got rid of it. Good luck on your travels.
A couple of life/old man hacks...I had to put some angled grease fittings on my wet bolts so that I could grease them with the tires on. Also to use your tools that you have to your advantage, slide your 4 way lug wrench under your tire kinda cross-ways where you have a stem on each side of the tire, then lift up on one or the other stems which now gives you some leverage on lifting the tire making it easier to manage lining up the wheel and lug bolts.
You have a Great Attitude with the adversity. Grand Design has gone from hero to zero in my views. They were really desirable to us in ‘19 and ‘20. We never bought one, thank goodness. Went with a Super C instead. With all the problems I’ve seen on Grand Design units, I wouldn’t own one now!
Good job, quick question how is your ceramic coating holding up? and do you think it was worth the money? and how long has been sense you had it applied
I have the same crack on one of my equa-flex equalizer. My springs and equalizers didn’t line up when I attempted to replace the equalizer. I assumed the springs were bent. After taking everything off, the springs are straight, the hangers are straight, equalizers are bent. 🤔 It’s almost seem like the axels have shifted to one side. My current tires have 4k miles, no abnormal wear. Take a measurement of the space between your frame and the edge of your tires. Curious if all the same, mine are not. Please update on the findings by the manufacturer.
Licensed Vehicles intending to travel on public roads must be equipped with a Compliance Decal or Plate that identifies the vehicle and confirms that it was built in compliance with all Federal regulations in affect at the date of manufacture. Those Federal regulations are mainly focussed around the OEM manufacturer's rated capacities of the axles, suspension and tires/wheels. My suggestion would be to look at the vehicle tare weights and the number of tires carrying that weight. I saw a tandem axle unit with each axle rated at 7,000# under specific conditions, and single tires for a total of 4 tires to semi support a tare weight of what was reported to be approx. 14,000# + .At best the tires were 9" wide (235 mm) and more likely 8" width or less. Assuming a weight transfer of approx 30% up thru the king pin on to the tow vehicle fifth wheel and into the truck frame would leave about 10,000# travelling down the highway at posted speeds while being carried on 4 tires (2,500 # ea on level road). Compare that to a typical passenger car weighing 4,000 # supported by 4 similar tires at 1,000 to 1,200 # ea. This brings into focus the braking ability, which, even if not conducting a distance braking test at various speeds, on a flat surface, it can be calculated in conjunction with the tow vehicle axles and brakes which would be documented by OEM. Typically the installer of brakes (usually axles are ordered with brakes installed) assumes responsibility that they meet highway standards and can prove it if required, or different industry standards for other applications. Generally the more axles, the more brake surface and the better the braking. Listening to the videos with Lippert, it was made clear that they were hired solely as a component supplier. They stated that they build to their customer's specifications and often to customer supplied CAD drawings. In this instance they knew the identity of their customer (Grand Design) and knew the intended application. Their customer had refused Lippert's recommendations for optional materials and designs and had refused to purchase Lippert's Engineering services.The implication of those comments means that they also knew that what they were building was inadequate for the application. IMO it may be helpful to have their claims confirmed by sworn testimony in a Court. So while they may not be responsible for anything other than providing welding fabricating services and perhaps surface finishing of components, it appears by the nature of numerous confirmed reports of frame failures, over extended periods of time, that they have even done a poor job of that when quality is a consideration. And a company who choses to continue to build a major component when their own experience and experts are concerned that it may provide a less than satisfactory result simply because thir customer is not willing to pay for their best efforts is morally reprehensible in my view. Damage done to their company repiutation within that market may never be redeemed. In my limited experience, all new steel purchases are supplied containing some of the steel content being re-refined. Limitations can be outlined along with steel characterists and preferred steel suppliers can be specified at time of original design when conducted by qualified professional. That's what they do. Such information is generally a part of the design package forwarded to supplier (in this case, that's Lippert). That information affects costs for Lippert if they are to source the steel. An easy test of this would be to have a metalurgist testing done of material that is felt to be inadequate b/c it failed (broke) for content and characteristics. Then request Grand Design provide details of their design layout including steel specifications. Find out the original steel supplier. Where did the steel come from, does it meet those specifications? .Request of Lippert to provide details of the steel package provided by Grand Design (if they did). Or, as Lippert has stated, they only provided welder/fabrication labour and steel must have been provided by Grand Design .So, where did they get it and does the tested material comply? . This will resolve many of the uncertainties surrounding Lippert's role and confirm only that which they have contributed. It also correctly identifies the role of parties and confirms responsiblity at the appropriate place. Grand Design seems to have been positioned themselves to benefit from as many choices as possible with their products, good and bad. However, allowing this to continue will impact every RV manufacturer in North America and place a shadow over the RV industry as a whole. And that will definitely be on them.
I dont care if you spend $25,000.00 or over $200,000.00 on these new RV's, they are all made with the same components and made like crap. After 11 years of RVing we called it quits. Our last 5th Wheelers frame was sagging also. Luckily ( or really not luckily) our RV had a huge tree come right through the roof and destroy it while we were inside. Thank God we were not hurt but it gave us an out to go through the repairs which may have cost us a fortune or totaled it out from the frame sagging. After having encounters with falling trees 2 times prior ( which just missed us before) we are done with camping and moved on to something else.
