I’ve learned so much from these videos, I really enjoy watching them! I am so impressed with how well your home system came out, i’ve been watching since the beginning.
I can votch for you, you are not a liar! I watched your video of you setting up those dual address detectors and you did indeed have this issue when you did the install of the devices!
No matter what Notiliar/Honeybad says you are right on the money Nic when it comes to placement and addresses. As the other folks on here have said I too have learned so much from watching these vids and also quite enjoy them. They give a really good indicator as to where modern fire alarm technology is going plus Notifier’s quality/bugs/issues. Hey for the bad heads you could do a durability testing adventure with Hayden I’ve missed those. Keep up the great work with your system Nic it’s been a super cool ride from beginning to end. Love what you have done and continue to achieve. Such a great learning experience each and every video.
I haven’t had too many issues with those newer addressable System Sensor detectors, although I do recall having a faulty tens dial on an ASD-PL3 on one of my jobs. And not to mention, I have an SK-HEAT-W that refuses to fit on a base when the chamber cover is on. But in general, I do feel like Honeywell QC as a whole has gone down a bit. Great video by the way.
Don't worry we believe you, that was showing as 13 and 15, honeywell is weird i have 0 experience but i can gess somthing is up that line or up with the garage station where you hook it up. Thanks for sharing, this problem was very interesting and very intriguing and this is a very fun series, thanks for sharing
Dont worry Nick. Notifier makes me and my company look like liars too. I just got certified by them last week. Ill attest for you 😂. We've been having to send back a lot of detectors back along with modules. Glad you were able to get those detectors to work though, saves some heartache. Good for spares
It's always when you whip out a camera or tell a friend that the system will be "all crap I gotta work now I can't let anyone know I am messing with him"
Maybe the panel just has problems with automatically programming a large amount of devices at once. Every time you ran the auto program to just add one device, it behaved fine. Plus, the vid where you programmed showed that the panel struggled to config a whole system but then behaved when a new head was programmed in by itself.
Hey Nic, Awesome video. I had one question. In the home fire alarm system. why didn't you connect the existing residential smoke detector system to your commercial fire alarm system. Kidde produces a relay module for smoke detectors that will trigger when the detectors go off.
Multiple reasons first one being that was the point of the system because the residential smoke alarms are absolutely garbage so it would defeat the whole purpose of installing a fire alarm system if they were kept and it is illegal to have mixed signals and they cannot be triggered from the system anyways
Seems like the fire main panel had a software bug or something because two of the detectors had issues on the install and like now with testing they work properly. Dont rlly know what to make else from it but hope it doesnt happen again in future with adding new things to your system.
Honeywell needs to get their act together. It's not just with their detectors, people has had tons of software problems with the new firelite es series and silent knight 6000 series. Honeywell is becoming the new EST, and the true EST is going bankrupt and carrier is selling of their fire and security business (including est) but i don't think anyone is gonna buy it. I heard Honeywell wanted to buy EST but they did not want Honeywell buying EST. Please don't reply if what I just said was false because I dont know if it is true or not and neither does anyone in the community most likely.
As a building architect who once worked for Honeywell I feel I can shed some light in the situation and this is what I was told when I asked a similar question about fire alarm quality in the Us because I too had noticed Honeywell went down hill. The problem is with Honeywell is they are mostly concentrating on their Europe systems. I believe the most advanced system Honeywell currently has in the market is a UK system called GENT. Most of their time and effort is put into those systems because they are more advanced then the American / Canadian systems Sadly this has meant US produced devices are now lower quality market primarily because the US and Canadian standards are so outdated Honeywell can pretty much get away with it. And it doesn’t even matter if they do loose custom because Honeywell makes most of its money from the UK and Europe systems like Gent and Morley and Notifier, KAC All systems developed to a much higher standard meaning the company focuses its attention on Europe more than the US and the alarms are used world wide, UK fire alarms for example are even required to be used on all cruise ships and Honeywell has a very big hand in that which makes the company millions. Honeywell definitely won’t be going bankrupt because it’s Europe what makes Honeywell all it’s money sadly the US is nothing but a stepping stone and a means of supply there is no profit in the US systems and our devices have been suffering for a while now with cheap quality and bad designed systems. Such as our notifier in the US and Canada is nowhere near the same advancement as those systems in the Uk because our standards are so outdated it doesn’t allow it meaning Honeywell needs to change its design completely for the US market but develops the systems more cheaper because the Us market is smaller compared to the world wide usage meaning they wouldn’t make profit and loose money. Same with Canada. Honeywell can’t afford to provide systems off the bat so they essentially strip the Uk system down a few design tweaks to make them worse quality and have less features and chnage things like call points to pull stations etc… to make them US compatible and then Wolla we have Honeywell as we know it in the US today. Both Honeywell the US and Canadian governments are responsible for the downgrade in fire safety equipment. Until the regulations change and both our countries come into the modern world Honeywell can’t make good quality products because doing so means they loose money and isn’t Hope that makes a little more sense as to why. So essentially. Honeywell spend most of its time and energy developing the Uk and European systems because these system make up the most money because a good chunk can be used world wide and the UK ones are legal standard on cruise ships meaning a big pay out for Honeywell. US and Canadian systems are pretty much outdated and are only regulated in a few countries US, Canada and a few 3rd worlds. Meaning Honeywell doesn’t make as much or even profit from the US systems so it’s not sustainable for them to make the systems at a higher quality.
As European this is true. Gent is for the Uk but Esser for mainland Europe is getting more advanced as gent. Notifier, KAC, Morley, system sensor are getting slightly more advanced but becoming worse quality like the us as it’s the same module. Also all the products are the same except panels as it’s 4 names under 1 product. Honeywell keeps focusing on Esser and gent which is unfortunate.
A local recreation center had a Fire-Lite ES -200X installed in 2021 and replaced an old Silent Knight (likely a 5820XL or IFP 1000). Haven't seen problems or troubles shown on the ANN-80 yet.
i had a silent knight version of that detector (sk-photo-w) that some how was coming up as a multi criteria, at least the seller sent me another unit free of charge. seems like honeywell qc is going down the toilet.
Other than the EST heat recall, My EST3 system and many other EST3 systems in this country do not really tend to give that much faults and faulty devices. The only one was a loose capacitor on my EST genesis mini horn. And for your EST systems in Canada, they are about from the 1960s but here it ranges from 2012 to 2023.
@@nics-systems-electricDon’t even get me started on my old middle school’s EST. And now I’ve heard one of the EST3s in my new college is having mapping issues and frustrating the techs. Map faults may be easy to solve, but it requires a lot of labor to find the culprits. EST mapping works by going device to device and checking the resistance between them to not only auto-address but physically locate the device. I’ve heard it’s useful for troubleshooting issues like ground faults and some other problems. However, it’s a double edged sword. While it can make pinpointing devices easy, it can generate service calls because of the precise nature of the mapping, and as field devices fail, the panel can get confused about device locations and generate a “map fault” trouble which can be a laborious process to fix, as I said before. Map faults are just one of the many issues EST has a reputation for.
@@dutchwolf2675 United States. EST is also very popular here, especially in government agency owned institutions like schools. It’s cheap, and the service is done by 3rd party companies which makes it less proprietary than Simplex and gives more flexible options for consumers to choose from. Despite that, I’ve not gotten a very good impression from EST. My old middle school was the worst system. It was a newer EST3 that had a mind of its own and constantly spat out false alarms and according to the principal was frustrating to deal with.
I wonder what happened to Honeywell, they were known to be good systems and now they got slammed with a QC disease. I knew Fire-Lite was not the best but it's now spreading to the other Honeywell branches.
Hey Nic, I just wanted to let you know that all 3 of those defective detectors are actually the US versions of those detectors. Now, do I believe that is the cause of their issues, I don't know. But when you showed the model numbers, I could tell those were the US versions when they just said "FSP-951" or "FST-951R", something like that. Because you happen to be in Canada, you probably should have ordered the "FSP-951A" smoke detectors and "FST-951RA" heat detectors, keep in mind, the A at the end is the Canadian model.
I have been putting in a fire alarm system in my home using the DSC Panel NEO. I have PG9936 Detectors and they have been falsing the same way I have had to replace them before going live with the monitoring Company.
first alert has an issue with their wireless alarms where from my experience is 1 out of every 8ish detectors won't pair with the rest. fire alarms is not a place to lack quality control
That's not a matter of employer at all i'm not sure what you mean by that. Monitoring companies companies do not dispatch Fire or police for residential customers here
You probably just "scared" them into working due to trying to catch it on camera. I t sure is strange though that they wouldn't work but now will work.