Perfect reason why they should all come with independent suspension so there is less abuse on the chassis of the trailer. Seems like a no brainer to me
Wow, seeing what's under the veneer is truly depressing. The camera has a weird fish-eye sometimes, but if you look closely, you can see some racking of the frame when you where working in the rear. All of that light gauge metal and cheap "barn gusset" design is shocking on a piece of this size.
Doesn’t look like you have cross braces between the spring hangers. Without those, you must have massive flexing whenever you back up at an angle or turn sharply. Have you considered Morryde X Factor braces between all of your spring hangers?
Just push that bolt out until it hits the drain pipe. Then cut off as much as you can with a sawzall. Then push it out further and repeat until the bolt is all out.
We are new to RV and not going full time. Retired. I’ve watched five or more fifth wheel frame failures. And as many suspension failures. All were Grand designs. I know lipert builds them and my frame but build is to grand design specific. Even my brother had to put all new suspension under his 44ft toy hauler. Got me wondering.
RV manufactures ask for the cheapest price for frames built by someone else and agree the the frame design. Bean counters force engineering to build the cheapest and lightest frame as well as every other component of the RV. And consumers purchase based on price also. Weight and price keep quality low in RV's. Also less owners of a company, less money required for ownership and more better for better service and materials. Three RVs in my life Airstream, Cruiser and ATC. Best one....ATC and price accordingly, Expensive, Mid Range, Expensive....Done RVing, if started again, would buy ATC again. Second frame issue with Grand Design on You Tube.
I’m sure somebody has mentioned if there is a correlation with the trailers built during Covid. They were pretty much slapping them together just to get them to the dealer.?.
Sorry for suspension troubles but almost oversized rvs have these problems it’s really a shame these rv manufacturers don’t oversized these components on the build
Great production and work on your rig! Man, what a chore. Just curious, how many miles do you have on your rig and did you buy new (what year)? We just returned from a 13,000 mile road trip from FL to WA and back, and many places in between, over a more than 2 month period towing a used 2019 Flagstaff E-Pro 19BH which we purchased less than a year ago. We had ZERO major problems and just some really minor issues. If we had any where near the issues that you had, I would have probably sold our rig. Kudos to you for for sticking it out with humility!
just the fact that the rig is nothing but cheap steel and osb instead of plywood. makes me glad I got out of RV life 10 yrs. ago. OSB is fine for stationary jobs, or first timer trailer, but something this nice should be built on a solid frame and I'm not seeing that in this video. In ten years, it wouldn't be worth more than scrap, not trying to be the jerk. JMHO good luck on your travels
So this begs questions. Did you take any measurements to determine that your kingpin/pinbox was flexing excessively? Did you have any upper deck flexing? We opened a case with GD because my pinbox is flexing up an inch and a quarter after hooking up. The mobile tech didn't want to tear anything apart at the RV park we were at in Montana. He showed us how to measure upper deck flex before and after hooking up. I have none. How did you get GD tech to come to your site?
We had to take a lot of pictures to show the flex outside and the damage to the cabinets on the inside. No measurements were needed as the bolts on the side were exposed when unhooked and the top row was covered when hooked. It was a lot of movement. They did as much as they could to get us to the shop.
Great question... We have a RAM 3500 dually and it does not have airbags. I assume it can have a big impact depending on how you have everything set up.
Concerning events. I've watched your video and also Geoff from My Bucket List Days video. Both rigs have the same serious chassis cracked frame issues in the exact same places. Hard to believe it would be a coincidence. Grand Design has a very large problem. So sorry.
This is why I will not own a new camper I personally don't feel like they're built very well the frames are not heavy enough. So I put my truck camper on a heavy-duty gooseneck trailer that is design for heavy equipment.
We will be staying at Pensacola NAS in November and then moving to Ft Walton Beach the rest of the month. Hope you were able to visit the Gulf Islands National Seashore near Navarre Beach.
I retired from working on aircraft for 40 years and the last thing I want to do is work on my vehicle! Gaa. Thought about buying one but thinking not. I’ll rent and not throw money into a pit.
I have a 2009 Cameo by Carriage and one of the reasons I went with them is the very apparent quality and the fact they build their own frame. In their TH-cam video they talk a lot about the frame strength and how most 5th wheels are not so strong. In our modern world manufacturers are cutting corners at every opportunity. I think they might have gone to far. Hopefully you can get your rig corrected.
I also have a 2008 carriage cameo and I bought it because of the reputation for their quality. I was and continue to be disappointed at the junk they built for the money I paid back in 2008. And then they went out of business shortly after my purchase and this unit is almond always. has been a nightmare. They all built piss poor quality for what the consumer pays.
You’re a good patient man! Although capable i would have had the tech do everything! No way I’m doing it!are they going to reimburse you for your time @165/ hr they’re shop rate? Just bought a 23 momentum, i guess I’ll have to keep my fingers crossed, good luck
Everyone I’ve heard having frame flexing issues have all been on 5th wheels. I have yet to hear if this is an issue on travel trailers as well. Any ideas?