Honeywell devices such as notifier, gent and Morley devices are kind off crappy in their ways because in my opinion they always throw faults. Especially the fact that half my schools Morley by Honeywell system is inactive and useless.
Saying GENT is crappy is crazy 😂 I’m an American and even I know Honeywell invests the Most money into GENT. It’s like their most advanced system in the market. And trust me the Americans and Canadians who know of GENT are wishing they will one day be made available other than just in the UK. So if your telling me that Gent has gone trashy when Honeywell invests the mosts in that company then the rest of us are pretty much screwed. It would be a shame if they have gone bad I saw a gent system in action when I visited the Uk I’ve genuinely to this day I’ve never seen a more impressive fire alarm system 😂
@@ryanhelton1865 Gent vigilons are bloody capable systems....i have seen one that was driving conventional bells via relay modules as opposed to the standard addressable sounders
I do like gent systems but here in the UAE where I currently stay they tend to give faults. I do have a whole collection of gent sounders and devices but unfortunately one broke because of quality. The model number is C3-IP-SN-W. I do agree that it is the most advance Honeywell system though. It’s just the quality. 😊
Ah yes, “Technology Making Us Make an Ass Out of Ourselves” example 1 million. Also, is there any reason you didn’t use that 4” mounting base to mount the garage heat?
@@nics-systems-electric ah, that makes sense. Would be nice if they had one that would fit on those 4” octagonal boxes for surface mounting, would definitely look better than those 6” bases in such situations.
@@HenBasketFireAlarms I agree they came with my detectors but they don't seem to fit on anything they are the same base the is permanently installed in the duct detector housings
@@nics-systems-electric I looked at the 951 series specification guide, and it appears those 4” bases are intended for European boxes, and the B501 datasheet says it can also mount to 3½” octagonal North American boxes. Either way, Honeywell kinda dropped the ball on making bases that look good on surface mounted boxes.
i have 5 detector and it thinks it was a heat detector but it was a smoke detector and 3 another detector have dual address problem until i set it like 80,81 and 82,that dual address is located in my room, Kelly's room and even Joey's room and after i wait for a month,it works. Simplex was lying dude
I’ve learned so much from these videos, I really enjoy watching them! I am so impressed with how well your home system came out, i’ve been watching since the beginning.
Thank you very much I appreciate your comment I'm glad you enjoy
@@nics-systems-electrichi nice
Nic my first video I watched of you was you fixing the ground fault of your MS4
Same
I can votch for you, you are not a liar! I watched your video of you setting up those dual address detectors and you did indeed have this issue when you did the install of the devices!
No matter what Notiliar/Honeybad says you are right on the money Nic when it comes to placement and addresses. As the other folks on here have said I too have learned so much from watching these vids and also quite enjoy them. They give a really good indicator as to where modern fire alarm technology is going plus Notifier’s quality/bugs/issues. Hey for the bad heads you could do a durability testing adventure with Hayden I’ve missed those. Keep up the great work with your system Nic it’s been a super cool ride from beginning to end. Love what you have done and continue to achieve. Such a great learning experience each and every video.
That slow motion moment when he dropped one of the heat detectors😂
I haven’t had too many issues with those newer addressable System Sensor detectors, although I do recall having a faulty tens dial on an ASD-PL3 on one of my jobs. And not to mention, I have an SK-HEAT-W that refuses to fit on a base when the chamber cover is on. But in general, I do feel like Honeywell QC as a whole has gone down a bit. Great video by the way.
Don't worry we believe you, that was showing as 13 and 15, honeywell is weird i have 0 experience but i can gess somthing is up that line or up with the garage station where you hook it up. Thanks for sharing, this problem was very interesting and very intriguing and this is a very fun series, thanks for sharing
Dont worry Nick. Notifier makes me and my company look like liars too. I just got certified by them last week. Ill attest for you 😂. We've been having to send back a lot of detectors back along with modules. Glad you were able to get those detectors to work though, saves some heartache. Good for spares
I do think your system and videos are awesome and entertaining
Glad you like them!
I think notifier is trying to act like Symplex now 😂😂😂😂
More like EST
I think you est problems is because the systems you have, are so old.@@nics-systems-electric
I haven't noticed this yet until now your TH-cam logo looks like Notifier Brand one Nic.
It's always when you whip out a camera or tell a friend that the system will be "all crap I gotta work now I can't let anyone know I am messing with him"
Maybe the panel just has problems with automatically programming a large amount of devices at once. Every time you ran the auto program to just add one device, it behaved fine. Plus, the vid where you programmed showed that the panel struggled to config a whole system but then behaved when a new head was programmed in by itself.
Hey Nic, Awesome video. I had one question. In the home fire alarm system. why didn't you connect the existing residential smoke detector system to your commercial fire alarm system. Kidde produces a relay module for smoke detectors that will trigger when the detectors go off.
Multiple reasons first one being that was the point of the system because the residential smoke alarms are absolutely garbage so it would defeat the whole purpose of installing a fire alarm system if they were kept and it is illegal to have mixed signals and they cannot be triggered from the system anyways
@@nics-systems-electric Thanks for explaining.
Seems like the fire main panel had a software bug or something because two of the detectors had issues on the install and like now with testing they work properly. Dont rlly know what to make else from it but hope it doesnt happen again in future with adding new things to your system.
Honeywell needs to get their act together.
It's not just with their detectors, people has had tons of software problems with the new firelite es series and silent knight 6000 series. Honeywell is becoming the new EST, and the true EST is going bankrupt and carrier is selling of their fire and security business (including est) but i don't think anyone is gonna buy it. I heard Honeywell wanted to buy EST but they did not want Honeywell buying EST. Please don't reply if what I just said was false because I dont know if it is true or not and neither does anyone in the community most likely.
As a building architect who once worked for Honeywell I feel I can shed some light in the situation and this is what I was told when I asked a similar question about fire alarm quality in the Us because I too had noticed Honeywell went down hill.
The problem is with Honeywell is they are mostly concentrating on their Europe systems. I believe the most advanced system Honeywell currently has in the market is a UK system called GENT. Most of their time and effort is put into those systems because they are more advanced then the American / Canadian systems
Sadly this has meant US produced devices are now lower quality market primarily because the US and Canadian standards are so outdated Honeywell can pretty much get away with it.
And it doesn’t even matter if they do loose custom because Honeywell makes most of its money from the UK and Europe systems like Gent and Morley and Notifier, KAC All systems developed to a much higher standard meaning the company focuses its attention on Europe more than the US and the alarms are used world wide, UK fire alarms for example are even required to be used on all cruise ships and Honeywell has a very big hand in that which makes the company millions.
Honeywell definitely won’t be going bankrupt because it’s Europe what makes Honeywell all it’s money sadly the US is nothing but a stepping stone and a means of supply there is no profit in the US systems and our devices have been suffering for a while now with cheap quality and bad designed systems.
Such as our notifier in the US and Canada is nowhere near the same advancement as those systems in the Uk because our standards are so outdated it doesn’t allow it meaning Honeywell needs to change its design completely for the US market but develops the systems more cheaper because the Us market is smaller compared to the world wide usage meaning they wouldn’t make profit and loose money. Same with Canada.
Honeywell can’t afford to provide systems off the bat so they essentially strip the Uk system down a few design tweaks to make them worse quality and have less features and chnage things like call points to pull stations etc… to make them US compatible and then Wolla we have Honeywell as we know it in the US today.
Both Honeywell the US and Canadian governments are responsible for the downgrade in fire safety equipment.
Until the regulations change and both our countries come into the modern world Honeywell can’t make good quality products because doing so means they loose money and isn’t
Hope that makes a little more sense as to why.
So essentially.
Honeywell spend most of its time and energy developing the Uk and European systems because these system make up the most money because a good chunk can be used world wide and the UK ones are legal standard on cruise ships meaning a big pay out for Honeywell.
US and Canadian systems are pretty much outdated and are only regulated in a few countries US, Canada and a few 3rd worlds. Meaning Honeywell doesn’t make as much or even profit from the US systems so it’s not sustainable for them to make the systems at a higher quality.