Kids want an RV, but the more I watch these videos, the more I am apt to just get the smallest possible for our immediate needs and put the rest of the money towards 5 star resorts and airfare. lol. The last thing I want to deal with while on "vacation" is climbing underneath the RV to fix horrible manufacturing defects... you are definitely not saving any money...
... 5th wheel RVs frame breaks UPDATE.... According to Lippert, do not buy RVs that have their frames built between 2014 and 2018. Defective. Not the RVs built between 2014 and 2018, talking about the FRAME being built between 2014 and 2018.
The wife and I have been planning on trading in ours transcend in January 2024 ans upgrading to a 5th wheel momentum, 410/ 397 or our top pick of 381. Now all I see is frame issues .. makes me really think twice. I know there will always be issues but these frame issues seem ridiculous and preventable.
Seems RV builders are just slapping these units together with shotty workmanship with substandard parts and charging top dollar. I'd never buy a new unit, best to find a nice used unit that has already got the bugs worked out.
![Broken RV Suspension In The Remote Yukon [No Cell Service]](/img/n.gif)
Sorry to hear about the issues. Grand Design might have responded correctly in your case, but we cannot give them a pass on the very poor engineering of these rigs. I have no idea why they still build junk after DECADES of making these things. One engineer said "Well.. it's like going through an earthquake every time it goes down the road". My response was - If I was building a house on a fault line; I would be smart enough to be build my house strong enough to be on a fault line. The engineer had no response...
We can devise the development of the Space shuttle, The roads in Greece that have withstood the time but we can't make a suspension or roads today to stand to the use its being made to do?
The grand design that we bought was absolute trash as well. Got rid of it as fast as we could.
This is so true. Our house in Alaska came through the 2019 7.2 earthquake unscathed...because it was built for it's environment. I have a 2023 390RK that has had structural issues since the very day we took delivery and spent over 50 days at GD.
I think it’s tough to strike a balance. If they could build these to withstand an earthquake, they would be unaffordable. It’s always a balance between weight, cost, and affordability. GD is not to bad compared to all the brands out there in my opinion. Certainly not the best, certainly not the worst. Quality control could certainly be better even given the materials they do use though. I’ve owned a GD Reflection, and then down sized to a Imagine XLS, and the quality of the latter was fairly disappointing.
@@Hawk89gtyes, I was thinking that the engineers are struggling to design a frame with strength to weight ratio, and a large floor plan, and still be towable by an F150 V8 or equivalent. Now pickup truck manufacturers are going to V6 turbo charged, and this is going to be an issue? Another TH-camr says he talked to a tech, and this guy said there are 7 out of ten (?) trailers with failing welds, and eventually these failures zipper throughout.
Sold a class A. When I jump back in, it will be very small and simple and with as few moving parts as possible. This constant maintenance takes the fun out of life.
Another video with Grand Design involved. Sorry for your issues, but sadly; thank you for letting others know what to avoid. Good luck.
Build out old moving vans semi trailers, I've broken down several toy haulers and fifth wheels back in the day, now own an ex Mayflower moving van zero leaks and Zero frame suspension issues at a fraction of the cost
Thank you very much for sharing your POS with us so we know what not RV to buy ever. And no grand design does not stand behind any of this. Specially, if you say the words frame flex. Grand design will be the last RV I would ever look at to think about buying, good luck everyone😮😢
When I see chip board in construction I get a bad feeling all over. Having been in the construction business for 35 years I think that stuff should be outlawed. But good luck with you fifth week enjoy your travels.
Thank you!
They should be using marine plywood for the roofs and inside these campers That OSB and compression board cant handle the damp But its all about building cheap cookie cutter campers now and making tons of money
Things like this make me glad I did my research and bought a good slightly used camper. Two years fulltime not a single problem..
That’s great to hear!
what brand, make model pls thx.
It's good that Grand Design took care of your sagging front end problem so quickly and sent a tech to your camp spot. I think they are trying to manage this defect in their frames as you aren't the only one who has made a video about this defect which resulted in weld failures.
I'm amazed how upbeat you are dealing with this issue. I'd be pissed. Also, stupid how they ran the sewer hose so close to your suspension links so they aren't serviceable or greasable.
I’ve seen other videos as well with this issue. Most manufacturers use the same frames and I know they recently made changes to that design so hoping the newer models don’t have the same problems.
@1StrangeAdventure sadly I've seen 20 or 25 different you tubers with the issue that's prob and miniscule number to reality .... I'd say it's every widebody built on that frame is in danger or folding 😮
Took a break from working on my Neighbor's 1999 Fleetwood Storm motorhome and I feel like travel trailers and fifth wheels are 'supposed' to be simpler because they don't have an engine but manufacture's of mega fifth-wheels added so much weight and complexity they have managed to make them less reliable. Shouldn't need to replace suspension components in an almost new unit. The main issues I'm dealing with are rust and corrosion from non-existent maintenance and the only damage in the suspension is melted bushings on the rear stabilizer due to age and that is an easy swap out.
Hope the repairs are now complete and you can start having fun again.
Appreciate that!!! Almost there b
I would hope so, but I highly doubt it. It’ll be one thing after the other, no doubt. That’s a polished up turd. 💩
They never end. RV owner is full time repairman.
Once that frame flexes. The whole camper just falls to pieces . Worse than termites... But you will end up with termites eventually... My advice is come to California and I'll buy you a drink
Yup, I am also starting to notice some issues with screws coming up through the floor in the master bedroom of my 2022 Momentum. I feel QC is getting out of control with all these manufacturers of RVs. Yet prices for these big RVs keep going up and on the other hand quality keeps going down. This has to stop
Hopefully it gets better… thankfully, they stand behind their products
Not sure how old you are, but back in the day it was known as “ trailer quality”. The fact that “a fool and their money soon parts way” is at play in many of these cases. Sounds harsh, but the proof is in all these failures. The people hired in the trailer factories are not the cream of the crop.
@@happycamper1372
The RV industry is a big group of shameless hacks.
My best friend has been an rv tech for 30 years. He's worked for big manufacturers and dealers and now runs his own rv service center.. the best advice he ever gave me was to only buy Northwoods products, specifically because their frames are 2nd to none, sure you're not going to get a huge rv with a garage etc but the artic fox campers are built to the highest standards, and you won't find a single one with a broken frame, I've owned mine for 8 years now, and I've had zero issues, zero.. everything has worked as it should..
I'm not a structural engineer but these massively large RVs take a tremendous beating down the road. I'm guessing at some point the compromise between size, features, strength and weight become more and more problematic.
While at the GD Rally, I had Performance Trailer repack my bearings and they found a cracked wet bolt. I had them replace all of them and they put them all in with the grease fitting facing outward so that greasing would be easier. I guess that means you can put them either way. I also notified GD of the broken wet bolt and there is an investigation underway due to the fact that they should not break.
That’s what they told us as well. MORryde asked for the parts back so they could investigate what is happening
What no one has mentioned in these comments is there a multiple episodes on TH-cam documenting this frame issue with GD. We plan to buy a Brinkley.
This is nothing new across all the brands. The common thread, Lippert chassis.
@@Itsa_Mea Doesn't Lippert build to OEM specs? I think it's poor engineering.
@@bfqywqd inferior materials and welding practices. In one case it was actual material that had sheered not the welds. The material wall thickness was half of what it needed to be. I replaced the 2x6 tubing with 3/16" wall thickness and has not moved or cracked again for years now with many trips from Maine to FL. to TN and everywhere in between.
It is a Lippert design and failure. They are building chassis with high carbon recycled steel not adequate for a trailer. If you ground or welded on the Lippert steel and you are an experienced fabricator you would know the difference immediately.
Interesting to watch another video of Grand Design frame flex issues. A channel I just watched quoted a Grand Design person stating that probably 70% of those frames are defective. Be careful because one channel the Grand Design techs did not disconnect batteries before welding on the frame and fried thousands of dollars worth of electronics including 6 Battle Borne batteries.
I have a 2017 Heartland Road Warrior 44ft triple axle Toyhauler. I also have the CRE 3000 equalizers but no wetbolts....so I replaced all the bolts and shackles withe the MorRyde wetbolt upgrade kit. I also was able to install the MorRyde X-Factor Crossmember on the rear most axle. I too could not install an additional crossmeber due to my sewer drain pipe clearance on the center axle. Good luck with your frame flex issues. Hope you enjoyed your visit to my hometown of Pensacola!
Just remove the zerk fitting then you can hit the wetbolt with a mallet (not hammer) and pop the zerk back in. Easy
Also buy a large battery powered impact gun so you can remove tires easy. No more breaker bar.
I remember the RVing days I had diesel Pushers and there was always something to fix. I sold my last one in the summer of 2022 and for a profit after owning it for three years. The Coach I had before this one got totaled out in the mountains of Tennessee fortunately we weren’t injured but the truck that caused the accident did not stop. I n 2016 I made the mistake of purchasing a brand new Thor Tuscany 45 footer which was nothing but one issue after another so after a year I sold it. Our first pusher was a 2011 Itasca Meridian 40 U a nice Coach but the negative was how the toilet area was so cramped. We had many fun times traveling the US and Canada and now we have moved to another stage of our lives we do the Airbnb’s. We do a lot of Cruises so this works for us now but the best part of RVing was the awesome people we met on our travels and the beautiful places we visited.
Thanks for the video, good effort on your part. Sorry for the issues you are having. 😢
Living in a 5th wheels in an RV park or on off-grid land seems appealing, but traveling in one on a regular basis seems exhausting.
Excellent point. I am a retired OTR commercial driver and being on the move constantly is a full time job. Also, road vibration destroys modern RV frames, walls and suspensions. I currently live full time in a 2014 Keystone Sprinter wide body 299RET in a senior mobile home park (mostly single wide mobiles homes and 10% RVs). My trailer has held up great, it's been stationary practically since new. I'm looking to buy a late model 2020 or newer Riverstone Legacy 39RKFB. It too will be a stationary full time primary residence.
The issues all occur with Lippert built frames that most of the mainstream manufacturers utilize!