As European this is true. Gent is for the Uk but Esser for mainland Europe is getting more advanced as gent. Notifier, KAC, Morley, system sensor are getting slightly more advanced but becoming worse quality like the us as it’s the same module. Also all the products are the same except panels as it’s 4 names under 1 product. Honeywell keeps focusing on Esser and gent which is unfortunate.
A local recreation center had a Fire-Lite ES -200X installed in 2021 and replaced an old Silent Knight (likely a 5820XL or IFP 1000). Haven't seen problems or troubles shown on the ANN-80 yet.
i had a silent knight version of that detector (sk-photo-w) that some how was coming up as a multi criteria, at least the seller sent me another unit free of charge. seems like honeywell qc is going down the toilet.
Other than the EST heat recall, My EST3 system and many other EST3 systems in this country do not really tend to give that much faults and faulty devices. The only one was a loose capacitor on my EST genesis mini horn. And for your EST systems in Canada, they are about from the 1960s but here it ranges from 2012 to 2023.
You must be lucky we have nothing but problems with EST probably the most unreliable brand there is
@@nics-systems-electricDon’t even get me started on my old middle school’s EST. And now I’ve heard one of the EST3s in my new college is having mapping issues and frustrating the techs. Map faults may be easy to solve, but it requires a lot of labor to find the culprits. EST mapping works by going device to device and checking the resistance between them to not only auto-address but physically locate the device. I’ve heard it’s useful for troubleshooting issues like ground faults and some other problems. However, it’s a double edged sword. While it can make pinpointing devices easy, it can generate service calls because of the precise nature of the mapping, and as field devices fail, the panel can get confused about device locations and generate a “map fault” trouble which can be a laborious process to fix, as I said before. Map faults are just one of the many issues EST has a reputation for.
What Country are you in
@@dutchwolf2675 United States. EST is also very popular here, especially in government agency owned institutions like schools. It’s cheap, and the service is done by 3rd party companies which makes it less proprietary than Simplex and gives more flexible options for consumers to choose from. Despite that, I’ve not gotten a very good impression from EST. My old middle school was the worst system. It was a newer EST3 that had a mind of its own and constantly spat out false alarms and according to the principal was frustrating to deal with.
@@achannelwithnopurpose1977I don’t think he is in US
The UK Notifier fire alarm systems, I believe, are run by KAC along with the Morley & System Sensor devices in the UK
@Mleslie98True
Kac is a private company just like Apollo
@@serialshitposter186no KAC is honneywell and Apollo is owned by Halma plc
Lol I saw the panel key and though "Oh! It has his channel icon on it!" then realised your channel icon is the notifier logo so no wonder it had it💀
I wonder what happened to Honeywell, they were known to be good systems and now they got slammed with a QC disease. I knew Fire-Lite was not the best but it's now spreading to the other Honeywell branches.
Hey Nic, I just wanted to let you know that all 3 of those defective detectors are actually the US versions of those detectors. Now, do I believe that is the cause of their issues, I don't know. But when you showed the model numbers, I could tell those were the US versions when they just said "FSP-951" or "FST-951R", something like that. Because you happen to be in Canada, you probably should have ordered the "FSP-951A" smoke detectors and "FST-951RA" heat detectors, keep in mind, the A at the end is the Canadian model.
Wouldn't make sense for that to be the cause when there is more of those on the system problem free
The only difference bettwen the models is the a has a ulc listing
A United States or Canadian version are entirely compatible, only difference is that the Canadian version is listed ULC instead of UL.
I have been putting in a fire alarm system in my home using the DSC Panel NEO. I have PG9936 Detectors and they have been falsing the same way I have had to replace them before going live with the monitoring Company.
For your next test, why not pull the tower pull and set off the garage heat in the house. It would be cool to see the tower pull in action again.
How are these still approved for life safety
Because difficulty with programming doesn't affect its operation once installed
Wait so if the alarms goes off in the garage do it go off in the house too?
No if either panel goes into alarm the other will go into supervisory
first alert has an issue with their wireless alarms where from my experience is 1 out of every 8ish detectors won't pair with the rest. fire alarms is not a place to lack quality control
Yeah not very good
20:16 I think that base that you are using would look better for the garage heat detector.