Stay clear from these manufacturers frames as they are all junk. Rather choose manufacturers who utilize Dexter frames and you will never have an issue. So sorry that you are just one of many people who are going through this issue.
So many RV 's are under engineered now. The quality of the big three manufacturers has degraded to the point where I don't think I would buy any of their designs right now. Hearing major issues about Grand Design, which in the past were good quality. Good luck hope you get your unit fixed correctly at the manufacturer.
Thank you so much! Thankfully they are helping which is why we stick with GDRV
Spot on. Quality builds in anything went out the widow decades ago. I see the appeal of wanting to travel but these RVs are not even close to being made for full time living. My wife and both been working from home for about 12 years now and she ask me if I ever wanted to RV travel full time….I told her she was out of her mind. I work to hard not to live in a single wide trailer..Lol. But I love to weekend travel in my GD as well. Best of luck to you and yours. Great memories for sure.
I remember all the way back to the 90’s that RV’s that had triple axels were prone to breaking springs/ shackles. This was due to the stress in turning… sorry to see you having such issues.
Neighbour has one. They started having problems with suspension and frame. The dealer (it was new) blew them off. Lawyer got involved. Dealer took it for months. My neighbor had signs made calling the dealer terrible names because they took so long. So all I know is they are still towing it. And you’re right. 23 years ago a major Class A manufacturer (now gone after 40 years) had broken axles and lawsuits.
I would not replace what aint broke. You are just as apt to have your new part break as you are to have your old part break. Folks, I really feel for you. I live ini Fl. I know how awful it is to do that work in terrible heat. Rvs are really made to break over and over again. Sorry. Guys. My first time watching you, good video. Charley from Ocala. fl.
Harold & Cindy, I have some info you might like to here. We have a 2021 397th. 6 months ago we went through the broken wet bolt, hanger replacement problem. During the repair the mechanic advised checking our center axle spring when you get home. It was looking pretty flat with weight on it so I removed it and took it to a local spring shop. They said the spring was only rated for 3200 lbs. How that is determined is the thickness of the individual leafs. I haven’t contacted Dexter or GD yet. Good luck with your rig.
Great info. Thank you so much for sharing! We will take a look when we get the rig back.
Great attitude in dealing with adversity! Really enjoyed the detail you covered. I too always carry enough tools to handle at least the simple things (not an angle grinder and mig setup though!). Must have been just horrible in that heat - at least you didn't have a hurricane! Well done and thanks for sharing.
Thank you! It’s been trying times but we have two choices: 1. Get mad and be unproductive or 2. Take it as a learning experience ☺️ we appreciate the support.
We had same problems last year, but it bust the cabinets around bed, tore wall in bed room, they came and fix it good enough to take back to factory, fix it all up and bought it back,
This sounds familiar. We have some damage on the inside as well.
So sorry for the issues. Thanks for showing that things are all not all good.
Thanks for this! We try to show it all… the good and the bad. ☺️
Been lots of reports of 5th wheel frames breaking. One person reported 17 frame welds that broke on his Grand Design 5th wheel.
Because everyone thinks they want a lighter and lighter trailer to tow with an inadequate tow vehicle (think-"half-ton towable"). It's not wise IMHO to go too far that direction for engineering of weight reduction.
They are using non-certified welders.
The tech that came out likely knew exactly what to look for before he even got there regarding those lag bolts.
You have amazing attitudes. God Bless you and know our thoughts are with you. Now off to college- another adventure
It’s good to see that those NOS Yugo parts have found new uses.
Harold, you are so modest when it comes to rig fixing or DIY projects. You're a great RV tech. Get yourself a harbor freight air lift jack. Doug Benjamin showed me his in Tennessee. Got one as soon as we got back. Hooks to your compressor and goes up with the push of a button. Can't wait to see you guys in Georgia. 1 week to go.
Thank you so much! I’ve had a lot of practice at this point. 😞 See ya soon!
Glad we saw this coming on many Grand Design 5vers and didnt go for the influencers on utube.
Sorry you got stuck…
We actually have been making our own wet bolts here in the our shop.
We cut the right side hangers off our good friends grand design to laser align wheels than welded and plated them. They were off by over a 1/4 inch 😬
Put a nut on the bolt before you hammer on it.
Man so sorry to see
For how much these rigs cost and to have these major frame issues is just so disappointing. Our 22 Grand Design Solitude is in the shop right now having water leaks fixed along with wood replacement from the water leaks.
So glad GD has been responsive for you, unfortunately that is not the norm with them from what we have seen posted online. They took over a year to finally resolve the issues we had from DAY ONE when we bought our Imagine.
It's unfortunate for sure. Glad you were finally able to have it resolved.
They never had the heat set high enough when doing those welds so there wasn't enough penetration Which was easy to spot as the welds look like bubble gum stuck to the steel instead of a lapped ribbon I recon there are broken and weak welds over most the frame and a lot of other frames too I recon Lipperd may have as lot of warranty work coming their way as they make frames for most the campers in Elkhart They must be hiring first day apprentice welders there for 5 bucks an hour to make those frames lol
Sorry to hear that you had these issues. This is the 2nd voice I have seen this week with the same issues, with the frame twisting and coming undone. I hope they got it fixed correctly for you. Safe travels.
Amazing you have to do so much upkeep on a relatively new RV.
Virrtually all RV frames come from Lippert, as designed by each manufacturer. A Lippert insider estimated that 7 of 10 5th wheel frames are going to fail. The other three are on campers that are permanently parked. The entire industry is selling junk - correction “selling shiny junk with pretty graphics”.
Lippert designs the frame to the manufacturer specifications. It’s high time Lippert tells them its not possible to build a frame strong enough and as light as they spec.
I have yet to see a mass market RV that is designed well and constructed well. They are nearly all weak by design and built as cheap as possible.
The majority of the customer base prioritizes initial cost so the manufactures listened and deliver on the demand for cheap.
10 to 1 the reason your suspension gave up the ghost is because there is too much rv weight on them. lots of rv folks are having issues with front frames coming apart, one channel has said the frames were not meant to handle the weight they have on them. these are nothing but money pits.
I had a new 2019 Grand Design Reflection in 2018. It was the worst RV I’ve ever had. The list of defects and shoddy design was non stop. Honestly, the best thing you can do is get rid of it. It took me 3 years an i finally got rid of it. Good luck on your travels.
Thanks for your input and its exactly why I will never buy an RV. Too many horror stories like yours.
A couple of life/old man hacks...I had to put some angled grease fittings on my wet bolts so that I could grease them with the tires on. Also to use your tools that you have to your advantage, slide your 4 way lug wrench under your tire kinda cross-ways where you have a stem on each side of the tire, then lift up on one or the other stems which now gives you some leverage on lifting the tire making it easier to manage lining up the wheel and lug bolts.
You have a Great Attitude with the adversity. Grand Design has gone from hero to zero in my views. They were really desirable to us in ‘19 and ‘20. We never bought one, thank goodness. Went with a Super C instead. With all the problems I’ve seen on Grand Design units, I wouldn’t own one now!
So sorry to hear about the troubles that you are having with your rig.
Good job, quick question how is your ceramic coating holding up? and do you think it was worth the money? and how long has been sense you had it applied
I have the same crack on one of my equa-flex equalizer. My springs and equalizers didn’t line up when I attempted to replace the equalizer. I assumed the springs were bent. After taking everything off, the springs are straight, the hangers are straight, equalizers are bent. 🤔 It’s almost seem like the axels have shifted to one side. My current tires have 4k miles, no abnormal wear. Take a measurement of the space between your frame and the edge of your tires. Curious if all the same, mine are not. Please update on the findings by the manufacturer.
Licensed Vehicles intending to travel on public roads must be equipped with a Compliance Decal or Plate that identifies the vehicle and confirms that it was built in compliance with all Federal regulations in affect at the date of manufacture. Those Federal regulations are mainly focussed around the OEM manufacturer's rated capacities of the axles, suspension and tires/wheels. My suggestion would be to look at the vehicle tare weights and the number of tires carrying that weight. I saw a tandem axle unit with each axle rated at 7,000# under specific conditions, and single tires for a total of 4 tires to semi support a tare weight of what was reported to be approx. 14,000# + .At best the tires were 9" wide (235 mm) and more likely 8" width or less. Assuming a weight transfer of approx 30% up thru the king pin on to the tow vehicle fifth wheel and into the truck frame would leave about 10,000# travelling down the highway at posted speeds while being carried on 4 tires (2,500 # ea on level road). Compare that to a typical passenger car weighing 4,000 # supported by 4 similar tires at 1,000 to 1,200 # ea.
This brings into focus the braking ability, which, even if not conducting a distance braking test at various speeds, on a flat surface, it can be calculated in conjunction with the tow vehicle axles and brakes which would be documented by OEM. Typically the installer of brakes (usually axles are ordered with brakes installed) assumes responsibility that they meet highway standards and can prove it if required, or different industry standards for other applications. Generally the more axles, the more brake surface and the better the braking.
Listening to the videos with Lippert, it was made clear that they were hired solely as a component supplier. They stated that they build to their customer's specifications and often to customer supplied CAD drawings. In this instance they knew the identity of their customer (Grand Design) and knew the intended application. Their customer had refused Lippert's recommendations for optional materials and designs and had refused to purchase Lippert's Engineering services.The implication of those comments means that they also knew that what they were building was inadequate for the application. IMO it may be helpful to have their claims confirmed by sworn testimony in a Court. So while they may not be responsible for anything other than providing welding fabricating services and perhaps surface finishing of components, it appears by the nature of numerous confirmed reports of frame failures, over extended periods of time, that they have even done a poor job of that when quality is a consideration. And a company who choses to continue to build a major component when their own experience and experts are concerned that it may provide a less than satisfactory result simply because thir customer is not willing to pay for their best efforts is morally reprehensible in my view. Damage done to their company repiutation within that market may never be redeemed.