I would agree but they don't fit on a 4" box
Those bases are meant for direct ceiling or round boxes. These bases are meant for Europe, Australia, NZ, Asia
@@nics-systems-electricthat’s unfortunate.
@13:40 just because your employer doesn't do it; doesn't mean that most stations don't.
That's not a matter of employer at all i'm not sure what you mean by that. Monitoring companies companies do not dispatch Fire or police for residential customers here
I don’t know I have two of those detectors and one of them is broke and it feels like EST runs notifier now
@Mleslie98 r/whoooosh
Do you have notifier addressable panel?
@@dutchwolf2675 yes but it’s dead now
That’s Honeywell QC for ya
1:08 lol your comment about EST
You probably just "scared" them into working due to trying to catch it on camera. I t sure is strange though that they wouldn't work but now will work.
The detectors think they are on a different Fire on systems. That's why it wasn't working. But it was correct
The detectors are designed to work regardless of panel firmware there's no way of changing what the detector is supposed to run on
ERICK
Honeywell devices such as notifier, gent and Morley devices are kind off crappy in their ways because in my opinion they always throw faults. Especially the fact that half my schools Morley by Honeywell system is inactive and useless.
They are great once installed but the quality control seems to be a problem possibly
Saying GENT is crappy is crazy 😂 I’m an American and even I know Honeywell invests the Most money into GENT. It’s like their most advanced system in the market. And trust me the Americans and Canadians who know of GENT are wishing they will one day be made available other than just in the UK.
So if your telling me that Gent has gone trashy when Honeywell invests the mosts in that company then the rest of us are pretty much screwed.
It would be a shame if they have gone bad I saw a gent system in action when I visited the Uk I’ve genuinely to this day I’ve never seen a more impressive fire alarm system 😂
@@ryanhelton1865 Gent vigilons are bloody capable systems....i have seen one that was driving conventional bells via relay modules as opposed to the standard addressable sounders
I do like gent systems but here in the UAE where I currently stay they tend to give faults. I do have a whole collection of gent sounders and devices but unfortunately one broke because of quality. The model number is C3-IP-SN-W. I do agree that it is the most advance Honeywell system though. It’s just the quality. 😊
I will have to superglue the crack in the base, the the quality will then be good. I like gent devices.
I don't like the panel you installed at your home, why didnt you install a different panel?
Because I don't care what you like it's the best option for me.
@@nics-systems-electric Makes sense.
Ah yes, “Technology Making Us Make an Ass Out of Ourselves” example 1 million. Also, is there any reason you didn’t use that 4” mounting base to mount the garage heat?
It doesn't fit on a 4" box
@@nics-systems-electric ah, that makes sense. Would be nice if they had one that would fit on those 4” octagonal boxes for surface mounting, would definitely look better than those 6” bases in such situations.
@@HenBasketFireAlarms I agree they came with my detectors but they don't seem to fit on anything they are the same base the is permanently installed in the duct detector housings
@@nics-systems-electric I looked at the 951 series specification guide, and it appears those 4” bases are intended for European boxes, and the B501 datasheet says it can also mount to 3½” octagonal North American boxes. Either way, Honeywell kinda dropped the ball on making bases that look good on surface mounted boxes.
@@HenBasketFireAlarms yeah every install I've ever done or seen it's always been on the normal 6 inch bases no matter if it's surface or flush
If you spin your address dials back and forth a few times, then set it to what you want should help with this problem.
That's what I tried on the original install to wipe the contact with no luck maybe the second time around it worked
i think est possessed notifier for 3 detectors
I think the disease has nailed most of the Honeywell branches, SK, Fire-Lite, & Notifier. I'm not sure about Farenhyt or Gamewell FCI.
The EST Disease is back
When I saw "is back," I have a feeling this EST disease happened before. It's weird that Honeywell has fallen down the toilet in terms of QC.
It is off ebay though...
Can't remember if these ones were or not however it doesn't make a difference where it comes from if it's sealed in box brand new
Your not a liar!
i have 5 detector and it thinks it was a heat detector but it was a smoke detector and 3 another detector have dual address problem until i set it like 80,81 and 82,that dual address is located in my room, Kelly's room and even Joey's room and after i wait for a month,it works. Simplex was lying dude
dont worry nic you dont look like an idiot the programming video shows the problems