In my limited experience, all new steel purchases are supplied containing some of the steel content being re-refined. Limitations can be outlined along with steel characterists and preferred steel suppliers can be specified at time of original design when conducted by qualified professional. That's what they do. Such information is generally a part of the design package forwarded to supplier (in this case, that's Lippert). That information affects costs for Lippert if they are to source the steel. An easy test of this would be to have a metalurgist testing done of material that is felt to be inadequate b/c it failed (broke) for content and characteristics. Then request Grand Design provide details of their design layout including steel specifications. Find out the original steel supplier. Where did the steel come from, does it meet those specifications? .Request of Lippert to provide details of the steel package provided by Grand Design (if they did). Or, as Lippert has stated, they only provided welder/fabrication labour and steel must have been provided by Grand Design .So, where did they get it and does the tested material comply? .
This will resolve many of the uncertainties surrounding Lippert's role and confirm only that which they have contributed. It also correctly identifies the role of parties and confirms responsiblity at the appropriate place.
Grand Design seems to have been positioned themselves to benefit from as many choices as possible with their products, good and bad. However, allowing this to continue will impact every RV manufacturer in North America and place a shadow over the RV industry as a whole. And that will definitely be on them.
Better off getting an extra large travel trailer. These 5th wheels are nightmares with these Lippert frames.
We love the space and maneuverability a 5W provides
I dont care if you spend $25,000.00 or over $200,000.00 on these new RV's, they are all made with the same components and made like crap. After 11 years of RVing we called it quits. Our last 5th Wheelers frame was sagging also. Luckily ( or really not luckily) our RV had a huge tree come right through the roof and destroy it while we were inside. Thank God we were not hurt but it gave us an out to go through the repairs which may have cost us a fortune or totaled it out from the frame sagging. After having encounters with falling trees 2 times prior ( which just missed us before) we are done with camping and moved on to something else.
12:36 My CRE3000 zert fittings are to the outside from dealer - much easier to grease than having zerts on the inside under the rig...!
I don't understand why they are on the inside. If you are worried about road damage, just put caps (or tape) on them for protection.
Gussets, gussets, gussets. Without them, the welds fail. RV’s move and are subject to vast cycles of loading and unloading the structural connections.
Perfect reason why they should all come with independent suspension so there is less abuse on the chassis of the trailer. Seems like a no brainer to me
Wow, seeing what's under the veneer is truly depressing. The camera has a weird fish-eye sometimes, but if you look closely, you can see some racking of the frame when you where working in the rear. All of that light gauge metal and cheap "barn gusset" design is shocking on a piece of this size.
That made me sick seeing the damage to such an expensive unit!
Doesn’t look like you have cross braces between the spring hangers. Without those, you must have massive flexing whenever you back up at an angle or turn sharply. Have you considered Morryde X Factor braces between all of your spring hangers?
Just push that bolt out until it hits the drain pipe. Then cut off as much as you can with a sawzall. Then push it out further and repeat until the bolt is all out.
We are new to RV and not going full time. Retired. I’ve watched five or more fifth wheel frame failures. And as many suspension failures. All were Grand designs. I know lipert builds them and my frame but build is to grand design specific. Even my brother had to put all new suspension under his 44ft toy hauler. Got me wondering.
RV manufactures ask for the cheapest price for frames built by someone else and agree the the frame design. Bean counters force engineering to build the cheapest and lightest frame as well as every other component of the RV. And consumers purchase based on price also. Weight and price keep quality low in RV's. Also less owners of a company, less money required for ownership and more better for better service and materials. Three RVs in my life Airstream, Cruiser and ATC. Best one....ATC and price accordingly, Expensive, Mid Range, Expensive....Done RVing, if started again, would buy ATC again. Second frame issue with Grand Design on You Tube.
I’m sure somebody has mentioned if there is a correlation with the trailers built during Covid. They were pretty much slapping them together just to get them to the dealer.?.
Sir why don’t you use that impact wrench for those lugs etc ?
All the structural integrity and crash worthiness of a fiberglass outhouse in a tornado.
As long as you have a SWAN Neck 5 th wheel coupling ,your Caravan's going to fold up like a can of beans.
So, working on your review instead of relaxing. Exactly the reason that we sold our almost new rv.
When hammering and you have your hand in the middle don’t you lose the power benefit from being at the end of the handle.
Yes- but at that point not sure how much power I had left 🤣 I’m not the best at this stuff and choke up so I have more control over the swing.
Sorry for suspension troubles but almost oversized rvs have these problems it’s really a shame these rv manufacturers don’t oversized these components on the build
We agree!
I can't believe that these big rigs don't come without wet bolts as standard. Should be required for any 4 season rig.
They should have had a TEAM there to install that FOR YOU. Uggghh. What kind of warrantee is there with you putting it on?
Great production and work on your rig! Man, what a chore. Just curious, how many miles do you have on your rig and did you buy new (what year)? We just returned from a 13,000 mile road trip from FL to WA and back, and many places in between, over a more than 2 month period towing a used 2019 Flagstaff E-Pro 19BH which we purchased less than a year ago. We had ZERO major problems and just some really minor issues. If we had any where near the issues that you had, I would have probably sold our rig. Kudos to you for for sticking it out with humility!
Why isn't Grand Design issuing a recall on the models that are being affected with the frame issues? Seems like a no brainer to me.
just the fact that the rig is nothing but cheap steel and osb instead of plywood. makes me glad I got out of RV life 10 yrs. ago. OSB is fine for stationary jobs, or first timer trailer, but something this nice should be built on a solid frame and I'm not seeing that in this video. In ten years, it wouldn't be worth more than scrap, not trying to be the jerk. JMHO good luck on your travels
Where did you get the awning screen?
You’ all need MORryde Independent Suspension. Might be time to make the journey to Elkhart, Indiana!
So this begs questions. Did you take any measurements to determine that your kingpin/pinbox was flexing excessively? Did you have any upper deck flexing? We opened a case with GD because my pinbox is flexing up an inch and a quarter after hooking up. The mobile tech didn't want to tear anything apart at the RV park we were at in Montana. He showed us how to measure upper deck flex before and after hooking up. I have none. How did you get GD tech to come to your site?
We had to take a lot of pictures to show the flex outside and the damage to the cabinets on the inside. No measurements were needed as the bolts on the side were exposed when unhooked and the top row was covered when hooked. It was a lot of movement. They did as much as they could to get us to the shop.
How much does the truck you pull the RV with affect the conditions of the RV? Shifting, bouncing etc..?
Great question... We have a RAM 3500 dually and it does not have airbags. I assume it can have a big impact depending on how you have everything set up.
its great that they fix it.. what about when they are 10 years old with 2000 miles and the frame breaks....... sigh
Concerning events. I've watched your video and also Geoff from My Bucket List Days video. Both rigs have the same serious chassis cracked frame issues in the exact same places. Hard to believe it would be a coincidence. Grand Design has a very large problem. So sorry.
What year is your camper. All this flex frame has me worried
2021
Thanks for sharing 😊
This is why I will not own a new camper I personally don't feel like they're built very well the frames are not heavy enough. So I put my truck camper on a heavy-duty gooseneck trailer that is design for heavy equipment.
I like my class b. It’s perfect for me and my dog. A lot less to worry about .
Heavy Heavy RV Those things are so heavy they max out any normal road abuse that can be tolerated
We will be staying at Pensacola NAS in November and then moving to Ft Walton Beach the rest of the month. Hope you were able to visit the Gulf Islands National Seashore near Navarre Beach.
We loved Navarre beach and the surrounding area. Beautiful out there!
The frames on travel trailers and fifth wheels are not built heavy enough to hold the weight
How many miles would you estimate you have on your trailer?
I like the Grand Design free spirit. Who needs engineers?
I retired from working on aircraft for 40 years and the last thing I want to do is work on my vehicle! Gaa. Thought about buying one but thinking not. I’ll rent and not throw money into a pit.
I have a 2009 Cameo by Carriage and one of the reasons I went with them is the very apparent quality and the fact they build their own frame. In their TH-cam video they talk a lot about the frame strength and how most 5th wheels are not so strong.
In our modern world manufacturers are cutting corners at every opportunity. I think they might have gone to far.
Hopefully you can get your rig corrected.
I also have a 2008 carriage cameo and I bought it because of the reputation for their quality. I was and continue to be disappointed at the junk they built for the money I paid back in 2008. And then they went out of business shortly after my purchase and this unit is almond always. has been a nightmare. They all built piss poor quality for what the consumer pays.
@@glenncoon6639 There is clearly no near perfect RV out there. What were your big issues with the Cameo?
You’re a good patient man! Although capable i would have had the tech do everything! No way I’m doing it!are they going to reimburse you for your time @165/ hr they’re shop rate? Just bought a 23 momentum, i guess I’ll have to keep my fingers crossed, good luck
Everyone I’ve heard having frame flexing issues have all been on 5th wheels. I have yet to hear if this is an issue on travel trailers as well. Any ideas?
We haven’t heard of any experiencing this issue.
Kids want an RV, but the more I watch these videos, the more I am apt to just get the smallest possible for our immediate needs and put the rest of the money towards 5 star resorts and airfare. lol. The last thing I want to deal with while on "vacation" is climbing underneath the RV to fix horrible manufacturing defects... you are definitely not saving any money...
Rv company's asking 100.000 plus for those trailers, only company that still builds solid trailers is Airstream 😢
Definitely not mechanics, leaving out parts isn’t good, will cause problems later
Did we leave parts out or are you referring to the Manufacture?
Like your Acadia NP shirt. Go Maine.
... 5th wheel RVs frame breaks UPDATE....
According to Lippert, do not buy RVs that have their frames built between 2014 and 2018. Defective. Not the RVs built between 2014 and 2018, talking about the FRAME being built between 2014 and 2018.
The wife and I have been planning on trading in ours transcend in January 2024 ans upgrading to a 5th wheel momentum, 410/ 397 or our top pick of 381. Now all I see is frame issues .. makes me really think twice. I know there will always be issues but these frame issues seem ridiculous and preventable.
Seems RV builders are just slapping these units together with shotty workmanship with substandard parts and charging top dollar. I'd never buy a new unit, best to find a nice used unit that has already got the bugs worked out.
Seems like your frame is underrated for how much your trailer weighs.